[00:45] Saviq: if you're still around; I can't build unity8 package due to 2 failing tests. Are you seeing this too? [01:10] Saviq, oh, sorry, didn't notice that there was already a branch for that. feel free to disregard mine, it's incomplete anyway [01:10] veebers, ^^ [01:34] robru: cool, sounds good to me. [01:34] robru: I was going to mention that my branch includes the tox stuff which eases running the tests with py27 and py3 [06:53] copied some newer Qt 5.2 beta1 builds over to qt5-beta2 from my other PPA, should not affect anything but tell me if it does === iahmad_ is now known as iahmad === iahmad is now known as iahmad|afk [08:47] Saviq: so the pass objects to c++ one has been merged \o/ [08:48] haven't had any comment in the compare singletons against themselves one yet === kgunn is now known as Guest15371 === iahmad|afk is now known as iahmad [09:15] tsdgeos, nice [09:26] Saviq, tsdgeos mind if we pick up about that FilterGrid animation? [09:26] From where we left off on Tuesday. [09:36] tsdgeos, can you have a look at the height animation in LVWPH with nic-doffay? [09:36] sure [09:36] nic-doffay: Saviq: what's the issue? [09:37] tsdgeos, bug #1224552 [09:37] bug 1224552 in Unity 8 "[Dash] Category expansion transition has varaible speeds" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1224552 [09:38] tsdgeos, and comment #3 in particular https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1224552/comments/3 [09:39] Ubuntu bug 1224552 in Unity 8 "[Dash] Category expansion transition has varaible speeds" [High,In progress] [09:39] tsdgeos, the animation currently happens in FilterGrid.qml [09:40] I was planning to keep it there. [09:40] nic-doffay, not only there [09:40] so you want it to expand at a continuous speed? [09:40] nic-doffay, it's there in listviewwithpageheader, too [09:41] tsdgeos, no, we need to expand it to $visible_height in a duration, then to $target_height in one frame [09:41] Saviq: hmmm, yes and no, the only thing the LVWPH does is move the Y [09:41] nothing to do with the height [09:41] tsdgeos, and the opposite for collapsing - to $visible_height in one frame and then animate to $target_height [09:42] tsdgeos, yeah, but still you put the comment in that they need to happen in sync ;) [09:42] tsdgeos, would it be possible to apply a height behavior on LVWPH's delegates? [09:42] tsdgeos, from LVWPH, I mean? [09:43] tsdgeos, well, maybe I'm overcomplicating things... the only expandable thing we have is the grid... [09:44] so maybe it's fine if we just leave it there [09:46] tsdgeos, the height animation was never in sync with the y animation then anyway - only important thing is that y happens slower than height, doesn't it [09:51] Saviq, is there a variable in FilterGrid which holds the shell height already btw? [09:51] nic-doffay, dunno, doubt it [09:52] nic-doffay: knowing the height of the shell is not going to help you anyway, lots of stuff to substract in there [09:55] tsdgeos, what do you mean? [09:56] nic-doffay: i mean we have the panel and stuff [09:56] you don't want to know the shell height [09:56] you want to know the genericscopeheight [09:57] tsdgeos, is that just the height of the GenericScopeView [09:58] is that a question? [09:58] or? [10:02] tsdgeos, yeah it is. [10:02] then i don't understand the question :D [10:04] tsdgeos, how can I calculate the genericscopeheight, is it stored somewhere? [10:04] nic-doffay: well the genericscopeview knows about it [10:04] and it's what triggering the filtering [10:05] so passing it around should not be that hard [10:07] tsdgeos, is the genericscopeheight the genericscopeview height property? [10:07] That's the question basically. [10:07] ah no [10:08] that's just some crap i wrote [10:08] but it's an item [10:08] so it has a .height property [10:10] tsdgeos, you mean the GenericScopeView has a .height property, right? Just double checking because I intend to pass that through... [10:10] If I'm understanding you correctly? You mean it's best to use the GenericScopeView height to work out the animation? [10:10] nic-doffay: well it's what contains the filter grid [10:10] so yes [10:11] tsdgeos, cool [10:11] that is what i'm saying [10:17] btw my leg is paining me a bit, sorry if i'm slower or grumpier than usual today [10:47] Saviq: about QtMultimedia in the test environment. Should I wait for jenkin's opinion or should I mock it straight away no prevent it from breaking at some point? [10:47] s/no/to/ [10:52] mzanetti, just mock it, shouldn't be too difficult - not sure we need the mp3s at all, either [10:52] ack [10:52] mzanetti, if you can control the Audio component from the test, shouldn't be needed [10:53] or well, you need to be able to control it, and once you mock the component, you won't need the mp3 ;) [10:53] yep [10:58] tsdgeos, so, rejecting the 5.2 regression workarounds? [10:58] i.e. https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity8/singleton_52/+merge/194123 [10:58] https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity-api/52regressions/+merge/194303 [10:59] Saviq: the unity-api needs the comparison one to land [10:59] ours is fine if we wait for the release [11:00] tsdgeos, yeah, I know, I'd rather distro-patch than to disable the tests, TBH [11:00] if we need it earlier [11:00] ok [11:07] i'm really confused about this [11:08] my GenericScopeView is getting the "onDestruction" call [11:08] but the ListViewWithPageHeader inside doesn't get the destructor called [11:08] any idea why that could happen? [11:10] tsdgeos, only reason I can think of... ownership somehow b0rked? and QML doesn't destroy the LVWPH? [11:12] tsdgeos, no idea why it would be b0rked, since it's a QML type like any other [11:14] right [11:14] thing is [11:14] kind of works sometimes [11:14] but if the test is adding removing them a lot [11:14] gets confused and breaks [11:16] dednick, ping [11:17] Cimi: pong [11:17] dednick, hey mate [11:17] dednick, I was reading carousel code [11:17] dednick, and I see pressandhold signal [11:17] dednick, however it's triggered only if you stay within 1px [11:18] dednick, can you pls try to see if you can click and hold the selected element without moving? [11:18] dednick, we might just decide to enlarge the area [11:21] what do i do manually to test lp:~mzanetti/unity8/fix-switching-previews-positioning ? [11:21] Cimi: is it working for you at all? [11:21] dednick, I'm compiling [11:21] tsdgeos: go to a scope where contentHeight > height [11:21] dednick, but I see there's code [11:21] tsdgeos: move it so that a row of items is mostly covered by the header [11:21] dednick, it's though only fwd when the click is steady in position [11:22] tsdgeos: open the preview => the items at the bottom should *not* be covered any more [11:22] dednick, which might be logically wrong [11:22] Cimi: i dont think you understand. It's not working for me at all, no matter pressAndHold/click. The click signal is not getting from the Carousel to GenericScopeView because we've put the GenericCaroselLoader in between, which is not forwarding the click. [11:22] dednick, AAAAAAAAHN [11:22] dednick, ok [11:22] dednick, will fix that [11:23] there's also other parameters which are expected to be bound when we're using the grid view, like expanded/filter. [11:24] Cimi: i think it's probably better not to use the CarouselLoader at all and just decide when to display either carousel / grid in the GenericScopeView. [11:24] dednick, I see all now [11:24] dednick, indeed it will get complicated unless carousel and filter grid will share common interface [11:25] well [11:25] i'm working on that [11:25] Cimi: yeah. [11:25] kind of [11:25] but stuck on other things [11:25] so yeah fix it :D [11:25] tsdgeos, who are you talking to? [11:25] you guys [11:25] ok :) [11:25] tsdgeos, what's your ideal solution? [11:25] that = common interface [11:26] ok [11:26] Cimi: you should be able to check the count in the GenericScopeView instead, by making the getRenderer function depend on the count. [11:26] dednick, unfortunately I think it depends on the model [11:26] dednick, let me dig into [11:26] Are we able to land branches again guys? [11:26] nic-doffay, not yet [11:28] Cimi, how far did you go with https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1152150 [11:29] Ubuntu bug 1152150 in Unity 8 "[DASH] diagonal swipe is recognized as a scroll" [High,Confirmed] [11:29] Saviq, this is ready if you'd like to take it for a test drive: https://code.launchpad.net/~nicolas-doffay/unity8/category-transition-speed-fix/+merge/195203 [11:29] nic-doffay, k [11:29] dandrader, I did not go far: I had a discussion with Saviq and tsdgeos on how we should approach this [11:29] dandrader, we decided we should work on low level qt [11:29] dandrader, so we stopped going ahead [11:30] dandrader, I might unassign myself [11:30] Cimi, mind if I take that bug? I have nothing better to do at the moment [11:30] nic-doffay, one nitpick: wrap "root.height = genericScopeHeight;" in { } [11:30] dandrader, it's qt bug though [11:30] Cimi, I know. I like digging into qt [11:30] dandrader, have fun then! :) [11:31] dandrader, I addigned you [11:31] *Assigned === _salem is now known as salem_ [11:34] Saviq, sure thing [11:43] nic-doffay, https://code.launchpad.net/~nicolas-doffay/unity8/category-transition-speed-fix/+merge/195203/comments/450635 [11:47] Saviq, reading [11:49] mzanetti: the test is failing for me [11:49] FAIL! : qmltestrunner::GenericScopeView::test_hiddenPreviewOpen() 'verify()' returned FALSE. () [11:49] Loc: [/home/tsdgeos_work/phablet/unity8/fix-switching-previews-positioning/tests/qmltests/Dash/tst_GenericScopeView.qml(149)] [11:49] interesting [11:50] mzanetti: can you test? [11:50] * mzanetti wonders how he broke that one [11:52] tsdgeos: sorry. forgot to update that one. it was still reading the context prop [11:52] tsdgeos: fixed now [11:58] Saviq, mzanetti what does it mean when a bug has a "affect Ubuntu UX" with a "fix commited" status? Does it mean that there's some design doc specifying it or something? [11:58] e.g. https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1152150 [11:59] Ubuntu bug 1152150 in Unity 8 "[DASH] diagonal swipe is recognized as a scroll" [High,In progress] [11:59] I would ask the reporter, but he's gone [11:59] dandrader: it menas that design has come to a conclusion on this [12:00] dandrader: but it might be a design spec or a comment on the bug [12:00] dandrader: in this case as Oren reported the bug I think the bug itself is the solution for the UX [12:02] mzanetti, hmm, ok. thanks === rachelliu_ is now known as rachelliu [12:04] Saviq, it needs to take the y of the filter grid itself into account right? [12:20] Saviq, test ping [12:23] tvoss, test pong ;) [12:24] nic-doffay, yes, the y in relation to ScopeListView [12:31] Saviq, out of interest did you see this issue on the desktop? I'm not noticing it yet. [12:31] nic-doffay, yes [12:31] Saviq, so the best way to see it is to scroll up one row then collapse/expand right? [12:31] nic-doffay, yes, but it's not even about seeing it - just think about it === dandrader is now known as dandrader|afk [12:40] nic-doffay, nevertheless it is visible - but it's happening very quickly [12:44] Saviq, yeah just wanted to ensure I could see the fix well though. === alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch [12:54] nic-doffay, here's one: http://ubuntuone.com/4AuII1GwHnbNI9C9yearMZ [12:54] nic-doffay, you can see "Files & Folders" disappearing both when expanding and collapsing [12:55] nic-doffay, that's the "you didn't take uncollapsedHeight into account" issue === dandrader|afk is now known as dandrader [12:58] nic-doffay, and here's the other one http://ubuntuone.com/5wVUF7Jo3YD8X9Kcs6qHL6 [12:58] nic-doffay, you can see it blinking when collapsing [12:59] but also when expanding it sometimes doesn't show all the items === alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g [13:30] mhr3: hi [13:30] mzanetti, hey [13:30] mhr3: looking at the preview spec there are some previews which are not fullscreen [13:31] mhr3: is there already a plan on how to make that possible? [13:31] mzanetti, yea... let's not go there yet :) [13:31] mhm [13:31] tbh i think the design should be changed [13:32] it was under the assumption that those results can't have an image [13:32] but they can [13:32] mhr3: wait. the smaller previews should have an image too? [13:33] design assumed they don't so they created small previews [13:33] that's how i think it went === dandrader is now known as dandrader|afk [13:34] mhr3: probably, yes. but so far the dash plugins don't have images except very few ones [13:34] which is a bug [13:34] majority of them do have images [13:34] but there's some issue on the server [13:34] ah ok. but maybe design doesn't even want those [13:35] i for one think the amazon preview would be better off without the screenshot of the amazon website [13:35] maybe [13:35] but those small previews don't consider other-than-phone form factors [13:35] ok. I'll clarify this with design [13:35] therefore they suck :) === pstolowski is now known as pstolowski|lunch === dandrader|afk is now known as dandrader [14:09] Saviq, i noticed that with my scopes split, unity goes for the mock scopes plugin when you ./run it [14:09] Saviq, ok to just do http://paste.ubuntu.com/6415955/ or would you want something more elaborate? === pstolowski|lunch is now known as pstolowski [14:23] mhr3, what's "unity-scopes-qml"? :D [14:25] mhr3, and why would plugindir come from there - shouldn't unity8 (or unity-api, for that matter) define that path? === dandrader is now known as dandrader|lunch [14:45] Saviq, it's me being consistent with naming :) [14:45] Saviq, otherwise, pc installed by unity-plugin-scopes [14:46] Saviq, sounds a bit odd that unity8 itself would define it [14:46] although only because you're running it [14:47] otherwise it kinda makes sense [14:52] mhr3, yeah, that's why I said unity-api [14:52] mhr3, it would define the interfaces and the place where to install them [14:53] mhr3, both the implementations and unity8 would find out where to look for those build-time [14:53] from the unity-api .pc [14:53] Saviq, yea, that sounds good [14:53] biab [14:54] so i'll just remove the unity-plugin-scopes' .pc file completely and move this var into unity-api's .pc, k? [14:54] hmm, and maybe i'll keep it [14:55] though not sure who'd need to know its libdir [15:02] Saviq, I've sorted out the one issue, but where must the y be taken into account? I've tried testing as much as I can to check for faults. [15:02] I'm not seeing anything after fixing the issue you mentioned in your comment. [15:06] Cimi: ping === didrocks1 is now known as didrocks [15:11] dednick: ping [15:12] tsdgeos: yo [15:13] dednick: i've updated https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity8/noScopeView/+merge/194486 with a wait and the crash is gone, it is my current understanding that for reason even if the element has been removed it if it had a pending paint it gets painted again and then it crashes. I think this is something we should investigate but given the amount of changes in the renderloop in 5.1 and 5.2 i've opted for adding a TODO about it [15:13] what's your opinion? [15:13] Saviq: ↑↑↑ [15:14] tsdgeos, pong [15:14] Saviq, was reading of that http://www.tomshardware.com/news/NAND-Flash-Flash-Friendly-File-System-F2FS-Jaegeuk-Kim,18229.html - do we have plans for ubuntu? [15:14] Cimi: so you're trying to find do a "base item" for the generic scope view items? [15:14] yep albert [15:16] tsdgeos: what is the change in plugins/ListViewWithPageHeader/listviewwithpageheader.cpp for? [15:16] or just a change in logic pattern? [15:16] Cimi: ok, i may have been not clear this morning, but i was also doing it before i got sidetracked, this is what i had in Dash/DashBaseRenderer.qml http://paste.ubuntu.com/6416258/ [15:17] dednick: there's no change? [15:17] or you mean the change in the last commit? [15:18] last commit. you removed check for parentContext [15:18] dednick: that was the reversal of the previous attempt to not make it crash [15:20] tsdgeos: oh right, so you were seeing it earlier? ok [15:20] yeah [15:20] on the same test [15:20] hm. wonder why this has suddenly caused issues [15:23] dednick: it's not sudden [15:23] dednick: the test was using a fake genericscopeview [15:23] not the real one [15:23] which now i use [15:23] tsdgeos: ah. ok [15:24] i can "fix" it [15:24] adding gets here and there [15:24] but tbh i'd like to wait for 5.2 and then see if it is still happening [15:24] and if it is [15:24] investigate it more [15:24] because it doesn't make sense that just adding the wait there it stops crashing [15:25] tsdgeos: ok, well if it's not a new thing and just now the test failing, then i think it's ok to just make the test pass for now and add a TODO [15:26] the todo is there already :-) [15:28] yup, i know, which is why i've approved :) [15:48] tsdgeos, there was a talk some time ago that we shouldn't be putting QObjects into a model? [15:48] hmmm [15:49] don't remeber about it [15:49] and can't think of an immediate reason why not to tbh [15:49] mhr3: c++ wise you mean, right? [15:49] tsdgeos, yep [15:50] tsdgeos, hm, i do remember a discussion about model and objects, although maybe the conclusion wasn't that there shouldn't be objects [15:50] or maybe it was about not using QFoo* in there? [15:51] instead to have QFoo instead [15:51] well, it depends on what you're trying to do :D [15:51] do you have an example we can talk over? [15:51] i'm writing a new model and don't want to make mistakes from the beginning :) [15:57] mhr3: i guess you just need to make sure you keep the ownership of the * clear if you use * [15:57] that's the only thing i can really think of atm [15:58] yea, that makes sense [16:20] nic-doffay, say you're expanding the second category [16:21] nic-doffay, you don't want to animate from $currentHeight to $scopeViewHeight [16:21] nic-doffay, but from $currentHeight to $scopeViewHeight - $currentY [16:22] dednick, btw any development on the glib source in qt issue? === greyback is now known as greyback|away [16:23] tsdgeos, does it crash in 5.2, too? [16:24] Saviq: haven't tried, compiling and running the whole thing against 5.2 is not that easy (unless you run the ppa which i'm not sure i want to do and risk messing up my system) [16:25] tsdgeos, I'm good with workaround + TODO, but if it's something that needs to be fixed in 5.2 anyway... [16:25] tsdgeos, the ppa should be safe, + ppa-purge to go back [16:26] i've never used ppa-purge [16:26] but ok, i'll check it tomorrow [16:26] changing the other Qt patch now [16:27] i pinged lars and he did a quick comment to make me fix something so i need to fix it so he has no excuse not to continue looking at it :D [16:27] tsdgeos, do do do :F [16:27] tsdgeos, ppa-purge is very handy - it will downgrade all the packages, that you have installed from that ppa, to distro versions [16:28] or at least to latest non-that-ppa versions [16:28] and comment out the ppa [16:31] Cimi, well, it's not in the kernel yet, even, is it ;) [16:31] Cimi, our kernel folk would have to look into it and see the advantages [16:32] Saviq, yeah so the individual category y. I was thinking of the scopeView y for some reason... [16:32] Got it though, ta [16:32] Saviq, I read that motorola is using it on moto x and g [16:32] moto g seems like a great phone where I would like to see ubuntu on it [16:32] it's cheap [16:33] and does good stuff === dandrader|lunch is now known as dandrader [16:38] mhr3: em, not really. have a better solution, but it's still just sending events === salem_ is now known as _salem === _salem is now known as salem_ === hggdh_ is now known as hggdh === greyback|away is now known as greyback [17:12] dednick, so I've been digging on the carousel filter grid [17:13] dednick, in general I think those two are too different to be shared :\ [17:13] there's so much more custom code between scope view and filter grid than it's required for the carousel [17:16] Saviq, ^ [17:16] as albert started http://paste.ubuntu.com/6416258/ [17:17] mterry: hi, did you ping me earlier about the MIR stuff? I can't find any trace of it, but my brain suddenly said, "hey you forgot something!" [17:19] pete-woods, yar, you said there were bug subscribers, but I don't see them [17:20] there's also highlightIndex [17:25] mterry: where do I look to verify? [17:25] I thought I added them [17:26] I put them on the launchpad project, not the source package, was that wrong? [17:26] pete-woods, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libqtdbusmock [17:26] pete-woods, yeah. I mean, both are good [17:26] pete-woods, but MIR specifically cares about Ubuntu maintainership [17:26] mterry: okay, I will do that then [20:43] Can anyone here tell me the status of Optimus graphics on Ubuntu? Should I stay away and opt for Intel graphics? Is bumblebee a solution that just works? [20:43] veebers, http://www.webupd8.org/2013/08/using-nvidia-graphics-drivers-with.html [20:44] awesome, thanks Saviq I'll take a look [20:44] veebers, at least in my Dell I can switch between nVidia (by disabling optimus) and Intel (by enabling, but not using optimus) [20:44] veebers, with nvidia-prime Xorg crashes here, though :/ [20:45] Saviq: sweet, sucks about the crash though :-\ Looks like I have a couple of other laptop options available to me now [20:45] veebers, I've been happily using either nVidia or Intel on this laptop for two years now, just never really both at the same time [20:45] I did experiment with bumblebee, but it's just never proven useful (I'm no gamer, though) [20:46] veebers, truth is, if you don't need the umph from nVidia for gaming or such, probably better to steer away from it for all kinds of reasons [20:47] Saviq: right, that was my original thinking. But I've got a couple of laptops that I'm considering, one has nVidia Optimus so thought I would do some reasearch [20:47] Saviq: actually, if you have a moment, could I ask you a qml question? [20:53] veebers, hit me, but latency might be high ;) [21:01] Saviq: ack, thanks. Is there a better way for me to pass an argument to this purely qml app so that it can be used as a property: https://code.launchpad.net/~veebers/stock-ticker-mobile-app/mock-server-for-testing/+merge/194971 [21:01] I'm wanting to pass in the server url to use, but on startup it seems that the argument value isn't ready yet and thus initially uses the default [21:19] veebers, yeah, so: QML objects are always instantiated with defaults [21:19] veebers, and then the property values are evaluated and set [21:19] veebers, so you always need to react to onPropertyChanged [21:20] veebers, "get_data_server() ? get_data_server() : ..." you can use bracket-enclosed JS that you return a value from in a binding, so: [21:21] { var foo = get_data_server(); if (foo) return foo; else return "bar"; } [21:21] saves you one call to get_data_server() [21:23] Saviq: ah right, nice. But your saying that for instance this isn't doing what I expect it to (i.e. I expect that the dataserver arg (used in get_data_server() ) is available and would be used) : property string dataServer: get_data_server() ? get_data_server() : "http://finance.yahoo.com/" [21:24] veebers, from what I can see things should be working, 'cause other props are bound to dataServer [21:25] veebers, only potential missing thing is listening for args.values.dataserver changes [21:26] veebers, but IIUC that comes as a command-line argument, so it should be safe [21:26] Saviq: odd, if I add debugging logging to get_data_server stating if args.values.dataserver is set or not, thre are some initial calls where it is not set [21:27] veebers, yeah, I expect there may be [21:27] Saviq: yes it's an Argument that's set via command line, so it shouldn't change during operation [21:27] veebers, well, but then it depends how the whole Arguments / Argument machinery behaves [21:27] Saviq: ah, good point [21:29] veebers, there might be some cycles where it didn't yet pick up the args === salem_ is now known as _salem [21:29] veebers, it's the first I've seen the Arguments component, do you know where it comes from? [21:30] ah, SDK ;) [21:30] Saviq: it's a uut component: http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/devel/ubuntu-13.10/qml/ui-toolkit/qml-ubuntu-components0-arguments.html [21:33] veebers, so yeah, I'm not sure on its internals, but I expect there might be some racing involved, especially if you see the value being empty at first [21:33] Saviq: ack ok. I'll explore further. Is there any other methods available to me for a pure qml app to pass an argument either via command line args or env var that you know of? [21:34] veebers, nope, there's nothing like that - those kind of things are meant to be done in c++ before starting the QML engine [21:35] Saviq: aye, that's the conclusion that I had come too as well. Thanks for clarifying :-) [21:35] Saviq: on that note, what sort of boiler plate would be needed to add that to the app (the c++ side)? [21:42] veebers, very little [21:43] Saviq: hmm, I might explore that then [21:43] veebers, create a QML app in QtCreator, it will give you a C++/QML template [21:43] Saviq: nice, thanks. [21:44] veebers, file a bug against SDK, though, if you find that's indeed the case that the values are not ready straight away [21:44] Saviq: will do [21:44] Saviq: also (change of topic :-) ) fyi: https://code.launchpad.net/~veebers/unity8/ap_make_use_of_helpers_in_tests/+merge/191575 [21:47] veebers, yeah I tested it today and it was fine, wanted to have a look again [21:47] Saviq: cool thanks. [21:47] veebers, one thing, though - there's some logging output from the helpers we should probably quiet down [21:48] * veebers looks [21:48] Saviq: this is the "Restarting unity . . ." logs? [21:54] veebers, yeah, and then the output from upstart [21:54] Saviq: cool, I'll take care of it [21:54] veebers, cheers [21:54] * veebers takes extra logging out into the woods to "take care of it" [21:55] veebers, while you're at it, maybe it'd make sense to log the output from upstart, so that it shows up in -v [21:55] Saviq: good point, will do [23:32] hmm, my qtcreator doesn't have the ubuntu branding etc. which leads me to believe that perhaps I need some more things installed. Anyone have an idea? [23:36] veebers, ubuntu-sdk [23:37] Saviq: ack thanks. I'm installing as we speak :-) [23:37] /away