[17:09] Just some thoughts... I know there are not that any people here right now, but, what things about the way the desktop is do you find anoying/confusing? [17:09] I think I will be more vocal about this in the ML [17:10] i think JACK is a mess, still [17:10] just clicking on something like ardour will not typically make audio start to work [17:11] it basically either crashes something, or starts JACK in the background, potentially making audio not work [17:11] not sure what to do about this [17:12] i think we might still have an identity issue as well.. is the desktop for audio? video? graphics? [17:12] if its for video, "why doesnt it include my favorite editor, which is the best option in linux".. they say [17:13] i *really* like the idea of adding the studio workflows to any DE [17:14] it gets back to a sort of idea that cory came in with.. basically not having a particular "release" of an official kind, but maintaining packages and meta packages [17:14] OvenWerks: what do you find "annoying"? [17:50] OvenWerks: that mute bug is a drag.. and the screensaver/locker looks *bad* [20:17] holstein: That is one thing I've been planning to work on this cycle [20:17] might require a wrapper script for each application that can use jack [20:17] or, upstream changes. Trying to create some sort of standard [20:18] its tough [20:18] i think falk is looking at that as well [20:19] really? I should talk with him about that then [20:19] wont hurt [20:19] im sure he'd share [20:27] Just makes sense we don't do more than one solution to that problem [20:27] why break tradition ;) [20:29] hehe [20:29] seems like we could talk everyone upstream into leaving that lock screen [20:38] holstein: I was talking about desktop stuff itself [20:38] Take a quick look at the email I sent to the list [20:40] I agree the way Jack works is not the best either though. [20:41] OvenWerks: We haven't really discussed changing the desktop at all. I know some people are wanting to do that, but that would be in contrast with the idea that we base our DE and settings entirely on existing packages [20:41] In which case, we would do no customization at all [20:41] The whole idea with Ubuntu Studio is after all to work on anything, not just our own setup [20:41] Ok. I can live wit5h that [20:42] I'm not against us having a default DE setup though. [20:43] If we do I would like to make sure there is nothing that slows down productivity [20:43] That sort of stuff is so personalö [20:44] I think the menu is already doing the biggest job in enhancing productivity [20:44] would be nice to have better controls for audio, and that is a goal for ubuntustudio-controls [20:44] Some of it is... and those thing should be left alone in some sort of sane "everyone does it this way" default [20:46] There are two things that right now I feel can get in the way. In particular of new users [20:46] Having the scroll wheel skip through desktops is one. [20:47] To someone coming from the normal world where extra desktops don't exist... It can be disturbing to ones workflow [20:48] Today having multiple workspaces is becoming standard [20:48] on IOS and android, so I don't fully agree there [20:48] Even OSX does it these days [20:49] I can agree on that the expected behaviour of double clicking the top panel of a window is to make it maximized, and so it is on many DEs [20:49] The person not used to it, scrolling on the focused window, all of a sudden finds themselves transported to a blank screen. [20:51] It's a nice feature I think. Would be better in that case to prepare a short introduction to the desktop, when first logging in [20:51] Ok we can make a title bar double click do that... it was doing a "rollup". [20:52] On XFCE, the rollup is traditional, is it not? [20:52] I'll check what the current default is [20:52] OK, but what do we want? [20:53] Let's add those suggestions to the -desktop blueprint [20:53] or, -default-settings [20:54] Someone coming from a windows audio environment already has to learn linux audio and apps, do they need to learn a totally new DE as well? [20:54] madeinkobaia has some rather radical ideas for a Ubuntu Studio theme, and he's probably also intrested in looking at changing the DE [20:55] Ok, maybe he is the better one to do it then [20:55] Should we include Writer by default? [20:55] I don't think one person should decide everything. It's best to have some discussion about the whole direction we want to go towards [20:56] right now we just have an installer and it installes all of libreoffice [20:56] Yes, I think it would make sense to include LibreOffice, but let's not decide that now. [20:57] The proper way would be for someone to pick up the entire publishing workflow, and do research, list applications, and make decisions based on that [20:57] Kubuntu include Loffice, but it is not on the iso, it is downloaded/installed on install to disk. [20:58] Do we have people to do that? [21:30] OvenWerks: Sure. Us :) [21:30] I personally have other priorities before I would get to that