/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/11/20/#ubuntu-uds-design-1.txt

=== ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-design-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/design-1/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/11/20/%23ubuntu-uds-design-1.html
=== ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-design-1 to: Track: Design | App Design Clinic | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/22103/app-design-clinic/
christinahi everyone14:02
christinawelcome to today's design track14:02
christinawe will be starting shortly14:03
davidcalleHi all14:04
christinadavidcalle, hey!14:05
katiesorry, we're having a few technical difficulties with the hangout14:05
katiewe'll be online very shortly!14:06
katieand we're live!14:06
dobeychristina: mute yourself please14:08
dobeychristina: your typing is quite distracting :)14:09
christinadobey, is this better14:11
nik90Hi everyone14:12
davidcallechristina, it is, thanks14:12
christinanik90, hey14:12
christinanik90, welcome14:12
dobeychristina: yes much better now14:12
nik90christina: hi :)14:13
christinalet us know if you got any questions at any time14:13
nik90hmm, I am not seeing the sidebar in the design.ubuntu.com/apps to navigate to other pages14:19
yaili_nik90: looking into it now14:21
nik90yaili_: thnx14:22
christinaany questions on apps guys?14:23
christinanik90, do you have any questions for us?14:23
nik90christina: framing one now..1 min14:24
davidcalleWhat new things can we expect soon on design.ubuntu.com?14:24
christinadavidcalle, patterns?14:25
dobeyQUESTION: are there any standards or recommendations for visualation of data in graphs/charts, as i don't believe the sdk or qml provide any standard graphing widgets?14:25
davidcalleThanks, looking forward to it14:26
christinadobey, can you give us an example  or context?14:26
nik90christina: Question: Regarding deep navigation, how many maximum pages is appropriate? For instance in my app, a user can navigate to Home Tab -> TV Shows -> Seasons List -> Season Information -> Episode List. As you can when the user in the episode list page, he is quite deep in the navigation which makes it harder to go back to home tab. Any way to improve this?14:26
nik90christina: sorry for the long question :P14:26
dobeychristina: if i was writing a fitbit app or financial app for example, and wanted to show a graph of progress14:27
christinanik90, thanks- coming up next :)14:27
yaili_katie: yes!14:28
nik90christina, katie: thnx. I think the expansion widget is not yet available in the SDK. But I think I can create a custom one temporarily.14:31
christinathanks nik9014:32
nik90christina: Question: When does one use Sheets?14:32
dobeyare you all in the same room, on opposite sides of the table?14:37
rickspencer3katie, can I join to ask a couple of questions?14:37
dobeychristina: ^^14:38
nik90christina: Question: Would it be possible to send a click package for the designers to run and get a feel of the app rather than app screenshots since my app is getting bigger and bigger?14:38
nik90christina: for the design clinic ^^14:38
christinarickspencer3, yes14:39
christinahttps://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7acpimosh0c45iim5j21d4j490?authuser=0&hl=en-GB14:39
christinarickspencer3, ^ or anyone who wants to join14:39
christinadobey, ahh yes :)14:39
dobeyheh14:40
nik90christina, katie: awesome. thnx14:40
christinadobey, hard to fit in one side ;)14:40
rickspencer3arg14:41
rickspencer3christina, I'm updating my desktop .... and it just temporarily rendered it hard for me to join :(14:41
christinarickspencer3, :(14:42
dobeyi can see rickspencer3 is enjoying the quality of google hangouts :)14:42
christinarickspencer3, can you let us know the questions here then?14:42
rickspencer3dobey, well, in fairness, I'm in the middle of updating to trusty ;)14:42
dobeyrickspencer3: great timing ;)14:42
rickspencer3oh well14:43
rickspencer3christina, I would like to say that I am impressed with how generous the design team is14:44
rickspencer3always willing to help folks out in improving their applications14:44
christinarickspencer3, aww thanks :)14:44
rickspencer3hey christina maybe if you paste me a link I can try joining14:45
rickspencer3the button in the web browser is not working for me :(14:46
dobeyrickspencer3: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7acpimosh0c45iim5j21d4j490?authuser=0&hl=en-GB14:46
christinarickspencer3, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7acpimosh0c45iim5j21d4j490?authuser=0&hl=en-GB14:46
rickspencer3going to be risky because apt is working really hard on my 'puter though :)14:46
christinarickspencer3, cant hear you14:46
rickspencer3it's green in the hangout, so the hangout thinks it can hear me14:47
dobeyi can hear you14:47
yaili_I can hear14:47
nik90christina: I can hear rickspencer314:47
dobeyrickspencer3: you're good14:47
christinanik90, dobey we are sorted now...think it was us :)14:48
dobeyrickspencer3: it sounds like the main issue would be solved by overriding the "go back" feature, so that when when you swipe back from the details page that you got to from a favorite, it goes back to the main page, rather than the search results page14:50
dobeyrickspencer3: maybe if you can avoid creating tabs until they need to exist; or switch to an expansion widget for stop details14:51
dobeyrickspencer3: default to using location service to find closest stops14:54
rickspencer3oops apt caught up with me14:57
dobeyrickspencer3: the search entry in the dash scrolls off too14:57
* rickspencer3 shrugs14:58
rickspencer3thanks dobey14:58
dobeynot sure if there's a good way to solve that without making a big change to the sdk to deal with it :-/14:58
dobeymaybe zoltan or someone on sdk team would know14:58
nik90thnx a lot for the guidelines.14:58
rickspencer3dobey, maybe there is nothing to solve, that's just the design14:59
dobeyrickspencer3: well, designs can be buggy/wrong too :)15:00
dobeyi think it's worth fixing15:00
dobeyhaving to scroll all the way back to the top to refine the search is pretty annoying15:00
=== ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-design-1 to: Track: Design | Designing responsive Ubuntu sites and web guideline | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/22040/web-visual-guidelines/
dobeyanyway, session is over. time for me to move channels again :)15:02
=== alex-abreu|afk is now known as alex-abreu
christinahey everyone15:02
christinathanks for joining us for the next design session on responsive website and web guideline15:03
christinaif anyone wants to join our hangout, heres the link: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/508h3bmoouqldar54mh3858aa4?authuser=0&hl=en-GB15:03
christinaand i (christina) is going to be yaili_  so if anyone wants to ask anyquestions pls ask yaili_ and not christina (if that makes sense)15:05
yaili_www.resources.ubuntu.com15:08
yaili_our responsive mobile website15:09
YoBoYhi15:10
yaili_YoBoY: hello15:10
yaili_welcome15:11
YoBoY(sorry i'm late ^^")15:11
yaili_YoBoY: no worries, glad you could join us.15:11
yaili_do you want to join our hangout too_15:11
yaili__15:11
yaili_f anyone wants to join our hangout, heres the link: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/508h3bmoouqldar54mh3858aa4?authuser=0&hl=en-GB15:11
YoBoYthanks but not at the moment15:12
yaili_any feedback for us, pls shout15:13
yaili_design.ubuntu.com/web-style-guide15:13
YoBoYI'm already on the page, thanks :)15:14
yaili_YoBoY: great! yay!15:14
yaili_YoBoY: let us know if you got any questions or feedback then15:16
YoBoYwell, some, i'm reading the website, and I don't see the "responsive" work, it's just fixed with15:17
YoBoYthis is still a work in progress website ?15:17
YoBoYok :)15:19
YoBoYquestion : do you have a version of the ubuntu-styles.css not compressed (human readable) ?15:27
YoBoYok, it could be added on the website site I think15:30
yaili_yep we will do that15:30
YoBoYthanks :)15:31
YoBoYQuestion : Do you use or recommand a CSS pre-processor to create this framework ?15:33
yaili_Sass15:33
YoBoYsorry a bit of lag between the video and irc ;)15:34
YoBoYok, and can you share your .scss files ?15:34
YoBoYit can help to create custom themes for loco websites15:35
yaili_do you want to join us on hangout_15:35
yaili_then no lag and can answer more questions face to face if you like15:35
YoBoYthe video is bad :]15:35
YoBoYok, I'll join, but my english is bad ;)15:36
yaili_https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/508h3bmoouqldar54mh3858aa4?authuser=0&hl=en-GB15:36
YoBoYsorry, not used to join ^^"15:37
YoBoYdon't seem to work :\15:38
yaili_sorry we are having a connection problem15:38
YoBoYyes I can see that :p15:38
YoBoYthanks you :)15:44
yaili_thanks15:44
yaili_YoBoY: hi there, we'll be getting the human readable and .scss files up there soon! would you like me to let you know when it's live?15:58
YoBoYyaili_, sure :)15:59
=== ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-design-1 to: Track: Design | Research insights on Android and Windows phones | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/22102/research-insights-on-android-and-windows-phones/
christinahey everyone16:04
christinawe are about to start our next session16:04
christinathanks for joining us16:04
christinahi everyone16:08
la_juyisa quick question: why was iOS users left out of the research? (for when questions are allowed, of course :))16:08
christinala_juyis, thanks for the question16:08
christinai will get that asked shortly16:08
la_juyischristina, thanks16:09
christinala_juyis, do you mean iOS platform?16:09
la_juyischristina, correct16:09
christinabecause we have included ios users16:09
christinala_juyis, sure then16:10
la_juyischristina, i mean, you say Ubuntu phone was compared against Windows 8 and Android - why not to compare it against iOS?16:11
christinala_juyis, yes i understand now :)16:11
christinai will ask that for you16:11
christinakeep the questions coming!16:11
la_juyisI'm also interested on why you focused on that group of demographics. (maybe it's they're our target when designing the Ubuntu phone, which I was unaware of :))16:16
christinala_juyis, sure16:17
christinala_juyis, i think we might take questions at the end#16:17
la_juyis:)16:17
christinaso keep the questions and i will make a note of them16:17
christinakeep the questions coming i meant la_juyis16:19
christinala_juyis, actualyl do you want to join our hangout16:30
christinathen you can ask questions directly :016:30
christina:)16:30
christinamakes it much nicer for us too!16:30
la_juyisoh, np, I wouldn't like to interrupt :)16:31
christinala_juyis, oh maybe when we take questions?16:32
la_juyischristina, sure16:33
christinala_juyis, great thanks16:33
christinala_juyis, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7acpjfe5hkq6mqh6h7doke9o94?authuser=0&hl=en-GB16:33
christinala_juyis, for when u need it ;)16:33
christinaanyone who wants to join us: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7acpjfe5hkq6mqh6h7doke9o94?authuser=0&hl=en-GB16:41
micah2QUESTION: What are the current ideas for improving back button (in the bottom toolbar) usability?16:45
micah2QUESTION: what are current ideas for making the toolbar more discoverable in Ubuntu Touch (I apologize if these ideas were already discussed, I had to miss part of the session)16:48
micah2What if there was a little orange line or something like that at the very bottom of the screen when a toolbar is available?16:49
micah2You've answered my questions! I coded up an example of how I think the toolbar could be improved (orange bar ideas, etc.) Should I email that to you? I emailed Jono, and he forwarded it to John Lea, but I haven't heard back.16:53
micah2Here is a link to the video demo I made16:55
micah2https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwAfnOGPZNCWLS1PcU9EOE1VNnNaVWt1N1RfZUZjelNGZVVV/edit?usp=sharing16:55
micah2my email is micah.losli@gmail.com16:56
micah2thank you!16:57
katiemicah2, great video17:01
micah2thank!17:01
=== ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-design-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/design-1/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/11/20/%23ubuntu-uds-design-1.html
micah2*thanks!17:01
micah2Do the designers ever write qml code for active mock-ups?17:03
christinamicah2, hey17:05
christinayes, some of us do.... :)17:05
micah2hi, christina17:05
christinarachel and versa on our team do prototyping for us too17:05
micah2The source of the demo is available on github, if playing with that would be at all helpful.17:06
micah2https://github.com/Micahnator/Toolbar117:06
micah2I hope I'm not being obnoxious, I just want to help make the UT experience great.17:08
katiemicah2, i like it, it's great to see your experiments and prototypes and designs :)17:09
katiemicah2, most of the designers hang out on the #ubuntu-touch channel normally, if you want to talk, share any more work17:12
davidcallemicah2, hi, very interesting mockup. Just a comment on page B hint. Maybe it's just due to the fact the the page is mostly blank, but I feel that this hint could be misinterpreted as a loading animation for the page.17:12
davidcallethat the*17:12
t1mpmicah2: hello, I just saw your video with ideas to indicate that there is a toolbar in an app17:13
micah2mmm, you make a good point davidcalle.17:13
t1mpmicah2: I'm the guy who's implementing the toolbars in ubuntu-ui-toolkit17:13
micah2hi, t1mp17:14
t1mpmicah2: there have been some changes recently, and more will come.17:14
t1mpmicah2: one change is that now when you switch pages, the toolbar will always show for 5 seconds, so you know that it is there.17:14
t1mpmicah2: I don't know if that will stay, but it seems to me that it helps already17:14
micah2I've heard that there was going to be experiments with that behaviour17:14
t1mpmicah2: still, personally I think it would be nice if there is some indication that always tells you whether there is a toolbar that you can swipe in17:14
micah2My opinion is that showing the toolbar for 5 seconds will get annoying as you get comfortable with the app, you won't need it anymore.17:15
t1mpmicah2: with the latest UITK packages there are some changes already. Whether you have it depends on the repository where you get the qtdeclarative5-ubuntu-ui-toolkit-plugin package17:15
micah2which repo has the latest stuff?17:15
t1mpmicah2: maybe. hard to tell without user tests17:15
t1mpmicah2: you on saucy?17:16
micah2I have upgraded to Saucy, yes.17:16
t1mpok, then it is in the SDK PPA. Let me search for it.17:16
micah2As an app developer, I feel like the toolbar showing for 5 seconds will get in the way of making things clean, beautiful, and leverage the whole screen.17:17
micah2I'm working on Panpipe, a pandora client. Right now I put media controls in the bottom of the "now playing" page. The toolbar would be fighting for that same space.17:18
t1mpmicah2: it is this PPA https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/+archive/ppa17:19
micah2There are probably other apps that do things differently that won't mind the 5 second peek....but it doesn't work well with my current design ideas.17:19
t1mpmicah2: suggestions for improvements are always welcome :)17:20
t1mpmicah2: but discuss with the designers mainly first. They are better at that stuff and know how to do user tests :)17:20
micah2thanks for the link t1mp, I wrote it down for when I get home.17:21
micah2I'm happy to discuss my recommendations with anyone. If any of the designers do incorporate my ideas into user testing, I'd love to hear what they do and what the results are.17:23

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