[00:00] <ali1234> and just use a normal window to show the pixmap before that
[00:00] <ali1234> that might be easier than trying to track all the pixbuf allocations
[00:00] <ochosi> yeah
[00:01] <ochosi> that sounds like a good solution
[00:01] <ochosi> that'd also make your fading solution work
[00:01] <ali1234> so the big question is does it matter if there's a root pixmap or not?
[00:02] <ochosi> well it kinda does for xfwm4
[00:02] <ali1234> yeah, eventually it does
[00:02] <ochosi> that's what brainwash was complaining about all the time
[00:02] <ali1234> i mean does it matter between the first and second set_background() calls...
[00:02] <ochosi> right, probably not
[00:02] <ochosi> only when the greeter exits would be my guess
[00:03] <ali1234> so then we can fix the flicker by just moving when it sets the background
[00:03] <ochosi> yeah, probably
[00:04] <ali1234> i just pushed another commit which does this
[00:05] <ochosi> darn, you're fast
[00:05] <ali1234> crap, i didn't test it
[00:05] <ochosi> hehe
[00:06] <ochosi> i'll leave the build-error to you then ;)
[00:06] <ali1234> how do i git reset with bzr?
[00:06] <ali1234> or git commit --amend?
[00:06] <ochosi> i dunno, i hate bzr and only use it if i absolutely have to...
[00:09] <ali1234> ah, bzr uncommit
[00:09] <ali1234> and now i have to delete the branch on launchpad and push it again because there's no bzr push -f
[00:11] <ali1234> ok, try that
[00:11] <ali1234> you'll probably have to delete and branch the repo again
[00:12] <ochosi> yup, rebranching...
[00:13] <ali1234> bzr -leave-me-alone-i-know-what-im-going
[00:13] <ochosi> :)
[00:13] <ochosi> if only
[00:14] <ochosi> ok, brb, testing now
[00:17] <Unit193> So you need a git-bzr. :D
[00:18] <ali1234> it's pretty much mandatory if you want to bisect
[00:18] <ochosi> looks good
[00:19] <ochosi> i still haven't built xfwm4 with that root-background support so the grey background flicker is still there
[00:19] <ali1234> my concern is that all that create_root_surface stuff will get done much later
[00:19] <ochosi> but the greeter still works
[00:19] <ochosi> as it did before, i didn't feel any difference
[00:19] <ochosi> (apart from your modified config-file ;)
[00:20] <ali1234> config file?
[00:20] <ali1234> did i commit that?
[00:21] <ali1234> no...
[00:21] <ochosi> hm, no, i forgot it defaults to radiance
[00:21] <ochosi> or ambiance actually
[00:21] <ochosi> i just remembered you used radiance on some screenshots, so i concluded without looking
[00:21] <ali1234> i use orion :)
[00:22] <ochosi> oh :)
[00:22] <ochosi> much better
[00:22] <ali1234> but recoloured with radiance colours
[00:22] <ochosi> i don't like how clumsy some of the widgets look with radiance
[00:22] <ochosi> so you're one of the few users of elementary-xfce-darkest?
[00:22] <ali1234> no, i use ubuntu-mono icons
[00:22] <ochosi> meh :)
[00:23] <ali1234> i just wish human theme worked on gtk3...
[00:23] <ochosi> human theme?
[00:23] <ochosi> which one do you mean?
[00:23] <ali1234> the ubuntu theme from before light-themes
[00:23] <ochosi> ah
[00:23] <ochosi> wasn't that something like a recolored version of gnome's default at the time?
[00:24] <ochosi> i mean cleanlooks
[00:24] <ali1234> possibly
[00:24] <ochosi> a brown cleanlooks of sorts
[00:24] <ochosi> i vaguely remember cleanlooks being ported to gtk3
[00:24] <ali1234> i think it was a fork of that, yes
[00:24] <ochosi> but the problem are the various gtk3 theme changes
[00:24] <ochosi> it'd have to be rather recent to be useable
[00:25] <ali1234> yeah... plus straight porting isn't enough with all the new things
[00:25] <bluesabre> that theme was good when it was more orange than brown
[00:25] <ochosi> ali1234: well yeah, obviously lots and lots of pixmap assets
[00:26] <bluesabre> I used to use shiki-/gnome-colors exclusively, but not many updates there :)
[00:26] <ochosi> yeah, i also used shiki for a longer while
[00:26] <ochosi> was nice with the icons that went along with it
[00:26] <ochosi> quite a consistent look
[00:27] <ochosi> bluesabre: someone made shiki-spinoffs of greybird, saw those a while ago (greybird-brave, etc.)
[00:27] <ochosi> but with gtk-theme-config they're kinda superfluous
[00:27] <ali1234> gtk-theme-config needs more options
[00:27] <ali1234> only one of them does anything with orion
[00:27] <ochosi> yeah, we initially considered more options
[00:28] <ochosi> but then again the UI just gets complex
[00:28] <ochosi> (for the average user)
[00:28] <ochosi> and it doesn't work with many themes
[00:28] <ali1234> perhaps have one colour selection, and generate the others based on that
[00:29] <ochosi> you mean all of them?
[00:29] <ali1234> well, "some"
[00:29] <ali1234> eg for orion...
[00:29] <bluesabre> like modifying @fg_color in greybird
[00:29] <ochosi> bluesabre: did you see ali1234's lp-branch?
[00:30] <bluesabre> haven't checked it yet
[00:30] <bluesabre> still the same one?
[00:30] <ochosi> ye4ah
[00:30] <ali1234> hmm i never pushed it
[00:30] <ochosi> haha
[00:30] <ochosi> sweet
[00:30] <ali1234> basically...
[00:31] <ali1234> the selection colour is the most colourful thing in most themes, yeah?
[00:31] <ochosi> yeah
[00:31] <ochosi> that and the bg-color define the theme mostly
[00:31] <bluesabre> ochosi: repost it?  its a lp: url and harder to find in this backlog
[00:31] <ali1234> so i found good results by setting that to a bright colour, and then setting on of the others to a kind of washed out version of the same tone
[00:31] <ochosi> https://code.launchpad.net/~a-j-buxton/lightdm-gtk-greeter/experimental
[00:31] <bluesabre> danke
[00:31] <ochosi> oh :)
[00:32] <ali1234> so you can set the selection with gtk-theme-config
[00:32] <ali1234> it could then automatically change the other one
[00:32] <ali1234> let me try to find the code...
[00:32] <ochosi> ali1234: "one of the others" means what exactly?
[00:33] <ali1234> i don't remember which one it was... looking now
[00:33] <ochosi> ah sure
[00:36] <ali1234> ah there we go
[00:39] <ali1234> actually i guess these colours are autogenerated anyway
[00:42] <ochosi> depends on what colors you are talking about
[00:42] <ali1234> well, all of them
[00:42] <ali1234> all the gtkrc colours
[00:42] <ochosi> yeah, well there are only 6 basic colors or so
[00:42] <ali1234> basically what i mean is that the user would pick their "favourite" colour, and it would tint all the gtkrc colours
[00:42] <ochosi> and then the rest is (usually, i.e. in good themes) generated
[00:43] <ochosi> in bad themes, there are hardcoded colors
[00:43] <ali1234> there's the basic ones, and then xfwm4 generates a whole load of different shades of them
[00:43] <ali1234> sure, bad themes will never work right though :)
[00:43] <ochosi> exactly
[00:44] <ali1234> if user picks a bad theme there's not much can be done about that :)
[00:44] <bluesabre> but they will still report bugs about it ;)
[00:45] <ochosi> tell me about it
[00:48] <ochosi> ali1234: did you push all the bits of your greeter-changes for testing?
[00:48] <ali1234> yes
[00:50] <ochosi> ok, from my pov this could be merged, but we can give it some more testing
[00:50] <ochosi> bluesabre: do you still use the nouveau drivers? :)
[00:51] <bluesabre> ochosi, not currently, though I could
[00:53] <ochosi> since the whole set_background mumbojumbo was kinda directed at nouveau, it'd be nice to see whether things got better, wors or are the same
[00:53] <ochosi> s/wors/worse/
[00:55] <ochosi> brainwash: could you test ali1234's branch with ati and intel and see whether it works as expected, plz?
[00:55] <ochosi> a garage full of testing hardware would really be nice...
[00:58] <ali1234> with all the talk about testing i watched today...
[00:59] <ali1234> it would be nice if there was a way to put out one-off calls for testing
[01:01] <ali1234> it's like... testing is focused on isos and packages... but all the dev work is done "upstream"
[01:01] <brainwash> ochosi: yes, will do it tomorrow
[01:02] <ali1234> it takes too long for feedback to filter through
[01:10] <ochosi> ali1234: yeah, true
[02:50] <refarr> hello
[02:50] <refarr> anyone there?
[02:50] <pleia2> usually
[02:51] <refarr> I have a question, about xubuntu and I can't find any help at all
[02:52] <refarr> I just installed xbuntu 12.04...I clicked on terminal and it asked me for the default
[02:52] <pleia2> you want #xubuntu
[02:52] <refarr> I tried that
[02:52] <pleia2> this is the development channel
[02:52] <refarr> no one responded
[02:52] <pleia2> I don't see you there
[02:53] <refarr> I'll see you over there then
[02:53] <pleia2> pro tip: don't lie, it makes a bad first impression :P
[02:59] <bluesabre> burn
[02:59] <bluesabre> :)
[02:59] <pleia2> I am clearly grumpy :)
[03:00] <bluesabre> just keeping things neat and orderly I'd say
[07:15] <forestpiskie> ali1234: for us to put out calls for testing it's really simple - talk to me 
[07:15] <elfy> or me 
[08:32] <xubuntu155> hi
[08:34] <Noskcaj> hey xubuntu155 
[08:35] <xubuntu155> I have a problem with xfce4-power-manager, it simply does not work
[08:37] <xubuntu155> the problem is for example: when I set to ASK when I press power button, it simply ignores :( that and turn off anyway
[08:38] <xubuntu155> and etc.. another example when set "do nothing" when close lid.. it will suspend too
[08:38] <xubuntu155> I'm not at home so just asking what would be the problem
[08:39] <xubuntu155> could*
[08:47] <Noskcaj> !support
[08:47] <Noskcaj> In this case, #xubuntu
[08:49] <Noskcaj> It's caused by logind and xfce4-power-manager not working together yet though. Affects me, but there's not much we can do right now
[09:27] <xubuntu155> ah k thx
[09:29] <xubuntu155> then I try to manually config logind
[09:29] <xubuntu155> thx bb!
[09:43] <slickymaster> morning all
[09:45] <slickymaster> knome: just wanted to thank you for the changes you made to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/NewDocs. They are very appealing and I'm certain that they should encourage users to return to NewDocs
[09:57] <slickymaster> knome: Can I just ask you how did you came across with NewDocs?
[10:53] <ochosi> micahg: since you reported the bug yourself and still nothing has happened there, I'd suggest I close this bugreport as wontfix for now? LP #1161498
[11:34] <bluesabre> ochosi: #-ot
[11:35] <bluesabre> thanks :)
[11:36] <ochosi> :(
[11:38] <bluesabre> the dangers of a wiki
[11:38] <ochosi> gah, that guy was already annoying yesterday...
[11:45] <ochosi> well, luckily wikis are easy to revert :)
[11:46] <ochosi> bluesabre: you didn't test the nouveau stuff anymore yesterday, right?
[11:46] <bluesabre> no, didn't get a chance
[11:47] <bluesabre> just testing login, or..?
[11:48] <ochosi> yeah, login and locking
[11:48] <ochosi> locking/blanking
[11:49] <ochosi> from the code-side, i think ali1234's changes make a lot of sense, but as drivers not always make sense..
[11:50] <ochosi> anyway, no rush
[11:50] <ochosi> maybe i can also test it later today or tomorrow
[11:50] <bluesabre> I'll go ahead and test it now
[11:50] <ochosi> oh
[11:50] <ochosi> cool
[11:50] <ochosi> gotta go, but lemme know
[11:50] <bluesabre> will do
[11:50] <bluesabre> have fun
[11:51] <ochosi> thanks, you too!
[11:51] <ochosi> ttyl
[12:08] <slickymaster> knome: FYi http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2110857&page=15&p=12852698#post12852698
[12:08] <bluesabre> ochosi: from what I've tested, his branch definitely seems faster.  On initial login, I don't see the graphical glitches, but when I lock the screen, I see leftovers from my last reboot
[12:14] <ali1234> it shouldn't be faster...
[12:15] <ali1234> it pretty much just does things in a different order
[12:18] <ali1234> bluesabre: when you say you see leftovers... what is the exact sequence of events?
[12:21] <bluesabre> when the screen comes up, my background consists of a garbled mess of what my previous session looked like. http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=278024
[12:21] <bluesabre> ali1234 ^
[12:21] <bluesabre> this is what it generally does with the nouveau drivers though
[12:21] <ali1234> ah, i see
[12:22] <ali1234> so lock->screen blanks->move mouse->you see that?
[12:25] <bluesabre> interestingly enough, the screen doesn't blank now on lock
[12:25] <ali1234> hmmmm.....
[12:25] <ali1234> the change i made was to only call the force lock function once
[12:25] <ali1234> since calling it more than once seems to make the screen unblank
[12:27] <bluesabre> I might try some different combinations with your branch and see if I can figure something out
[12:27] <bluesabre> also, it might just seem faster to me because nouveau is faster with VT-switching than nvidia-proprietary drivers
[12:28] <ali1234> i can't test with nouveau because it freezes on my card :/
[12:29] <bluesabre> I can probably look forward to that with my next laptop... this one is quite a few years old
[12:30] <bluesabre> anyway, gotta go get ready for work now.  Back in 10ish hours
[13:18] <ochosi> bluesabre: i also experienced the "garbled mess" with nouveau
[13:18] <ochosi> furthermore suspend didnt work well, so i switched back to nvidia
[14:56] <knome> slickymaster, ta ta
[14:59] <slickymaster> knome: ?!
[14:59] <knome> slickymaster, the forum link.
[14:59] <slickymaster> knome: ah :)
[14:59] <knome> slickymaster, i'll keep on tweaking stuff there...
[15:00] <knome> see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FrontPageRefresh
[15:00] <knome> any feedback is welcome
[15:01] <slickymaster> knome: I appreciate your help
[15:02] <slickymaster> knome: alright, I'll take a look at it later and will tell you my views
[15:02] <knome> sure
[15:02] <knome> it's still a WIP
[15:02] <knome> i really want to have some feedback from people who are familiar with the community help wiki
[15:03] <knome> i don't just want to come there and change everything
[15:03] <slickymaster> knome: let me ask you something, just out of curiosity, how come did you came across with NewDocs?
[15:03] <knome> slickymaster, i found it buried somewhere in the frontpage ;)
[15:04] <slickymaster> knome: well, lucky us for your good pair of eyes
[15:04] <knome> heh
[15:05] <knome> my intention is to make that more prominent in the future as you can see from the drafted frontpage
[15:08] <slickymaster> knome: resulting just of a quick glance I could suggest you the addition of a NewDocs link in the See Also section, but I'll have a thorough look at it this night
[15:25] <slickymaster> knome: by the way, I meant to ask you this a while ago, but forgot it, can you tell me where is the <<(NewDocs/Banner)>> you included in the entry page of https://help.ubuntu.com/community/NewDocs
[15:27] <knome> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/NewDocs/Banner
[15:28] <slickymaster> knome: thanks
[15:30] <slickymaster> knome: as it turns out it was as idiot question because logically it would be a distinct page
[15:30] <knome> slickymaster, but NewDocs is already in the top banner. why should it be in "see also" ?
[15:33] <slickymaster> knome: I think I should not only get a new pair of glass but also a fresh cop of coffee. Please apologize me and pay no attention to me today, knome as I'm surely going dumb ;)
[15:33] <knome> lol :)
[15:33] <knome> np
[18:24] <elfy> knome: re front page - at a quick look, I'd put the top 2 lines underneath the 3 help topic boxes or make them more pronounced - if I was going there in a panic/hurry I would miss the official docs link
[18:25] <elfy> the installation boxes would be better not lop-sided imo
[18:27] <elfy> the hardware/software/ firther areas look good
[18:27] <elfy> bit of white space between them and the signpost perhaps 
[18:27] <knome> hey elfy 
[18:27] <knome> haven't got as far as the signpost yet
[18:27] <knome> so yep, will look into that
[18:28] <knome> ultimately, i don't think if the signpost is useful as it is
[18:28] <elfy> not really - though I've met some real life ones like that - pointing to nowhere :p
[18:29] <knome> heh
[18:29] <elfy> would probably be better as a 'boxed area' like the 3 previous ones
[18:29] <knome> mhm
[18:29] <elfy> sigh - keep getting an error on a wiki save 
[18:30] <knome> :)
[18:30] <elfy> 503 last time - internal server error this time 
[18:31] <elfy> but it appears to have saved - so I'll move on quickly :p
[18:41] <sergiobenrocha2> hello
[18:42] <sergiobenrocha2> elfy or anyone?
[18:42] <elfy> I'm sort of here sergiobenrocha2 
[18:42] <sergiobenrocha2> sort?
[18:43] <sergiobenrocha2> i'm having an "save session" issue here...
[18:43] <elfy> with a wiki? 
[18:43] <elfy> ubuntu wiki type?
[18:44] <elfy> if you are - join the club, so was I - might be having issues, which it does from time to time
[18:44] <sergiobenrocha2> no, with save session support of xfce
[18:45] <elfy> not really the best place to talk about it - is it in trusty? 
[18:45] <sergiobenrocha2> yes
[18:47] <sergiobenrocha2> "Automatically save session on logout" option, from "Session and Startup", is not saving session
[18:49] <sergiobenrocha2> even selected, it is not saving session.
[18:49] <elfy> ok - well I'd file a bug for it then we can get people to confirm it 
[18:49] <elfy> not sure what package to file it against though off hand - knome might know, or someone else will pipe up
[18:49] <sergiobenrocha2> but it is funny, here, in xubuntu 13.10, it is the opposite. Even it is not selected, it saves session...
[18:49] <sergiobenrocha2> see: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-panel/+bug/1204919
[18:53] <sergiobenrocha2> but it is not the only issue... if you logout and select "Save session for future logins", it will save the session and doesn't matter if you take select from this option and make it not selected in "Automatically save session on logout" option, from "Session and Startup", it will continues to open the previously saved session
[18:54] <sergiobenrocha2> so... it's 2 problems... and I think that the last issue is more an design problem than a code bug
[18:54] <elfy> sergiobenrocha2: I'm not going to be much help to you tonight at all I'm afraid
[18:54] <sergiobenrocha2> ok
[18:55] <sergiobenrocha2> to who can I report (assigned) these issues in launchpad?
[18:56] <elfy> when you know the package - file the bug - we'll see it 
[18:56] <sergiobenrocha2> these problem are very annoying, mainly if you close an session of full open apps...
[21:18] <knome> sergiobenrocha2, you can file a bug against xubuntu-desktop if you don't know the package. we will then triage it to point it to the correct package.
[21:19] <sergiobenrocha2> ok
[21:19] <sergiobenrocha2> thanks
[23:14] <bluesabre> ochosi: one possible solution is to draw GtkImages on each display, which should effectively eliminate and X leftovers
[23:14] <bluesabre> not sure what the memory difference would be
[23:16] <ali1234> if you log out and log in again (ie not a full reboot) do you see the leftovers or the correct bitmap?
[23:17] <ali1234> it could be that nouveau doesn't implement RetainPermanent properly, and deallocates the pixmap, thus drawing garbage instead
[23:17] <ali1234> this is just wild guessing of course
[23:24] <bluesabre> actually, now that I have rebooted, Xorg crashes when I try to lock O.o
[23:26] <ali1234> well, that could be the same bug really, if it's just drawing invalid pointers on the screen
[23:28] <ali1234> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/03/05/%23ubuntu-x.txt <- oh look, the unity-greeter people had the same though as me (ctrl-f RetainPermanent)
[23:29] <ali1234> RAOF = robert ancell?
[23:29] <bluesabre> dunno, ochosi?
[23:29] <GridCube> https://launchpad.net/~raof
[23:30] <ali1234> no then
[23:30] <GridCube> lol he is member of all xubuntu's groups 
[23:31] <ali1234> that info is private to me :)
[23:33] <GridCube> no, its in the lp page
[23:38] <ali1234> it only shows "latest memberships" and the "all memberships" link is private
[23:38] <ali1234> oh, the icons...