[00:39] <ochosi> knome: yay, the item formerly known as "item 2" on this list has been fixed upstream in gmusicbrowser http://pad.ubuntu.com/oTOfP4p8z7
[00:39] <ochosi> knome: (and i've tested it and it works, obviously)
[00:52] <cell> boo
[00:53] <ochosi> jjfrv8: just had time now to review your prefs changes
[00:54] <ochosi> jjfrv8: i think i like how it's done, but i think stuff like "
[00:54] <ochosi> "The same four color options as in earlier versions are available from the Color: list."
[00:54] <ochosi> is superfluous
[01:43] <cell> I plan to attend the community meeting here on Dec. 19, 2100 UTC
[01:44] <Unit193> Sounds like a plan to me.
[01:46]  * skellat will be unavoidably absent from Thursday's meeting
[01:51] <cell> I will not arrive until 2215 UTC but perhaps it will be a long meeting or there will be stragglers
[02:33] <sergiobenrocha2> anyone?
[02:35] <sergiobenrocha2> hey
[07:58] <elfy> brainwash: so I must have blinked when the grey screen was there yesterday ... 
[07:59] <Noskcaj> Have we got a blog post about http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=lini_pc_haswell&num=1 ?
[07:59] <elfy> no
[08:25] <elfy> Noskcaj: write one ;)
[08:26] <Noskcaj> I might try tomorrow
[08:49] <elfy> ochosi: and xchat goes for the late '90s again - so it logically must be something to do with nouveau
[08:50] <elfy> http://pastebin.com/pP6bcJEK same sort of error 
[08:51] <elfy> not quite sure what to report this against 
[08:52] <elfy> if it's something we can fix - happy to run whatever's needed to get trace etc
[08:53] <elfy> if not - it's just get lost in LP and I'll just reinstall nvidia and forget about it 
[08:53] <elfy> s/it'll
[08:56] <elfy> at the same time the indicator panel in the panel is transparent again
[08:56] <elfy> so lots of coincidences - but whether they are 'really' related I've no idea
[08:57] <elfy> and the terminal running tail just closed for no apparent reason
[08:57] <elfy> :(
[09:59] <ochosi> Unit193: which reminds me that we should also deactivate roll-up window on scroll over the titlebar. it's just too confusing for new users and sometimes happens accidentally
[10:00] <elfy> ochosi: did you see the wall of text from me earlier or did you lose it with the net split stuff?
[10:00] <ochosi> i did, but so far i don't know what to reply
[10:00] <ochosi> it's quite puzzling
[10:01] <ochosi> i'm wondering whether there are bugs in nouveau though that cause this kind of behavior
[10:01] <elfy> possibly 
[10:01] <ochosi> does the indicator-transparency happen with nouveau or nvidia?
[10:01] <elfy> I get this random gpu lockup with nouveau as well
[10:02] <elfy> I've not seen the transparency issue with nvidia - and I'd have expected to have seen it over the last couple of days
[10:02] <ochosi> hm
[10:03] <elfy> could possibly just be this machine 
[10:03] <ochosi> i'm wondering whether we'll get more testers with nouveau who report stuff like this, or whether it's a combination of nouveau and your graphics card
[10:03] <ochosi> yeah, that would be my hope
[10:03] <elfy> snap :p
[10:03] <ochosi> but i fear that if you have it, others might see it too
[10:03] <ochosi> especially as it's LTS
[10:03] <elfy> yep 
[10:04] <elfy> could always mail the list(s) 
[10:04] <elfy> if it was the other way round - nouveau working/nvidia not it'd be less worrisome
[10:05] <elfy> I'd leave this machine on nouveau if there was a way to reset xchat without logging out - but it drives me nuts after an hour of looking at it :D
[10:11] <ochosi> yeah, i understand
[10:12] <ochosi> well just as an example, i can't use nouveau because the fan of my laptop is then always on
[10:12] <ochosi> in other news: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=lini_pc_haswell&num=1
[10:12] <slickymaster> morning all
[10:12] <elfy> morning slickymaster 
[10:12] <slickymaster> hey elfy 
[10:13] <elfy> ochosi: yea - saw that - jackson was on about it - he's writing a blog item he says 
[10:13] <elfy> after I told him too :p
[10:13] <ochosi> cool
[10:15] <ochosi> crap, have you seen the website of linipc? :>
[10:15] <elfy> ochosi: http://pastebin.com/L3Q74Z6h
[10:15] <elfy> nope
[10:16] <elfy> ochosi: I have now ... 
[10:16] <elfy> I can post that ^^ to the test lists - or at least our ones
[10:17] <elfy> and the -quality one - might get someone there to try xubuntu for us
[10:19] <elfy> ochosi: perhaps they're applying the hardware/software logic to everything :p
[10:21] <elfy> if that pastebin looks half sensible I'll post it later
[10:21] <slickymaster> elfy: do you have a minute to take a look at http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/306/builds/55995/testcases/1585/results
[10:22] <slickymaster> it's still instructing testers to make use of gksudo
[10:22] <elfy> is it?
[10:22] <slickymaster> haven't you taken care of that?
[10:22] <slickymaster> yeaps
[10:23] <elfy> I thought I'd done that
[10:23] <slickymaster> let me check the code in -qa trunk
[10:23] <elfy> oh - it got approved then nothing else got done 
[10:23] <ochosi> elfy: sounds good to me
[10:26] <elfy> slickymaster: it's good in the testcases - looks to me like it needs to just be done on the tracker
[10:26] <slickymaster> elfy: the test in the main branch is correct
[10:26] <elfy> yea
[10:26] <slickymaster> isn't ^^
[10:26] <slickymaster> and yeah the tracker hasn't been updated
[10:27] <slickymaster> but the test needs to be fixed
[10:28] <slickymaster> elfy: presently you have dt>Press Alt+F2</dt> -> <dd>Application Finder opens</dd> -> <dt>In dialogue type sudo -i mousepad, press Launch</dt> -> <dd>Application Finder closes, authorisation dialogue opens</dd>
[10:28] <elfy> ok - marked the code merged - no idea what went on there, tracker is now updated too
[10:28] <slickymaster> elfy: ^^^
[10:29] <slickymaster> that test needs to be fixed
[10:29] <slickymaster> what I wrote above is incorrect as it doesn't happens
[10:30] <elfy> slickymaster: I'm having trouble reading stuff in xchat atm - if there's a bug report it please
[10:31] <slickymaster> elfy: ok, I'll report it and will do MP to fix it, if it's ok with you
[10:33] <elfy> thanks
[10:36] <elfy> not sure how that managed to get onto the main branch but not merged
[10:43] <elfy> ochosi: ok - posted to lists and on the forum as well
[10:44] <elfy> I'm reinstalling nvidia now - can go backwards if necessary in the future ... 
[10:45] <ochosi> okey, thanks elfy!
[10:47] <elfy> welcome - I do what I can :)
[10:47] <brainwash> ochosi: AMD restricted driver and the background of my gtk3 indicators turns transparent after some application adds its indicator to the panel or when I swit between themes and then return to greybird
[10:47] <ochosi> brainwash: hmm :/
[10:47] <elfy> oooh 
[10:48] <ochosi> well i can only hope that the gtk3 transparency issues will be sorted out by a panel patch of sorts
[10:48] <elfy> brainwash: so since I added jackson's ppa yesterday - the restart button when you install nvidia in software - does exactly nothing ... 
[10:53] <brainwash> elfy: create a bug report :)
[10:54] <elfy> sick of reporting stuff lol
[10:54] <elfy> and what should I report it against ... jackson :p
[10:55] <brainwash> ochosi: just installed the latest version of xubuntu-icon-theme, don't really like the black terminal icon when used with greybird (black icon / black panel)
[10:55] <brainwash> just my first impression
[10:56] <brainwash> elfy: 
[10:56] <elfy>  indicators turns transparent after some application adds its indicator to the panel or when I swit between themes and then return to greybird
[10:57] <brainwash> woops
[10:57] <brainwash> jockey-gtk maybe
[10:57] <elfy> I just got that changing icons
[10:57] <elfy> brainwash: it worked fine the other day - so the cause of it not working would logically be the ppa
[10:58] <brainwash> the restart button?
[10:58] <elfy> in jockey 
[10:58] <elfy> worked ok the other day
[10:58] <brainwash> is it even jockey? it's now part of software-properties I think
[10:58] <brainwash> yep, that's strange
[10:59] <brainwash> "the ppa"?
[10:59] <brainwash> you mean the power-manager one?
[11:00] <elfy> no - install nvidia via jockey/software updates tab thing/ you get a restart button - not working now
[11:01] <elfy> ochosi: I'm also not so sure about the black terminal icon on this black panel ... 
[11:05] <brainwashx> my xchat looks fine
[11:06] <elfy> mine does until it happens
[11:07] <elfy> then it looks like the screenshot and the startxfce4 log error shows and the panel goes transparent
[11:07] <elfy> s/does/did - it won't happen now I've got nvidia installed
[11:11] <elfy> slickymaster: I'm not sure why that testcase even asks for that - just change it for any old random command
[11:12] <elfy> I think that I was half way to doing that - which is why the testcase got left hanging, then it all went wrong here with health and I forgot
[11:13] <brainwash> our special xubuntu bug advent calendar
[11:13] <elfy> LOL
[11:14]  * elfy gets the chocolate
[11:15] <slickymaster> elfy:are you saying to completely drop all the instructions that refers to open an application with the root account? because that's almost the entire test?
[11:16] <elfy> oooh - now I go to Alt F I remember what I was going to do - I picked the same thing to use instead of the root command
[11:16] <elfy> I was going to replace the current stuff with thunar /home
[11:18] <elfy> slickymaster: commented on bug
[11:19] <slickymaster> elfy: saw it ;) I'll go that way then
[11:21] <elfy> makes sense to me - and must have then too lol
[11:21] <elfy> sorry that I forgot about that
[11:21] <elfy> I think that's why it wasn't merged - as I knew I was going to rework it again
[11:32] <slickymaster> np
[11:52] <knome> ochosi, cool
[11:58] <ochosi> knome: i encouraged quentin to do a release soon so it'll get to us through debian
[11:58] <ochosi> but he wants to fix google-image-search first
[11:58] <ochosi> (or in fact find alternatives for it, since it doesn't work anymore)
[11:59] <knome> okay
[11:59] <knome> fixing point 1 would be cool as well
[12:02] <ochosi> yeah, but i see less hope for that tbh
[12:02] <ochosi> i'm not sure i remember perl and the gmb source well enough to do something useful with it
[12:02] <ochosi> and the only idea i came up with is an ugly hack
[12:02]  * elfy posts the the xfce dev mailing list to introduce myself to P.K whoever that is so he knows at least one person who "I've never met anyone who actually uses the mousewheel-rollup on purpose,"
[12:03] <ochosi> :D
[12:03] <ochosi> elfy: i still do agree though that this should be disabled by default in xubuntu
[12:04] <elfy> I'm not too worried about disabling ti by default and can see the reasons for it
[12:05] <ochosi> knome: what do you think? ^
[12:05] <elfy> same with the supposed double click in the title bar - which apparently could do something - I have NEVER managed to get that to work - must be set to some speed that I can never get to
[12:05] <ochosi> double-clicking the titlebar maximizes a window
[12:05] <ochosi> and that works fine here
[12:05] <elfy> nope - never get that to work - ever
[12:06] <ochosi> weird
[12:06] <ochosi> but you know how to double-click, right? :D
[12:06] <elfy> must be something like 79ms exactly anything above or below and you're right out of luck :p
[12:06] <ochosi> hm, you can try to increase the double-click tie
[12:06] <ochosi> time
[12:06] <ochosi> anyway, g2g, bbl
[12:06] <knome> ochosi, yep, agreed
[12:07] <elfy> that was easy 3 off +1's to that then :)
[12:08] <knome> elfy, i forwarded you a mail in case you're not subbed to -release ML
[12:08] <elfy> I saw that, but I am subbed to it :) thanks though
[12:09] <knome> ta
[12:09] <knome> i'll try to remember you are ;)
[12:09] <elfy> when is A1 finished - tomorrow ?
[12:09] <knome> also more critical now since i don't now much about our ISOs atm..
[12:09] <knome> yep, thurdays are release days
[12:09] <elfy> yep - I have been watching them this week 
[12:10] <knome> is our ISO working now?
[12:10] <knome> or do we still have the login bug?
[12:10] <elfy> well ... 
[12:10] <knome> also, would you be able to write some release notes?
[12:10] <elfy> we still have the login bug
[12:10] <slickymaster> knome: he still have it
[12:10] <slickymaster> we
[12:10] <knome> any hope of getting it fixed?
[12:10] <elfy> knome: can try - back to work tomorrow
[12:11] <knome> did somebody do the sponsorship queue paperwork?
[12:11] <elfy> knome: I don't think so - not even sure if it got added to the sponsor queue to be honest - and no idea how to even check
[12:11] <elfy> I saw micah and Unit193 talking about it in -offtopic logs 
[12:11] <knome> elfy, http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
[12:11] <knome> micahg, ping me when you're around
[12:12] <knome> let's hold the release/ISO for now
[12:12] <knome> i'll try to take care of that today
[12:12] <elfy> ok 
[12:12] <knome> i should have another internet here now :P
[12:12] <elfy> another one? 
[12:12] <elfy> greedy ... 
[12:12] <knome> haha, yeah...
[12:12] <knome> well you need to have backup plans :P
[12:12] <elfy> lol
[12:13] <elfy> I have trusty mother half a mile away with some internets
[12:13] <knome> heh
[14:08] <jjfrv8> ochosi, per your suggestion, I removed the "same four color options..." line from the Prefs section.
[14:09] <ochosi> jjfrv8: yeah, i'm wondering whether we shouldn't keep the diff as minimal as possible
[14:09] <ochosi> it will not be standalone anyway, it should only highlight what has changed
[14:10] <ochosi> you've done that nicely with the icons-section i think
[14:10] <ochosi> so personally, i'd also drop the "menus" section entirely if there was no change
[14:10] <jjfrv8> k, wilco
[14:11] <jjfrv8> ochosi, I can hook up a multi-monitor setup to do that too once slickymaster is close to finishing Usage
[14:11] <ochosi> that'd be really nice!
[14:11] <ochosi> i'll send an email to Nick and eric_the_idiot_ then so they can review and give us some feedback
[14:32] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: which instrument do you have?
[14:33] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: hm, so i definitely *need* a spider for this to work?
[14:33] <pmjdebruijn> yeah
[14:33] <pmjdebruijn> of course
[14:33] <ochosi> hm, i read about doing it "with the eye" with a white sheet of paper
[14:34] <pmjdebruijn> yeah need a colorimeter or spectrophotometer
[14:34] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: yeah, that's near nonsense
[14:34] <ochosi> ok :)
[14:34] <pmjdebruijn> in theory it can be done, but practically speaking there are GINORMOUS margins of error
[14:34] <ochosi> well i was testing gnome3 a while ago and it had some default profiles which all looked better than the blue-ish crap i have now
[14:34] <pmjdebruijn> oh possibly
[14:35] <pmjdebruijn> if you have a profile for the same type of display, it'll likely give decent results
[14:35] <pmjdebruijn> it wouldn't be super precise because of backlight aging and so
[14:35] <ochosi> i'm not really expecting something that implements 98%SRGB on my laptop, i have my eizo monitor for that
[14:36] <pmjdebruijn> though just getting rid of the blue can be done more easily though
[14:36] <pmjdebruijn> https://encrypted.pcode.nl/blog/2012/01/21/my-notebook-display-is-too-bluish/
[14:37] <ochosi> nice
[14:37] <ochosi> very true, that improves things decently
[14:37] <ochosi> thanks a bunch, i'll add that to startup
[14:37] <pmjdebruijn> :)
[14:38] <pmjdebruijn> probably the vcgt in a proper profiles does the same thing as xgamma, namely manipulate the videolut
[14:38] <pmjdebruijn> except that a proper profiles does it in more detail (and is measured to be correct)
[14:38] <ochosi> are you using xubuntu now or were you just posting this here?
[14:38] <pmjdebruijn> I use Unity on my main desktop, where I'm happy with it
[14:38] <pmjdebruijn> but Unity is a bit of a beast of netbooks
[14:38] <pmjdebruijn> so I use xubuntu now on my netbook
[14:39] <pmjdebruijn> and I'm quite impressed with xubuntu (and xfce) these days
[14:39] <pmjdebruijn> you guys have done a lot of great work
[14:39]  * pmjdebruijn will love to see light locker in 14.03
[14:39] <ochosi> thanks, that's nice to hear
[14:39] <ochosi> are you using it already?
[14:39] <pmjdebruijn> light locker
[14:39] <ochosi> yup
[14:39] <pmjdebruijn> I did a backport from trusty to saucy
[14:39] <pmjdebruijn> but it didn't work well
[14:40] <pmjdebruijn> I think it crashed my X
[14:40] <ochosi> no need, we have a daily PPA
[14:40] <pmjdebruijn> not sure if I was using it properly though
[14:40] <ochosi> for saucy too
[14:40] <pmjdebruijn> ah
[14:40] <pmjdebruijn> I guess I should give that a try then
[14:40] <ochosi> if you need help with light-locker, feel free to ping me
[14:40] <ochosi> i'm using it on saucy without troubles
[14:40] <pmjdebruijn> thanks, I'll give it a spin tonight I guess
[14:40] <ochosi> okeydokey
[14:40] <pmjdebruijn> do I need to uninstall gnome/xscreensaver
[14:41] <elfy> ochosi: I've got it here - lock screen from action buttons doesn't work/ctrl+alt+del doesn't do it either
[14:41] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: yeah, better to do that
[14:41] <pmjdebruijn> xscreensaver is quite functional, but it's soo darn ugly :)
[14:41] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: right, will do
[14:41] <ochosi> elfy: you have to patch /usr/bin/xflock4 for that to work
[14:41] <elfy> oh that's somthing to with xflock isn't it 
[14:41] <elfy> aaand snap again lol
[14:41] <ochosi> really easy patch
[14:42] <pmjdebruijn> does xflock need to  be patched
[14:42] <pmjdebruijn> it would a xscrensaver wrapper script fix it too?
[14:43] <ochosi> no, xscreensaver should be removed
[14:43] <pmjdebruijn> I know
[14:43] <ochosi> otherwise you might get in a conflict
[14:43] <pmjdebruijn> I meant wrapper light-locker with a script to pretend it's xscreensaver
[14:43] <pmjdebruijn> for xflock
[14:43] <elfy> ochosi: if it's easy I'll do it - on the other hand I might wait for Bug 1254366 
[14:43] <ochosi> but really, xflock is not a very clever script, it just tries one command after the other, better to patch that ;)
[14:43] <ochosi> elfy: it's really really easy
[14:43] <elfy> The patch looks good, can it be forward to the upstream developers please?
[14:43] <pmjdebruijn> oh btw
[14:44] <elfy> said dan holbach
[14:44] <pmjdebruijn> which reminds me
[14:44]  * pmjdebruijn is still fighting gnome keyring
[14:44] <pmjdebruijn> anybody here experience on that?
[14:44] <elfy> not here
[14:44] <pmjdebruijn> is it correct for xfce gnome keyring daemon is launched by pam?
[14:44]  * pmjdebruijn doesn't want to gpg component
[14:44] <pmjdebruijn> it interferes with smartcard operation
[14:45] <pmjdebruijn> on gnome I can disable it in the /etc/xdg/autostart desktop files, but those are ignored by xfce
[14:45] <ochosi> you should be able to modify that in the sessions & startup settings
[14:45]  * pmjdebruijn tried making an xfce specific .desktop file, with the --replace operator, but then it requiries for my password again
[14:45] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: I tried a couple of variations
[14:45] <pmjdebruijn> it's not that easy
[14:46] <ochosi> elfy: yeah, it will be fixed upstream too, but for the moment having the delta would be better in order to keep things working for us. things tend to take too long otherwise
[14:46] <pmjdebruijn> I guess I should try to contact the gnome keyring people themselves
[14:46] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: possibly, i don't have much experience because i haven't had any problems with the keyring so far..
[14:47] <elfy> ochosi: single syllable instructions then :p
[14:47] <elfy> or chuck it on a txt file and I can call for testing at the same time if you want ;)
[14:50] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: if it weren't for GnuPG smart card operation, it would have been fine too :(
[14:50] <elfy> bbl
[14:53] <ochosi> elfy: it really is a 2-line patch and it's so dead simple and obvious that it doesn't need any testing really
[14:54] <elfy> ok
[14:55] <elfy> so we'll not be needing to wrry about testing lightlocker at all? 
[14:56] <elfy> if that's the case I'll remove it from the blueprint
[14:56] <ochosi> no, the xflock4 patch doesn't need testing
[14:57] <ochosi> light-locker will need some testing
[14:57] <elfy> ok - thought I'd get one of the blocked things gone :D
[14:57] <ochosi> but as far as i know, it hasn't been added to the seed nor has anything else been done about it
[14:58] <elfy> well I'm cynical so aren't actually expecting anyone to get me to do anything from my side till the middle of March at the earliest ;)
[15:01] <knome> elfy, expect more involvement from my side on january
[15:01] <elfy> :)
[15:01] <ochosi> elfy: i understand you, believe me. i'm just not part of xubuntu-dev, so all i could do is merge-requests
[15:02] <knome> or whenever i have a working chair...
[15:02] <elfy> ochosi: I know 
[15:02] <elfy> knome: I laugh
[15:02] <knome> well the old one we dumped, it was so broken
[15:02] <knome> need to go and buy a new one
[15:03] <elfy> ochosi: so this easy patch - just edit xflock4 to this ? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/157461573/xflock4-light-locker-support.diff
[15:03] <ochosi> elfy: exactly
[15:05] <elfy> that works then
[15:06] <elfy> ochosi: did you see comments about the black terminal icon on the black panel earlier - if I've not got my glasses on I can't actually see it here
[15:06] <ochosi> no, didn't
[15:06] <elfy> well - ^^ then :p
[15:07] <elfy> while I don't have a default panel setup - I don't do anything with the colours of it
[15:07] <ochosi> hmm
[15:07] <ochosi> ok, will think about it
[15:07] <elfy> :)
[15:08] <elfy> not everyone is young with good eyes ;)
[15:10] <elfy> ok - really off for a bit now
[15:45] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: btw, @blue displays, https://encrypted.pcode.nl/files/temp/HSD121PHW1.png
[15:45] <pmjdebruijn> might be interesting to see, that's spectral pattern from a cheap netbook (which has a too blue display as well)
[15:54] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: that's the measurement with a colorhug?
[16:01] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: no, colorimeters don't offer that kinda accuracy
[16:01] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: that's with a colormunki photo spectrophotometer
[16:02] <elfy> made up names I am sure :p
[16:02] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: would be interesting to compare results of popular notebook-screens with that
[16:02] <pmjdebruijn> a 'colormunki photo' is a real product :D
[16:02] <ochosi> :]
[16:02] <elfy> :)
[16:02] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: probably very similar
[16:03] <pmjdebruijn> as with notebook everything needs to be compact
[16:03] <pmjdebruijn> so they are rarely decent
[16:03]  * pmjdebruijn has to run again
[16:05] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: hmm, just wonder where the blue tendency comes from... ttyl then :)
[16:18] <pmjdebruijn> well the backlight
[16:19] <pmjdebruijn> white leds are quite blueish by their nature
[16:19] <pmjdebruijn> IIRC
[16:20] <ochosi> hm, i see, would be nice if we could offer an easy way to help ppl with that in xubuntu
[16:21] <ochosi> just offer a few presets or something. do you think that would make sense or that meaningful presets could be created, pmjdebruijn ?
[16:22] <andrzejr> Anyone seeing bug #542336? Software-center used up 4GB memory + 4GB swap and got killed because of OOM exception
[16:25] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: yes sortof
[16:25] <pmjdebruijn> the xgamma trick is the easiest
[16:25] <pmjdebruijn> just taking away a little blue generally works on most of these display
[16:25] <pmjdebruijn> but, that doesn't make them "color accurate"
[16:25] <ochosi> yeah, sure
[16:26] <ochosi> i'm thinking more about: nicer to use/look at
[16:26] <pmjdebruijn> right
[16:26] <ochosi> photographers should get a spectrometer of sorts anyway
[16:26] <pmjdebruijn> but such a feature could conflict is someone actually wants to do proper color management (with xiccd for example)
[16:26] <pmjdebruijn> since both would manipulate the videolut
[16:27] <pmjdebruijn> are it's basically a race condition
[16:27] <pmjdebruijn> and*
[16:27] <ochosi> what i have in mind is providing e.g. 3-5 presets, that could be optionally chosen (so no default) in e.g. the display settings
[16:27] <ochosi> or even in a separate dialog, if we allow more stuff
[16:27] <pmjdebruijn> right
[16:27] <pmjdebruijn> that could work
[16:27] <pmjdebruijn> but something in xfce session would been to manipulate the videolut
[16:28] <pmjdebruijn> also keep in mind that if the videolut is manipulated to strongly the user might be visible banding
[16:28] <ochosi> why? it could be a simple app that creates an autostart item that sets the xgamma for starters
[16:28] <pmjdebruijn> true
[16:28] <pmjdebruijn> but in that case, I'd probably just call it xfgamma :)
[16:29] <ochosi> hehe
[16:29] <ochosi> yeah, maybe
[16:29] <pmjdebruijn> and allow the user to set each gamma value (with a few presets)
[16:29] <ochosi> yeah
[16:29] <pmjdebruijn> less yellow
[16:29] <pmjdebruijn> more yellow
[16:29] <pmjdebruijn> most yellow
[16:29] <pmjdebruijn> or something like that :)
[16:29] <ochosi> exactly, that sounds really nice
[16:29] <ochosi> would you be interested in writing such a tiny tool?
[16:29] <pmjdebruijn> haha :)
[16:30] <ochosi> :D
[16:30] <pmjdebruijn> not really
[16:30]  * pmjdebruijn is into full color management
[16:30] <ochosi> don't tell me you didn't see that coming!
[16:30]  * pmjdebruijn worked on xiccd
[16:30] <ochosi> yeah, i understand
[16:30] <ochosi> but xubuntu (and xfce even more so) is understaffed anyway, so we can use every help we can get
[16:31] <pmjdebruijn> I know
[16:31]  * pmjdebruijn is already stretched between projects (darktable/gnome-color-manager/colord/gnoduino/exiv2/lensfun)
[16:31]  * pmjdebruijn is doing a little beta testing on the intel drivers now tearfree feature
[16:31] <ochosi> so see my shameful attempt to trick you into doing that in this context :)
[16:31] <ochosi> uuh, sounds nice
[16:32] <pmjdebruijn> btw
[16:32] <pmjdebruijn> in theory
[16:32] <pmjdebruijn> having a app for the xfce control panel
[16:32] <pmjdebruijn> does that have any special requirements?
[16:32] <ochosi> not really
[16:32] <ochosi> i mean if it should go into xfce4-settings upstream, there are some "rules"
[16:33] <pmjdebruijn> vala would probably be out, right? :D
[16:33] <ochosi> no, you can use vala if you please
[16:33] <pmjdebruijn> oh? :S
[16:33] <ochosi> it's only xfce-core that is c-only
[16:33] <pmjdebruijn> oh right
[16:33] <ochosi> some other xfce stuff is written in vala
[16:34] <pmjdebruijn> well I doubt I'll have time to work on this though, but if I get bored I might give it a ago
[16:34] <ochosi> nice, that's good enough for me :)
[16:39] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: feel free to ping me anytime about that
[16:39] <pmjdebruijn> :)
[16:39] <pmjdebruijn> I'll play with light-locker first :)
[16:39] <ochosi> sure thing :)
[16:39] <pmjdebruijn> and then I still have the gnome-keyring thing to look into too :)
[16:39] <ochosi> yeah, that one sounded tricky
[16:40] <pmjdebruijn> well GNOME does it, so it's possible
[16:40] <ochosi> ideally, light-locker is something you don't really have to touch much
[16:40] <pmjdebruijn> just need to know how :)
[16:40] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: @ll, sure
[18:09] <slickymaster> bbl
[18:25] <Noskcaj> Good news everyone. prpltwtr now fully works with API 1.1
[18:36] <ali1234> what does that mean?
[18:38] <knome> ali1234, i imagine that's the twitter plugin for pidgin
[18:38] <ali1234> and API 1.1 is what?
[18:38] <ali1234> required for apps to use?
[18:38] <knome> the current api, i suppose
[18:38] <ali1234> or just nice to have?
[18:38] <knome> the old plugin broke
[18:39] <ali1234> i don't get twitter
[18:41] <ali1234> it reminds me of youtube comments (the old ones) except without the video
[18:49] <elfy> twitter is aptly named 
[19:03] <sergiobenrocha2> i have a problem with alpha iso, xfce4-settings is broken in amd64 iso, or it seems...
[19:03] <sergiobenrocha2> greybird theme is not working, and other settings are reset...
[19:09] <brainwash> link to bug report?
[19:17] <elfy> sergiobenrocha2: I'd guess that you didn't set the session to xubuntu nor the language
[19:17] <elfy> the whole thing is reported in a bug already
[19:20] <sergiobenrocha2> no, i set xubuntu session and english language. I tested in EFI and non EFI system.
[19:20] <sergiobenrocha2> see: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-settings/+bug/1262049
[19:21] <sergiobenrocha2> in the first time that i saw the blue theme, i thought that it was changed from Greybird to other
[19:22] <elfy> 32 bit was like that yesterday - changing things at the login screen made no difference
[19:22] <elfy> try todays image - there were changes - zsync saw 20% or so difference I think
[19:22] <sergiobenrocha2> 32 bit? i tested in VM, it is normal
[19:22] <sergiobenrocha2> humm, OK
[19:23] <elfy> though to be honest I doubt you'll see much change as the fixes we had/have are stuck in the queue so it's not really worth discussing it now until those changes are there
[19:24] <sergiobenrocha2> gtk3 themes and other things are in the iso?
[19:31] <elfy> sergiobenrocha2: everything is on there
[19:35] <elfy> knome: unless we actually get the user session issue actually in I see no point in doing anything much with this alpha release and while it's not really what we'd like to have out there I don't see much point in hanging on to it and would be better to just go back to dailies
[20:05] <sergiobenrocha2> the iso is great
[20:06] <sergiobenrocha2> why thunar does not have Downloads, Documents and other folders in Side Pane, by default?
[20:14] <ali1234> sergiobenrocha2: i dunno, but you can just add them to ~/.gtk-bookmarks
[20:18] <sergiobenrocha2> yeah, I can drag and drop each folder to side pane too
[20:18] <sergiobenrocha2> but for a begginer, i think it's better to be default
[20:19] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: in 13.10?
[20:19] <sergiobenrocha2> no, in trusty
[20:19] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: im not sure that the team is up to that yet
[20:19] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: are you doing official iso testing?
[20:19] <sergiobenrocha2> hum, i want to
[20:20] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
[20:20] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: otherwise, you should be able to customize all the parts of the operating system to fit your personal needs after its released
[20:21] <sergiobenrocha2> yeah, this is not problem for me
[20:22] <sergiobenrocha2> i want to help, but all is a bit confusing for me...
[20:22] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: its just not out yet.. so, little things like that could have just not been attended to yet
[20:22] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: the qa iso testing is *quite* helpful
[20:23] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: you dont report here, or the list.. you do it right there.. following the test guidelines
[20:23] <sergiobenrocha2> so, i'm testing today daily build, if i find something i reported to launchpad, and then I (or other person, dunno) assign to iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/..... ?
[20:24] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: it depends on what you fine
[20:24] <sergiobenrocha2> sorry, i'm very noob at devel :)
[20:24] <holstein> !bug
[20:24] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: otherwise, just downloading the iso daily.. you dont need to report anything
[20:24] <sergiobenrocha2> yeah, ubuntu-bug i already use
[20:24] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: especially preferences
[20:25] <sergiobenrocha2> hum, ok
[20:25] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: you can follow the qa testing.. that helps, since, or *all* the isos there are, they *must* be a certain number of tests done, in order to be released
[20:25] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: if you find a bug that is related to something in patricular, you report it like the above !bug link outlines
[20:26] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: also, for the upcoming releases, hang in #ubuntu+1
[20:26] <elfy> unless it's already reported - when you use the tracker you'll see bugs people have reported - in those cases you can just report the bug number against your results
[20:26] <sergiobenrocha2> qa testing is this? http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/308/builds
[20:26] <holstein> yup.. you can check there for bugs that have already been reported, and add yourself to them
[20:27] <elfy> that's the daily - at the moment we're testing the alpha 1 release
[20:27] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: those change, and can change.. i usually hang and ask the the release channel when the tests are due
[20:27] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: if something is wrong, a new iso can be pushed out.. its good to check in and make certain you are not testing an older iso
[20:27] <elfy> sergiobenrocha2: you need to subscribe to the dev mailing list - which is where I post what testing we are up to
[20:28] <elfy> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel
[20:28] <sergiobenrocha2> yeah, i'm trying to read all of mailing list, i'm already subscribe
[20:29] <elfy> well I'd not read all of it :)
[20:29] <elfy> anything important testing wise will be from me
[20:29] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: then, you will check your mail, and the announce will come out about testing from elfy .. you will be able to help test the iso's that are necessary
[20:29] <elfy> and anything that's older than a month I'd ignore
[20:30] <holstein> yeah.. the iso testings that need to happen, need to happen pretty quick
[20:30] <holstein> elfy: in a few days? you's say? maybe 3 or 4
[20:31] <elfy> sergiobenrocha2: we have 2 strands of testing at the moment - image and packaging, shortly will be joined by a third 
[20:31] <elfy> holstein: not sure what you mean?
[20:31] <sergiobenrocha2> hum, ok
[20:31] <elfy> sergiobenrocha2: and I make sure that mailings about images and packages are obviously different
[20:31] <holstein> elfy: when the request for iso testing for a milestone occurs.. theres a deadline.. it wouldnt make sense to QA test an older iso, for example
[20:32] <holstein> elfy: i was just trying to give sergiobenrocha2 an idea of the time frame for iso testing.. which is arguably one of the easiest ways to contribute constructively
[20:32] <elfy> oic no - not at all - when we decide enough is enough - we mark the image ready - then no-one can report against them anyway
[20:32] <holstein> elfy: OK
[20:32] <elfy> actually I disagree at the moment 
[20:32] <sergiobenrocha2> hum, ok, starting to understand
[20:33] <elfy> much the eaasiest way at the moment is testing packages - which you can do at anytime at all - even when you're working if you are clever about it :)
[20:33] <elfy> anyway - gtg now 
[20:33] <elfy> back tomorrow
[20:33] <holstein> o/
[20:34] <holstein> i think i was just seeing it like this... an iso works or doesnt.. and you just report in the QA tracker
[20:34] <elfy> there is that :)
[20:34] <elfy> cya holstein sergiobenrocha2 
[20:34] <holstein> you dont have to deal with bug reports.. but.. package testing could be easier depending on where the user is, i agree
[20:34] <sergiobenrocha2> so, what it matters? testing alpha 1 image or today daily build?
[20:35] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: testing packages is on going..
[20:35] <sergiobenrocha2> ok, but using daily build, ok?
[20:36] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: you want to use current packages.. in case a fix has already been applied
[20:40] <sergiobenrocha2> one thing i'm a bit confuse is, why whisker menu, gtk3 indicators and light-locker are not in iso already? I have to install PPA, and then do testing... it's not more easy to have all that in official repo? at least in proposed repo
[20:40] <holstein> !ppa
[20:41] <holstein> sergiobenrocha2: you wont want to add ppa's to test packages.. even the dependencies could through the results off
[20:41] <Noskcaj> I've got  basic prpltwtr PPA at https://launchpad.net/~noskcaj/+archive/prpltwtr ready for testing
[20:42] <Noskcaj> I'm trying to get upstream to merge my debian fixes and package it as a native release
[20:42] <holstein> yeah.. accept for dev team ppa's that are requested to be tested sergiobenrocha2  ^
[20:42] <knome> elfy, i actually think it's still a valuable checkpoint
[20:43] <knome> elfy, just mention the regression in the notes (it's an alpha release, people are supposed to read that) and we can carry on with other testing
[21:57] <slickymaster> good night all
[21:57] <ochosi> night slickymaster 
[21:57] <slickymaster> hey ochosi 
[21:58] <slickymaster> ochosi, it's only my part that is missing in the xfdesktop but I'll finish it before the weekend
[21:59] <ochosi> slickymaster: sure, no worries
[21:59] <ochosi> i'll actually be a bit afk in the next days
[21:59] <ochosi> lots travelling and duties when i come home...
[21:59] <slickymaster> yeah, and Christmas is at our doors
[22:03] <knome> hey slickymaster 
[22:03] <slickymaster> hi knome
[22:06] <ochosi> slickymaster: exactly, so we'll see, to the worst we'll get things merged 2014 ;)
[22:07] <slickymaster> ochosi, well, if we're talking about first January week, it's not so bad
[22:11] <ochosi> hehe
[22:11] <ochosi> yeah, i'll be around then again
[22:13] <slickymaster> but we'll have time to wish a merry christmas and a happy new year before that, I hope ochosi
[22:14] <ochosi> yup, hope so too
[22:14] <slickymaster> :)
[22:20] <slickymaster> knome, mind if I bother you and ask you a favor?
[22:23] <knome> slickymaster, not at all
[22:23] <slickymaster> can you please merge https://code.launchpad.net/~slickymaster/ubuntu-manual-tests/ubuntu-manual-tests/+merge/199577 and update the tracker?
[22:23] <slickymaster> to see if it finally gets fixed
[22:24] <knome> sure
[22:24] <slickymaster> you're a gentleman
[22:25] <knome> done
[22:26] <slickymaster>  thanks knome 
[22:26]  * slickymaster bows
[22:26] <knome> np
[23:20] <sergiobenrocha2> i can't reproduce Bug #1259662 - Menus include settings applications
[23:20] <Unit193> It's because you're in the right session, if you are in the Xfce session you get that.
[23:21] <sergiobenrocha2> yes, i'm in xubuntu session
[23:22] <sergiobenrocha2> so, can i change the bug description?
[23:24] <Unit193> It's not a valid bug, 
[23:25] <knome> marked as invalid
[23:27] <brainwash> lool, now I understand this "bug"
[23:29] <Unit193> Would be "fixed" with the merge. :P
[23:32] <sergiobenrocha2> there is a problem to change between xfce and xubuntu session
[23:33] <sergiobenrocha2> if my first choose is xubuntu, then if i logout and login in xfce, there is no change. And xfce --> xubuntu is the same
[23:33] <sergiobenrocha2> *choice
[23:44] <sergiobenrocha2> wait, there are only 3 apps in System menu, Task Manager, Gigolo and other. I changed to Xfce session, and then there are many entries in System menu. But I shutdown and reboot, and then login to xubuntu session, and now there are many entries in System. How can it is possible, if choose "Discard on shutdown" files and settings in Usb-creator?
[23:47] <Unit193> Used to be that going to Xfce from Xubuntu would work, but not to Xubuntu from Xfce.  Remove .config/xfce4 and all should switch well.
[23:50] <sergiobenrocha2> the choice between xfce and xubuntu is inconsistent, someone noticed?
[23:51] <sergiobenrocha2> 3 times i choose xubuntu, i'm sure, and it goes to xfce
[23:52] <sergiobenrocha2> i can see the difference in menu. Sometimes "Xubuntu Website" and "Contribute to Xubuntu is missing", even if i enter in xubuntu session
[23:56] <sergiobenrocha2> i could reproduce this now, but it is random
[23:56] <brainwash> delete your session cache
[23:58] <sergiobenrocha2> i'm trying in VM.
[23:58] <sergiobenrocha2> so, when it shutdow, it erase session cacha, right?
[23:58] <sergiobenrocha2> *cache