[00:20] <Noskcaj> Can some of you leave a comment at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Noskcaj#Xubuntu_PackageSet to help me get packageset upload rights?
[02:33] <sergio-br2> Noskcaj, how can i do a bluetooth testcase, if there isn't ?
[02:34] <sergio-br2> first, hello :p
[02:34] <Noskcaj> hey sergio-br2. Just use the package a bit, see if everything works. Or write a testcase for it
[02:35] <sergio-br2> but have i acces to this things?
[02:36] <sergio-br2> there is no hardware test case for trusty, but there are to saucy. I don't know how to do a test case, but ctrl+c & ctrl+v yeah :)
[02:38] <Noskcaj> Could i have a link please?
[02:40] <sergio-br2> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/1263351
[02:41] <Noskcaj> You don't need a testcase to report a bug, if that's what you mean
[02:41] <sergio-br2> and this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/1263430
[02:41] <sergio-br2> no, this is not what i mean
[02:42] <sergio-br2> i mean that there is no qa to bluetooth things... or i didn't find it
[02:43] <Noskcaj> Only bluetooth thing i can find is http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/306/builds/55992/testcases/1591/results
[02:45] <sergio-br2> hum, i can add test result for bluez, for example, but for gnome-bluetooth i think no
[02:46] <brainwash> doesn't xubuntu ship blueman?
[02:46] <sergio-br2> yeah
[02:47] <sergio-br2> but it does not use gnome-bluetooth
[02:48] <brainwash> do we really need a testcase for bluetooth? hardly one uses it anyway
[02:48] <sergio-br2> and the second bug is with gnome-bluetooth or related
[02:48] <sergio-br2> well...
[02:48] <brainwash> how do these bugs affect xubuntu?
[02:49] <sergio-br2> hum, the first bug affects xubuntu
[02:50] <sergio-br2> blueman does not connect with the device in xubuntu, i think that is a problem with bluez
[02:50] <brainwash> so you will have to update/change the bug report
[02:50] <sergio-br2> so, this bug, i will associate with blueman in lubuntu qa
[02:50] <sergio-br2> why?
[02:51] <brainwash> because xubuntu does not use bluez
[02:51] <sergio-br2> i put bluez as affect. I tried blueman and gnome-bluetooth, and both didn't pair with smartphone
[02:52] <sergio-br2> but blueman don't use bluez?
[02:52] <sergio-br2> sorry, i'm noob
[02:52] <Noskcaj> sergio-br2, don't worry. I manage to look stupid on a daily basis, so you're doing pretty well
[02:52] <sergio-br2> humm, it's true, bluez isn't blueman dependence
[02:53] <brainwash> mmh
[02:54] <sergio-br2> so, what's common with blueman and gnome-bluetooth?
[02:54] <brainwash> the iso actually comes with bluez
[02:54] <brainwash> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/current/trusty-desktop-amd64.manifest
[02:54] <brainwash> well, I don't know
[02:57] <Noskcaj> How much of xfce is C++? I was going to try and learn C or C++ and apparently C++ is easier.
[03:03] <brainwash> much c
[03:05] <Noskcaj> such code, so compile, wow?
[03:06] <brainwash> what?
[03:06] <brainwash> that's not proper english
[03:07] <Noskcaj> Never mind, it's a bad internet joke
[03:56] <sergio-br2> bluetooth experience in xubuntu is much better than in ubuntu :)
[03:57] <sergio-br2> it's less painfull
[03:59] <Noskcaj> I think it leaks memory though. I never used it and it used 40mb of RAM at standby
[03:59] <Noskcaj> (just the indicator visible)
[03:59] <sergio-br2> really?
[04:00] <sergio-br2> i will see that
[04:00] <Noskcaj> last i checked
[04:00] <sergio-br2> well, here don't care, i have 8 GB ram :D
[04:00] <sergio-br2> or at least 4 GB, in the other laptop
[04:00] <Noskcaj> This laptop has 4, but it still annoys me.
[04:02] <Unit193> Noskcaj: It's python isn't it?  So that'd be expected.
[04:06] <Noskcaj> yeah. Python and dead upstream
[04:39] <Lone_Coyote> http://xkcd.com/713/  that one?
[04:39] <sergio-br2> brainwash, Noskcaj, https://github.com/cschramm/blueman/blob/master/README.md
[04:39] <Lone_Coyote> oops, sorry, wrong window
[04:39] <sergio-br2> its seems that blueman uses bluez
[04:40] <Unit193> Lone_Coyote: Heh, still a good one.
[07:33] <DanChapman> Noskcaj, I see you using the process manager, I was able to introspect it fine the other day, but you mentioned a newer version coming, I have 3.2.5 installed here. But anyway were you unable to introspect it? 
[07:34]  * DanChapman jaw drops at the sheer amount of widget trees in gthumb, it's crazy 
[07:34] <elfy> ok - ochosi brainwash ali1234 - so now - indicator panel is not changing to transparent - but is real jet black rather than the sort of greyish black the rest of the panel is
[07:36] <elfy> but - xchat stayed normal - they did tend to happen at the same time - following discussions with ali yesterday - tv hdmi is disconnected still
[07:43] <Noskcaj> DanChapman, I'm not sure i was able to introspect it here. the version should be 3.2.5-2
[07:43] <Noskcaj> nevermind, it does introspect
[07:44] <Noskcaj> so my list of "working" is now gthumb and catfish
[07:45] <elfy> DanChapman: a really basic thought here that I'm not sure I ever got to the bottom of - these autopilot tests - what do they actually test in general - that the thing works or can it do more?
[07:45] <Noskcaj> I only used process manager since i was porting from the other tests
[07:45] <elfy> like catfish - does it test it can find things? 
[07:45] <Noskcaj> elfy, core xfce: that it works, catfish + gthumb: possibly everything
[07:46] <Noskcaj> I assume menulibre and mugshot would work fully too
[07:46] <elfy> Noskcaj: when you say everything - you mean everything that the manual test checks?
[07:47] <Noskcaj> If we have the dev time to make a test, i'm pretty sure yes
[07:47] <DanChapman> elfy yes in theory and written well it can do everything you do manually
[07:47] <elfy> right ok - thanks :)
[07:48] <Noskcaj> DanChapman, Is there a guide anywhere for writing tests for gtk or just use the command list?
[07:48] <elfy> Noskcaj: I understand that - so a generalised plan for us then would be to disable the manual once we are sure that the entirety of the manual test is covered
[07:49] <Noskcaj> Maybe make the manual one a low-priority smoke test, so people can still report errors if they want
[07:51] <elfy> possibly - but that's a long way in the future 
[07:51] <Noskcaj> yeah
[07:51] <elfy> time to be looking at that is not LTS cycle :D
[07:51] <DanChapman> Noskcaj, I have made a start on writing one but it's more aiming at Ubiquity than others which is slightly different but there is no official guide, I mainly use the autopilot documentation myself just replace the Qt/QML referenced stuff with Gtk widges :-)
[07:52] <Noskcaj> ok. I never really know what to replace, but coding isn't my strong point. I barely know what self. does.
[07:53] <elfy> Noskcaj: it's not your strong point ... I hide under rocks 
[07:53] <Noskcaj> :)
[07:54] <elfy> we do what we can :p
[07:58] <DanChapman> Noskcaj, self is exactly what it says. In other languages its similar to syntax like 'this.' and 'me.' which you can use both them if you wanted, self is the 'standard' way and is just the instance the method is bound too.
[07:58] <Noskcaj> ok
[08:00] <Noskcaj> I'll see if i can improve the test tomorrow. Tonight i've got one ftbfs to look at then watch house of cards
[08:00] <DanChapman> Noskcaj, It will click one day :-) I never used to get any of it... and couldn't get how anyone even understood any of it. But the more code you write the easier it becomes
[08:01] <Noskcaj> That's probably my issue. I don't actually code much
[08:03]  * DanChapman is sure that trying to unsubscribe from groupon is just a magic button to triple the junk!!
[08:08] <Noskcaj> I think i'm subscribe to something like that, but i get so much spam from debian, i barely notice
[08:39] <DanChapman> Noskcaj, elfy, what's your thoughts on having a seperate xubuntu-autopilot-tests project? rather than mixing up ubuntu/xubuntu apps in the same project which is kind of confusing and end up having to install loads of deps to run the whole suite? just a thought
[08:40] <Noskcaj> DanChapman, I support it, although most would be far from pretty, and we'd probably need to copy the evince test across
[08:40] <elfy> DanChapman: that sounds like a good idea - the only downside will be if people from say kubuntu start looking - do we end up with projects for all
[08:40] <Noskcaj> One other xubuntu app that introspects is simple-scan
[08:41] <elfy> Noskcaj: not sure we need to copy things - common apps are common - just like we don't have xubuntu manual tests for firefox etc
[08:41] <Noskcaj> elfy, Lubuntu couldn't, and i'm not sure kubuntu have the time, at least till after kde 4.12 is finished
[08:41] <Noskcaj> ok
[08:41] <Noskcaj> And gnome have 2 devs total
[08:41] <elfy> if we did that then I would be inclined to say that a xubuntu-autopilot-tests project would be things specific to us
[08:42] <elfy> Noskcaj: I know what you're saying - but I try to look further ahead 
[08:43] <elfy> while they aren't my/our responsibility - I try to think of as many official flavours when I have a general qa head on :)
[08:43] <Noskcaj> ok
[08:43] <Noskcaj> Maybe we just have a separate branch in the project?
[08:44] <elfy> no idea - but the general theory from DanChapman makes sense to me
[08:44] <DanChapman> hmmm well they could all go under an umbrella project or even at least have a seperate branch ( Noskcaj beat me too it)
[08:44] <elfy> :)
[08:44] <DanChapman> But i think having them all together makes no sense :-)
[08:45] <elfy> agreed
[08:45] <elfy> the trouble with all this - manual/automatic stuff is it's originally done for Ubuntu - then everyone else joins in
[08:46] <elfy> consequently the original plans are done with that in mind
[08:46] <elfy> which is normal enough
[08:52] <DanChapman> elfy true :-) Since xubuntu has quite a few Gtk2 apps and autopilot 'should' be supporting that. I will look into building autopilot-gtk against Gtk2 so it will give more opportunities for better tests :-) 
[08:53] <elfy> that'd be appreciated - though I'm not sure what the future holds for us with those 
[08:53] <DanChapman> elfy, are you looking to move on from them now then?
[08:54] <elfy> not sure what the longish term plan is - for the moment we're not
[08:54] <Noskcaj> g'night buys
[08:54] <elfy> and to be honest I get confused as to which are which at present
[08:54] <elfy> night Noskcaj :)
[08:54] <DanChapman> see ya Noskcaj o/
[10:57] <brainwash> elfy: you do you mean with "so now"? did you disable the compositor?
[11:52] <elfy> yea
[13:20] <brainwash> elfy: oh, my question started with "you" :D
[13:20] <brainwash> disabling the compositor does not really help actually
[13:21] <elfy> installing kubuntu worked wonders :p
[13:22] <elfy> brainwash: to be frank - I'm not worried about it now - I'll just wait for it to land properly in trusty - then I'll worry about it again
[13:22] <elfy> I'm assuming that it will land in time anyway
[13:22] <elfy> back later 
[15:48] <ochosi> elfy: eric was working on a patch – and he posted it to bugzilla already (i think) – that should help with that transparency bug. at least the panel now accepts the changes in bg color and alpha again (so i'm hoping your issue will be resolved by it too)
[15:49] <ochosi> andrzejr, ali1234 ^
[15:49] <ochosi> here you go: https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10561
[15:49] <ochosi> please test and reply on bz whether it works!
[15:53] <ochosi> note: it's not working with all themes/engines yet, but with e.g. adwaita and our themes it's fine (ambiance/radiance don't work, haven't been able to figure out why though yet)
[16:04] <elfy> ochosi: well I can try it - but you know I'll nto have much idea what I'm supposed to do with it :)
[16:05] <ochosi> elfy: well you'd have to follow the instructions to manually compile the panel (as formulated for the saucy instructions) and apply the patch
[16:06] <elfy> k
[16:11] <ochosi> elfy: have you tried reverting the gtk3 indicator packages to see whether the xchat bug still appears?
[16:12] <ochosi> g2g, later guys
[16:12] <ochosi> and gals
[16:13] <elfy> ochosi: nope -= not done anything much - not going to be doing anything this side of xmas tbf
[16:13] <elfy> cya later
[16:15] <elfy> ochosi: not had recurrence of the xchat thing since yesterday morning when ali1234 said it could well be the tv and hdmi so I disconnected
[16:53] <ali1234> "Updating from saucy-proposed fixed the printing indicator on my machine" - no, no it didn't...
[17:44] <andrzejr> ochosi, the patch needs some more work but it mostly does the job
[17:44] <andrzejr> see my comment on bug #10561
[17:45] <andrzejr> https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10561
[19:37] <brainwash> oh, Noskcaj should update his gtk3 indicator ppa then :)
[19:37] <Noskcaj> brainwash, ?
[19:38] <brainwash> https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10561
[19:38] <brainwash> If you got some time to do it
[19:38] <brainwash> I will try it somewhat later
[19:39] <Noskcaj> yeah, i'll do it. Should it be just a patch or is there a new release coming?
[19:39] <Unit193> Though, the patch isn't complete.
[19:39] <brainwash> but it's one step forward
[19:39] <Unit193> Quite.
[19:40] <Unit193> I suppose I should update it to xfdesktop4 4.11.2, as well. >_>
[19:42] <brainwash> oh nice, xfdesktop: "Scale down oversize icons in menus"
[19:43] <brainwash> I'll update it too :D
[19:47] <Unit193> You got tabwin?
[19:47] <brainwash> no
[19:47] <Unit193> Ah, you're no fun.
[19:48] <brainwash> tabwin is the alt-tab switch window, right?
[19:48] <Unit193> Yes, in this case it indicates the new work on it.
[20:02] <brainwash> sergio-br2: editing the conf file did not work for me either, so it looks like xfce4 settings daemon does not disable the actions for the top/bottom touchpad area
[20:03] <brainwash> tapping the top right area triggers a scrollwheel click
[20:03] <sergio-br2> so, it's xfce settings problems?
[20:04] <brainwash> if you call it a problem, then yes
[20:05] <brainwash> synclient -l | grep -i cornerbutton
[20:06] <brainwash> we would need to report it upstream
[20:26] <Noskcaj> Is there a know memory leak in tumblerd?
[20:32] <Noskcaj> Yeah, that's definitely a leak. It's at 300mb now
[20:42] <brainwash> I recall reading about it