knomeslickymaster, the "wiki" team is basically people in the doc team anyway00:16
slickymasterknome,  are you referring to the editors?00:17
knomeslickymaster, referring to the #ubuntu-wiki discussion00:18
slickymasterI saw the mail on the DocumentationTemplate, but assumed that was meant just for the wiki editors and admins00:20
knomethat's a different discussion :)00:20
knomebut it was meant for everybody editing the wiki00:20
knomebecause the templates are for everybody to use00:21
knomemy comment was pointed at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2014-January/018548.html00:22
slickymasterah :)00:23
slickymasterknome, but I remember talking with elfy about it and I got the impression that was composed mostly by ubuntu forum mods and some contributors00:24
knomeit's possible it used to, though ultimately the team is/should be just a (non-separate) subteam of the docs team00:25
knomeconsisting of everybody who is interested in the wiki00:25
slickymasteryes and that is logical00:26
slickymasterbut it's been on stand by for while00:26
knomeit's been active lately ;)00:30
slickymasterwell, keeping in mind the idea of people in the doc team, yes, you're right00:32
knometoo much team structure is bleh anyway00:33
slickymasterknome, but I got to say that the initial idea of migrating some threads from the forum to the wiki strikes me as really good00:33
belkinsaHey all, what's up?00:33
knomeyep, i guess that makes them more discoverable00:33
slickymasterhi belkinsa, how were your holidays00:34
belkinsaThere were fine, yours?00:34
slickymasterkind pf bumpy, but with health, thanks00:35
belkinsaNot a problem.  And I know what you mean, I had a nasty burn out00:48
knomei'm off, have fun belkinsa00:48
belkinsaSee you.00:48
slickymasterI'm off to belkinsa00:49
slickymastercy tomorrow00:49
belkinsaSee you too00:49
slickymasterknome: ping11:11
=== cprofitt_ is now known as cprofitt
knomeslickymaster, pong12:39
SaberX01GM all .. after pulling the ubuntu-doc branch yesterday , I tied to use make status  and it's falling over, I can post the actual error if need be, but is this still used?13:55
SaberX01I played around with different Grep one liners and got a list, but would nice to see the html out from make.13:56
SaberX01like: grep -R 'status="review"/>' ./   and jsut change the review to help or whatever, then I used |wc -l to get a count on what was what on the status indicators.13:57
slickymasterknome: you there?15:09
SaberX01_Is this the best place to discuss ubuntu-docs or is it better to go though the mailing lists?20:36
shaunmSaberX01_: probably ok to ask things here, but if you don't get a response, use the list21:00
SaberX01_Ok, thanks, just had probelm with  .. make status .. not working21:01
shaunmin the ubuntu-docs repository? I don't even see a status target in the Makefile21:02
SaberX01_I was able to build all the files, but when reading through the editing / checking dos online, said to use make status to list the files current status, help, review  etc21:05
shaunmthat might be outdated info. where's that page?21:06
SaberX01_Let me get it, net really slow at the moment.21:07
SaberX01_shaunm, Bottom of this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Checking21:09
SaberX01_the Tags are there cuz I can grep the tag status with: grep -R 'status="review"/>' ./21:10
shaunmSaberX01_: which document are you looking at?21:14
SaberX01_This one: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Checking21:14
shaunmno, I mean on which document are you trying to run make status?21:15
shaunmthe ubuntu-help document in the ubuntu-docs repository?21:15
shaunmthis wiki page is all about docbook, and I think it's probably outdated (though maybe it's correct for some other document)21:16
SaberX01_Oh, I'm not marking them up, was just looking for the files that had a status of "help" on them .. to see if there was any I could help out with. But with 370+ files, that's allot to look through for jsut the "help-wanted" files.21:16
SaberX01_shaunm, Yes, this is system Documentation: lp:ubuntu-doc21:17
SaberX01_I pulled the Repo .. and was lookign to start helping with it, reviewing, maybe a few edites etc.21:17
shaunmyou should probably just use the yelp-check command, from the yelp-tools package21:18
SaberX01_ok .. I'm kinda new to the system docs stuff, so, I need to go read up on yelp-tools not used them before.21:19
SaberX01_Is the Ubuntu dosumentation Page out of date then / needs updating ?21:19
shaunmI can't really say for certain. the team maintains a few different documents, and that info might still be correct for some of them21:21
shaunm(though in that case it should probably say so)21:21
shaunmI just know mallard and upstream yelp stuff21:21
SaberX01_ok, Im looking at yelp-tools now, did not see anything on the wiki about the tools. Mainly Im looking to spend calories, but where is the big sea of documents is the question :-)21:22
SaberX01_shaunm, I just wanted to work on the 14.04 docs and thought I was following the right How-Too there.21:23
shaunmsomewhat useful: https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Yelp/Tools/yelp-check21:24
SaberX01_ok, and 14.04 is all Mallard now yes?21:25
dsmythiesSaberX01_: I don't know about "make status", as I never use it. In the last cycle I didn't even know we were supposed to keep the status lines up to date.21:32
dsmythiesWhy? becuase I came from the server guide and we don't worry about it there.21:32
dsmythiesWe track status on a google page, I'll find the link in a minute...21:32
SaberX01_yelp-check status does what I was after ..21:33
dsmythiesas for creating the html, please see the build wiki page. Link coming in a moment.21:33
dsmythiesOh, and "Little Girl" was working on mkaing all the status pages up to date for the 14.04 cycle a month or two ago, but I forget how far she got.21:34
SaberX01_dsmythies, Yeah, I got all fo the pages to build just fine, but was looking for pages to review, check or whatever, and had no idea where to start looking, so went to the wiki and found that .. make status ..21:34
dsmythiesGive me a moment to find the links.21:35
SaberX01_dsmythies, I read a bit of what Little Girl put out, they using the Kubuntu Wiki Tasks for tracking.21:35
SaberX01_at least for Kubuntu Sys Docs anyway.21:36
dsmythiesWe are using this: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsSw0cKYcffNdFlFakF5M0VjR002UEVvakVPZGpydHc21:38
dsmythiesfor status tracking for 14.0421:39
dsmythiesfor html see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/BuildingDocumentation21:40
SaberX01_Who maintains the Spreadsheer?21:40
dsmythiesor even easier (for just english), see the build html area of: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/UbuntuDesktopGuide21:41
dsmythiesWe all maintain the spreadsheet21:41
SaberX01_I'm not on the Commit list so, just needed to figure out a work-flow and where to start. The Yelp-Tools, if folks use the Status could be really helpful.21:43
SaberX01_In any case, thanks for all the Info .. can start looking through things a bit further now.21:46
dsmythiesSaberX01_: We specially did the getting started page last cycle (previous link) to, hopefully, help people get going. There is also a serverguide version.21:52
dsmythiesat: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/UbuntuServerGuide21:54
SaberX01_Yes, I started on the server guide first, as Im more of a command-line user than desktop. went thought the mailing list, seems there making some changes there as well.21:54
slickymasterknome, there's no need now. it was related with https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HybridGraphics and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/HybridGraphics21:55
belkinsaSaberX01_, welcome to the team, if you are new.21:56
knomeaha, oki21:57
slickymasterknome, if I understood you correctly you're suggesting to merge the wiki page onto the documentation page, right?21:58
knomeno... i think the wiki.u.c page has its own merits as it is21:58
SaberX01_belkinsa, thnx .. just getting a feel for things at the moment .. hope to be able to help out somewhere.21:58
knomewhether some of it should be moved to the community help wiki...21:59
belkinsaNot a problem.  Make sure you join the list and introduce yourself.21:59
slickymasterknome, are you think of placing a redirect link on it?21:59
knomeprobably, but i'm pretty sure somebody wants to track/update exactly only what is on w.u.c21:59
knomei was thinking just a normal link would probably do21:59
knomeif the content of the community help page seems to be in conflict with the w.u.c page, then that should be updated22:00
slickymasterknome, that's my opinion also. That's the reason I pinged earlier this morning.22:00
shaunmusing mallard revision tags and yelp-check is really powerful22:00
slickymasterknome, I'll reply my opinion in both mailing lists22:00
shaunmbut I'm extremely biased on that subject, so take what I say with a grain of salt22:00
knomeslickymaster, also looking at the background, seems like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Config/HybridGraphics is used by the developers to track their work22:01
knomeslickymaster, so that's why i don't think we should poke that too much, or move it22:01
knomeslickymaster, and copying that content over as it is... well if it changes, somebody has to make sure the content is up-to-date, and i don't want that kind of double maintaining effort22:02
slickymasterthat's also why I think that the link should be the best move here22:03
SaberX01_shaunm, I know Im new here, but a quick grep and pipe with yelp-tools status, and bingo, had a status list.22:05
dsmythiesSaberX01_: The google spread sheet is the master list, regardless of other info.22:06
SaberX01_dsmythies, ok22:07
dsmythies... At least that is my understanding. (And as mentioned, I wasn't even updating the status lines last cycle.)22:08
SaberX01_how often are commits made ?22:10
dsmythiesCommits are done as often as required. Anywhere from many per day, to none for many weeks.22:11
SaberX01_I see, and for those of us that are not on the commiters list, we send the changes to the mailing list?22:12
dsmythiesYou can (send to mailing list), but myself I hate that method, because it just tosses the burden to someone else. You should submit a merge proposal, as described in the getting started page (link(s) from earlier)22:16
SaberX01_Ahh, yes, thats a much better way .. thnx22:19
dsmythiesSaberX01_: Are you on the ubuntu-doc mailing list? (Myself, I am somewhat IRC challenged and rarely on IRC)22:22
SaberX01_dsmythies, yes, Im on the mailing list. Have not sent out any mails yet. But it's using my Launchpad account KI7MT22:24
SaberX01_I should just use the one account KI7MT, that's where all my Ubuntu stuff is anyway.22:25
SaberX01_or nick I should say .. I do not have any accounts with SaberX0122:26
SaberX01_be back in a few.22:26
belkinsaSaberX01_, beaware that you could start another one of these months of a flood of e-mails from on list just like I did a few months back.22:28
SaberX01_belkinsa, I've been reading all of the November list mails. Allot of interesting things posted. I tried to follow the Server Guys Proposals, but I kinda got lots of the 7-To Do List :-)22:30
belkinsaCool.  I'm more of a wiki person, so there's some e-mails that I have ignored.22:30
belkinsaWe will get a prefix system going soon.22:31
KI7MTbelkinsa, Im back, prefix system for what?22:32
belkinsaHold on, lookinbg for that message22:32
dsmythiesI still have not caught up on the flurry of e-mail from dec 6th tti dec 16th22:32
dsmythiesI still have not caught up on the flurry of e-mail from dec 6th to dec 16th22:33
belkinsaKI7MT, ^^^22:33
KI7MTmay as well add [ ask ] and [ help ] :-) ... I was gonna ask about all those also :-)22:34
belkinsaAlso, there is one e-mail that I didn't mean to send to the list.22:34
belkinsaYeah, those maybe needed and go ahead.22:34
KI7MTI would think, as a minimum, [ server ] & [ desktop ]22:35
belkinsaAnd [wiki]22:35
KI7MTI dont have a clear understanding of the differences between wiki and help22:36
dsmythiesshaunm, are you still here?22:37
belkinsaWhat was the help prefix for, in your mind?22:37
KI7MTI was referring to wiki.ubuntu.com and help.ubuntu.com22:37
KI7MTand what the intended use / purpose was / is.22:38
belkinsaOh.  Help is what we work on and the wiki is for teams to use.  This is where your LoCo team stuff is.22:38
belkinsaHelp is support22:38
belkinsaWiki is where the doc team's docs are is what I meant22:38
dsmythieshelp.ubuntu.com is the official ubuntu documention22:39
KI7MTOk, so the Help, in an ideal world, should follow closely with the online published Desktop & Server guides yes ?22:39
belkinsaWoah, woah!  Don't use documentation!22:39
belkinsaUse Community Help Wiki.22:39
dsmythiesbelkinsa, ??? help.ubutnu.com is exactly the online published Desktop & Server guides22:40
belkinsaBut there is other things on that wiki also.22:40
KI7MTHere's the thing, I use this, allot: https://help.ubuntu.com/  .. both for personal and IRC support use, and often find, things need adding or updating.22:41
dsmythiesAnd it is NOT a wiki22:41
belkinsaOh, I can read.22:41
* belkinsa facepalms!22:41
belkinsaI shouldn't be multitasking.22:42
dsmythiesKI7MT, Yes many many things need adding or updating22:42
KI7MTdsmythies, Yes, fare enough, not beating on that, what Im after is, should help.ubuntu.com match up with the Server & Desktop guides? In other words, if we edit / update one, should all three not get the updates?22:43
KI7MTOr should thing like ...22:43
KI7MTsshd-server only be in the server guide and links form Desktop & help to the server pages22:44
KI7MTReason I ask is, I found three different pages for OpenSSH Server Config ...22:44
dsmythieshelp.ubtuntu.com is not updated very often. I have been the one doing it os recent, and I only do it later in the cycle for a prepliminary version and then again on the release date for the final version.22:45
KI7MTIn my mind, while one could have an an sshd on their desktop .. should the configuration of that server be in the server guides or help adn desktop too ?22:45
dsmythiesGood question, I don't really know, but earlier others were mentioning "double-maintaining", and we should strive for no double-maintaining.22:47
KI7MTand what's drive that quesiton is, the untold numerb of folks that pop into #ubuntu wih questions. I really dont like to send someone asking about Ubuntu things, to a non-ubuntu site for info, but sometimes, allot of times, we have too.22:47
dsmythiesMyself, I am only familiar with the serverguide version of openssh-server.22:47
KI7MTdsmythies, That's ok, fare enough, was jsut usign that as an example.22:48
KI7MTWherein the Desktop has many itmes exclusive to the DE, the server has many items that can cross over, figuring out where the docs should be, well that's kinda what I was tryign to get my head around.22:50
dsmythiesshaunm, are you still around?22:54
dsmythiesKI7MT, is that an amateur radio call sign? If yes, mine is VE7NP22:59
KI7MTYes, .. howdy neighbor :-)22:59
KI7MTthink I finally have this Nick/Clak thing figured out.23:01

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