[05:59] <elfy> knome: thoughts on this - bug 1266032
[06:14] <elfy> Noskcaj: are we? "We're discussing changing to libreoffice"
[06:14] <elfy> last I saw we'd discussed it and weren't doing anything
[06:18] <Noskcaj> elfy, We'll end up discussing it for 14.10, but i doubt we'll do anything for 14.04. It's what the guy wants to here, rather than "we might fix this, eventually"
[07:46] <ali1234> well i think we should switch sooner rather than later
[07:46] <ali1234> abiword and gnumeric just don't cut it
[07:47] <ali1234> otoh i don't use them often anyway and could probably manage without any off ice stuff on the install cd
[07:48] <elfy> personally I'm in the meh stands - I'm not worried about abiword/gnumeric being there - I install -calc when I install - all I need
[07:48] <Unit193> -calc -gtk -writer
[07:49] <elfy> oh yea - I usually end up with writer as well
[08:49] <Noskcaj> libxfce4ui is getting uploaded now, i'll be safe to drop it from my ppa for trusty
[08:58] <Unit193> Should wait for it to filter down to release of course.
[08:59] <Unit193> But yeah, that's the plan.
[09:00] <ochosi> Noskcaj: nice, who's doing the honors?
[09:33] <Unit193> Noskcaj: Could update xubuntu-docs' d/changelog to format 1.0 if you were bored. :P
[09:43] <slickymaster> morning all
[09:45] <ochosi> morning
[09:45] <ochosi> have any of you used xfburn recently?
[09:45] <ochosi> specifically, for burning dvds
[09:46] <slickymaster> ochosi do you have 5 minutes to discuss something about eric_the_idiot views on xfdesktop
[09:46] <ochosi> slickymaster: sure, shoot
[09:47] <slickymaster> ochosi: eric points that the gtk_file_chooser in folder mode can be confusing and the user might try to pick the individual files rather than hitting open once they are in the desired folder
[09:47] <slickymaster> but the user has to click at the desired image, right?
[09:48] <slickymaster> ochosi: thing is, I don't see any 'open' button
[09:49] <ochosi> click the folder-combobox -> other
[09:49] <ochosi> i'm pretty sure that's what he's talking about
[09:49] <ochosi> part of the problem is that the window-title says "open file"
[09:49] <slickymaster> ochosi: ok, that one is covered
[09:49] <ochosi> which is really misleading
[09:49] <ochosi> not sure how easily that can be fixed though, as it's a dialog straight from gtk
[09:50] <slickymaster> another thing, the “Chronologically” option. He mentions something about that you both worked on. What is this?
[09:53] <ochosi> what he refers to is that you can change the background at certain times/intervals of the day
[09:54] <ochosi> so theoretically, you could show them based on when they were taken (timestamp)
[09:54] <ochosi> which could be quite cool, so e.g. around 4 o'clock you'd only get pics that were taken around that time of the day
[09:55] <slickymaster> but that's already covered in the usage section
[09:55] <ochosi> yeah, but this hasn't been implemented
[09:55] <ochosi> chronologically just goes through the images, but not based on their timestamps
[09:55] <ochosi> try it, it goes through them in their sort-order
[09:56] <slickymaster> I'll try it
[09:56] <slickymaster> one last thing, the removable devices expander
[09:57] <ochosi> so if you have e.g. a folder with 5 pics, named pic_05.jpg, pic_20.jpg ..., it'll sort them according to filename and then spread them equally over one day
[09:57] <ochosi> yup?
[09:57] <slickymaster> is this also related to the backdrop gtk_file_chooser in folder mode?
[09:58] <ochosi> sry, i don't understand
[09:58] <slickymaster> he mentions that the removable devices expander isn't covered?
[09:59] <ochosi> this is just an expander that let's you distinguish between different types of devices: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-01082014-105917am.php
[10:00] <slickymaster> ah, now I see to what it's related
[10:00] <slickymaster> ochosi: that coverered everything
[10:00] <slickymaster> thanks
[10:01] <slickymaster> I'll ping you when I'll get everything done
[10:06] <ochosi> slickymaster: thanks a lot!
[10:10] <slickymaster> np
[10:40] <ochosi> ali1234: mind if i ask you a quick question wrt the background pixmap in the greeter?
[10:41] <ali1234> sure
[10:43] <ochosi> i think drawing the bg pixmap correctly behind the login_window won't be a problem, but somehow getting the reference to the background pixmap doesn't work
[10:43] <ochosi> what i tried so far is adding a global_var that holds a copy of this pixbuf: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lightdm-gtk-greeter-team/lightdm-gtk-greeter/trunk/view/head:/src/lightdm-gtk-greeter.c#L1687
[10:44] <ochosi> this would be the most minimal diff to illustrate what i'm trying: http://dpaste.com/1541422/
[10:44] <ochosi> when i then try to gdk_cairo_set_source_pixbuf (cr, background_pixbuf, 0, 0); in the draw-callback, the greeter shows itself for a splitsecond, then crashe
[10:44] <ochosi> s
[10:44] <ochosi> (and oddly my logs are pretty empty, so i'm a bit stumped)
[10:45] <ochosi> i might be trying things the totally wrong way though...
[10:45] <ali1234> ok.
[10:45] <ali1234> X11 pixmaps are reference counted inside the server
[10:46] <ali1234> when you XFree it, it really decrements the counter
[10:47] <ali1234> actually which pixmap are you talking about?
[10:47] <ochosi> sorry, line fail, i meant this one http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lightdm-gtk-greeter-team/lightdm-gtk-greeter/trunk/view/head:/src/lightdm-gtk-greeter.c#L1686
[10:48] <ali1234> ok so notice that p *might* get unrefed
[10:49] <ali1234> where exactly did you copy the variable?
[10:49] <ochosi> directly after 1687
[10:49] <ali1234> right so that's absolutely wrong :)
[10:49] <ochosi> line 16 here: http://dpaste.com/1541422/
[10:49] <ochosi> ok :)
[10:50] <ali1234> look at those "g_object_unref" calls
[10:50] <ali1234> look at line 1701
[10:51] <ochosi> yeah, it gets unrefd there, which is why i thought i have to copy it before that happens
[10:51] <ali1234> right but you can't just copy the pointer (lol)
[10:51] <ali1234> what you have to do is ... not unref it until you are done
[10:52] <ali1234> so line 1701
[10:52] <ali1234> replace it with this: if(background_pixmap) { g_object_unref(background_pixmap); } background_pixmap = p;
[10:52] <ali1234> and make sure that background_pixmap is initialized to null
[10:53] <ochosi> yup, did initialize that to null
[10:53] <ali1234> and then g_object_unref(background_pixmap); before exiting the greeter
[10:53] <ali1234> hopefully you see why this works, if not i'll try to explain it
[10:54] <ali1234> also you have to do this at line 1701 because those imageops above create a new image, and then delete the old one, and assign the new one to the old pointer
[10:55] <ali1234> you'll need to switch between pixmap/solid background somehow too
[10:57] <ochosi> yeah, the pixbuf loading and modifying is a little complicated at this point
[10:57] <ali1234> nah, it's not that complicated :)
[10:57] <ali1234> also i simplified it a bit
[10:59] <ochosi> so i never unref p? or does it later get unrefd via the background_pixbuf
[10:59] <ali1234> yes, it gets unref'd the next time you go through the loop
[11:00] <ali1234> p is just a pointer to some arbitrary memory, the pointer itself is not ref counted
[11:00] <ochosi> ok
[11:01] <ochosi> yay, works now
[11:01] <ochosi> thanks :)
[11:01] <ali1234> np :)
[11:47] <ochosi> ali1234: rounded corners transparency without the xshape extension: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-01082014-123542pm.php
[11:47] <ali1234> cool
[11:47] <ali1234> looks good :)
[11:53] <ochosi> thanks for helping me sort that out :)
[12:53] <ali1234> found a bug: http://imagebin.org/285688
[12:53] <ali1234> the menu opens in the wrong place
[12:58] <brainwash> ali1234: the dream is over, after applying the latest trusty updates (incl. kernel 3.13) I now got the black screen flicker on login
[12:59] <ali1234> that is your graphics driver
[12:59] <brainwash> abiword completely refuses to start, apport points to some issue with the restricted AMD driver libraries
[13:00] <brainwash> the driver did not change
[13:03] <brainwash> Unit193: were you using kernel 3.13 since early RCs? you were the one noticing the black screen flicker, right?
[13:12] <ali1234> what creates thumbnails in xfce? it's broken apparently on my machine
[13:12] <ochosi> tumbler
[13:12] <ochosi> and the menu-position bug is known to some extent with gtk3 indicators
[13:13] <ochosi> at least i have heard of it before, but never saw it like this
[13:15] <ali1234> i saw xfce have problems like this before a long time ago
[13:15] <ali1234> right now though i really need to fix tumbler :/
[13:16] <ali1234> all the services are running correctly
[13:16] <ochosi> what's wrong with it?
[13:16] <ali1234> i don't get thumbnails in thunar or xfdesktop background selector
[13:16] <ochosi> i mean does it not do anything at all? or crash at startup?
[13:16] <ochosi> hmm
[13:16] <ali1234> i used to, but now i don't
[13:20] <brainwash> did you check the folder permissions?
[13:20] <brainwash> ~/.thumbnails
[13:21] <ali1234> it looks ok
[13:23] <ochosi> enough free space?
[13:24] <ali1234> yes
[13:24] <ochosi> (weird question, i know, but...)
[13:30] <ochosi> oh noes, we've got a libreoffice thread again on x-d ML
[13:31] <elfy> yep - but you can probably bet your last euro that those wanting it will want others to deal with it for them
[13:31] <brainwash> still better than dealing with abiword :)
[13:32] <elfy> not for me it isn't ;)
[13:34] <ochosi> yeah, ppl usually want others doing the work for them
[13:37] <ali1234> hmmmm i think i know why
[13:40] <ali1234> could someone with working thumbnails run this for me: ldd `which thunar` | grep tumb
[13:40] <ali1234> does it output libtumbler?
[13:40] <knome> ochosi, didn't i tell them "no way" already? :P
[13:40] <knome> and elfy ^
[13:43] <ochosi> ali1234: i don't get any output there
[13:43] <ochosi> and tumbler works here
[13:43] <ali1234> hmm
[13:43] <ali1234> are you sure?
[13:43] <ochosi> knome: yeah, i received your mail a bit later than when we discussed
[13:43] <ochosi> ali1234: yes, i just moved a pixmap over to a new dir to check, tumbler is still working
[13:49] <ali1234> so what is happening is that the queue function works and it queues files to be thumbnailed, but then it never happens
[13:49] <ali1234> so it doesn't use the built in fallback
[13:50] <ali1234> hmm... i did rm -rf ~/.thumbnails ; killall tumblerd and now it works again
[13:51] <ali1234> it definitely wasn't a permission issue though
[13:51] <ali1234> but maybe a corrupted thumbnail in the cache or something
[13:52] <ochosi> hmm, not nice though
[13:52] <ochosi> i mean it's an easy-enough workaround for ppl, but it would be great if tumbler were more solid in that respect
[13:54] <ali1234> yeah. unfortunately i can no longer reproduce the issue
[13:54] <ochosi> :/
[13:54] <ochosi> you should've just moved the thumbnail-folder to trash ;)
[13:55] <ali1234> i'm pretty sure it broke while i was using xfdesktop and not thunar
[13:55] <ali1234> i think it tried to display an icon for some huge file
[13:55] <ali1234> maybe i can reproduce it that way
[14:37] <brainwash> ochosi: does sound only stop playing after a vt switch if pulseaudio is being used?
[14:37] <ochosi> brainwash: it doesn't stop for me here...
[14:38] <brainwash> oh
[14:38] <ochosi> i don't really have an explanation for that though
[14:38] <brainwash> just switched to tty1 and sound stop playing after like 5sec
[14:39] <ochosi> i guess some consolekit fun
[14:39] <brainwash> strange delay
[14:39] <brainwash> consolekit is gone
[14:39] <ochosi> eh, policykit
[14:39] <brainwash> right
[14:39] <ochosi> i tend to mix the different *kits up
[14:39] <brainwash> maybe polkit
[14:40] <ochosi> that's what the guys in ubuntu-desktop suggested at least
[14:40] <ochosi> (approximately)
[14:41] <brainwash> but that is a general issue then, why does pulseaudio stop playing sound in this case? the X session is still running and not locked in any way
[14:41] <brainwash> :(
[14:42] <ochosi> well another seats becomes active and that gets the priority (for audio-playback, in this case)
[14:42] <ochosi> it's really logical, if you ask me
[14:45] <brainwash> another seat becomes active when switching to tty1?
[14:46] <ali1234> yes
[14:48] <brainwash> oh, you are not talking about logind seats
[15:05] <ali1234> ochosi: so from what i gather from the chat the other day, the fact that audio stops is entirely cooperative and not enforced in any meaningful way
[15:07] <ochosi> yeah, i think so
[15:08] <ochosi> btw, we put two new items on our light-locker roadmap that'll help with that
[15:08] <ochosi> i mean indirectly, by locking the session without vt-switch
[15:08] <ali1234> yeah
[15:11] <ochosi> actually it's a two-step plan
[15:11] <ochosi> first, introduce an option to only switch the vt when the mouse moves
[15:11] <ochosi> so as long as your screen is blank, i.e. you're not intentionally doing something, the music will keep on playing
[15:12] <ochosi> then you move your mouse -> vt-switch -> music stops -> login -> music continues
[15:13] <ochosi> not ideal, but a step ahead (and easier to do than loading the greeter) ^
[15:23] <ali1234> yeah that would work
[16:03] <slickymaster> ochosi: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=xfdesktop-docs:usage is all set taking in consideration eric's opinions on http://dpaste.com/1534821/
[16:04] <ochosi> eric_the_idiot: ^
[16:04] <ochosi> thanks slickymaster 
[16:04] <ochosi> currently in the middle of something, but i'll get to it later
[16:05] <slickymaster> ochosi: I just haven't covered the spanning screen because it deals with a multidisplay setup which I'm not able to provide :( 
[16:05] <slickymaster> np
[16:05] <ochosi> no problem, we'll fix that later
[16:06] <knome> bluesabre, pingading
[17:19] <slickymaster> bbl
[17:59] <elfy> lderan: can you get where we are with autopilot up together for tomorrow's meeting if possible?
[18:17] <jamees> Alguém me ajuda?
[18:17] <jamees> Help me please?
[18:18] <elfy> jamees: #xubuntu is the support channel
[18:18] <jamees> sorry i'm novice in xubuntu
[18:19] <jamees> and speak a little english
[18:19] <jamees> I can not estratir a file
[18:20] <knome> jamees, this is not the support channel
[18:20] <knome> !br | jamees 
[18:21] <jamees> Thanks! Sorry!
[18:23] <sergio-br2> hey, there is no 'ê' in portuguesa.
[18:24] <sergio-br2> and it is "Obrigado", not "Obrigada"
[18:25] <knome> sergio-br2, say "!br is <reply> Correct text" without the quotes and it'll be fixed.
[18:25] <knome> i guess that might be an alias for !pt, but that's easily fixed..
[18:26] <knome> (it'll be fixed == somebody will look at it)
[18:26] <elfy> :)
[18:26] <brainwash> somebody: please fix it!
[18:26] <sergio-br2> hum, let me try
[18:27] <sergio-br2> !br is <reply> Por favor, use #ubuntu-br para ajuda em português. Para entrar no canal por favor faça "/join #ubuntu-br" sem as aspas. Para a comunidade local portuguêsa, use #ubuntu-pt. Obrigada.
[18:27] <sergio-br2> !br is <reply> Por favor, use #ubuntu-br para ajuda em português. Para entrar no canal por favor faça "/join #ubuntu-br" sem as aspas. Para a comunidade local portuguesa, use #ubuntu-pt. Obrigado.
[18:28] <sergio-br2> !br
[18:28] <knome> sergio-br2, it's forwarded. cheers
[18:28] <knome> (it's not automatically changed)
[18:29] <sergio-br2> hum, someone take a look and do the change?
[18:29] <sergio-br2> i don't know irc things
[18:30] <sergio-br2> knome, thanks
[18:30] <elfy> sergio-br2: someone will - it's an irc op thing - they'll get around to it when they stop playing :)
[18:31] <sergio-br2> haha, ok
[18:31] <brainwash> looks like there are some issues with the new trusty kernel (3.13) and the restricted AMD driver
[18:31] <elfy> that sucks 
[18:31] <elfy> for you :)
[18:32] <brainwash> they should use the proposed repo
[18:32] <sergio-br2> only amd driver? i had trouble with nvidia 331 in trusty today
[18:32] <brainwash> maybe nvidia too
[18:33] <brainwash> the AMD one does not build properly against kernel 3.13
[18:33] <brainwash> so you are not able to start the Unity session at all :D
[18:34] <brainwash> in Xubuntu some apps refuse to start and act slow/weird
[18:34] <brainwash> or
[18:34] <elfy> running the new kernel on nvidia here
[18:34] <brainwash> open source or restricted driver?
[18:34] <elfy> sergio-br2: I had trouble with -331 yesterday and about 2 weeks ago - same issue
[18:35] <elfy> brainwash: nouveau here atm
[18:35] <elfy> NOT trying nvidia again - though I might see if -331-updates fares better
[18:35] <sergio-br2> nouveau works well, proprietary don't
[18:36] <elfy> some issue with nvidia-prime failing - and it appears to do something with the lightdm.conf too
[18:36] <elfy> not had time to dig a bit more tbh
[18:37] <elfy> sergio-br2: I get this with nouveau http://i.imgur.com/VPyW1RS.jpg and http://i.imgur.com/mIU9sQZ.jpg
[18:42] <sergio-br2> hey, same problem here
[18:43] <sergio-br2> elfy, the 2º image, if i boot in windows first and then boot to xubuntu, then i have this strange behavior, with peaces of windows...
[18:43] <elfy> good - at some point I'll do a bug report 
[18:43] <sergio-br2> the 1º is if i turn on computer, and choose xubuntu
[18:43] <elfy> sergio-br2: is that a cold start or restart - I get the artifacts from another session on reboot/restart
[18:44] <elfy> the first from a cold boot
[18:44] <sergio-br2> yeah, same here
[18:48] <elfy> good 
[18:57] <elfy> bbl
[19:17] <elfy> Noskcaj: just quickly - I'm not here - libxfce4ui came though in updates here - nothing has blown up :)
[19:17] <elfy> thanks :)
[19:17] <Noskcaj> elfy, no problems? Yay
[19:20] <lderan> elfy, sure thing with the autopilot :)
[19:34] <Noskcaj> Unit193, I assume you mean d/copyright? d/changelog seems fine. Also, why is it cdbs?
[19:50] <lderan> elfy, i might have to leave my autopilot findings in an email, i can't gurantee i will be there for the meeting tomorrow
[19:53] <Noskcaj> lderan, What autopilot findings?
[19:54] <lderan> the current state of the progress
[19:57]  * jarnos pushed development of xdg-screensaver (package xdg-utils) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=42776 I hope we get an updated package for the next Xubuntu.
[19:57] <lderan> have you had any fuirther luck with the introsepction bits Noskcaj?
[19:59] <Noskcaj> lderan, gthumb introspects fine, as does simple-scan and all of blusabre's programs, i'm just really bad with python so nothing has happened
[20:01] <elfy> lderan: yea - that's fine :)
[20:02] <lderan> Noskcaj, woo sounds good to me :)
[20:08] <brainwash> ochosi: do you plan to add a light border to more things? first the new terminal icon, now the greeter panel, what's next? :P
[20:08] <ochosi> yeah, more light to the world!
[20:09] <brainwash> I like it
[20:10] <brainwash> hopefully we get even more visual improvements for trusty 
[20:10] <ochosi> phew, finally i've done something you like!
[20:11] <brainwash> can the height of the active tab be changed via the theme files?
[20:12] <ochosi> in gtk3 you have fine-grain control ove that
[20:12] <ochosi> in gtk2 i think there might be a setting too
[20:14] <brainwash> just wondering, pcmanfm does it already although I'm using greybird
[20:14] <ochosi> does what?
[20:14] <ochosi> and how
[20:14] <ochosi> screenshot plz
[20:14] <brainwash> the active tab is 2 pixels bigger
[20:15] <ochosi> the same is true in greybird everywhere
[20:15] <ochosi> if standard tabs are used
[20:16] <ochosi> http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-01082014-091606pm.php
[20:16] <brainwash> so thunar behaves differently?
[20:16] <ochosi> i have no idea how pcmanfm works, so...
[20:17] <brainwash> you mean thunar?
[20:17] <ochosi> no, i don't know how tabs look in pcmanfm or how they're packed
[20:17] <ochosi> so how would i know the diff?
[20:17] <ochosi> and true, i've never used tabs in thunar
[20:18] <brainwash> pcmanfm tabs looks like those in the screenshot
[20:18] <brainwash> so it's the normal behavior
[20:18] <ochosi> depends on how you look at it
[20:18] <ochosi> terminal also has tabs like thunar
[20:19] <brainwash> right, thunar's tabs are different
[20:19] <ochosi> (and anyway, i can't see how those 2px really matter)
[20:19] <brainwash> yes, these tabs expand and fill the whole bar
[20:19] <brainwash> 2 px :(
[20:20] <brainwash> consistent look
[21:01] <Unit193> brainwash: Nope.
[21:03] <Unit193> Noskcaj: Right, was really late, thought I typed that one.  No idea, but changed that locally.
[21:25] <Noskcaj> knome, Mind if i change xubuntu-docs from cdbs to dh?
[21:25] <knome> no, if it works (tm)
[21:32] <Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/AolMw4gUSgz3Sb14wE7G what I had for that.
[21:33] <Noskcaj> Yeah, looks like that's all that's needed. I'll just debdiff to check i didn't break anything
[21:34] <Unit193> I didn't change the copyright though.
[21:37] <Unit193> knome: It'd be pretty easy to package in the other translations, but when you click help from the menu it'd still go to the English one.  Not looked extensivly into how to do that.
[21:40] <knome> Unit193, one of the options, probably easy one, is to create a simple link to the startpage (not the desktop-guide start) saying "see here for the translated docs"
[21:40] <knome> and another page that listed them all
[21:45] <slickymaster> good night all
[21:46] <ochosi> evening
[21:46] <ochosi> slickymaster: it's looking more realistic now that we'll get versioned docs
[21:46] <ochosi> talked to NSchermer and he approved the idea
[21:47] <slickymaster> that's terrific
[21:47] <slickymaster> really good bewa
[21:47] <slickymaster> news ^^
[21:48] <slickymaster> let's hope eric_the_idiot agrees and likes the alterations made to the Usage section
[21:49] <ochosi> yup
[22:49] <ochosi> any trusty testers here?
[22:50] <slickymaster> o/
[22:50] <ochosi> quick question, are you using the shimmer daily PPA?
[22:50] <brainwash> I do use git
[22:50] <slickymaster> nopes, just testing it out of the box
[22:51] <ochosi> there is one thing i'd like ppl to test
[22:51] <ochosi> i recently removed gnome from the inherits-line in elementary-xfce
[22:51] <brainwash> hopefully a new border :)
[22:51] <ochosi> a new border?
[22:51] <slickymaster> shoot ochosi, I'll set up a new vbox tomorrow
[22:51] <brainwash> so it's icon theme related?
[22:51] <ochosi> so you need to use elementary-xfce from the shimmer daily PPA for the test to make sense
[22:52] <ochosi> brainwash: indeed
[22:52] <ochosi> you're a keen observer ;)
[22:52] <brainwash> and you want us to look for missing icons now?
[22:52] <ochosi> i want to know whether we suffer (many) regressions from dropping the gnome-icon-theme
[22:52] <brainwash> :D
[22:52] <ochosi> this can most easily done in a system that you *use*
[22:53] <ochosi> so in case any of you do, this is very harmless
[22:53] <ochosi> to the worst, you'll see a broken icon
[22:53] <knome> though you need to be running trusty, you say ;P
[22:53] <ochosi> yeah, i'd rather
[22:53] <knome> yeah
[22:53] <ochosi> i mean if you notice stuff in saucy, then yeah, i wanna fix that too
[22:53] <ochosi> cause it'll most likely affect trusty
[22:53] <knome> i'd imagine running trusty gives you more headache than missing icons...
[22:53] <slickymaster> I can do it tomorrow in my trusty box, at work, ochosi 
[22:54] <ochosi> but i'm testing saucy all the time anyway
[22:54] <ochosi> thanks slickymaster