[12:50] <wrst> tenc: I must say I like some flash with my desktop, I mean we have the hardware why not use it? :)
[12:54] <tenc> wrst: I don't disagree--as long as the flash is smooth and unobtrusive. :)
[12:54] <wrst> very true
[12:54] <wrst> and good morning tenc
[13:01] <tenc> Good morning to you sir. ^^
[13:08] <wrst> tenc: I have a love/hate relationship with gnome
[13:10] <tenc> wrst: From what I've read it seem like most people do. No one seems to endorse it unreservedly.
[13:14] <wrst> no they improve some things then take features out of others its frustrating
[13:14] <wrst> hard to say bad things about kde, but I just don't like it
[13:14] <wrst> and that's just a personal opinion of course
[13:17] <tenc> Haha, yeah, there is something about KDE isn't there? Just doesn't feel right.
[13:17] <wrst> yeah people that love it love it
[13:17] <wrst> I think its mainly how gtk apps are just horrendous in kde without a lot of love
[13:18] <wrst> specifically firefox
[13:35] <tenc> Yeah who wants to deal with that? I mean I don't mind putting time in to an OS and being intimate with config details but leave me out of the window decorating. Not my area of expertise. :)
[13:44] <wrst> yeah that's my thing tenc, I want good defaults
[13:44] <wrst> most apps seem to wrok well with gtk based desktops
[13:44] <tenc> ^^
[14:09] <tenc> So, wrst, how come you you hang out in the #ubuntu channel if you're an Arch guy?
[14:10] <wrst> started out as an ubuntu user :)
[14:10] <wrst> and still use it some on my mom's computer is the main place
[14:10] <wrst> pretty much anywhere else I use debian
[14:10] <wrst> or arch
[14:11] <wrst> just depends on what I'm doing
[14:13] <tenc> I guess a lot of people probably start out with ubuntu. I love the history behind each distro, it's like they each have their own lore.
[14:14] <wrst> ha ha yep and their own fanatical fan base
[14:15] <wrst> I like arch not becuause of anything other than fresh packages without hassle
[14:15] <wrst> and no upgrading every 6 months
[14:20] <tenc> I've only been using Arch for a few weeks but the stand out points for me are definitely fresh packages, simple package management, outstanding wiki resource and "The Arch Way" which I strongly agree with.
[14:21] <wrst> yes people that aren't into that will not be a fan
[14:21] <wrst> I wouldn't want to install arch for my mom, but for me I really like it and after you do it a couple of times the install isn't bad
[14:23] <tenc> It really isn't. And I think it's rewarding to spend time getting to know each corner of an OS--which Arch makes possible with it's predictably simple approach.
[14:24] <tenc> A lot of what ubuntu in particular brings to the table is obsfucating things for convenience which is a big trade-off.
[14:26] <wrst> yes and there are times when I want that trade off, but after using arch and learning more about what makes things tick, I find a lot of ubuntu stuff just gets in the way
[14:26] <wrst> debian seems to be a good tradeoff for me
[14:26] <wrst> when I want something with an installer
[14:29] <tenc> I haven't tried base debian yet but I'm sure I will. Seems like every few weeks I find myself back at distrowatch.com reading up on my next adventure. :)
[14:33] <tenc> openSUSE and CentOS are on that list.
[14:41] <wrst> ha ha
[14:42] <wrst> nothing like some distro hopping
[15:06] <tenc> wrst: When did you start with ubuntu?
[15:16] <wrst> hmm around 2007
[15:17] <wrst> tenc: I started out trying ubuntu, but had a machine with a braodcom wireless chip, this was just before they started with jockey and managing restricted drivers
[15:17] <wrst> so I ended up using mandriva on that machine they had really good tools for most things
[15:19] <tenc> I have a Broadcom wireless chip in this laptop. Took a while to make it behave. My desktop is all Intel though so that's been a breeze to manage.
[15:20] <tenc> Did you start with Linux personal or work reasons?
[15:20] <wrst> personal
[15:20] <wrst> just to use some old hardware that at the time was designed for windows ME :)
[15:20] <tenc> Oops, missed a word *for
[15:21] <wrst> braodcom even has gotten better over the years its nto near the pain it used to be
[15:21] <tenc> Oh WinME... my goodness.
[15:21] <wrst> oh yeah
[15:21] <wrst> wb netritious
[15:22] <tenc> Yeah--I mean getting this chip functional wasn't terrible but it was more involved than anything else to get running.
[15:24] <tenc> I wonder when Linux as a whole got better about that--I remember my first venture with Linux back in 2000? 2001? Somewhere around there I tried to put RHL on my desktop and it was just over my head at the time but since then driver support and online documentation has come sooo far.
[15:25] <tenc> I didn't really come back to Linux until just last year. Completely different experience.
[15:30] <wrst> yes I mean ubuntu is easier to install than windows by a long shot I think
[18:54] <cyberanger> well, as an overall yeah
[18:55] <cyberanger> but certain things give me a headache still
[18:55] <cyberanger> granted, it's usually more enterprise stuff now, but scanner ethernet and wifi driver support could be improved
[19:00] <tenc>  ^^ indeed cyberanger.
[19:04] <tenc> tmux is all you need.
[19:19]  * Unit193 uses screen. :D

[19:39] <wrst> cyberanger: same could be said about windows also
[19:39] <wrst> their driver support isn't exactly great
[19:42] <wrst> and don't even get me start on OS X
[21:43] <tenc> Anyone know if uptime metrics be normalized by the number of CPU cores or threads?
[23:36] <cyberanger> tenc: not offhand