[05:09] <Kilos> morning all
[05:26] <Kilos> hi Private_User hows things?
[05:39] <Kilos> wbb
[07:44] <Kilos> hi Gotango 
[07:47] <Gotango> Hi Kilos
[08:32] <Gotango> Kilos i went to the AMD website and typed my graphic cards details. I got this
[08:32] <Gotango> Download:
[08:32] <Gotango> AMD Catalyst™ 13.1 Proprietary Linux x86 Display Driver 	
[08:32] <Gotango> 102 MB	13.1	1/21/2013
[08:32] <Gotango> Description:
[08:32] <Gotango> Automated installer and Display Drivers for Xorg 6.9 to Xserver 1.12 and Kernel version up to 3.4
[08:34] <Gotango> But ubuntu already got the Xorg thing here on my lappy
[08:36] <Kilos> it will merge what is needed
[08:36] <Gotango> The drivers above support English only.
[08:36] <Gotango> The display driver requires POSIX shared memory to be enabled on the system.
[08:36] <Kilos> but i told you to use the additional drivers tool
[08:36] <Gotango> Kernal Sources package is no longer required if Kernel Header package is installed.
[08:36] <Gotango> 32-Bit packages must be installed for 64-Bit Linux drivers to install or work.
[08:36] <Gotango> *These sites are community resources, and are not supported by, or affiliated with AMD in any way
[08:36] <Kilos> use additional rather
[08:37] <Gotango> I dont know if additional drivers picked up the same drivers as above
[08:37] <Kilos> always try to use what the pc wants to get
[08:37] <Kilos> additional reads the hardware and gets the right stuff
[08:37] <Gotango> Okay, why is Xorg here on my lappy
[08:38] <Kilos> thats what makes the screen work
[08:38] <Gotango> Or is it an old version of Xorg
[08:38] <Kilos> oh ya you havent upgraded so could be
[08:39] <Gotango> How do i check Xorg version
[08:39] <Kilos> but additional will sort it
[08:39] <Kilos> dont worry about it man the os knows what is needed
[08:39] <Gotango> Okay hope so
[08:40] <Kilos> thats why the additional drivers utility was added
[08:40] <Gotango> When i have enough data i will tick the activate button at additional drivers
[08:40] <Kilos> good
[08:41] <Kilos> and do the upgrade
[08:41] <Kilos> then everything will be better and faster
[08:42] <Gotango> Upgrade will upgrade everything, including programs like gimp, which was 20mb , the newer version is 50mb
[08:42] <Kilos> whew
[08:42] <Kilos> do you use gimp?
[08:42] <Kilos> do you know gimp?
[08:42] <Gotango> Cant i choose what gets upgraded
[08:42] <Kilos> in the update manager yes
[08:43] <Gotango> Yes i used it on windows
[08:43] <Gotango> Use gimp here too
[08:43] <Kilos> you can untick things in update manager
[08:43] <Kilos> but not at random
[08:44] <Gotango> I dont want things upgraded that i will never use, just the important stuff i want upgraded
[08:44] <Kilos> there are lots of security upgrades that you need to keep the pc safe 
[08:44] <Kilos> find what you dont use and ask here
[08:45] <Kilos> some work with other things so you cant remove them but there will be things i had installed that you dont need
[08:45] <Gotango> I download from trusted souces ,and hardly visit xrated websites. i dont need that much security
[08:45] <Kilos> those we can remove from cli
[08:46] <Kilos> there are crackers out there as well
[08:46] <Kilos> security isnt only for sites
[08:47] <Gotango> What things did you install
[08:47] <Kilos> i dunno
[08:47] <Gotango> nvidia is stil here
[08:47] <Kilos> didnt we remove it
[08:48] <Gotango> You said not to
[08:48] <Gotango> How to uninstall nvidia
[08:48] <Kilos> you can look in synaptic at what is installed and right click remove from there but read what else it wants to remove before you tell it ok
[08:49] <Gotango> ok
[08:49] <Kilos> if you see it wants to remove ubuntu-desktop then cancel that
[08:49] <Kilos> or you go black screen
[08:50] <Gotango> There is alot of nvidia stuff in synaptics
[08:50] <Kilos> installed?
[08:51] <Gotango> 39 nvidia packages
[08:51] <Kilos> that show installed?
[08:51] <Kilos> we then removed nvidia-173
[08:51] <Gotango> Some got a green tick some dont
[08:51] <Kilos> green tick is installed
[08:52] <Gotango> ok
[08:52] <Gotango> nvidia-173 is installed green tick
[08:52] <Kilos> bgut maybe its better to wait till you have done additional drivers before you remove them
[08:53] <Kilos> remove that
[08:53] <Kilos> and nvidia-173-updates
[08:54] <Gotango> ok, uhm fglrx has not got a green tick when i type ati
[08:55] <Kilos> if needed it will install from additional
[08:56] <Kilos> additional installs what is needed
[08:57] <Gotango> ok , i will do the additional driver first , then after decide what to upgrade from Update manager
[08:57] <Kilos> ok
[09:12] <Kilos> look if gwibber and thunderbird are installed
[09:14] <Gotango> Nothing for them in search
[09:14] <Gotango> I use opera for email too
[09:19] <Gotango> I see games in synaptic aswell. Is the software center an extension of that
[09:20] <Kilos> yes synaptic and software centre use the same repo
[09:22] <Gotango> oh ok
[09:24] <Kilos> but i like synaptic because its much faster and more user friendly i thinkk
[09:26] <Gotango> Yeah Sofware center always hangs , after its crashed my pc i'm not going there again
[09:26] <Kilos> most likely because its not upgraded
[09:27] <Kilos> dont forget that system has all desktop stuff installed
[09:27] <Gotango> Will have to add it to upgrade list then
[09:28] <Kilos> dont just untick random stuff in the pdate manager when you update
[09:28] <Gotango> You mean Upgrade 
[09:28] <Kilos> also in synaptic you can make packages lock on the installed version
[09:29] <Kilos> but thats better to do after first upgrade
[09:29] <Kilos> yes sorry upgrade
[09:30] <Gotango> Whats meant by "lock on the istalled version "
[09:30] <Kilos> so it never upgrades 
[09:31] <Gotango> oh ok 
[09:31] <Kilos> you can check the installed gimp for example and if it does everything you want you lock that version
[09:31] <Kilos> but after the first upgrade
[09:32] <Kilos> that dvd might not have fully installed/updated the apps
[09:32] <Kilos> first update/upgrade is very important
[09:32] <Gotango> What do you mean after the first upgrade. I dont want to upgrade gimp ever
[09:33] <Gotango> Gimp works fine as it is now
[09:33] <Kilos> thats why i say check if it does everything you want 
[09:33] <Gotango> gedit aswell
[09:33] <Gotango> opera aswell
[09:34] <Kilos> then you can untick that when you upgrade
[09:34] <Gotango> Good, thats what i wana do
[09:35] <Kilos> you can open update manager and see how many meg it says it must download
[09:35] <Gotango> I just want the core system stuff to upgrade. The user programs left as it is
[09:37] <Gotango> How do i do that
[09:37] <Kilos> open it
[09:37] <Gotango> done
[09:37] <Kilos> it shows how much is needed near the bottom
[09:37] <Gotango> It shows nothing
[09:37] <Kilos> ai!
[09:38] <Kilos> lemme see
[09:38] <Gotango> pk
[09:38] <Gotango> ok
[09:38] <Kilos> does it say there are updates to install?
[09:39] <Kilos> mine is up to date so it says there is nothing to update
[09:39] <Gotango> It says : There are no updates to install
[09:39] <Kilos> surely you see the packages there it wants to upgrade
[09:40] <Kilos> whew
[09:40] <Kilos> tick the check button
[09:40] <Gotango> Nope its blank in those boxes
[09:40] <Gotango> ok
[09:41] <Kilos> the check is same as sudo apt-get update
[09:42] <Gotango> What is it downloading now in the check
[09:42] <Kilos> ^
[09:43] <Kilos> it is updating it self so it know what is out there
[09:43] <Kilos> updating not upgrading
[09:44] <Gotango> I had to cut the connection yesterday it got to 10MB with sudo apt-get update
[09:45] <Kilos> update only checks what is available and tells synaptic and software centre and update manager what is available
[09:46] <Kilos> told you the first sudo apt-get update is about 20m
[09:47] <Kilos> update manager is now doing what you didnt finish with apt-get update
[09:47] <Gotango> Ok i will let it work
[09:49] <Gotango> I guess so
[09:52] <Kilos> very frustrating being restricted with data
[09:53] <Kilos> thats why when 8ta brought out the 2+1 for less than voda charged for 500m i jumped
[09:54] <Gotango> It finished the update , but didn't give the any number at bottom, still blank boxes
[09:55] <Kilos> yay then you can close it and open synaptic
[09:55] <Gotango> I will try telkom mobile, i just hope my modem accpets the sim, it wont accept vodacom
[09:55] <Kilos> what modem
[09:56] <Gotango> ok
[09:56] <Kilos> you might need to unlock it if it is cellc branded
[09:56] <Gotango> My usb stick modem with cellc sim in
[09:56] <Kilos> ya man make and model
[09:56] <Gotango> Nope its from portugal and unlocked already
[09:56] <Kilos> they can be unlocked to accept all sims
[09:57] <Kilos> ok well lets hope then
[09:57] <Kilos> you have a cell phone
[09:57] <Kilos> with data cable
[09:58] <Kilos> i used mine as a modem for a long time, that was slow
[09:58] <Gotango> Nope , my phones screens broken , i only got the ub modem
[09:58] <Kilos> if its only the screen it can still work as a modem
[09:58] <Gotango> ya , the phone has only dialup speed
[09:58] <Kilos> ubuntu sees it
[09:59] <Gotango> The usb stick got broadband HSDPA 
[09:59] <Kilos> this is iff your modem doesnt see telkom sim
[09:59] <Gotango> lol i cant even read an sms
[09:59] <Kilos> being hsdpa capable is useless it the provider cant provide the 3g
[10:00] <Gotango> Will get a phone when i need one
[10:00] <Kilos> im just saying if modem dont see telkom sim you can use fone
[10:00] <Kilos> no need to buy one
[10:01] <Gotango> ya that true, wish telkom mobile works and has 3G coverage here. Telkom got a big office in town
[10:01] <Kilos> ubuntu doesnt need the phones screen to work to connect
[10:02] <Gotango> The phone also dont pick up usb cable, so it needs to be flashed too
[10:02] <Kilos> ai!
[10:03] <Gotango> Anyway i will cross those bridges when i get there
[10:03] <Kilos> but dont worry about that yet
[10:03] <Gotango> So what now in synaptic
[10:03] <Kilos> try telkom sim first and hope it works then you smiling
[10:03] <Kilos> ok type in gimp
[10:04] <Gotango> 66 results for gimp
[10:04] <Kilos> tick on one
[10:04] <Kilos> one thats installed
[10:05] <Kilos> then go to package and tick lock version
[10:05] <Kilos> you can lock whatever you dont want to have upgraded at a later stage
[10:06] <Gotango> You mean the main gimp program
[10:06] <Kilos> yes
[10:06] <Kilos> you can do it to them all
[10:06] <Gotango> I cant see the main gimp file
[10:07] <Gotango> if it had something like gimp.exe i will understand thats the main one but it doesnt
[10:09] <Kilos> it must be there at the top
[10:10] <Kilos> gimp then gimp-data
[10:12] <Gotango> I think i found it 13MB . 
[10:12] <Gotango> Its got a green lock now and shows red
[10:12] <Kilos> is that the size of the installed version or is that what it wants to fetch still
[10:13] <Kilos> ok open terminal
[10:13] <Kilos> sudo aptitude reinstall gimp
[10:13] <Kilos> then see what aptitude says
[10:14] <Gotango> At the size it says 13MB and at the download row it says 0 MB
[10:14] <Kilos> oh aptitude wont work iff synaptic is open
[10:14] <Kilos> cool
[10:14] <Gotango> ok
[10:15] <Kilos> ok you can lock all the installed gimp packages
[10:15] <Gotango> Do you wana test if gimp will reinstall
[10:15] <Kilos> and opera
[10:16] <Gotango> The following packages will be REINSTALLED:
[10:16] <Gotango>   gimp 
[10:16] <Gotango> 0 packages upgraded, 0 newly installed, 1 reinstalled, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
[10:16] <Gotango> Need to get 0 B of archives. After unpacking 0 B will be used.
[10:16] <Gotango> E: I wasn't able to locate a file for the gimp package. This might mean you need to manually fix this package.
[10:16] <Gotango> E: I wasn't able to locate a file for the gimp package. This might mean you need to manually fix this package.
[10:16] <Gotango> E: Internal error: couldn't generate list of packages to download
[10:17] <Kilos> do it
[10:17] <Kilos> oh my
[10:17] <Gotango> Does that mean the lock worked
[10:17] <Kilos> oh its because it isnt in the cache
[10:18] <Gotango> the cache was updated when i updated it
[10:18] <Kilos> i keep all packages and add them to the cache before updating but you didnt download gimp so there isnt a package to reinstall from
[10:19] <Kilos> the cache is in /var/cache/apt/archives/
[10:19] <Gotango> That should not be a problem
[10:19] <Kilos> maybe ive forgotten that command lemme thing
[10:19] <Kilos> nope
[10:20] <Gotango> If i ever want to install a new version of gimp i just uninstall this one and install the new one
[10:20] <Kilos> we set your synaptic to save your downloaded packages so you archives will grow then ill give you the command to save them to another place
[10:21] <Kilos> you just unlock it and do sudo aptitude reinstall gimp
[10:21] <Gotango> oh ok
[10:21] <Kilos> it will then get a later version if its there
[10:22] <Gotango> mysql is here now and php
[10:23] <Kilos> then you can install what you need
[10:23] <Kilos> im waiting for you say ubuntu rocks
[10:23] <Kilos> will keep feeding you till you realise it
[10:25] <Gotango> I am happy with ubuntu, but until this heat on this lappy is fixed i will keep on having this ubuntu headache
[10:25] <Kilos> you need high pressure air
[10:26] <Gotango> I know , that will help a bit
[10:27] <Kilos> do you know how many fans it has
[10:27] <Kilos> if 2 isnt one dead
[10:27] <Kilos> you need to talk to lappy peeps about that
[10:29] <Gotango> Nope only see one fan on a heat sink
[10:30] <Kilos> ok
[10:31] <Kilos> later kernels are normally more efficient
[10:31] <Kilos> ubuntu gets better with each upgrade
[10:31] <Gotango> I'm using 3.2 , it was kernel 3.5
[10:31] <Gotango> I chose older version at boot
[10:31] <Kilos> most likely 3.5 is better
[10:32] <Gotango> I dont see 3.5 there anymore
[10:32] <Kilos> the upgrades are to improve things
[10:32] <Kilos> look in synaptic
[10:32] <Kilos> then reinstall
[10:33] <Kilos> if i have things right the upgrades are like adding service packs on xp or so
[10:33] <Gotango> Only 3.2 stuff there now
[10:33] <Kilos> ai!
[10:34] <Kilos> well when you have data well sort it with aptitude
[10:34] <Kilos> but use as is now
[10:34] <Kilos> again you just changed things without knowing what they do
[10:35] <Kilos> always ask first
[10:35] <Kilos> you only revert to older things if the new one doesnt work
[10:35] <Kilos> i go eat
[10:36] <Gotango> The fan blew like crazy so i changed it to older version
[10:36] <Gotango> Ok enjoy lunch
[10:57] <Kilos> hmm... 
[12:57] <Kilos> hmm...
[13:10] <Symmetria> hrm I need a few new suits for the first time in ages
[13:10] <Symmetria> Im finding myself being invited to things I am so not prepared for 
[13:45] <Kilos> haha getting civilised
[13:46] <Kilos> civilized
[14:14] <Kilos> bbl
[14:27]  * Kilos greets
[14:27] <Gotango> Wb Kilos
[14:27] <Kilos> ty
[14:28] <Kilos> are you starting to get used to ubuntu?
[14:28] <Gotango> yw
[14:29] <Gotango> Yes i am
[14:29] <Kilos> yay
[14:29] <Kilos> it groes on you unity does
[14:29] <Kilos> the old gnome2 was much easier to learn
[14:29] <Gotango> I see many settings options i see in forums are not included in my ubuntu
[14:30] <Kilos> there must be something hidden or not activated
[14:30] <Gotango> like the "Personal" tab in System Settings > Appearences are not there
[14:30] <Kilos> do you see 4 rows of icons
[14:31] <Kilos> lemme see
[14:31] <Gotango> Where ?
[14:31] <Kilos> that whole row?
[14:31] <Kilos> personal is the first row
[14:32] <Kilos> personal hardware and system
[14:32] <Kilos> hardware has 2 rows
[14:32] <Gotango> There is only "Look" and "Behaviour" tabs in Apearences settings no "Personal"
[14:32] <Kilos> oh my
[14:33] <Kilos> oh thats right
[14:33] <Kilos> what more do you want there
[14:34] <Gotango> One row in Personal , 2 rows in hardware , and 1 in System
[14:34] <Kilos> ya thats right
[14:35] <Gotango> I added ubuntu-tweak , it shows in Personal
[14:36] <Kilos> what do you want to tweak
[14:36] <Gotango> The themes and look of unity
[14:36] <Kilos> i thought you dont want fancy stuff
[14:37] <Kilos> there was another thing
[14:37] <Gotango> I like Verdana font so i replaced Ubuntu system font using ubuntu-tweak
[14:37] <Kilos> hmm...
[14:37] <Gotango> No i wana get rid of the fancy stuff , animations and stuff
[14:37] <Kilos> for your text?
[14:37] <Gotango> No luck with that
[14:38] <Kilos> there is a thing called myunity you can install but i forget what it does
[14:38] <Gotango> For everything
[14:39] <Kilos> Maaz, google myunity for 12.04
[14:39] <Maaz> Kilos: "Install MyUnity 3.0 on Ubuntu 12.04/11.10/11.04 (New Release ..." http://www.noobslab.com/2012/02/install-myunity-30-on-ubuntu.html :: "Where can I find My Unity to download - Ask Ubuntu" http://askubuntu.com/questions/199492/where-can-i-find-my-unity-to-download :: "Customise Ubuntu 12.04 With myunity - YouTube" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pz4MaK2LXgE
[14:39] <Maaz> :: "MyUnity — Ubuntu Apps Directory" https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/precise/my…
[14:39] <Gotango> Its the same as ubuntu-tweak
[14:39] <Kilos> ah
[14:40] <Gotango> Can only make minimal changes, and gives another less intense version of Software center
[14:40] <Kilos> well sooner or later youll have it doing what you like
[14:40] <Kilos> i never used software centre
[14:41] <Kilos> use
[14:47] <Kilos> oh another thing, ubuntu will tell you when it needs a reboot
[14:47] <Kilos> you dont reboot with every app you install
[14:47] <Gotango> Why is that
[14:47] <Gotango> oh
[14:48] <Kilos> normally only kernel and network manger stuff need a reboot
[14:48] <Kilos> its linux
[14:48] <Gotango> Yeah same on windows
[14:48] <Kilos> linux only needs a reboot with serious stuff
[14:49] <Kilos> ai! xp i had to reboot with everything i installed 
[14:50] <Kilos> when i ran the motherboard software it rebooted 7 times on its own
[14:50] <Gotango> lol ya that was a pain when i had a xp desktop 
[14:50] <Kilos> we used to mock, "you moved the mouse, windows needs to reboot"
[14:51] <Gotango> haha they had minds of there own
[14:51] <Kilos> i am running 7 but cant remember how often it needed to reboot
[14:51] <Kilos> i think also lots with the mobo driver
[14:51] <Kilos> s
[14:53] <Gotango> So it good that things improve, to sort out the bugs 
[14:53] <Kilos> thats how linux works
[14:54] <Kilos> a release is brought out and there is a built in bug report goody  and then dev guys worldwide work on it and in the next update/upgrade its fixed
[14:54] <Gotango> Ya all programs works that way
[14:58] <Gotango> Great thats how it should be
[14:58] <Kilos> so have you got your web design tools?
[15:01] <Gotango> Not yet, dont wana risk installing it and something happens with the upgrade that makes me lose them
[15:01] <Kilos> ai!
[15:02] <Kilos> you then saw there is nothing to upgrade
[15:03] <Gotango> Mysql is a background service and makes the cpu work harder. I wana sort the driver issue first
[15:03] <Kilos> ah
[15:03] <Gotango> When this lappy is cool enough i will install them all
[15:04] <Kilos> is mysql and sqlite similar stuff
[15:05] <Kilos> nm i dont need to know that
[15:05] <Gotango> they got the same syntax, but different ways they organise there databases
[15:05] <Kilos> head too full already
[15:06] <Gotango> lol, the head has infinate space
[15:06] <Kilos> not mine. half my brain leaked out
[15:06] <Gotango> Why do you say i got nothing to upgrade ?
[15:07] <Kilos> you said update manager was empty
[15:07] <Gotango> It says nothing to update yes
[15:07] <Kilos> if there was upgrading it would have showed the packages
[15:07] <Gotango> but what about that first upgrade thing ?
[15:08] <Kilos> the reastersys tool must have sorted that
[15:08] <Kilos> remastersys
[15:08] <Gotango> You said it will be large download
[15:08] <Gotango> oh
[15:09] <Kilos> yeah well there is a new kernel but i dont know why you didnt get it
[15:09] <Gotango> So i dont have to waste so much data then
[15:09] <Gotango> What new kernel 
[15:09] <Kilos> if you do audo apt-get upgrade it should show you
[15:09] <Kilos> an improved one i think
[15:09] <Kilos> lemme look what i have in here
[15:10] <Gotango> ok
[15:11] <Kilos> linux-headers 3.2.0. 58.88
[15:13] <Gotango> linux-headers 3.2.0. 57.87
[15:13] <Kilos> linux-image 3.2.0-58.88
[15:14] <Gotango> Those are big files hey
[15:15] <Kilos> normally they about 50m together
[15:15] <Kilos> up to 80m
[15:15] <Gotango> linux-image files show 113mb by me 
[15:16] <Gotango> linux-headers 56mb
[15:16] <Kilos> but those you dont choose, ubuntu chooses them as updates come
[15:17] <Gotango> Those ones are already installed
[15:17] <Kilos> ya the images show 113m but download of 38m
[15:17] <Gotango> oh ok
[15:17] <Kilos> yes dont worry about them
[15:18] <Kilos> if we can get a debdelta server going somehwere then we can save like 80% on upgrading
[15:18] <Gotango> So i will just tick the activate button at additional drivers when i got the data
[15:18] <Kilos> because the server only supplies what you need
[15:19] <Kilos> yes
[15:19] <Gotango> debdelta sounds interesting
[15:19] <Gotango> So SA dont got one
[15:21] <Kilos> i dont think ubuntu has one anywhere
[15:21] <Kilos> only mint i think it was
[15:21] <Kilos> oh no debian
[15:21] <Gotango> oh ok
[15:21] <Kilos> when you have data you run 
[15:22] <Kilos> sudo apt-get update && sudo aptitude upgrade
[15:22] <Gotango> There is nothing to run though
[15:22] <Kilos> save that command
[15:22] <Gotango> ok
[15:22] <Kilos> aptitude upgrades kernels too
[15:23] <Gotango> I hope  it improves things 
[15:23] <Kilos> yes it will but im sure your heat is inside
[15:24] <Kilos> dust build up
[15:24] <Kilos> arent lappies supposed to be service 
[15:24] <Kilos> or do peeps use them till they crash then buy new ones
[15:25] <Gotango> Nope this is a second hand lappy, service expired long agao
[15:25] <Kilos> im asking are they supposed to have services like cars do
[15:25] <Kilos> i know my desktop needs a good blow clean every 2 months or so
[15:26] <Gotango> Well the components are very hard to find compared to aa desktop. When you service it you will wait for many months for the correct part
[15:27] <Kilos> i mean just clean outs
[15:27] <Kilos> your fan blows out right?
[15:28] <Kilos> so where does air get in for it to blow out
[15:28] <Gotango> Well this lappy never go a good cleanout before, and lappies are usually poorly ventilated
[15:29] <Gotango> Just the fan outlet is open everything else is closed 
[15:29] <Gotango> No air can get in from other placed 
[15:29] <Gotango> places*
[15:30] <Kilos> http://h30434.www3.hp.com/t5/Other-Notebook-PC-Questions/Notebook-Overheating-Read-this/td-p/188912
[15:30] <Kilos> they say there are air vents
[15:31] <Kilos> 3. If you use your laptop/notebook on such a surface that it block air inlets then that could be a problem for overheating. and this goes for new notebooks to
[15:32] <Gotango> My lappy is on a table all day
[15:32] <Gotango> I dont see othe air vents though
[15:32] <Kilos> try a good hard suck on the vents
[15:32] <Kilos> and spit out the dust
[15:35] <Gotango> lol i got a lung problem , i will definatly land n hospital if i do that
[15:35] <Kilos> ai!
[15:35] <Kilos> read that whole article
[15:35] <Gotango> The thing about AMD being hotter than Intel may be tru
[15:35] <Gotango> true*
[15:35] <Kilos> the comments say hp all have that prob
[15:36] <Kilos> maybe someone further down will say where to drill some vents
[15:37] <Gotango> That heatpad melting thing bothers me
[15:37] <Gotango> I will have to try opening this lappy more to find out 
[15:38] <Gotango> If i can get to the heat sink and fan and some components around it i can clean it with toilet paper
[15:38] <Kilos> maybe one can buy them separate
[15:39] <Kilos> then you will need thermal paste too
[15:39] <Kilos> thats heavy, R50 a tube i paid
[15:39] <Kilos> tube thinner than a pencil
[15:40] <Kilos> hi psychicist why so quiet
[15:40] <Gotango> first i wana try totaly opening this thing
[15:41] <Gotango> then will take other steps if i should
[15:41] <Kilos> you gotta be careful they hide clips all over and many screws
[15:42] <Kilos> lappys are horrible to work on
[15:43] <Gotango> Yeah i saw them, i layed out the screwes in the shape the lappy so its easier to put back
[15:43] <Kilos> lol then still the clips
[15:43] <Kilos> whew
[15:43] <Kilos> ill stick with desktops
[15:44] <Kilos> easy access
[15:44] <Gotango> lol desktop is way easier maintenance
[15:44] <Kilos> yeah
[15:45] <Kilos> i love mine even though they are old
[15:45] <Gotango> Thats good, take care of them they will care for you
[15:46] <Gotango> I thought of converting this lappy to desktop
[15:46] <Gotango> In a box with extra fans and stuff
[15:46] <Kilos> whew theyve given me many grey hairs
[15:46] <Kilos> how you gonna do that
[15:47] <Kilos> thats an idea though
[15:47] <Kilos> i have a scrap one here the has broken charger board and keyboard
[15:48] <Kilos> and spares arent easy to find
[15:48] <Kilos> and costly
[15:49] <Gotango> Just the bottom part of the lappy , sticking it to a box size shape the same with 2 more fans and ventilation paths
[15:49] <Gotango> Yeah the chargers for these things are hard to find
[15:50] <Kilos> the prob is the screen connector cable
[15:50] <Kilos> i have a charger but the small pc board that the charger connects to is broken
[15:50] <Kilos> physically broken
[15:51] <Gotango> Well everything stays the same just the bottom is open to let extra airflow in
[15:52] <Gotango> lol mine too, but its the pin inside the connector thats broken
[15:52] <Gotango> But works fine after a few adjustments
[15:53] <Kilos> thats how this one started too and then lots of bits and pieces were broken when peeps tried to strip it
[15:54] <Kilos> oh you dont need antivirus but you can use a firewall
[15:54] <Kilos> the built in one is gufw
[15:54] <Kilos> tiny package
[15:55] <Gotango> Thats good will try it 
[16:00] <Kilos> anjd you dont need antimalware or any of those things
[16:00] <Kilos> also no registry cleaner
[16:01] <Gotango> Thats good , but i never used them on window either
[16:05] <Kilos> been a good day
[16:05] <Kilos> you didnt once say you want windows back
[16:05] <Kilos> yay
[16:06] <Gotango> lol , its like i lost a pet dog of mine, you get over it after a while and like the new puppy :)
[16:08] <Kilos> lol
[16:08] <Kilos> twit
[16:08] <Kilos> pity you didnt like kubuntu
[16:09] <Kilos> its very lekker but again totally different
[16:09] <Gotango> So this week i wana try if i can clean this pc inside. And get the drivers . Hopefully everything will be fine after that
[16:09] <Gotango> I hear kubuntu use more resourses than ubuntu
[16:10] <Kilos> when its open maybe look if you can drill some vents for it so the fan sucks air past mobo and cpu
[16:10] <Gotango> I would've prefered Xubuntu though, just the basic interface is waht i want
[16:10] <Gotango> what*
[16:11] <Kilos> it is a bit heavier but does lots of thing faster than unity as well
[16:11] <Kilos> well you can install xubuntu-desktop when you have data
[16:11] <Kilos> and chhose which gui to boot from
[16:11] <Kilos> choose
[16:12] <Gotango> Hope telkom mobile works then
[16:12] <Kilos> yeah
[16:12] <Kilos> they have coverage maps online
[16:13] <Kilos> Maaz, google telkom mobile coverage map
[16:13] <Maaz> Kilos: "Coverage - Telkom Mobile" http://www.telkommobile.co.za/coverage/ :: "Mobile > Coverage Map - Telkom Business" https://business.telkom.co.za/coverage/tm.html :: "Telkom 3G/HSPA Coverage Map: Cape Town - MyBroadband" http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/215720-Telkom-3G-HSPA-Coverage-Map-Cape-Town :: "Telkom's W-CDMA plans and coverage - MyBroadband"
[16:13] <Maaz> http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/138389-Telkom-s-W-CDMA-plans-and-coverage :: "D…
[16:13] <Gotango> In a mybroadband forum i saw the coverage maps are out of data
[16:13] <Gotango> date*
[16:14] <Kilos> then you can fone free from the telkom sim
[16:14] <Kilos> and the operator will tell you
[16:14] <Gotango> hmm , no way to check before i buy the sim 
[16:15] <Kilos> where is ceres
[16:15] <Kilos> and where are you in ceres
[16:15] <Gotango> Bella Vista , its about 2 km outside ceres
[16:16] <Kilos> which direction
[16:16] <Gotango> What do you mean
[16:17] <Kilos> north south east or west of ceres
[16:17] <Kilos> and where is ceres
[16:17] <Gotango> North i think , in the Western Cape
[16:20] <Kilos> near what major city
[16:20] <Gotango> Capetown
[16:23] <Kilos> what direction from capetown
[16:24] <Kilos> hate these maps things they just waste data
[16:24] <Gotango> North east
[16:24] <Gotango> They sound complex
[16:25] <Kilos> grr it doesnt scroll away from there
[16:25] <Kilos> we ask someone tonight
[16:25] <Gotango> ok
[16:26] <Gotango> vodacom got 3g here, but they been around a long time
[16:26] <Kilos> when you go for the sim ask at the telkom shop
[16:27] <Kilos> even the post office should know
[16:28] <Gotango> hmm will have to check if there is a telkom mobile store in town
[16:28] <Kilos> i see it on my paper map but the coverage map wont scroll that far away from capetown
[16:28] <Kilos> post office checkers etc
[16:28] <Kilos> clicks spar etc too
[16:29] <Gotango> I dunno about that R49 promotion thing though, do you pay it when the sim is rica'd
[16:30] <Kilos> yes you take proof of residence with
[16:30] <Gotango> Ya i know about rica
[16:30] <Kilos> you by your folks?
[16:30] <Kilos> good
[16:31] <Kilos> i get my sis to do all that for me
[16:31] <Gotango> I mean the R49 to who do you pay that and how will you know its not just regular airtime you put in
[16:31] <Kilos> so sims in her name
[16:31] <Kilos> hehe
[16:31] <Gotango> oh ok
[16:35] <Gotango> So when you buy a R149 data bundle you get 2GB for that
[16:36] <Kilos> 2g +1g night surfer
[16:36] <Kilos> from 11pm to 5am
[16:37] <Gotango> Other network asks the same price for 1Gb
[16:37] <Gotango> Does that bundle expire
[16:37] <Kilos> end of the next month
[16:38] <Gotango> 60 days
[16:38] <Kilos> so i try put new one in at the month beginning
[16:38] <Kilos> its not from bought date for 2 months
[16:39] <Kilos> its valid till the end of the next calender month they call it
[16:39] <Gotango> oh ok
[16:42] <Gotango> So i have to check if telkom mobile even have any kind of 2G coverage here, before i can use it
[16:42] <Kilos> all thier towers are 3g
[16:42] <Kilos> hsdpa 
[16:42] <Kilos> their
[16:43] <Gotango> What is the difference between All Networks and Telkom Mobile Net? All networks – All networks internet bundles is available on Telkom Mobile’s network and MTN roaming Telkom Mobile – Telkom Mobile internet bundle is available only on Telkom Mobile’s network. Subscribers will be required to check for coverage at
[16:44] <Gotango> www.telkommobile.co.za/coverage/
[16:44] <Kilos> thats if they have a transceiver on the tower near you otherwise they roam to others
[16:45] <Gotango> oh ok
[16:47] <Kilos> im lucky i can see my tower out the window here
[16:47] <Kilos> hi not_found 
[16:47] <Kilos> wb
[16:47] <not_found> hi uncle Kilos, thanks
[16:48] <Gotango> I'm close to one aswell
[16:49] <Gotango> Hi not_found
[16:49] <Kilos> well hope telkom has a unit up there
[16:49] <not_found> Gotango: hi, winning with ubuntu yet?
[16:49] <Gotango> I hope so too Kilos
[16:50] <Gotango> Just the heat issue not-found, everything else works great
[16:50] <Kilos> hahaha he hasnt said he want win back all day not_found 
[16:50] <Kilos> im winning
[16:50] <Gotango> lol
[16:51] <not_found> :)
[16:51] <Kilos> Gotango, when you strip it look for places to drill vent holes
[16:51] <Kilos> there are lotsa peeps with heat probs with hp lappies not_found 
[16:52] <Kilos> poor design, no air intake vents
[16:52] <Gotango> This thing is build so tight. will see if i can etch out some creative vent grooves
[16:52] <not_found> well was it running hot on windows?
[16:53] <Kilos> dont you start blaming buntu as well
[16:53] <Gotango> Nope was cool on windows, just the 3D games was heating it
[16:55] <not_found> thus it isn't really a hardware problem then...
[16:56] <Kilos> its better since he clean it a bit by blowing by mouth
[16:56] <not_found> better := good
[16:56] <not_found> ;)
[16:56] <Kilos> but need strong air to clean properly
[16:57] <Gotango> Yeah i need to activate the proprietary drivers , that must fix the issue totally
[16:57] <not_found> which drivers are those Gotango?
[16:58] <Gotango> the drivers for the graphics card. Its now listed as : "Unknown" by ubuntu
[16:58] <Kilos> ati amd stuff
[17:01] <Gotango> I switched it on this morning and the screen was blank for a long time. I had to restart the pc again it worked again
[17:01] <Kilos> bet that had you worried
[17:01] <not_found> hmmm... hybrid graphics intel and amd?
[17:02] <Kilos> you forget you did that touch /forcefsck command
[17:02] <Kilos> so it was doing a file system check
[17:03] <Gotango> Nope kilos i rebooted before that last night
[17:03] <Kilos> ah
[17:04] <Gotango> not-found what is hybrid intel and amd?
[17:04] <Kilos> not_found, also he installed from a remastersys dvd i made here on desktop
[17:05] <Kilos> so might be some thing needed to make the install lappy happy
[17:05] <Kilos> the graphics drivers should help
[17:05] <not_found> Gotango: does the laptop have intel and amd graphics and the ability to switch between them etc.
[17:06] <Gotango> I ont know about that not_found . Its an ATI radeon HD 3200 graphics card is all i know
[17:07] <not_found> well the "community" documentation has this --> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto/ATI
[17:07] <Gotango> Kilos you think you Nvidia drivers are conflicting with ATI ?
[17:08] <Kilos> might be or they just struggling to make something work they werent designed for
[17:09] <not_found> sounds to me like you guys are just making life more difficult than it needs to be :p
[17:10] <Kilos> no man i had nvidia-173 installed here for my card and remastersys made the dvd to suit similar hardware
[17:10] <Gotango> not_found i dunno how to check if its an hybrid graphics 
[17:11] <Gotango> fglrx is not installed here
[17:12] <Gotango> nvidia-173 is still installed here
[17:12] <not_found> if the install had been made with the normal iso from ubuntu then this would have been simpler...
[17:12] <not_found> easiest thing in my opinion is to remove the nvidia drivers...
[17:13] <not_found> sudo apt-get remove nvidia*
[17:13] <not_found> that should do it
[17:13] <not_found> depends on what the driver is called of course
[17:13] <Gotango> You sure it wont break anything
[17:13] <not_found> what make and model is the lappy Gotango (will search to see if it is hybrid)?
[17:14] <Gotango> Xorg ATI stuff is running the graphics here
[17:14] <Kilos> yes not_found but then he wouldnt have it updated
[17:14] <not_found> Gotango: nothing in life is guaranteed
[17:14] <Gotango> Its a HP Compaq 615
[17:14] <Kilos> he hasnt got 200m upgrades to do this way
[17:14] <not_found> so at least a compatible driver is in use so don't worry about the nvidia stuff
[17:15] <not_found> ok, it doesn't use hybrid graphics
[17:15] <Gotango> hmm ok thanks for checking not_found
[17:17] <Gotango> I feel like wanting to do sudo apt-get remove nvidia*
[17:17] <not_found> won't make much of a difference either way I would imagine
[17:17] <not_found> there are some threads online with people complaining about the heat on this lappy, but not that much
[17:18] <not_found> but we could try and install the propriatery amd drivers... only issue is they tend to be pretty big <100mb and with some of the dependencies can go much bigger
[17:19] <Gotango> I will try cleaning out dust in it and making more room for airflow , that will help aswell
[17:19] <not_found> true
[17:20] <Gotango> I can manage with 100mb , will get the drivers in the week
[17:20] <Gotango> Hopefully everything works as expected
[17:22] <not_found> like I said, there might be a lot of other stuff it also needs and then it becomes much bigger than 100mb...
[17:23] <Gotango> oh , like what other stuff
[17:25] <not_found> often times it needs things to help it compile the driver to work on your system, most of these don't come pre-installed on an ubuntu system as many people will never need them... and then there may be outdated pieces of software than the system will want to update before continuing to ensure it works etc. etc.
[17:29] <Gotango> oh i thought ubuntu had c compiler built in. Thats probably beyond a gig . Ai! Thanks for the help though not_found 
[17:30] <Kilos> it wont be a gig man
[17:31] <Kilos> if you know the correct driver you can look for it in synaptic the right click install and it will tell you what extra packages are needed and how big the download will be then you close synaptic without installing
[17:32] <not_found> shouldn't be a gig...
[17:32] <not_found> and it is stuff like kernel headers etc. that it needs to compile the driver against the kernel you are using etc...
[17:32] <not_found> it all depends what you already got and what it wants / needs
[17:33] <Gotango> Oh ok , i understand 
[17:34] <Gotango> Atleast there is an option to check the size. All i know is the base driver is 102MB
[17:38] <Gotango> Does Xubuntu have these issues too
[17:38] <Kilos> yes
[17:38] <Gotango> lol , that changes my whole view of ubutnu and linux
[17:40] <not_found> the only difference between all of the *buntus is the default interface and some of the pre-installed applications
[17:40] <not_found> why did you decide to try ubuntu Gotango?
[17:44] <Gotango> i always wanted to use ubutnu. Just now that i'm unemployed and got this second hand laptop with no windows dvd to revert to when windows broke. I thought i will get ubuntu , atleast then i will have a dvd i can reinstall from. Windows was still working though , was my choice to erase it in favour of ubuntu. now i have to live with the consiquinces
[17:46] <not_found> well the good news is that it is possible to get the PC working and working well and even better than when it was using windows so I wouldn't worry to much... the big pain for you now is the fact that it is "different" and that you are not "familiar" with the world of linux... in a very short while you can became much more acquainted and much happi
[17:46] <not_found> er I am sure
[17:46] <not_found> you are on a good irc channel for assistance and even making some new friends :)
[17:47] <not_found> but it will take some time, patience and sometimes bumping our heads to figure it all out
[17:48] <not_found> the biggest pain is the fact that data in SA is so expensive and most everything comes from the web these days
[17:52] <Gotango> Yeah not_found, i like the linux way of computing. I have no issue with the UX of it even better than windows. Just the toll on the hardware i was'nt expecting. The help i get here is some of the best in the world , you guys are awesome holding the fort for ubuntu-za. I prefer typing commends to clicking icons , its kinda fun lol. 
[17:53] <Gotango> Ya SA got the highest internet rates in the world. I will have to do damage control for ubuntu, but i'm not going back to windows again
[17:56] <not_found> just note that most issues with linux and hardware isn't linux's fault.  the hardware manufacturers don't want to open source there drivers and often don't support linux as well as we like (and often not at all)... you can thank Microsoft for a lot of that
[18:02] <magespawn> good eveniing
[18:03] <Kilos> hi age
[18:03] <Kilos> ai!
[18:03] <magespawn> lol
[18:03] <Kilos> hi magespawn 
[18:03] <magespawn> hey Kilos 
[18:03] <Gotango> yeah the linux community does alot to port those drivers to it platform. lucky the worlds eyes are opening and in the future linux software and hardware with be smoothly intergrated. We're just at the beginning of that reform, so some must face the penalty for that, guess i'm one of those
[18:03] <Gotango> hi magespawn
[18:03] <magespawn> hey Gotango 
[18:04] <magespawn> what machine are you using Gotango ?
[18:05] <Kilos> HP Compaq 615
[18:05] <Kilos> whew hard work scrolling back to find stuff
[18:05] <magespawn> i have had generally really good experiences with hp and linux
[18:06] <Gotango> ty Kilos
[18:06] <Kilos> yw
[18:06] <Gotango> Thats good to know magespawn
[18:07] <magespawn> my one machine is a Compaq nx 6110, currently running Kali Linux
[18:09] <Gotango> Nice magespawn , i'm sure its working good 
[18:09] <magespawn> never reallly had a problem but was not really up to the task of running unity, so i have always had one of the other 'buntu's on it
[18:09]  * not_found wanted to use kali linux to hack his own wifi just because... didn't want to install so just used ubuntu :p
[18:10] <magespawn> not_found, did you use kali or backtrack?
[18:11] <magespawn> Gotango, what are you struggling with?
[18:12] <Gotango> The only hot spots are the fan outlet and the mouse pad, all other parts of the laptop is cool
[18:13] <magespawn> how old is the laptop?
[18:13] <Gotango> 2009
[18:13] <magespawn> maybe it just needs a good clean
[18:14] <magespawn> the heatsink fins on the inside of the laptop tend to get clogged with dust and lint etc
[18:14] <Gotango> I will try cleaning it more tomorrow, the fan calmed down a bit yesterday when i tried to clean it
[18:15] <magespawn> do you feel comfortable taking the laptop apart?
[18:15] <Gotango> yeah i saw alot of dust buit up on the fan
[18:15] <Gotango> built*
[18:16] <Gotango> Its second hand with no warrenties, so its good to mess with it
[18:16] <not_found> magespawn: it was the latest edition of kali about two months ago... I think the issue is the lappy I was using has a silly cpu and kali doesn't come with an appropriate kernel... but all the same apps are available to install in ubuntu so I just did that... used reaver to get my own password :p
[18:17] <magespawn> the dust on the fan is not too serious but if the heatsink is blocked the heat has nowhere to go 
[18:17] <magespawn> cool not_found 
[18:17] <magespawn> I like both of them
[18:18] <not_found> only took the lappy 3 days to get it >.<
[18:18] <not_found> slow cpu is slow
[18:19] <Gotango> I pulled some wire through the heatsinks fins and got no dust from them
[18:19] <Gotango> between the fins*
[18:21] <magespawn> here is a link to the service manual Gotango http://tim.id.au/laptops/hp/compaq%20610%20615.pdf
[18:21] <magespawn> not_found, i use some of the tools for monitering my own network
[18:22] <not_found> cool...
[18:22]  * not_found doesn't know enough to know what to monitor and why :p
[18:22] <magespawn> work network that is
[18:22] <magespawn> best way to learn is to play
[18:22] <magespawn> Gotango, here is another http://h20565.www2.hp.com/portal/site/hpsc/public/psi/manualsResults/?lang=en&cc=us&sp4ts.oid=3958411
[18:23] <magespawn> to paraphrase inetpro man pages
[18:23] <Kilos> lol
[18:49] <theblazehen> hi!
[18:49] <Kilos> hi theblazehen 
[18:58] <theblazehen> night all
[18:58] <not_found> night
[18:58] <Gotango> lol i've been ignoring big place where i can cut out heat
[18:59] <Gotango> night theblazehen
[19:01] <Gotango> i've put the laptop on four supporting columns, about 3 centimetres in the air, with a semi wet cloth at the base, now it more comfortable than before. There was alot of heat beneath there 
[19:02] <magespawn> neat trick
[19:02] <magespawn> the machine should not be getting that hot though
[19:02] <magespawn> Gotango, do you know anything about hardware?
[19:02] <Gotango> Could it be using too much power
[19:03] <Gotango> Yes i worked with desktops before magespawn
[19:03] <Gotango> Not lappies though
[19:03] <magespawn> maybe check the bios, on some machines there are settings to change fan speed and overclocking 
[19:04] <magespawn> same general principles
[19:05] <not_found> bios shouldnt have changed since switching from windows to ubuntu
[19:06] <not_found> but still worth a look
[19:06] <Gotango> I will check there in hp bios magespawn. Not sure if i saw settings to change hardware though, but will check that
[19:06] <not_found> perhaps force the fan to run @ 100%
[19:06] <magespawn> might be an idea to dismantle it, clean and reseat the heat sink, you would need heat paste if you do that
[19:07] <Gotango> not_found why set it so high
[19:07] <not_found> after I opened and cleaned my lappy it was cooler... three days later it can't charge a battery any longer but that might not have been my fault :p
[19:07] <magespawn> lol @ not_found 
[19:07] <not_found> fan @ 100% = coolest the lappy can run
[19:08] <magespawn> i cleaned mine and managed to stop the keyboard working
[19:08] <Gotango> magespawn i will do that but , not reseating the heat sink though
[19:09] <Gotango> lol only more noise with that option
[19:09] <not_found> the stupid keyboards using those silly zeroforce locks ugh!
[19:09] <not_found> had to try three times to get the keyboard working properly afterwords
[19:10] <magespawn> not_found, it should also not be running hoter because of change of os, so who knows, lol
[19:10] <Gotango> I can remove my keyboard easily though. Have to be careful with the thin connecting cable
[19:10] <magespawn> ribbon cable?
[19:11] <Gotango> Ya ribbon cable, forgot its name :p
[19:12] <magespawn> they usually have a connector straight on to the board, those can be delicate
[19:13] <Gotango> yeah one has to be carefull if you didnt know about the ribbon cable and just pull out the keyboard , your toast
[19:26] <magespawn> indeed
[19:30] <inetpro> Kilos: hoor jy die donderweer?
[19:30] <inetpro> good evening
[19:30] <magespawn> hey inetpro
[19:30] <inetpro> ohi magespawn
[19:38] <Kilos> ohi inetpro ja dit donder baie hier
[19:41] <inetpro> seriously need some rains here
[19:41] <Kilos> yeah
[19:42] <Kilos> so dry we spit cotten wool here
[19:46] <inetpro> just started cutting the lawn the other day when it started growing nicely with all the rain, now it's suffering heavily with the heat
[19:46] <Kilos> just started raining here nw
[19:47] <Kilos> now too
[19:47] <inetpro> mooi!
[19:47] <Kilos> lots of lightning/thunder
[19:50] <Kilos> funny the power hasnt died yet
[20:07] <magespawn> and there it goes
[20:08] <somaunn> Hello everyone
[20:10] <magespawn> hi somaunn 
[20:11] <somaunn> magespawn: it's quiet here today
[20:12] <magespawn> relatively, was some chatter earlier
[20:12] <somaunn> i can see that
[20:13] <magespawn> bit too early for some, and other need their sleep
[20:17] <somaunn> yeah
[20:19] <magespawn> i am also off, good night all
[20:19] <somaunn> what advice can you give me, i want to setup a recording room to do video recording for internet show like the one made by Hak5 but for french countries
[20:21] <magespawn> somaunn, there is also a pod/video cast doen here in south africa called "Let's Talk Geek", they do that sort of thing, superfly works with one of the guys who was involved i that, so maybe ask when he is here next
[20:22] <magespawn> now off to bed
[20:26] <Kilos> hmm... 
 funny the power hasnt died yet
[20:26] <Kilos> power died same time
[20:26] <Kilos> hehe
[20:29] <inetpro> Kilos: it stopped there already? 
[20:29] <Kilos> ya here too
[20:29] <Kilos> but at least me got some for a change
[20:30] <Kilos> it normally blows past
[20:30] <inetpro> still falling a bit.. took a while to get here after you said it started there 
[20:33] <Kilos> spose i can go sleep now.
[20:33] <Kilos> night all. sleep lekker
[20:33] <inetpro> Good night oom 
[20:33] <Kilos> hi superfly toods superfly 
[20:38] <inetpro> somaunn: you want to talk to HawkiesZA
[20:40] <somaunn> inetpro: why not ! will he provide me necessary infos
[20:40] <somaunn> ?
[20:42] <inetpro> as far as I know he was very much involved with let's talk geek 
[20:42] <inetpro> see http://ltg.ltnet.tv/
[20:53] <superfly> inetpro: somewhat involved. more like his brother is involved