[00:04] <ochosi> Noskcaj: so is today already tomorrow for you? :D
[00:04] <Noskcaj> ochosi, um, what
[00:05] <ochosi> you previously mentioned your agenda for "tomorrow", by which i think you meant tuesday
[00:05] <ochosi> and it is tuesday now :)
[00:06] <Noskcaj> yeah, but still at my grandparents, so limited internets
[00:06] <knome> internets?
[00:06] <knome> you only need one
[00:06] <ochosi> no worries, enjoy your time there
[00:06] <knome> that reminds me i should setup my secondary internet as the backup solution in dd-wrt
[00:06] <knome> >:D
[00:17] <sergio-br2> hello?
[00:19] <sergio-br2> i installed and purged nvidia-331 in trusty, now i got a infinity plymouth loading. Any idea?
[00:20] <ochosi> how did you install/purge the driver?
[00:21] <sergio-br2> install by synaptic, nvidia-331-updates
[00:21] <sergio-br2> and purge by sudo apt-get purge (many packages that install with nvidia)
[00:21] <ochosi> did you install another nvidia driver instead after purging?
[00:22] <sergio-br2> no, only in i915 and nouveau
[00:23] <ochosi> hmkay, not sure then
[00:23] <sergio-br2> ochosi, i purged because i didnt get graphic window after install, only tty
[00:23] <ochosi> i'd start by going back to something that has already worked
[00:23] <ochosi> i.e. installing a driver you know should work
[00:24] <sergio-br2> hum, but the problem is that here is Optimus hybrid card
[00:25] <sergio-br2> nvidia-304 work with nvidia-prime?
[00:25] <ochosi> no idea
[00:25] <ochosi> i have no experience with that at all
[00:25] <sergio-br2> hum ok
[00:26] <sergio-br2> do you know how to restore xorg config?
[00:37] <Unit193> Remove /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[00:38] <ochosi> any users of nouveau driver around?
[00:40] <sergio-br2> there is no /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[00:40] <sergio-br2> but there is /etc/X11/xorg.conf.failsafe
[00:41] <sergio-br2> this xorg.conf file is not deprecated?
[00:45] <Noskcaj> ochosi, Could you check xubuntu_fix-duplicate-volumes.patch in xfdesktop 4.11.2? It's not applying and i'm not sure where it should go
[00:46] <ochosi> Noskcaj: i think we best ask eric about it
[00:46] <ochosi> not even sure it's still needed in 4.11
[00:46] <ochosi> i can try to talk to him tomorrow, can you link me to the patch?
[00:46] <Unit193> As far as I know, it isn't.
[00:47] <ochosi> there ya go ^ :)
[00:47] <Noskcaj> ok, dropping now
[00:47] <ochosi> a deuce? or what?
[00:47] <knome> :P
[00:47] <knome> the ball
[00:47] <Unit193> In this case though, it mainly means I've tested on several systems without that with no problems.
[00:48] <ochosi> i have no idea spontaneously what the patch does
[00:48] <ochosi> must be pre-gio stuff
[00:49] <Unit193> Noskcaj: If you're working on a sync, just pull from my ppa, diff, review, s/unit193/jackson/ :P
[00:49] <Noskcaj> Unit193, I was just going to merge from the debian svn to minimise the delta
[00:49] <Noskcaj> Any extra changes in the PPA?
[00:50] <Unit193> It's basically just a sync, dropping or refreshing patches.
[00:50] <Noskcaj> ok
[00:51] <Unit193> Before pushing, I'd test it with nautilus trying to take over the desktop though.
[00:52] <Unit193> ochosi: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/trusty/xfdesktop4/trusty/view/head:/debian/patches/xubuntu_fix-duplicate-volumes.patch
[00:54] <ochosi> yeah, i remember now
[00:54] <ochosi> not reproducible here
[00:54] <ochosi> i'd drop it for now
[00:54] <Unit193> Mhmm, I did.
[00:55] <Noskcaj> Pushed to lp:~noskcaj/ubuntu/trusty/xfdesktop4/4.11 . Can one of you guys check it?
[00:57] <ochosi> sorry, still don't have a trusty box :( (will in 10 days or so)
[00:57] <Noskcaj> also, Can someone take a look at bug 1244629 ? It's my first attempt at an SRU bug
[00:57] <ochosi> Unit193: can you test the desktop pkg? ^
[00:58] <Unit193> ochosi: The part that needs it the most I can't. :P
[00:58] <Noskcaj> should i just propose the merge?
[01:00] <ochosi> sorry, got 0 SRU experience personally
[01:00] <Noskcaj> bluesabre, When do you think mugshot and menulibre will be ready? plus the next catfish release
[01:00] <Noskcaj> ochosi, It's fine.
[01:01] <Unit193> nautilus patch: s/added/updated/
[01:01] <Unit193> er, refreshed.
[01:01] <ochosi> :>
[01:01] <knome> :P
[01:02] <Unit193> bzr be sloooow..
[01:02] <ochosi> always
[01:03] <Unit193> Bitbucket++ Alioth++  :P
[01:06] <sergio-br2> night
[01:07] <ochosi> ok, seems like nouveau drivers don
[01:07] <ochosi> 't support screen blanking at all
[01:12] <ochosi> night everyone
[01:13] <knome> night ochosi 
[01:13] <Unit193> Hmm, does that xfdesktop build?
[01:13] <Unit193> Good night.
[02:13] <bluesabre> Noskcaj: if everything goes as planned...  menulibre this week, mugshot this weekend, catfish next week
[02:14] <bluesabre> knome ^
[02:15] <Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/61154/ ends up being the diff.
[02:17] <bluesabre> looks good to me
[02:17] <Unit193> (It's a diff of xfdesktop4 from https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/trusty/xfdesktop4/4.11 to what I have.)
[02:21] <Unit193> bluesabre: Re: response/last ping.  Right, understandable completely, just said somethng about it (in an effort not to ping you too) because it was marked in progress.
[02:24] <bluesabre> cool
[02:24] <bluesabre> Unit193: what/which ping?
[02:24] <Unit193> Packageset uploader.
[02:25] <bluesabre> ah right
[02:25] <bluesabre> after I get these apps done, I'll double down on that again
[02:27] <Unit193> Still though, thanks for the first two, rather so the first one.  Third is just for someone else. :P
[07:39] <xubuntu547> hi guys, i just have one question. Is there any way that the rectangular pathbar location selector could be implemented in thunar instead of the arrow one in greybird?
[09:18] <ochosi> can some of you bugsquad members please set this bug to "triaged"? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/shimmer-themes/+bug/1268243
[09:42] <elfy> morning
[10:03] <slickymaster> morning all
[10:03] <elfy> hi slickymaster 
[10:04] <slickymaster> hi elfy, good morning
[10:15] <knome> ochosi, done
[10:15] <knome> ochosi, anything else, importance?
[10:16] <elfy> knome: when you've time to do something :p https://code.launchpad.net/~elfy/ubuntu-manual-tests/pidgin 
[10:16] <elfy> and good morning :)
[10:16] <slickymaster> elfy: just a quick question
[10:17] <elfy> slickymaster: I will endeavour to give you a quick answer as well then :p
[10:17] <slickymaster> on your catfish test, on line 64 you have "click on Folder icon to right of search term box"
[10:18] <elfy> possibly
[10:18] <slickymaster> am I crazy or this icon is on the left of the search term box?
[10:18] <elfy> nope - you are sane :p
[10:18] <slickymaster> ah, ok
[10:18] <elfy> that's been there since the beginning I think - no-one's noticed 
[10:18] <slickymaster> just checking :)
[10:19] <slickymaster> ok, I'll add that correction to the review also
[10:19] <elfy> :)
[10:21] <ochosi> knome: importance is very low :)
[10:23] <knome> wishlist-low or low?
[10:24] <ochosi> wish-list
[10:24] <knome> elfy, done
[10:25] <elfy> knome: you are a star - want me to do the tracker - or you doing that as well?
[10:25] <knome> i'll do that next
[10:26] <knome> and done
[10:27] <elfy> ok - thanks boss :p
[10:30] <knome> ha
[10:43] <ochosi> thanks knome 
[10:49] <slickymaster> elfy: I've added my comments/review to you https://code.launchpad.net/~elfy/ubuntu-manual-tests/minorchanges/+merge/201284 proposal
[10:49] <slickymaster> your^^^
[10:51] <elfy> thanks :)
[10:54] <slickymaster> elfy: do you think it is too thorough?
[10:55] <elfy> no- thanks :)
[10:56] <elfy> though I can't find "The indentation at line 47 needs 4 more spaces to the right" :)
[10:57] <elfy> looks right here 
[10:58] <slickymaster> it could be my text editor causing it
[10:59] <elfy> ok 
[10:59] <slickymaster> On Geany, in mx box, lines 46, 47 and 48 are equally left aligned
[11:00] <slickymaster> my^^
[11:00] <elfy> and as far as the <code> thing is concerned - there are loads of those dotted around the place, guess the way to do that is check when we're doing other things
[11:00] <davmor2> slickymaster: but are they spaces or tabs ;)
[11:01] <slickymaster> yes, but I think they should be added, because it will impact the readability of those lines, in the tracker 
[11:02] <slickymaster> davmor2: spaces
[11:02] <davmor2> slickymaster: now is the rest spaces or tabs
[11:03] <knome> slickymaster, only on the admin side. the tags itself will make sure the text is indented correctly in the regular testcase view
[11:03] <brainwash> ochosi: your screen saver changes seem to work fine here
[11:04] <ochosi> brainwash: with both amd and intel?
[11:04] <brainwash> ochosi: yes
[11:04] <ochosi> did you try to first lock your primary session and then create a new session on vt8?
[11:05] <brainwash> yes
[11:05] <ochosi> (just to see whether the settings get inherited)
[11:05] <ochosi> and xset -q showed the defaults?
[11:05] <slickymaster> davmor2: knome: well, I remember that there was one test that the use of tabs instead of spaces broke it and Noskcaj asked me to always use spaces
[11:05] <brainwash> but I only checked with the restricted AMD driver
[11:05] <brainwash> wasn't in the mood to once again switch to the open source one =S
[11:06] <ochosi> brainwash: ok, thanks for testing. if you can, please also test with the opensource one, cause that's what's used by default
[11:06] <knome> yeah, testing with that would have increased the usefulness of your testing by 50%!
[11:06] <brainwash> ochosi: I did not check the actual values, but the screen did not blank after 30sec
[11:07] <elfy> slickymaster: ok - all done
[11:07] <davmor2> slickymaster: that's why I was asking,  If you are working on someone elses code they might well of used tabs rather than spaces as that is what worked best for them, most people just make tab == 4 spaces in ide's though
[11:07] <brainwash> ochosi: I'll check them next time
[11:07] <ochosi> brainwash: hmm, ok. well i presume you're using greeter from daily anyway, no? if so, testing should be easier now as the pkgs have been built. ideally check the xset values. thanks!
[11:07] <slickymaster> davmor2: yes
[11:07] <brainwash> ochosi: bzr
[11:08] <ochosi> brainwash: in a next step we'll most likely make the value configurable, but i think 30secs is quite an okayish default
[11:08] <slickymaster> elfy: thanks
[11:10] <elfy> slickymaster: if you want to double check those changes at some point, then I can merge and update the tracker - then get the call out tomorrow at some point
[11:10] <slickymaster> elfy: it will be done before lunch
[11:11] <ochosi> brainwash: oh, one more thing. you tested on trusty, right?
[11:11] <elfy> slickymaster: don't rush - I'm chilling out at home - you're at work :)
[11:12] <brainwash> ochosi: yes
[11:12] <ochosi> ok, good to know
[11:12] <brainwash> ochosi: gnome-screensaver hides the login box after 60sec of inactivity
[11:13] <ochosi> hm, ok. let's test this a bit more and then settle on a default
[11:13] <ochosi> honestly i don't care whether we set 30secs or 60 :>
[11:14] <ochosi> but it's good to know the g-s value as reference
[11:14] <brainwash> xscreensaver does it after few seconds
[11:19] <slickymaster> elfy: np, both the database and the applications servers are running smoothly over here
[11:23] <elfy> :)
[11:27] <slickymaster> elfy, Abiword and gThumb are correct now
[11:28] <slickymaster> but you misplaced the <code></code> tags in the Catfish test. Do you want me to comment it in you MP, or can we get it right gere?
[11:28] <slickymaster> your^^^
[11:28] <slickymaster> here^^ª
[11:35] <elfy> slickymaster: it's ok - I see it 
[11:35] <elfy> personally I don't think they're really needed though ;)
[11:36] <slickymaster> elfy: ping me after you make the changes and I'll comment on your MP
[11:37] <elfy> slickymaster: pushed that
[11:42] <slickymaster> elfy: Perfect, I think it can me merged and the tracker updated. Already approved it
[11:42] <elfy> ok - I'll get on that shortly
[11:59] <elfy> well - no idea what's going on there :|
[12:06] <slickymaster> elfy: with your proposal?
[12:06] <elfy> knome: if you get a minute at some point today - I am hating on bzr again :(
[12:09] <knome> elfy, i'm just preparing lunch, i'll ping you after that if you are around
[12:11] <elfy> ok - not doing much today here :)
[12:12] <elfy> slickymaster: kind of - hating bzr
[12:12] <elfy> package tracker is updated now though
[12:12] <slickymaster> well, you never seemed to love bzr all that much ;)
[12:13] <elfy> lol
[12:13] <elfy> keeps telling me there is nothing to push to the parent 
[12:13] <elfy> anyway ... 
[12:26] <knome> elfy, ok, so what's the issue
[12:26] <elfy> bzr push :parent tells me there's nothing to push
[12:27] <elfy> but - I can see the changes here :p
[12:27] <elfy> https://code.launchpad.net/~elfy/ubuntu-manual-tests/ubuntu-manual-tests
[12:27] <elfy> this one
[12:28] <knome> so you want to push what where?
[12:29] <elfy> the changes in mine to https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-testcase/ubuntu-manual-tests/trunk
[12:29] <knome> right
[12:29] <knome> :parent might be set to your own branch
[12:29] <knome> so try bzr push lp:ubuntu-manual-tests
[12:29] <elfy> lol 
[12:30] <elfy> now branches have diverged
[12:30] <knome> ok,
[12:30] <knome> bzr merge lp:ubuntu-manual-tests
[12:30] <knome> bzr commit -m 'Merge with trunk'
[12:30] <knome> bzr push lp:ubuntu-manual-tests
[12:30] <elfy> mmm 
[12:31] <elfy> it did something
[12:31] <elfy> but - seems to have only been pidgin - which is old
[12:31] <knome> ...except that i only just merged it
[12:31] <knome> that's something you didn't have in your personal branch
[12:32] <elfy> ok - so yea - the changes are there now - thanks :)
[12:32] <slickymaster> I can confirm that, https://code.launchpad.net/~elfy/ubuntu-manual-tests/minorchanges/+merge/201284 just got merged
[12:32] <knome> np
[12:32] <elfy> I still hate bzr though :p
[12:33] <slickymaster> lol
[12:33] <elfy> don't do it enough and my notes for fighting with it are sparse :)
[12:34] <slickymaster> knome: I'm going to lunch now but after lunch can we talk about the documentation?
[12:34] <knome> yes, i should be around
[12:34] <slickymaster> ok
[13:30] <brainwash> so there has been some activity on this report bug 1246364
[13:30] <brainwash> we want the old behavior (tray icon instead of random popup window), right?
[14:38] <christoffer> hmm I'm trying to set playback of sound from "Klavaro" application to my headset in PulseAudio Control but the application only plays a sound (and shows up in the list) for a few seconds
[14:38] <christoffer> no time to change output device.
[14:38] <christoffer> Is it possible to set output device for specific application in some other way?
[14:40] <ochosi> christoffer: sry, but the support channel is over at #xubuntu, this is the dev channel
[14:40] <christoffer> aha ok 
[14:40] <christoffer> right
[15:02] <elfy> ochosi: was going to let them find out it wasn't a bug by reading the report :p
[15:03] <ochosi> haha, sorry for spilling the beans ;)
[15:03] <ochosi> fwiw, i think i just fixed the problem with nouveau and the greeter
[15:03] <elfy> and it'll only be half a dozen people do it - so I'm ok just telliing them :)
[15:04] <ochosi> i guess blues will review it tonight and then i'll merge it and in two days or so it'll be in the daily PPA the latest for you to try (optimistically speaking)
[15:04] <elfy> ochosi: excellent - I have been reading that inbacklog when I can, so I knew you were all there 
[15:04] <elfy> cool - as always - just let me know and off I'll trot :)
[15:04] <ochosi> btw, i need one more test from you as a nouveau user
[15:04] <elfy> k
[15:05] <ochosi> i found out that for me the screen *never* goes blank with nouveau
[15:05] <elfy> inlock screen? 
[15:05] <ochosi> and i wonder whether that's an issue of my specific hardware/driver combo, or in general
[15:05] <elfy> if that's the case it does here
[15:05] <ochosi> it blanks in the lockscreen?
[15:06] <elfy> yea - pretty sure it does - I'm off for a while in a bit - so can test whatever you want
[15:06] <ochosi> ok, then it's just me (good to know)
[15:06] <ochosi> yeah, there's one more greeterrelated thing i#d ask you to test
[15:06] <elfy> ok
[15:06] <ochosi> so ping me whenever you have time (hope i'll be around then)
[15:07] <elfy> why not tell me now :)
[15:07] <elfy> unless you're busy of course 
[15:07] <ochosi> no, i can, sure
[15:07] <elfy> go ahead then 
[15:08] <ochosi> 1) make sure you have the latest version of the greeter from daily PPA 2) lock your session 3) make sure the screen gets blanked 4) move your mouse to unblank the screen, then wait patiently for 30secs for the screen to go blank again
[15:08] <ochosi> 5) unblank the screen again, log into a *new* session from the lock-screen (e.g. guest-session if you don't have a second user)
[15:09] <elfy> not sure I have the daily ppa 
[15:09] <ochosi> 6) open a terminal, run "xset -q" and tell me the timeout value of ScreenSaver
[15:09] <ochosi> (or run "xset -q | grep timeout")
[15:10] <elfy> pretty sure I've got stable here - got link to the daily ppa 
[15:10] <ochosi> ok, in that case 0) "sudo add-apt-repository https://launchpad.net/~lightdm-gtk-greeter-team/+archive/daily"
[15:10] <elfy> and I can do that test of course
[15:10] <ochosi> so these 6 (or 7) steps, that's it
[15:10] <elfy> yep - no problem :)
[15:11] <ochosi> note that the nouveau issue isn't fixed in daily yet
[15:11] <ochosi> so ignore that for now
[15:11] <elfy> grrr
[15:11] <ochosi> :>
[15:11] <elfy> that ppa - httperror404
[15:11] <ochosi> if you wanna test that, you have to build a special branch yourself
[15:11] <elfy> nah - that's not what the grrr's for :p
[15:11] <ochosi> sudo add-apt-repository ppa:lightdm-gtk-greeter-team/daily
[15:12] <ochosi> that's better ^
[15:12] <ochosi> ;)
[15:12] <elfy> yea - got the lp page now - was running on copy what people say instead of read it first then :D
[15:14] <ochosi> yeah, sry for the mis-paste
[15:14] <elfy> that's ok - I should have noticed anyway lol
[15:14] <ochosi> indeed :D
[15:15] <elfy> ok - greeter updated 
[15:17] <elfy> ok - away for a bit now - shall lock screen etc
[15:17] <ochosi> mhm
[15:22] <papadoc> hey guys.  How does one go about submitting suggestions for Xubuntu.  ie, solutions to xfwm4 screen tearing, menu improvements, etc?
[15:23] <ochosi> hm, you can write things up and send them to the dev-ml
[15:23] <ochosi> or you can start to chat ppl up here
[15:24] <papadoc> ok great.  I'll do a bit more research to see if my suggestions have already been bounced around before I flood the chat =)  thanks
[15:24] <ochosi> what solution do you have to xfwm4 screen tearing? (switching the compositor off or saying compton is forbidden)
[15:25] <ochosi> wrt menu, we're currently strongly considering whiskermenu
[15:27] <pmjdebruijn> doesn't the new xfwm having vsync builtin?
[15:27] <pmjdebruijn> and the intel driver has _beta_ tearfree now too
[15:27] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: yeah, but it doesn't work well/at all with nvidia proprietary drivers
[15:28] <papadoc> ok thats what I was going to refer to:  sync to vblank
[15:28] <pmjdebruijn> ochosi: I know...
[15:29] <pmjdebruijn> http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfwm4/commit/?id=22d6df280117fba8eb7584bca631d73a7ba359e2
[15:29] <pmjdebruijn> it's already in an unreleased version of xfwm4
[15:29] <ochosi> sync to vblank is already in the xfce4.12ppa
[15:29] <ochosi> and xfwm4.11 will land in 14.04 most liekyl
[15:30] <ochosi> likely
[15:33] <pmjdebruijn> whiskermenu "looks" pretty nice
[15:33] <pmjdebruijn> what are the arguments against it?
[15:33] <pmjdebruijn> oh same guy as focuswriter
[15:35] <pmjdebruijn> btw
[15:35] <pmjdebruijn> with regard to bootsplash/wallpaper
[15:35] <pmjdebruijn> on some displays (read cheap laptops) there's some banding visible
[15:36] <pmjdebruijn> while that's partially the problem of the laptop
[15:36] <pmjdebruijn> adding some noise to the imagery might hide the issue
[15:36] <pmjdebruijn> http://noisepng.com/
[15:36] <pmjdebruijn> I'll do some experiments soon :)
[15:39] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: banding?
[15:40] <pmjdebruijn> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colour_banding
[15:40] <ochosi> guess i have to read up on 1) whether colour banding is what i think it is and 2) how noise helps there :)
[15:40] <ochosi> oh, right, it is what i thought it is
[15:40] <pmjdebruijn> effectively my netbook display is only 6bit per component, so 18bit in total, not 24bit
[15:41] <pmjdebruijn> yeah I still need to do some experiments
[15:41] <pmjdebruijn> it's common practice for css to add noise to gradients
[15:41] <pmjdebruijn> so I assume it works for bitmaps too
[15:41] <pmjdebruijn> but I'll try
[15:41] <ochosi> i think we have to add the noise directly to the png/svg files
[15:42] <pmjdebruijn> the added noise may fail to help after scaling
[15:42] <ochosi> i mean theoretically i can look at whether gtk has a function for that (for the greeter), but plymouth (=bootsplash) isn't very flexible
[15:42] <pmjdebruijn> right
[15:42] <pmjdebruijn> let me see if it helps first :)
[15:42] <ochosi> sure :)
[15:42] <pmjdebruijn> I'll just quickly gimp it :)
[15:43] <ochosi> i think "gimp" is really under-used as a verb, so kudos for that
[15:44] <ochosi> maybe you can tell me afterwards what the theory behind noise vs. banding is
[15:45] <ochosi> (simply distracting the eye by "blurring" the lines?)
[15:46] <pmjdebruijn> I think so
[15:46] <pmjdebruijn> it's akin to dithering
[15:47] <elfy> ochosi: timeout 600 cycle 600 
[15:48] <ochosi> elfy: and 4) ?
[15:48] <elfy> the blank after mouse movement was 10 mins - I assume that's ^^ why
[15:48] <ochosi> oh
[15:48] <ochosi> hmmm
[15:48] <ochosi> then i guess the last version in the PPA doesn't contain my latest patch :/
[15:48] <ochosi> sorry elfy
[15:49] <ochosi> let me check
[15:49] <elfy> however - I have fiddled with this install and xset previously
[15:49] <pmjdebruijn> http://ephotopros.com/articles/article-archives/articletype/articleview/articleid/399/reduce-banding-in-gradients.aspx
[15:49] <pmjdebruijn> I really do wonder if that survives scaling
[15:50] <ochosi> elfy: xset isn't persistent (unless you add it to the session-startup manually)
[15:51] <ochosi> pmjdebruijn: nice illustration there. it really does look better
[15:51] <elfy> ochosi: ok - thanks 
[15:52] <elfy> greeter version here is 201401131803~ubuntu14.04.1
[15:53] <ochosi> elfy: so yeah, that version has my patch
[15:53] <ochosi> elfy: after you unblanked the screen in the greeter, it really took 10mins for it to blank again?
[15:53] <elfy> mmm - ok - so not working for me
[15:53] <elfy> yep - I'd not make it up :)
[15:54] <ochosi> (in the session it should take 10mins, only in the greeter it's reduced)
[15:54] <ochosi> and you didn't just log out, but *lock* your session
[15:54] <elfy> I didn't count exactly - but it was enough time to do a cuppa and other stuff
[15:54] <elfy> yep - definitely - locked just after I spoke to you 
[15:54] <elfy> 10 mins - blanked
[15:54] <ochosi> weird
[15:55] <elfy> moved mouse 
[15:55] <elfy> then ~10 minutes again
[15:55] <ochosi> brainwash said it worked for him
[15:55] <ochosi> (and it does work for me)
[15:55] <elfy> nothing in any of the other ppa's likely to conflict with it 
[15:55] <ochosi> not really
[15:55] <elfy> or you having done stuff to files localy I'd not have?
[15:56] <ochosi> maybe you need to restart your greeter/computer somehow
[15:56] <ochosi> not really in this respect, no
[15:56] <elfy> perhaps - I can reboot a bit later and try - certainly worth doing that - just in case
[15:57] <ochosi> ok, thanks
[16:23] <elfy> ochosi: rebooted - will check again in a while
[16:23] <ochosi> thanks elfy
[16:23] <ochosi> bbl
[16:43] <slickymaster> knome: you're around?
[16:45] <holden87> Hi, me again (this morning's pathbar question asker). Is there a special reason the pathbar is like arrows?
[16:46] <elfy> I guess that was the way the person/people designing the theme wanted it 
[16:47] <elfy> personally I prefer it to show path - so do that
[16:50] <holden87> Oh, sorry, i wasn't clear on my thoughts. I apologise. The idea is great, it's just the problem (as i see it) that the buttons are detached onw from another, and in caseof arrows, i think the elementary os approach would fit nicer. But hey, you guys made evverything else beautiful so no real need for me to rant about this little thing :)
[17:04] <elfy> lol
[17:04] <elfy> ochosi: no change after a reboot - still not 30s after mouse movement - still same with xset -q
[17:23] <knome> slickymaster, pong
[17:24] <slickymaster> knome: about today's -devel mail
[17:24] <knome> yes
[17:25] <slickymaster> I can pick up mugshot and work on its documentation
[17:25] <knome> ok, then send an email on the list saying you will start working with it, and anybody else willing to help with that, contact you
[17:26] <knome> for the documentation itself, be in touch with bluesabre and make sure you are testing the version we are shipping
[17:26] <slickymaster> just one thing, is it supposed to be done in Docbook?
[17:26] <knome> that's a good question.
[17:26] <knome> bluesabre can tell you how he wants the upstream documentation to be done
[17:27] <knome> but i think we need to document mugshot at least briefly in the xubuntu documentation as well
[17:27] <knome> so we will, at some point, need to think about converting to docbook
[17:27] <slickymaster> I've worked on the Parole and xfdesktop on bluesabre server, but I'm guessing that for this it will be completely different
[17:28] <knome> how the upstream documentation is up to bluesabre, as i said
[17:28] <slickymaster> ok, I'll ping him on it
[17:28] <knome> not sure if docbook is the best choice for that
[17:28] <knome> i mean, it's not an xfce project, so it won't go to te xfce wiki
[17:28] <slickymaster> yeah, guessed as much
[17:28] <knome> and docbook is maybe a bit heavy for a single app
[17:29] <slickymaster> I'll discuss it with him
[17:29] <knome> but... yeah, i'll leave the decision to him
[17:29] <knome> good :)
[17:29] <knome> are you at all familiar with docbook?
[17:29] <slickymaster> not that much
[17:30] <knome> okay,
[17:30] <slickymaster> but if it deemed necessary I'll have to find a way to be ;) 
[17:30] <knome> if you want to become more familiar with it, i'd suggest getting the docs
[17:30] <knome> bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs
[17:30] <knome> then go to desktop-guide/C/, and look at the xml files
[17:31] <slickymaster> yeah, I've already done a few fixes on them, but that's not the same as building from the ground up
[17:31] <knome> sure
[17:31] <slickymaster> I'll see what he has to say about it
[17:31] <knome> writing the upstream doc is good already
[17:32] <knome> if not else, i can always port the required parts to docbook
[17:32] <knome> but we have other people, including jjfrv8, able to work with that
[17:33] <knome> and until we have the docs written... that's the least of our worries :)
[17:33] <slickymaster> yeah, I'm sort of counting on him to cover my back if it comes to that ;)
[17:33] <knome> hehe, sure
[17:56] <slickymaster> elfy: https://code.launchpad.net/~elfy/ubuntu-manual-tests/update_display_testcase/+merge/200101 is reviewed and approved
[17:57] <sergio-br2> hey hello
[18:00] <sergio-br2> what "size" means in Notes Properties? There are 3 option, small, medium and large, but apparently it does not changes anything
[18:01] <elfy> slickymaster: thanks :) 
[18:01] <knome> sergio-br2, affects new groups
[18:01] <knome> sergio-br2, shift+ctrl+n
[18:02] <slickymaster> np elfy 
[18:02] <sergio-br2> ahh, the size of the entire window, ok
[18:03] <sergio-br2> hey, this notes is cool :)
[18:03] <knome> yep
[18:03] <knome> the difference barely notifiable...
[18:06] <sergio-br2> isn't possible to each window have a different color? color by group?
[18:07] <knome> doesn't look like it.
[18:19] <sergio-br2> hum, if i change close and minimize buttons to left, it does not change in notes. It is a know behavior?
[18:19] <slickymaster> I'm off
[18:19] <slickymaster> bbl
[18:19] <elfy> cya 
[18:20] <knome> sergio-br2, notes doesn't use the regular xfwm controls anyway
[19:48] <jarnos> brainwash, did you have still something in mind concerning xfce4-terminal -e or -x?
[19:49] <brainwash> jarnos: no, it works for me
[19:49] <brainwash> -x executes the remainder, so no quoting needed
[19:49] <brainwash> however, you need to spawn a shell, otherwise you won't be able to pipe output
[19:50] <brainwash> xfce4-terminal -x sh -c "ls | less"
[19:55] <elfy> lderan: YAY :p
[19:55] <elfy> now what happens with it ... 
[19:55] <lderan> elfy, woo
[19:56] <lderan> it shoiuld get merged now
[19:58] <elfy> yep - I guess I need to start looking at jenkins reports properly now 
[19:58] <lderan> :P
[19:58] <elfy> I was looking at our image ones - but the last time I looked it was a red wall of fail
[19:58] <lderan> oh dear
[19:59] <elfy> still got the session bug so they just fail
[20:00] <elfy> last green one we have is the beginning of december
[20:02] <elfy> DanChapman: am I right in thinking that once we've got autopilot tests actually live, results would be in https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/
[20:05] <brainwash> micahg: we really need to merge the fix for 1259525 and released the updated package =S
[20:05] <brainwash> release I mean
[20:08] <brainwash> bug 1259525
[20:10] <micahg> brainwash: ok, I'll take a look when I get home later tonight
[20:11] <brainwash> micahg: thank you :)
[20:11] <ochosi> wb micahg 
[20:13] <DanChapman> elfy, no they haven't been set up to run on trusty yet, not sure why they stopped tbh, jibel has a work item for it this cycle i believe so should be up running again at some point :-S. You can also set them up to run as autopkgtests but that would mean moving each test to it's corresponding package. 
[20:14] <elfy> DanChapman: any haven't been set up - or the one we just got finsihed? 
[20:15] <elfy> hi micahg 
[20:17] <sergio-br2> someone knows what the default size icon to pop window that appears when you hover around the mouse in desktop?
[20:18] <ochosi> sergio-br2: that will be configurable in 14.04 with xfdesktop4.11
[20:18] <ochosi> i think the default is 128
[20:18] <ochosi> (mostly useful for images)
[20:18] <elfy> not so much for folders :p
[20:19] <sergio-br2> there is one or other icon that is less
[20:19] <sergio-br2> like calculator and screenshot
[20:19] <ochosi> yeah, possible that we don't have higher res icons for those two
[20:19] <elfy> I'm looking at something else ... 
[20:20] <sergio-br2> hum, i can get from the svg, make others png sizes, try a patch (it's good for me to learn this :) )
[20:23] <ochosi> sergio-br2: if you want to contribute to the icon-theme (which is very welcome btw) you have to pull the github-repo and create an svg in the appropriate size
[20:23] <knome> ochosi, Unit193: any possibility you could apply some pressure to get the session fix uploaded?
[20:23] <ochosi> knome: on who exactly?
[20:24] <ochosi> sergio-br2: https://github.com/shimmerproject/elementary-xfce
[20:24] <Unit193> knome: micahg is busy, and hasn't been handy lately.
[20:24] <knome> is it on the sponsor queue?
[20:24] <sergio-br2> hum, ok. But i saw, there is many svg icons. I think the question is only svg --> png, but i can do one or two icon in inkscape too.
[20:24] <sergio-br2> thanks ochosi
[20:24] <knome> does it have a patch?
[20:25] <ochosi> sergio-br2: yeah, png icons can't be accepted in the icon-theme, that much is for sure :)
[20:26] <knome> i'm off to watch a movie
[20:26] <knome> i will be back after that to pester you more
[20:26] <knome> ->
[20:27] <Unit193> knome: <miahg> brainwash: ok, I'll take a look when I get home later tonight
[20:31] <sergio-br2> hah, now i undertood... this icon theme is a little bit different
[20:34] <sergio-br2> in repo it's svg, in your deskop it is png. System convert during installation?
[20:36] <ochosi> sergio-br2: yes, because it makes the files smaller and they load faster
[20:40] <sergio-br2> smart trick
[20:41] <ochosi> well, also, svg is far better for maintenance, because you can modify the icons more easily
[21:13] <ochosi> brainwash: notice anything? http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-01142014-101324pm.php
[21:14] <brainwash> fake
[21:15] <brainwash> transparency
[21:15] <brainwash> :D
[21:15] <brainwash> ready to test?
[21:18]  * drc thought ochosi meant that he had his own, personalized lego character :)
[21:18] <ochosi> brainwash: well that as well, the mouse-cursor should serve as a hint
[21:19] <ochosi> drc: yeah, it kinda is ;)
[21:20] <brainwash> I noticed that too, grayed out panel items
[21:21] <ochosi> (fake transparency has been in trunk for days already, there's just no theme that uses it yet...)
[21:21] <ochosi> yeah, i fixed the code for the insensitive language and session items
[21:21] <ochosi> in case you don't remember, you've been nagging about that as well
[21:21] <brainwash> yeah :)
[21:22] <elfy> I am very pleased to see that I'm not the only one nagging then :p
[21:23] <brainwash> do you think that a visual indicator to "warn" the user about the incoming screen blank could be useful?
[21:23] <drc> 99 xubuntu bugs on the wall, 99 bugs on the wall, take one down, fix it around, 101 xubuntu bugs on the wall....
[21:23] <brainwash> ochosi: like a timer
[21:23] <brainwash> 10 sec before the screen blanks
[21:23] <ochosi> drc: thanks for the getting the spirits high ;)
[21:23] <ochosi> bleh, and he's gone
[21:23] <elfy> we can wait behind the tree :p
[21:24] <brainwash> ochosi: xscreensaver has such an indicator, gnome-screensaver print "blabla expired" some seconds before it hides the login box
[21:24] <ochosi> brainwash: yeah, thought about that, but honestly, ppl will notice. it's a no-brainer in a way
[21:24] <ochosi> brainwash: i mean ppl don't have an option in the greeter to change this or switch it off, so...
[21:25] <ochosi> just means adding yet another useless ticker
[21:25] <brainwash> which stays invisible most of the time
[21:25] <ochosi> yeah, i don't think it's worth the effort
[21:26] <ochosi> i'd rather fix other stuff
[21:27] <brainwash> true, if I really want this timer, I could implement it myself I guess
[21:28] <ochosi> yeah, would be about time you get your ass off the couch and send in some patches
[21:28] <brainwash> yes =S
[21:29] <ochosi> there are enough bugs for everyone ;)
[21:30] <ochosi> you could e.g. implement session-menu icons
[21:31] <ochosi> (if you prefer features to bugfixes)
[21:31] <brainwash> session-menu icons.. not sure what you mean
[21:31] <brainwash> in lightdm-gtk-greeter?
[21:31] <ochosi> give each session an icon
[21:31] <ochosi> yeah
[21:32] <brainwash> ah
[21:32] <ochosi> and show it in the menu instead of that silly settings-cog
[21:32] <brainwash> like unity-greeter does
[21:32] <ochosi> (like unity-greeter)
[21:32] <ochosi> shouldn't be hard
[21:32] <brainwash> monochrome?
[21:32] <ochosi> icons are already there, and i can draw additional ones
[21:32] <ochosi> i mean we can borrow them from unity-greeter for now
[21:32] <ochosi> and if there are sessions that need another icon, we can add them
[21:32] <brainwash> but they would be way too small
[21:33] <ochosi> why? xubuntu's logo in the startmenu on the panel is quite distinct imo
[21:34] <brainwash> same for language selector?
[21:34] <ochosi> nah, i don't wanna add 200 flags
[21:34] <brainwash> well, not a flag icon, but en_us
[21:34] <brainwash> de_de
[21:34] <ochosi> ah right
[21:34] <ochosi> yeah, true
[21:34] <ochosi> that'd be useful i guess
[21:35] <ochosi> so that you can see the settings before logging in without opening the menu
[21:35] <ochosi> originally, i wanted those items to be a part of the login-window
[21:36] <brainwash> yes, sounds like a nice improvement
[21:37] <ochosi> the language stuff would be very easy to do in fact
[21:48] <elfy> cheerybye
[21:58] <ochosi> as i thought: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-01142014-105815pm.php
[22:03] <brainwash> nice
[22:06] <brainwash> ochosi: oh, what about the sessions without an icon?
[22:06] <brainwash> some simple/basic sessions don't ship with icon I think
[22:07] <knome> Unit193, tomorrow = what day?
[22:07] <knome> Unit193, err, tonight
[22:07] <brainwash> ochosi: so cog as fallback, printing the actual session name sounds like a bad idea
[22:08] <brainwash> knome: he answered me 2 hours ago
[22:09] <knome> brainwash, ok, cheers
[22:09] <knome> brainwash, i can agree that printing session names is not a good idea
[22:10] <ochosi> yeah
[22:11] <ochosi> cog as fallback, session-icon if found/matched
[22:11] <ochosi> but we can at least add all major desktops/sessions we know of
[22:12] <brainwash> right, I was thinking of the basic "wm only" sessions
[22:12] <knome> yep.
[22:13] <ochosi> bbl
[22:20] <brainwash> ochosi: so we don't want to bloat the greeter screen with more information, but what about an indicator for the battery status (if available)? wasn't the initial plan to actually use the gtk3 indicators like unity-greeter?
[22:21] <brainwash> battery status would be awesome, now that we use the greeter as unlock screen
[22:24] <brainwash> I'll try to implement it
[22:24] <olli_> ng
[22:25] <knome> olli_, :)
[22:25] <Unit193> knome: Said not long ago, scrollback still.
[22:26] <knome> brainwash, yeah, i guess the battery indicator would be useful
[22:26] <knome> Unit193, mhm, didn't get to read that ye
[22:26] <knome> +t
[22:26] <Unit193> I skimmed. :P
[22:27] <knome> i should pick some photos today or tomorrow
[22:31] <ochosi> brainwash: not necessary, there is already support for gtk3 indicators there, so you only have to whitelist indicator-power and activate indicators in the config file
[22:32] <ochosi> if we use gtk3 indicators by default in 14.04, adding the power-indicator to the greeter would've been my plan
[22:33] <knome> "would have been" ?
[22:35] <ochosi> +anyway
[22:35] <ochosi> but it doesn't matter really before we get the gtk3 indicators uploaded finally
[22:36] <knome> but we're getting them uploaded, right?
[22:36] <knome> i mean, they are ready for upload, and there's no critical bugs?
[22:36] <Unit193> They randomly go transparent?
[23:12] <sergio-br2> ochosi, when there are no 128 px icon, desktop preview use 48 or 64 icon?
[23:14] <sergio-br2> don't worry, i understand now
[23:20] <ochosi> Unit193: even with the latest panel and indicator-plugin? weird, i really can't reproduce that at all
[23:25] <brainwash> ochosi: yes, transparency seems to work fine now
[23:26] <brainwash> at least if the panel is transparent, it might still bug if the panel is set to be non transparent
[23:29] <brainwash> ochosi: the highlighted menu entry is still a buggy, but this does not happen in unity, or?
[23:29] <brainwash> if you use greybird in unity I mean
[23:29] <ochosi> i have no idea 1) what you mean exactly and 2) what happens in unity, cause i've never used it
[23:30] <brainwash> I mean the gtk3 indicator menus show this visual glitch
[23:30] <ochosi> show me a screenshot, then i might know what you mean
[23:30] <brainwash> when you hover over the menu entries
[23:30] <ochosi> also, are you using the latest theme?
[23:31] <ochosi> (either from git or shimmer daily PPA)
[23:31] <brainwash> yes
[23:31] <brainwash> mmh, didn't you actually confirm this glitch some days ago? :D
[23:31] <brainwash> now I'm confused
[23:32] <brainwash> so basically it does change the background of the highlighted menu entry, but the background of the text label remains white (not blue)
[23:33] <ochosi> no
[23:33] <ochosi> i never confirmed that
[23:33] <ochosi> at least not that i can remember
[23:34] <ochosi> and your issue sounds totally like not using the latest greybird (i'm not talking about the trusty version, because that one is outdated)
[23:34] <brainwash> ok ok, let me boot my test system
[23:34] <brainwash> :)
[23:34] <brainwash> I'll also check unity
[23:36] <ochosi> sounds good to me
[23:42] <brainwash> ochosi: looks ok in unity, but not in my xubuntu session
[23:43] <ochosi> screenshot plz
[23:43] <brainwash> ochosi: do I need git/master of indicator-plugin?
[23:43] <brainwash> ok, give me 30sec
[23:43] <ochosi> no, Noskcaj's PPA should be fine
[23:43] <ochosi> basically that and the shimmer daily PPA
[23:44] <Unit193> ochosi: I use the ppa, it's there.
[23:45] <ochosi> Unit193: in trusty i suppose?
[23:45] <Unit193> Mhmm.
[23:45] <ochosi> Unit193: and, it just happens during the running session or at startup?
[23:46] <Unit193> What?
[23:46] <ochosi> that the indicators go transparent
[23:47] <Unit193> Two different issues, I was talking about the menus thing here.  They randomly go that way, don't know why.  The menu thing is always like that.
[23:47] <ochosi> what menu thing?
[23:48] <Unit193> That brainwash is talking about.
[23:48] <ochosi> so it's not always like that, just sometimes?
[23:49] <ochosi> ah, sorry
[23:49] <ochosi> didn't read attentively there
[23:49] <Unit193> Two different issues.  One is always like that, the menus being white and blue; and a second issue where the panel randomly shows the desktop background behind the icons.
[23:49] <ochosi> let me check whether the shimmer daily PPA actually works :p
[23:52] <bluesabre> slickymaster: feel free to document as you please on my wiki, I'll be dropping the help button from mugshot, so it will be helpful
[23:52] <brainwash> ochosi: http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/label13.php
[23:52] <ochosi> very odd, but exactly what the theme should fix
[23:52] <brainwash> it's daily ppa
[23:52] <ochosi> brainwash: just for testing, could you pull the latest version from github and test that for me?
[23:53] <ochosi> wanna rule out that it's the PPA
[23:53] <brainwash> sure
[23:53] <ochosi> (in saucy, this looks totally fine, so it could only be gtk3.10, but i haven't heard of any menuitem changes there)
[23:55] <brainwash> ochosi: same with git/master
[23:56] <brainwash> and it looks fine in unity
[23:56] <ochosi> ok, i'll try to come up with a patch
[23:56] <brainwash> isn't this strange? why does it look fine unity
[23:57] <brainwash> should be the same menu code, or?
[23:57] <ochosi> nope, it isn't
[23:57] <brainwash> so I guess that all shimmer themes are affected
[23:58] <ochosi> yeah, i guess
[23:58] <brainwash> Orion isn't
[23:59] <ochosi> yeah, orion doesn't have any special theming for the indicators
[23:59] <ochosi> ok, try this diff plz: http://dpaste.com/1551823/
[23:59] <ochosi> (i can also put up the whole file, if you don't like to apply diffs)