[07:01] <MooDoo> hello all
[07:02] <Myrtti> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lindaliukas/hello-ruby
[07:04] <Guest13800> heylo
[07:05] <MooDoo> that looks great Myrtti
[07:37] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Handwriting Day! :-D
[07:39] <MooDoo> morning JamesTait :)
[07:55] <MartijnVdS> \o
[08:09] <diplo> Morning all
[08:09] <MooDoo> morning
[08:10] <brobostigon> week two of workfare/mwa here i come,
[09:04] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[09:06] <MooDoo> morning bigcalm
[09:09] <bigcalm> !14.04
[09:10] <darrenflaherty> hey jpds
[09:11] <MooDoo> bigcalm: I'm running LTS on my laptop, looking forward to upgrading to Trusty :)
[09:11] <bigcalm> MooDoo: is there an ISO I can get?
[09:12] <MooDoo> bigcalm: for trusty?
[09:12] <bigcalm> Or do I have to install 13.10 and then try and move to 14.04?
[09:12] <bigcalm> MooDoo: yes
[09:12] <MooDoo> well there is this page - http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[09:12] <MooDoo> bigcalm: what version are you on at the moment?
[09:13] <bigcalm> MooDoo: not yet installed. This is for my new laptop that just arrived :)
[09:13] <MooDoo> bigcalm: go for Saucy then, it's the current version
[09:14] <MooDoo> 13.10, then you can upgrade when it's released, unless your a die hard and like to play :D
[09:14] <bigcalm> Ah, dailey-live. I was searching the cdimage site but didn't really know where to look
[09:14] <MooDoo> I just llike to use LTS releases as I'm not bothered about cutting edge tech for what I use
[09:14] <bigcalm> MooDoo: I realise that, I wanted to see how well +1 worked out of the box :)
[09:15] <MooDoo> ah there you go then :)
[09:16]  * bigcalm curses his desktop's wifi - limiting the download to 4ish MB/s
[09:18] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: you should talk to knightwise ;)
[09:22]  * foobarry has been virused.
[09:22] <MooDoo> foobarry: oooops
[09:23] <MartijnVdS> foobarry: what kind?
[09:26] <darrenflaherty> drussell, hi
[09:28] <Myrtti> -22C and I need to go get some food and mail a letter X-|
[09:29] <foobarry> MartijnVdS: headache/high temp/pains/cough
[09:29]  * foobarry crawls back to bed
[09:31] <MooDoo> ah not computer virus lol
[09:31] <bigcalm> foobarry: I seriously thought you meant a computer virus. Doh. Get well soon
[09:31] <MooDoo> bigcalm: you're not the only one :d
[09:37] <darrenflaherty> jnick_tait: hi
[09:47] <bigcalm> Right, how does one transfer the 14.04 ISO onto a USB stick in Linux? The Startup Disk Creator keeps on failing me
[09:53] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: dd
[09:53] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: dd if=isofile of=/dev/sdX
[09:54] <bigcalm> That all?
[09:54] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: it's a hybrid image, which works (and boots) in CD-ROM mode (BIOS and UEFI) and USB stick mode (also BIOS and UEFI)
[09:54] <bigcalm> Fair enough :)
[09:55] <bigcalm> sdc
[09:55] <bigcalm> dd if=Downloads/trusty-desktop-amd64.iso of=/dev/sdc
[09:55] <bigcalm> Nice and simple
[09:55] <directhex> clearly the tech was stolen from Ye Olde SteamOSe
[09:56] <bigcalm> Heh
[09:56] <MartijnVdS> directhex: obviously, where else?
[09:56] <directhex> (note: THIS IS A JOKE, THE REVERSE IS TRUE)
[09:57] <bigcalm> Before turning the new laptop on, I have already replaced the windows8 HDD with a blank SSD
[09:57] <bigcalm> Now to see if the image boots
[09:58] <bigcalm> dd says that it's finished its work yet the USB stick is still flashing :S
[09:58] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: cache!
[09:58] <MartijnVdS> maybe waiting for 'sync' helps?
[09:58] <bigcalm> Yeah, fun
[09:59] <bigcalm> I'm surprised with dd though. Would have thought that it would have done write immediately
[09:59] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: add "fsync" to the command line :)
[09:59] <bigcalm> MartijnVdS: I'll try to remember that for next time ;)
[10:05] <bigcalm> Installing \o/
[10:05] <bigcalm> The install screen says "Welcome to Ubuntu 13.10"
[10:06] <MooDoo> yay
[10:06] <bigcalm> I'm guessing that there are more important things to do before the install screen text
[10:07] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: I'd file a bug just in case
[10:08] <bigcalm> Heh
[10:09] <bigcalm> The 'grub-efi-amd64-signed' package failed to install into /target/. Without the GRUB boot loader, the installed system will not boot.
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> uhhh
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> how did you partition the drive?
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> just "Automatic use all" or manually?
[10:10] <bigcalm> MartijnVdS: left eveything to to the automatic stuff
[10:11] <bigcalm> The "Install crashed" window will now not close
[10:12] <bigcalm> Issued a sudo shutdown -P now from tty2
[10:12] <bigcalm> Now, do I try with 13.10 or try and tinker with the efi system?
[10:14] <bigcalm> popey: ping :)
[10:24] <bigcalm> http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-1873959/solved-ubuntu-linux-installing-computer.html
[10:24] <bigcalm> The guy gives up and installs Fedora
[10:25] <bigcalm> Appointment with my bank manager in a bit. Best have a shave :S
[10:27] <diplo> Anybody here use VMWare ESX with failover? ( redundancy )
[10:38] <bigcalm> Good news about OZC
[10:38] <MartijnVdS> Oh?
[10:40] <bigcalm> http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/01/toshiba-purchase-of-ocz-finalized-first-new-products-released/
[11:01] <davmor2> Morning all
[11:01]  * foobarry resurfaces
[11:04] <bashrc> periscope up
[11:09] <MooDoo> morning davmor2
[11:09] <davmor2> Hey MooDoo 'ow am ya chap
[11:09] <davmor2> bigcalm: is your spycamera here yet?
[11:12] <MooDoo> davmor2: fedup.com :D
[11:13] <davmor2> MooDoo: have a sadtrombone.com you won't feel so glum
[11:14] <MooDoo> new job please lol
[11:15] <davmor2> MooDoo: take a look see at http://www.canonical.com/careers
[11:17] <RaxMatt> hey guys
[11:17] <MartijnVdS> MattMan
[11:17] <RaxMatt> ¬.¬
[11:17] <MooDoo> davmor2: yeah just had a look, liked the look of the support engineer one, but can't speak manderin ;)
[11:18] <MartijnVdS> MooDoo: no better way to learn than immersion
[11:18] <davmor2> MooDoo: wuss ;)
[11:18] <MooDoo> MartijnVdS: I think mandering is a bit over my head :)
[11:18] <MooDoo> davmor2: geez thanks for the support :p
[11:25] <knightwise> afternoon everyone
[11:26] <MooDoo> hello knightwise
[11:26] <foobarry> anyone get a letter from the tax man today?
[11:26] <foobarry> about new tax code
[11:26] <knightwise> hey MooDoo :)
[11:26] <knightwise>  how are you guys today
[11:27]  * knightwise is playing with his Xfce box , tweakin it a bit
[11:39] <knightwise> Does anybody know the name of the backup application that is the standard one in ubuntu ?
[11:39] <foobarry> dejadup?
[11:39] <knightwise> i Like the fact you can backup your stuff anywhere
[11:39] <knightwise> ah :) Dejadup ! :)
[12:17] <MooDoo> trying to introduce code club to my local school :D
[12:34] <bigcalm> davmor2: yes. Tried to install 14.04. Looks like it got to the end except for this error: <bigcalm> The 'grub-efi-amd64-signed' package failed to install into /target/. Without the GRUB boot loader, the installed system will not boot.
[12:35] <bigcalm> The screen is very nice
[12:35] <davmor2> xnox: ^
[12:37] <xnox> bigcalm: do you have full install log? "ubuntu-bug ubiquity" if using desktop cd, or collect syslog if using d-i.
[12:38] <xnox> bigcalm: it shouldn't be a problem if grub-efi-amd64-signed fails to install, that only has detached secureboot signatures.
[12:38] <bigcalm> xnox: Once I OK'd that error, the whoops something crashed window appeared and would not clear
[12:39] <bigcalm> I haven't tried booting since installing
[12:39] <bigcalm> Will give it a go :)
[12:39] <bigcalm> Ah, no boot device found :)
[12:40] <xnox> bigcalm: i'd be interested in that crash dialog to be submitted before reboot... or ubuntu-bug ubiquity also before reboot.... =)
[12:40] <xnox> bigcalm: otherwise, can you fetch /var/log/installer/* from that system, if there is anything?
[12:40] <xnox> bigcalm: e.g. by booting back into live cd and mounting the target.
[12:41] <bigcalm> xnox: do you want me to start the install from fresh and then try to provide you with information. Or do you want me to boot to the 'try before you buy' desktop and try to provide you with information?
[12:41] <davmor2> bigcalm: I'd say xnox is awesome but he does have to get his head out of the doorways, so I won't :)
[12:43] <xnox> bigcalm: from the "try before you buy" provide me with info =)
[12:46] <bigcalm> xnox: okay, walk me though it :)
[12:47] <xnox> bigcalm: boot into live cd, click Try Ubuntu, "ctrl-alt-t" on the keyboard to start terminal, "sudo nautilus"
[12:47] <MartijnVdS> or Ctrl+Alt+F1, and just go from the terminal :)
[12:47] <xnox> bigcalm: under devices on the left you should see your current hard-drives, click on them to mount
[12:48] <xnox> bigcalm: than, find the most recent install and open up "var/log/installer" i want all of those files copied & pasted into e.g. http://paste.ubuntu.com
[12:48] <xnox> (e.g. open firefox on the left) assuming you have internet connection.
[12:53] <bigcalm> Sorry, a silly client phoned
[12:53]  * bigcalm presses keys
[12:59] <bigcalm> var/log/installer does not exist
[12:59] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: on the (not-quite-)installed system
[12:59] <xnox> bigcalm: =(((( reinstall
[13:00] <xnox> bigcalm: and if the install crashes, don't reboot, press "ctrl-alt-t" and do "ubuntu-bug ubiquity"
[13:00] <xnox> or if poop-ups appear click through to file a bug.
[13:00] <bigcalm> Will do
[13:00] <knightwise> :) Deja-du :) Its like Crashplan for linux :)
[13:00] <bigcalm> Tried to do that last bit, it didn't work
[13:01] <directhex> crashplan is like crashplan for linux!
[13:01] <knightwise> directhex: I think i should give the headless version of crashplan a try on linux ,
[13:02] <knightwise> because the "regular" one isn't any good :(
[13:02] <knightwise> keeps storing updates in the wrong location
[13:26] <bigcalm> Waiting for LP to process the report and let me finish it
[13:26] <bigcalm> Does this usually take a while?
[13:29] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: about a minute, I guess
[13:30] <bigcalm> Still waiting
[13:30] <bigcalm> Oh, it did finish :)
[13:30] <bigcalm> Just that the screen looks the same as it did before - laptop is on the floor while I got on with work
[13:32] <MartijnVdS> ♫ let the laptops hit the floor
[13:32] <MartijnVdS> ?
[13:35] <twager> Anyone tell me if the Nokia Lumia mounts as a block device in Linux ?
[13:36] <davmor2> twager: I'm assuming mtp same as android
[13:36] <knightwise> Mass storage device
[13:36] <knightwise> at least the 620 does
[13:40] <bigcalm> xnox: bug 1271934
[13:40] <xnox> bigcalm: scary!
[13:41] <bigcalm> xnox: it is?
[13:41] <MartijnVdS> Jan 23 13:19:07 ubuntu ubiquity: E: Failed to fetch cdrom://Ubuntu 14.04 LTS _Trusty Tahr_ - Alpha amd64 (20140123)/pool/main/g/grub2/grub-efi-amd64-bin_2.00-22_amd64.deb  Hash Sum mismatch
[13:42] <MartijnVdS> so either your 'dd' went wrong, or your copy of the .iso got corrupted somehow, or the copy on the server is corrupt.
[13:42] <bigcalm> Okay, I'll start by re-running dd and do another install
[13:43] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: I'd restart with checking the ISO :)
[13:43] <xnox> bigcalm: your media is most-likely borked.
[13:43] <bigcalm> Yay
[13:43] <twager> davmor2: Don't think so as my xperia mounts ok but my old sanfran does not..
[13:43] <MartijnVdS> xnox: it could be that the iso he downloaded is borked
[13:43] <xnox> bigcalm: yeah or that.
[13:44] <xnox> bigcalm: i have the same iso stamp and grub-efi-amd64-signed .deb md5sum matches on disk and in Packages.gz file.
[13:44] <xnox> bigcalm: verify iso md5sum after download, and recreate your install media.
[13:45] <bigcalm> d2ef4f5333aec03ea1ca11abd2f1c0fc *trusty-desktop-amd64.iso
[13:45] <bigcalm> d2ef4f5333aec03ea1ca11abd2f1c0fc  trusty-desktop-amd64.iso
[13:45] <bigcalm> md5sum is correct
[13:46] <smittix> afternoon all
[13:46] <knightwise> hey smittix
[13:46] <knightwise> :)
[13:46] <bigcalm> What was the option to write at once rather than have it cache?
[13:46] <bigcalm> dd
[13:46] <xnox> bigcalm: hm, can you do $ mount trusty-desktop-amd64.iso /mnt/
[13:47] <xnox> wait, nah,
[13:47] <xnox> bigcalm: boot into "try ubuntu" and do $ md5sum /cdrom/pool/main/g/grub2-signed/grub-efi-amd64-signed_1.27+2.00-22_amd64.deb
[13:48] <xnox> bigcalm: and compare it with mounting iso locally, I get: d4bd5b4f9dcd9876cf50e04396c2f930
[13:49] <bigcalm> xnox: I get that md5sum as well
[13:50] <davmor2> bigcalm: what are you burning it from?
[13:50] <xnox> bigcalm: click on network manager on the top right and disable interentz
[13:51] <bigcalm> Ug, I've just shutdown the machine again
[13:51] <xnox> bigcalm: wait a second.
[13:51]  * bigcalm waits :)
[13:51] <xnox> bigcalm: it's not -signed which is borked in your log but grub-efi-amd64-bin
[13:51] <bigcalm> davmor2: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/trusty-desktop-amd64.iso
[13:52] <davmor2> bigcalm: no I use k3b how did you burn the image?
[13:52] <xnox> f35d0af7f65c6ee2e58fa2cbe1577360  ./pool/main/g/grub2/grub-efi-amd64-bin_2.00-22_amd64.deb
[13:52] <bigcalm> davmor2: oh, dd
[13:52] <xnox> bigcalm: can you check md5sum of above (prefix with cdrom) from within "Try Ubuntu session" ?
[13:52] <bigcalm> xnox: sure, one moment
[13:54] <bigcalm> Yay, different number!
[13:55] <davmor2> bigcalm: that might be the issue then.  You want to use growisofs iirc if you are burning from the cli.  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CdDvd/Burning bottom of the page unless you are using a usb stick
[13:55] <xnox> bigcalm: i rest my case, sir =) re-create media ;-)
[13:56] <xnox> bigcalm: there should a boot option - press esc at the beginning to execute / validate installation media.
[13:56] <xnox> bigcalm: it takes a while, but helps to catch errors like these.
[13:56] <bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6803047/
[13:57] <bigcalm> Okay
[13:58] <bigcalm> xnox: thanks for the help :)
[14:01] <bigcalm> Check finished: errors found in 17 files!
[14:08] <MartijnVdS> time to buy a new USB stick
[14:09] <BigRedS> Apparently there's a site/toy that'll let you 'open' another webpage in it and play around with the HTML as a way of learning HTML; anyone know what it is?
[14:10] <MartijnVdS> Ctrl+Shift+J in Chrome ;)
[14:10] <MartijnVdS> you can edit the HTML and see the effects immediately from there
[14:12] <BigRedS> ooh, nifty
[14:12] <MartijnVdS> also CSS and JS, of course
[14:14] <foobarry> if this is real then cool http://messagetoeagle.com/easterislandbodies.php#.UuEjunhFDQo
[14:14] <MartijnVdS> message toe agle?
[14:15] <foobarry> why did nobody dig before?
[14:16] <MooDoo> foobarry: http://www.livescience.com/20580-easter-island-heads-bodies.html
[14:16] <MartijnVdS> foobarry: the images look shopped
[14:18] <Myrtti> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ahu_Tongariki.jpg
[14:21] <Myrtti> well, the news of the petroglyphs hasn't yet made surface elsewhere it seems
[14:21] <Myrtti> petroglyphs themselves though http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easter_Island#Petroglyphs
[14:22] <bigcalm> Does the 5th one have a cake on its head?
[14:23] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: that must mean he's the boss
[14:24] <bigcalm> :D
[14:24] <Myrtti> bigcalm: no, a 'pukao'
[14:24] <Myrtti> damn you and the person who set me on a Wikipedia binge
[14:24] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: at least it's not tvtropes
[14:24] <bigcalm> HEhe, aww
[14:25] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LandmarkOfLore
[14:25] <Myrtti> ahha! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moai#Markings_.28post_stone_working.29
[14:27] <Myrtti> höh
[14:28] <foobarry> we nicked one for the brit museum?
[14:28] <Myrtti> MartijnVdS: neither that article or "weaponised landmark" mentions the jumping Moai from Super Mario on Gameboy
[14:28] <bigcalm> Re-created the install media. Now running the check before installing :)
[14:28] <foobarry> time for a kip
[14:28] <bigcalm> No errors \o/
[14:28] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: Super Mario Land's World 3 has Moai not only in the background, but also as enemies. (They're called by other names in the manual, but come on.) Even the boss is a stone-throwing Moai. Not to mention the fact that World 3 is called Easton.
[14:29] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EenieMeenieMinyMoai
[14:29] <Myrtti> right
[14:33] <Laney> wow, just started bucketing down
[14:38] <MooDoo> yeah here too :D
[14:38] <Laney> funny that
[14:38] <diplo> Blue skies here, for once no rain!
[14:40] <RaxMatt> my servers are on rackspace now \o/
[14:41] <RaxMatt> and by jimminy they're fast
[14:43] <bigcalm> I have a working laptop. Yay :)
[14:44] <bigcalm> xnox & davmor2: thank you both :)
[14:44] <davmor2> bigcalm: you're welcome dude enjoy all the goodness
[14:46]  * bigcalm waits for things to break :P
[14:47] <bigcalm> I see that there is a lack of a battery monitor icon :(
[14:47] <davmor2> bigcalm: on the installed system ther eshould be
[14:47] <bigcalm> davmor2: I don't see it
[14:49]  * bigcalm shuts down to get on with his darn work
[14:51] <SuperMatt> yo yo yo
[14:51] <davmor2> bigcalm: go into settings power and see what the status is for the show battery status in the menu bar I have it when battery is present
[14:51] <SuperMatt> In west philidelphia bored and raised, on the playground is where I spend most of my days
[14:51] <davmor2> SuperMatt: fired already that was quick ;)
[14:52] <bigcalm> davmor2: as do I
[14:52] <davmor2> SuperMatt: at least your old nick^wjob hadn't gone hey
[14:52] <RaxMatt> I'm still here
[14:52] <SuperMatt> I'm just porting my server across
[14:53] <MooDoo> SuperMatt: RaxMatt free hosting now on their cloud?
[14:53] <davmor2> bigcalm: I'm just updating I'll see if mine disappears
[14:53] <bigcalm> Wow, I had a newer version of ubuntu than davmor2 for a change
[14:53] <SuperMatt> MooDoo: yup
[14:54] <davmor2> bigcalm: busy working on the older version for the apps :)
[14:55] <MooDoo> SuperMatt: nice
[14:55] <davmor2> bigcalm: oh no I'm up-to-date so just you then dude :P
[14:55] <bigcalm> davmor2: ho hum
[14:55] <bigcalm> Also, who thought it would be a good idea to make the track pad buttons also part of the track pad?
[14:56] <davmor2> forgot the archive is frozen for alpha2
[14:56] <davmor2> bigcalm: that is the issue on mine that I told you about really annoying right.  You can get used to it though
[14:57] <bigcalm> davmor2: means that I can no longer use 2 hands to move windows around
[14:58] <bigcalm> Guess I'll continue to use an external mouse
[14:58] <davmor2> bigcalm: yes you can
[14:59] <davmor2> bigcalm: left click and move works fine here
[14:59] <davmor2> bigcalm: or you can just click down and keep your finger pressed down and move it
[15:00] <MartijnVdS> bit it annoys!
[15:01] <davmor2> MartijnVdS: indeed it's when you get everything lined up nicely and then go to click on the button and it moves the cursor nothing worse
[15:01] <bigcalm> The touch screen is odd in Ubuntu
[15:02] <MartijnVdS> that too
[15:02] <MartijnVdS> can't get scrolling to work with it
[15:02] <MartijnVdS> it's "just" a mouse pointer
[15:03] <bigcalm> Yep
[15:17] <popey> bigcalm: pong
[15:17] <popey> I think I may have a memory leak
[15:17] <popey>   PID USER      PR  NI    VIRT    RES    SHR S  %CPU %MEM     TIME+ COMMAND
[15:17] <popey>  1710 root      20   0 2671944 2.212g 210352 S  12.6 14.2 108:28.86 Xorg
[15:20] <bigcalm> popey: too late, xnox and davmor2 helped me get my laptop install fixed
[15:21] <MartijnVdS> popey: only 2GB? You have 16! ;)
[15:21] <popey> your spycam arrived?
[15:21] <foobarry> resources exapnd to what's avaiable...
[15:21] <popey> its also constant 10%
[15:21] <popey> which it never was on saucy
[15:22] <davmor2> popey: what have was told you about the ear buds, when you feel resistance stop pushing
[15:22] <popey> davmor2: you on trusty on intel?
[15:22] <popey> (or anyone)
[15:22] <davmor2> popey: I am
[15:22] <davmor2> popey: it is optimus gfx
[15:22] <popey> top.. press m, is xorg near top?
[15:22] <popey> no, intel
[15:22] <davmor2> but the nvidia bit is broken
[15:23] <davmor2> popey: second
[15:23] <popey> my latest ebay item arrived broken ☹
[15:23] <popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/141142336606?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
[15:23] <foobarry> compiz top on my 1204 box grr
[15:23] <popey> http://imgur.com/KiZEPZ6,nspyQCB
[15:28] <bigcalm> popey: https://twitter.com/bigcalm/status/426375609325858816/photo/1
[15:28] <bigcalm> Well this isn't good
[15:28] <bigcalm> I can't shutdown my laptop
[15:28] <popey> omg!
[15:28] <bigcalm> It constantly reboots
[15:28] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: it's spying on you
[15:28] <popey> laptop with numeric keypad ⍨
[15:28] <bigcalm> popey: the keyboard is rather odd
[15:29] <bigcalm> Not used the laptop in anger yet
[15:29] <bigcalm> I've tried sudo shutdown -P now
[15:30] <bigcalm> Even that rebooted
[15:30] <bigcalm> To take the battery out, I will have to unscrew the back of the machine
[15:30] <bigcalm> Time to press and hold the power button
[15:30] <davmor2> popey: htop makes it clearer still :)
[15:31] <davmor2> popey: I a laptop with an numeric pad too, it's great for typing in credit card numbers :D
[15:32]  * davmor2 hugs htop it's so much easier to follow than top :)
[15:32] <popey> oh jeez
[15:32] <popey> every single damn time I say top
[15:33] <popey> someone somewhere on the internet tells me to use htop
[15:33] <Dave2> popey: have you tried htop?
[15:33] <popey> "no".
[15:33] <MartijnVdS> Dave2: is the "h" silent (like in American "herb")
[15:33] <popey> i even ran top just now, took a screenshot to put online and then thought "nah, someone will say use htop"
[15:33] <popey> goits
[15:35] <davmor2> popey: top is great for a quick assessment but I find it easier to follow things on htop.  Which is all I said not that you should use it :P
[15:36] <foobarry> do u have to be dumb to get on daytime quiz shows?
[15:37] <MartijnVdS> foobarry: "u"? are you trying to get on a daytime quiz show? ;)
[15:37] <popey> i just don't see it
[15:37] <popey> http://imgur.com/qJ36U9Z
[15:37] <popey> "Is xorg using lots of RAM?" -> "Yes"
[15:37] <MartijnVdS> popey: do you have 3d-heavy programs running?
[15:38] <popey> nope
[15:38] <foobarry> htop can show threaded processes or not
[15:38] <MartijnVdS> foobarry: so can top
[15:38] <foobarry> htop shows colours
[15:38] <popey> it's like me saying "can you google for foo"
[15:38] <popey> "No, I'd rather use BING"
[15:38] <popey> I DO NOT CARE
[15:38] <popey> the question was "is xorg using ram" not "what's your favorite cpu monitor"
[15:38] <popey> meh
[15:39] <popey> ☻
[15:39] <foobarry> popey got trolled
[15:40] <popey> 5GB disk cache tho ☻
[15:40] <MartijnVdS> popey: and an SSD?
[15:42] <popey> two
[15:42] <popey>  / or one, /home on the other
[15:42] <popey> http://www.itwire.com/it-industry-news/deals/62910-ibm-sells-server-division-to-lenovo
[15:42] <MartijnVdS> popey: still, all SSD
[15:43] <popey> ya
[15:43] <popey> no rust
[15:45] <foobarry> http://www.itnews.com.au/News/370344,hacker-gets-facebooks-keys-to-the-kingdom.aspx
[15:52] <JGJones> I might be a bit late to the party, but I was wondering my dear friend popey if you had heard of this excellent CPU monitor. It comes with colour too. As an additional bonus, it also have an extra letter over top. This letter is h. Most probably stand for Hyper and we all know Hyper make anything better. So popey, allow me to introduce you to htop!
[15:53] <popey> "lol"
[16:01] <JGJones> No love for atop though? :P
[16:08] <diplo> Or iotop
[16:10] <foobarry> i've got 50 mins of enfroced bed rest, what programme/youtube/etc can i watch?
[16:10] <bigcalm> foobarry: hat films
[16:10] <bigcalm> foobarry: they are nutty :)
[16:11] <foobarry> iplayer is still flash based? ugh
[16:12] <bigcalm> get_iplayer FTW!
[16:12] <bigcalm> And the web interface even more so :D
[16:12] <foobarry> chrome frw
[16:18] <popey> foobarry: here's one for you.. only 11 mins though https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlZ8iPaufTg
[16:18] <popey> :D
[16:18] <Myrtti> bigcalm: get-iplayer is nice, because you can set it to use a proxy by default ;-)
[16:19] <popey> Myrtti: feel free to send me your tv license fee and I'll passs it on, promise.
[16:20] <Myrtti> popey: I'll have to ask the SO for that
[16:23] <foobarry> popey: seemed rather incorrect view in the first 10 seconds
[16:24] <popey> yeah, he dives right in
[16:24] <popey> was only joshing
[16:24] <foobarry> showed blatant ignorance
[16:24] <foobarry> he lost me already
[16:24] <popey> heh
[16:44] <shauno> oh tihs goes on the "if you do this" list.  uses a setting "maxLenght".  if you subconsciously use the correct spelling, no workey.
[17:02] <bigcalm> Anybody know why my laptop reboots instead of powering off?
[17:02] <davmor2> bigcalm: it hates you?
[17:02] <bigcalm> davmor2: that's a given
[17:03] <drussell> lol
[17:03] <davmor2> bigcalm: I can't think of an obvious reason why it wouldn't shut down
[17:04] <drussell> davmor2: what's the laptop? and recent change or always been like that?
[17:04] <drussell> davmor2: and same behaviour from VT as from gui?
[17:05] <bigcalm> It shuts down, and then powers back up again. I wonder if it's something in the BIOS (or whatever it's called these days)
[17:05] <davmor2> drussell: not my laptop bigcalms
[17:05] <bigcalm> drussell: http://www.dell.com/uk/p/inspiron-15-7537/pd?oc=cn75305&model_id=inspiron-15-7537
[17:05] <drussell> davmor2: sorry, apologies, not paying enough attention!
[17:05] <bigcalm> drussell: running 14.04
[17:05] <drussell> bigcalm: always done it, or new behaviour?
[17:06] <bigcalm> drussell: the machine was delivered this morning :)
[17:06] <drussell> bigcalm: hehehe awesome, congrats :o)
[17:06] <drussell> bigcalm: sometimes they need different acpi quirks loaded to get around that kind of issue
[17:07] <bigcalm> drussell: I thought it might be an apci issue, just don't know what the best settings will be :)
[17:08] <drussell> bigcalm: if you switch to a VT after having logged out, what does "sudo shutdown -h -q now" do?
[17:10] <bigcalm> I haven't tried with -q
[17:10] <bigcalm> But -P now reboots
[17:11] <drussell> bigcalm: interesting
[17:11] <bigcalm> Is -h -q the same as -P now?
[17:11] <drussell> bigcalm: the -q shouldn't make any difference, just quiet
[17:11] <bigcalm> Ah, -h is halt
[17:11] <drussell> bigcalm: yup
[17:11] <bigcalm> I'll try just doing a halt
[17:11] <drussell> bigcalm: H P and h are all the same
[17:12] <drussell> bigcalm: are you using the nvidia binary drivers also?
[17:12] <bigcalm> drussell: not yet
[17:13] <bigcalm> lspci: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6803821/
[17:13] <bigcalm> I get the feeling that I'll run into the optimus problems
[17:13] <bigcalm> I've issued a halt. I can't tell if it's finished shutting down or has frozen :S
[17:14] <drussell> bigcalm: it's likely.... if you're not planning to use the nvidia hardware, can you disable it from the uefi settings?
[17:14] <drussell> bigcalm: lol @ shutdown or frozen
[17:14] <bigcalm> The ubuntu and 5 dots are on screen with the 1st one orange
[17:15] <bigcalm> I held down power
[17:15] <bigcalm> I want to use nvidia!
[17:16] <drussell> bigcalm: in that case, I'd suggest installing the binary drivers, see if that changes the behaviour for better or worse
[17:17] <bigcalm> Are you still talking about the shut down issue?
[17:17] <bigcalm> I'll get around to graphics some other time :)
[17:25] <Myrtti> oops http://usvsth3m.com/post/74285062011/you-wont-believe-why-the-victoria-line-is-currently
[17:31] <davmor2> bigcalm: stay on intel for now the nvidia guys still haven't fixed the 3.13 kernel issue yet
[17:32] <bigcalm> davmor2: that's what I thought
[17:32] <davmor2> bigcalm: it's in the works apparently
[17:35] <davmor2> drussell: optimus is broken on 3.13 the intel part is fine but the minute you enable the nvidia bit it falls back to safe gfx mode
[17:37] <drussell> davmor2: ahhhhhh I thought that'd been fixed :o(
[17:58]  * Laney gives in and mails directhex for a key
[18:12] <mapps> applied for another job
[18:12] <mapps> :D
[18:12] <mapps> annoying it just says salary 'competitive'
[18:15] <bigcalm> mapps: what kind of job?
[18:16] <mapps> system engineer architecht fanc title really.way more fancy than needs be
[18:16] <mapps> working for William Hill in London
[18:17] <mapps> annoying when they just say competitive and stuff
[18:17] <mapps> they had a few other roles but im not doing tchnical lead/service support roles 20-25k and living in London?
[18:18] <Laney> "crap but we know someone will take it anyway"
[18:18] <mapps> yea definitely
[18:18] <mapps> and sure if you live 10 to a house you'd manage
[18:18] <mapps> but i couldn't manage on 25k in London paying 1200+ rent
[18:22] <TheOpenSourcerer> directhex: Nice one :-) You got an indirect mention in ars: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/01/steamos-beta-adds-legacy-bios-official-dual-boot-support/
[18:32] <directhex> TheOpenSourcerer, old news! the new news is https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2014/01/msg00006.html
[18:46] <ali1234> i'm impressed how quickly valve picked that stuff up. they've also been very responsive to the trivial bugs i reported on steam for linux
[18:47] <ali1234> which were just silly stuff like "your XDG shortcuts are wrong"
[18:47] <ali1234> really trivial stuff that doesn't even affect the officially supported platforms. but they fixed it anyway
[18:48] <directhex> their engineers are really sharp
[18:49] <directhex> it'd piss them the hell off to be wrong
[18:49] <MartijnVdS> like true debian devs ;)
[18:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> directhex: Yeah - I'd heard that a day or two ago.
[20:55] <MartijnVdS> Good news: http://www.zdnet.com/uks-security-branch-says-ubuntu-most-secure-end-user-os-7000025312/
[20:55] <MartijnVdS> UK's security branch says Ubuntu most secure end-user OS
[20:57] <ali1234> NO
[20:57] <ali1234> no they don't
[20:57] <ali1234> this was well and truly debunked last week
[20:58] <MartijnVdS> tell that to zdnet
[20:58] <ali1234> zdnet sucks
[21:02]  * bigcalm waves from the new laptop :)
[21:02] <MartijnVdS> \o
[21:02] <MartijnVdS> it working OK then?
[21:03] <bigcalm> MartijnVdS, current problem is that I can't power off the machine without holding down the power button. But working okay otherwise :)
[21:04] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: just suspend instead ;)
[21:04] <bigcalm> ;)
[21:06] <Myrtti> well, the Hello Ruby-book which had less than ten backers when I first saw it, now has 1213 backers, with less than a day behind it, and has got 537% of the requested funding
[21:06] <bigcalm> I really really like the display
[21:08] <popey> bigcalm: what happens when you shutdown?
[21:09] <bigcalm> popey: the system powers itself back on
[21:11] <popey> bigcalm: be interested to know if the upstream kernel does it
[21:12] <popey> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v3.13-trusty/
[21:12] <popey> that one
[21:12] <bigcalm> popey: so just install the deb and reboot?
[21:13] <popey> debs
[21:13] <popey> the two amd64 and the all one
[21:13] <bigcalm> Oh yes, headers as well
[21:13] <bigcalm> Okay
[21:14] <bigcalm> Any particular order?
[21:14] <popey> all 3 at once
[21:14] <popey> download them and dpkg -i 1.deb 2.deb 3.deb
[21:14] <bigcalm> ah, I see
[21:14] <popey> and maybe then also grab the 3.12 too
[21:14] <popey> be interested to know if this is a regression
[21:18]  * bigcalm reboot
[21:18] <bigcalm> s
 Linux iain-laptop 3.13.0-031300-generic #201401192235 SMP Mon Jan 20 03:36:48 UTC 2014 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
 Shutdown worked correctly and did not power back on until I told it to do so
 Do you want me to check 3.12 as well?
[21:26] <bigcalm> Wrote all of that in the wrong channel :D
[21:26] <bigcalm> davmor2: battery notification icon appears once I've suspended the laptop by closing the lid
[21:29] <bigcalm> popey: ?
[21:30] <popey> no
[21:30] <bigcalm> Okay
[21:30] <popey> so 3.13.0-031300-generic works and stock 3.13 does not?
[21:30] <popey> bug time!
[21:30] <bigcalm> Heh
[21:31] <popey> thats good news
[21:31] <popey> you can keep using that kernel for now
[21:31] <bigcalm> Shall I stick with this kernal?
[21:31] <bigcalm> kernel
[21:31] <bigcalm> Sure
[21:31] <popey> reboot into the broken one and do "ubuntu-bug linux" to file a bug
[21:31] <bigcalm> Okay
[21:31] <popey> and give us the url or ping jsalisbury with it directly
[21:32] <bigcalm> How do I get grub to show when booting? It's booting straight into Ubuntu without asking
[21:32] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: hold shift I think
[21:32] <bigcalm> Okay, I'll try that
[21:32] <popey> yes, hold shift as soon as it powers on
[21:32] <popey> and choose the second option
[21:32] <popey> and then you'll get the list
[21:33] <bigcalm> Tally ho!
[21:35] <bigcalm> That didn't work :(
[21:35] <bigcalm> Keeps booting directly without showing grub
[21:35] <bigcalm> Can I edit grub to show the list every time?
[21:37] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: in /etc/default/grub comment the GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT line and update-grub
[21:37] <bigcalm> Ta
[21:37] <MartijnVdS> maybve set GRUB_TIMEOUT to non-zero
[21:38] <bigcalm> Reboot :)
[21:38] <popey> uhm
[21:38] <popey> hold shift earlier
[21:38] <popey> like, all the time
[21:38] <bigcalm> I did
[21:38] <popey> after you press power button
[21:38] <directhex> BEEP
[21:39] <directhex> KEY HELD ERROR, PRESS F1 TO CONTINUE
[21:39] <popey> nope
[21:39] <popey> shouldn't, thats why it's shift surely?
[21:39] <bigcalm> brb
[21:39] <directhex> i once had a motherboard that would throw a "no keyboard, press f1" error if windows ever crashed. shut down cleanly, fine. reboot forcefully, keyboard not found
[21:39] <directhex> this applied only to USB keyboards
[21:40] <directhex> so i had a cheap old PS/2 keyboard hanging out the back of the PC, just to hit F1 to continue on occasion
[21:40] <ali1234> i had a motherboard once where the PS/2 mouse port died
[21:40] <ali1234> you cannot disable PS/2 mouse in windows NT, it's built in to the kernel
[21:40] <ali1234> so that computer could not ever run windows again
[21:41] <MartijnVdS> why not? couldn't it cope with 2 mice at once?
[21:41] <ali1234> because it would freeze as soon as anything tried to open the mouse
[21:41] <ali1234> even if no mouse was plugged in
[21:41] <MartijnVdS> ah.. not just electrically dead
[21:41] <MartijnVdS> actively dead ;)
[21:42] <bigcalm> Good/bad news
[21:42] <bigcalm> I've rebooted with the default kernel 3.13.0-5-generic
[21:43] <bigcalm> I can now shut down correctly
[21:43] <MartijnVdS> \o/
[21:43] <bigcalm> Which means that I don't have a bug to report :S
[21:43] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: you do.. it's still in the Ubuntu kernel
[21:43] <MartijnVdS> so they need to get whatever patch is in upstream (or revert whatever they did to break it)
[21:43] <bigcalm> I can't reproduce the issue though
[21:44] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: but you can with the Ubuntu kernel right?
[21:44] <MartijnVdS> so it's something that's different between stock and ubuntu kernels
[21:44] <bigcalm> Linux iain-laptop 3.13.0-5-generic #20-Ubuntu SMP Mon Jan 20 19:56:38 UTC 2014 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[21:44] <MartijnVdS> ah wait
[21:44] <bigcalm> As far as I can tell, this is the ubuntu kernel
[21:44] <MartijnVdS> the *default* kernel.. not the *stock* one, I need to read better :)
[21:45] <bigcalm> The issue has gone away since installing the 2nd kernel and then booting with the original one
[21:45] <bigcalm> Most confusing
[21:47] <MartijnVdS> what if you power down completely and boot the original one
[21:47] <MartijnVdS> (so not stock but ubuntu, the previously broken one)
[21:48] <bigcalm> I'll give it a go
[21:48] <popey> yeah, start from scratch
[21:51] <bigcalm> The system is still shutting down correctly with the kernel that comes with Ubuntu 14.04
[21:53] <bigcalm> Now to try to remove the upstream kernel and see if it still happens
[21:53] <bigcalm> How do I do that? :)
[21:54] <bigcalm> I do have a bug to report though :)
[21:54] <bigcalm> Bluetooth won't stay disabled
[21:55] <bigcalm> !ping
[22:06] <oly> hi, any suggestions for me ubuntu 14.10 is locking at boot think its todo with sound
[22:06] <oly> 14.04 even, is there a parameter to disable at boot
[22:07] <oly> or a module i can block,
[22:07] <oly> previous versions of the kernel work, i think something changed probably because there never used to be any driver :p
[22:12] <ali1234> you can blacklist alsa modules
[22:16] <oly> cool i will give that a try, i was not sure if alsa was a module or if it was a sound driver i needed to blacklist
[22:19] <diddledan__> so I managed to sleep through the entire day
[22:22] <bigcalm> Much rebooting later. Bluetooth continues to ignore being turned off. This is with both kernels
[22:24] <bigcalm> Wee, my keybord lights up :D
[22:35] <popey> bigcalm: dpkg -l *3.13.0-031300-generic*
[22:36] <popey> bigcalm: when you say bluetooth ignores being turned off.. you mean you turn it off and it stays on?
[22:36] <popey> or do you mean you turn it off, reboot, and its back on?
[22:36] <ali1234> oly could be either. alsa is a module and each driver is also a separate module.
[22:37] <ali1234> probably go for the driver if you know which one it is
[22:37] <oly> yeah still happened,
[22:37] <oly> not sure on the driver, its likely loading the wrong one
[22:37] <oly> as looks like theris still no driver file for this sound card
[22:37] <ali1234> check the system logs
[22:38] <oly> will report a bug i can see a kernel oops in the logs when i go back to the older kernel
[22:39] <bigcalm> popey: the later
[22:40] <popey> bigcalm: thats been the case for years
[22:40] <popey> add a cronjob to sudo rfkill blah to shut it down ☻
[22:41] <ali1234> or disable in the bios
[22:41] <popey> bug 922375
[22:41] <popey> hmm
[22:41] <ali1234> rfkill is supposed to save state and restore at the next boot, like alsa does with volume
[22:41] <popey> ah
[22:41] <ali1234> at least i think it is
[22:42] <ali1234> maybe the udev rule got broken recently, like the alsa one did
[22:42] <ali1234> bug 1268301
[22:42] <bigcalm> popey: funky
[22:42] <ali1234> or maybe it doesn't work anything like that, i dunno
[22:49] <ali1234> ah here we go: /var/lib/rfkill/saved-state
[22:49] <ali1234> and /etc/init/rfkill-store.conf and -restore.conf
[22:50] <ali1234> does not appear to use udev
[22:51] <oly> that sounds a bit like the issue i am hitting
[22:51] <ali1234> nah, you have an oops :)
[22:51] <ali1234> show oops pls
[22:52] <oly> um one sec need to setup ssh on the other maching
[22:53] <ali1234> the alsa udev thing doesn't get fixed by swapping kernels either, it's caused because the udev rules changed, and the way they are parsed is quite complex, so changes in an unrelated rule can affect other rules
[22:56] <oly> http://pastebin.com/3NqnYFKW
[22:58] <ali1234> ooh, that's your video driver
[22:58] <oly> actually thats for the working one lol
[22:58] <ali1234> definitely report that
[22:59] <oly> 3.12.0-7 that works fine, i actually have graphics
[22:59] <ali1234> probably already reported then
[22:59] <oly> whats best way to report, the docs are confusing is it ubunt-bug
[23:00] <oly> i was reading some of the docs and could not find an actual command that seemed relevant, they all seemed geared towards applications
[23:00] <ali1234> yeah, they are
[23:00] <ali1234> that bug should eventually end up on bugs.freedesktop.org anyway
[23:00] <ali1234> but you might want to test with the vanilla kernels
[23:01] <ali1234> i just searched and i don't see it already reported upstream
[23:02] <oly> what shoudl i type to report it to launchpad ?
[23:02] <ali1234> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67345
[23:02] <ali1234> might already be fixed
[23:03] <oly> probably fixed in the kernel that does not boot :)
[23:03] <ali1234> probably, yes
[23:09] <oly> thanks for the help anyway ali1234, will try some things tomorrow
[23:09] <oly> at least i have touch screen and video,
[23:10] <oly> although anyone know if you can make onscreenkeyboard work with unity ?
[23:10] <oly> it seems to work for everything but the dash :p
[23:14] <oly> anyway thanks again night