[00:18] <ochosi> bluesabre: yeah, got any idea how his application went?
[00:28] <ochosi> i'm kinda busy tomorrow, if someone could tell elfy that his test-case for light-locker is good plz
[00:28] <knome> was there a branch for it?
[00:29] <ochosi> here: http://pastebin.com/rKmcbR2a
[00:29] <ochosi> :)
[00:29] <ochosi> that's what he pinged me about today
[00:29] <knome> that's not a branch :P
[00:29] <ochosi> oh rly?? :D
[00:30] <ochosi> brainwash: have you seen the nice annoying gtk3.10 cut buttons bug yet?
[00:30] <knome> ochosi, send an email to him and tell him to propose a merge :P
[00:30] <brainwash> ochosi: no, greybird?
[00:30] <knome> or, actually, blah
[00:30] <knome> i could do that myself right now
[00:30] <knome> (push to production)
[00:31] <ochosi> thanks knome 
[00:32] <ochosi> brainwash: try to launch synaptic with any theme that doesn't use pixmap-buttons
[00:32] <ochosi> (e.g. greybird, numix, ...)
[00:32] <ochosi> bluebird and ambiance work
[00:32] <ochosi> (hint: bottom border is cut off)
[00:32] <ochosi> probably a bug in the default engine
[00:32] <ochosi> anyway, g2g
[00:32] <ochosi> night everyone
[00:33] <brainwash> ochosi: good night
[00:36] <brainwash> ochosi: buttons in synaptic look fine, greybird-git
[01:10] <bluesabre> ochosi, brainwash: I think the bug is mainly GtkDialog, GtkMessageDialog
[01:25] <Unit193> knome: Sooo, this is a terrible mockup: https://paste.unit193.net/?f88fb53e8fe93467#L1Shvn0vUTtFh07xE59OtDuWQHUO8aYFcjJfUpdkRzQ=
[01:28] <Unit193> Honestly?  I have no clue what'll happen with tasksel, I have no way of testing it.
[01:28] <knome> hmm.
[01:29] <knome> just email the list with whatever you have, so we can get the discussion going
[01:29] <knome> i don't know enough to judge the technical issues this or that way
[01:30] <Unit193> Yes, but you can ask questions that any normal person would, so I can put it in the text to begin with. :P
[01:30] <knome> hah
[01:30] <Unit193> I'm too close to the issue to know what everyone would ask.  Also, can you somehow make it magically better worded?
[01:31] <Unit193> (Which is why I shouldn't help with marketing. :P )
[01:31] <knome> hah, i can help with that.
[01:31] <knome> dump it on a pad
[01:31] <Unit193> That paste has comments enabled, but sure.
[01:32] <knome> comments are meh compared to editing the actual content :)
[01:32] <Unit193> http://openetherpad.org/p/xubuntucore
[01:38] <Unit193> Woah, waaaaait.  I see where this is going, all the blame on "Unit193"
[01:38] <Unit193> :P
[01:38] <knome> hah
[01:39] <bluesabre> this happens every time
[01:39] <bluesabre> :)
[01:41] <bluesabre> Unit193 is our secret weapon with getting minimal stuff and xmir
[01:42] <knome> wait, that doesn't make sense
[01:42] <Unit193> knome: It happens because of how things work, apt-get install gets the package and everything depended on.  Tasksel will select the task (xubuntu-desktop^) with installs all the packages in the task taking into account the blacklist as well.
[01:42] <bluesabre> its a bit contradictory :)
[01:43] <knome> Unit193, so why do we mull on it? :P
[01:44] <Unit193> Because it's different, we can tell people to only use tasksel or apt-get install xubuntu-core^, but that's not going to cover all the bases, or the main one.
[01:44] <knome> i'm not understanding the problem
[01:44] <Unit193> bluesabre: Simply because I never know what's going on. ;)   Also, new xmir images are actually usable until they crashed.
[01:44] <Unit193> knome: OK...
[01:44] <knome> it's also almost 4am :P
[01:45] <knome> why do we need to consider that issue any further?
[01:45] <knome> isn't it just ok to mark those packages as depends?
[01:45] <knome> if not, what's the workaround?
[01:45] <Unit193> Sure, but "Xubuntu" will work fine without some of them. :P
[01:45] <Unit193> (Meaning, you can get more minimal.)
[01:45] <knome> of course.
[01:46] <knome> but we aren't trying to be minimal-minimal
[01:46] <knome> just xubuntu-minimal
[01:46] <knome> which doesn't mean we'll rip your pants off if you give us a chance.
[01:46] <knome> so the "problem" is that by depending on those packages, we're introducing more stuff than we need?
[01:47] <Unit193> Basically.
[01:47] <knome> but aren't we doing that by installing thunar...
[01:48] <Unit193> "Problem" is that tasksel'd xubuntu-core will be a bit different than apt-get install'd xubuntu-core.  Yes.
[01:48] <knome> ok, but that's true for -desktop as well
[01:48] <knome> what can we do about it?
[01:48] <Unit193> xfce4-terminal isn't really needed either.  Well, we can try to strip out all () packages, but not sure if that'd do it.
[01:49] <Unit193> xubuntu-desktop doesn't matter as much because that's expected.
[01:49] <knome> aha?
[01:49] <Unit193> You install the livecd or by the menu option in the mini.iso, thus nothing is needed to fix it.
[01:49] <knome> okay...
[01:50] <Unit193> So, all good?
[01:50] <knome> well i think i understand a bit more now :P
[01:50] <knome> but i don't still understand the section on the mail
[01:51] <knome> what you want to say is, the two things do not give the same results, right?
[01:51] <knome> but you don't know how they could be made to give the same results?
[01:52] <knome> and that it is a probably bad thing, because users are able to install the -core package with both ways, and both of them are just as correct?
[01:52] <Unit193> 1. These are marked as a dep so we get what we want even by doing --no-install-recommends.  2. We should be installing by --no-install-recommends.  3.  Tasksel and --no-install-recommends may be a tad different, but nothing major.
[01:53] <Unit193> Comment in the seed file explains: If you are using tasksel, you should get packages in parenthesis.  If following instructions with apt-get, you will not.
[01:53] <knome> okay
[01:54]  * Unit193 isn't good at being clear, but knows what he means. :P
[01:56] <knome> is that good now? :)
[02:00] <knome> dunno, i need to go to bed
[02:00] <knome> talk to you later, and you can always also bother pleia2 
[02:00] <knome> nighty!
[02:01] <Unit193> Cool, thanks.
[02:01]  * Unit193 looks.
[02:06] <Unit193> bluesabre: Ooooh, did you review the seed? :)
[02:06] <bluesabre> Unit193: I haven't
[02:06] <bluesabre> but I assume its probably good
[02:06]  * bluesabre hopes that doesn't come back to bite him later
[02:07]  * Unit193 stamped it approved by bluesabre.
[02:07] <bluesabre> crap
[02:07] <Unit193> It's created by me, it's likely insane. :D
[02:07] <bluesabre> :D
[05:25] <Unit193> Ugh, indicator-sound having dumb depends, means you have to hold the package and upgrade manually or disable recommends system wide. :/
[07:37] <elfy> knome: unless I hear different - going to put lightlocker in xfce core -even if it isn't - so it gets dragged into a not yet made testing call - the power one is in there as well for the moment
[07:38] <elfy> it can be tidied up later before unreal unicorn testing starts
[07:38] <Unit193> Hrm, might be nicer to remove xscreensaver for testing of lightlocker.
[07:38] <elfy> have you read the testcase?
[07:39] <elfy> oh 
[07:39] <elfy> yes
[07:39] <Unit193> Not yet, haven't seen it.
[07:39] <elfy> had a note in the one I've got here to do just that :p
[07:39] <elfy> but it wasn't in the paste ochosi had - that knome saw and used :p
[07:40] <elfy> added that to the tracker - but not trunk 
[07:41] <elfy> ty Unit193 - made me look :)
[07:55] <Unit193> Sure.
[07:55] <elfy> once it's properly in then I'll remove it
[08:41] <Unit193> elfy: You see the core proposal pad?  (Pretty sure it's not your thing, but meh.)
[08:41] <elfy> Unit193: not seen it no - might not be mine - but I know a couple of people that might be interested enough to test it
[08:43] <elfy> and I'd look at least :)
[08:51] <elfy> bluesabre: looking at menulibre now - highlighting accessories then adding launcher - I'd be expecting it to put the new launcher in accessories - but it appears to want to have it seperate from existing menu categories
[08:52] <elfy> is that right>? and does what I've said make sense? 
[08:52] <elfy> is the manual half done perhaps so I can look at the draft
[09:05] <ochosi> elfy: light-locker test case looks good btw
[09:06] <elfy> thanks - saw all that in the backlog eventually
[09:06] <elfy> couldn't work out how it had got there when it was still sitting here lol
[09:13] <elfy> ochosi: I'll try and get it into the tracker today - there'll be a call soon for the set it's going to live with for the moment - or do you want me to all for it specifically
[09:27] <elfy> done
[09:55] <slickymaster> morning all
[09:56] <elfy> hi slickymaster 
[09:56] <slickymaster> hi elfy 
[09:57] <elfy> slickymaster: started looking at menulibre this morning for testcase - but I can't work it lol, is there a draft/working copy of the docs for it?
[10:01] <slickymaster> elfy: not yet. I was planning on starting the menulibre docs as soon as I finish the mugshot's, which I think it will by the end of this week
[10:01] <elfy> ok
[10:03] <elfy> I'll wait for the answer from sean then 
[10:18] <slickymaster> elfy: need a favour from you
[10:18] <elfy> if I can do it then I of course will :)
[10:19] <slickymaster> I've this poor english sentence: "If you want to use a close-up photography of you!"
[10:19] <slickymaster> can you reword it for mr, please
[10:19] <slickymaster> me ^^
[10:19] <elfy> context?
[10:19] <elfy> slickymaster: ^^
[10:20] <ali12341> "If you want, use a close-up photograph of yourself!"
[10:20] <slickymaster> I'll give you the link
[10:20]  * slickymaster curses his internet connection
[10:20] <ali12341> but this may not mean what you intended, so, context...
[10:20] <slickymaster> elfy, here you go: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=mugshot-docs:usage#webcam_images_captures
[10:21] <elfy> aah ok - yea like ali12341 says ^^
[10:21] <elfy> no
[10:21] <slickymaster> ali12341: I think you've nail it 
[10:21] <ali12341> maybe
[10:21] <slickymaster> yeah, Thank you guys
[10:22] <ali12341> you're documenting mugshot - there's no reason why the user has to take a picture of themselves
[10:22] <elfy> If you want to use a close-up photograph of yourself, then after clicking the image button, choose ... 
[10:23] <ali12341> what i wrote does not fit the context at all
[10:24] <slickymaster> ali12341: well, the all idea behind mugshot is to ease the choosing of a profile image, and that's just one of the possibilities 
[10:26] <elfy> If you want to use a close-up photograph of yourself, then after clicking the image button, choose ... 
[10:26] <elfy> that should work in the context
[10:26] <ali12341> yes
[10:27] <slickymaster> yes, elfy. I think you're right
[10:27] <slickymaster> thanks
[10:27] <elfy> welcome - though you'll just get me and ali12341 arguing about English :p
[10:28] <ali12341> i should rope my brother in to writing documentation. he's a technical writer.
[10:28] <ali12341> he doesn't use linux at all though
[10:28] <slickymaster> :) that's good, it's a way to improve my english
[10:35] <elfy> ali12341: I keep meaning to get a mate to do the Gallego translation for us - he uses Xubuntu amongst other things
[10:44] <knome> elfy, is the test in tracker correct now?
[10:47] <knome> FYI, raring aka 13.04 is EOL now
[10:50] <bluesabre> elfy, yeah, that makes sense.  I wasn't sure what the preferred method for that would be.  You can use the up and down buttons to move an item into an open directory though
[11:28] <knome> !team | just a reminder, keep your blueprint work item statuses up-to-date!
[11:29] <Unit193> Do I have one?
[11:29] <knome> yep
[11:29] <knome> [Unit193] Work with GTK3 indicators packaging
[11:29] <knome> you can take more, there are items that are still assigned to teams
[11:30] <Unit193> Heh, not what I was thinking. :P
[11:31] <knome> also, team, if you've finished a work item or marked a bug "fix released", please make sure you have assigned yourself to the item/bug if at all appropriate, so we can track better who did what
[11:35] <knome> [xubuntu-doc] Write documentation for GTK3 indicators: BLOCKED
[11:35] <knome> any reason why that couldn't be TODO?
[11:36] <ali12341> not that i know of
[11:36] <ali12341> the user interface won't change, just backend stuff
[11:36] <knome> yep
[11:36] <knome> marked that as TODO then, ta
[11:36] <ali12341> although i guess it's depending on someone deciding which ones will actually ship
[11:37] <knome> ali12341, also, feel free to pick it up if you wish ;)
[11:37]  * knome shrugs
[11:37] <ali12341> i use them all but i can see that they're not all "ready"
[11:37] <ali12341> eg the ones with broken control panels
[11:37] <knome> marking back as BLOCKED :P
[11:39] <knome> Unit193, was there anything you actually needed to do with the gtk3 indicators packaging?
[11:39] <knome> and, are we still testing the indicators from PPA, or is the new stuff uploaded to the main repositories?
[11:39] <Unit193> Not that I know of...
[11:40] <knome> removing that work item then, but for the sake of it, assigning you: [unit193] Create specification for the xubuntu-core metapackage: INPROGRESS
[11:41] <bluesabre> I've added several branches to the 14.04 topic: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-t-flavor-xubuntu
[11:41] <knome> bluesabre, ta ta
[11:41] <knome> [xubuntu-dev] Refresh xubuntu_set-accountsservice-user-bg.patch to work with Xfdesktop4.11: DONE
[11:41] <knome> who done that?
[11:41] <bluesabre> ochosi or Noskcaj, maybe?
[11:42] <knome> yeah, but that doesn't help
[11:42] <knome> stupid team, not taking credits for things they did
[11:42] <Unit193> ochosi
[11:43] <knome>  [xubuntu-team] Discuss about technical guidelines in the Strategy Document: TODO
[11:43] <Unit193> FWIW I refreshed the nautilus one. :P
[11:43] <knome> Unit193, ^ eh, your area
[11:43] <Unit193> Eh?
[11:43] <knome> Unit193, there was some discussions to review the seed composition stuff and technical limitations for new packages
[11:43] <knome> i think it was brought up by skellat though
[11:44] <knome> if none of you developers raise that up, it'll be postponed
[11:44] <knome> developers or Unit193 
[11:44] <knome> ;)
[11:44] <knome> or skellat
[11:44]  * bluesabre votes Unit193
[11:44] <knome> yes, i think that would be a good pick
[11:45] <Unit193> bluesabre: Remember that I dislike python, right? ;)
[11:45] <bluesabre> sure
[11:45] <knome> Unit193, well there's probably no way going back now, but... :P
[11:45] <knome> we'd need the guidelines updated to what we've done
[11:45] <knome> (not really the right way to do it, but...)
[11:46] <bluesabre> Unit193 can help me port catfish, menulibre, and mugshot to vala or C
[11:46] <bluesabre> should be done by next lts, 16.04
[11:47] <knome> that's fine, i won't be leading this ship any more then ;)
[11:47] <knome> leading/steering
[11:48] <knome> tbh, the aforementioned changes to the strategy document barely concerns me either, so whatever, do what you want ;)
[11:48] <knome> (not really, but it's more up to the team what they want than me)
[14:40] <slickymaster> bluesabre, knome, http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=mugshot-docs are done and ready for your review/approval/suggestions. Please ping me your feedback and/or changes you see as neede
[14:40] <slickymaster> needed ^^ª 
[15:11] <micahg> hrm, will try to review some of the outstanding branches later
[15:47] <slickymaster> another thing, bluesabre, assuming that the mugshot documentation is alright, there's one thing you might want to update, which is the applications man pages.
[15:48] <slickymaster> bluesabre: maybe adding a SEE ALSO section informing that the full documentation for Mugshot is available online at http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=mugshot-docs
[15:48] <slickymaster> application's ^^^
[18:19] <pleia2> removing link to raring docs from our doc site since it's EOL today (I'll still keep the directory up though)
[18:23] <knome> pleia2, already removed the mention on /help
[18:23] <pleia2> cool
[18:25] <pleia2> also filed bug 1273798 that I'll get to this week
[18:25] <pleia2> if there's other stuff we should add to static, feel free to lmk, but we don't have a ton of space (only a few gigs on that server, we told them it wouldn't be much :))
[18:28] <knome> "only a few gigs"
[18:29] <knome> so we can store a gig of at pics?
[18:30] <pleia2> *cat
[18:30] <knome> yes that!
[18:36] <genii> I sort of find it amusing, since the XFCE thing is the mouse
[18:39] <knome> well of course those would be pics where cats are humiliated, with funny hats and stuff
[18:40] <genii> I guess that could work :)
[18:42] <pleia2> haha
[19:31] <elfy> knome: yep it is
[21:02] <brainwash> sergio-br2: we might need an upstream bug report for bug 1271891
[21:02] <sergio-br2> ok
[21:03] <brainwash> basically it always helps to also write a report upstream and link it to the launchpad one
[21:04] <brainwash> thanks
[21:33] <sergio-br2> brainwash, there is a way to link "officially" to bug reports in launchpad, but i don't how to do that.
[22:13] <slickymaster> night all
[22:27] <brainwash> sergio-br2: simply click on the "+ Also affects project" link below the list of affected packages
[23:17] <bluesabre> slickymaster: thanks for the suggestion
[23:17] <bluesabre> knome: looks like the sru docs went it
[23:17] <bluesabre> (in
[23:17] <knome> yep
[23:18] <slickymaster> bluesabre, did you get to review the mugshot docs yet?
[23:18] <bluesabre> slickymaster: I just now got back
[23:18] <slickymaster> ok
[23:21] <bluesabre> I'll check it out shortly though, thanks for all your work
[23:23] <slickymaster> np bluesabre. If you're ok with them, we have to start the next step, which is to port them to docbook format
[23:24] <slickymaster> bluesabre, and also start to think in the MenuLibre documentation
[23:30] <bluesabre> yep, that's going to be the fun part :)
[23:35] <knome> slickymaster, for xubuntu docs, i think we're mostly interested in a short version of the "choosing a profile image" and "profile data" sections
[23:35] <slickymaster> just that, nothing regarding the installation?
[23:35] <knome> "... are installed and regularly used ..."
[23:35] <knome> how's that probed?
[23:36] <knome> why installation? we're including it in the seed
[23:37] <knome> so it's ready to use in the system, just need to tell where the user can find it :)
[23:37] <slickymaster> knome, "... are installed and regularly used ..."  ?!
[23:38] <knome> slickymaster, http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=mugshot-docs:usage#profile_data
[23:38] <knome> slickymaster, end of first <p>
[23:38] <knome> well, middle of
[23:40] <slickymaster> knome, I don't have an answer for that. I'm not even really sure if bluesabre have quantified it in the code
[23:40] <knome> bluesabre, ping ping ping ping
[23:40] <bluesabre> bluesabre: hey, pay attention!
[23:40] <bluesabre> oh!
[23:41] <bluesabre> so what do we want?
[23:43] <slickymaster> knome, hmmm... short version. how short is short? :P
[23:44] <bluesabre> sounds like we're just interested in basic usage
[23:45] <slickymaster> and I'm guessing that there will be no use of images, right?=
[23:45] <knome> slickymaster, "here's how you launch mugshot. in mugshot, you can change your profile image by clicking the userimage button on the left. select one of the options and follow the instructions. (note: you need package X to use webcam.) in dialog Y, you can change your personal details; applying these details with LO/pidgin installed, you will be prompted to update their settings as well."
[23:45] <knome> slickymaster, there will, on the login/lock screens :)
[23:45] <slickymaster> ok, got it
[23:46] <slickymaster> and as we're speaking about the xubuntu docs, we might as well address the xfdesktop
[23:47] <slickymaster> does the approach is to be the same?
[23:48] <knome> yes, similar to that
[23:56] <knome> jjfrv8, you happen to be around?