[01:17] Saviq: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6835250/ - no ideas :( We need that fix badly, you've seen the screenshots how bad it is (or make FilterGrid clip views instead of limiting the model) [04:26] https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/unity8-fix-filtergrid/+merge/203657 [04:26] https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/unity8-center-align-title/+merge/203664 [04:26] * karni -> eod [04:27] (FTR I did sofly eod before, I just don't write this on every channel ;)) [06:11] Mirv: ping, hey I just saw your bug reports re: qt 5.2 && autopilot. I haven't had a proper look yet but had some thoughts/questions [06:12] I'm about to pop out for the night, thought I should mention it "Is it perhaps an AppArmor issue? Looks like there is a dbus exception happening" and "Is it possible that in this new version Qt have removed the ability to load the testability driver? I know we had to patch something in at some stage, but I'm not sure of the specifics off the top of my head". [06:15] veebers: a good question. regarding Qt, the "load_testability_from_env_var.patch" is still applied ie support for QT_LOAD_TESTABILITY env var [06:15] of course, there might be something changed with the testability driver, or then something on the apparmor side indeed [06:24] I updated the bug report with those thoughts [08:49] dednick: ping [08:49] tsdgeos: pong [08:50] Saviq: so what's the plan for the CI? isn't it a bit weird we are run both against released and unreelased stuff? [08:50] dednick: can you put the new merge stuff in your prposals? [08:50] tsdgeos, yeah, it is, I talked to fginther already, and we'll probably remove the local repo altogether [08:50] https://code.launchpad.net/~nick-dedekind/unity8/indicator.ubuntu-settings-components/+merge/199311 https://code.launchpad.net/~nick-dedekind/unity8/indicators.better-visible-items/+merge/201789 and https://code.launchpad.net/~nick-dedekind/unity8/indicators.hint-interval/+merge/202104 [08:51] Saviq: makes sense, will help reproducing the problems too [08:51] tsdgeos, what I would like is that it will be run against the CI Train silo PPA when active [08:51] tsdgeos: it's in https://code.launchpad.net/~nick-dedekind/unity8/indicators.better-visible-items/+merge/201789 already, will do rest. [08:51] tsdgeos, otherwise we'll get build failures in CI, for example, when we'd be releasing some project we depend on at the same time [08:52] dednick: tx [08:52] Saviq: makes sense [09:03] Saviq: i also was wondering if we're going to change who does the top approval [09:03] tsdgeos, I don't think so [09:03] tsdgeos, especially when we want to batch merges for release [09:03] Saviq: we could use it more as a marker of "what the grand master merger wants to merge in the next run" [09:04] tsdgeos, well, but that would mean he has to brood in all the MPs [09:04] right [09:04] tsdgeos, as opposed to just Approved ones [09:04] not cool [09:04] tsdgeos, and there's no problem with leaving one in Approved state until later [09:05] tsdgeos, so yeah, I think top-Approved are basically all candidates for next release [09:05] didrocks, morning o/ [09:08] didrocks, there's no 24h coverage of the landing team is there? any place where we could usually reach someone? again, chasing any one of you guys in person does not scale [09:13] didrocks, what do you think about automagically enabling silos for CI jobs when a project is active in CI Train? [09:13] Saviq: in meetings, there will be 24h coverage soon, but it's a long topic about autoenabling silo assignement [09:14] Saviq: we'll first try manually, if you wait too much, I'm happy to revisit [09:14] didrocks, no no, not what I was about [09:14] didrocks, please ping when you're out of meetings [09:14] didrocks, just wanted to leave you messages, not trying to drag you away from things [09:15] Saviq, they don't want to autoallow silos because they can want to be organize/ack what can land and not [09:15] seb128, not what I was about [09:15] they want to organize* [09:16] Saviq, ok, I would like to be able to get a ppa to test without blocking on a CI person to press the ack button for me :p [09:16] but maybe it's only me [09:16] seb128, different topic, but completely agree [09:16] I got stucked yesterday for half an hour waiting to get a silo so I could start a build before going away [09:17] seb128, yeah, the test builds should probably be allowed, even if it won't be published straight away [09:17] right [09:17] but I guess then the issue is the number of ppas in the pool [09:18] and the fact that the projects are locked when in silo [09:18] seb128, anyway, what I meant was enabling the silo PPAs for -ci jobs for projects that are in an active silo currently [09:18] well, that's your issue as a project lander [09:18] Saviq, I'm not sure to understand what that means? [09:19] seb128, say project x depends on a change in project y [09:19] seb128, they both need to land at the same time [09:19] seb128, -ci jobs for project x would fail due to (hopefully) dependencies or at least the missing change in project y [09:20] until now we had the local per-stack repo, built straight out of -autolanding jobs [09:20] ah, now I see what you mean [09:20] yeah, that makes sense [09:20] well to me, let's see what Dider&co think ;-) [09:20] ;) [09:21] Saviq: i guess we should start adding 2014 to at least the (C) notices of the new files we add [09:23] tsdgeos, indeed... [09:23] tsdgeos, or we could just bump them all in one go... [09:23] that too [09:24] not sure what are the lawyer-guidelines for increasing the year in a file we haven't touched that year [09:25] but i guess changing the year includes touching the file ^_^ [09:25] ;) [09:28] .... 5.5GB ram free... "This computer does not have enough free memory to analyse and send this error report"... [09:28] .crash file? 157K... [09:28] :D [09:29] you wrapped an integer of free memory [09:29] python was unhappy [09:29] random guess [09:55] MacSlow, is unity-notifications safe to release with all the changes after last release? [09:55] nice. this year we have a much better positioned stand at MWC :) [09:56] tsdgeos, where did you get that? [09:56] google does wonders :D [10:14] tsdgeos, got a thing for you [10:14] shoot [10:15] tsdgeos, we need to be able to tell LVWPH to start at category further down than 0 [10:15] tsdgeos, WDYT? [10:15] what for? [10:15] tsdgeos, to "hide" the top-most category by default [10:16] tsdgeos, so that unless you pull down you see the second category [10:16] Saviq, that isn't needed atm, we said the favourites are revealed by bottom swipe [10:17] mhr3, I must not have been there... and where do they show up? [10:17] Saviq: so it's one of those "pull down extra to change the beginning of the list" type of things? [10:17] Saviq, in that bottom swiped screen [10:17] someone used a Jolla phone? :D [10:18] mhr3, not following [10:18] tsdgeos, not springy, though [10:18] tsdgeos, anyway, apparently I don't know something, as you were [10:18] Saviq, the bottom swipe is supposed to give you a view similar to the current running view where you can remove favourites, reorder etc [10:19] running apps* [10:19] mhr3, yes, which is not gonna happen yet [10:19] Saviq: i guess it's doable, not sure how much it would take, and would for sure need an exact design of how it's supposed to behave, there's like hundreds of ways it can work [10:19] Saviq, the reordering yes, but the removing should [10:19] mhr3, the bottom swipe was connected to the "zoom-out" gesture [10:19] right [10:19] mhr3, which is not gonna happen [10:20] mhr3, and the fall back was to have a top-most category with favourites [10:20] oh good so then i missed something :P [10:20] mhr3, well, not gonna happen for MWC I mean [10:20] Saviq, oh, but 14.04? [10:20] mhr3, no [10:21] mhr3, first iteration we agreed to be just a top-most category in scopes scope, hidden by default [10:21] i remember design being strongly against that [10:21] although that != mark [10:22] Mark explicitly said that we should go for that top-most category to start with [10:22] yes, and rest of design didn't agree [10:23] ok, I need to clarify this then [10:24] ping katie once she's here [10:49] /food [10:56] Saviq, can i get someone to review https://code.launchpad.net/~mhr3/unity-scopes-shell/preview-model/+merge/203706 ? [10:56] or maybe you want to? ;) === _salem is now known as salem_ [10:57] Saviq: back from all talking [10:57] Saviq: so, publishing unity8 is ready it seems? awesome! [10:58] Saviq, I ran lp:unity-notifications with all notification ap-tests and the supported examples... all worked. [11:03] didrocks, yup, ready [11:03] Saviq: and doneeeeeee [11:03] MacSlow, that wasn't my question ;) [11:03] Saviq: happy first landing! [11:03] didrocks, I need to wait now for them to be published, right? [11:04] Saviq: in the release pocket yeah [11:04] didrocks, yup, thanks [11:04] Saviq: if you run merge and clean before, it will tell you where things are [11:04] didrocks, I'll look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8 [11:04] that's how you can "hum, after 6 hours, still in proposed, there is an issue" [11:04] Saviq: yeah ;) [11:04] but you don't have to [11:04] you can wait for 3 hours [11:04] and rerun it [11:04] didrocks, yup, I know [11:04] it will tell you :) [11:05] Saviq: ok, I just meant, don't feel obliged to track right away :p [11:05] Saviq, I say yes [11:05] MacSlow, ok :) [11:06] Saviq, I just also wanted to provide you with my reasons :) [11:07] didrocks, so, my question for you was: what do you think about enabling the relevant silo PPA in -ci jobs, when applicable? [11:07] Saviq: so they are 2 sides of that story [11:07] didrocks, so say project x depends on a change in project y, and they're in the same silo, but still -ci jobs for them will fail [11:07] first, a technical one, we'll need to write a jenkins plugin [11:07] (but that shouldn't be a blocker) [11:07] then, there are social sides [11:08] 2 things as well here :) [11:08] first, I think it's great to have the conversation on the testing plan [11:08] like "you try to land the sdk, you listed only the sdk testing plan, you should as well run the unity8 one and the apps ones" [11:08] -> that kind of feedback/discussion is good before assigning a silo IMHO [11:09] once this is addressed and people can make sensible decisions [11:09] didrocks, again, not my question I think ;) [11:09] didrocks, I'm not about *assigning* a silo [11:09] we can have automated silos attribution for most of the case [11:09] oh [11:09] I shouldn't anticipate questions :p [11:09] let me backlog again, sorry ;) [11:09] didrocks, say a silo is already assigned [11:09] yep [11:10] didrocks, both project x and y are in there [11:10] yeah [11:10] didrocks, and x depends on the change in y [11:10] didrocks, -ci jobs for x would fail on (hopefully) dependencies, or just due to the missing change in y [11:10] ah, -ci jobs like the one showing on the MP? [11:10] didrocks, yes [11:10] yeah, so that's in my mind [11:10] and we should do that [11:10] (and it's a known flaw) [11:10] you're quick to pick them up :p [11:11] :D [11:11] I just didn't want to disturb fginther before they finish their current project [11:11] but it's on my list to "poke the CI team about" [11:11] didrocks, yeah, I'm just gathering opinions [11:11] so sounds like we're on the same page [11:11] I completely agree that at least for the MP you set/attribute a silo for [11:11] they should add the ppa [11:11] and use that [11:11] I think the impact isn't low on the CI machinery to do that [11:11] didrocks, yup [11:12] but that would align us more with the Airline vision [11:12] didrocks, true [11:12] indeed [11:12] so yeah, we do agree :) [11:12] I just wonder if I should depress fginther right away [11:12] (what I think I did pinging him twice) [11:13] * didrocks has no glasses to see Francis' face on the other side of bluefinn [11:13] didrocks, ;) [11:15] tsdgeos, mzanetti, could one of you do https://code.launchpad.net/~mhr3/unity-scopes-shell/preview-model/+merge/203706 ? [11:16] /food for real [11:16] i will [11:31] didrocks, ^ is what I wanted to talk about. today is not good for me, maybe tomorrow === rachelliu_ is now known as rachelliu [11:38] MacSlow: added the 4 questions with their answers [11:38] to https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity-notifications/qcompare/+merge/203362 [11:39] tsdgeos, thx... what do you think about "extending" unity8's new MR-process to unity-notifications? [11:40] Saviq, ^ [11:40] tsdgeos, overkill or not? [11:40] it's ok, i guess the ui question will never apply [11:40] tsdgeos, true [11:40] but i just answer no and that's it :D === alan_g is now known as alan_g|afk === alan_g|afk is now known as alan_g [11:49] fginther: ah great! [12:05] mhr3: is it me or testresultstest-ng is pretty unstable? [12:05] every second run it hands [12:05] hangs [12:06] tsdgeos, yea, there's something wrong with the registry i already brought it up, fwiw with latest scopes-api it times out, and then the second try always works [12:06] ok :/ [12:10] mhr3: i always like doing while [ true ]; do make test; if [ $? -ne 0 ]; then break; fi; done to stress the tests [12:10] but i can't in unity-scopes-shell because of that [12:11] tsdgeos, add pkill -f scoperegistry and scoperunner [12:11] then it will work [12:11] mostly the runner, registry should exit fine [12:12] is that planned to work? [12:12] i.e. it's a bug or per design? [12:12] bug [12:13] the registry "forgets" to kill the scope [12:13] for some reason [12:13] oki [12:14] tsdgeos, while [ true ]; do make test; if [ $? -ne 0 ]; then break; fi; pkill -f scoperunner; done === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [12:17] Saviq: good day :) looks like we didn't land stuff yet :(? Did I miss something in the process? https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/unity8-fix-carousel5/+merge/203444 [12:17] oh.. forgetting you still need the timeout branch for that [12:18] karni, no, it just didn't happen yet - but it's almost there - waiting for things to get published in release pocket [12:18] MacSlow|lunch, it will, but it's Thomas's turf [12:18] Saviq: thanks :) [12:19] karni, did review of your branches, too [12:19] wohoo [12:19] * karni goes through them [12:22] karni, did your filtergrid branch actually fix the issue? I'm afraid I didn't understand well what was happening [12:23] yes, allow me a moment to address yor comments :) [12:23] karni, ok good [12:23] karni, your fix carousel branch just got merged [12:23] Saviq: in unity8-center-align-title - you mean the decision whether or not something should be centered should be based on mappings, not values, right? [12:23] Saviq: \o/ [12:23] Saviq: if that's the case, I understand now, and you're right. I'll need to fix that. [12:24] karni, leave that be for now, please [12:24] karni, I'm extracting those kind of decisions (category-wide) to a CardTool [12:24] Saviq: oh ok [12:24] karni, so it will fit in there [12:24] * karni nod [12:27] sil2100, could we still have automerger for non-trunk branches? [12:28] mhr3: i don't understand the hideDash signal, what's it about? [12:28] Saviq: addressing your filtergrid comments - you're right on the fixes. Regarding the question - yes, it does fix it. The problem seems to be that FilterGrid freaks out (rendering-wise) when backed by FilterProxyModel - that made the test implementation clean and 'smart', but made it fail at the same time. Instead, I would manually swap out the model, which would solve the failing tests - and the fix was still untouched, in that branch. ... [12:28] ... Concluding, yes - it does fix the rendering issues shown on screenshots :) [12:28] * karni addresses the comment fixes [12:29] karni, right, so a FilterProxyModel over a FilterProxyModel freaks out [12:29] karni, file a bug indeed, please [12:30] Saviq: do you know what's the toolkit project called? or shall I file against unity8? [12:30] tsdgeos, it's scope saying "oh i probably launched something or invoked a dbus service, user wants to interact with that and not the dash" [12:30] karni, that's internal in unity8 [12:30] ok [12:30] didrocks, sil2100, Mirv, can one of you guys please push unity-notifications through landing pipeline (old)? [12:31] mhr3: hmmmm ok [12:31] tsdgeos, shouldn't really be necessary in mir land though [12:31] Saviq, ok makes sense [12:40] mhr3: wouldn't doing [12:40] + Q_EMIT previewReady(m_preview); [12:40] + m_preview.clear(); [12:40] get the receiver a dangling pointer? [12:41] tsdgeos, the receiver owns the preview, not the scope [12:42] tsdgeos, or well.. the one that invokes preview() owns it [12:42] mhr3: ok, got it [12:43] Saviq: Tried my best to explain this weird behavior. https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1274095 [12:43] Ubuntu bug 1274095 in Unity 8 "FilterGrid backed by FilterProxyModel renders wrong" [Undecided,New] [12:48] Saviq: we'll try! [12:48] sil2100, thanks :) [12:49] mhr3: I think we could! [12:50] karni, yup, got it [12:50] :) [12:52] tsdgeos, but maybe i should have set the previewmodel's parent to the scope... still i wanted to express that the invoker is supposed to delete it once it's done with it [12:53] mhr3: i think what you have works [12:53] lunch! [12:53] tsdgeos, well if the invoker didn't delete it, it would leak [12:53] mhr3: maybe document in the .h that review() passes the ownership on [12:53] it's typical for this kind of "it's your duty to delete stuff thing" i'd say [12:54] tsdgeos, i have a feeling that qml will ignore me no matter what i say in a comment [13:01] dednick, conflicts in hint-interval === alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch [13:04] Saviq, can you repeat me what you told me yesterday about the models and model data? I think I'm confusing things here [13:05] Cimi, the model for the audio widget will be an array of dictionaries [13:05] Cimi, so [{"source": "foo", "title": "bar", "subtitle": "baz"}, { ... }] etc. [13:05] Saviq, I did this [13:05] Saviq, but how do I use this inside the repeater? [13:05] Cimi, to access those, you need to use modelData["source"], modelData["title"] etc. [13:06] Cimi, model: [...] works in a Repeater [13:06] Cimi, only then, in delegates, you don't have model.source, but modelData["source"] instead [13:06] oh great [13:06] thought that didn't work [13:06] I'll continue then [13:07] Saviq, wrote this for the test file http://paste.ubuntu.com/6837718/ [13:07] Saviq, need to put title, length, uri with " " [13:07] ? [13:08] Cimi, no, that's fine, Repeater { model: data.musicData; delegate: Label { text: modelData["title"] } } } will work now [13:09] Cimi, no need to wrap in the QtObject, though [13:09] ok [13:09] I'll see if that works [13:09] thank you [13:13] Saviq: "I'd collapse that into one line now." - I didn't want to make the line lengthy, but maybe I should just remove the { return .. } bits? [13:13] Saviq: so it's one (broken) line [13:14] Saviq: the readonly prop collapsedHeight: { return } -> readonly prop collapsedHeight: /n [13:14] karni, yeah, and our line lenght limit is 120 anyway [13:14] oh [13:14] I should have known better. [13:14] :) [13:14] karni, nw [13:14] karni, but yeah, you shouldn't use { return ... } unless you need to wrap, or have more complicated bindings there [13:14] Saviq: nw? :D [13:14] * karni nods [13:18] karni, no worries [13:18] that one I didn't know haha [13:27] Saviq: all comments addressed :) https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/unity8-fix-filtergrid/+merge/203657 [13:28] Saviq: Yup, seen it [13:28] karni, dednick, k [13:33] karni, flatten 16 + readonly property int rowsWhenCollapsed: { [13:33] 17 + return Math.min(collapsedRowCount, Math.ceil(model.count / columns)) [13:33] 18 + } too, please [13:34] missed that [13:35] Saviq: collapsed, compacted and pushed [13:37] Saviq: fixed one teset case tag, sorry. [13:37] *test case tag [13:37] Saviq: unity-notifications is building, we'll try releasing it later on [13:37] sil2100, thanks [13:45] karni, approved [13:45] Saviq: Thanks! [13:45] Saviq: If carousel5 was merged to trunk, is it time to +! the new-scopes carousel fix? https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/new-scopes-fix-carousel5/+merge/203597 [13:45] * +1 [13:45] karni, yup, lemme merge trunk into new-scopes first [13:46] Saviq: Sorry I'm bugging you, but thanks to you, we've pushed forward *significant* amount of work the phone delivery needs to make decisions for MWC :) We appreciate that. [13:47] karni, don't be [13:47] karni, conflicting, merge please [13:47] * karni does that [13:48] karni, and that's why I didn't want to push before ;) [13:48] ^-^ [13:50] Saviq: right, that is because getRenderer function in GenericScopeView is different in trunk and new-scopes. You're aware if I merge trunk to unity8, one day merging new-scopes back to trunk will conflict, right? [13:51] unless we'll want that change in trunk already. for now, getRenderer is different in trunk and new-scopes [13:51] the latter uses the template, and has less arguments. [13:52] karni, no it won't conflict [13:52] karni, because I just merged trunk into new-scopes [13:52] karni, so your change will be correct on top of new-scopes [13:52] erm [13:52] on top of trunk === alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g [13:57] Saviq: I merge new-scopes, and bzr shows me only 1 conflict in tst_GenericScopeView.qml, while lp shows me 1 more in GenericScopeView.qml. super confusing. [13:57] * karni expects 2 conflicts, like lp shows [13:58] heh, ignore me ;P [14:00] Saviq: fixed. https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/new-scopes-fix-carousel5/+merge/203597 [14:01] karni, cheers [14:01] cheers! [14:11] good morning. [14:11] can I get a review here please? https://code.launchpad.net/~elopio/unity8/generic_preview/+merge/202793 [14:16] elopio: sure, will do [14:18] tsdgeos: thank you. [14:20] kgunn: Saviq: hangout or mumble today? [14:21] tsdgeos: let's hangout [14:22] okidokig [14:22] * tsdgeos fixes his hair [14:22] :D [14:23] tsdgeos: you too huh ? [14:23] * dandrader looks for a tshirt to put on [14:23] * dednick looks for his pants [14:23] oh wait, dont need those [14:24] Saviq: Can I test a custom scope using unity-scope-tool? I found there's --scope-dir argument, but couldn't make it work. If I install a scope on my machine, can I make unity-scope-tool pick it up? [14:25] karni, just switch the scope like you would on the phone [14:25] karni, either via top bar or swipe left/right [14:25] perfect [14:26] If someone could PM me the hangout link, that'd be neat :) [14:27] or, just add it to calendar event [14:27] they do mumble [14:27] not today, I hear [14:27] oh wow [14:27] mhr3, yeah, it's a full-blown bi-weakly hangout today ;) [14:28] mhr3: I thought you were on this team, how confusing ;D [14:28] karni, you got invite [14:28] karni, anyway, --scope-dir takes a dir which has subdir and inside it needs to have subdir.ini and libsubdir.so [14:28] subdir == scope_name usually [14:29] Thanks :) [14:29] mhr3: ah [14:29] so "--scope-dir /foo" if you have /foo/bar + /foo/bar/bar.ini + /foo/bar/libbar.so [14:30] dammit google [14:30] mhr3: helpful! [14:30] yeah i need to swtich g+ identities too [14:31] nope [14:31] hrm. unity-scope-tool working for folks? http://paste.ubuntu.com/6838096/ [14:32] karni, restart scope-registry should help [14:32] * karni tries [14:32] kgunn, you joining? [14:33] Saviq: ha :> thanks [14:34] kgunn, lost you on hangout... [14:36] Saviq: is the standup on hangout today? [14:36] elopio, yes, sorry, let me paste you the link [14:36] :) [14:42] greyback_, not happening for you? [14:42] Saviq: no I only stay connected for 15-20 seconds then loose connection [14:43] greyback_, nice... [14:45] Saviq: no good, I can't even connect now [14:45] greyback_, nw, just put your stuff in the doc [14:45] Saviq: ack [14:46] Saviq: what's the best way to check what has landed in trusty-proposed - the landing spreadsheet? what about new-scopes ppa? I'm fairly new to this, sorry. [14:49] re: my question, just heard that trunk would only be a bit behind demo-stuff builds [14:52] Saviq: hi! About unity-notifications, could you use CITrain for landing this maybe? Would be much of a problem? [14:53] thostr_, ↑ [14:54] sil2100: I'm having a big timing problem tbh. So, if you could get landed I'd be more than happy [15:01] mzanetti, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/trunk/revision/558 [15:01] Saviq: are you landing branches into a staging branch before landing them to trunk? === dandrader is now known as dandrader|afk [15:01] mzanetti, did you forget to add the ogg test files? [15:01] elopio, no, that was a plan we had, but decided against it [15:02] Cimi: need to check, one sec [15:02] Cimi, I don't think we wanted test files like that - the Audio { } component is overridden for the tests [15:02] Saviq: that's the plan they have in autopilot, so can you tell me why you didn't like it? Just to see if they shouldn't do it. [15:03] elopio, well, it's something the CI train folks don't want us to do, and because we can land multiple MPs at the same time in a single CI Train landing, it didn't really give many advantages [15:03] kgunn, Saviq: so first action (for the in-call notification of 2nd call) is to get latest feedback from the sdk-folks [15:03] elopio, other than having a branch into which we merge before actually merging to trunk [15:04] macSlow, there's two of you... [15:04] kgunn, Saviq: yeah... I've not logged out of the other machine [15:04] MacSlow, truth is first of all we need to get design to stabilize [15:04]