[01:02] <callmeDarwin> What the irc client you all prefer?
[01:02] <rick_h_> irssi + tmux
[01:08] <callmeDarwin> ok checking it out
[01:24] <cmaloney> I'm using weechat + tmux
[02:45] <jrwren> weechat, i hear good things.
[02:49] <callmeDarwin> using XChat now but looking around
[02:51] <callmeDarwin> I'll have to do some more research
[12:14] <cmaloney> morning
[12:18] <cmaloney> Oh, the Pebble Steel actually looks like it wasn't beat senseless by the ugly stick
[12:19] <cmaloney> http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/01/the-pebble-steel-review-wearables-2-0-arrive/
[12:20] <cmaloney> I <3 "The Bad": "Some developers still think we want to type on our watches"
[12:30] <rick_h_> yea, I can't wait until mine ships
[12:30] <rick_h_> sad I ordered on annoucement day back at CES and missed the first batch
[12:50] <cmaloney> rick_h_: Wow, that's some demand.
[12:50] <cmaloney> also: http://www.reddit.com/r/csbooks/comments/1wfoid/hey_guys_im_looking_for_modern_programming/
[12:50] <cmaloney> I'm an ass, but that's really a dumb question.
[12:51] <brousch> Totally voting you up
[12:51] <cmaloney> tx
[14:08] <jrwren> cmaloney: did you see what the subreddit description says?
[14:10] <brousch> Ah, they only want free versions of books
[14:10] <brousch> cmaloney: I'm totally voting you down
[14:48] <cmaloney> Bah
[14:50] <cmaloney> Well something tells me it's not released like that.
[15:24] <jrwren> add that do your comment and then the comment is good
[15:27] <cmaloney> Whatever. I think she's just looking for free books, as is evidenced by her reply.
[15:28] <jrwren> oh! a reply!
[16:56] <rick_h_> woot! with the latest user import crossed 70k bookmarks https://bmark.us/dashboard
[16:56] <widox> yay
[16:58] <brousch> Will you send everyone a tshirt when you pass 100k?
[16:58] <rick_h_> brousch: hah, no. I've got stickers though.
[17:05] <widox> I think sending out a binder of everyones bookmarks when it reaches 100k is more appropriate :)
[17:05] <widox> to save on ink, it could be the readable version
[17:36] <cmaloney> rick_h_: Awesome!
[17:39] <jrwren> i hate taking python scripts and turning them into proper packages
[17:39] <rick_h_> jrwren: always start with either cookiecutter or modern-package-template and never have the problem
[17:41] <cmaloney> http://www.metalinjection.net/tour-dates/motley-crue-announce-final-tour
[17:42] <cmaloney> brousch: It even starts in Grand Rapids
[17:42] <cmaloney> So no excuses
[17:50] <jrwren> rick_h_: yeah... easier said
[17:51] <rick_h_> jrwren: yea, I know but have to push. I hate scripts that aren't packagable
[17:51] <jrwren> me too
[17:51] <jrwren> i'm making it happen here. its just work for what feels like little gain
[17:51] <rick_h_> yea, it's the kind of thing that once you start right you notice how nice life is
[17:52] <rick_h_> especially if the script has deps/etc
[17:52] <rick_h_> pita to have to go through a readme to use a script
[18:01] <jrwren> when imp.find_module doesn't work. *rage*
[18:12] <brousch> cmaloney: My excuse is that Motley Crue sucks
[18:20] <cmaloney> brousch: All I hear is just more reasons you should go
[18:21] <rick_h_> smoser: https://twitter.com/alex_gaynor/status/428592822912950272 ?
[18:26] <smoser> that will be us eventually.
[18:26] <smoser> and the answer will probably be 'no'
[18:26] <smoser> :)
[18:27] <rick_h_> smoser: cool, just ran into it and thought I'd mention
[18:27] <smoser> the other answer is "its in the cloud image".
[18:27] <smoser> currently docker maintains this tiny little ubuntu image.
[18:28] <smoser> we're working towards them to use 'ubuntu core' more directly
[18:28] <smoser> and posibly to also offer ubuntu cloud image
[18:28] <smoser> although you can easily just use the ubutnu cloud image in docker too
[18:28] <rick_h_> cool
[18:29] <jrwren> ca-certificates IS installed.
[18:30] <jrwren> at least on the cloud-image I'm running
[18:32] <rick_h_> jrwren: right, that's what smoser is saying. It's in the cloud image, while Alex doesn't have it in the ubuntu docker image
[18:32] <jrwren> ah.
[18:38] <mathomastech> Finally got my Raspberry Pi up and running, and externally accessible via SSH! Only took about 3 weeks :)
[18:41] <brousch> WTF
[18:41] <brousch> Should take 30 minutes at most!
[18:43] <jrwren> new python issue - i'm having problems with imp.find_module. one case it finds it, another case it doesn't.
[18:49] <mathomastech> brousch: First time installed and setting up arch, messing with port forwarding, setting up DNS records, learning ssh, scp, and screen. All in all a solid day's worth of research and learning. But I only did it may a half hour at a time.
[18:50] <mathomastech> If I had to do it again, I could probably get it done in an hour or under :)
[18:51] <brousch> Good learnin
[19:27] <jrwren> python kinda sucks.
[19:27] <jrwren> its hacks ontop of hacks in too many places
[19:27] <rick_h_> jrwren: yep
[19:28] <jrwren> .NET was/is sooooooooo good in that regard.
[19:28] <rick_h_> but let me show you ruby and its hacks :P
[19:28] <jrwren> oh ruby is worse for sure.
[19:28] <brousch> So go use Java!
[19:28] <jrwren> NEVAR!
[19:28] <rick_h_> hah, speaking of hacks
[19:28] <jrwren> oracle is evil1!
[19:30] <jrwren> imp.find_module just does not ork.
[19:31] <jrwren> maybe a mac thing?
[19:31] <jrwren> 2.7.5 venv thing?
[19:31] <jrwren> this is driving me mad. can you tell?
[19:31] <jrwren> even more troubling thing is that it works on antoher system.
[19:32] <jrwren> someday, I'll master packages and modules
[19:33] <jrwren> waht is the different between a.b and a/b when loading a module?
[19:33] <brousch> This function does not handle hierarchical module names (names containing dots). In order to find P.M, that is, submodule M of package P, use find_module() and load_module() to find and load package P, and then use find_module()with the path argument set to P.__path__. When P itself has a dotted name, apply this recipe recursively.
[19:34] <jrwren> brousch: thanks!
[19:35] <jrwren> which explains why a/b/c works on one system, but it doesn't explain why a/b/c doesn't work on antoher system.
[19:35] <brousch> One system is superior
[19:35] <brousch> The other is crap
[19:36] <jrwren> agree, linux > osx
[19:36] <brousch> Sorry. I don't have any actual useful advice
[19:36] <jrwren> no, pointing that out was very helpful. I can attack the problem differently
[19:37] <brousch> The docs have some system-specific wording, but it is not helpful
[19:38] <jrwren> this is actually better.
[19:38] <jrwren> i can specify path instead of searching sys.path
[19:38] <jrwren> very helpful brousch
[19:38] <brousch> RTFM!
[19:38] <brousch> Now I feel better
[19:42] <jrwren> now I get an import error runnign find_module
[19:42] <jrwren> No frozen submodule named a/b.z
[19:42] <jrwren> where I have find_module('z','a/b')
[19:42] <jrwren> so weird!!!
[19:43] <brousch> What is the /?
[19:44] <brousch> OH, that's the path?
[19:44] <jrwren> right
[19:47] <greg-g> jcastro: hey! I'm in the same hotel for a product owner training thingy that the '08 Google UDS was!
[19:47] <jrwren> 6 yrs seems like yestreday
[19:48] <jcastro> greg-g, !
[19:48] <jcastro> was that the one with the pool in the lobby?
[19:48] <jcastro> like one of those long pools with rocks in it?
[19:48] <greg-g> yeah
[19:49] <greg-g> in crazy sprawl land of south bay
[19:49] <greg-g> we had to walk like a mile to the nearest bar
[19:49] <jcastro> yep
[19:49] <greg-g> where you and I roomed :)
[19:56] <cmaloney> my one regret is I never went to a physical UDS
[19:56] <cmaloney> well, I have many regrets, but that's the most pertinent one at the moment.
[20:09] <rick_h_> lmorchard: widox waf trevlar cmaloney reminder it's early CHC tonight 7pm
[20:09] <trevlar> rick_h_: cool
[20:10] <trevlar> hey could I borrow that cabinet making book from you?
[20:10] <rick_h_> trevlar: sure, I'll bring a few books down if you'll be there and you can pick over them
[20:11] <widox> rick_h_: blag, no CHC for me -- wife has the car in GR :(
[20:11] <rick_h_> widox: booo
[20:11] <rick_h_> widox: not up for a nice brisk walk? :P
[20:11] <widox> hah!
[20:22] <jrwren> brousch: load_module directly instead of using find_module FTW!!!
[20:22] <jrwren> maybe python doesn't suck as bad I sometimes think <3
[20:23] <brousch> It is the greatest programming language and ecosystem ever created
[20:25] <jrwren> next to C# and .NET
[20:26] <jrwren> or wait... ecosystem.
[20:26] <jrwren> I take it back.
[20:26] <jrwren> You are correct.
[21:07] <rick_h_> cmaloney: http://r.bmark.us/u/af045a9add9327 heads up
[21:15] <rick_h_> wtf? http://r.bmark.us/u/eb106a51277521
[21:16] <brousch> hm
[21:16] <rick_h_> my phone is now a lenovo phone?!
[21:16] <brousch> If it's a Motorola
[21:16] <rick_h_> yep
[21:16] <rick_h_> motox
[21:17] <brousch> Well, it could be worse
[21:17] <brousch> Some of the new Lenovo tablets are interesting
[21:22] <jrwren> anyone have tips for multiple pakcage_dir ?
[21:22] <brousch> For whowha?
[21:25] <rick_h_> jrwren: modern-package-template
[21:25] <rick_h_> it's got the setup for that ootb
[21:25] <rick_h_> which is one annoying thing because it's another dir level in the package and I've not needed it
[21:27] <jrwren> i can't.
[21:28] <jrwren> i'm WAY more complex than that.
[21:28] <jrwren> i guess if setuptools can't do what i want, that is an option :)
[21:28] <rick_h_> setuptools does it
[21:28] <rick_h_> I just mean that it's 'template' is setup for it
[21:28] <rick_h_> run it in an empty dir and look
[21:28] <jrwren> too sipmle.
[21:28] <jrwren> give me something moar complex than that.
[21:29] <rick_h_> virtualenv ~/tmp/test-package && cd ~/tmp/test-package && bin/pip install modern-package-template && bin/paster create -t modern-package testthingy
[21:29] <rick_h_> or something like that
[21:29] <jrwren> yay, modern package template links to docs that don't exist anymore.
[21:30] <rick_h_> they're right there? https://pypi.python.org/pypi/modern-package-template
[21:30] <jrwren> links to docs.
[21:31] <brousch> MPT does not have Python3 port, so it is deprecated
[21:31] <jrwren> it links to http://packages.python.org/distribute/setuptools.html#namespace-packages
[21:31] <jrwren> which is 404
[21:31] <rick_h_> jrwren: oic
[21:32] <rick_h_> brousch: right, cookiecutter is the new hotness
[21:32] <rick_h_> brousch: but I've not used it
[21:32] <brousch> I'll have to look at it. MPT was nice
[21:33] <brousch> Next GRPUG meeting is packaging and distribution
[21:34] <rick_h_> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/cookiecutter/0.7.0
[21:34] <rick_h_> Works with Python 2.6, 2.7, 3.3, and PyPy.
[21:35] <jrwren> i learned this today: http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/PythonEggs#accessing-package-resources
[21:35] <jrwren> which is pretty cool
[21:36] <rick_h_> yea, in theory you can package up a pyramid/etc app and if you access resources like that you just pip install package and can run it
[21:36] <rick_h_> I use from pkg_resources to get the version number within the package now as well which is handy
[21:37] <rick_h_> fewer places to update to get script --version to work
[21:37] <rick_h_> https://github.com/juju/jenkins-github-lander/blob/develop/src/jenkinsgithublander/__init__.py
[21:39] <brousch> Come talk about it next month. I'll buy you a beer at the 3rd best beer bar in the world in Beer City USA (2 years running)
[21:39] <jrwren> haha, my use of open() and then load-module made it not zipsafe. hahah
[21:39] <jrwren> i'm veyr close here.
[21:39] <jrwren> 2 packages was the key
[21:40] <jrwren> someday I'll get good at this :)
[22:32] <jcastro> wait
[22:32] <jcastro> WHAT
[22:32] <jcastro> http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/29/5358620/lenovo-reportedly-buying-motorola-mobility-from-google
[22:35] <rick_h_> jcastro: yea, wtf
[22:35] <rick_h_> jcastro: /me is nervous with my motox now
[22:36] <jcastro> wasn't there an article on them cancelling nexus?
[22:36] <jcastro> I was like "oh that makes sense, they have Moto now."
[22:38] <rick_h_> yea, I saw something about that as they've not updated the N10 in a while
[22:38] <jcastro> The Moto G in particular is a game changer
[22:39] <rick_h_> but that article was pointing at those devices in the store that are Play Edition
[22:39] <jcastro> I would think they didn't update the 10 because a) 7 is where it's at
[22:39] <rick_h_> so they're getting out of the devices and encouraging them to put out a Play Edition to be auto updated/etc
[22:39]  * rick_h_ <3 my N10
[22:39] <jcastro> and b) The 10 was always performant, unlike the old 7, that _had_ to be updated
[22:39] <rick_h_> much nicer for things
[22:39] <rick_h_> yea, true. I don't feel like it's 'old' yet
[22:39] <rick_h_> they did a good job putting good orig hardware in it
[22:40] <jcastro> so let's see
[22:40] <jcastro> Android's turned into a near monopoly
[22:40] <jcastro> HTC is basically doomed
[22:40] <jcastro> Moto will take _another 2 years_ to figure out whatever they're doing
[22:40] <rick_h_> yea, :/
[22:40] <rick_h_> samsung is owning stuff
[22:40] <jcastro> Yeah, and LG is a small player
[22:41] <rick_h_> yea, true
[22:41] <rick_h_> Google initially bought Motorola Mobility for $12.5 billion back in 2012
[22:41] <rick_h_> :/ is that a 9B write off then?
[22:41] <jcastro> yeah but they sold off cable box division for like 2B
[22:41] <rick_h_> poor motorola, they were a game changer
[22:41] <jcastro> and moto had like 3B onhand cash
[22:41] <rick_h_> and sad to see them go down like that
[22:42] <jcastro> but still, the leftover cash ... all for patents
[22:42] <jcastro> stupid
[22:42] <rick_h_> yea? I guess. Still crazy to see "bought 12B" and sold for 3, even 8B
[22:42] <jcastro> imagine if that money would have been spent on R&D instead of patent potfolios
[22:42] <rick_h_> yea, the new phones are nice
[22:43] <rick_h_> they were just starting to get out and running and then sell it
[22:43] <jcastro> I don't have high hopes
[22:43] <jcastro> especially after the new X1 Carbon
[22:43] <rick_h_> yea, me either
[22:43] <jcastro> DEATH SPIRAL
[22:43] <rick_h_> that was a blow
[22:44] <rick_h_> though I have to say I keep looking at that yoga2
[22:44] <jcastro> Though what do I know ... maybe a $179 phone is why they kept losing money, heh