| Unit193 | ochosi: So only thing we're waiting for is knome to ack and someone to upload, right? Everyone is fine with their email/name/etc? | 02:45 |
|---|---|---|
| knome | ack from my side. | 02:46 |
| Unit193 | You don't even know if I filled it with rats or something. | 02:54 |
| knome | we'll find out... | 02:55 |
| Unit193 | Did anyone save the rejected ones? | 02:59 |
| knome | no, they were infinitely deleted from the planet earth | 03:00 |
| Unit193 | Bummer. | 03:00 |
| knome | they are still in /Accepted | 03:01 |
| knome | and in a secret tarball somewhere | 03:01 |
| knome | and my, ochosi's and probably pleia2's harddrives | 03:01 |
| bluesabre | mine too | 03:14 |
| * bluesabre is sneaky | 03:14 | |
| ochosi | Unit193: i've sent them all an email together, let's give them until after the weekend to respond. just in case someone doesnt want their email or realname there... | 06:07 |
| ochosi | Unit193: so far i only collected the infos, only one of them has ack'ed it expressis verbis | 06:14 |
| Unit193 | Sure, it'd take a while to get it up anywho. | 06:15 |
| Noskcaj | menulibre is now updated, mugshot is upload ready | 06:16 |
| Noskcaj | and i'll do parole later tonight | 06:16 |
| ochosi | i presume 0.6? | 06:17 |
| Noskcaj | yeah | 06:19 |
| ochosi | cool | 06:24 |
| Noskcaj | mugshot's uploaded, but in NEW | 06:39 |
| elfy | lderan: thanks - seen the pastebin | 07:36 |
| zequence | I'd like to add a couple of apps to be autostarted when the user logs in, by default. How does one add that for users, by default? | 08:54 |
| zequence | Ah, /etc/xdg/autostart/*.desktop | 09:01 |
| slickymaster | morning all | 09:31 |
| slickymaster | work meeting | 10:29 |
| slickymaster | bbl after lunch -> | 10:29 |
| Unit193 | zequence: You may want to make sure it doesn't conflict with another package or settings package. You can use /etc/xdg/ubuntustudio/autostart/ if the path already exists in another package. | 11:26 |
| zequence | Unit193: It's for the next version of the application ubuntustudio-controls, and the idea is that it should autostart on any DE | 11:31 |
| zequence | There's a way to make it only start on certain DEs though, specified in the desktop file | 11:32 |
| zequence | even if put in /etc/xdg/autostart | 11:32 |
| Unit193 | Yep, and to exclude a few. | 11:33 |
| Unit193 | OnlyShowIn, NotShownIn. | 11:33 |
| brainwash | bug 880533 | 14:08 |
| ubottu | bug 880533 in thunar (Ubuntu) "Thunar reports Trash Empty when it is not" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/880533 | 14:08 |
| brainwash | not yet fixed, delete a file and relog to reproduce it | 14:09 |
| knome | brainwash, where's your patch for the bug? | 14:22 |
| brainwash | knome: work in progress I guess | 14:56 |
| brainwash | does anyone here use whisker menu? | 15:25 |
| brainwash | if it's the left most item in the panel and you try to drag a panel window button, does the whisker menu panel item turn black? | 15:27 |
| brainwash | nevermind, it's a known issue | 15:30 |
| * pmjdebruijn uses 1.3.1 backported to saucy | 15:31 | |
| brainwash | https://github.com/gottcode/xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin/issues/37 | 15:34 |
| brainwash | BUT it might affect more/all external panel plugins | 15:34 |
| brainwash | occasionally it happens to the places plugin too | 15:35 |
| pmjdebruijn | sounds like a panel bug? | 15:35 |
| brainwash | could be, marking whisker menu as internal plugin apparently resolves the glitch | 15:36 |
| pmjdebruijn | btw in the next intel video driver there are going to be some nice fixes, which are relevant for xfwm | 15:36 |
| pmjdebruijn | brainwash: huh? | 15:36 |
| brainwash | "Something else that also solved the bug for me was making the plugin internal instead of external." | 15:37 |
| brainwash | you mean SNA related fixes? | 15:38 |
| pmjdebruijn | define internal vs external? | 15:38 |
| pmjdebruijn | brainwash: indeed | 15:38 |
| pmjdebruijn | I helped troubleshoot like 5+ bugs in grand total | 15:38 |
| pmjdebruijn | 2 were xfwm artifacts with sna | 15:38 |
| pmjdebruijn | and 3 were TearFree related (which defaults to off) | 15:38 |
| brainwash | ppor dev, he is working on SNA on a daily base, but it still causes so many glitches | 15:39 |
| brainwash | tearfree related? did not notice anything odd | 15:39 |
| pmjdebruijn | do you have tearfree enabled i nthe intel driver? | 15:40 |
| pmjdebruijn | (not xfwm) | 15:40 |
| brainwash | currently not, but I did enable it occasionally | 15:40 |
| pmjdebruijn | will latest git master it should finally be reliable | 15:40 |
| pmjdebruijn | I hit a lot of issues using chromium | 15:40 |
| brainwash | but didn't notice anything strange | 15:40 |
| pmjdebruijn | chromium :) | 15:41 |
| brainwash | other than the expected performance loss | 15:41 |
| brainwash | oh ok | 15:41 |
| pmjdebruijn | there were lots of cornercases :) | 15:41 |
| brainwash | firefox here | 15:41 |
| pmjdebruijn | yeah didn't have any issues there either | 15:41 |
| pmjdebruijn | and I had some weird issue with scummvm :) | 15:41 |
| pmjdebruijn | like I said, I helped troubleshoot 5 (or 6?) issues by now :) | 15:41 |
| pmjdebruijn | ickle did the hard work of actually fixing stuff | 15:41 |
| brainwash | awesome :) | 15:42 |
| pmjdebruijn | just trying to get the intel driver in as best shape as possible for the next LTS | 15:42 |
| brainwash | hopefully we get all the fixes to land in trusty | 15:43 |
| brainwash | and regarding internal/external -> https://github.com/gottcode/xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin/issues/37#issuecomment-29758966 | 15:44 |
| brainwash | I assume that the internal plugins are all those which ship with xfce4-panel | 15:45 |
| brainwash | app menu, window buttons,.. | 15:45 |
| brainwash | I'll file a report against xfce4-panel after some more testing | 15:46 |
| * slickymaster damns his work internet connection | 15:51 | |
| knome | slickymaster, yes (re: docs meeting) | 15:55 |
| knome | any reason not o? | 15:55 |
| knome | to | 15:55 |
| slickymaster | knome: ok, just lost connectivity and didn't notice | 15:55 |
| slickymaster | if you've answer | 15:55 |
| slickymaster | it's ok with me | 15:55 |
| knome | ;) | 15:55 |
| brainwash | pmjdebruijn: https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10656 | 16:42 |
| ubottu | bugzilla.xfce.org bug 10656 in General "Dragging a panel window button turns external panel plugin black" [Normal,New] | 16:42 |
| slickymaster | knome: I have to go and pick up my kid at school. will be back in about 45 minutes | 17:33 |
| slickymaster | -> | 17:33 |
| ochosi | nice, fixed power-indicator already landed in trusty (with support for xfce4-powerman) | 18:01 |
| jjfrv8-work | if I disappear unexpectedly, it's because I've got like a triple remote connection going on here | 18:59 |
| pleia2 | hah, sounds fun | 18:59 |
| jjfrv8-work | if it stays up :) | 18:59 |
| knome | #startmeeting Xubuntu community meeting | 18:59 |
| meetingology | Meeting started Thu Jan 30 18:59:47 2014 UTC. The chair is knome. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. | 18:59 |
| meetingology | Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired | 18:59 |
| knome | so who's here for the meeting | 18:59 |
| jjfrv8-work | o/ | 18:59 |
| slickymaster | o/ | 19:00 |
| pleia2 | o/ | 19:00 |
| elfy | yep | 19:01 |
| knome | ok, cool | 19:01 |
| knome | let me get my act together :d | 19:01 |
| knome | !team | meeting time | 19:01 |
| ubottu | meeting time: bluesabre, elfy, GridCube, jjfrv8, knome, lderan, micahg, mr_pouit, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, skellat, slickymaster, Unit193 | 19:01 |
| knome | #topic Open action items from previous meeting | 19:02 |
| knome | #action ali1234 follows up on gtk3 indicator status | 19:02 |
| meetingology | ACTION: ali1234 follows up on gtk3 indicator status | 19:02 |
| knome | #action elfy to poke Noskcaj if time-admin and users-admin do not exist in the next daily | 19:02 |
| meetingology | ACTION: elfy to poke Noskcaj if time-admin and users-admin do not exist in the next daily | 19:02 |
| knome | did that happen? | 19:02 |
| ali1234 | again already? | 19:02 |
| ali1234 | where does the time go? | 19:02 |
| knome | ali1234, shoo :P | 19:02 |
| elfy | poked and nothing happened | 19:02 |
| knome | keeping it carried on to make sure things happen | 19:02 |
| Noskcaj | o/ | 19:03 |
| knome | #action knome to be in touch with people re Tech Lead position | 19:03 |
| meetingology | ACTION: knome to be in touch with people re Tech Lead position | 19:03 |
| knome | still TBD | 19:03 |
| knome | #action knome to send an email to the mailing list re: bluetooth | 19:03 |
| meetingology | ACTION: knome to send an email to the mailing list re: bluetooth | 19:03 |
| knome | TBD | 19:04 |
| knome | #action ochosi to follow up on xfce 4.12 release with nick and report back | 19:04 |
| meetingology | ACTION: ochosi to follow up on xfce 4.12 release with nick and report back | 19:04 |
| knome | #action ~QA to write tests for new packages, sync to tracker and call for testing | 19:04 |
| meetingology | ACTION: ~QA to write tests for new packages, sync to tracker and call for testing | 19:04 |
| knome | elfy, want to carry that on? | 19:04 |
| elfy | well it's ongoing | 19:04 |
| knome | i ask you a simple yes/no question and you start with "well..." ;) | 19:05 |
| elfy | well ... | 19:05 |
| elfy | yes | 19:05 |
| knome | do you need a weekly reminder? | 19:05 |
| elfy | no | 19:05 |
| knome | ok | 19:05 |
| knome | haha, so dropping it then :P | 19:05 |
| knome | #undo | 19:05 |
| meetingology | Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x1769290> | 19:05 |
| elfy | ok :p | 19:05 |
| knome | #action team members that are able to test/use bluetooth stuff, consider which software they would like to use, if it matters | 19:05 |
| meetingology | ACTION: team members that are able to test/use bluetooth stuff, consider which software they would like to use, if it matters | 19:05 |
| knome | #nick team | 19:05 |
| knome | that's it. | 19:05 |
| knome | #topic Team updates | 19:05 |
| knome | please use #info and #action (for new action items) as appropriate | 19:06 |
| knome | lderan, autopilot | 19:06 |
| knome | Unit193, -core email | 19:06 |
| knome | #info knome updated the meetings page with the new structure | 19:06 |
| slickymaster | #info slickymaster finished Mugshot's online documentation -> http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=mugshot-docs | 19:06 |
| elfy | #info Image testing for the last 7 days -> 64 bit image tests 3, no 32 bit tests reported | 19:07 |
| elfy | #info Upgrade testing since call earlier in the week - 64 bit 13.10 to 14.04 5 reported for update manager upgrading, no tests from image | 19:07 |
| elfy | #info Upgrade testing since call earlier in the week - 64 bit lts to lts 5 reported for update manager upgrading, 3 reported for image update | 19:07 |
| elfy | #info Upgrade testing since call earlier in the week - 32 bit 13.10 to 14.04 2 reported for update manager upgrading, no tests from image | 19:07 |
| elfy | #info Upgrade testing since call earlier in the week - 32 bit lts to lts 2 reported for update manager upgrading, none reported for image update | 19:07 |
| elfy | #info Settings Manager test call out soon - includes light-locker | 19:07 |
| knome | #info knome looked into the docs SRU and the new, fixed package (thanks bluesabre) should land in precise any day. | 19:07 |
| elfy | #info Manual testcase continues prior to calls | 19:07 |
| knome | ali1234, news about gtk3 indicators? | 19:07 |
| knome | #info knome, ochosi and pleia2 held a meeting and selected the winners for the community wallpapers | 19:08 |
| ali1234 | some changes were pushed to the indicators but still no fix to the core library problems afaik | 19:08 |
| knome | #info knome did housecleaning on the blueprints | 19:08 |
| knome | ali1234, ok, cheers | 19:08 |
| Noskcaj | #info mugshot in debian NEW | 19:08 |
| Noskcaj | #info menulibre updated | 19:08 |
| Noskcaj | #info parole 0.6 in ubuntu repos | 19:09 |
| knome | Noskcaj, i'd appreciate "#info Noskcaj did ..." (easier for the team reports) | 19:09 |
| Noskcaj | ok. | 19:09 |
| ali1234 | it's looking a lot like we'll have to wait until feature freeze and then demand it's either fixed or rolled back | 19:09 |
| slickymaster | #info slickymaster started to work on migrating Mugshot documentation into docbook format | 19:09 |
| Noskcaj | #info Noskcaj updated gthumb to 3.3 | 19:09 |
| knome | ali1234, but new "features" are in already, just broken? | 19:09 |
| micahg-work | ali1234, does the current gtk3 indicator stack need to be uploaded to the archive still or is that waiting on fixes? | 19:10 |
| ali1234 | micahg-work: there is nothing new on our side. the problems all exist in the unity stack | 19:10 |
| Unit193 | knome: Yes? | 19:10 |
| ali1234 | knome: the new features are in some packages and not others | 19:10 |
| knome | Unit193, please #info that you actually did something! | 19:10 |
| ali1234 | that mismatch is half the problem | 19:10 |
| knome | ali1234, okay. then we should get the new features in before FF if at all possible (there's still time) | 19:11 |
| knome | ali1234, but other than that, FF shouldn't be the hard deadline for the fixes, and i'm optimistic of landing those fixes | 19:11 |
| ali1234 | i don't know the status of stuff like xfce4-panel actually | 19:11 |
| micahg-work | I uploaded 2 SRUs, but I don't remember which ones | 19:11 |
| ali1234 | we can't land any fixes in libindicator3 for example, that is what is currently broken | 19:12 |
| ali1234 | and it is broken in unity too, still | 19:12 |
| Unit193 | #info Unit193 sent a message to the list about the xubuntu-core meta. | 19:12 |
| micahg-work | ali1234, is there a summary of the issues somewhere (or list of bugs) | 19:12 |
| knome | #info lderan made a list of apps that can be ran simple "does it open" tests with autopilot: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6840722/ | 19:12 |
| ali1234 | micahg-work: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-network/+bug/1185565 and https://code.launchpad.net/~a-j-buxton/libindicator/remove-timeout/+merge/198070 | 19:13 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1185565 in libindicator "Indicators should have Upstart jobs" [Medium,Confirmed] | 19:13 |
| knome | ali1234, micahg-work: if you don't mind, i'll add an action item for you to follow up on it and actually fix the stupid issues | 19:13 |
| knome | #action ali1234 and micahg to follow up on gtk3 indicator stack issues | 19:13 |
| meetingology | ACTION: ali1234 and micahg to follow up on gtk3 indicator stack issues | 19:13 |
| knome | #nick micahg | 19:13 |
| ali1234 | i already sent a MR, there's nothing more i can do until tedg gets around to fixing it | 19:13 |
| micahg-work | ali1234, poke tedg and ask if he has time to review or can hand off to someone else | 19:14 |
| ali1234 | i'm poking him once a week already | 19:14 |
| knome | micahg-work, any possibility you could oversee how that goes? would be good to have more people on top of the issue | 19:14 |
| ali1234 | i've spoken to him several times about this already and it's always "yeah, i'm working on it" | 19:15 |
| ali1234 | he knows and understands the problems we face | 19:15 |
| micahg-work | well, that's great, but I don't see why an MR should go 8 weeks without a review | 19:16 |
| * micahg-work <-- pot | 19:16 | |
| ali1234 | because it's part of a much bigger change, basically | 19:16 |
| micahg-work | yes, but there are ways to move these things forward, maybe it should be merged into a branch instead | 19:17 |
| ali1234 | there are a bunch of other issues around this too, like under xubuntu it wont actually use upstart to launch indicators, because it's hardcoded to only do that in unity | 19:17 |
| knome | looking at the bug, not everybody agrees with what is going on | 19:17 |
| ali1234 | knome: right | 19:17 |
| ali1234 | that's a problem too | 19:17 |
| knome | i guess we're fine to do weekly reminders for a few more weeks | 19:18 |
| knome | if things do not progress, look at it again then | 19:18 |
| jjfrv8-work | sorry about that. I'm back. | 19:18 |
| knome | i guess another thing you could try, ali1234, is add more reviewers for the MP. | 19:18 |
| knome | jjfrv8-work, np :) | 19:18 |
| micahg-work | rewriting the indicator stack for the LTS seems so wrong... | 19:19 |
| ali1234 | right, this is why i mentioned FF and either fix NOW or rollback | 19:19 |
| micahg-work | yeah | 19:19 |
| knome | as long as gtk3 indicators work for us, i don't mind how this falls | 19:20 |
| ali1234 | we can always add the workaround to the environment | 19:20 |
| knome | ali1234, micahg-work: please obey the action item and follow up on it as much as needed :) | 19:20 |
| knome | and i'm of course also available, if you need something i can do to help. | 19:20 |
| brainwash | maybe we could already switch to gtk3 indicators and use the workaround (exporting an env var) | 19:21 |
| micahg-work | wait, we're still on GTK2 indicators? | 19:22 |
| knome | since FF is still somewhat far, i don't think it makes sense to push a workaround and then start using the new "real" fix | 19:22 |
| ali1234 | agreed | 19:22 |
| ali1234 | but it's always there if we need it | 19:22 |
| brainwash | the workaround can be reverted easily | 19:22 |
| knome | rather wait until the FF, and if the situation *then* looks stupid, do the workaround | 19:22 |
| brainwash | ok | 19:22 |
| knome | brainwash, it's still more work to get the workaround up than not. | 19:22 |
| ali1234 | micahg-work: i'm not sure what is actually in the archive, because i work mainly upstream | 19:22 |
| micahg-work | ok | 19:23 |
| knome | we have to believe things are going to be fixed eventually | 19:23 |
| Noskcaj | micahg-work, i've got the stuff in a PPA, but i'd rather wait for a real release to upload stuff | 19:23 |
| brainwash | yes, Noskcaj's PPA + workaround works fine | 19:23 |
| Noskcaj | archive is all possible 4.11 stuff + garcon git snapshot | 19:23 |
| micahg-work | while I generally prefer that, we need baketime for the LTS, now if it'll just be broken in the archive, there's no point in uploading | 19:24 |
| ali1234 | it's not as badly broken as gtk2 indicators... | 19:24 |
| knome | well exactly, my opinion is: hold until nearer to FF | 19:24 |
| knome | and see if things are fixed and then decide what to do, once, rather than uploading any workarounds now and having to poke around it later | 19:25 |
| Noskcaj | Is that for both panel and indicator? | 19:26 |
| brainwash | there is no panel 4.11 release yet | 19:27 |
| knome | looks like we're done with this. people involved, please keep in touch with each other. | 19:28 |
| knome | #topic Announcements | 19:28 |
| knome | i have one! | 19:28 |
| knome | at the end of the T cycle, jjfrv8-work will step from the doc lead position. | 19:28 |
| knome | while the T cycle lasts, he will keep on leading, with the assistance of slickymaster | 19:29 |
| knome | and if everything goes well, jjfrv8-work should be able to hand over the leader hat to slickymaster at the start of the U cycle | 19:30 |
| knome | of course, with the approval of the team | 19:30 |
| * Unit193 approves. | 19:30 | |
| * elfy approves | 19:30 | |
| * pleia2 approves | 19:30 | |
| knome | we are going to have a meeting on docs issues sometime soon, where those two can update each other on the situation etc. | 19:31 |
| * Noskcaj approves the approvals | 19:31 | |
| micahg-work | sure | 19:31 |
| knome | (well the approval should happen later, when U cycle is starting :P) | 19:31 |
| knome | so, anybody interested in docs... hear hear! | 19:31 |
| knome | jjfrv8-work, slickymaster: you around to schedule? | 19:31 |
| slickymaster | yeaps | 19:31 |
| jjfrv8-work | yes | 19:31 |
| knome | whatever time works for you two is the best | 19:32 |
| knome | next week before/after the community meeting? | 19:32 |
| jjfrv8-work | next week I should be pretty flexible | 19:33 |
| slickymaster | next week is my ubuntu membership meeting | 19:33 |
| slickymaster | it depends on how much it will eventually take | 19:33 |
| knome | friday though, isn't that it | 19:33 |
| slickymaster | on the UM meeting ins on the 6th | 19:34 |
| slickymaster | is^^ | 19:34 |
| knome | aha | 19:34 |
| knome | then i've mismarked that on my calendar ;) | 19:34 |
| knome | what about wednesday 19utc then? | 19:34 |
| jjfrv8-work | ok with me | 19:35 |
| slickymaster | fine with me, also | 19:35 |
| knome | ok, that's it | 19:35 |
| knome | #info Documentation checkup meeting on Wednesday, Feb 5 at 19UTC | 19:35 |
| knome | aaand thanks for both jjfrv8-work and slickymaster for all the work they have done this far and will do in the future! | 19:36 |
| knome | any other announcements? | 19:36 |
| * pleia2 adds to calendar | 19:36 | |
| knome | pleia2, ta | 19:36 |
| knome | pleia2, you can add thu 19utc as the community meeting while you're at it | 19:36 |
| knome | ok, moving on | 19:37 |
| knome | #topic Agenda | 19:37 |
| knome | #subtopic Enabling more people to push to Xubuntu branches (separate branches team, or would -team do?) | 19:37 |
| knome | micahg-work, ping | 19:37 |
| micahg-work | yes? | 19:37 |
| knome | see the subtopic | 19:37 |
| knome | basically, we'd like to allow more people to be able to push to xubuntu branches | 19:37 |
| micahg-work | depends on the branches | 19:37 |
| knome | -default-settings | 19:38 |
| knome | mostly, i think | 19:38 |
| micahg-work | we can separate the branches from the uploaders team | 19:38 |
| knome | mhm | 19:38 |
| knome | do you think it would be ok to add them under ~xubuntu-team, or would you prefer a new team? | 19:39 |
| Noskcaj | I'd suggest we allow -team to modify branches | 19:39 |
| micahg-work | but I'd prefer to limit the people who can push to people who understand the package and have proven through MRs that they know what they're doing | 19:39 |
| Unit193 | Would be best to use merges and have a couple review and approve. | 19:39 |
| micahg-work | yes | 19:39 |
| knome | ok, so something like ~xubuntu-branches | 19:39 |
| * Unit193 likes to have at least bluesabre take a look. | 19:39 | |
| micahg-work | so, I'd basically move the xubuntu-dev team out of the DMB control and we would create a new team for uploaders when someone needs that | 19:40 |
| micahg-work | xubuntu-dev is fine | 19:40 |
| knome | ok, | 19:40 |
| knome | when you say "when someone needs that", what are you exactly referring to? | 19:40 |
| knome | when somebody gains packageset uploader access? | 19:40 |
| micahg-work | yes | 19:40 |
| Noskcaj | That takes for ever | 19:41 |
| knome | right, i would hope that happens sometime soon | 19:41 |
| knome | and rather create a new team for -branches | 19:41 |
| Noskcaj | micahg-work, Is there anything you can do to speed up my application? | 19:41 |
| Noskcaj | It will be a month tomorrow | 19:41 |
| Noskcaj | probably a new record | 19:41 |
| knome | but i guess i'm fine with doing what you proposed, then create ~xubuntu-dev-upload if/when we need it | 19:41 |
| micahg-work | Noskcaj, it's being discussed | 19:41 |
| Noskcaj | ok | 19:42 |
| micahg-work | knome, the uploader team would be managed by the DMB, so, nothing to worry about there | 19:42 |
| knome | micahg-work, sure | 19:42 |
| knome | micahg-work, can i get back to you on this in a week or so, to land the change | 19:43 |
| micahg-work | land what change? | 19:43 |
| knome | the LP teams changes, and separating -dev from upload stuff | 19:43 |
| knome | or would you rather just do it right away, or does it need some ack from the DMB? | 19:43 |
| micahg-work | oh, I just need to discuss quickly with the DMB | 19:43 |
| knome | ok, sure | 19:43 |
| knome | #action micahg to talk with the DMB and separate -dev from upload rights so we can allow more people to push to xubuntu branches | 19:44 |
| meetingology | ACTION: micahg to talk with the DMB and separate -dev from upload rights so we can allow more people to push to xubuntu branches | 19:44 |
| knome | #info if we need packageset uploader rights for certain people later, we shall create a new team for that purpose | 19:44 |
| micahg-work | nope | 19:45 |
| micahg-work | DMB would create that | 19:45 |
| knome | #undo | 19:45 |
| meetingology | Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x1632310> | 19:45 |
| knome | #info if we need packageset uploader rights for certain people later, we shall ask DMB to create a new team for that purpose | 19:45 |
| knome | nitpicking says me! | 19:46 |
| knome | #subtopic Status of Bluetooth in Xubuntu; what kind of testing we want to run, which software we want to use? | 19:46 |
| knome | micahg-work, do you have any opinion to that discussion? | 19:46 |
| micahg-work | ah, so, I think blueman upstream has be revived | 19:46 |
| Noskcaj | fyi: i updated blueman last week | 19:47 |
| knome | do we have a preference? do they all work with indicators, or do we need to consider that kind of issues? | 19:47 |
| micahg-work | is there something better out there, IIRC, blueman was the only one that worked well that didn't pull in half the GNOME stack | 19:48 |
| knome | then that sounds like a good one to use | 19:49 |
| knome | if there's no problems with using that... | 19:49 |
| micahg-work | if there's another alternative, I'm all ears, but with the recent resurgence of development on blueman, I think it's a good horse to be hitched to | 19:49 |
| Noskcaj | I think blueman has a memory leak though | 19:49 |
| cyphermox | there are no big alternatives really | 19:50 |
| cyphermox | memleaks are fixable ;) | 19:50 |
| * micahg-work waves to cyphermox | 19:50 | |
| * cyphermox waves back | 19:50 | |
| Noskcaj | http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=700863 | 19:51 |
| ubottu | Debian bug 700863 in blueman "blueman-applet eats up memory" [Important,Open] | 19:51 |
| Noskcaj | There's two other memory leaks i know of in xubuntu, so if someone could help me with them after the meeting | 19:51 |
| micahg-work | 1 year with no response from reporter , that bug isn't likely to be addressed | 19:52 |
| Noskcaj | no | 19:52 |
| knome | can anybody from the team even confirm that bug? | 19:52 |
| Noskcaj | It's just blueman uses 40mb of ram here and i've never used bluetooth | 19:53 |
| micahg-work | that doesn't sound like a memory leak as much as not loading on demand | 19:53 |
| cyphermox | Noskcaj: guess it would be worth running it through massif | 19:53 |
| micahg-work | if you said 400MB, that would sound like a memory leak | 19:54 |
| Noskcaj | I'll leave it on during the day to see if i can reproduce it | 19:54 |
| cyphermox | micahg-work: it really ought to be running all the time, to be able to get you anything | 19:54 |
| cyphermox | unless you don't have a bluetooth device of course | 19:54 |
| micahg-work | cyphermox, right, I have that on one machine, bluetooth is off and it's running | 19:54 |
| cyphermox | ah | 19:54 |
| knome | so i guess the gist is that we should use blueman. | 19:56 |
| knome | great, go file bugs! | 19:56 |
| knome | (: | 19:56 |
| knome | #subtopic Discuss documentation translations | 19:57 |
| knome | we should mostly do this on the docs meeting, but... | 19:57 |
| elfy | ummm - so what about testing blueman - forget it ? | 19:57 |
| knome | right... test it! :) | 19:57 |
| micahg-work | hrm? | 19:57 |
| knome | micahg-work, hrm to what? | 19:58 |
| micahg-work | can launchpad not translate the docs? | 19:58 |
| micahg-work | hrm to test.. | 19:58 |
| knome | it can | 19:58 |
| knome | we're doing that. | 19:58 |
| knome | we have the .po files in the branch | 19:58 |
| elfy | #action Someone with bluetooth to write a testcase | 19:58 |
| meetingology | ACTION: Someone with bluetooth to write a testcase | 19:58 |
| knome | but we need to tweak the packaging to build the translations and display them in a sane way | 19:59 |
| knome | Unit193 has been helping with that | 19:59 |
| slickymaster | there are already finish and portuguese versions of the docs | 19:59 |
| slickymaster | finnish ^^ | 19:59 |
| knome | we also might need/want to set some kind of cut-off percentages, if that's not happening now | 19:59 |
| knome | micahg-work, if you happen to know about that side as well, poke Unit193 and me.. | 19:59 |
| micahg-work | not too much, I could help on the packaging side | 20:00 |
| Unit193 | knome: It was for me, I have that set up but not sure if any sane person would like it. :P | 20:00 |
| elfy | I've gtg - thanks - cya | 20:00 |
| knome | micahg-work, that's probably helpful as well | 20:00 |
| knome | but ok, let's follow up on that | 20:00 |
| knome | #topic Schedule next meeting | 20:00 |
| knome | #info Next meeting Thursday, Feb 6, 19UTC | 20:01 |
| knome | #endmeeting | 20:01 |
| meetingology | Meeting ended Thu Jan 30 20:01:21 2014 UTC. | 20:01 |
| meetingology | Minutes (wiki): http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-01-30-18.59.moin.txt | 20:01 |
| meetingology | Minutes (html): http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-01-30-18.59.html | 20:01 |
| pleia2 | on the calendar :) | 20:01 |
| knome | Noskcaj, so what about time- and users-admin? | 20:01 |
| Unit193 | Hah, beat me. | 20:01 |
| Noskcaj | knome, I have no idea | 20:01 |
| Noskcaj | elfy has issues with it, i just did ask pitti asked, since i don't know the package very well | 20:02 |
| knome | Noskcaj, you can't leave a mess behind. | 20:02 |
| Noskcaj | i know. I think i asked elfy to ask pitti about it | 20:02 |
| knome | Noskcaj, why can't you ask pitti as you were the one who made the changes? | 20:03 |
| knome | i can't see why elfy would need to pick it up | 20:03 |
| Noskcaj | good point. My reasoning was i don't understand the issue | 20:03 |
| Unit193 | micahg-work: I changed the packaging locally to be 'dh7' or dh sequencing, and a couple others. | 20:03 |
| Unit193 | Noskcaj: Issue is, nothing is installed except 'pixmaps', try installing the package. | 20:04 |
| Unit193 | Look at the .install file | 20:04 |
| Noskcaj | That's how debian has it, strangely | 20:04 |
| knome | maybe the debian package is broken | 20:04 |
| Unit193 | knome: No, it's not split up. | 20:04 |
| knome | okay, then maybe the ubuntu port is broken | 20:05 |
| knome | which leads us to... Noskcaj, please fix it. Unit193 just told you what's wrong | 20:05 |
| Noskcaj | ok | 20:05 |
| knome | thanks | 20:05 |
| Noskcaj | on a different topic, do we want xkb-plugin 0.7 ? | 20:06 |
| Unit193 | https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-system-tools built packages vs http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gnome-system-tools.html binaries. | 20:06 |
| knome | would also think cleaning your mess would help you gaining access rights | 20:06 |
| knome | re: xkb-plugin; i don't know; is there a very specific reason to have it? | 20:06 |
| Unit193 | xkb-plugin? Is that seeded? | 20:06 |
| Unit193 | So it is. | 20:07 |
| knome | i'm off. | 20:08 |
| Unit193 | knome: You know what's proper in a Makefile? :P | 20:08 |
| knome | see you later :) | 20:08 |
| Unit193 | Bah. | 20:08 |
| Unit193 | Chau. | 20:08 |
| knome | Unit193, no | 20:08 |
| Noskcaj | debian dropped back off 0.7, it might be worth seeing if we want it. http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/main/x/xfce4-xkb-plugin/unstable_changelog | 20:08 |
| knome | you can tell me and i'll read it when i get back ;) | 20:08 |
| slickymaster | dinner time for. bbl -> | 20:09 |
| knome | Noskcaj, that doesn't tell much | 20:09 |
| knome | but yeah, i'm really off | 20:09 |
| knome | -> | 20:09 |
| Noskcaj | the new xkb plugin is for settings 4.11, and the current one might break settings | 20:20 |
| Noskcaj | It will also allow us to patch bug 733563 | 20:21 |
| ubottu | bug 733563 in xfce4-xkb-plugin (Ubuntu) "Can't change font for keyboard layout indicator" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/733563 | 20:21 |
| Unit193 | slickymaster: Russian is also pretty complete, but not fully. | 20:24 |
| Noskcaj | Unit193, you're right, all the files are missing from the binary. I'm guessing it's the extra packages we make | 20:39 |
| Noskcaj | https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/trusty/gnome-system-tools/regression-fix/+merge/204099 | 21:05 |
| ochosi | hmpf, wasn't able to make the meeting... | 21:27 |
| Unit193 | That's alright, we just assigned everything to you. | 21:30 |
| ochosi | cool | 21:33 |
| slickymaster | yeah Unit193, Russian is 84% done | 21:37 |
| slickymaster | and GridCube has been keeping himself busy, the Spanish translation is half way through it | 21:38 |
| ochosi | so gtk3-panel and indicators are on hold, eh? :/# | 21:38 |
| Unit193 | slickymaster: Not quite >80% yet though, so not autogenerated. | 22:07 |
| slickymaster | ok | 22:08 |
| knome | ochosi, until they work, or until we are so close to FF that we will (have to) land them with a workaround | 22:59 |
| knome | Noskcaj, fixing that bug is nowhere near our top priority | 23:01 |
| ochosi | actually the only indicator that doesn't work for me is appindicator at the moment | 23:01 |
| ochosi | sound and power work just fine | 23:01 |
| * Unit193 downloaded that one from saucy repos, works fine. :P | 23:01 | |
| ochosi | yeah, but only because there is no upstart job yet | 23:02 |
| ochosi | (which is why it's borked in the first place i guess) | 23:02 |
| knome | ochosi, the ubuntu folks do not agree on whether they should have upstart jobs or "actually fix" .. something | 23:03 |
| Unit193 | I like how they land something that's half transitioned, thus broken. :D | 23:03 |
| knome | yep | 23:03 |
| knome | but isn't that how it always goes? | 23:04 |
| ochosi | yeah, but at least the panel we will need if we want gtk3 indicators | 23:04 |
| knome | "ok boys, this cycle, no breaking stuff" | 23:04 |
| knome | "oops we landed that too early" | 23:04 |
| ochosi | that wouldn't be affected by changes to the indicator stack, it would mostly affect xfce4-indicator-plugin | 23:04 |
| knome | ochosi, well you read my reasoning why we want to hold | 23:04 |
| knome | ochosi, or why i want to hold | 23:04 |
| knome | ochosi, the branches stuff is moving forward. | 23:06 |
| ochosi | yeah, looking forward to that | 23:07 |
| ochosi | we should definitely try to prepare branches for the case that indicators get fixed with upstart jobs (or even: for the case that we use them) | 23:08 |
| ochosi | especially a default-settings branch and a seed-branch | 23:08 |
| Unit193 | Yes, but just swap out the indicator-*-gtk2 for indicator-foo. That's application and sound. | 23:11 |
| ochosi | well, and add in -power | 23:11 |
| ochosi | (and set powerman to always hide the trayicon) | 23:11 |
| Unit193 | Doesn't xfpm do whatever that does? | 23:11 |
| Unit193 | Just because we can't doesn't mean we should. Something about seeding "all" doesn't make sense either, since that'd be at least: indicator-application indicator-appmenu indicator-appmenu-tools indicator-bluetooth indicator-china-weather indicator-cpufreq indicator-datetime indicator-sync indicator-sound indicator-session indicator-printers indicator-power indicator-network indicator-multiload indicator-messages indicator-location ... | 23:12 |
| Unit193 | ... indicator-keyboard | 23:13 |
| ochosi | yeah, seeding sound, application, power and if needed bluetooth seems good enough | 23:20 |
| Unit193 | Bleh. :P | 23:21 |
| knome | printers? | 23:21 |
| ochosi | i think they use app-indicators atm | 23:21 |
| knome | bluesabre, just don't take too much on your plate :) | 23:27 |
| Unit193 | ^ +1 | 23:27 |
| knome | bluesabre, but i just wanted to let you know people are asking about that | 23:27 |
| Unit193 | I'm still interested as well, I wouldn't purge that. | 23:27 |
| knome | same. | 23:28 |
| brainwash | ochosi: and messages? | 23:28 |
| ochosi | yeah, guess also messages | 23:28 |
| brainwash | what about printers? | 23:29 |
| ochosi | but i don't have a strong opinion on messages as i've never used it | 23:29 |
| ochosi | afaik printers use indicator-application atm | 23:29 |
| Unit193 | Already have something for printers. | 23:29 |
| knome | my take on it is that some people like it, some people hate it | 23:29 |
| ochosi | like/hate what? | 23:30 |
| ochosi | messaging? | 23:30 |
| ochosi | err, -messages? | 23:30 |
| knome | yep | 23:30 |
| ochosi | well i don't have a strong opinion because i've never tried how well it works with out default messaging apps | 23:31 |
| knome | yep | 23:31 |
| ochosi | (thunderbird, pidgin..) | 23:31 |
| knome | well, | 23:31 |
| knome | it could be a make-or-break thing for *single* users, but not the distro | 23:31 |
| bluesabre | from my experience, it works great for pidgin and thunderbird | 23:35 |
| Unit193 | Quassel is iffy. | 23:35 |
| bluesabre | (finally caught up) | 23:35 |
| Unit193 | Click any notification bubbles and up pops quassel... | 23:36 |
| bluesabre | but... thats not the indicator | 23:36 |
| bluesabre | : | 23:36 |
| Unit193 | Right. | 23:37 |
| Unit193 | (Quassel works with the indicator though, sort of.) | 23:37 |
| bluesabre | anybody else think action buttons at the top of a window are stupid? http://worldofgnome.org/a-redesigned-file-picker-4-gnome-mockups/ | 23:38 |
| Unit193 | Very. | 23:39 |
| Unit193 | When the Windows Metro UI is starting to look sane.... | 23:40 |
| bluesabre | :) | 23:40 |
| bluesabre | btw, adding these packages could be a value-add: libappindicator1 libappindicator3-1 | 23:40 |
| knome | value added tax? | 23:41 |
| bluesabre | they're not pulled by the indicator stack, or indicator-application, yet they are required for skype and dropbox indicators (with no documentation) | 23:41 |
| bluesabre | and probably others as well | 23:42 |
| Unit193 | Package: nautilus-dropbox -> Recommends: libappindicator1 | 23:42 |
| bluesabre | it might be the 3-1 that is required then | 23:43 |
| bluesabre | there is an askubuntu about it somewhere | 23:43 |
| bluesabre | anyway, :_ | 23:43 |
| bluesabre | ) | 23:43 |
| Unit193 | indicator-application: Depends: libappindicator3-1 same with network-manager-gnome. | 23:43 |
| * bluesabre will do more research to figure out what the lib is later | 23:44 | |
| Unit193 | libappindicator3-1 is even pulled in onto xubuntu-core, which doesn't even have the indicators. :D | 23:45 |
| * bluesabre returns to programming | 23:45 | |
| Unit193 | bluesabre: Yes, and when you figure out why there is a libappindicator1, libappindicator3-1, libindicate5, libindicator3-7, and libindicator7 tell us?? :P | 23:45 |
| Unit193 | Sure, have fun! | 23:46 |
| bluesabre | because ubuntu! | 23:46 |
| ali1234 | the ones with -3 are the gtk versions | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | gtk3 versions | 23:47 |
| Unit193 | libappindicator3-1 and libindicator3-7 are hard deps from something because -core pulls those two (and those are the only *indicat* packages.) | 23:47 |
| Unit193 | Ah, hrm. | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | appindicator is how all apps make their own indicators | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | you either use appindicator, or you integrate with an existing indicator (sound, message...) | 23:48 |
| ochosi | yeah, which makes it suck even more that that one is currently not working in trusty :/ | 23:48 |
| ali1234 | appindicator = indicator-application | 23:48 |
| ochosi | yeah | 23:48 |
| ali1234 | libindicator5 = i have no idea what that is | 23:48 |
| Unit193 | libappindicator1 gtk2, libappindicator3-1 gtk3 and they are for the indicator-application, OK. | 23:49 |
| ochosi | frankly, i've been wondering since saucy whether we should just try to avoid indicators in our default panel layout | 23:49 |
| Unit193 | 5 is what threw me off, this all makes more sense now except for that. | 23:49 |
| knome | ochosi, sucks for laptop users | 23:49 |
| ochosi | there was once talk of an mpris2 plugin for the xfce-panel | 23:49 |
| ochosi | knome: why? | 23:49 |
| knome | battery indicator? | 23:50 |
| Unit193 | ali1234: Thanks. | 23:50 |
| knome | or is there still components for the notification area? | 23:50 |
| ochosi | knome: we never had an indicator for that | 23:50 |
| ochosi | that was always a trayicon | 23:50 |
| knome | what about sound? | 23:50 |
| Unit193 | !info volumeicon | 23:50 |
| ubottu | Package volumeicon does not exist in saucy | 23:50 |
| ochosi | that is an indicator, actually the only real one we have | 23:50 |
| Unit193 | !info volumeicon-alsa | 23:50 |
| ubottu | volumeicon-alsa (source: volumeicon): systray volume icon for alsa. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.4.6-2 (saucy), package size 37 kB, installed size 181 kB (Only available for linux-any) | 23:50 |
| brainwash | xfce4-mixer plugin | 23:50 |
| Unit193 | Boom. | 23:50 |
| knome | alsa, meh | 23:50 |
| ochosi | Unit193: we need something for pulse though | 23:50 |
| ali1234 | basically without indicators you are stuck using the horrible crappy and broken tray icons, or writing xfce panel plugins | 23:51 |
| knome | ochosi, ^ that might be your winning answer | 23:51 |
| Unit193 | ochosi: Well, that source package now supports pulse. | 23:51 |
| knome | i don't think migrating to indicators *itself* is too bad... | 23:51 |
| ali1234 | if you think indicators are bad, tray icons are 100x worse | 23:51 |
| bluesabre | yes | 23:51 |
| ochosi | yeah, i agree that trayicons suck | 23:51 |
| brainwash | why do they suck? | 23:51 |
| knome | aaand we have a winner ;) | 23:52 |
| knome | congrats ali1234 | 23:52 |
| ali1234 | no multimonitor support, not process separation... | 23:52 |
| bluesabre | thing is, everything will be significantly easier once there is an official gtk3 xfce4-panel | 23:52 |
| knome | bluesabre, now you're kidding ;) | 23:52 |
| bluesabre | no more hacky workarounds | 23:52 |
| bluesabre | when we get that | 23:52 |
| bluesabre | in 2017 | 23:52 |
| ochosi | well in fact the current git-panel handles it okay | 23:52 |
| knome | besides, didn't you go back to programming? | 23:52 |
| bluesabre | after gtk5 is out | 23:52 |
| knome | ochosi, isn't that what we're going to land in T? | 23:52 |
| ali1234 | there wont be a gtk5 | 23:52 |
| bluesabre | there's interesting discussion here | 23:52 |
| ali1234 | there will be nothing left to remove by gtk4 | 23:53 |
| knome | procrastinating, i see | 23:53 |
| bluesabre | haha | 23:53 |
| ochosi | anyhow, i think i'll try to do releases for our themes now, adding in support for gtk3 indicators, in case they ever land... | 23:53 |
| ochosi | ali1234: hehe, good point | 23:53 |
| knome | ochosi, they will, one way or another | 23:53 |
| bluesabre | ali1234: what about all the stuff they are adding in gtk3? they can get rid of that :) | 23:53 |
| knome | ochosi, they aren't on infinite hold, just "for now" | 23:53 |
| knome | ochosi, don't worry! | 23:53 |
| knome | i hate to see ochosi sad | 23:54 |
| ochosi | knome: yeah, trying hard to start loving the bomb... | 23:54 |
| === ochosi is now known as dr_strangelove | ||
| knome | i hate even more when ochosi is ironic, but kind of right | 23:55 |
| dr_strangelove | maybe that helps | 23:55 |
| dr_strangelove | meh, doesn't seem to help... | 23:55 |
| === dr_strangelove is now known as ochosi | ||
| ochosi | ali1234: quick question, as that's kinda relevant for our default panel setup, are you aiming at 14.04 with panel-switch? | 23:56 |
| ali1234 | no, not really | 23:56 |
| ochosi | okey | 23:56 |
| knome | ali1234, maybe you should ;) | 23:56 |
| knome | push, push, push! | 23:56 |
| ali1234 | i noticed that debian has a tool for this already | 23:56 |
| ali1234 | when you first log in it asks you what layout you want | 23:57 |
| knome | does it bring half of gnome? | 23:57 |
| ali1234 | you only get two choices though | 23:57 |
| ali1234 | i dunno, it's installed y default | 23:57 |
| ochosi | that sounds nice actually | 23:57 |
| ochosi | i mean only being asked once is kinda "hmmm" | 23:57 |
| ochosi | but still | 23:57 |
| knome | doesn't allow experimenting | 23:58 |
| knome | so it's really "meh" | 23:58 |
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