[02:31] <rww> handling it ^
[03:15] <rww> I just resurrected one of my old scripts.
[03:15] <rww> "Pici's munin site has graphs of the size of the +b list over time, which you may find interesting."
[03:15] <rww> no it doesn't :'(
[03:16] <rww> also, boring fact of the day, 93% of #ubuntu-offtopic's banlist doesn't have ban authors because lol netsplits
[03:20] <Pici> :(
[03:21] <rww> i miss that website Pici, you make me cry :9
[03:21] <Pici> sorry
[03:22] <Pici> I accidentally deleted it
[03:46] <phunyguy> don't delete my bans plz
[03:46] <phunyguy> I need em
[03:48] <Pici> rww: I'm writing a new irc thing now though
[03:53] <Flannel> Pici: yeah?  Going to start your own? or just a hostile take over of freenode?
[04:20] <rww> dealing with ^
[04:20] <Pici> ty
[04:24] <Pici> rww: I threw the guidelines at dupingping today, and perhaps the other day as well.
[04:24] <rww> ta. what were they doing then?
[04:24] <Pici> They were repeating a question over and over and not getting the point that they shouldn't do that.
[04:25] <Pici> the today one was just a few minutes ago for quoting what looked to be their resume
[04:25] <Pici> "I can do this, I can do that"
[04:25] <rww> mhm, just pulled up scrollback
[04:26] <rww> I note prepangolin is on the same IP address, and has been on a few other occasions
[04:26] <Pici> curious
[04:27] <h00k> maybe they are flatmates
[04:27] <rww> they claimed girlfriend in PM with somsip
[04:27] <rww> language barrier too, it seems
[05:31] <Unit193> rww: !raring s/supported/support/  ?
[05:57] <ianorlin> I found sometihng wrong with ubottu in that !canonical does not list Lubuntu or ubuntu-Gnome
[06:04] <Flannel> ianorlin: That's not a mistake.  Although since you brought it up, I'm unsure whether Xubuntu should be in that factoid anymore.
[06:07] <ianorlin> ok
[06:07] <Flannel> ianorlin: It's because Lubuntu and Ubuntu-Gnome aren't Canonical related.
[06:07] <ianorlin> ah
[06:07] <Unit193> Flannel: I do not think Xubuntu got funding, Kubuntu used to but doesn't any more from Canonical.
[06:08] <Unit193> Technically it's Canonical that does the hosting and buildds as well as repo.
[06:08] <Flannel> Unit193: I haven't kept up on what is/isn't sponsored/affiliated/whatever, because theres a number of dimensions.
[06:09] <Unit193> Actually, the Lubuntu.net website isn't Canonical, but Xubuntu is.
[06:09] <Unit193> Flannel: Yes, not really sure, it's complicated.
[06:10] <Flannel> So yes, I would think that Kubuntu might also be due to be removed from that list.
[06:11] <Unit193> I could concur, though it may be nice to say that they provide the infrastructure for the !flavors as well.
[06:12]  * ianorlin thinks provides infrastructure for falvors sounds good
[06:18] <rww> !raring
[06:18] <rww> !-raring
[06:19] <rww> !raring =~ s/  Supported/ Support/
[06:19] <rww> Unit193: thanks
[06:19] <Unit193> rww: Thank you.
[06:31] <bazhang> * FloodBot1 is now known as Guest41456
[06:31] <rww> yeah, the floodbots got a bit broken during the netsplam
[06:32] <rww> ... actually, nvm
[09:02] <bazhang> * FloodBot2 is now known as Guest50375
[09:02] <bazhang> bizarro
[09:38] <bazhang> autoremove does not take any arguments iirc
[09:38] <bazhang> perhaps he meant purge
[09:38] <Unit193> autoremove can be used with or without.
[09:40] <bazhang> and the fbots are mia
[09:44] <bazhang> day of wonders: 34 lines pasted and no fbot
[09:50] <knome> bazhang, you can do --purge autoremove
[09:55] <bazhang> what about autoremove packagename
[09:56] <knome> no
[09:56] <bazhang> ie mysql 5.5
[09:56] <knome> nope, you got to run remove then
[09:56] <bazhang> thats what I thought, thanks knome
[09:56] <knome> np
[09:57] <Unit193> knome: Then how have I done it?
[09:57] <knome> Unit193, hum?
[09:57] <knome> you're a weirdo?
[09:57] <Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/62429/
[09:58] <knome> -s?
[09:58] <knome> right
[09:58] <knome> is that again a new feature?
[10:00] <Unit193> Pretty sure not.
[10:00] <Myrtti> hiya AlanBell_
[10:01] <Unit193> (Hint, autoremove --purge for most effect.)  Sometimes autoremove after removing the package will remove stuff that calling the remove with autoremove will miss, oddly.
[10:03] <knome> Unit193, aha.
[10:03] <Unit193> Yeah, it's weird.
[12:57] <LjL> the floodbots aren't broken (not more so than usual anyway). i disabled them.
[13:42] <k1l> LjL: Y U hatin floodbots?
[13:44] <LjL> i'm not, but since it seems everyone else is, i thought they might as well go
[13:44] <ikonia> I love the floodbots I sing their praises
[13:45] <Tm_T> I didn't know there's hate
[13:45] <ikonia> only love
[13:45]  * Tm_T huggles ikonia and LjL
[13:46] <k1l> hmm, i thought  it was because they gone mad in the netsplits or something like that.
[13:46] <ikonia> they did go mental
[13:46] <ikonia> but to be honest, what's to be expected
[13:46] <ikonia> the whole network went bad.
[13:46] <k1l> well, i have gone mad too while the ddos netsplits :)
[13:47] <k1l> ikonia: you really should stop that ddosing ;p
[13:47] <ikonia> brilliant so dupingping in #ubuntu-offtopic just got muted in #freenode for flooding it with pointless stuff
[13:47] <ikonia> k1l: nah, it's the one thing I'm good at.
[13:48] <k1l> hmm, dupingping rings some bells
[13:48] <LjL> i'm just tired of getting unprovoked remarks and arguments at how "bad" and/or "useless" the floodbots are. i don't care about maintaining them anymore, nobody stepped up to, i had to repeatedly bicker in meetings etc for their status... meh.
[13:48] <ikonia> LjL: they are really good.
[13:48] <ikonia> they provide a good function.
[14:00] <IdleOne> I need to get to an appointment, no time to talk. LjL please bring back the floodbots. Anybody else who doesn't like them is welcome to step up and provide a equal or better solution. be back a little later.
[14:09] <LjL> i think my mental health related to the frustration in responding to the "criticism" could possibly turn out to be more important than bots that are supposed to fight attacks that aren't really happening, when there's actual ops who can do a better job of that
[14:10] <ikonia> I don't think there is a better job
[14:10] <ikonia> they catch the general blurb very well
[14:10] <ikonia> it's only a troublesome individual that gets missed by them.
[14:10] <ikonia> which is where the human element wins
[14:12] <LjL> well let's put it like this, a "break" from using them was suggested, i implemented it. if the ircc wants them back - at large, though, not just informally "put them back" on here, then i guess the experimental break may be put aside
[14:12] <Pici> Maybe theres a lack of people praising the job of the floodbots, but that is only because we're so used to them.  I'm not sure I could go back to the old days of having to mute people manually and all that.
[14:12] <phunyguy> ^
[14:13] <Pici> LjL: The only break that was discussed (to my knowledge) was due to the 'new' way that freenode handles webchat bans.  The other features of the floodbots are definitely needed.
[14:13] <LjL> Pici, well, all i know is i periodically get shit from staffers and our ops about how they're useless in the first place, and #ubuntu doesn't have attack that need stopping - which is so frustrating to even reply to because i *know* the reason i originally made the bots was that we had to +r *all the time* due to GNAA and similar attacks. but i get a "that seems doubtful" as a response
[14:14] <phunyguy> LjL: I could take a look at the FloodBot code at some point to see if it is something I can help with
[14:14] <LjL> so hey if people want to change history and pretend this was never useful and just a paranoid concoction of mine... i'm not going to play the part of the fool
[14:14] <phunyguy> :(
[14:16] <LjL> Pici, i think IdleOne should have the logs of the particular incident i'm referring to. i probably don't because it was during the netsplit frenzy, and i was talking through not-my-computer. but, it's not the only incident of that kind, for sure. as i said, it's something that periodically gets raised.
[14:17] <ikonia> LjL: I fought hard to get the floodbots left in place, even when you where disputing with the team and threatening to take them away
[14:17] <ikonia> LjL: I genuinly value them.
[14:17] <Pici> Me too
[14:18] <Pici> As much as I joke about them being php, I do value them.
[14:18] <LjL> well, when i was "threatening" to take them away, i was accused of blackmail and such (of course it's my code, but hey). so now i'm not threatening anything, i've just taken them away. discuss it openly, and i'll bring them back if there's widespread agreement.
[14:19] <ikonia> no-one said you where threatening anything now, I'm just trying to show you that I valued them
[14:19] <LjL> ikonia, but it was said at the time. in pretty strong ways. my memory is a bit messed up by meds, but it still works a bit.
[14:19] <ikonia> LjL: beause it was true
[14:20] <ikonia> it was a blackmail situation - if this doesn't change I'll take the bots
[14:20] <ikonia> seems it needs a clear decision from the council if we want them / not
[14:20] <LjL> right so i was wrong about doing it like that
[14:20] <LjL> so this time there is no "if this doesn't change"
[14:20] <ikonia> and if people critiquing them bothers you, I guess you need to decide if you can live with it before offering it
[14:21] <ikonia> I know, no-one is saying any such threat has been made.
[14:21] <ikonia> I was just showing that I fought for them even when it wasn't in our interest
[14:21] <ikonia> because they are good
[14:22] <phunyguy> LjL: I would be glad to help with them if you don't have much time/interest.
[14:22] <LjL> there was a Launchpad project with the source that people could ask to access, but then Canonical sent me an email stating that "private" projects could only continue being offered on a paid basis, and i did nothing, so i think it got locked
[14:22] <phunyguy> I would just need to learn whatever language they are written in, but shouldn't be too hard.
[14:23] <phunyguy> are they Python?
[14:23] <dupingping> hello!
[14:23] <ikonia> LjL: maybe we could look at setting up a private SVN/GIT repo or something to sort that out
[14:23] <dupingping> yes
[14:23] <phunyguy> hi dupingping, how can we help you?
[14:23] <dupingping> ah~
[14:24] <dupingping> #ubuntu-offtopic is died.
[14:24] <ikonia> dupingping: I banned you and removed you from #ubuntu-offtopic
[14:24] <dupingping> i want to join it.
[14:24] <LjL> phunyguy: no, PHP
[14:24] <LjL> phunyguy: and very messy
[14:24] <phunyguy> LjL: even better
[14:24] <ikonia> dupingping: you kept just hilighting people for no reason, LjL had asked you to stop
[14:24] <phunyguy> LjL I was a perl guy
[14:24] <dupingping> +ikonia: why?
[14:25] <ikonia> dupingping: you also got muted in #freenode for flooding it, so I have to assume your intention is to cause a problem rather than participate in the channel.
[14:25] <dupingping> ah~
[14:25] <phunyguy> going to agree with ikonia here.  I saw it in #freenode.
[14:25] <dupingping> please help me!
[14:25] <dupingping> i am a poor beginner!
[14:25] <ikonia> yes, you've said that multiple times
[14:25] <ikonia> but you've also been asked not to do something - and you do it
[14:25] <ikonia> that's not being a beginner, thats ignoring instructions/advice.
[14:26] <dupingping> oh?
[14:26] <dupingping> i am a python developer!
[14:26] <ikonia> that has nothing to do with anything
[14:26] <phunyguy> dupingping: I suggest you start taking some of the advice you are given.
[14:26] <phunyguy> if not all.
[14:26] <ikonia> I suggest finding another channel to talk in, maybe one that uses your native language.
[14:28] <dupingping> 您好
[14:28] <dupingping> please help me!
[14:28] <phunyguy> I think we are done here.
[14:28] <LjL> :(
[14:28] <ikonia> dupingping: what's your native language ?
[14:29] <dupingping> it's chinese.
[14:29] <LjL> chinese is my guess
[14:29] <ikonia> a good guess
[14:29] <dupingping> then?
[14:29] <phunyguy> 您好 = Hello
[14:29] <dupingping> yes! hahaha
[14:29] <ikonia> try #chinese
[14:29] <ikonia> that is a chinese chat room
[14:29] <dupingping> yes?
[14:30] <dupingping> i hate chinese!
[14:30] <dupingping> i learn english!
[14:30] <ikonia> try ##english then
[14:30] <ikonia> good place to learn / talk about English language
[14:30] <dupingping> i want to join in #ubuntu-offtopic
[14:31] <ikonia> dupingping: you can't
[14:31] <LjL> dupingping, i think you need to understand English better, to follow rules in #ubuntu-offtopic.  So, yes, please use ##English for a while... I am there, and it is a very nice channel!
[14:31] <dupingping> why?
[14:31] <dupingping> ok ok
[14:32] <dupingping> i'll sleep!
[14:33] <phunyguy> Goodnight, sir
[14:33] <phunyguy> Please /part the channel when you go.
[14:33] <dupingping> Goodnight, everyboard.
[14:33] <dupingping> Goodnight, everybody.
[14:33] <dupingping> it's my mistake
[14:36] <phunyguy> LjL: if you feel up to it, you can PM me a link with some code, I don't mind if it is messy.  I can tinker with them in my own channel.
[16:57] <ikonia> really "microsoft_" is an offensive nickname and needs to be changed ?
[16:57] <Pici> People are annoying today.
[16:57] <ikonia> I'm getting very fed up with MonkeyDust's actual help of people.
 microsoft_  your nick is offensive and disturbing, please change it
[17:01] <bazhang> wth
[17:01] <phunyguy> indeed.
[17:01] <phunyguy> I am guilty of similar mistakes, so I can't say much
[17:01] <LjL-Card> MonkeyDust and ActionParsnip are the new Marvel heros
[17:02] <bazhang> if it was M$sux I could see it, but ....
[17:02] <ikonia> ha ha
[17:02] <ikonia> actionparsnip can actually help though
[17:02] <ikonia> monkeydust just quotes google articles at people as his own
[17:02] <ikonia> (mostly)
[17:13] <raznik> Hello.
[17:13] <raznik> I was banned by ikonia for doing nothing.
[17:16] <IdleOne> LjL: I don't know who suggested this break from using the bots. I don't recall it being me.
[17:17] <bazhang> #ubuntu: 2014-02-04T17:08:20 <raznik> please shut up, Pici. it is related with Ubuntu.
[17:17] <Pici> To be honest, I had no idea what they were talking about.
[17:17] <bazhang> raznik augh he quit
[17:17] <ikonia> good
[17:17] <Pici> It just didn't sound like Ubuntu.
[17:17] <bazhang> dealxi?
[17:18] <bazhang> dealextreme
[17:20] <Pici> The antenna stuff
[17:34] <LjL> IdleOne, Pici: http://privatepaste.com/f0649bc9a3/sb45y
[17:35] <IdleOne> LjL: yes I remember it quite clearly.
[17:35] <LjL> then you know who suggested it...?
[17:36] <IdleOne> I remember that part now.
[17:37] <IdleOne> I wish you would have talked to me before pulling them though
[17:38] <IdleOne> not saying you can't do what you want with the code after all it is yours.
[17:38] <Pici> LjL: adran isn't an op
[17:38] <LjL> i couldn't care less, i've got enough of this from ops, ex-ops, staff, ex-staff
[17:38] <ikonia> ok - so lets get used to life without the floodbots
[17:38] <ikonia> they did a great job, but if they are no longer available, lets deal with it and move on
[17:38] <IdleOne> IMHO the floodbots do more good and help us more than most people think.
[17:39] <LjL> then maybe it will be nice if they are reminded, eh
[17:39] <bazhang> "tough love"
[17:39] <ikonia> don't think so
[17:39] <ikonia> can't have it run like that
[17:39] <bazhang> baby dont hurt me
[17:39] <ikonia> I'm unhappy so I'll punish the channel to make individuals realise
[17:39] <ikonia> so lets drop the floodbots despite their qualities and move on
[17:40] <LjL> yep, indeed, no matter what i do, i'm either a fool or malicious, so, this camp can fuck off, and the other camp can fuck off
[17:40] <IdleOne> err
[17:40] <ikonia> sorry but that is fact
[17:41] <ikonia> you removed the bots from the channels
[17:41] <ikonia> no-one else did that
[17:41] <ikonia> so if it's going to be at the whim of an individual we should get used to not having them
[17:41] <IdleOne> I would rather you bring the bots back and we work on either opening the code or implementing a different solution.
[17:41] <k1l_> you only know what you got till its gone.
[17:41] <LjL> IdleOne: look at the train. it's gone.
[17:41] <ikonia> I know what it is, it was a quality useful tool
[17:41] <bazhang> big yellow taxi
[17:42] <k1l_> so i dont see a "problem" with the floodbots. (besides technical stuff i dont see anyway)
[17:42] <LjL> IdleOne, seriously, the code has been there for... what, a year? two? for people to chime in and "open the code" or "implement a different solution". rww didn't even KNOW that, despite, i believe, it being publicly advertized.
[17:43] <LjL> how long am i supposed to wait still (while being mocked at random)? half a decade, just to be sure?
[17:43] <ikonia> no-one is mocking you
[17:43] <LjL> is "step down considerably" supposed to be in slow motion?
[17:43] <LjL> ikonia: you mean no-one except the ones that are?
[17:43] <IdleOne> LjL: If that is what you want to do, pull the bots, that is fine with me. I want you to understand that there are people who appreciate the bots and what they do.
[17:43] <Pici> LjL: then give us a deadline
[17:44] <LjL> Pici: yesterday
[17:44] <Pici> LjL: thanks
[17:44] <k1l_> well, would a "call for coders" help? like a call for operators the irrc does
[17:44] <LjL> k1l_: THAT'S WHAT I DID
[17:44] <LjL> A YEAR AGO
[17:45] <Pici> this did happen
[17:45] <IdleOne> LjL: phunyguy has expressed interest in helping with them, again this is up to you, but if you are willing to work with him and get this started. That would be great
[17:45] <IdleOne> it did and nobody was interested then, now we have someone who is.
[17:46] <Pici> LjL: I understand your frustration, but is there really something that you are actively doing to keep the floodboots up and running?
[17:46] <ikonia> LjL: would you allow me to take a copy of the code and host it on an internal server for the team
[17:46] <ikonia> that way it's off your plate/hands
[17:46] <ikonia> I appreciate the launchpad solution crippled any effort
[17:46] <ikonia> (along with a lack of interest)
[17:47] <k1l_> LjL: ok, i didnt know that. besides i am not a coder and i dont think i can help with that i try to help that situation with some brainstorming. maybe we need to call to a broader audience and not just the typic op and #ubuntu* friends? like a post on planet.ubuntu ?
[17:47] <ikonia> posting the code would be unacceptable
[17:47] <ikonia> thats the reason it's being controlled
[17:47] <Pici> Does it need to be?
[17:48] <ikonia> I think so yes
[17:48] <ikonia> ljl made a pretty good case initially as I recall to keep it to a small list
[17:48] <ikonia> (list of people)
[17:48] <IdleOne> LjL: I know this was explained before but could you tell us again why it was made a private project?
[17:48] <ikonia> he didn't
[17:48] <ikonia> non-open projects are paid process
[17:48] <IdleOne> explained a year ago*
[17:49] <ikonia> (on launchpad)
[17:49] <RobKardashian_> did kim kardashian spread her pussy for kayne west?
[17:51] <LjL> IdleOne: because the source code wasn't supposed to be opened up until someone stepped up to clean it?
[17:51]  * phunyguy steps up
[17:52] <phunyguy> I don't know PHP, but syntax is all I don't know.
[17:52] <IdleOne> LjL: is there anything in the source that shouldn't be available to all eyes is what i am asking?
[17:52] <LjL> anyway the answer is no, i'm fed up, with Ubuntu, with the ops team, with people who "know better", and so on. there's been all the chances in the world to get them opened up through a "process", now *at most*, all that's going to happen is that if in a while, the IRCC thinks these are still useful after the "break", they can decide to ask me to re-enable them, and then we start from there. but if it's unacceptable for one individual to control them, then
[17:52] <LjL> write replacements.
[17:52] <LjL> IdleOne: yes
[17:54] <ikonia> LjL: it's not unacceptable for an individual to control them, but it's a problem when you take them away / bring them back at your own decision.
[17:54] <ikonia> I don't mind you running the bots, infact I'm thankful for it,
[17:56] <Blueink_> !ops
[17:56] <Blueink_> !staff
[17:56] <phunyguy> wow, vermont?
[17:56] <phunyguy> his reach is growing
[17:56] <Pricey> Is that the guy we ignored...?
[17:56] <IdleOne> yes
[17:56] <Pici> it was
[17:56] <k1l_> yes, he switched states to undo the mute
[17:56] <IdleOne> ubottu: ignore *!*c-107-3-23-43.hsd1.vt.comcast.net
[17:57] <IdleOne> ubottu: ignore *!*@c-107-3-23-43.hsd1.vt.comcast.net
[17:57] <Pricey> 'states'?
[17:57] <Pricey> oh, american states
[17:59] <genii> He seems to be making the rounds
[17:59] <ikonia> sorted now
[19:22] <k1l_> @mark #ubuntu govno misusing the supportchannel to find people click on his ref-link
[19:26] <bazhang> he just hit multiple other channels as well
[19:26] <bazhang> "just need 3 more!"
[19:30] <genii> Bah
[19:32] <DJones> SN3: Is there something we can help you with?
[19:35] <IdleOne> SN3: Please stop joining this channel unless you have a specific need and are available to discuss it.
[22:57] <genii> @comment 59386 Reviewed, not removed.