[03:29] <hyperair> could someone please help me upload https://launchpad.net/~hyperair/+archive/staging/+files/libgpod_0.8.3-4ubuntu3.dsc to ubuntu while i apply for my PPU access to libgpod?
[03:52] <TheMuso> hyperair: Sure, I'll take a look.
[03:52] <hyperair> thanks
[04:03] <zgsppdale> Hi
[04:04] <TheMuso> hyperair: Uplaoded.
[04:04] <hyperair> TheMuso: thanks
[04:07] <TheMuso> hyperair: np
[06:18] <pitti> Good morning
[07:23] <larsu> good morning!
[08:14] <ritz> hi, is indicators-printer maintained ?
[08:14] <larsu> ritz: not really...
[08:14] <larsu> what's the issue?
[08:14] <ritz> thought so
[08:15] <ritz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/959451
[08:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 959451 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Credentials from gnome-keyring is not used while printing" [Low,In progress]
[08:16] <ritz> are we deprecating this in favour of system-config-printer ?
[08:17] <ritz> or will we implement a different solution ( for ubuntu-unified-touch-phone-laptop-... image ) ?
[08:17] <dholbach> hey hey
[08:18] <dholbach> setting date and time in trusty does not work - it just opens up the general system settings
[08:18] <dholbach> is there a workaround?
[08:21] <dholbach> larsu, ^ do you know?
[08:22] <larsu> ritz: indicator-printer replaced system-config-printer's applet. We still use s-c-p for other stuff
[08:22] <larsu> ritz: I don't know about any plans for the phone yet
[08:22] <larsu> dholbach: let me check...
[08:23] <larsu> dholbach: do you have unity-control-center installed?
[08:23] <dholbach> larsu, yep
[08:23] <ali1234> you need unity-control-center-datetime
[08:24] <ali1234> it's a new package
[08:24] <larsu> but it's not pulled in by u-c-c or indicator-datetime?
[08:24] <ali1234> it ispulled in by ubuntu-desktop^
[08:24] <ali1234> but not if you're just upgrading
[08:24] <larsu> dholbach: alternatively you can still start the g-c-c with gnome-control-center.real
[08:24] <ali1234> don't ask me why, i'm looking for the bug report (popey?)
[08:24] <larsu> ali1234: not for me after a dist-upgrade
[08:25] <popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/+bug/1278063
[08:25] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1278063 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "date and time settings missing unity-control-center-datetime not installed" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[08:25] <ali1234> cheers
[08:25] <popey> np
[08:25] <dholbach> ali1234, great, thanks - that made it work
[09:01] <seb128> good morning desktopers!
[09:02] <JackYu> morning:)
[09:02] <popey> Morning
[09:02]  * popey wonders why his keyboard layout keeps (twice in two days) changing on trusty from UK to US 
[09:03] <seb128> do you have both configured?
[09:03] <popey> no, only one
[09:03] <seb128> weird
[09:04] <seb128> what's the key combinaison to cycle layouts for you?
[09:04] <seb128> (settings -> text input has it)
[09:04] <popey> super+space, super+shift+space
[09:04] <popey> which if i press, just echos a space
[09:04] <seb128> do you hit those by error maybe?
[09:05] <seb128> hum, k
[09:05] <seb128> dunno then
[09:05] <popey> seemed to happen when i got the new unity settings thing
[09:06] <seb128> what new unity settings?
[09:06] <popey> unity-control-center
[09:07] <popey> may be coincidence, but the layout was fine all last week, only flipped over the weekend. (when ironically I went from the US to UK)
[09:08] <popey> ok, added US to list of layouts, switched to it and switched back and now my kb layout is correct.
[09:08] <popey> odd.
[09:08] <seb128> unity-control-center is like gnome-control-center
[09:08] <seb128> it's only a configuration UI, it has no service/daemon side
[09:09] <seb128> it's not running if you don't and click it
[09:09] <seb128> so not likely it changing your keymaps
[09:10] <popey> hm. No idea then ☻
[09:10] <seb128> me neither...
[09:19] <jibel> I had the same issue with FR->US. I applied latest updates and rebooted, now it's back to french
[09:21] <seb128> jibel, popey: it changed after some upgrades during a session and get back to normal after reboot then?
[09:21] <seb128> do you know what got updated when it happeneD?
[09:26] <jibel> seb128, after an upgrade and a cold boot. I think it was fr in lightdm because I could enter my password but the layout was wrong once logged in. Packages updated during previous upgrade http://paste.ubuntu.com/6908067/
[09:26] <seb128> jibel, thanks (I don't see any obvious candidate for the issue in that list)
[09:27] <mlankhorst> oh btw, hello world :P
[10:01] <lschuetze> Hi, is there a way to get an Indicator without icon with AppIndicator3? I am using python with PyGI currently.
[10:05] <ali1234> no
[10:09] <ritz> larsu, hi, again, wrt https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/959451 . running system-config-printer-applet resolves the issue.  indicator-printer seems to be a wrapper around system-config-print for queue management and printer management
[10:09] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 959451 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Credentials from gnome-keyring is not used while printing" [Low,In progress]
[10:09] <ritz> is there a reason why we do not deprecated this in place of s-c-p
[10:10] <czajkowski> loving Trusty folks thank you :) \o/
[10:24] <lschuetze> Hi, is there a way to get an Indicator without icon with AppIndicator3? I am using python with PyGI currently.
[10:25] <larsu> ritz: s-c-p uses a systray applet and I wrote indicator-printer to be a proper indicator
[10:26] <larsu> ritz: but it's been changed by design to not be an indicator at all anymore
[10:26] <larsu> I just didn't have the time to update it yet
[10:31] <seb128> larsu, the issue (if I read the description correctly) is that there is some acl management the indicator doesn't do
[10:34] <larsu> seb128: according to my last comment on the bug, it seems to be an issue with the print dialog. (I'm not sure right now though, I can't remember the details)
[10:34] <larsu> but yeah, it passes along empty credentials
[10:35] <seb128> what is s-c-p-a doing? can we easily do the same thing as a workaround?
[10:35] <seb128> I don't really understand the issue but it seems like something that would be nice to fix for the lts
[10:38] <larsu> right. I'll look into it later
[10:39] <seb128> larsu, thanks
[10:40] <seb128> larsu, btw, did you see the new comments in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evince/+bug/1277370 ?
[10:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1277370 in evince (Ubuntu) "Now used Aiatana design blocks Evince accessibility usage if the current session is not Unity" [Undecided,New]
[10:40] <seb128> larsu, I'm not sure if I screwed the merge, but that's the same thing I was seeing on friday, some keybindings don't work under !Unity
[10:42] <larsu> right
[10:42] <larsu> looks like at least the first comment is about that
[10:42] <larsu> the second one isn't a regression, but we can talk about it
[10:42] <larsu> (changing Ctrl+Left to be used for jumping word when caret navigation is turned on)
[10:43] <larsu> seb128: is ubuntu5 the one from last FridaY?
[10:43] <seb128> (seems reasonable to me)
[10:43] <larsu> ah, seems like it
[10:43] <seb128> yes, ubuntu5 is the one with your fixes
[10:44] <seb128> but I'm not ruling out that I screwed something when I reconsiliated the revisions I forgot to push and your merge request
[10:44] <seb128> can you check that what you get from lp:~ubuntu-desktop/evince/ubuntu bzr bd-do correctly includes the fix your had?
[10:44] <seb128> you
[10:44] <larsu> hm, ubuntu5 crashes on Ctrl+S for me due to a double-free
[10:45] <seb128> urg
[10:45] <larsu> yeah let me check
[10:45] <seb128> same here for ctrl-s
[10:49] <larsu> the caret-navigation thing works fine here
[10:49] <larsu> Ctrl+S is broken in my build as well
[10:52] <seb128> I didn't try the caret navigation, but I had the keybindings not working under g-s on friday
[10:52] <larsu> right, I'll test that after fixing the crash
[10:52] <larsu> I already know the issue, doesn't seem very related to my patches
[10:53] <seb128> the keybindings or the ctrl-S?
[10:53] <larsu> the ctrl+s
[10:53] <larsu> oh, it is :(
[10:53]  * larsu hides in shame
[11:00] <larsu> seb128: gotta go to the doctor and lunch first, though
[11:00] <seb128> larsu, ok, no problem, good luck with the doctor and enjoy lunch!
[11:10] <ritz> larsu, so, updating s-c-p to support indicator features would help ?
[12:28] <desrt> hello europeans and just-returned americans
[12:31] <seb128> desrt, hey, how are you? had a good trip back?
[12:32] <desrt> yup
[12:32] <desrt> very nice
[12:32] <desrt> had a nice ubuntu-using seatmate :)
[12:33] <desrt> it's kinda neat how this sort of thing happens more and more often
[12:33] <seb128> nice
[12:33] <desrt> the usual response these days is at least "oh ya.. i've heard of that" instead of "huh?"
[12:34] <desrt> and every now and then you get someone who has actually tried it :)
[12:48] <mdeslaur> desrt: cool. were they using unity?
[12:48] <desrt> mdeslaur: they didn't have it on their laptop
[12:48] <mdeslaur> oh, I see
[12:49] <desrt> although i ran into another guy once on a bus on the way to the airport who asked for directions... and for some random reason started talking to the guy.... and came to the topic of the fact that i was travelling for free software.... and he said "oh.  i use suse... a friend of mine set it up..."
[12:49] <desrt> i asked him "ah... are you using kde or gnome?"... "uh.... i don't know.... kde, i think?"
[12:49] <mdeslaur> hehe
[12:50] <desrt> when he took it out at the airport, gnome
[12:50] <desrt> tells you all you need to know about the desktop holy wars :)
[12:50] <seb128> ;-)
[12:50] <desrt> "uh... i don't know.... firefox?"
[12:50] <mdeslaur> yes, I have to constantly remind myself that reddit isn't our target market :)
[12:53] <desrt> that guy was cool... environmental engineer from france who was working at a freshwaters facility on lake ontario
[12:53] <desrt> as part of a canada<->france governmental exchange program
[12:53] <desrt> i really like it when non-computer-people are using our stuff
[12:53] <mlankhorst> I like not thinking about the defaults ;)
[13:03] <GunnarHj> seb128: ping?
[13:03] <seb128> GunnarHj, hey
[13:03] <GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Seb!
[13:03] <GunnarHj> seb128: Question about ubuntu-docs?
[13:03] <seb128> sorry, ctrl-W on the wrong screen
[13:03] <GunnarHj> seb128: Question about ubuntu-docs?
[13:04] <seb128> GunnarHj, sure (I'm probably not the best placed to reply about those but I can try)
[13:06] <GunnarHj> seb128: We try to document the "release process" wrt ubuntu-docs. In my world it ought to be easiest to create a source package from lp:ubuntu-docs and upload that, and let lp:ubuntu/ubuntu-docs be automatically updated. Is there anything that speaks against that?
[13:07] <seb128> that sounds good/logical
[13:07] <GunnarHj> seb128: I know that you normally are expected to both commit to the ubuntu branch and upload. That's why I asked.
[13:08] <seb128> well, if the upstream branch is the main location for the package as well that works fine
[13:08] <seb128> that's what we do for most projects nowadays
[13:08] <GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks, that's what I wanted to hear. :)
[14:46] <Sweetshark> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libetonyek/+bug/1277152/comments/5 <- FYI, Ill stay with internal libetonyek.
[14:46] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1277152 in libetonyek (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libetoneyek needed as b-d for libreoffice" [Low,Won't fix]
[14:46] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok
[16:17] <seb128> larsu, getting anywhere with those evince issues? do you need debug infos from me?
[16:18] <larsu> seb128: nope, preparing a patch for the Ctrl+S issue right now
[16:18] <seb128> larsu, great, thanks
[16:18] <larsu> I haven't been able to reproduce the other issues he mentioned
[16:18] <larsu> do you still have them?
[16:19] <larsu> !Unity not working, I mean
[16:19] <seb128> yes
[16:19] <ubot2> larsu: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
[16:19] <seb128> let me retry to be sure
[16:21] <larsu> ubot2: sorry, my bad.
[16:21] <ubot2> Factoid 'sorry, my bad.' not found
[16:21] <larsu> :)
[16:24] <seb128> back
[16:24] <seb128> larsu, sorry, something made user switching really unhappy on my box
[16:24] <seb128> when I log out from sessions I get no X working
[16:25] <seb128> need to test if that's the intel driver updates or lightdm
[16:25] <seb128> larsu, anyway, still the same issue, under gnome-shell e.g f9 doesn't work
[16:42] <larsu> seb128: ah I still had a locally-built version on my machine. I can reproduce with ubuntu5
[16:42] <larsu> now I wonder what the differences were...
[16:43] <seb128> larsu, as said, I don't rule out me screwing up the merge
[16:43] <larsu> it looks fine so far. I'm rebuilding it right now
[16:43] <seb128> there was a conflict in one of the debian/patches and diff on diff can be tricky
[16:43] <larsu> ya :)
[17:22] <sil2100> seb128: ping!
[17:22] <seb128> sil2100, hey
[17:22] <sil2100> seb128: hi! Can I borrow you for some preNEWing? ;)
[17:22] <sil2100> seb128: when do you EOD today?
[17:23] <seb128> sil2100, I'm going for sport in some 10 minutes, but feel free to give me the names and I can review them tomorrow morning when I start
[17:25] <asac> sil2100: noone else we can try?
[17:25] <asac> seb128: https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-003/+packages
[17:25] <asac> unity-scopes-scopes
[17:25] <asac> :)
[17:25] <asac> err unity-scope-scopes
[17:27] <seb128> asac, sil2100: +1 for that source, I just reviewed it, it's a trivial one
[17:27] <sil2100> \o/
[17:27] <popey> grr, seb128 my laptop has just randomly flipped to US layout again!
[17:27] <sil2100> seb128: can you check if the whitelist is updated?
[17:27] <sil2100> (I guess we still need that to be done?)
[17:27] <popey> indicator still shows UK
[17:27] <sil2100> No, wait... hmm
[17:27]  * sil2100 is confused
[17:28] <sil2100> We didn't use CITrain yet for new packages, so I don't even know where from does it take the whitelist
[17:28] <seb128> popey, :/
[17:28] <popey> no idea what's causing it... very odd
[17:29] <kenvandine> popey, you spent a week in the US... we figure you are ready for a change :)
[17:29] <popey> hah
[17:29] <popey> hey, I'm all for eating meat and dancing on tables!
[17:29] <popey> Keyboard layouts however, no.
[17:29] <kenvandine> haha... shhhhhhh
[17:29] <kenvandine> :-D
[17:30] <kenvandine> seb128, remember the greek place we went to a couple years ago?  we went back :)
[17:30] <seb128> kenvandine, did you dance on the table? :p
[17:31] <kenvandine> of course!
[17:31] <seb128> ;-)
[17:39] <larsu> seb128: building evince for hopefully the last time :-/
[17:39]  * larsu really hates accels in 3.10
[17:41] <seb128> :-(
[17:41] <larsu> seems to work now though
[17:41] <seb128> larsu, what was the issue?
[17:41] <larsu> with a small workaround - desrt redid accel handling in 3.12 so I didn't bother to fix it in 3.10
[17:42] <larsu> seb128: the accels from the menu xml don't get picked up by the window
[17:42] <larsu> calling gtk_application_set_accelerator() in addition makes it work
[17:42] <seb128> k
[17:42] <larsu> the Ctrl+S issue was my mistake
[17:42] <larsu> I'll mr both in the same branch
[17:42] <seb128> hopefully we are gold this time ;-)
[17:42] <larsu> ya....
[17:43] <seb128> feel free to just commit to your git and point me to the commits
[17:43] <seb128> e.g don't bother with quilt if you don't want to
[17:43] <seb128> I can easily cherrypick diffs
[17:43] <larsu> I already imported it into the package because I wanted to makes sure it works this time
[17:43] <seb128> k
[17:43] <larsu> by building the package itself
[17:43] <larsu> (hence the wait...)
[17:44] <seb128> larsu, take your time, I've to go for sport so that's going to be for tomorrow for me anywa
[17:44] <seb128> have a nice evening everyone
[17:44] <seb128> see you tomorrow
[17:44] <larsu> seb128: enojoy!
[17:44] <larsu> *enjoy
[17:44] <seb128> thanks ;-)
[17:49] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, is it possible for you to try running the key grabber AP tests again with this branch? it just adds some extra debug output: https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/compiz/debug-gnome-key-grabber
[18:45] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yeah, I'll do that now.
[20:05] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I have some results from the debugging you asked me to do.
[20:10] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, hey, thanks
[20:12] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: So I ended up just using printf's instead because I couldn't get Compiz debug output to work on my setup.
[20:12] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: But this is what was ouputted when I ran the failing test:
[20:12] <ChrisTownsend> grad 38 0xd
[20:12] <ChrisTownsend> ungrab 38 0xd
[20:12] <ChrisTownsend> Err, grab
[20:14] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, is there any more than that?
[20:15] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Not when the test is ran.
[20:15] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: There is more when Compiz starts.  Do you need that?
[20:16] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, did you replace all of the compLogMessage's? i'm hoping you didn't happen to miss some of them
[20:16] <attente_> (btw i was adding the --verbose flag to unity to get them to appear)
[20:16] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: This is only for the test_grab_accelerator test that is failing.
[20:16] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes, all of the one's you added.
[20:17] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Oh, --verbose?  I was using --debug.  Let me switch it back and try that, but I think it will be the same.
[20:17] <attente_> oh ok
[20:18] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, do global shortcuts work at all for you?
[20:18] <attente_> i mean the ones that g-s-d normally provides
[20:18] <attente_> like the volume up/down buttons
[20:18] <attente_> or the next/previous input source ones
[20:19] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Doesn't appear they are.
[20:20] <attente_> so bizarre... :S
[20:20] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: So the same thing with --verbose.
[20:21] <attente_> ok
[20:22] <attente_> can you try again: dbus-send --session --dest=org.gnome.Shell --print-reply /org/gnome/Shell org.gnome.Shell.GrabAccelerator string:'<Shift><Control><Alt>a' uint32:0
[20:23] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok
[20:23] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Then dbus-monitor?
[20:23] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, what is the reply for that send?
[20:24] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, it seems so strange that the tests fail and none of the g-s-d keybindings work
[20:24] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: method return sender=:1.875 -> dest=:1.887 reply_serial=2
[20:24] <ChrisTownsend>     uint32 2
[20:24] <attente_> but your alt+f is still opening in the panel
[20:24] <attente_> correct?
[20:25] <ChrisTownsend> Yes, alt+f opens the menu in the Panel.
[20:25] <attente_> that suggests to me that the key grabber dbus server is down
[20:25] <attente_> ok, now 'dbus-monitor member=AcceleratorActivated'
[20:25] <attente_> and ctrl+shift+alt+a again
[20:26] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Nothing is outputted.
[20:27] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, dbus-send --session --dest=org.gnome.Shell --print-reply /org/gnome/Shell org.gnome.Shell.UngrabAccelerator uint32:2
[20:28] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok
[20:28] <attente_> any reply?
[20:29] <ChrisTownsend> method return sender=:1.875 -> dest=:1.890 reply_serial=2
[20:29] <ChrisTownsend>      boolean true
[20:31] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, do you have any special compiz plugins installed?
[20:32] <attente_> hmm.. no that can't be it...
[20:33] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, can you killall gnome-settings-daemon?
[20:33] <attente_> then try again dbus-send --session --dest=org.gnome.Shell --print-reply /org/gnome/Shell org.gnome.Shell.GrabAccelerator string:'<Shift><Control><Alt>a' uint32:0
[20:34] <attente_> i'm wondering why g-s-d doesn't seem to be registering its accelerators
[20:35] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Umm, this may be telling.  There is no gnome-settings-daemon process running.
[20:36] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I'm going to reboot and see if it comes back.
[20:36] <attente_> wow, that's really strange
[20:36] <attente_> ok
[20:36] <ChrisTownsend> It is strange.
[20:38] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Still no g-s-d.  What is up with my system?????
[20:38] <attente_> :(
[20:39] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I can start it manually, right?
[20:39] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, 'start gnome-settings-daemon'
[20:39] <attente_> i hope so...
[20:39] <attente_> but it's weird that it's in such a state as to not start with the session
[20:40] <ChrisTownsend> Yeah, very strange.  It's running now.  I'll try the test and see what happens.
[20:40] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, i guess the tests will still fail
[20:40] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, but i'm wondering if your g-s-d keybindings work again
[20:41] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes, g-s-d keybindings work now
[20:41] <attente_> ok, can you do 'dbus-monitor member=AcceleratorActivated' again and try using some of those keybindings?
[20:43] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I get no output from those keybindings.
[20:43] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, but the keybindings still have an effect?
[20:43] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes
[20:44] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, apt-cache policy gnome-settings-daemon
[20:45] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Uh, I didn't notice, but I guess an update overwrote your g-s-d package I installed.  3.8.6.1-0ubuntu8
[20:45] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, ah, ok
[20:45] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I only installed your package not using your PPA.
[20:46] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, i guess this is still only half the problem though
[20:46] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Right
[20:47] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, can you downgrade g-s-d, restart it, and then dbus-monitor member=AcceleratorActivated again?
[20:47] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yeah, I'll try that.
[20:49] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Bah, it won't let me because the gnome-settings-daemon-schemas cannot be downgraded.
[20:49] <attente_> ooph.
[20:49] <attente_> ok, let me upload a new one
[20:49] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok
[20:51] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, i think i see what happened. it must be the g-s-d fork
[20:52] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I think this new package is also when my g-s-d started to fail starting.
[20:54] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, i'll have to apply the changes to unity-settings-daemon instead
[20:54] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, thanks for your help, i'll let you know when it's ready
[20:58] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok, np
[21:41] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, do you actually have unity-settings-daemon installed?
[21:43] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I didn't, but now I do.
[21:45] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, i can't seem to replicate the problem where your g-s-d isn't running, mine still runs and i don't have u-s-d installed
[21:47] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: I honestly have no idea why it would not start.  u-s-d starts up on session start though.
[21:47]  * ChrisTownsend Shrugs
[21:47] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, you manually installed u-s-d?
[21:48] <ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes
[21:48] <attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, i'm not sure what the right course of action is here
[21:48] <attente_> robert_ancell, hey
[21:48] <robert_ancell> attente_, hello
[21:49] <attente_> robert_ancell, is there an issue where g-s-d wouldn't start up in the unity session because of the fork?
[21:49] <robert_ancell> attente_, did you manually install u-s-d?
[21:49] <attente_> robert_ancell, i didn't, but ChrisTownsend seemed to encounter that problem earlier
[21:49] <robert_ancell> attente_, it was working for me, but it should be opt-in. xnox was playing around with the upstart config though
[21:50] <Laney> buh
[21:50] <Laney> the upstart changes went in
[21:50] <ChrisTownsend> Right, I had latest g-s-d installed with no u-s-d installed and g-s-d would not start on session start up.  I manually installed u-s-d and not u-s-d starts fine.
[21:50] <Laney> -start on started dbus and starting gnome-session
[21:50] <ChrisTownsend> s/not/now
[21:50] <xnox> attente_: please do $ apt-cache policy libunity-core-6.0-8 gnome-settings-daemon unity-settings-daemon
[21:51] <Laney> +start on started dbus and starting gnome-session INSTANCE!=ubuntu
[21:51] <Laney> that is bad if we don't pull in u-s-d in some way
[21:51] <xnox> Laney: there is an override in libunity-core-6.0-8 to start gnome-settings-daemon, if there is no unity-settings-daemon, until unity-settings-daemon is pulled in by default.
[21:52] <xnox> attente_: and paste the output somewhere =)
[21:52] <attente_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6911569/
[21:52] <attente_> xnox, ^
[21:53] <attente_> xnox, but this isn't my issue i guess, somehow ChrisTownsend got into that state
[21:53] <ChrisTownsend> Ah, libunity-core-6.0-8 was uninstalled due to me installing libunity-core-6.0-9 from the Unity daily-build PPA.
[21:54] <xnox> ChrisTownsend: yeap, that would make things bad...
[21:54] <attente_> bah. ok. my fault, sorry ChrisTownsend!
[21:54] <xnox> robert_ancell: how far up the stack are we to make unity-settings-daemon the default?
[21:54] <Laney> man, that is weird
[21:54] <Laney> I'd have just waited before uploading it and done all the changes at once
[21:54] <ChrisTownsend> Sorry guys for my Frankenstein system!
[21:54] <xnox> ChrisTownsend: attente_: sorry about that, I should make merge proposal into unity.
[21:55] <robert_ancell> xnox, "far up the stack"?
[21:55] <xnox> Laney: that's what I wanted, that's why i had it blocked in -proposed.
[21:55] <xnox> Laney: but somehow we ended up thinking on friday that gnome-settings-daemon is good to be unblocked into release pocket....
[21:57] <xnox> robert_ancell: there was a tracking bug to switch dependencies, wasn't there?
[21:57] <robert_ancell> xnox, bug 1277487
[21:57] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1277487 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "Create Unity Settings Daemon so can remain on old GNOME Settings Daemon version" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1277487
[21:57] <xnox> right that.
[22:04] <xnox> robert_ancell: i guess we can seed unity-settings-daemon & gnome-settings-daemon.
[22:04] <xnox> actually seed unity-settings-deamon only and drop gnome-settings-daemon.
[22:05] <xnox> unity-s-d will pull in g-s-d-schemas and those remaining applications that depend on gnome-settings-daemon will pull it in, until we do all the uploads for s/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-daemon-schemas/
[22:07] <kgunn> robert_ancell: yo!
[22:07] <robert_ancell> kgunn, how's is going?
[22:07] <robert_ancell> sure
[22:22] <xnox> tedg: how do i land https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-session/unity-settings-daemon/+merge/205421 ? it's all good to go.
[22:24] <tedg> xnox, thostr is the landing engineer for that project, so you'll have to ask him.
[22:24] <tedg> xnox, He'll have to get it into the silo request spreadsheet, and then... there's process.
[22:30] <xnox> tedg: what does a landing engineer means? why can't i be the lander of this branch? Surely anyone who can dput should be able to be the "landing" engineer.
[22:30] <tedg> xnox, One would think.
[22:31] <xnox> thostr, if you are in current working timezone and not on vacation and not otherwise swamped with high priority work, what needs to happen to land above branch into the archive?
[22:31] <xnox> tedg: i have this wonderful command called "dput" and it's a pretty good landing robot =)
[22:32] <tedg> xnox, It would be against the release process for me to recommend distro patching it and saving yourself a day's work.
[22:39] <ali1234> hi tedg, how is the indicator stuff going?
[22:43] <Laney> xnox: I'm not sure I knew that the upstart stuff was in there
[22:43] <Laney> thought it was just the split
[22:44] <Laney> oh well
[22:44] <xnox> Laney: well, it was all of our changes as well -> that is: g-s-d start on !=ubuntu and u-s-d start on =ubuntu
[22:44] <xnox> trickery that we designed.
[22:44] <Laney> yeah I guess I got the wrong end of the stick
[22:44] <Laney> thought they would just be put into bzr
[22:44] <xnox> to be fair, if i didn't upload, i would have lost context about the "solution" by today =)
[22:45] <xnox> Laney: they were committed into version control, -proposed branch... using dput. =)))))))) that's my preferred version control system these days.
[22:46] <Laney> heh
[22:46] <tedg> ali1234, Eh, okay.  Getting bogged down in non-code stuff, but I very much have fixing that on the TODO list.
[22:47] <ali1234> tedg: we really need the fix for xubuntu, because we want to land gtk3 indicators this cycle, and currently our testers cannot test it
[22:47] <ochosi> +1
[22:48] <xnox> ali1234: is there something you need sponsoring?
[22:48] <xnox> ali1234: i am also indicator developer.
[22:48] <tedg> ali1234, I understand, sorry to take this long on it.
[22:49] <ali1234> xnox: i have a MR that goes on top of the existing upstart indicator work
[22:49] <xnox> ali1234: link?
[22:49] <ali1234> https://code.launchpad.net/~a-j-buxton/libindicator/remove-timeout/+merge/198070
[22:50] <tedg> xnox, It's basically finishing the session service transition for indicators.
[22:50] <tedg> We can't land that until I get all the indicators cleaned up.
[22:51] <ochosi> tedg: how many are missing atm?
[22:51] <tedg> ochosi, messaging is the big one, but I think some of the others aren't right.  They're not using the Upstart XDG dirs, so they're kinda flaky.
[22:51] <xnox> tedg: chicken and egg, eh? can't have both no-trigger-activation and auto-shutdown.
[22:52] <ali1234> xnox: exactly, it causes a race condition
[22:52] <tedg> It's really more about ditching all the process management code in libindicator, it fights with whoever *should* be managing the process.
[22:52] <xnox> tedg: or do we have a lifecycle manager to start us up?
[22:52] <xnox> (on the phone that is)
[22:53] <tedg> On the phone Upstart does the session management.
[22:53] <tedg> Or, management of the session.
[22:53] <tedg> Technically "session management" is done by unity-mir.
[22:53] <tedg> Wow, I'm not really sure I cleared anything up there.
[22:58] <ochosi> tedg: hm, is there an ETA/deadline for the indicator work to be finished?
[22:58] <Laney> feature freeze is in 10 days :-)
[22:58] <tedg> ochosi, I think the... yes, what Laney said :-)
[22:59] <ali1234> yeah but since you already cunningly half-pushed the changes, technically FF does not apply :)
[23:00] <ochosi> well, does it apply to xubuntu then if we push the gtk3-indicator-related stuff after FF?
[23:00] <ali1234> yes
[23:01] <ali1234> this is the exact same situation that caused them not to get landed last cycle
[23:01] <Laney> sure it does, the rest of the changes are still features
[23:01] <Laney> it'd be polite to give flavours time to get their ducks in a row before feature freeze too ...
[23:01] <ali1234> +1
[23:02]  * ochosi admits he was asking rhetorically, trying to make a point
[23:02] <Laney> to the bed-mobile!
[23:02] <ochosi> well i guess we should half-cunningly push our changes then
[23:02] <ali1234> yeah
[23:03] <ali1234> well it would help if upstream would do a release too
[23:03] <ochosi> yeah, i sent an email about that a few days ago (still waiting for a reply)
[23:04] <ochosi> don't think we have any more time to wait
[23:08] <ali1234> ochosi: worst case we can always stuff the workaround variable somewhere in the xfce environment