[00:00] behold, trusty's new greeter looks: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-2014-02-11-005943.php [00:01] note, the ugly lego person not included by default [00:01] * knome hides [00:01] yeah, that's your loss though! [00:32] fancy [00:32] btw, documentation is not very fun [00:32] sorry slickymaster and jjfrv8 for making you do so much :) [00:33] np, bluesabre [00:33] bluesabre, depends... ;) [00:37] bluesabre+1 [00:39] so, once I populate this with more than old screenshots and lorem ipsum, it should be sufficient, slickymaster? http://wiki.smdavis.us/doku.php?id=menulibre_usage [00:44] lol bluesabre, wasn't that the parole docs? [00:44] quick copy+paste job :) [00:44] and adding the dos structure [00:44] *docs [00:44] but yeah, I think that we'll be able to work with it [00:44] k [00:45] I'll try to wrap that up tonight [00:45] thanks for that bluesabre [00:45] jjfrv8: ^^^ [00:45] sure thing [00:45] just got here and saw it. thanks. [00:46] jjfrv8: Hello! [00:46] hey, jjfrv8 my proposal for the xfdestop of the settings-preferences chapter: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6911856/ [00:46] ping me after you see it [00:46] hey, Unit193 [00:46] slickymaster, will take a look here in a sec [00:46] if you're ok with it, I'll make a MP [00:47] okie dokie [00:48] bluesabre, will the MenuLibre docs have to be flavor-agnostic, unlike the xfce stuff we've done up til now? [00:48] or maybe not agnostic actually but show things like how it works with Unity? [00:49] does it even work with unity? [00:49] in his screencast on his website, the older version did [00:49] jjfrv8: I'll add screenshots for each DE and a section on that support [00:49] ali1234: unity, xfce, gnome, lxde, cimmamon, mate [00:49] kde? [00:49] never tried [00:50] * bluesabre is not a fan of qt/kde [00:50] it should do, they have a menu and it uses xdg [00:50] but theoretically it should [00:50] it's based on alacarte's code [00:50] but, it works [00:50] :) [00:51] I should check that out at some point [00:51] :) [00:52] though I think kde has their own menu editor [01:05] I'm off [01:05] hf slickymaster [01:05] slickymaster, sorry, I know it's late for you. I should have my comments ready for you tomorrow [01:05] jjfrv8: I'll catch up on your feedback on the logs, later on [01:05] cy guys tomorrow [01:05] -> [01:06] jjfrv8: So do you want me to set -R jjfrv8 on every MP? :P [01:06] will I know any more about them than the first one? [01:07] Hah, there's a chance. Just thinking generally. [01:07] sure, why not. I might even learn something. [01:07] (Not from me! :P ) [01:07] :) [01:35] knome: thanks - missed that [01:36] elfy, what? :) [01:36] :) [01:42] section 1/3 complete: http://wiki.smdavis.us/doku.php?id=menulibre_usage [01:42] *phew* [01:42] bluesabre, ooh ooh [02:08] off, see you all later [02:18] ochosi: no way to do anything other than log back in when logged out presently - all the menu's have gone [02:41] slickymaster, my comments/suggestions at http://paste.ubuntu.com/6912644/ The line numbers refer to those in your original paste. [03:06] foresktpiskie: edit lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf, comment out show-indicators [03:06] i.e. [03:06] #show-indicators= [03:23] hmm my mainline kernel updater installed the low-latency kernel :/ not sure if good or bad [04:52] ochosi, pong [04:52] There's too much scrollback for me to read that, plus i have cadets in two hours [07:44] bluesabre: thanks [07:44] ochosi: the user box in the login screen is half black/half white here :) [08:09] forestpiskie: yes i know, xubuntu-default-settings are currently lacking [08:10] forestpiskie: the other thing is that a greybird update hasn't landed yet [08:10] ok - just shouting out when I see stuff :) [08:10] i pushed it already yesterday, but you'll have to wait for them to land [08:10] sure [08:10] i appreciate it [08:11] it's really really annoying that we can't even push to x-d-s, so merge-requests are just hanging out there [08:12] I can understand that - is the change to lightlocker from xscreensaver waiting for the same thing? I assume so [08:14] yeah, it's similar [08:14] i mean someone would still have to upload changes, but without even having them in our bzr branches, who would upload them... [08:15] :) [08:15] what is x-d-s? [08:15] xubuntu default settings [08:16] I saw that micahg was actioned to push Noskcaj's dmb membership to e-mail voting yesterday [08:17] aha [08:17] did anything happen there? [08:17] only that it was pushed to e-mial vote [08:17] * elfy apparently got subscribed to a whole bunch of stuff as a byproduct of being in the CC [08:18] much scratching of head ensued ... [08:18] :) [08:21] ochosi: aaand - login box is now white and offwhite - so I guess that's the greybird update [08:21] No more black. :( [08:24] no more black [08:24] #useful - can see things without glasses again :p [08:46] good to hear [08:50] Does Xubuntu have both xubuntu and xfce sessions? And if not, how do you go about removing the xfce session? [08:50] it does [08:51] ok. thanks [08:55] it has both sessions but there are no obvious differences between them last time i tried [08:57] i think less stuff is started by default in xfce, and settings are more upstreamy [08:57] e.g. menu-file [09:35] ochosi: when you know that xscreensaver and light-locker are sorted in the seed could you remind me - I'll need to sync the test tracker for it [09:37] elfy: ok, will do [09:37] but generally, i don't know who will update the seed (i guess micahg ?) [09:37] there should be merge-requests ready [09:37] if not, they'd be easy enough to do [09:39] yea understood - I'm completely at sea tbh - I generally only notice when I go and physically look, unless I remember to check changelogs - and it's usually updating during the first cuppa ;) [09:39] ochosi: There are. [09:41] Unit193: thanks [09:46] morning all [09:48] morning [09:48] morning ac [09:48] ochosi: [09:54] hi slickymaster-job [09:56] hey elfy, good morning [10:18] ochosi: can you confirm me whether the Xfdesktop -docs will be migrated to docs.xfce.org/ before docfreeze? [10:37] jjfrv8: didn't knew about that convention. In the Mugshot section I just used &mugshot; so I'm going to reflect the convention also there so it will be corrected. [10:37] jjfrv8: As for the other suggestions, I think you're right and I've made the necessary changes accordingly [10:48] slickymaster-job: when is doc-freeze again? [10:49] ochosi: March, 20th [10:50] ochosi: I'm asking because, presently we have its section in the Xub -docs yet linking to bluesabre's wiki [10:54] yeah, i thought you were asking because of that [10:54] i'll see to it that it gets there in time [10:54] i've already thought of two ways, 1) being the versioned docs, 2) being updating what's there now [10:55] and i asked eric and he's fine with it [10:55] so basically i'll wait for the versioned docs a little longer and in case that doesn't happen in time, we can land them in the mixed mode [10:55] (i.e. reflecting 4.8-4.12) [10:57] ok, let us wait then [11:00] well, i suggest you change the ref in the xubuntu-docs to xfce.org already now [11:00] that way we're not dependant on anything [11:01] (i have edit-rights on docs.xfce.org to the worst) [11:02] with dependant i mean: dependant on freezes or anything [11:02] as long as docs.xfce gets an update before our release, it's fine if our docs point there [11:02] ok, I'm going to do a MP by lunch time and I'll include that correction in it also [11:02] great [11:03] if you're tracking the docs-process somehow, feel free to put in a workitem for you or me that says "check whether docs.xfce already holds info on xfdesktop4.11" [11:03] thanks for the heads up, ochosi [11:03] that way we can keep an overview [11:03] no problemo [11:04] just a last thing ochosi, the link will still be http://docs.xfce.org/xfce/xfdesktop/start, right? [11:04] yes, ideally it will [11:04] ok, I'll use that one [11:04] thing is, with versioned docs it might be xfdesktop/4.12/start [11:04] but we'll see about that [11:05] point to the master-page now [11:06] okie dokie, I'll use http://docs.xfce.org/xfce/xfdesktop/start for now, and if needed it will be corrected [11:06] yup [11:07] (or we add a notice on that start page that there are docs for multiple versions) [11:07] if it gets to that, it's a good solution [11:35] ochosi: added that in https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-t-docs [12:22] bluesabre, Unit193 could you prepare a new xubuntu-docs upload? [12:22] knome: Translations? [12:22] would really like to get all the new stuff in the branch in in trusty now [12:22] Unit193, with or without translations, maybe latter would be better if it's doable [12:22] Pending review? [12:22] Ah, then perhaps don't merge that yet. [12:23] would be good to get them in relatively soon [12:23] knome: could you poke micahg to get some traction on the merge requests? [12:23] +1 [12:24] FF is approaching... [12:24] bluesabre, i have [12:24] k, thanks :) [12:24] micahg, ping [12:24] [knome] Find out how to ship translated documentation: DONE Oh? [12:25] Unit193, well, your work item [12:25] Unit193, basically, we know how (one way) to ship them [12:25] and i'm fine with that [12:25] Well, it's quite static, build time too. :/ [12:25] that's better than no translations for trusty [12:26] we can improve it later [12:27] OK. [12:27] or do you have an idea how to pull out a developer from nowhere along with more time for micahg? [12:28] it's not too late to improve them this cycle [12:28] * Unit193 is no dev. :D [12:28] well that's why i was asking whether you knew how to get one to appear from nowhere :P [12:29] if we could summon mrpouit, he can also handle mergey stuff [12:29] but seriously... just shipping translations in any way is a huge improvement from the situation in 12.04 when released (outdated docs with no translations) [12:29] if the build time is slow, who cares? [12:30] we don't have dozens of languages anyway [12:31] Build time = updated at build time. [12:32] hmm well, [12:32] we could drop that [12:32] I'd like ru finished, and es at >80, but meh. [12:32] and just make sure we've updated before. [12:32] No, there is no updated at build time, that's my point. :P [12:32] aha [12:32] Anywho, got a mockup? [12:33] for what? [12:33] the languages frontpage? [12:33] Yeah. [12:33] btw, are we translating the startpage? [12:33] no? [12:33] the languages landing page needs to be similar to that [12:34] do we want to translate those? [12:34] do you know how to add a similar page? [12:34] As far as I know, no, there is no translation of the startpage. [12:34] considering the user picks a translation there... [12:34] maybe it isn't sane to translate it [12:34] unless we can get automatic language probing. [12:37] was thinking we could try to use some JS, but looks like there isn't really a clean way to get even browsers language preferences? [12:37] -? [12:38] I wouldn't. [12:38] and i wonder if those are even updated when using another language in ubuntu, probably not [12:38] point being, if you don't have JS, then you'll get the english version [12:39] if you do, and non-english language that exist is identified, you'd get redirected to the language version [12:39] Landing page English, Language names in those Languages. Can depend on that the most really. [12:40] you think we should add those in the main about page, or another? [12:40] was thinking it could be a list in the main page as well [12:40] maybe not one per line, but a long listing at the bottom [12:40] http://unit193.net/xubuntu/ <---- that page. [12:41] that's a bit meh [12:41] (Not like how I have it.) [12:41] blah [12:41] maybe we should review that page altogether [12:41] Don't like it on that one? Where else? [12:41] reworked. [12:42] we should probably drop the introduction paragraph. [12:42] at least the "the ubuntu project..." [12:42] then maybe add a new heading for "xubuntu documentation" [12:43] and rename "get help & support" to "other support methods" or sth. [12:43] and rethink the "report bugs" [12:43] maybe we could be a bit more verbose on the "get involved" section [12:43] and drop the "report bugs" bullet point [12:43] i'll come up with a new draft for that today. [13:37] knome: if you'd be so kind: https://code.launchpad.net/~slickymaster/xubuntu-docs/xubuntu-docs/+merge/205771 [13:57] slickymaster, done [14:00] ok, knome [14:00] thanks [14:00] no problem [14:01] slickymaster, now go update the blueprint;) [14:01] i'll do it when i get back to work [14:01] have been cleaning them up again, already looks better: http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-t/group/topic-t-flavor-xubuntu.html [14:01] well i can do that now, i have the page open [14:01] having lunch as i type [14:01] done [14:02] appreciate it [14:02] tk :) [14:03] heh, np [14:03] rather update the blueprints than do all the work items ;) [14:03] no doubts about that ;) [14:04] ochosi, bluesabre: bug 1277149 ? [14:04] bug 1277149 in thunar (Ubuntu) "Thunar's "set as wallpaper" plugin doesn't work anymore with xfdesktop4.11" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1277149 [14:05] ochosi, bluesabre: [xubuntu-dev] Look into creating a GUI for light-locker settings (or integrate into xfce4-powermanager): TODO ? [15:36] knome: what about that bug, there's already a branch by Noskcaj [15:36] and yeah, not sure what will happen wrt light-locker UI [15:36] ochosi, okay, is it being tested? [15:36] by whom? [15:36] anybody? [15:36] not sure? [15:36] :) [15:37] bbl [18:01] ochosi: do we have to backport all the xfdesktop fixes/changes? [18:04] currently I only report upstream and hope that a new possible release will land in trusty eventually [18:07] bbl -> [18:20] brainwash: if there's a bugfix-only release, we can get that in after FF [18:20] if there are no features, then we can't, that's the easy rule [18:20] asking for exceptions is possible, but tedious [18:21] is adjusting the icon size/spacing a bug fix? :) [18:22] the new release will be a mix of bug fixes and small new features I guess :/ [18:25] ochosi: can you confirm https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10685 ? [18:25] bugzilla.xfce.org bug 10685 in General "wallpaper thumbnails are missing sometimes" [Minor,New] [18:25] or is your SSD too fast? [19:25] brainwash: yeah, i think i see that as well [19:47] ochosi, you pinged? [22:06] Noskcaj-school: yeah, i just wanted to inform you about the gtk3 indicators/panel status [22:06] what i pinged you about came after the ping [22:06] * Noskcaj-school searches for logs [22:08] Noskcaj-school: head-line: we should try to get our stuff independently of whether ubuntu manages to fix the indicators before FF [22:08] because they can also fix them afterwards (and probably will) [22:08] and we can do the same, if a panel-release happens after FF [22:08] and i vaguely remember you mentioned preparing them for uploading soonish [22:09] ok, i'll get some git snapshots working on when i get home [22:09] great! [22:10] we also need a new xfce4-indicator-plugin release [22:10] yeah, but that's pending on the panel-release [22:11] so git-snapshot for both now [22:11] and update them to release as soon as possible [22:11] can you confirm https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10658 ? [22:11] bugzilla.xfce.org bug 10658 in Panel "GTK3 indicator area background turns transparent/black occasionally" [Normal,New] [22:11] not that important anymore, because you intend to make the panel transparent (80%) [22:12] so this glitch won't occur [22:12] yeah, but still, it should be fixed [22:12] and your patch looks valid at first glance [22:12] that would be great [22:12] Sure it will, just might not notice as much. Also non-default config. [22:13] and i can reproduce it [22:13] Yep. [22:13] andrzejr: could you take a look at this bug and the patch attached? https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10658 [22:13] bugzilla.xfce.org bug 10658 in Panel "GTK3 indicator area background turns transparent/black occasionally" [Normal,New] [22:13] I guess that eric should have a look and fix it [22:13] eric has no push-rights to the panel [22:13] so he could only prepare a patch [22:14] yes, but he provided the transparency fix initially [22:14] but since you did that already, it's better to ask someone who has push-rights to the panel [22:15] I'll add Andrzej to the cc list then [22:16] better fix the stuff now and don't bother with it later before or even after release [22:20] ochosi: no bold font for the icon labels anymore, correct? [22:20] brainwash: you mean in the panel? [22:20] and if so, where exactly? [22:21] nono, xfdesktop [22:21] font is normal now, was bold before [22:24] yeah, murrine's shadow setting is broken, so xfdesktop's is used instead [22:24] can't draw a shadow around the whole character anymore [22:24] and that turned out more readable, end of story [22:24] ok [22:34] knome: re: the patch for thunar, it was written by xfdesktop's maintainer, so i'd presume it works fine [22:34] and it's fairly clear why the current plugin can't work and what has to be done [22:34] so a rather straight-forward thingy [22:35] ochosi, sure, thanks [22:37] Hi, can anyone tell me the status of time-admin and users-admin in Xubuntu trusty? I can't find them in alpha2. "Does Anybody Really Know What Time It Is?" --Chicago - [22:39] dockelley: how can you not find them? [22:39] they're in the settings-manager here (also on trusty, daily though) [22:39] dockelley: gnome-system-tools got fixed, you should download and apply the latest updates [22:39] they might have been not around for alpha 2, there was some failed packaging magic... [22:45] Thanks so much. That installed them. Now I can know who and when I am! [22:50] hey, if gst finally got fixed, bug 1185396 can also finally be solved [22:50] bug 1185396 in gnome-system-tools (Ubuntu) "users-admin crashed with SIGSEGV in gst_user_profiles_get_for_user()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1185396 [22:52] and bug 1016932 [22:53] bug 1016932 in gnome-system-tools (Ubuntu) "Setting user as administrator doesn't give him sudoing rights" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1016932 [22:53] too bad it's not maintained properly anymore [22:55] yeah, but apparently gst still has a maintainer at debian [22:57] ..who did not comment on your debian report yet :( [22:57] will the normal user even notice this segfault? [22:58] apport gets deactivated on release [22:58] you're right brainwash not even taht he has been able to do so far [22:58] IMO, no. [22:59] maybe the MATE guys fixed it in their fork mate-system-tools [23:00] I'll take a look at their changelog [23:00] it would be great if they did [23:02] but.. does it still segfault? I did confirm that it does on trusty back in december [23:03] and apport is enabled since alpha 1 or? [23:03] xnox: ping [23:14] xnox: since you offered your help once in case we were in need of an uploader, this would be a package waiting for upload: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1279113 [23:14] Launchpad bug 1279113 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] xubuntu-community-artwork" [Undecided,New] [23:18] I think xnox is a debian maintainer [23:19] Both. [23:21] bluesabre: am a Debian Developer and Ubuntu Core Dev. [23:21] super cow powers [23:21] :) [23:22] indeed :) [23:22] awesome [23:22] xnox: does that mean you get two copies of every valve game? [23:22] :D [23:22] bluesabre, no, it means he gets double bug mail [23:23] and he hangs around us [23:23] poor xnox [23:23] maybe he's a bug mail collector [23:23] bugistelia [23:26] Hi! [23:26] !hello [23:26] Hi!, Welcome to #xubuntu-devel! Feel free to ask questions and help people out. The channel guidelines are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines. Enjoy your stay! [23:27] I'm an Archlinux user that simply loves Xfce and the work you did with Xubuntu. [23:27] * knome bows [23:27] ouch! the forehead hit the table! [23:28] I'm trying to use some of yours indicator on Arch, but it seems I've got some problems... [23:28] Is the AUR pulling from bzr or a released version? What's wrong? [23:28] ... and have you read this? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Saucy/Gtk3Indicators [23:29] (and the other one at s/Saucy/Trusty/) [23:29] I can add the indicator plugin to the panel, but even if I install an indicator, it won't appear there. [23:29] Mmm... So basically all my packages are outdated? [23:29] 12 Unity-for-Arch/indicator-sound 12.10.2daily13.11.25-101 (unity) [installed] 15 Unity-for-Arch/libdbusmenu-glib 12.10.3daily13.11.25-100 (unity) [installed] 16 Unity-for-Arch/libdbusmenu-gtk2 12.10.3daily13.11.25-100 (unity) [installed] 17 Unity-for-Arch/libdbusmenu-gtk3 12.10.3daily13.11.25-100 (unity) [installed: 12.10.2-3] 19 Unity-for-Arch/libindicator 12.10.2daily14.01.29-100 (unity) [installed] 29 Unity-for-Arch-Extra/x [23:30] ArchXfce: What about xfce4-panel? Needs to be from git and compiled with the gtk3 wrapper. [23:30] that's one way to look at it [23:30] or you use the gtk2 indicators only [23:30] (the ones that work are -sound and -application) [23:31] Unit193: thanks, but I prefer (if I can make it work) the solution proposed by ochosi. The problem is, I've got indicator-sound installed, but it won't show up and I don't know how to get some information on what's wrong. [23:32] Is there a way to launch it from the terminal to see what I'm missing? [23:32] I see, then you will need the indicator-sound-gtk2 package, and you get get more output if you run the panel from the terminal. [23:34] Unit193: thanks, but I see that I need gtk2-ubuntu package to make it work. I think I'll do it tomorrow. [23:34] good luck then [23:34] ArchXfce, remember... if everything fails, you can always install xubuntu [23:34] Just a question: if I want to do it exactly *the Xubuntu way* should I compile the gtk3 version? [23:34] ochosi: What was the last xfce4-indicator-plugin to work with gtk2? [23:34] 1.0 iirc [23:35] from 2.0 it supported gtk3 only [23:35] knome: I already use Xubuntu at work, at home I prefer something more *fun* :D [23:35] ArchXfce, building packages is fun? [23:35] * knome makes note not to attend ArchXfce's "parties" ;) [23:37] knome: building packages, trying to do exotic things like *steal* other DE component... I like those things :D [23:37] daily packages of the indicator-plugin can be found here btw: https://code.launchpad.net/~landronimirc/+archive/xfce-daily [23:38] lderan: peng! [23:38] ArchXfce, have fun with that :) [23:39] ArchXfce: you need very up to date indicator libraries for it to work [23:39] ochosi, hello [23:39] Ok, let's consider this a challenge, I'll try to do my best [23:39] lderan: disclaimer: knome set me up to this! [23:39] Thanks *A LOT* for the informations! [23:39] lderan: soo, he mentioned that you might be up to writing a small settings UI in python..? [23:39] hah! [23:40] ochosi, sounds interesting [23:40] Have a nice day/night, bye! [23:40] lderan: we've been thinking about doing one for light-locker [23:41] ah i see cool [23:41] Unit193: wanna subscribe the sponsors to the wallpaper-pkg bug? [23:42] lderan: there are not many settings to implement, but the crucial thing is that we don't store the settings anywhere currently [23:42] Kind of want a pointer on how to upload one that has (LP: 923487) without changing the version that'll be in Ubuntu. :P [23:42] Launchpad bug 982421 in Me TV "duplicate for #923487 "epg_event row replaced for id" is causing high usage of harddrive" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/982421 [23:43] lderan: so we might have to work around that somehow, should be still possible as a xubuntu-only solution for now though [23:44] ochosi, i would be up for that :D [23:44] lderan: cool, mind if i PM you about that instead of flooding this chan? [23:45] sure