[00:31] <skellat> Unit193: PING
[00:31] <Unit193> skellat: Well howdy.
[00:31] <belkinsa> OMG...hey there.
[00:32] <belkinsa> Guest25821 is james.
[00:32] <skellat> Ah, good.
[00:32] <belkinsa> And I'm free to talk.
[00:32] <skellat> What is the state of the state?
[00:33] <belkinsa> It seems to be calm, no issues.  We had some folks come in that wanted to join but they seem to be gone now.
[00:33] <skellat> :-(
[00:34] <belkinsa> And we talked about the CD's for OLF  in the list but not the meeting planned.
[00:34] <skellat> To which you've got my long e-mail from last night
[00:34] <belkinsa> No, sorry.
[00:35] <skellat> Let us just say that too many LoCo groups have been silent but as soon as you mention freebies they suddenly perk up
[00:35] <belkinsa> Oh, the CD one.
[00:35] <belkinsa> Then yes.
[00:35] <skellat> And run smack into a brick wall as they've ignored LoCo Council about verification
[00:36] <skellat> I still have 12.04 discs laying around that I inherited from my predecessors
[00:36] <skellat> If we request discs...I don't want them laying around
[00:36] <belkinsa> Yes, that's an issue.
[00:37] <skellat> Whatever plans can be hatched, I'll be looking forward to looking them over
[00:37] <skellat> But we gotta have a plan
[00:37] <Unit193> I think we need to ease off the push on the CoC a tad. :/
[00:38] <skellat> Unit193: That I'll be thinking about heavily.
[00:39] <skellat> The LoCo Council's "Roman Census" found out a whole bunch of things.  We only made one Interim Report and never released our final conclusions.
[00:39] <Unit193> Right now, it seems like "You can't idle in this channel if you don't have an LP page with it!", and I think that's strong, and sure as heck not how I did it.
[00:39] <skellat> Unit193: And that's not the intent either
[00:39] <skellat> You're empowered to disabuse people of that notion, you know
[00:42] <skellat> One of the cases that threw red-flags at LoCo Council recently actually neared that issue
[00:42] <skellat> A nation-state sized community had 30 members on LP and claimed over 1k through other means
[00:43] <skellat> I think it was the Belgians
[00:45] <skellat> We ended up having the question raised internally as to how do we define "community" in terms of any central nexus points as we know that some communities such as our friends in Thailand use plenty of non-canonical non-Canonical resources too
[00:45] <skellat> We just don't know yet
[00:46] <skellat> LoCo Council's views on things are drifting a little from Canonical Community Team's view on things
[00:47] <skellat> Plus we also are in the process of collapsing a group of five sub-national teams to form a single team representing all of the Kingdom of Spain at the moment too
[00:47] <Unit193> The community is permitted to disagree with what Canonical wants the community to think?
[00:48] <skellat> Unit193: As in we freely yell at Jono?
[00:48] <Unit193> Could almost split the US into 3 sections and be done with it, but not quite.
[00:49] <skellat> Unit193: *snort* Well, something akin to that has been discussed
[00:49] <Unit193> But, I think I like my Ohio (And -tn) people pretty well, larger channels wouldn't be as preferred.
[00:50] <skellat> Unit193: Well, LoCo Council owns 2 of the state LoCo groups in the US because they collapsed (Nevada and Massachusetts) already
[00:51] <skellat> We want to transition away from that
[00:51] <Unit193> Ah, yeah.
[00:52] <skellat> The overall nature of the "Roman Census" when we went through it showed that we had barely a 1 in 3 response rate from LoCo groups across Earth.  Too many responses that we did get back from US groups were that they existed on paper alone.
[00:52] <skellat> Ohio, California, Colorado, Pennsylvania, to a lesser extent Michigan...we've got a decent presence
[00:53] <skellat> And that's about it
[00:53] <skellat> Across Europe we saw LoCos in fairly decent shape
[00:54] <belkinsa> Time is the issue, right, of most the members?
[00:54] <skellat> Many cases
[00:54] <belkinsa> And the lack of getting new active members?
[00:54] <skellat> Colorado actually took personal intervention on my part to get somebody to finally take over and stand up as a responsive Point of Contact finally
[00:55] <skellat> As to the lack of getting new active members, I defer to the book "Bowling Alone" as it relates to a sociological shift we've seen in US society that doesn't show up the same way in Europe
[00:56] <skellat> http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/43599073
[00:56] <jenni> [ Bowling alone : the collapse and revival of American community (Book, 2000) [WorldCat.org] ] - https://j.mp/OsLpLV
[00:58] <skellat> The lack of getting new active members is mostly unique to the US.  From the LoCo Council's planetary perspective, it isn't a trend we're seeing in the bulk of planetary population of which the US makes up only 5%.  The US may be the loudest but the issues are different elsewhere on the globe.
[00:59] <belkinsa> I see.
[01:02] <skellat> Brazil, for example, is among a group of South American country groups that are having no trouble with members
[01:07] <skellat> In our particular corner of this planet we share, though, we have to think through some things
[01:07] <skellat> The current sociocultural trend is toward "slacker activism" where someone is far more likely to retweet something than actually go to a protest rally in this day & age
[01:08] <belkinsa> I agree and maybe a global LoCo meeting is needed?
[01:08] <skellat> (Notwithstanding that ridiculously loud rally in support of Ukraine on the steps of Cleveland City Hall I could hear plainly at my desk a couple weeks ago)
[01:08] <skellat> belkinsa: As for a global meeting, I'm not sure
[01:09] <skellat> One thing that's been talked about in council is that Canonical Community Team is an *engineering* group while LoCo Council deals with social issues
[01:09]  * paultag smirks
[01:09] <skellat> The council takes into accounts matters like Thailand being in the middle of long-running unrest akin to what Ukraine is experiencing right now
[01:09] <belkinsa> That sounds about right since they try to get Ubuntu going the way it should as OS.
[01:10] <skellat> CCT has different priorities
[01:10] <skellat> paultag: Ears burning?
[01:10] <skellat> :-)
[01:10] <paultag> PTSD :)
[01:10] <Unit193> I just sit here normally to mess with paultag, or ping him about crap.
[01:10] <belkinsa> I know.  Is this why the community wants someone that works with them for community reasons and such?
[01:11] <Unit193> paultag: Speaking of crap, got another language for my weather script (supports translations.)
[01:11] <skellat> belkinsa: You got it!
[01:11] <belkinsa> Isn't that Jono's job or not?
[01:12] <paultag> Unit193: awesome
[01:13] <skellat> belkinsa: Jono's job is kinda murky.  From LoCo Council's perspective, we've had to discuss with teams in the last 12 months issues like import/export compliance for getting disc distribution (Morocco), how to address issues for a group that lost its own server due to civil unrest that continue (Thailand), and how to getting various ethnic groupings to come together as one national team (Spain).
[01:13] <belkinsa> I see.
[01:13] <skellat> Nobody from CCT has administrator access for administering LoCo Teams now.  We removed that as a bit of confusion that existed previously.
[01:14] <Unit193> cryptsetup is on the disk, wonder if that hinders stuff. :P
[01:18] <skellat> belkinsa: As you've been aware, I've been hamstrung since I am a federal civil servant who is in probationary career-conditional status in a "seasonal" position subject to furlough.  We just had the first round of furloughs issued at work where some folks on an 89 day detail we told in the middle of day 59 to turn in their badges and not come back to work until further notice.  The guessing game has started as to when I'll be furloughed and wh
[01:19] <skellat> s/we told/were told/
[01:19] <jenni> skellat meant to say: belkinsa: As you've been aware, I've been hamstrung since I am a federal civil servant who is in probationary career-conditional status in a "seasonal" position subject to furlough.  We just had the first round of furloughs issued at work where some folks on an 89 day detail were told in the middle of day 59 to turn in their badges and not come back to work until further notice.  The guessing game has started as to when I'll be 
[01:22] <skellat> belkinsa: Other members of LoCo Council have been bogged down too over the past few months
[01:22] <skellat> belkinsa: Things are picking up, though
[01:22] <belkinsa> I understand.  Do you guys need help with anything?
[01:22]  * Unit193 likes to bother jose.
[01:24] <skellat> belkinsa: Nothing really to help with at this point except hunting people down.  I just flipped the flag to "Incomplete" on 6 verification cases as communities like Florida and New Zealand haven't replied to us in 3 months.
[01:28] <skellat> The best thing to do is keep on keeping on.  Other members of LoCo Council hold the three of you up as examples to other communities as to what leadership and direction look like.
[01:28] <belkinsa> Alright, we shall do this.
[01:30] <skellat> The current bet is my badge gets taken away on April 16th
[01:31] <belkinsa> In a month, scary.
[01:31] <skellat> Though as the last team meeting put it...you have a schedule for next week...just look at things on a day by day basis & be glad we tried to schedule for the next week...
[01:32] <belkinsa> Any day of this week will work for me, any time too.
[01:32] <belkinsa> (spring break for me)
[01:32] <skellat> So since gambling is officially prohibited at work, nobody has laid any wagers as to when furlough will be.
[01:33] <skellat> I'm just glad I've got Monday off so I don't have to deal with NCAA basketball matches + the St. Patrick's Day parade in downtown Cleveland around the workplace
[01:35] <skellat> And now I have to disappear again
[01:35] <Unit193> Tschau!
[01:35] <belkinsa> See you later, skellat.  Hang in there.
[01:36] <belkinsa> And I will work out the doodle poll for the meeting.
[01:36] <belkinsa> Unit193, is that okay with you?
[01:37] <Unit193> Got a list of times Guest25821 can make it?
[01:37] <Unit193> (The idea is to have him there, right?)
[01:37] <belkinsa> No...good point.
[01:37] <belkinsa> And skellat too.
[20:34] <belkinsa> And now I get his long e-mail...stupid Thunderbird.
[22:28] <canthus13> don't blame the client. blame the mail server.