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| bdmurray | I'm ready for a meeting | 15:02 |
|---|---|---|
| caribou | me too | 15:03 |
| cjwatson | slangasek,barry,doko,jodh,stgraber,xnox: around? | 15:03 |
| * barry waves | 15:03 | |
| cjwatson | no infinity here | 15:03 |
| MooDoo | I'm just here, but I'll watch any way :D | 15:03 |
| jodh | o/ | 15:03 |
| doko | did we move it? | 15:04 |
| cjwatson | doko: I think google calendar did | 15:04 |
| cjwatson | doko: it's the weeks of confusion due to eu/us daylight savings desync | 15:04 |
| * stgraber waves | 15:04 | |
| doko | ahh, ok | 15:04 |
| barry | cjwatson: should i file a bug to remove dst from trusty? | 15:05 |
| cjwatson | barry: I'd like it removed from the planet, personally | 15:05 |
| barry | +1 | 15:05 |
| cjwatson | #startmeeting | 15:05 |
| meetingology | Meeting started Thu Mar 20 15:05:52 2014 UTC. The chair is cjwatson. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. | 15:05 |
| meetingology | Available commands: action commands idea info link nick | 15:05 |
| cjwatson | [TOPIC] Lightning round | 15:05 |
| === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Lightning round | ||
| xnox | cjwatson: hey! | 15:06 |
| caribou | cjwatson: I would like to go first if you don't mind | 15:06 |
| caribou | cjwatson: I will need to leave the meeting in ~20min | 15:06 |
| cjwatson | $ echo caribou $(shuf -e barry doko stgraber jodh bdmurray slangasek cjwatson xnox infinity) | 15:06 |
| cjwatson | caribou bdmurray xnox barry infinity slangasek stgraber doko cjwatson jodh | 15:06 |
| cjwatson | MooDoo: just a quick team standup, may not be very exciting I'm afraid :) | 15:07 |
| caribou | cjwatson: shall I proceed ? | 15:08 |
| cjwatson | yes, please do | 15:08 |
| caribou | weekly highlights | 15:08 |
| cjwatson | the above was the ordering | 15:08 |
| caribou | * Tested backport of kdump-tools to Precise | 15:08 |
| caribou | * Picked up some Work Items for updates to the Server Guide | 15:08 |
| caribou | - /etc/network/interfaces | 15:08 |
| caribou | - uvtool | 15:08 |
| caribou | * Worked on various charms issues | 15:08 |
| caribou | Done | 15:08 |
| bdmurray | working with dames regarding moving the error tracker to prodstack | 15:08 |
| bdmurray | worked on an apport branch to install specific package versions when retracing | 15:08 |
| bdmurray | updated integration-tests for the error tracker for testing prodstack | 15:08 |
| bdmurray | test of phased-updater with prodstack version of errors | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | attempted to get the error-tracker working with python-django 1.5 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | investigation into missing detailed stacktrace for a ubiquity crash (LP: #1267112) | 15:09 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1267112 in Daisy "errors indicates a retraced crash but isn't showing a stack trace" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1267112 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | pushed daisy code to log a traceback if setting up the retrace env fails | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | submitted RT to have daisy updated | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | manually retraced the crash provided by jibel for bug 1267112 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | sorted out why the ubiquity crashes are disappearing (bug 1267112) | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | tested submit.py changes in canonistack (looks good) | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | submitted merge proposal regarding python crash detection for daisy | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | resolved an issue with the phased updater not stopping phased-updates due to a traceback | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | uploaded a fix for ubuntu-release-upgrader bug 1071025 | 15:09 |
| ubottu | bug 1071025 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "do-release-upgrade allows both -d and -p switches although neither takes effect" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1071025 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | reported and fixed ubuntu-release-upgrader bug 1289580 to improve crash report consolidation | 15:09 |
| ubottu | bug 1289580 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu Saucy) "dist upgrade crash tracebacks include a tmpdir name" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1289580 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | overrode blocked phasing of ubuntu-release-upgrader (new crashes are seen because of how duplicates are consolidated) | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | reported ubuntu-release-upgrader bug 1289604 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | uploaded Saucy SRU for ubuntu-release-upgrader bugs 1289580 and bug 1289604 | 15:09 |
| ubottu | bug 1289604 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu Saucy) "ubuntu-release-upgrader doesn't depend on python-apport" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1289604 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | uploaded ubuntu-release-upgrader change to include DistUpgradeVersion from the release-upgrader tarball in the Package line of apport crashes | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | uploaded update-manager Precise SRU for bug 1289580 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | reported and fixed apt-clone bug 1290584 | 15:09 |
| ubottu | bug 1290584 in apt-clone (Ubuntu) "apt-clone restore should have a use my mirror option" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1290584 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | uploaded fix for update-notifier bug 1227000 | 15:09 |
| ubottu | bug 1227000 in The Ubuntu Power Consumption Project "update-notifier is polling every 5 seconds" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1227000 | 15:09 |
| bdmurray | uploaded update-manager fix for bug 1290825 | 15:09 |
| ubottu | bug 1290825 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Upgrade using do-release-upgrade takes a long time to start because 'iptables -L' runs with DNS lookups enabled" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1290825 | 15:10 |
| bdmurray | investigation into update-manager test failures | 15:10 |
| bdmurray | I could use some help with that last thing regarding update-manager test failures | 15:10 |
| bdmurray | And the error tracker should be moving to prodstack today! | 15:10 |
| cjwatson | finally | 15:10 |
| cjwatson | :-) | 15:10 |
| bdmurray | ⌁ done ⌁ | 15:11 |
| xnox | \o/ | 15:11 |
| xnox | * vUDS: | 15:11 |
| xnox | - participated in the discussions, following up from that | 15:11 |
| xnox | * python2 / ap transition: | 15:11 |
| xnox | - pending release of phablet-tools from silo | 15:11 |
| xnox | - pending release of gallery-app click | 15:11 |
| xnox | - pending release of calendar-app click | 15:11 |
| xnox | * x86-emulator: | 15:11 |
| xnox | - uploaded bionic i686 toolchain | 15:11 |
| xnox | - working on packaging changes in src:android to build x86 emulator images | 15:11 |
| xnox | * release: | 15:11 |
| xnox | - worked on reviewing download pages / messaging on those for 14.04 release date | 15:11 |
| xnox | * qt5.2 transition: | 15:11 |
| xnox | - helped unwinding / unblocking the transition and building arch-restricted packages | 15:11 |
| xnox | * probably other things I missed. | 15:12 |
| xnox | TODO: | 15:12 |
| xnox | * boost1.54 bugfix update | 15:12 |
| xnox | * mdadm transition finalisation | 15:12 |
| xnox | .. | 15:12 |
| xnox | I am away next week, snowboarding. | 15:12 |
| barry | phone: gallery_app pkg_resources branch. camera_app py3autopilot branch. ci-train for landing system-image 2.2. extensive testing. had meeting on qa for system updates and worked on the system-image test plan. | 15:12 |
| barry | debuntu: worked a bit on LP: #1220013 and LP: #1272359. LP: #1269898. sponsored nose 1.3.1-1. Python 3.4 and ensurepip. LP: #1295153. | 15:12 |
| barry | done | 15:12 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1220013 in python-apt (Ubuntu) "python-apt can SIGSEGV when encountering Packages stanzas with no Description field (was: update-apt-xapian-index crashed with SIGSEGV in File())" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1220013 | 15:12 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1272359 in aptdaemon (Ubuntu Trusty) "Test suite fails in all versions of Python" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1272359 | 15:12 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1269898 in oneconf (Ubuntu Trusty) "The use of __file__ causes the tests to fail in Python 3.4" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1269898 | 15:12 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1295153 in python3.3 (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Remove Python 3.3 from Trusty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1295153 | 15:12 |
| cjwatson | infinity and slangasek not here | 15:13 |
| cjwatson | stgraber: | 15:13 |
| stgraber | LXC: New CI infrastructure, code reviews, ... | 15:13 |
| stgraber | logind: Finished writing cgmanager integration patches, now blocked on the cgmanager MIR | 15:13 |
| stgraber | network: Working on a bunch of fixes for ifupdown/ifenslave. Fixed a small bug in isc-dhcp. | 15:13 |
| stgraber | system-image: Renamed all channels to ubuntu-touch/<channel> | 15:13 |
| stgraber | other: reviewd OFED packages, vUDS, travel plans for Malta, couple of CI-Train landings | 15:13 |
| stgraber | (DONE) | 15:13 |
| doko | - came back from vacation without computer, wading through email ... | 15:14 |
| doko | - intend to work on ftbfs, toolchain updates, python3.4, python3.3 removal, and on the fallout of the two test rebuilds | 15:14 |
| doko | (done) | 15:14 |
| cjwatson | python3.3 removal sounds promising | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | Last week: vUDS; landed libclick, followed by another landing to add interfaces for getting manifests and frameworks; worked on porting various bits of the phone stack to libclick for performance (1.4 seconds shaved off app startup, waiting to land). | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | Architecture porting assistance for the Qt 5.2 landing and fallout. Bits of this continue. | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | Landed new ubuntu-sdk-14.04-*-dev1 click frameworks. | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | Landed a slew of "click chroot" improvements, so both 13.10 and 14.04 chroots should work now. | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | Working on getting ubuntu-sdk-libs-dev:armhf installable on other architectures. Currently blocked on https://code.launchpad.net/~cjwatson/dee/multiarch/+merge/211463 and https://code.launchpad.net/~cjwatson/libaccounts-glib/multiarch/+merge/211468. | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | Helping jodh out with upstart async-spawn work. | 15:15 |
| cjwatson | .. | 15:15 |
| jodh | * vUDS. | 15:15 |
| jodh | * foundations-1305-upstart-work-items: Working with cjwatson on async | 15:15 |
| jodh | issues. | 15:16 |
| jodh | * other: Initial reviewed of plymouth MP for xnox (still need to re-review). | 15:16 |
| jodh | ⤤ | 15:16 |
| cjwatson | [TOPIC] AOB | 15:16 |
| === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: AOB | ||
| cjwatson | anything else people have for today? | 15:16 |
| bdmurray | I'd appreciate it if someone else could have a look at t the update-manager test failures | 15:17 |
| cjwatson | ok, just current trunk? | 15:17 |
| cjwatson | been a while since I looked at u-m | 15:17 |
| bdmurray | yeah, its been failing since february it seems | 15:17 |
| barry | bdmurray: is there a bug? | 15:17 |
| bdmurray | barry: I don't think so | 15:18 |
| barry | bdmurray: okay | 15:18 |
| cjwatson | bdmurray: erm, remind me how to run the tests? | 15:18 |
| bdmurray | xvfb-run nosetests3 --tests tests/test_update_list.py | 15:19 |
| * barry grabs the branch | 15:19 | |
| cjwatson | oh, well if barry's keen ... :-) | 15:19 |
| bdmurray | nothing has changed in update-manager itself | 15:19 |
| barry | well, i'll take a look :) | 15:20 |
| cjwatson | might be worth trying with saucy's python-apt, that seems like a plausible candidate | 15:20 |
| barry | bdmurray: FAILED (errors=1, failures=5) | 15:20 |
| barry | is that what you see? | 15:20 |
| bdmurray | I did try it with python-apt 0.9.1ubuntu1 and it still failed | 15:21 |
| bdmurray | barry: yes | 15:21 |
| barry | cool. i'll poke at it more after lunch | 15:22 |
| bdmurray | xnox: you said you'd updated app-install-data? | 15:22 |
| bdmurray | barry: thanks! | 15:22 |
| xnox | bdmurray: yes, I did. | 15:22 |
| xnox | bdmurray: i didn't update "command-not-found" and I'm not sure how that is generated. | 15:22 |
| xnox | should I contact mvo about that? | 15:22 |
| xnox | bdmurray: well the data used by command-not-found. | 15:22 |
| bdmurray | xnox: I think so, but I'll check my notes too. | 15:23 |
| xnox | bdmurray: well, it's before my time. And there was nothing substantial on the wiki.ubuntu.com (apart from original implementation blueprints / plannning) | 15:23 |
| barry | xnox: yes, i think you should contact mvo. iirc, it's rather tricky to update that data | 15:24 |
| cjwatson | xnox: mvo is back soon, so maybe it can wait a couple of weeks :) | 15:24 |
| bdmurray | http://bignay.canonical.com/~mvo/command-not-found/ | 15:24 |
| bdmurray | that has recent data | 15:24 |
| doko | cjwatson, start of April? | 15:25 |
| cjwatson | think so | 15:25 |
| xnox | bdmurray: oh, excellent! if that is still cron-running, i think i should be able to figure out how to update the package with data off there. | 15:26 |
| xnox | bdmurray: the generating new data is what I was after ;-) | 15:26 |
| bdmurray | xnox: pre-build.sh seems to call update-from-web.sh which gets data from there | 15:26 |
| cjwatson | ok, anything else? | 15:29 |
| xnox | bdmurray: right, i think i need to reconcile lp:command-not-found, lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/command-not-found/ubuntu, lp:ubuntu/command-not-found, do pre-build.sh, generate new upload and upload. And then it should be all good. I'll work on doing that. | 15:29 |
| bdmurray | xnox: thanks | 15:30 |
| cjwatson | right, I think we're done, further command-not-found discussion -> #ubuntu-devel :) | 15:31 |
| cjwatson | #endmeeting | 15:31 |
| === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | ||
| meetingology | Meeting ended Thu Mar 20 15:31:45 2014 UTC. | 15:31 |
| meetingology | Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2014/ubuntu-meeting.2014-03-20-15.05.moin.txt | 15:31 |
| cjwatson | thanks all | 15:31 |
| barry | thanks! | 15:31 |
| jodh | thanks! | 15:32 |
| stgraber | thanks! | 15:36 |
| mhall119 | o/ | 16:03 |
| jose | mhall119: looks like DST corrections played on you :P | 16:55 |
| mhall119 | jose: yes :( | 16:56 |
| YokoZar | Hey, at least you got to lose an hour's sleep | 17:01 |
| dholbach | hey | 17:02 |
| jose | hey YokoZar! long time no see! | 17:03 |
| YokoZar | Hey there :) | 17:04 |
| dholbach | all rightie... who's here from CC and LoCo Council? :) | 17:04 |
| jose | coolbhavi will be joining us in 2mins, PabloRubianes and I are already here | 17:04 |
| PabloRubianes | LoCo Council o/ | 17:04 |
| dholbach | welcome welcome everyone! :) | 17:04 |
| PabloRubianes | thanks | 17:04 |
| dholbach | #startmeeting | 17:05 |
| meetingology | Meeting started Thu Mar 20 17:05:08 2014 UTC. The chair is dholbach. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. | 17:05 |
| meetingology | Available commands: action commands idea info link nick | 17:05 |
| dholbach | #chairs YokoZar mhall119 | 17:05 |
| dholbach | hum | 17:05 |
| dholbach | #chair YokoZar mhall119 | 17:05 |
| meetingology | Current chairs: YokoZar dholbach mhall119 | 17:05 |
| elfy | hi | 17:05 |
| dholbach | aha! | 17:05 |
| dholbach | #chair elfy | 17:05 |
| meetingology | Current chairs: YokoZar dholbach elfy mhall119 | 17:05 |
| jose | a wild elfy appeared! | 17:05 |
| pleia2 | o/ | 17:05 |
| dholbach | #topic Checking in with the Loco Council | 17:05 |
| === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Checking in with the Loco Council | ||
| dholbach | #chair pleia2 | 17:05 |
| meetingology | Current chairs: YokoZar dholbach elfy mhall119 pleia2 | 17:05 |
| dholbach | PabloRubianes, jose: thanks a lot for joining us today | 17:06 |
| dholbach | How are you doing? How is the LoCo Council doing right now? | 17:06 |
| jose | hello hello :) | 17:06 |
| PabloRubianes | hello | 17:06 |
| czajkowski | aloha | 17:07 |
| jose | I think PabloRubianes should go, he's been there before I joined :) | 17:07 |
| PabloRubianes | well here I go | 17:07 |
| dholbach | hey coolbhavi | 17:07 |
| PabloRubianes | I think that with the addition of the new members we had a new energy in the team | 17:07 |
| coolbhavi | hey dholbach | 17:07 |
| pleia2 | that's great | 17:08 |
| elfy | always good to hear about new energy | 17:08 |
| PabloRubianes | mainly in the this period we had a LoCo Check in | 17:08 |
| PabloRubianes | we contact all the LoCos listed in the loco portal | 17:09 |
| PabloRubianes | this is something we want to do every 6 months cicle | 17:09 |
| PabloRubianes | is not part of the verified process just a "hello how are you? can we help in something?" | 17:10 |
| YokoZar | It's a good idea ;) | 17:10 |
| YokoZar | An inspired one, even | 17:10 |
| elfy | yep | 17:10 |
| elfy | is it doable though | 17:10 |
| coolbhavi | yes and the response was also quite good except few teams who failed to respond | 17:10 |
| elfy | it is then :) | 17:10 |
| coolbhavi | even after say a week | 17:10 |
| PabloRubianes | we got in the past some feedback of not been as present as LoCos expected so this can help with this | 17:11 |
| jose | http://lococouncil.ubuntu.com/2014/02/16/interim-report-on-2014-census-effort/ has an interim report published a month ago | 17:11 |
| dholbach | great... I could imagine that if you run something like this the first time, you get a few who don't respond | 17:11 |
| czajkowski | coolbhavi: who did you contact was it the person listed on LP or LTP or how did you directly contact the team ? | 17:11 |
| dholbach | did you mail the contacts of the loco or their mailing lists? | 17:11 |
| dholbach | :) | 17:11 |
| dholbach | #chair czajkowski | 17:11 |
| meetingology | Current chairs: YokoZar czajkowski dholbach elfy mhall119 pleia2 | 17:11 |
| jose | the contacts directly, mostly we wanted to see if the contact was still active and how the team was doing | 17:11 |
| PabloRubianes | czajkowski: team contact | 17:11 |
| coolbhavi | czajkowski, we contacted the team contacts | 17:12 |
| czajkowski | dholbach: great minds :) | 17:12 |
| jose | I think that our main goal is to demonstrate teams and team contacts (who often have some questions) that there's people there to give a hand when needed, and we tried to achieve that with the check-ins | 17:12 |
| dholbach | that's great | 17:12 |
| * coolbhavi remembers the d-a-t reachout feedback cycle here | 17:12 | |
| elfy | seems a lot of loco's didn't respond then | 17:13 |
| jose | that was the main issue, yes | 17:13 |
| dholbach | I could imagine that in some cases you hit LoCos whose contacts got too busy, or where it might make sense to explain the distinction between "a contact" (somebody who can be contacted) and a "team leader" :) | 17:13 |
| PabloRubianes | dholbach: busy or not the contact anymore | 17:14 |
| coolbhavi | yes again few who responded said our loco team is not so active | 17:14 |
| PabloRubianes | sometimes LoCo info gets outdated | 17:14 |
| dholbach | did you have follow-up conversations with some of the teams? like the ones who said "yeah, we actually do need help" | 17:14 |
| czajkowski | jose: can I suggest mailing the teams directly as I know some contacts may not be the contact any more nad there could be others who running things | 17:14 |
| jose | czajkowski: that's actually a good idea, which is what actually happens in ubuntu-de, maybe we can try that with the teams that didn't respond | 17:15 |
| czajkowski | jose: +1 | 17:15 |
| coolbhavi | dholbach, yes basically and the questions that we got were mostly on loco resources | 17:15 |
| PabloRubianes | and on LoCo activity | 17:16 |
| PabloRubianes | the need of new members or members who want to organize is common | 17:16 |
| jose | about that contact/team leader thing, we're trying to define it as usually the contact doesn't have contact with the team leader, and it's more useful to have team leaders as contact | 17:16 |
| jose | s | 17:16 |
| dholbach | jose, I think that it'd be super helpful to get that message across | 17:17 |
| jose | would a blog post stating that sound good to you? | 17:17 |
| dholbach | yeah, that might be a good start :) | 17:18 |
| elfy | it would sound good to me too :) | 17:18 |
| jose | added to our trello board :) | 17:18 |
| pleia2 | so I'm not so sure about that | 17:18 |
| PabloRubianes | another stuff we were working in | 17:19 |
| jose | pleia2: about what? | 17:19 |
| pleia2 | I like the contact is a delegated thing, if a leader doesn't want to do it they can tell someone else to be contact | 17:19 |
| pleia2 | requiring leaders to take on specific responsibilities seems a bit odd | 17:19 |
| pleia2 | making it more clear that contacts and leaders must communicate is good, but requiring leaders to handle that administrative thing... no so much | 17:19 |
| elfy | pleia2: possibly so - but if the contact isn't contactable then I'd say that at the least a leader should be | 17:19 |
| YokoZar | Does the loco council feel that the situation with Loco logistic support (CDs, etc) is better than in the past? | 17:20 |
| coolbhavi | how about getting the mails on the mailing list if available so that if members see it they would be able to respond? | 17:20 |
| pleia2 | I'm happy to be a leader and contact, by my two co-leaders seem quite happy not to have to deal with that responsiblity | 17:20 |
| elfy | pleia2: of the 156 teams contacted, the council only received responses from 53 teams would suggest that something needs to be looked at | 17:20 |
| pleia2 | elfy: oh of course, I just don't like top down mandates of roles ;) | 17:20 |
| mhall119 | ha, and now I'm late | 17:20 |
| elfy | :) | 17:20 |
| pleia2 | contacts and leaders must work together, but I don't think they need to be the same people | 17:21 |
| jose | pleia2: I think that what you're mentioning may work for some teams, but for others it doesn't, contacts are the ones that usually drop more quicker | 17:21 |
| czajkowski | I think that you're right to try something new | 17:21 |
| pleia2 | jose: that's kind of my point :) teams organize how they organize, mandating that a leader must be a contact also won't work for everyone, so why not just say that contacts and leaders must work together? | 17:22 |
| dholbach | pleia2, hum... that's at least how I understood the conversation earlier - that a team leader doesn't need to be the contact, but that we need somebody who's contactable | 17:22 |
| jose | YokoZar: I think we're good with it, communication with Canonical in those terms is good since I joined, and Michelle/Cezzaine have been super responsive to all our enquiries | 17:22 |
| czajkowski | and see if something needs to be tweeked/changed slightly in order to get more feedback from the teams | 17:22 |
| dholbach | (or maybe I misunderstood the last parts of the conversation now) | 17:22 |
| pleia2 | my concern really is just that we don't want to enforce structure on teams | 17:23 |
| dholbach | ok | 17:23 |
| elfy | pleia2: I would agree with that - it should be up to the loco and council - but to have a loco uncontactable doesn't work for anyone | 17:23 |
| dholbach | "have a contactable contact" sounds like a reasonable request to me ;-) | 17:23 |
| pleia2 | I'd be annoyed if my team were required to all of a sudden make our trio of leaders contacts too | 17:23 |
| pleia2 | dholbach: yeah | 17:24 |
| mhall119 | when you say you want leaders to be contactable, what does that mean? that they subscribe to loco-contacts? That you (the LC) can sent them email directly? | 17:24 |
| pleia2 | mhall119: they emailed all contacts directly, many didn't reply | 17:24 |
| jose | I'd say that when us (LC) email them directly they respond | 17:24 |
| * pleia2 nods | 17:24 | |
| mhall119 | it seems to me that it's a judgement call, whether a particular message should go to just team contacts, or contacts *and* leaders | 17:25 |
| mhall119 | for example, if it's to announce global jam, that's appropriate for just contacts, if it's for a team health check, that should be both contacts and leaders | 17:25 |
| jose | in this case, which was about health, we tried to contact leaders without getting an answer from many of them | 17:26 |
| jose | global jam-like things are usually announced via the loco-contacts ML, so it goes to the contacts | 17:26 |
| mhall119 | in that case, it sound like a separate issue from who is listed as a contact | 17:26 |
| pleia2 | I never did like the name of the loco-contacts mailing list ;) | 17:26 |
| pleia2 | should just be locoteams, everyone should subscribe | 17:27 |
| pleia2 | (indeed, I tell people to subscribe all the time) | 17:27 |
| * mhall119 isn't opposed to that, but sounds like it should be it's own topic | 17:27 | |
| pleia2 | yeah | 17:27 |
| jose | I think we need to further discuss how can we make team leaders contactable in case we need it, and still don't enforce structure on the teams | 17:28 |
| * pleia2 nods | 17:28 | |
| mhall119 | yeah, leaders should always be responsive to direct emails from the LC | 17:28 |
| mhall119 | IMO, that is one of the responsibilities of being a leader | 17:29 |
| pleia2 | contact is the person who is the liason for 3rd party things (supplies from canonical, books from publishers) | 17:29 |
| jose | one thing that I saw was that when the LC directly contacted a team leader in a certain team, he didn't respond, but when he got an email from another team member saying to contact us he did respond | 17:29 |
| pleia2 | and can reply to inqueries | 17:29 |
| pleia2 | requiring that person to be a leader is... a different skillset :) | 17:30 |
| jose | pleia2: +1 | 17:30 |
| elfy | I don't understand why there is an issue with a 'leader' being contactable | 17:30 |
| jose | elfy: it's just that some of them aren't, for unknown reasons | 17:31 |
| pleia2 | elfy: there is a difference between "contact" and "contactable" | 17:31 |
| elfy | yea - I get that :) | 17:31 |
| elfy | pleia2: agreed | 17:31 |
| pleia2 | leaders should respond, certainly | 17:31 |
| pleia2 | but "contact" is a specific role | 17:31 |
| elfy | mmm | 17:31 |
| jose | so we're going to further discuss that and we'll report the results to the CC | 17:32 |
| elfy | thanks jose | 17:32 |
| pleia2 | thanks jose | 17:32 |
| dholbach | great - thanks a lot | 17:32 |
| dholbach | what has been keeping the LoCo Council busy in the last cycle? | 17:32 |
| jose | :) | 17:32 |
| jose | we've basically had some discussions about how things are moving | 17:33 |
| jose | we discuss everything on a Trello board and have a voting system there | 17:33 |
| pleia2 | cool | 17:33 |
| jose | any LC member can propose an item to be discussed, and once it has 4 votes it's moved for discussion | 17:33 |
| jose | we've also set bug status definitions on the ubuntu-locoteams project (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/BugStatus) | 17:33 |
| coolbhavi | dholbach, reverification rebranding and reachout 3R's basically and internal discussions. | 17:34 |
| jose | about verification, we're using both the traditional meeting method, where the team leader attends the LC meeting set to be done on this channel and we check things, and our new bug/email method | 17:35 |
| jose | a bug is created on the ubuntu-locoteams project for each (re-)verification to be done on the cycle, and with those bug statuses we've set we track the progress of the (re-)verification | 17:35 |
| dholbach | and that's working well? | 17:36 |
| jose | works better than I expected, most leaders prefer to do it via email | 17:36 |
| jose | so how it works is, once they post the link to their verification application, we check it, and once the first vote is casted all LC members have 7 days to vote | 17:37 |
| dholbach | nice :) | 17:37 |
| jose | in case not all votes have been casted within the first 7 days, then it only needs only +4 votes, which would make it positive even if the other 2 missing people voted -1 | 17:37 |
| dholbach | it's interesting to see which forms of organisation work well for which teams :) | 17:38 |
| elfy | :) | 17:38 |
| jose | I think it's basically because timezones suck :) | 17:38 |
| elfy | ha ha ha | 17:38 |
| dholbach | that makes a lot of sense :) | 17:38 |
| * elfy likes the "votes have been casted within the first 7 day ..." thing and ponders | 17:39 | |
| jose | oh, and we're trying to encourage as many teams as possible to be verified so they can get their DVD pack from Canonical | 17:39 |
| coolbhavi | dholbach, we call it a vote shot clock and as jose said differing timezones are sometimes tough to handle | 17:39 |
| dholbach | yeah, I remember a few other boards having similar issues - mailing list threads going on forever, people forgetting to vote, etc | 17:40 |
| jose | the verification system allows this to be more efficient than approval as teams find it easier - we only check that the leader/contact have signed the CoC, that all resources are set up and follow the naming standards, and they're alive and have good health | 17:40 |
| dholbach | so this is interesting to see :) | 17:40 |
| cprofitt | yes, this is good to see | 17:41 |
| jose | hey, cprofitt! | 17:41 |
| cprofitt | hello jose | 17:41 |
| dholbach | Did you get many direct enquiries from LoCos themselves? I think I recall this taking up the majority of time of the LC in the past. | 17:41 |
| mhall119 | jose: are the verification requirements listed somewhere? | 17:41 |
| jose | dholbach: not that much, what consumes most of our time is discussion as well as verifications and guiding people for a successful verification | 17:42 |
| PabloRubianes | Another topic that we are working is the subteam thing | 17:42 |
| jose | mhall119: we have https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/TeamVerificationGuidelines | 17:42 |
| PabloRubianes | czajkowski: might remember this | 17:42 |
| mhall119 | thanks jose | 17:42 |
| jose | sure | 17:42 |
| jose | oh, yep, the subteams issue | 17:43 |
| PabloRubianes | we are trying to see which is the best solution for this | 17:43 |
| PabloRubianes | as some teams want to divide but we dont have resources for all | 17:43 |
| PabloRubianes | and some of the divisions could kill teams | 17:43 |
| PabloRubianes | and we have the fact that USA for example is divided | 17:44 |
| cprofitt | the issue of sub-teams is a complex one... | 17:44 |
| PabloRubianes | cprofitt: yes it is | 17:44 |
| PabloRubianes | but we want to have a conclusion to this topic soon to move forward this | 17:45 |
| cprofitt | it becomes difficult to monitor teams as the number grows... but I do understand the desire to organize on a smaller geographic region | 17:45 |
| PabloRubianes | cprofitt: I always believe the brazilian model is the best | 17:45 |
| PabloRubianes | one main team and subteams within the team | 17:46 |
| PabloRubianes | not separate locos | 17:46 |
| jose | and it's only considered as one team, with a board, though | 17:46 |
| cprofitt | PabloRubianes: just keep in mind there is no solution that everyone will be satisfied with ... you have to do what you feel is withing the capabilities of the community to handle and is healthy for the loco teams | 17:46 |
| jose | cprofitt: +1 | 17:46 |
| PabloRubianes | cprofitt: yes | 17:47 |
| cprofitt | What I have always been concerned with is the splintering of teams due to personalities and not other factors | 17:47 |
| PabloRubianes | cprofitt: we also care about the resources as DVDs and conf packs too | 17:47 |
| jose | that is something that should never happen, conflicts are to be resolved | 17:47 |
| dholbach | jose, the podcast you're doing on Saturday(?) - how many of them did you do before? | 17:48 |
| jose | dholbach: 0, it's the first edition ever | 17:48 |
| PabloRubianes | dholbach: is a hangout | 17:48 |
| dholbach | ah... yes, a hangout - right :) | 17:48 |
| cprofitt | PabloRubianes: I think the resource issue can be dealt with regardless of how many teams / sub teams there are... but the question would be how much time would be necessary to manage it... | 17:48 |
| dholbach | nice :-) | 17:48 |
| dholbach | I'm looking forward to it | 17:48 |
| jose | that takes us to the next point, in our efforts to engage with the community we'll be having a monthly ubuntuonair show, the LoCo Teams update (http://lococouncil.ubuntu.com/2014/02/28/loco-teams-update-on-air/) | 17:49 |
| cprofitt | Nice, what do you plan on covering in these? | 17:49 |
| jose | the show is to be community-focused, so it's a show made by LoCo Teams for LoCo Teams, anyone can submit news | 17:49 |
| jose | basically what teams have been doing | 17:49 |
| cprofitt | nice | 17:50 |
| dholbach | jose, I added a few small things to your notes :) | 17:50 |
| jose | we want to recognize the efforts of the loco community, and also use it to announce a couple things or give some advice in terms of event organizing | 17:50 |
| jose | dholbach: cool, I'll check them in a while | 17:50 |
| dholbach | I think it's great - especially if you showcase great work which has been happening elsewhere | 17:51 |
| jose | we expect it to happen more frequently if needed (if teams send so many events we can't cover all of them doing a monthly 1h session) | 17:51 |
| pleia2 | yeah, I'm really looking forward to the results from this :) | 17:52 |
| jose | we thought on a Saturday as most LoCo people are off-work that day | 17:52 |
| elfy | that all sounds like good stuff | 17:52 |
| PabloRubianes | yes having events in not working days is something we find important | 17:52 |
| cprofitt | I think there are a lot of positive angles to it and look forward to seeing it in action | 17:53 |
| dholbach | Is there anything the CC could help with? | 17:53 |
| jose | well, if you guys can give us some input about the subteams thing that would be useful | 17:54 |
| PabloRubianes | yeap | 17:54 |
| cprofitt | input on sub-teams... | 17:55 |
| dholbach | I could imagine that that could result in a loooooooooooooooong discussion. :-) | 17:55 |
| pleia2 | again | 17:55 |
| cprofitt | I think you should look at both sides of that issue and determine the road blocks | 17:55 |
| elfy | again for you pleia2 :p | 17:55 |
| dholbach | shall we take that offline or discuss in a hangout on air maybe? | 17:55 |
| cprofitt | once you have that list you could submit it to the CC for input | 17:55 |
| pleia2 | elfy: there have been many threads about pros and cons on loco-contacts | 17:55 |
| elfy | I don't doubt it :) | 17:55 |
| dholbach | I'm done with questions... pleia2, cprofitt, elfy, czajkowski, mhall119, YokoZar: anything else from you? | 17:56 |
| pleia2 | I'm good | 17:56 |
| mhall119 | nothing from me | 17:56 |
| cprofitt | nothing ele from me | 17:56 |
| coolbhavi | I recall the pains when czajkowski sergio chris n myself went through brainstorming on this when we started | 17:56 |
| pleia2 | thanks everyone :) | 17:56 |
| * mhall119 needs to get his team re-verified | 17:56 | |
| YokoZar | I'm good, thank you guys :) | 17:56 |
| elfy | nothing from me thanks | 17:56 |
| jose | well, if you have anything to say the team is completely open to suggestions, we want to make the loco experience better than ever :) | 17:56 |
| dholbach | great, thanks so much for your hard work on the LC | 17:57 |
| coolbhavi | yes thanks to all the CC members too :) | 17:57 |
| dholbach | hugs! :) | 17:57 |
| mhall119 | thanks everyone | 17:57 |
| dholbach | and thanks for making time | 17:57 |
| * jose hugs dholbach | 17:58 | |
| dholbach | #topic Any other business... | 17:58 |
| === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Any other business... | ||
| PabloRubianes | no problem thanks for having us | 17:58 |
| dholbach | :-) | 17:58 |
| dholbach | Does anyone have anything else to discuss? | 17:58 |
| dholbach | Looks like all's good. | 17:58 |
| dholbach | Thanks everyone! | 17:58 |
| dholbach | #endmeeting | 17:58 |
| === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | ||
| meetingology | Meeting ended Thu Mar 20 17:59:02 2014 UTC. | 17:59 |
| meetingology | Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2014/ubuntu-meeting.2014-03-20-17.05.moin.txt | 17:59 |
| elfy | thanks all | 17:59 |
| jose | enjoy the rest of your day, everyone :) | 17:59 |
| coolbhavi | good night all btw striking midnight here :) | 18:00 |
| === vladk|offline is now known as vladk | ||
| === marrusl is now known as marrusl_afk | ||
| === marrusl_afk is now known as marrusl | ||
| === vladk is now known as vladk|offline | ||
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