[00:43] <starrats> Got a question for anyone that is available.
[00:43] <ochosi> !aks
[00:43] <ochosi> "ask
[00:43] <ochosi> meh
[00:43] <ochosi> !ask
[00:43] <ochosi> starrats: ^
[00:44] <starrats> What is better to do the daily updates/ypgrades morning or night?  I did them this morning like aLways but should I do them tonight?
[00:44] <starrats> I like to stay currnet.
[00:45] <starrats> current
[00:45] <starrats> I do the three upgrades or should back off and do the two?
[00:45] <starrats> three thing 
[00:46] <starrats> update/upgrade/dist-upgrade
[00:48] <starrats> ochosi I was being polite, can you help me?
[00:50] <ochosi> sure, but !patience
[00:50] <ochosi> anyway, i don't think it makes any difference, just check for updates whenever you can/want
[00:50] <ochosi> i don't think there's a specific deploy-time for the buildbots
[00:51] <starrats> ah okay and thank you
[00:53] <ochosi> np
[00:53] <starrats> patience I do have but your 6 lines weren't patient ochosi
[00:53] <ochosi> my six lines?
[00:54] <starrats> ok 4 lines and ubooto came on, sorry
[00:54] <starrats> ubottu came in
[02:27] <ganglere> Just had apt crash after an update/reboot cycle, Bug #1296495 
[02:28] <ganglere> Changed to public, Bug #1296495 
[02:29] <brainwash> bug 1296495
[03:22] <chrispage1980> can I ask where the default wallpapers are stored?
[05:06] <fibz_> /usr/share/xfce4/backdrops/
[05:15] <chrispage1980> thankyou, I coldn't findit after I changed the wallpaper
[05:39] <chrispage1980> can't see it in defects summary but when I try installing .deb files with Software Center I get "The installation or removal of a software package failed."
[09:19] <elfy> knome:  I've been looking at the Settings Manager description bug, grabbed the relevant from http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfce4-settings/ , then found where the subtitle string is and changed it - do I just attach the edited xfce-settings-manager dialog.c file to the xfce bug?
[09:20] <elfy> https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10765
[09:24] <ochosi> elfy: not sure that this is really an improvement, "system settings" and "settings manager" just seem to be too similar to me
[09:27] <elfy> ochosi: it's the subtitle which is all wrong - it's currently Customise your desktop - which is not what the settings manager does
[09:27] <elfy> it has those things in it - but it also gets populated with tools like gparted
[09:28] <elfy> gparted doesn't customise your desktop - in fact you might use it to do something not at all related to the desktop :p
[09:34] <ochosi> i know, but you can consider that a bug in gparted
[09:35] <ochosi> not sure it should show up there, there were discussions about that
[09:39] <elfy> it's not a bug ingparted - it used to land in system menu - it's a bug in whatever was changed to make it land in settings manager then :)
[09:39] <elfy> whichever it is :)
[09:41] <elfy> disks goes there as well, and software updates and updater a whole bunch of things which aren't anything to do with customising a desktop
[09:41] <elfy> settings manager now appears to actually be a settings manager area - which is fine, but either the description is wrong or we should stop dropping everything into it imo
[09:42] <ochosi> gparted's desktop file decides about that
[09:43] <ochosi> and i guess it depends on what you see as "desktop"
[09:43] <elfy> well I don't see installing gparted to work with usb's desktop related at all :)
[09:44] <elfy> anyway - bbl - panicking about a job interview for an hour now 
[09:44] <ochosi> heh, ok, good luck with the interview!
[09:44] <elfy> ta
[11:10] <slickymasterWork> knome: you around?
[11:15] <slickymasterWork> knome: downloaded today's po_xubuntu_ubiquity-slideshow-xubuntu-pt.po and it's still not showing ochosi's text to the "Make the desktop your own" slide. It's just still showing the word "Stuff" as we had before ochosi made the text
[11:22] <knome> slickymasterWork, hum
[11:23] <slickymasterWork> and a good morning knome :)
[11:24] <knome> downloaded from launchpad?
[11:24]  * starrats is waiting for brainwash to arrive
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> knome: not sure if it relates but even though your https://code.launchpad.net/~knome/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/uife-bug-1294619/+merge/211707 has been merged it's still under 'Pending' status
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> yes knome, downloaded a while ago from LP
[11:25] <knome> slickymasterWork, we still need an upload
[11:25] <knome> slickymasterWork, that's the reason
[11:25] <knome> slickymasterWork, if you want to prepare the translation, you can update the .po file against the .pot
[11:26] <knome> (from the branch)
[11:26] <slickymasterWork> knome, so it's just a matter of someone poking Ubiquity Slideshow to get on with it
[11:26] <knome> yes, stgraber has promised to do an upload
[11:26] <slickymasterWork> I've the translation all done
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> to update the .po file against the .pot I'll have to make a MP, right
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> ?
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> or can I just upload it via LP?
[11:28] <knome> you should upload it via LP, but i don't know how it goes if you upload it before the pot file is uploaded
[11:28] <slickymasterWork> hmm, so it's still better to hang on a few more days
[11:29] <knome> yes
[11:29] <knome> until we have the new upload
[11:29] <knome> i hope we get it today
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> okie dokie
[11:29] <knome> because that would also mean we'd get it in for beta2
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> thanks for the heads up ;)
[11:29] <knome> won't get the *translations* to beta2 though...
[11:29] <knome> but for final, sure
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> that's what's important anyway 
[11:29] <knome> https://launchpad.net/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu
[11:29] <knome> scroll down
[11:30] <knome> left bottom part
[11:30] <knome> once the trusty package says version 80, we're good to go
[11:32] <slickymasterWork> good to know that
[11:33] <starrats> may I ask what version is trusty at now?
[11:34] <knome> starrats, what about looking at the link just posted? :)
[11:37] <starrats> okay knome saw where you folks are at the moment
[11:38] <knome> mhm
[11:38] <elfy> morning knome 
[11:38] <knome> hey elfy 
[11:38] <starrats> will version 80 be the final package for the release next month or will there be more work?
[11:39] <knome> we will need a new upload for the translations when that freeze lands, so at least 81
[11:39] <knome> but the version number itself doesn't matter
[11:39] <knome> just that we need two more uploads
[11:41] <starrats> ah okay
[13:02] <ochosi> brainwash: can you reproduce the "greeter doesnt exit cleanly" bug?
[13:02] <brainwash> ochosi: no
[13:02] <ochosi> hmkay
[13:03] <elfy> hi brainwash 
[13:03] <brainwash> hey elfy 
[13:42] <ochosi> brainwash: btw, i was only able to confirm this bug after my laptop crashed on suspending: https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10605
[13:42] <ochosi> now i get it consistently, before i didn't at lal
[13:42] <ochosi> all
[13:43] <ochosi> so i'm starting to wonder whether it's solely xfdesktop's fault
[14:25] <brainwash> ochosi: it's a race condition, my session start is rather slow on a fresh boot -> theme glitch, after a quick relog -> no glitch
[15:14] <brainwash> ochosi: we could revert the "faulty" commit
[16:07]  * starrats is waiting for brainwash to arriveand finally
[16:28] <knome> slickymasterWork, ubiquity stuff should be in order now
[16:28] <slickymasterWork> ok, thanks knome 
[16:29] <slickymasterWork> yeaps knome, Version 80 uploaded 1 hour ago
[16:42] <slickymasterWork> knome: the problem subsists in the file :P
[16:43] <slickymasterWork> in Version 80 file, that is
[16:44] <knome> ?
[16:48] <knome> hmm, right, i see
[16:48] <knome> weird...
[16:48] <knome> what the...
[16:52] <slickymasterWork> damn connection
[16:52] <knome> yeah, i see the issue.
[16:52] <knome> that's weird.
[16:53] <knome> because both me and stgraber updated the templates
[16:53] <slickymasterWork> it's as if your MP didn't get uploaded
[16:54] <knome> well it did, i merged it..
[16:54] <knome> but oh well
[16:54] <knome> i will have to look at it
[16:54] <knome> >__<
[16:54] <slickymasterWork> I'll keep waiting for good news ;)
[17:07] <starrats> brainwash did yo get my private message?
[17:09] <knome> bbl
[17:46] <starrats> brainwash did not want to send a ubuntu-bug report but the same tings have happened to me today as yesterday.  Those things you gave me did nothing at all.  I'm baffled why i was having so much luck on getting thru start-up that the last two have just been anirritation to me.
[18:16] <brainwash> starrats: please add all information to your bug report
[18:17] <starrats> havent'filed it yet brainwash
[18:18] <starrats> if you want me to file, it will be like the other one, ther was nothing from the term, this is way prior to term
[18:18] <brainwash> it seems to be a general hardware and/or driver issue
[18:19] <starrats> then should file this new report
[18:22] <brainwash> I suggest that you try asking in #ubuntu+1, maybe someone there could help you with debugging the bug/crash
[18:22] <starrats> ah ok will do
[18:55] <Noskcaj> Anyone who'se not given me a motu testimonial, you have 5 minutes, and it's fairly important you do
[19:08] <elfy> Noskcaj: might have been better to tell people earlier
[19:08] <Noskcaj> elfy, I woke up 5 minutes ago
[19:08] <Noskcaj> And i did
[19:08] <elfy> I meant like yesterday - though if you did you can't do more than that :)
[19:09] <elfy> good luck anyway :)
[19:10] <Noskcaj> ty
[19:10]  * elfy did do one for what it's worth a while back
[19:34] <elfy> Noskcaj: at a guess I would suggest what you've been doing package wise and what you've done to deal with their previous comments
[19:54] <micahg-work> ochosi, knome: -default-settings uplaoded
[19:57]  * elfy saw thanks micahg-work :)
[20:32] <micahg-work> woohoo, default settings update  in release pocket
[20:32] <elfy> cool
[20:41] <Noskcaj> So i know can upload catfish, gthumb, parole, and mugshot
[20:42] <micahg-work> not yet
[20:42] <micahg-work> vote needs to be finished by email
[20:44] <Noskcaj> s/know can/should be able to
[20:46] <starrats> those folks over in #ubuntu+1 were as helpful as an umbrella with holes in a down pour, lol
[20:46] <elfy> starrats: nature of IRC - if the people who can help aren't there then it get's lost
[20:47] <elfy> you just have to try again ... and again sometimes :)
[20:47] <starrats> ah ok
[20:50] <elfy> and sometimes you get idiots 
[20:55] <starrats> I got some idiot over there and told me to use gentoo instead od a pre-release
[20:55] <elfy> I know I'm in the channel
[20:56] <starrats> ah okay
[20:56] <ochosi> micahg-work: thanks!
[20:57] <ochosi> congrats Noskcaj 
[20:58] <micahg-work> ochosi, sorry that took so long, but it's in
[20:58] <elfy> yea - sorry Noskcaj - congrats
[20:59] <ochosi> micahg-work: well the most important thing is that it's in ;)
[20:59] <Noskcaj> thanks, although i feel letdown for only getting that
[20:59] <ochosi> micahg-work: and anyway, might not have been the last update/upload for this cycle
[20:59] <micahg-work> that's fine
[20:59] <ochosi> Noskcaj: why's that? i think it's actually pretty good, these are core apps for xubuntu
[20:59] <elfy> Noskcaj: you can do more than I can :)
[20:59] <micahg-work> we can do more post beta 2 (for a week or so)
[21:00] <elfy> micahg-work: did you have any thoughts about this ibus/keyboard issue at all?
[21:00] <Noskcaj> ochosi, yeah, but i didn't even get PPU for all of my packages from debian, let alone all of xubuntu or all of universe
[21:00] <ochosi> Noskcaj: also, that motivates me to fix bugs in parole cause i know it'll get uploaded
[21:00] <Noskcaj> :)
[21:01] <ochosi> and there are actually a few outstanding ones...
[21:01] <ochosi> micahg-work: yeah, what elfy mentions is actually one more thing we might have to do in default-settings too (disable ibus startup by default)
[21:01] <ochosi> i presume you guys have talked about this already?
[21:01] <micahg-work> elfy, I found a commit I thought might have been responsible, knome was doing some tests
[21:02] <elfy> oh d'oh - sorry - yea I saw that on thursday ... 
[21:02] <brainwash> Noskcaj: gz
[21:02] <ochosi> i'm wondering though whether we really want ibus in the tray by default
[21:02] <elfy> ochosi: it did take up a chunk of the last meeting - I just forgot ... 
[21:03] <ochosi> that was never the case in any previous release
[21:03] <elfy> ochosi: yea +1 to that
[21:03] <ochosi> so personally i'd go for disabling at least the trayicon, even if ibus gets fixed
[21:03] <micahg-work> ochosi, I don't like the idea of disabling ibus by default, how does that affect xubuntu in other languages
[21:03] <brainwash> how does one even disable the ibus autostart?
[21:04] <micahg-work> also, maybe there's someone who can help us with this that's more familiar with this
[21:04] <ochosi> from what i gather, ibus is needed when you have >1 input language/keyboard-layout
[21:04] <ochosi> so it doesnt affect xubuntu on other languages per se
[21:06] <ochosi> but i'm +1 on getting folks in that know more about this
[21:06] <ochosi> btw, ubuntu doesnt use ibus anymore
[21:06] <ochosi> they switched to indicator-keyboard
[21:06] <ochosi> (which we could still do)
[21:06] <elfy> micahg-work: also - we never had it in the panel previously, so why would it be an issue for anyone that it wasn't previously
[21:06] <elfy> at the moment it IS an issue when keyboard layout is fubar once you've logged in
[21:07]  * elfy just looks at this logically rather than from a packaging pov
[21:07] <ochosi> yup, i also agree with that logic
[21:07] <brainwash> maybe it was there, but the tray icon was hidden
[21:07] <ochosi> that's not impossible
[21:07] <elfy> brainwash: maybe so - but unhiding it has caused an issue :)
[21:08] <micahg-work> elfy, right, I just know it was seeded before, not sure how it was working in previous ISOs
[21:08] <ochosi> micahg-work: i think part of the problem might be that unity doesnt use it anymore, i.e. less maintenance/care about the package...
[21:08] <brainwash> ibus isn't even working for my main user account, it shows 1x de and 4x en_US
[21:09] <ochosi> one could ask around on #ubuntu-devel tomorrow about how it worked in unity and how indicator-keyboard works now
[21:10] <elfy> I'd ask but would get lost in the explanations probably lol 
[21:12] <micahg-work> ochosi, that could be
[21:13] <ochosi> micahg-work: if you want i can ask, but the outcome might be that we might want to do s/ibus/indicator-keyboard/
[21:13] <ochosi> micahg-work: and i don't wanna be the one who is stuck with that change and then there's no uploader... (i guess you see where i'm going with this ;))
[21:14] <brainwash> ibus is still present on the daily ubuntu iso
[21:16] <elfy> ochosi: guy on the forum has added logs to the greeter bug he says
[21:18] <micahg-work> ochosi, if that's what we need to do, let's decide, it's getting late to make major changes, but I don'
[21:18] <micahg-work> t want to be supporting a broken package for 3 years
[21:19] <micahg-work> ibus is seeded across the board as well
[21:20] <knome> micahg-work, testing didn't really turn up as well as it could have, downgrading didn't work as expected so couldn't really do much more than confirm the bug...
[21:21] <ochosi> micahg-work: ok, i'll ask seb128 about it tomorrow, i think he'll know (and if not, he can at least point me somewhere)
[21:22] <elfy> we should put a cap on how long we try and sort this I guess - ie not too long
[21:22] <elfy> said the man ulikely to be able to help sort it ... 
[21:22] <ochosi> +1
[21:22] <ochosi> i also want to know why unity doesnt use it anymore
[21:22] <ochosi> seeding it is one thing, activating it by default is another
[21:22] <micahg-work> it's still seeded on the Ubuntu ISO
[21:23] <ochosi> we can also seed it but don't let it autostart
[21:23] <micahg-work> is that what they do?
[21:23] <elfy> micahg-work: when I was looking at this it affected us, studio obviously and lubuntu 
[21:23] <micahg-work> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7148322/
[21:24] <elfy> I didn;t check all of those other ones 
[21:24] <ochosi> micahg-work: well they certainly don't use the ibus trayicon anymore because i fixed a bug for them in their icon-theme today and they wanted to drop the icon for ibus(!)
[21:25] <ochosi> (i actually saved them from doing so)
[21:25] <knome> i don't mind about not autostarting ibus.
[21:25] <knome> to be exact, i don't mind about not seeding it
[21:25] <knome> however, it would need to be evaluated if there are some downsides to either
[21:25] <ochosi> agreed
[21:25] <elfy> I suppose what we want - is to be back where we were before it landed in the panle
[21:25] <ochosi> and for that, we ideally ask "someone who knows" :)
[21:25] <elfy> surely?
[21:25] <micahg-work> well, everyone else is using it, so unless there's a major reason not to, I'd not like to be different in this case
[21:26] <brainwash> ochosi: maybe they just integrated ibus into indicator-keyboard
[21:26] <micahg-work> as it's in main, we're not directly on the hook for its maintenance either
[21:27] <knome> micahg-work, agreed.
[21:27] <knome> micahg-work, you happen to know any reason why we should keep https://launchpad.net/xubuntu-desktop/ ?
[21:28] <micahg-work> well, I think it was used before to track tasks related to the project per Ubuntu release
[21:29] <micahg-work> I think we're using blueprints for that now
[21:29] <knome> the last release that it had was natty
[21:29] <knome> i went and cleaned those up the other day
[21:29] <knome> i think that page is just confusing for a user if they happen to land on it
[21:30] <knome> and if it has no technical or social meaning for the developers either, we should remove it
[21:32] <elfy> micahg-work: so how soon do we need to actually make a decision on ibus by?
[21:33] <micahg-work> definitely before apr 10, the sooner the better
[21:33] <knome> ochosi, micahg-work: can you elaborate
[21:34] <knome> what's left to do in https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-t-features ?
[21:34] <knome> or is the last thing left to do to mark the rest DONE ?
[21:34] <elfy> micahg-work: so assuming we have weekly meetings - by next weeks? 3rd? 
[21:34] <knome> elfy, that sounds fair
[21:35] <knome> "just dropping it from the seed/autorun" is pretty simple
[21:35] <ochosi> knome: what should i elaborate?
[21:35] <knome> ochosi, see the next comment
[21:35] <micahg-work> I have no idea about the gtk2 indicators, I'd have to look
[21:36] <knome> in that case, ochosi, can you elaborate on *that* with micah :)
[21:36] <knome> as you probably understand, i'd like to get all of that blueprint done ASAP
[21:36] <elfy> knome: ok - I've made a note to make sure to add it agenda if it's not decided by then 
[21:36] <knome> elfy, ok, thanks
[21:36] <ochosi> micahg-work: we have to make sure that they get removed for upgraders
[21:36] <ochosi> micahg-work: otherwise the gtk3 indicators don't work
[21:37] <ochosi> because they conflict
[21:37] <brainwash> really?
[21:37] <ochosi> (at least they did before upstart)
[21:37] <knome> elfy, i've added that to the team calendar
[21:37] <elfy> ok - even better
[21:38] <micahg-work> ochosi, ok, can you file add notes about what specifically conflicts somewhere and make sure I'm subscribed (was thinking a bug against xubuntu-meta)
[21:38] <micahg-work> maybe just the whiteboard would be enough
[21:39] <ochosi> micahg-work: ok, however you prefer. i mostly noted it on the whiteboard in the first place in order not to forget it
[21:39] <ochosi> and that was weeks ago
[21:39] <brainwash> ochosi: I have them all installed (gtk2 and gtk3)
[21:40] <ochosi> brainwash: that must be the upstart transition then, it really didn't work before
[21:40] <brainwash> gtk2 due to ubuntu-studio I think
[21:40] <ochosi> micahg-work: in that ^ case, we can also skip it
[21:40] <micahg-work> ok
[21:40] <micahg-work> let me know
[21:40] <ochosi> and xscreensaver conflicting with light-locker is also not a problem anymore
[21:40] <ochosi> because light-locker comes first in xflock
[21:41] <knome> nice
[21:41] <ochosi> (although it sucks a bit to have all those useless things installed, but hey...)
[21:41] <knome> mmh
[21:41] <micahg-work> yeah, those shouldn't conflict
[21:41] <ochosi> (the price for LTS->LTS upgrading)
[21:41] <micahg-work> it would be nice if xflock can be taught with a setting which to use
[21:41] <brainwash> what about the double power indicator problem (upgraders)?
[21:42] <ochosi> micahg-work: yeah, xflock could really use an improvement (many patches in bugzilla), somehow nobody wants to touch it...
[21:42] <knome> maybe for .1
[21:42] <ochosi> brainwash: not sure what to do about that
[21:42] <knome> ochosi, describe it to micah who might
[21:43] <brainwash> ochosi: a faq entry to explain it?
[21:43] <knome> (be sure)
[21:43] <ochosi> brainwash: we can't mess with user's config, and we can't conditionally *not* install  indicator-power
[21:43] <ochosi> knome: ^
[21:43] <knome> FAQ item seems the last effort
[21:43] <ochosi> yeah, we can do that
[21:43] <knome> hmm,
[21:43] <ochosi> it's also not a given problem
[21:43] <knome> aren't there some packages which as if you want to keep the current config or replace it with the newest?
[21:44] <micahg-work> what's causing the old indicator
[21:44] <micahg-work> errr.ico
[21:44] <micahg-work> icon
[21:44] <ochosi> micahg-work: trayicon from xfce4-powermanager
[21:44] <ochosi> i disabled it in xubuntu-default-settings to resolve that for new installs
[21:44] <ochosi> but we cant do much about existing configs
[21:44] <micahg-work> the new indicator uses the power-manager?
[21:44] <ochosi> yes
[21:44] <ochosi> i patched it
[21:44] <knome> \o/
[21:44] <ochosi> the "new indicator" is indicator-power
[21:45] <ochosi> so we don't (have to) maintain it
[21:45] <ochosi> we can just use it like indicator-sound
[21:45] <micahg-work> I supposed we still want users to have a trayicon for xfce4-powermanager even if they don't have indicator-power
[21:49] <knome> brainwash, was bug 1271871 fixed by you or jackson?
[21:49] <knome> brainwash, same for bug 1284923
[21:50] <brainwash> it was fixed by the upstream people
[21:50] <knome> aha
[21:50] <knome> and jackson did the packaging work?
[21:50] <brainwash> I guess so
[21:50] <knome> ta.
[21:51] <ochosi> micahg-work: why wouldn't they have indicator-power?
[21:51] <brainwash> he just did not add the bug reports numbers to the changelog
[21:51] <knome> brainwash, ok, thanks
[21:51] <micahg-work> if someone chooses to remove it
[21:52] <brainwash> micahg-work: the problem is, that some upgraders might see both icons after upgrading to 14.04
[21:52] <micahg-work> studio and mythbuntu don't have indicator-power
[21:52] <micahg-work> brainwash, right, one of the options is to remove the trayicon, but I don't see it as viable
[21:53] <brainwash> we hide the power-manager via global config file provided by xubuntu-default-settings
[21:53] <ochosi> micahg-work: yeah, it's still there, it's just hidden (the trayicon)
[21:55] <knome> slickymaster, the .pot file seems to be okay...
[21:56] <knome> slickymaster, i wonder if the launchpad automatic translation stuff will notice that change at some point
[21:56] <knome> slickymaster, for the .po files, i guess you just need to update the catalog manually
[21:56] <knome> slickymaster, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubiquity-slideshow/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/html/view/head:/po/xubuntu/slideshow-xubuntu.pot
[22:00] <micahg-work> there should be a script to do that I would think
[22:01] <knome> yeah, i'm not worrying about it since everything looks okay in the branch
[22:01] <knome> slickymaster has just been asking about it and why old stuff appear
[22:01] <knome> and sure, would be nice to get that stuff updated to be able to run the call for translators
[22:36] <ochosi> arrr, and there i just missed elfy...
[22:38] <knome> :)
[22:40] <ochosi> anyway, commented on another t-bug that should be wontfix imo
[22:40] <knome> #?
[22:40] <ochosi> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfwm4/+bug/1271883
[22:40] <ochosi> commented upstream though
[22:40] <ochosi> as that's where it's really tracked
[22:43] <brainwash> ochosi: 100 is max for workspaces
[22:43] <ochosi> yeah, but that's still a lot
[22:44] <ochosi> doesn't really change my point
[22:44] <brainwash> but what is the drawback of enabling it?
[22:44] <ochosi> i explained that in my comment
[22:44] <ochosi> potentially lots of cpu usage, what's the benefit of enabling it?
[22:45] <brainwash> try it
[22:45] <brainwash> worked flawless for me
[22:45] <ochosi> what's the benefit of enabling it?
[22:46] <brainwash> a happy elfy
[22:46] <ochosi> HUHU
[22:46] <ochosi> sorry, uppercase wasn't intended
[22:47] <brainwash> it works, so I've attached the diff
[22:47] <brainwash> and upstream won't answer anytime soon
[22:47] <ochosi> probably not
[22:47] <ochosi> but gtkspinbuttons are editable by default
[22:48] <ochosi> so this was a conscious decision
[22:48] <brainwash> I know, it has been like this for years
[22:48] <brainwash> so it's not a regression or so
[22:48] <ochosi> that's not a reason for changing anything though
[22:49] <knome> if i could assign any (non-existing) bug importance field for that bug, it would be... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX7wtNOkuHo
[22:49] <brainwash> no, but it works if editable
[22:50] <ochosi> probably not always. anyway, i'm tired of arguing about that dialog's spinbutton. i added my argument and upstream most likely won't change this
[22:50] <ochosi> or if they do, they hopefully have a good reason to do so
[22:50] <brainwash> why didn't you just ignore the report? :)
[22:51] <ochosi> (with that i mean, a better reason than just "make elfy happy" – no offense, elfy)
[22:51] <ochosi> it's part of xubuntu-t-bugs
[22:51] <ochosi> i went through that list right now
[22:51] <brainwash> it shouldn't be
[22:51] <ochosi> yup, i wholeheartedly agree
[22:51] <brainwash> all this minor stuff should be removed
[22:51] <ochosi> it's not even a bug
[22:51] <ochosi> i'll set it to wishlist if i can and remove it from the bp
[22:52] <brainwash> or bug 1271861
[22:52] <brainwash> easy fixable, but meh
[22:52] <brainwash> what is right and what is wrong
[22:53] <ochosi> yup
[22:53] <ochosi> knome: mind to set this to wishlist? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfwm4/+bug/1271883
[22:54] <brainwash> ochosi: new comment https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10605
[22:55] <ochosi> yup, i saw, have you tried it?
[22:55] <brainwash> once
[22:55] <brainwash> no change
[22:56] <brainwash> my session start is damn slow
[22:56] <brainwash> the first on after boot
[22:56] <brainwash> one
[22:57] <brainwash> slow session start -> race condition
[22:59] <ochosi> i'm seeing it after i had a bug with suspend
[22:59] <ochosi> so apport comes up at session start and that is seemingly enough
[22:59] <brainwash> apport pops up every time?
[23:00] <ochosi> yup
[23:00] <ochosi> fun, eh?
[23:00] <brainwash> report the bug then :D
[23:00] <ochosi> yeah, appart never finishes collecting the data
[23:00] <ochosi> so eh
[23:01] <ochosi> brb, testing that suggestion from the bugreport now
[23:01] <brainwash> ok
[23:02] <ochosi> yup, also doesnt work for me
[23:02] <ochosi> huhu, now apport finished with one of the bugs
[23:03] <ochosi> and tada! it was a bug in apport
[23:04] <brainwash> eric likes the new way of handling style changes... but we want to release something that works 100%
[23:05] <ochosi> i'd really like to get to the bottom of thise
[23:05] <ochosi> it's not very nice to just revert to *some* solution
[23:09] <ochosi> brainwash: can you confirm https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfdesktop4/+bug/1295614 ?
[23:09] <ochosi> cause i can't
[23:11] <fibz_> i have a fresh install i can let sit for a while and see what happens
[23:11] <brainwash> oh, forgot to monitor the mem usage
[23:12] <ochosi> i did that
[23:12] <ochosi> i set the change to 2secs and waited a while
[23:12] <ochosi> actually the first time i read it, i entirely overread how he changes the bg
[23:12] <ochosi> with "variety"
[23:13] <ochosi> obviously not knowing that there is a builtin wallpaper-changer
[23:13] <ochosi> or somehow not being happy about that one
[23:15] <brainwash> but still, it's xfdesktop changing the wallpaper in the end
[23:26] <knome> http://xubuntu.org/getxubuntu/requirements/
[23:26] <knome> surprise!
[23:52] <fibz_> if not already, that should be a trigger for the bot