[00:00] <huwshimi> hatch__: I don't think so, I just have all sorts of apps floating around.
[00:00] <hatch__> oh heh
[00:00] <hatch__> well I'd probably pick that over the constant system error report dialogues
[00:01] <hatch> they are probably because of something apple hardware related heh
[00:02] <rick_h_> sorry, sent to huwshimi but meant hatch
[00:02] <rick_h_> hatch: what did you need to do? Just install the packages mentioned in the bug report?
[00:03] <hatch> rick_h_ I created a livecd using dd but didn't convert the iso, just used dd 
[00:03] <hatch> then rebooted
[00:03] <hatch> in rEFInd I picked the usb option which has 'EFI' in the text that popped up
[00:03] <hatch> then it installed and works.....almost.....like a charm
[00:03] <hatch> :)
[00:03] <rick_h_> hatch: from the mac iso?
[00:04] <hatch> I'll try and put together a blog post tonight, but it was really fast/simple
[00:04] <hatch> nope used the desktop one
[00:04] <hatch> the kernel guys use the desktop one they said
[00:04] <hatch> I'm not really sure what the mac version does considering you can't dl the mac version except for as a daily
[00:05] <huwshimi> hatch: it has a different boot setup, I think with modern macs you want the standard image
[00:06] <hatch> huwshimi ahh ok
[00:06] <hatch> well if it wasn't for these darn system errors....it doesn't even give me the ability to view the error
[00:06] <hatch> I'll have to figure out how to read these
[00:06] <hatch> it must store them somewhere
[00:08] <hatch> I'll also need to investigate multi touch
[00:08] <hatch> three finger drag doesn't work
[00:08] <hatch> but two finger scroll does
[00:08] <hatch> MOAR multitouchy
[00:08] <hatch> :)
[00:09] <hatch> rick_h_ more than 900 http://venturebeat.com/2014/04/03/microsoft-azure-portal/ :-)
[00:10] <hatch> huwshimi are you running on metal or in a vm?
[00:10] <hatch> I thought you were on a vm
[00:11] <huwshimi> hatch: Metal. Always have.
[00:11] <hatch> oh interesting - well you clearly know more than rick_h_  and I because we coudln't get it to run lol
[00:12] <huwshimi> hatch: Well, I booted from a usb disk and clicked install.
[00:12] <hatch> lol ok yeah that didn't work for us haha
[00:14] <hatch> well I'm just happy it works now, bugs and whatnot can be resolved
[00:14] <hatch> I mean, it's not even released yet hah
[00:15] <huwshimi> hatch: This has been the smoothest upgrade experience for me in a long time.
[00:15] <hatch> yeah? That's good, this is an important release for us
[00:17] <huwshimi> hatch: Not good you're having a bunch of issues two weeks out from release though
[00:18] <hatch> well...I guess I give them some slack being that brand new apple hardware is probably a little finicky  
[00:19] <rick_h_> hatch: well I don't have the new dashboard yet I guess. 
[00:20] <huwshimi> hatch: Oh, you got a new mbp then?
[00:21] <hatch> huwshimi yeah late 2013 MBP 15"
[00:21] <huwshimi> Nice!
[00:21] <hatch> I got all the options but stuck with the 500GB drive
[00:21] <hatch> $500 more for 1TB was not a good value proposition for me
[00:21] <hatch> haha
[00:21] <huwshimi> yeah
[00:22] <huwshimi> hatch: What's not working?
[00:22] <hatch> I switched back to OSX now, but it all appears to be working well
[00:22] <hatch> it feels a little laggy
[00:22] <hatch> there is a system error for 'something' that keeps poping up every few minutes
[00:23] <hatch> and I need more multi touchies
[00:23] <hatch> but other than that it seems to be working well
[00:23] <hatch> it can even handle the retina screen decently
[00:24] <hatch> oh and that shutdown bug
[00:24] <hatch> the laggyness I'm guessing is a driver issue
[00:24] <huwshimi> hatch: Could be worse.
[00:24] <hatch> oh yeah I'm not complaining
[00:25] <hatch> I am a little curious who to get in touch with to get a 'better' video driver if that is what's causing the laggyness
[00:25] <hatch> and just to be clear, we aren't talking laggy, just not as smooth as osx
[00:30] <huwshimi> hatch: What driver are you currently using?
[00:30] <hatch> whichever one came with it
[00:32] <huwshimi> If you go to System Settings > Software & Updates > Additional Drivers tab, you can install a new driver.
[00:33] <hatch> oh I just assumed noone would have come out with one yet
[00:33] <hatch> I'll have to switch back and give it a go
[00:33] <hatch> :)
[00:39] <huwshimi> kadams54: Not sure if it's just an old build that's just finished up, but it looks like a couple of lint errors in your branch.
[00:43] <hatch> now the question is...which irc client to use
[00:45] <huwshimi> hatch: Were there new drivers?
[00:45] <hatch> no idea
[00:45] <hatch> still in osx land
[00:45] <huwshimi> Ah
[00:45] <hatch> ok switching
[01:38] <kadams54> *sigh* bit by the Selenium bug
[01:40] <rick_h_> kadams54: :(
[01:51] <rick_h_> huwshimi: do you use something to disable the trackpad when typing?
[01:54] <huwshimi> rick_h_: Only the checkbox in the Mouse & Touchpad settings
[01:54] <rick_h_> huwshimi: k
[01:54] <huwshimi> rick_h_: I don't have tap-to-click on though
[01:55] <huwshimi> rick_h_: Only the physical press
[01:55] <rick_h_> ah
[01:57] <huwshimi> rick_h_: I prefer the physical press
[01:58] <rick_h_> huwshimi: yea, I hate the force level of the click
[01:58] <rick_h_> I prefer physical buttons on my thinkpad 
[01:59] <rick_h_> I must have wimpy fingers and get annoyed with the click sounds too easily :)
[01:59] <huwshimi> haha
[02:00] <rick_h_> it is cool to finally have it working on metal though. installing all my normal deps
[02:00] <rick_h_> should be fun to try out my tiling window manager setup on here and see how it feels with a touchpad
[02:06] <huwshimi> rick_h_: I just wish I could boot osx as a vm for safari testing.
[02:06] <rick_h_> huwshimi: yea, I think it's actually possible, but not legal
[02:07] <rick_h_> ugh, slow repos means installing takes for ever
[02:11] <kadams54> I dug into the Selenium failure more
[02:12] <rick_h_> kadams54: yea? we've had runs of this before but seemed selenium based. It's seeming to be an issue starting up the firefox selenium tests. 
[02:12] <kadams54> It's happening when Selenium gets an HTTP status code between 300  and 304
[02:12] <kadams54> When that happens, it triggers this line of code:
[02:12] <kadams54> return self._request('GET', resp.getheader('location'))
[02:13] <kadams54> It seems like our location header in the response is None
[02:13] <rick_h_> yea, it's a simple http server. So the question is why is it getting a 300/304? It loads an html file directly without redirect
[02:14]  * rick_h_ ponders setting up apache on there to proxy these ports out to sauce
[02:17] <kadams54> http://0.0.0.0:8889/test/index.html
[02:17] <kadams54> Is that right?
[02:18] <kadams54> It's port 8888 locally
[02:18] <rick_h_> right
[02:18] <rick_h_> no, port 8888 is for the test run
[02:18] <rick_h_> and 8889 is for the merge run
[02:18] <kadams54> Ah
[02:18] <rick_h_> so the two jobs can test/merge different branches at once
[02:22] <rick_h_> lol, and then npm issue
[02:22] <rick_h_> kadams54's branch is not meant to land
[02:22] <rick_h_> CI doesn't like it
[02:22] <kadams54> :-b
[02:22] <kadams54> Hmm. 304's for me locally, which makes sense. The code is 300 <= statuscode < 304, so a 304 isn't going to trigger it.
[02:23] <rick_h_> oh hmm, well 302 is a redirect
[02:23] <rick_h_> which some things might throw, but I can't see what would do it
[02:23] <rick_h_> would have to track the network tab and see if anyone throws a 302 redirect for some reason
[02:24] <kadams54> Ah, yeah
[02:24] <kadams54> I was only looking at the initial request for index.html
[02:24] <rick_h_> yea, I wonder if something of the initial deps throws something that it doesn't care for
[02:29] <kadams54> Well in 3 minutes I'm heading to bed.
[02:29] <rick_h_> all good, thanks for poking at it some
[02:29] <kadams54> CI build success or not.
[02:29] <rick_h_> I should be taking my meds and heading to bed myself
[02:29] <rick_h_> kadams54: oh yea, it's well past EOD, please don't feel like you have to watch it
[02:30] <kadams54> Fret not. Catching up on my hulu queue on the big monitor ;-)
[02:35] <bcsaller> *6
[02:41] <hatch> huwshimi yeah so a bunch more bugs came up with one critical one that I haven't found a solution for ye
[02:41] <hatch> t
[02:44] <rick_h_> chrome is core dumping on me, still installing my base package suite
[02:45] <rick_h_> and done, time to link configs and reboot and hopefully be close to normal
[02:45] <rick_h_> other than the fn/ctrl keys and meta/alt keys both being backwards :/
[02:48] <huwshimi> hatch: Oh, no good
[02:48] <huwshimi> hatch: Did the sluggish go away?
[02:48] <hatch> huwshimi well when I try to change any of the drivers and click save it just reverts to the old one
[02:48] <huwshimi> *ness
[02:48] <huwshimi> hatch: Oh
[02:48] <hatch> so because of that i have no wifi
[02:48] <rick_h_> the only driver I could get was the broadcom one
[02:48] <rick_h_> there wasn't anything else
[02:49] <hatch> and there is no network control over VPN
[02:49] <hatch> other than...
[02:50] <hatch> rick_h_ you were able to select the broadcom one and it worked?
[02:50] <hatch> Did it enable wifi?
[02:50] <rick_h_> hatch: it seems to but I don't have permissions to edit the wifi
[02:50] <rick_h_> so had to change a group and need to reboot in a sec
[02:50] <hatch> I also found that unless I boot with the ethernet dongle in then I have no internet because there is no 'Network' control
[02:51] <hatch> hmm, seems like it's a little unstable still
[02:51] <rick_h_> yea, something in the hardware has to pick up the dongle on boot to expose it
[02:51] <rick_h_> ok, reboot time to see how well it all went
[02:53] <rick_h_> woot, on the wifi and working
[02:54] <rick_h_> will have to fix these keybindings doh
[02:54] <hatch> nice I'll have to look into the wifi stuff
[02:54] <hatch> it's odd that I couldn't change the driver
[02:55] <rick_h_> oh sucky, you can't remap the fn key as it's not exposed
[02:55] <rick_h_> $#@$@#
[02:56] <rick_h_> and chrome still seg's ugh
[02:56] <hatch> hmm
[02:56] <hatch> there 'has' to be some way to remap the fn key
[02:57] <hatch> this keyboard format has been around for so long someone must have written something :)
[02:58] <rick_h_> no, it's isolated at the hardware level
[02:58] <rick_h_> it doesn't even show up in xev
[03:09] <rick_h_> woot, meta/alt keys fixed
[03:09] <rick_h_> now just have to figure out how to deal without middle click
[03:13] <hatch> ohh really? I swap it using software in OSX
[03:15] <rick_h_> hah, can't figure out how to paste the link into this terminal 
[03:15] <rick_h_> how the $#@$@# do people live without middle click?
[03:15] <hatch> right click?
[03:15] <hatch> lol
[03:15] <hatch> I have never used middle click
[03:15] <rick_h_> paste.ubuntu.com/7201599/
[03:15] <rick_h_> fixes my control, meta, and alt keys for me
[03:16] <rick_h_> well my terminal doesn't have copy/paste commands built into it
[03:16] <rick_h_> so you just always middle click into it
[03:17] <rick_h_> I could normally use shift-insert, but no insert key on this keyboard either
[03:17] <hatch> hmm the only key I actually want to change is the fn and control buttons
[03:18] <rick_h_> heh, and fn is hardware controlled and you can't change it
[03:18] <rick_h_> at least not with xmodmap or any normal mapping things I know of
[03:19] <hatch> yeah I'm just wondering why it can be done in software with windows and osx
[03:19] <rick_h_> oh maybe it can
[03:20] <rick_h_> I'm floored it doesn't register in xev, never seen that before
[03:20] <hatch> KeyRemap4MacBook is what I use to swap them in OSX
[03:21] <hatch> Windows can apparently use something called Sharp Keys
[03:23] <hatch> rick_h_ http://cyberdork33.wordpress.com/2008/11/04/swap-fn/ does this mean anything to you?
[03:24] <rick_h_> I would if I could open it
[03:24] <rick_h_> I can't middle click the link to auto open in a browser, and can't copy/paste it out lol
[03:25] <hatch> haha aren't you using gnome-terminal?
[03:25] <rick_h_> nope, urxvt...
[03:25] <rick_h_> which is getting painful quick
[03:25] <hatch> ahh-
[03:26] <hatch> I'm going ot miss iterm
[03:26] <rick_h_> I disagree lol
[03:26] <rick_h_> pos
[03:26] <hatch> oh right, it has a GUI for settings :P
[03:27] <rick_h_> right, this is what I was talking about
[03:27] <rick_h_> you can use this to force the hardware to send FnX by default vs the hardware keys for lights/volume/etc
[03:28] <rick_h_> but this does not swap the fn key with the ctrl next to it
[03:28] <hatch> ohh hmm
[03:30] <hatch> http://askubuntu.com/questions/193529/how-to-swap-between-fn-and-ctrl-keys thinkpads say it's a bios option heh
[03:32] <rick_h_> yea, what I mean. It's more at a bios level
[03:32] <rick_h_> hardware that is
[03:32] <rick_h_> oh hell, can't scroll right with 2-finger scroll?
[03:32] <hatch> that works for me
[03:33] <rick_h_> I can scroll up/down but not side to side
[03:34] <hatch> oh hmm I didn't try that
[03:34] <hatch> I'm back in OSX land right now
[03:34] <rick_h_> heh
[03:35] <hatch> well now how the heck does the keyremap work in osx
[03:36] <hatch> eventType:keyMod          code:0x3f       name:Fn              flags:Fn                                 misc:characters:    	KeyCode::FN
[03:36] <hatch> eventType:keyMod          code:0x3f       name:Fn              flags:                                   misc:characters:    	KeyCode::FN
[03:36] <hatch> that's what it says it's doing
[03:38] <hatch> http://www.nongnu.org/xbindkeys/xbindkeys.html
[03:41] <hatch> that's what the keyremap4macbook author suggested
[03:41] <hatch> not sure if it'll actually work though heh
[12:20] <bac> frankban: i didn't need to but i re-reviewed your patch.  thanks for the changes.
[12:20] <frankban> bac: thank you!
[12:28] <bac> frankban: for your reading pleasure, here is the bug i filed regarding joyent and ssh keys:  bug 1302561
[12:28] <_mup_> Bug #1302561: Joyent gives decode error on SSH key with passphrase <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1302561>
[12:30] <frankban> bac: cool
[12:46]  * frankban lunche
[12:46] <frankban> (s)
[14:17] <luca___> rick_h_: showed mark the demo’s, he said it looks great :)
[14:17] <rick_h_> luca___: woot woot
[14:17] <luca___> :)
[14:20] <hatch> party...on
[14:27] <hatch> rick_h_ did you get a chance last night to give http://www.nongnu.org/xbindkeys/xbindkeys.html a go?
[14:27] <hatch> it looks like it might work using the 0x3f code from KR4MB
[14:28] <rick_h_> luca___: we're working on the machine view and the representation of the unit, machine, and container in each column
[14:28] <rick_h_> luca___: so if there's an update from spencers folder of shots we could use that asap
[14:28] <luca___> rick_h_: the latest can be seen here: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/lvdydgiu7jeuuso/7MlRX5-IPu
[14:29] <rick_h_> kadams54: ^
[14:29] <luca___> rick_h_: I’m in a wrap up meeting at the moment
[14:29] <rick_h_> luca___: rgr, have fun
[14:29] <luca___> rick_h_: but Spencer should be free for a call if to talk you through them
[14:29] <rick_h_> luca___: all good, it'll be an initial stab that's not fully functional so just want to make sure we're closer vs farther
[14:30] <luca___> ah ok
[14:30] <luca___> rick_h_: I’ll move the images over to the gdrive and share the link with everyone
[14:30] <rick_h_> kadams54: so from that, #13 - #18 are the keys to what you're working on
[14:30] <rick_h_> kadams54: and we should chat, because I'd like to work together on these toksn to share common bits and follow a bit of the charm token pattern we used before that worked well
[14:31] <hatch> :'(
[14:31] <kadams54> Yeah, will definitely need pre-impl chat for this
[14:33] <rick_h_> hatch: why the :'(?
[14:33] <rick_h_> serious, the charm tokens are some of the most reusable, no problems to us, code in the codebase
[14:33] <rick_h_> what possible complaint can you have on it?
[14:34] <rick_h_> kadams54: look through the shots. I'll head back to the house from the coffee shop here and we can chat pre-stand up
[14:35] <hatch> juuuuuuust jokin
[14:36] <hatch> my only 'issue' with them is that they should be views
[14:37] <hatch> but that's just because I don't really know where widgets fit into the ecosystem anymore
[14:38] <luca___> rick_h_: I shared the MV with juju-gui-list….is that ok?
[14:38] <hatch> the other option is to just use a template rendering....I'm not sure there is any 'contained' funcitonality with the machine tokens
[14:38] <hatch> I could be wrong though
[14:38] <hatch> well too late now :P
[14:38] <hatch> ^ luca___  lol
[14:39] <luca___> hatch: yeah but I can’t remember if that just shared mv with people outside of the company....
[14:39] <hatch> ohh that I'm not sure about
[14:40] <hatch> is there no way to see inside the groups?
[14:42] <luca___> I think it’s private
[14:42] <luca___> hatch: if you click the “mailing list” link at the bottom of the email it takes you here:
[14:42] <luca___> hatch: https://launchpad.net/~juju-gui-peeps
[14:42] <hatch> yeah that's private
[14:42] <hatch> was....
[14:42] <hatch> lol
[14:43] <hatch> oh man.....friday
[14:43] <jcsackett> hatch: don't you *dare* shit talk the tokens. :)
[14:44] <hatch> lol
[14:44] <hatch> hmm the machine view tokens need to be draggable, better make them views
[14:44] <rick_h_> luca___: sure thing
[14:45] <rick_h_> luca___: you used peeps?
[14:45] <luca___> rick_h_: juju-gui-peeps@lists.launchpad.net
[14:45] <rick_h_> hatch: please join in the call then if you've got architecture ideas
[14:45] <rick_h_> luca___: that's private and cool
[14:45] <luca___> rick_h_: nice, had a mini heart attack
[14:45] <hatch> rick_h_ linky?
[14:45] <hatch> luca___ haha I hate it when that happens
[14:46] <rick_h_> kadams54: can you setup a link please?
[14:46] <kadams54> Yup
[14:46] <hatch> this almond milk is vile
[14:46] <luca___> yeah, hatch
[14:46] <luca___> don’t you date bad mouth tokens!
[14:46] <hatch> #lifestylechange
[14:47] <hatch> haha
[14:47] <kadams54> rick_h_: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7acpinhuclebv09kb1or515ac4
[14:48] <rick_h_> hatch: ^
[14:48] <hatch> hmm
[14:49] <hatch> kadams54 it says I'm not allowed to join
[14:49] <rick_h_> hatch: connect from canonical account
[14:49] <rick_h_> use a private browser tab if required
[14:49] <hatch> ahh ok
[14:55] <rick_h_> jujugui call in 5 kanban please
[15:01] <rick_h_> jujugui call now
[15:02] <frankban> rick_h_: we are in https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/calendar/cmljay5oYXJkaW5nQGNhbm9uaWNhbC5jb20.t3m5giuddiv9epub48d9skdaso
[15:18] <hatch__> Makyo so how is your coffeescript coming? Are you finding that you're actually more productive with it?
[15:19] <Makyo> hatch, yeah, I'm liking it.  It feels more expressive.  There's a quirk with order of operations with regards to parens which took some getting used to, but that's about it. Once I started thinking of it as a compiled language, it made sense.
[15:21] <hatch> innnteresting
[15:22] <Makyo> It's like working with Java in a way (the concept, not the language).  You write something that compiles down to very succinct byte code.
[15:25] <hatch> what is this order of operations thing?
[15:25] <hatch> my google fu is failing me
[15:28] <Makyo> Parens are optional for function calls, so you can do foo bar, baz and it calls foo with bar and baz as arguments.  But if you have foo(bar(a, b), baz) and try to do foo bar a, b, baz, that reduces to foo(bar(a), b, baz), so if you have function calls as arguments, it's best to just use parens.  It's a language design thing.  Sometimes it's good (I'm looking at you, d3 chaining), but sometimes it increases confusion rather than increasing
[15:28] <Makyo>  readability.
[15:33] <hatch> ahhh yeah that would be a tough bug to find too
[15:40] <hatch> rick_h_ is ~charmers/precise/mysql-9 supposed to work the same as precise/mysql-9 ?
[15:40] <hatch> at the moment it just gives an empty details tab
[15:40] <rick_h_> hatch: depends, it may/may not be the same charm
[15:40] <hatch> oh I thought that for it to be promoted it had to be charmers
[15:41] <rick_h_> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~charmers/charms/precise/mysql/trunk/files yea it should because it is a ~charmers branch
[15:41] <rick_h_> hatch: it's not always true, see the juju-gui promulgated charm
[15:41] <rick_h_> hatch: the ~charmers rule is ONLY always true for bundles
[15:42] <hatch> oh ok so it's a bug in....charmworld? 
[15:42] <hatch> https://manage.jujucharms.com/api/3/charm/~charmers/precise/mysql-38 404s
[15:43] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, so bug we dont' see much because we intentionally drop the user for promulgated charms
[15:43] <rick_h_> hatch: feel free to file on charmworld
[15:43] <hatch> I'm just trying to figure out if I should parse ~charmers out of the url in the GUI
[15:44] <rick_h_> no, if it's specified by the user then it should be there
[15:44] <rick_h_> however, internals might do that when generating links using logic
[15:44] <hatch> ok sounds good, I'll file the charmworld bug then
[15:44] <Makyo> Woo plumbers
[15:44] <rick_h_> so links to a promulgated bundles might generate a link without it, but if a user enters it, it's valid
[15:44] <rick_h_> Makyo: lol
[15:45] <hatch> yay plumbers!
[15:52] <hatch> kadams54 wrong G+ account :)
[15:52] <hatch> that was my work one
[16:10] <Makyo> This is gonna be ugly.  Oh well.  At least we'll have it fixed.
[16:10] <rick_h_> Makyo: heh, heavy machinery leaves marks 
[16:10] <Makyo> Yep.
[16:11] <Makyo> Also having to run the line in along the ceiling to avoid having to either bore through or tear up the concrete pad.
[16:11] <Makyo> Unforunately, the studs run the wrong way, so that means outside the drywall.
[16:12] <rick_h_> Makyo: can you confirm for me which browser returned "" and which one was null?
[16:12] <hatch> man we have a lot of urls
[16:12] <rick_h_> Makyo: re: the friday talk for a blog post on it
[16:12] <rick_h_> hatch: more coming
[16:12] <Makyo> rick_h_, firefox was null, chrome was ""
[16:13] <rick_h_> Makyo: ty
[16:15] <bac> hey jcastro, i'm investigating the discrepancy between your bundles on m.j.c (http://manage.jujucharms.com/search?search_text=bundle%3A+jorge&op=) and on staging (http://staging.jujucharms.com/search?search_text=bundle%3A+jorge&op=)
[16:15] <bac> jcastro: i assumed the extras on staging were 'stale' ones, removed from launchpad, that were not deleted from staging, but that does not seem to be the case.  any insight?
[16:21] <rick_h_> jujugui off to dr biab
[16:21] <kadams54> Makyo, hatch: Just catching up on the coffeescript discussion. We started to write our tests in it on my last job.
[16:22] <kadams54> Things got much easier once our resident coffeescript expert told me, "Oh yeah, it's kinda of an unwritten convention to just be explicit about parens"
[16:22] <kadams54> That was the most confusing thing for me: just because Coffeescript allows certain syntactical laziness/shortcuts doesn't mean you should actually use them.
[16:22] <hatch> so they fixed some javascript oddities and created new ones for kicks
[16:22] <hatch> lol
[16:23] <kadams54> I think everything works out once you get a handle on the conventions
[16:23] <kadams54> I just wish the language had more balls to be opinionated
[16:23] <hatch> I figure it's going to go away come ES6/7
[16:23] <rick_h_> <3 python and pep8 pep257, etc
[16:24] <kadams54> Yup
[16:24] <kadams54> If you just use the syntax conventions of python, you'll be fine
[16:24] <kadams54> Except for the whole underscore vs. camelcase thing
[16:24] <kadams54> DON'T DO THAT IN COFFEESCRIPT!
[16:24] <kadams54> ;-)
[16:24] <hatch> lol what?
[16:25] <kadams54> var my_variable_is_cool
[16:25] <kadams54> Instead of:
[16:25] <kadams54> var myVariableIsCool
[16:25] <kadams54> I told rick_h_ you can always spot python devs writing JS code
[16:25] <hatch> yep
[16:25] <hatch> we had many discussions about that when rick_h_ started on the team
[16:25] <hatch> haha
[16:25] <hatch> camelCaseForTheWin!
[16:26] <kadams54> I don't think one is inherently better than the other
[16:26] <kadams54> I just hate mixing
[16:26] <kadams54> And camelcase is standard in the JS world
[16:27] <hatch> yeah it is
[16:27] <hatch> someone did a study once that proved that snake case was better
[16:30] <hatch> I think if I'm going to use vim I'll need to remap caps lock to escape
[16:30] <hatch> switching modes sucks so much reading for escape all the tiome
[16:33] <hatch> ok we have about 50 different url formats....I think
[16:33] <hatch> I might have missed some
[16:34] <kadams54> ?
[16:36] <hatch> kadams54 which one?
[16:36] <hatch> I made two statements :)
[16:36] <kadams54> 50 different URL formats… not sure what you mean by that.
[16:36] <hatch> ohh like /bundle/hadoop/3/demo
[16:36] <hatch>  /bundle/hadoop/demo
[16:36] <hatch> ...
[16:37] <hatch> it wouldn't be as bad if we dropped support for old urls heh
[16:37] <hatch> but that's not a good idea
[16:37] <kadams54> Ah
[16:40] <Makyo> Only took them 10 minutes to knock out the internet.  Record time.
[16:50] <Makyo> jujugui going to conserve data from tethering and run offline; still have charmworld set up.  Will have phone if you need me.
[16:50] <hatch> lol
[16:50] <hatch> cya
[17:31] <Makyo> Well, no Internet until Tuesday, so no sense in conserving.
[17:32] <Makyo> Will have to work from the coffee shop Monday anyway.
[17:34] <hatch> did they put a backhoe through the phone line or something?
[17:51] <frankban> guihelp: I need two reviews + QA for https://codereview.appspot.com/84630043 (python/quickstart). Some QA steps need compiling the juju-core 1.18 branch. Anyone available?
[17:51] <frankban> thanks a lot and have a great weekend!
[17:51] <Makyo> hatch, yeah
[17:51] <bac> frankban: i can do qa, since i have everything in place from yesterday
[17:52] <frankban> bac: yeah it would be great, thanks
[18:19] <bac> jcastro: did you see my question here about an hour ago?
[18:20] <jcastro> bac, been slammed one sec
[18:20] <bac> jcastro: no rush, just would like five minutes of your time today, whenever
[18:20] <jcastro> now is the time!
[18:20] <jcastro> ok so I keep a bunch of bundles in ~jorge
[18:21] <jcastro> but all the ones that are important got promoted to ~charmers
[18:29] <BradCrittenden> jcastro: yeah, but staging and m.j.c show different ones for ~jorge.  so i'm trying to figure out why the difference.  my theory about you deleting them off LP is wrong.
[18:30] <BradCrittenden> (sorry, i lost connectivity)
[18:30] <jcastro> I have no clue why they are different, heh
[18:31] <jcastro> maybe some of them pass proof but some don't?
[18:32] <hatch> rick_h_ when you return, in your experience did the router parse hashes for you?
[18:32] <BradCrittenden> jcastro: thanks.  i'll keep looking
[18:51] <rick_h_> hatch: yea we had to update it to do that
[18:52] <hatch> rick_h_ alright I didn't think it did it by default
[18:52] <hatch> thx
[18:53] <rick_h_> hatch: map jj to esc
[18:53] <rick_h_> " Maps for jj to act as Esc
[18:53] <rick_h_> ino jj <esc>
[18:53] <rick_h_> cno jj <c-c>
[18:53] <jcastro> Charm school at the top of the hour, The topic is Juju Plugins:  http://ubuntuonair.com, we'll be taking questions in #juju
[18:53] <hatch> interesting....why jj vs caps?
[18:54] <rick_h_> hatch: because caps lock is ctrl
[18:54] <rick_h_> hatch: and because jj is on home row
[18:54] <rick_h_> and almost never used in real typiung
[18:54] <rick_h_> typing
[18:54] <rick_h_> so your hands stay where they already are
[18:54] <hatch> ahh ok that makes sense
[19:52] <kadams54> rick_h_: Looking through the Token class, I see some stuff that's charm-specific
[19:53] <kadams54> _charmIconSetter, utils.determineEntityDataType(cfg) [19:55] <kadams54> Wondering if the first task should be to refactor Token into something more generic
[19:58] <hatch> kadams54 imho they are a little too different that the shared parts would be minimal
[19:59] <hatch> it might be pre optimization 
[20:06] <kadams54> I can understand that for machines, but deployed units (my card) are basically charms attached to a container/machine, right?
[20:07] <hatch> hmm those are the ones in the first of the three columns in the machine view?
[20:08] <hatch> those will need to be expanded to create new machines and whatnot
[20:08] <hatch> so much more complex than the charm tokens
[20:08] <kadams54> The first column is undeployed units
[20:08] <hatch> ohh
[20:08] <hatch> hmm lemme take a look at the design again
[20:08] <kadams54> The third column is containers and the units deployed within them
[20:09] <kadams54> i.e., charms that have been deployed to a specific machine and/or container
[20:10] <rick_h_> kadams54: no, the token is used here
[20:10] <rick_h_> just the general idea as a model
[20:10] <rick_h_> kadams54: no, because unit tokens will have these mix ins for the constraints, machine selector, etc
[20:10] <rick_h_> I think it's a totally different thing than the charm token which is static, never updates, no new metadata/data entry on it
[20:11] <hatch> yeah any shared functionality will be minimal
[20:11] <kadams54> OK. I started off coding up a DeployedUnit class that was based conceptually on Token
[20:11] <kadams54> Then started to reconsider
[20:11] <rick_h_> kadams54: and tokens are currently charms/bundles and you'll have many unit tokens for a given service
[20:11] <kadams54> But sounds like I was on the right track…
[20:11] <rick_h_> kadams54: and tokens are widgets and we want to try to use views as they'll give us a nicer event design for this
[20:11] <rick_h_> kadams54: there's still to look at, getting the right icon, etc
[20:12] <rick_h_> but the interactions and such will be vastly different and more complicated with one only 'size' or version to be drawn vs many for charm tokens
[20:12] <kadams54> Yeah, I've spent most of the afternoon perusing through View and Widget docs, as well as watching that Luke Smith presentation
[20:12] <rick_h_> did that presentation help some?
[20:12] <rick_h_> as far as designing YUI classes and structure
[20:13] <kadams54> Yes
[20:17] <hatch> rick_h_ if you have an inspector open with charm details and you have the relations tab selected AND the code tab selected in the details
[20:17] <hatch> that's two hashes
[20:18] <hatch> do we maybe drop the idea of using hashes
[20:18] <hatch> because they aren't scalable with the multi url story
[20:27] <rick_h_> hatch: no, we have to have only one hash, so I don't think we support hashes for tabs in the inspector
[20:28] <rick_h_> hatch: I dont know that the case of tabs in the inspector are as strong a user story
[20:28] <rick_h_> I can see wanting to show you the code or readme of a charm
[20:28] <rick_h_> the config tab on a service? there's the config tab in the details. 
[20:29] <rick_h_> hatch: so I think we keep the existing functionality, wrap it into service details, and skip it on the inspector, what do you think?
[20:29] <hatch> yeah that's fine - thinking a little further ahead, are there other instances where we would have the charm details open and something else which would require a hash?
[20:29] <rick_h_> on top of that, it's not something we've supported to date and I don't recall seeing any feature requests for it so far. 
[20:29] <hatch> thinking of when they have the charm details in the 'sidebar' view
[20:30] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, we'll have to look into that at that time
[20:30] <hatch> ok dumb hash parsing it is!
[20:30] <hatch> *phew*
[20:31] <rick_h_> yea, if we can support something now that we didn't support before I'm +1 (like charm details tabs and service details tabs)
[20:31] <rick_h_> but not going to break out back trying to support all things
[20:31] <rick_h_>  /out/our
[20:32] <rick_h_> obviously let me know if you find a case where you disagree and we can look into it more
[20:32] <hatch> yeah I can't think of any beyond the one I mentioned first...but if we drop the inspector hashes then all's good
[20:32] <rick_h_> hatch: how goes it overall? 
[20:33] <hatch> good good I'm just trying to write a thing for router to return a request object form a url string
[20:33] <rick_h_> going to EOD soon, dinner with folks tonight, so let me know if you want to have any chat/etc before the weekend hits
[20:34] <rick_h_> hatch: can we just use the YUI router code to do that for us? Something already takes the url to req, resp, next
[20:34] <rick_h_> and we're just messing with the req part
[20:34] <hatch> you'd think! Nick wrote a method for an old version of YUI that I'm going to repurpose - it still requires the router but the router doesn't have a good access point for that
[20:34] <hatch> it builds the url all over the darn place
[20:34] <rick_h_> ah, sucky
[20:34] <rick_h_> well I could hope :)
[20:35] <hatch> it has one nice method _getRequest()
[20:35] <hatch> which unfortunately requires something totally different passed in than a url
[20:35] <hatch> heh
[20:35] <rick_h_> well yea, I mean it's just got to be close as the route thing isn't parsing a ton, just the few routes
[20:35] <rick_h_> so easy enough to hardcode 
[20:36] <hatch> yeah I have about 50 routes
[20:36] <hatch> once this is done it'll make testing them super easy
[20:36] <rick_h_> but the router bit isn't parsing those, the new code will. Mocking YUI router is just the three?
[20:36] <rick_h_> or am I misunderstanding? the complicated code handling 50 combinations is in the state.loadRequest right?
[20:36] <hatch> the parseUrl method that I made takes a request object. I need to get from the url to the request object
[20:37] <rick_h_> right, the request object will be one of 3 routes (ok, with a querystring or hash on it?)
[20:37] <rick_h_> it seems it should be a huge subset of the 50
[20:38] <hatch> right, but right now you add a url and a state object to a 'urls' object in the test and it runs through them all
[20:38] <hatch> super easy to add/remove/modify the tests then
[20:38] <rick_h_> right, but I'm worried the parsing code is going in the wrong place at the moment. 
[20:38] <rick_h_> because it's doing more than YUI will do when you put it in place
[20:38] <hatch> nope the parseUrl takes the request object from the router
[20:39] <hatch> I just need to get to that request object from the url in the tests
[20:39] <rick_h_> hatch: call? 
[20:39] <hatch> yeah sure
[20:39] <hatch> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/76cpir8rpegm2m1llno864gvog?hl=en
[20:46] <rick_h_> jujugui have a great weekend all. I'm out
[20:47] <bac> you too rick_h_
[21:12] <kadams54> seeya
[21:19] <bac> jujugui: frankban still needs one more review.  i've done the qa.  https://codereview.appspot.com/84630043/
[21:19] <bac> have a nice weekend