/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/04/29/#ubuntu-uk.txt

maps|wrkgrmph00:12
maps|wrkeveryone gone to sleep?00:26
maps|wrk:)00:26
maps|wrkanyone looked at http://goodnightlamp.com/ ?00:36
shaunoI don't get it00:41
maps|wrkim not sure i do really00:41
maps|wrkit seems a bit pointless to me?00:41
maps|wrkGood Night Lamp is a physical social network. It allows you to keep in touch with people all over the world. When you buy Good Night Lamp it comes as a set of two lamps: a Big Lamp and a Little Lamp. When you turn on your Big Lamp, the Little Lamp turns on too. You can send your Little Lamp to your friend or family member anywhere in the world. There is no lengthy setup and no internet connection needed.00:42
maps|wrkuses the phone network and when  i turn my big light on the small liht also come on..great whats the point of that?00:42
maps|wrk* The Good Night Lamp Lightning service is free for five years. pah they expect people to pay after? O_o00:43
shaunosounds reasonable enough00:44
shaunoI mean, you'd be crazy to promise lifetime support when you're selling stuff that's so pointless you're not going to be in business next week00:45
maps|wrkyea00:46
maps|wrkbut the actual concept? i dont see the need for it00:46
MooDoohello all06:13
mappsmorning MooDoo mate06:25
MooDoohow's it going mapps06:25
mappsnot bad mate...u?06:42
mappswas just watching black gold:) always find theres stuff on between 6-8am i like watching06:42
dwatkinsis that a TV channel, mapps?07:56
mappsits the show about drilling for oil..us show shown on ITV2/3 atn like 6/7am07:56
mappsjust watched the following finale ;D07:57
dwatkinsaha interesting07:57
dwatkinsare there prizes? do they eject people from the house^W rig if they're naughty?07:57
DJonesmapps: Has Bobby Ewing got out of the shower yet07:58
mappshttp://www.imdb.com/title/tt1239472/07:58
mappsi dont think so dwatkins07:59
mappsits just kinda interesting imo07:59
dwatkinsyeah, I'm just kidding07:59
mappsyou seen it? its decent enough07:59
diploMorning all07:59
mappsmorning diplo07:59
mappsthe finale of the following was good too08:00
dwatkinsno, I did enjoy Ice Road Truckers, though.08:00
mappsah yea thats kinda cool08:00
bashrcmorning08:01
mappsmorning bashrc08:02
bigcalmGood morning peeps :)08:04
mappssleep time for me now08:05
mappsthink im the only one that works nights here heh08:05
TheOpenSourcererpopey: You asked: http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2014/04/how-to-install-a-squid-dansguardian-content-filter-on-ubuntu-server/08:22
popeyyay08:22
=== msm is now known as Guest18667
smittixMorning all08:35
MooDoohowdy smittix08:36
smittix:D08:36
brobostigon[A09:24
brobostigonmorning boys and girls.09:24
dwatkinshey brobostigon09:27
brobostigonhi dwatkins09:28
andylockranhowdy all09:28
brobostigonmorning andylockran09:29
bashrcmorning09:29
brobostigonmorning bashrc09:30
BigRedSdoes setting xdebug.profiler_enable to 0 effectively turn xdebug off (so I can rule that out as why everything's going slowly)?09:58
davmor2Morning all09:59
MooDoomorning davmor209:59
BigRedSoh, and good morning everyone! :)09:59
davmor2MooDoo: Ow's Life up norff10:00
MooDoodavmor2: aye not bad lad10:02
jussigot a good laugh out of this... http://www.brewdog.com/blog-article/sorrynotsorry10:23
ali1234what browser is "browser"?11:12
brobostigonany of dozens of possibilities. :)11:12
ali1234it doesn't work properly anyway11:13
brobostigonwhich one?11:13
ali1234ubuntu browser11:13
brobostigonfirefox, chromium, etc. ?11:14
ali1234no11:14
ali1234ubuntu web browser11:14
ali1234the web browser made by ubuntu11:15
MooDooali1234: there isn't such as thing11:15
ali1234popey: tell them ^11:15
popeyYup.11:15
popeyoxide11:15
ali1234it doesn't appear to support javascript11:16
popeyexample site?11:16
ali1234dev.drumoff.tv click on the blue video thumbnails11:16
* MooDoo shuts up, you're referring to mobile aren't you11:16
popeyno, desktop11:16
MooDoooh11:16
ali1234it's available on desktop too11:16
popeywebbrowser-app html5test.com11:16
popeyseems to show quite a bit of support11:16
ali1234it still have the mobile UI though, which makes it incredibly difficult to use, but hey, early days11:17
jussiwaiiit.... what?11:17
jussiubuntu wants to become google?11:17
ali1234also it isn't correctly preserving aspect ratio on divs11:17
popeyali1234: what doesn't work?11:17
popey(I mean, specifically on your site)11:17
popeyI am seeing the nice pictures scrolling, cat!11:17
ali1234popey: click the blue video thumbnails - the videos don't play. it doesn't even load up11:17
ali1234compare the site on ... well pretty much anything else11:17
popeyplays here11:18
* popey watches someone drum11:18
popeymohawk!11:18
ali1234also if you horizontally resize the window, notice that the thumbnails aspect ratio isn't preserved11:18
ali1234oh yeah mohawk guy... well, why doesn't it work here?11:18
popeysome do, some dont11:18
popeyyou're missing codecs11:18
ali1234hmm11:18
popeyoxideqt-codecs-extra11:18
popeyinstall that11:19
ali1234the horizontal resize/aspect ratio thing applies to the whole page... that's really weird11:19
ali1234well, it can't be codecs... the div doesn't even get replaced with the iframe11:19
ali1234in the jquery code, when you click a video, it gets the parent element of "Choose a video." and does .html('<iframe>...') on it11:20
ali1234that event isn't even firing here11:20
ali1234and yeah the resize thing is because it's resizing a bitmap while it rerenders the page properly11:20
ali1234still doesn't work with the codecs11:21
popeyodd, works here.11:23
ali1234though the javascript must be running, because the thumbnail rows work okay11:23
ali1234can i get a debug console?11:23
ali1234object inspector?11:23
popey--inspector11:23
popey  --inspector        run a remote inspector on port 922111:23
ali1234what's the command called?11:23
popey webbrowser-app --inspector dev.drumoff.tv11:23
popeyshould do it?11:24
popeynever used it myself..11:24
ali1234are you rnning a bleeding edge version or something?11:24
* popey points at chrisccoulson 11:24
popeytrusty11:24
ali1234because i've only got whatever demo is in trusty11:24
diploAnyone use php curl here ?11:24
popey  Installed: 0.23+14.04.20140416-0ubuntu111:24
diploOn my local dev my code downloads images I'm trying to get fine, on my VPS it downloads as a 404 file, exactly the same code11:25
ali1234jsbin.com doesn't work at all for me11:27
selinuxiumHi all, anyone here had any experience with Spiceworks?11:27
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch
popeyOoh, thunder11:54
DJones...thunder...thunder...thundercats...hoooo12:05
MartijnVdSDJones: oh man I used to watch that :)12:05
MartijnVdSa *LOT*12:05
MartijnVdSback in the 80s?12:05
diploheh, my kids are in to it in a big way now12:06
diploAnd 80's sounds about right12:06
DJonesYeah, same here, it nice to relax to as a student12:07
davmor2DJones: see I see popey type thunder and I hear this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uT3SBzmDxGk12:08
davmor2curses youtube for ruining his childhood cartoon connection :)12:09
DJonesI had either thundercats or "bolt and lightning, very, very frightening"12:11
MartijnVdSgalileo?12:11
DJonesYep12:12
davmor2Figaro12:12
MooDooda da da da da da da da da dadadada :)12:13
DJonesHeh https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t1.0-9/486694_467187566724623_2128209998_n.png12:23
MooDooDJones: oh that's fab :)12:47
DJonesMade me smile anyway12:48
MooDoome too I've shared it on FB12:48
DJonesWonder how long it'll be till McDonalds, Starbucks & Burger King try to get it taken down12:50
=== alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g
ali1234DJones: http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/31/de/e5/31dee50261eabeeb7fd0721308fb5a2d.jpg13:14
ali1234top left is relevant, the others are amusing too13:14
DJonesTop left isscary13:14
=== bashrc_ is now known as bashrc
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|tea
=== alan_g|tea is now known as alan_g
foobarryif i am configuring calendars for the evlution data server, do i need evolution app too?14:56
foobarryi want to configure calendar apps that alelgedly support eds14:56
MartijnVdSno e-d-s is separate14:57
popeynope15:02
popeyi dont have evolution installed and i use eds15:02
popey(we use it on the phone too)15:02
foobarryhow does one config eds?15:03
awilkinsI've just ignored eds since I've never found a way to integrate it with Thunderbird / Lightning / Google Calendar15:04
popeyi only know the answer for ubuntu15:04
awilkinsIs there a Calendar lens?15:04
foobarrypopey: what's the answer for ubuntu pls?15:05
foobarrywould be a start15:05
popeycog -> online accounts15:05
=== Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte
foobarry!info evolution-ews15:17
lubotu3evolution-ews (source: evolution-ews): Exchange Web Services integration for Evolution. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.8.4-0ubuntu1 (saucy), package size 289 kB, installed size 1481 kB15:17
foobarrynot in 12.04 :(15:22
aquariuspopey, ping: what would you want to see in a syncthing indicator?15:38
popeyaquarius: is it running, is there an update (shush about packaging), any transfers pending, whether every other machine is in sync or not15:39
aquariusOK, cool.15:40
aquariusI'll look at the updates stuff15:41
popeyaquarius: buttons to pause/restart sync would be handy15:42
popeydunno if syncthing has an api to pause/restart sync15:42
diploI couldn't get syncthing to work last time I tried15:44
* diplo sets as a TODO for tomorrow 15:44
popeyupdated mine to 0.8.2 today15:45
aquariusafaict you can't pause and restart from the web gui15:45
aquariusso there's no API15:45
aquariusthe feature may not even exist15:45
aquariusyou can of course entirely stop syncthing15:45
aquariusbut how you do that is massively system-dependent15:45
aquariuson my machine you'd do "stop syncthing" but on yours probably not :P15:46
diplohttps://github.com/calmh/syncthing - That the right one ?15:47
popeyyes15:47
diploGreat thanks15:47
popeyi love it ☻15:48
diploI really like the look of it but couldn't get it to run between my machines15:48
diploWould like to also do windows machines that I had an issue with15:48
diploDo you just use it locally popey ?15:53
popeyi use it between 3 machines at home15:53
popeyi haven't yet exposed it to the outside15:53
diploah right, probably what I want to do.. but I'll try between this machine and a VM for a start I guess15:54
* peng42phone waits for the bus back from Alton towers15:56
Laneyman15:57
Laneyaren't rainbow just a great band15:57
* Laney inches closer to becoming his dad15:57
peng42phoneWho?15:58
Laneyrainbow15:58
peng42phoneNever heard of them15:59
Laneyi recommend changing that fact15:59
bashrcwhat genre?15:59
Laneyi suspect you'd probably call them classic rock nowadays16:00
peng42phoneA.t. was pretty much empty, walk on to most stuff (especially as single rider) and the weather has been great16:01
peng42phoneLaney: what year where they big?16:01
Laneysecond half of the 70s to the 80s16:03
peng42phoneHmm, I do know a lot of the softer 70s stuff and more common stuff16:04
Laneyyou probably know since you've been gone16:04
peng42phoneAnd anyway when people say rainbow I think zipper and bungle16:06
peng42phoneY16:06
daftykinshttps://www.dropbox.com/s/pz32na7dtmsk65k/IMG_20140429_170456.jpg16:07
daftykinsglad these aren't for me16:07
Laneysrsly16:07
Laneycan't you get third party ones :(16:08
daftykinsyou can if you don't want them to last16:08
ali1234popey: i rewrote all my jquery and it works now in webbrowser-app... weird16:08
daftykinsfar too much cheap knock off stuff going on for lightning, if you check out amazon the reviews are not great16:08
aquariuspopey, wanna try the indicator? It doesn't talk to actual syncthing yet because calmh hasn't written the events API, but you can experiment with it and send fake events16:09
ali1234i notice that webbrowser-app follows the same none-standard behaviour of safari and chrome, where it won't autoplay html5 video unless the user clicks the player once16:10
Laneywebbrowser-app handily triggers a nouveau bug which locks up my machine16:10
ali1234this "feature" would be fine if there was a way to do feature detection on it, but there isn't :(16:11
ali1234the only way to detect it is to try to autoplay a video, wait 5 seconds, and then test if the video is hanging16:11
peng42phoneAli1234: hmm that sounds a reasonable feature frankly16:11
ali1234or do browser sniffing. both ways really suck16:11
ali1234yeah it's reasonable. it's only a feature on mobile devices16:12
ali1234so iphone and android16:12
aquariusthat's not non-standard.16:12
popeyaquarius: sure, in an hour, on a call.16:12
ali1234show me where it is documented how to tell whether a webbrowser will do this or not then16:12
daftykinsauto video playback should be banned16:13
aquariusthat you can't tell whether it's doing it or not does not mean that you're not allowed to do it. :)16:13
peng42phoneAli1234: I think I'd like it on desktop as well16:13
aquariusthe standard actively encourages browser vendors to require user interaction16:13
ali1234you can disable autoplay on deskop too16:13
aquariusI agree that it's annoying that you can't tell whether it's happened!16:13
aquariusalthough...16:13
ali1234but the way it is implemented also prevent any site that wants to have a play button that is outside the video window16:13
aquariuscan't you just check one second after the page loads whether the video is in playing state?16:14
ali1234and rather than say, just doing nothing, if you call playVideoById() on one of the non-standard implementations, it hangs the player on a black screen16:14
ali1234aquarius: no, because i am not trying to autoplay a video16:14
ali1234i am trying to implement a playlist, remember?16:15
ali1234the only problem for me is that 1. i need an annoying workaround in the code just for this case and 2. the user has to click twice instead of once before they can watch a video16:15
aquariusyou could make the "play" button *be* the video element, and then just move it when they click on it ;)16:16
ali1234user has to click the playlist item for the video, and then click the play button in the video window. but only on mobile devices16:16
bashrcis there any way of showing bank holidays on the calendar, as in KDE?16:16
ali1234aquarius: no, impossible, because i am using youtube embeds16:16
aquariusah16:16
aquariuspopey, nw, let me know when16:21
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|EOD
popeyaquarius: yo, around16:42
aquariuspopey, git clone https://github.com/stuartlangridge/syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.git16:44
aquariuspopey, edit syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.py line 58 and set it to wherever your syncthing is16:45
aquariuspopey, run "python testserver.py" in a terminal16:45
aquariuspopey, run "python syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.py" in another terminal16:45
aquariusthen you can generate events in the testserver.py terminal by pressing keys 1-516:46
* peng42phone passes a sign 'Beware! Bikers' I wonder if that's aims are 2 or 4 wheeled readers16:46
popeyi see a cloud16:47
aquariusgood. If you hit 3 in the testserver window, which is a "PULL_START" event (a file has started syncing down to this computer), the cloud should indicate that syncing is going on16:48
aquariusand there is information in the menu that syncing is going on16:48
popeythe cloud does, it's grey though so hard to see16:48
aquariushitting 4 in the testserver window will send a "PULL_COMPLETE" event (that file has now successfully synced to this machine), and the cloud should stop indicating that syncing is happening16:49
popeyyup, that all works16:49
aquariusgrey? shouldn't be; the cloud is white16:49
aquariusscreenshot?16:49
aquariusbasically, you've seen what it does, now -- the question is, what else should it show, and how? and does it need all the info that it currently displays?16:50
popeyhttps://imgur.com/PS8ZUnA16:50
popeydropbox sync thing tells you which specific file is being synced which is nice to know16:50
popey"Oh, it's doing that giant file"16:51
popey"Oh, why is it syncing that, i thought I'd deleted it"16:51
popeyetc16:51
aquariusah, that's a good idea, yeah, I can do that16:51
aquariuswtf?16:51
aquariusah.16:51
popeydropbox also has a recently changed files thing16:51
aquariusI used the same icon names as the sync menu16:52
aquariusI bet it's using the sync menu icons for you, not mine (which are very similar)16:52
aquariusI'll fix that16:52
aquariusand I'll show currently syncing files16:52
popeycool, thanks!16:52
aquariusand recent files (perhaps in a submenu)16:52
shauno'recently changed' is ftw, that's the most common reason I use the dropbox icon rather than the folder16:53
popeyits not stopping when i CTRL+C16:53
* popey kills16:53
* popey wanders off for a bit16:54
popeyaquarius: also, notifications17:04
popeye.g. I see "17:14:45: Connection to Desktop closed: ping timeout" in the web UI17:05
popeythat would do as a notification17:05
popeymaybe17:05
aquariuspopey, most of that stuff now fixed17:36
popeyooh17:36
aquariuspopey, ^C works; you should get my icons now; recently synced and currently syncing17:36
aquariusI'm not sure about notifications17:36
aquariusit's really really irritating to get a zillion notifications...17:37
aquariuspopey, update with "git pull", I think17:37
popeystill grey17:38
aquariusrly?17:38
popeyand ctrl+c still fails to kill it17:39
aquariusdoes "grep client-idle syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.py" show any lines?17:39
aquariusok, I don't think you've got the newest version :)17:39
aquariustry "git pull origin master"17:39
popeyoh, hang on17:39
aquariusman, I hate git :)17:39
popeypull failed because I edited it17:40
aquariusah17:40
aquariusyeah17:40
aquariusyou could edit it back17:40
popeynvm17:40
popeydelete, re-clone17:40
aquariusor "git fetch" or "git merge" perhaps17:40
aquariusbut just bin it and reclone is prolly easier ;)17:41
popeytoo much effort17:41
popeynew ugly icon ☻17:41
mappsevening folks17:42
aquariuspopey, ha!17:42
aquariuspopey, bust out inkscape and do better ;)17:42
popey17:42
aquariuspopey, the rest should work though17:44
popeyyup17:49
aquariusgood. Anything else you think it should do, or that it does do that you think that it does not need?17:50
aquarius(note: it also will tell you about updates, if there are any)17:50
aquariusannoyingly, it needs a config window, I think17:54
aquariusunless reading syncthing's own config file is kosher17:54
popeyaquarius: a link to the support disqus site?18:06
aquariusI think that reading syncthing's config file is kosher, so I'm gonna do that.18:08
aquariusNo config windows for me; that's rubbish18:08
aquariusit makes the indicator feel like a separate app rather than part of syncthing.18:08
TheProphet[S]Hi all, trying to connect to wife from console, but dhclient hangs on dhcpdiscover18:34
TheProphet[S]To WiFi sorry18:34
daftykinslol18:35
TheProphet[S]I'm using wpa supplicant and the wext driver18:35
daftykinsi was going to say, that protocol hasn't been refined yet18:35
daftykinsdoes static addressing work?18:35
neuroGOOD EVENING PEOPLE, IT IS I, THE NEURO18:36
daftykinsoh crikey not you!18:36
daftykins:D18:36
ali1234popey: git reset --hard HEAD && git clean -d -f18:36
neurodaftykins: YES, TIS I18:37
daftykins*gasp*18:37
davmor2neuro: seeing that statement now makes me wonder if it is actually you, or just an elaborate double bluff :)18:38
neuroTIS NOT AN ELABORATE BLUFF18:38
neuroLOOK AT MY USE OF CAPITALS18:38
daftykinsooh my, drama and intrigue in #ubuntu-uk18:38
TheProphet[S]Daftykins not sure about static addressing18:38
daftykinsgive it a try?18:39
davmor2neuro: but I haven't seen you use one yet I mean no LONDON, EDINBURGH nothing18:39
daftykinsTheProphet[S]: though often no DHCP communications suggests a bad driver, or failed wireless key auth18:39
neuroLondon? Edinburgh?18:40
neuroI am in neither of these places18:40
davmor2neuro: no but they are CAPITALS :P18:41
neurojpc18:42
TheProphet[S]I guess "network is unreachable" is not a good message to get when trying to ping18:42
neuronope18:42
daftykins^18:42
TheProphet[S]Maybe the syntax is wrong, but I followed how to on Ubuntu forum18:43
mappshm18:44
mapps9eps behind on hannibal serie 218:44
daftykinsTheProphet[S]: sometimes routers/APs in mixed-mode WPA1 and 2 can trip things up18:46
TheProphet[S]I'm probably doing something wrong18:47
TheProphet[S]I start with ifconfig wlan0 up18:49
TheProphet[S]Then wpa_supplicant -B -Dwext -iwlan0 -c/etc/wpa_supplicant.conf18:51
TheProphet[S]The conf file contains network={18:52
TheProphet[S]ssid="abcd"18:52
TheProphet[S]psk="pass"18:52
TheProphet[S]}18:52
daftykins!paste18:53
lubotu3Pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://pastebin.ubuntu-uk.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)18:53
daftykinshopefully you have a space there "-c /etc/wpa_su..."18:53
TheProphet[S]I'm actually typing it sorry, I'm using my phone to chat because of no connection on PC18:54
TheProphet[S]There's no space on man pages between -c and path to file18:54
daftykinsthat seems odd18:55
TheProphet[S]I think wpa_supplicant works with no spaces, same goes for the driver wext option -D which becomes -Dwext18:56
TheProphet[S]Problem could be that when I start wpa_supplicant as stated above the daemon starts successfully but I get an Invalid Argument error twice18:58
daftykinsyeah that's definitely not good18:58
daftykinsyour interface definitely is wlan0 then and not eth1 or something odd?18:58
MartijnVdSI installed a new machine last week, and it ended up with "p1p1" and "p3p1" instead of eth0 and eth119:02
TheProphet[S]Yes it is wlan019:04
daftykinsMartijnVdS: heh, funky drivers?19:05
MartijnVdS05:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller (rev 06)19:07
MartijnVdSapparently these names are "less confusing"?19:07
MartijnVdShttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/biosdevname/+bug/129363319:08
lubotu3Launchpad bug 1284043 in biosdevname (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1293633 udev renaming the same hardware network i/f to different name, breaks networking and firewall" [High,Confirmed]19:08
MartijnVdShttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2012-August/035670.html19:09
MartijnVdSit's because it's a server install19:09
daftykinshrmm19:10
diddledanmorning19:16
daftykinshowdy19:16
czajkowskialoha19:20
daftykinsa wild czajkowski o/19:21
diddledanin the wild, too19:21
czajkowskinope actually in the UK and working19:21
czajkowskialthough boggling at gmail19:22
czajkowskiwebmail shows 88 in inbox19:22
czajkowskidesktop client shows 11219:22
czajkowskino idea why the difference19:22
daftykinsmy Nexus 4 tells me i have '1 unread' when the inbox is at 019:25
daftykinsdrives me mad but if you go through pages and pages not one appears unread XD19:25
daftykinscould it be threading?19:25
czajkowskihmm possibly19:26
czajkowskitrying to get to 0 before Friday19:26
daftykins*mission impossible theme*19:26
diddledanhtf have I got 16.85million emails in my gmail account?!19:29
diddledan(apple's mail.app is still syncing after setting it up yesterday)19:29
daftykinsO_O19:29
daftykinsmail clients are so 2000's19:30
czajkowskiI do love thunderbird19:30
czajkowskinothing has come close to replacing it19:30
diddledanyeah, but I like to pgp19:30
daftykinsugh i have a client with thunderbird, its' settings for accounts and storage just became far too confused19:32
daftykinsthey're too tight to let me have them all standardised with google apps19:32
daftykinsmainly 'cause their current mail host keeps forgetting to charge them for anything, so their current fee = £019:32
penguin42it's embarrassing when you realise a supplier has never asked you to pay for something19:37
daftykins:D19:38
czajkowskihah #78 take that19:38
daftykinsa clients web hoster had a unique approach to finally asking for some money19:38
daftykinspulling the website with no warning19:38
daftykins\o/19:38
penguin42nasty19:38
penguin42daftykins: I've seen it where an electricity company only asked us to pay for 1 of 6 meters in a company I worked for - it took us a year or two to convince them we should be paying, and we were running a few 100A off it19:39
daftykinslol19:39
daftykinsclassic19:40
penguin42daftykins: It was after I went to look about adding more capacity and went to track down the details that I had to go look at the bill, and came to the conclusion we hadn't been paying for about 5 years19:41
daftykinsthat is some impressive stuff19:42
penguin42anyone got any idea what  http://imagebin.org/308206   text is - it's overlayed (with a load of other computery text) on 'The Smiler's funky displays19:42
daftykinshmm certainly getting nothing from Google from a guess of 'callPanelDivFreqInput'19:44
aquariuspopey, syncthing indicator now reads your config file to know where syncthing is, so no more editing needed for you19:44
popeyaquarius: sweet!19:45
popeythanks for working on that19:45
aquariusnw19:46
aquariusmakes sense19:46
aquariusI'm the one who customised his syncthing port, after all :P19:46
ali1234penguin42: it's the log from some mobile phone19:49
ali1234http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:4EzzENTDmFgJ:home.educities.edu.tw/fushiyun2000/gameconsole_jxd_jxd_200_hardware_uart.htm+&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=ubuntu19:49
penguin42ali1234: Since that says 'game console' and the other thing I found said playstation maybe it's more game dev?19:50
ali1234http://www.tripleoxygen.net/files/cybergame/log/minicom.cap119:50
ali1234it's from some chinese fake-iphone thing that doesn't know if it's a phone or a games console19:51
penguin42oh weird, mention of eCos as well19:52
aquariuspopey, something to think about: it's rare that you'd open the menu without a reason, which means that you are likely not to see that there's an update to syncthing20:03
aquariuspopey, this suggests that there should be an icon for "there's an update available". So, two questions: what does it look like, and more importantly what happens if there's an update available *and* a file is syncing?20:04
aquariusperhaps some sort of "download arrow" overlay? but it's a pretty small icon to show that sort of thing20:04
popeyit should change colour20:05
popey</mpt>20:05
directhexum...20:06
directhexrip off sparkleshare? a down arrow overlay for downloading, an exclamation mark for "look at me"20:06
directhex(plus corresponding up arrow)20:06
aquariusto what? there's no standard highlight colour, I can't think of any particular colour which means "there are updates", symbolic icons are monochrome, and I'm already worried about what it looks like with the radiance theme :)20:06
popeyblue20:06
popeymessaging menu20:06
aquariusdirecthex, what happens if it needs looking at *and* it's downloading?20:07
popeyhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/MessagingMenu/20:07
aquariusI already have circle arrows for "stuff is syncing" and an exclamation point (plus red icon) for "there is an error"20:07
popeyarrow in it, and blue20:07
aquariuspopey, ya, but that's calling for attention. Is "there's an update" worthy of calling for attention?20:07
popeyyes20:07
popeyrarely enough20:08
ali1234why aren't updates handled by the normal package manager?20:08
popeythey could be if it was packaged20:08
aquariusali1234, because nobody's packaged it yet20:08
ali1234seems like the answer is obvious then20:08
aquariussure thing. Let me know when you've packaged it. :)20:08
ali1234i don't even use it. why would i package it?20:09
ali1234i don't even know what it is :)20:09
aquariusyou said the answer was obvious; I assumed you meant that it was clear that you should package it ;)20:09
aquariusyou can't have meant it was obvious that *I* should package it; I know nothing about debian packaging. :)20:09
ali1234no, i mean the answer is you shouldn't worry about it20:10
popeyI'm inclined to agree. you shouldn't have to20:10
popeythat way lies windows nagware20:10
aquariusthe reason knowing about updates is important is that it's still moving really fast, and if you upgrade one node it breaks all the others :P20:10
ali1234when there are updates it should pop up a fullscreen modal dialog saying "please package this application"20:10
* aquarius laughs!20:10
aquariusI don't understand why you're not on the design team. I think they're missing an important voice. :)20:11
directhexno no no, you're going about it all wrong20:11
directhexit should not report that it has updates20:11
directhexthe standalone updater app, with its own tray icon, has that job20:11
aquariusso, two suggestions so far: go blue (popey), overlay some sort of icon (directhex)20:11
directhexthis also works around your "how to show update AND sync icon" dilema20:11
ali1234yes, bring back the update notifier tray icon20:12
directhexthe updater app can show a modal dialogue on boot!20:12
ali1234removing it was stupid, now i have to deal with that weird popup thing stealing focus all the time20:12
ali1234of course this won't help if it isn't packaged, but there you go20:12
popey"all the time"20:13
popeyI never see it20:13
directhexthe updater app can also helpfully install a browser toolbar on every update, unless you tick the hidden tickbox20:13
ali1234it pops up multiple times every day20:13
ali1234it pops up after every time i do "sudo apt-get update"20:13
diddledanhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVwAodrjZMY lol @ the bot20:14
ali1234and then it pops up again when "sudo apt-get dist-upgrade" finishes, to tell me to reboot20:14
ali1234and if i just close it, it pops up again after about 8 hours20:14
ali1234also all of my indicators are broken - whenever i try to use them i get dbus permission errors, ever since i installed ubuntu-sdk20:15
ali1234gnome-15 is also broken20:17
ali1234looks like installing ubuntu-desktop^ and ubuntu-sdk turned my system into a locked-down mobile-style thing where i can't touch anything or it crashes20:18
ali1234i think placekitten has banned me :)20:24
penguin42oh dear, ff29 is rolling out to trusty - and changing the whole layout to users during a normal upgrade20:25
ali1234nah, it's barely different20:25
ali1234the biggest difference is the fugly tabs20:25
penguin42ali1234: The hidden menu bar is the problem20:25
ali1234it's not hidden tho20:25
penguin42well, it certainly changed20:25
penguin42ali1234: I bet that'll fox a lot of non-technical users20:26
aquariusmenu bar isn't hidden; the global menu is still just as it was before, according to chrisccoulson20:26
penguin42aquarius: Bzzt - not here20:26
ali1234yes, or if you use a real desktop, you get a real menu bar just as before20:26
ali1234you have the unremovable hamburger thing as well20:26
penguin42ok, on Kubuntu it changed20:26
aquariusah. I don't know about Kubuntu.20:26
ali1234works fine on xfce20:26
penguin42It's easy enough to find the preferences thing and reenable display of menubar, but it's going to fox non-techies20:27
ali1234non-techies should not be using KDE20:27
chrisccoulsoni suspect these non-techies (ie, the other 400 million firefox users) probably won't care about the menubar when the functionality they use is accessible via the main menu panel20:27
penguin42chrisccoulson: They'll need showing where it is20:27
aquariusit's going to fox non-techies who are running Ubuntu and have installed an alternative desktop, yep. Why aren't Kubuntu distro-patching it, then? Ubuntu are, in order that it fits in with their desktop.20:28
penguin42aquarius: Because it's not their fault - it's Firefox's/packagers for changing the default like that20:28
ali1234xfce certainly haven't patched it and it has a menu bar by default - or at least if you upgrade your profile20:28
* penguin42 doesn't know this is only KDE - I'm just saying what I just hit as the upgrade hit here20:28
aquariuschrisccoulson, I am mildly disappointed that we need to distro patch it and FF upstream aren't doing that -- I bet they are for Mac, for example.20:29
ali1234i have even disabled all the ubuntu extensions20:29
ali1234maybe if you have never ever toggled the menu bar on/off it will hide it by default20:29
chrisccoulsonaquarius, there's a bug open, but I just don't have time to drive our patch through their review process atm. somebody is more than welcome to pick that up (and mozilla are open to having that functionality included)20:30
aquariuschrisccoulson, ah, they're happy to take it? Then fair play, and I apologise for doubting; if it's just going to take time to have that happen, that's cool with me20:30
penguin42It's going to be a PITA for people with non-tech relatives/or labs full of stuff20:30
chrisccoulsonpenguin42, it's nobodies fault. the UX design of firefox doesn't include a menubar, because it doesn't really need one. the only reason unity (and mac) have one is because there's a global menubar that isn't part of the app20:31
chrisccoulsonseriously, 400 million users are not going to be complaining that they no longer have a menubar that they didn't previously need to use anyway20:31
chrisccoulsonyou're in a very small minority20:31
penguin42<sigh>20:32
aquariusman, it really isn't. It works on at least two major Ubuntu desktops without change; Firefox shows you a nice upgrade thing; it's now the same as Chrome; and saying "the menu is now here" is really not hard. My dad adapted to the window buttons being on the other side in seconds, he really did, despite everyone saying that naive users would now abandon their computers for abaci because of it20:32
ali1234neither is saying "right click on the new menu thing and tick menu bar"20:34
chrisccoulsonyeah, i suspect it's not going to be a problem. chrome doesn't have a menubar, and I don't think IE11 does either (i could be wrong there)20:36
chrisccoulsonthe small number of people who want to reenable it in firefox will be able to figure out how to20:36
ali1234chrome is really horrible for webdev :/20:36
chrisccoulsonin fact, the firefox menubar has been disabled on non-linux platforms since firefox 4 anyway20:36
chrisccoulsonIIRC, they used the firefox button on the left-hand side instead20:37
ali1234yeah. you could enable that in ff28 by hiding the menu bar, but now that's gone unless you use classic theme restorer20:37
penguin42chrisccoulson: My concern here isn't the lack/presence of it - my concern is just the change20:43
penguin42curious, I've been out all day and the number of from-internet surewall warnings has been much lower than previous days, but it seems to have started going back up after I got in and started browsing - I wonder if I'm blocking something useful or it's just something spots an active IP somehow20:50
diddledanit's the NSA have spotted you're at home - they were attacking your phone while you were out20:52
diddledan:-p20:53
diddledansorry, been watching snowden20:53
penguin42yess....20:53
czajkowski whooo #3621:49
czajkowskimay have to call it a night!21:49
diddledano_O21:53
maps|wrkhai22:16
diddledanello maps|wrk22:45
maps|wrkhey diddledan22:51
maps|wrkup to much?22:51
diddledanright at this second I'm reading that harry split with his g/f (prince harry)22:53
diddledanother than that nowt22:53
maps|wrkhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b042m637/My_Brother_the_Terrorist/23:03
maps|wrkwatching that atm23:03
=== Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away
maps|wrkpah barmy women, her son gets convicted of terrorist activities, trying to make bombs all that lot and she says he 'deserves' anothger chance23:31
maps|wrkpff23:31
shaunoI'm glad there was no such thing when I was a kid.  because a lot of what I called "being a kid" would probably be called domestic terrorism these days23:32
maps|wrkheh23:33
maps|wrkthis guy was in his 20s and buying chemicals trying to make bombsa23:34
maps|wrkthink his mum struggles to understand tyhe meaning of the word 'deserves'23:34
diddledanI've just got to the bit23:54
diddledan"he spent all his time online" <-- that's me23:54
maps|wrkyea and how he played games..yea because thats likely the cause23:54
maps|wrkil scour iplayer see if theres anything else i fancy watching :)23:55
maps|wrkhmm madagascar on there..not seen that23:57

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