[00:12] <maps|wrk> grmph
[00:26] <maps|wrk> everyone gone to sleep?
[00:26] <maps|wrk> :)
[00:36] <maps|wrk> anyone looked at http://goodnightlamp.com/ ?
[00:41] <shauno> I don't get it
[00:41] <maps|wrk> im not sure i do really
[00:41] <maps|wrk> it seems a bit pointless to me?
[00:42] <maps|wrk> Good Night Lamp is a physical social network. It allows you to keep in touch with people all over the world. When you buy Good Night Lamp it comes as a set of two lamps: a Big Lamp and a Little Lamp. When you turn on your Big Lamp, the Little Lamp turns on too. You can send your Little Lamp to your friend or family member anywhere in the world. There is no lengthy setup and no internet connection needed.
[00:42] <maps|wrk> uses the phone network and when  i turn my big light on the small liht also come on..great whats the point of that?
[00:43] <maps|wrk> * The Good Night Lamp Lightning service is free for five years. pah they expect people to pay after? O_o
[00:44] <shauno> sounds reasonable enough
[00:45] <shauno> I mean, you'd be crazy to promise lifetime support when you're selling stuff that's so pointless you're not going to be in business next week
[00:46] <maps|wrk> yea
[00:46] <maps|wrk> but the actual concept? i dont see the need for it
[06:13] <MooDoo> hello all
[06:25] <mapps> morning MooDoo mate
[06:25] <MooDoo> how's it going mapps
[06:42] <mapps> not bad mate...u?
[06:42] <mapps> was just watching black gold:) always find theres stuff on between 6-8am i like watching
[07:56] <dwatkins> is that a TV channel, mapps?
[07:56] <mapps> its the show about drilling for oil..us show shown on ITV2/3 atn like 6/7am
[07:57] <mapps> just watched the following finale ;D
[07:57] <dwatkins> aha interesting
[07:57] <dwatkins> are there prizes? do they eject people from the house^W rig if they're naughty?
[07:58] <DJones> mapps: Has Bobby Ewing got out of the shower yet
[07:58] <mapps> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1239472/
[07:59] <mapps> i dont think so dwatkins
[07:59] <mapps> its just kinda interesting imo
[07:59] <dwatkins> yeah, I'm just kidding
[07:59] <mapps> you seen it? its decent enough
[07:59] <diplo> Morning all
[07:59] <mapps> morning diplo
[08:00] <mapps> the finale of the following was good too
[08:00] <dwatkins> no, I did enjoy Ice Road Truckers, though.
[08:00] <mapps> ah yea thats kinda cool
[08:01] <bashrc> morning
[08:02] <mapps> morning bashrc
[08:04] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:05] <mapps> sleep time for me now
[08:05] <mapps> think im the only one that works nights here heh
[08:22] <TheOpenSourcerer> popey: You asked: http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2014/04/how-to-install-a-squid-dansguardian-content-filter-on-ubuntu-server/
[08:22] <popey> yay
[08:35] <smittix> Morning all
[08:36] <MooDoo> howdy smittix
[08:36] <smittix> :D
[09:24] <brobostigon> [A
[09:24] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[09:27] <dwatkins> hey brobostigon
[09:28] <brobostigon> hi dwatkins
[09:28] <andylockran> howdy all
[09:29] <brobostigon> morning andylockran
[09:29] <bashrc> morning
[09:30] <brobostigon> morning bashrc
[09:58] <BigRedS> does setting xdebug.profiler_enable to 0 effectively turn xdebug off (so I can rule that out as why everything's going slowly)?
[09:59] <davmor2> Morning all
[09:59] <MooDoo> morning davmor2
[09:59] <BigRedS> oh, and good morning everyone! :)
[10:00] <davmor2> MooDoo: Ow's Life up norff
[10:02] <MooDoo> davmor2: aye not bad lad
[10:23] <jussi> got a good laugh out of this... http://www.brewdog.com/blog-article/sorrynotsorry
[11:12] <ali1234> what browser is "browser"?
[11:12] <brobostigon> any of dozens of possibilities. :)
[11:13] <ali1234> it doesn't work properly anyway
[11:13] <brobostigon> which one?
[11:13] <ali1234> ubuntu browser
[11:14] <brobostigon> firefox, chromium, etc. ?
[11:14] <ali1234> no
[11:14] <ali1234> ubuntu web browser
[11:15] <ali1234> the web browser made by ubuntu
[11:15] <MooDoo> ali1234: there isn't such as thing
[11:15] <ali1234> popey: tell them ^
[11:15] <popey> Yup.
[11:15] <popey> oxide
[11:16] <ali1234> it doesn't appear to support javascript
[11:16] <popey> example site?
[11:16] <ali1234> dev.drumoff.tv click on the blue video thumbnails
[11:16]  * MooDoo shuts up, you're referring to mobile aren't you
[11:16] <popey> no, desktop
[11:16] <MooDoo> oh
[11:16] <ali1234> it's available on desktop too
[11:16] <popey> webbrowser-app html5test.com
[11:16] <popey> seems to show quite a bit of support
[11:17] <ali1234> it still have the mobile UI though, which makes it incredibly difficult to use, but hey, early days
[11:17] <jussi> waiiit.... what?
[11:17] <jussi> ubuntu wants to become google?
[11:17] <ali1234> also it isn't correctly preserving aspect ratio on divs
[11:17] <popey> ali1234: what doesn't work?
[11:17] <popey> (I mean, specifically on your site)
[11:17] <popey> I am seeing the nice pictures scrolling, cat!
[11:17] <ali1234> popey: click the blue video thumbnails - the videos don't play. it doesn't even load up
[11:17] <ali1234> compare the site on ... well pretty much anything else
[11:18] <popey> plays here
[11:18]  * popey watches someone drum
[11:18] <popey> mohawk!
[11:18] <ali1234> also if you horizontally resize the window, notice that the thumbnails aspect ratio isn't preserved
[11:18] <ali1234> oh yeah mohawk guy... well, why doesn't it work here?
[11:18] <popey> some do, some dont
[11:18] <popey> you're missing codecs
[11:18] <ali1234> hmm
[11:18] <popey> oxideqt-codecs-extra
[11:19] <popey> install that
[11:19] <ali1234> the horizontal resize/aspect ratio thing applies to the whole page... that's really weird
[11:19] <ali1234> well, it can't be codecs... the div doesn't even get replaced with the iframe
[11:20] <ali1234> in the jquery code, when you click a video, it gets the parent element of "Choose a video." and does .html('<iframe>...') on it
[11:20] <ali1234> that event isn't even firing here
[11:20] <ali1234> and yeah the resize thing is because it's resizing a bitmap while it rerenders the page properly
[11:21] <ali1234> still doesn't work with the codecs
[11:23] <popey> odd, works here.
[11:23] <ali1234> though the javascript must be running, because the thumbnail rows work okay
[11:23] <ali1234> can i get a debug console?
[11:23] <ali1234> object inspector?
[11:23] <popey> --inspector
[11:23] <popey>   --inspector        run a remote inspector on port 9221
[11:23] <ali1234> what's the command called?
[11:23] <popey>  webbrowser-app --inspector dev.drumoff.tv
[11:24] <popey> should do it?
[11:24] <popey> never used it myself..
[11:24] <ali1234> are you rnning a bleeding edge version or something?
[11:24]  * popey points at chrisccoulson 
[11:24] <popey> trusty
[11:24] <ali1234> because i've only got whatever demo is in trusty
[11:24] <diplo> Anyone use php curl here ?
[11:24] <popey>   Installed: 0.23+14.04.20140416-0ubuntu1
[11:25] <diplo> On my local dev my code downloads images I'm trying to get fine, on my VPS it downloads as a 404 file, exactly the same code
[11:27] <ali1234> jsbin.com doesn't work at all for me
[11:27] <selinuxium> Hi all, anyone here had any experience with Spiceworks?
[11:54] <popey> Ooh, thunder
[12:05] <DJones> ...thunder...thunder...thundercats...hoooo
[12:05] <MartijnVdS> DJones: oh man I used to watch that :)
[12:05] <MartijnVdS> a *LOT*
[12:05] <MartijnVdS> back in the 80s?
[12:06] <diplo> heh, my kids are in to it in a big way now
[12:06] <diplo> And 80's sounds about right
[12:07] <DJones> Yeah, same here, it nice to relax to as a student
[12:08] <davmor2> DJones: see I see popey type thunder and I hear this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uT3SBzmDxGk
[12:09] <davmor2> curses youtube for ruining his childhood cartoon connection :)
[12:11] <DJones> I had either thundercats or "bolt and lightning, very, very frightening"
[12:11] <MartijnVdS> galileo?
[12:12] <DJones> Yep
[12:12] <davmor2> Figaro
[12:13] <MooDoo> da da da da da da da da da dadadada :)
[12:23] <DJones> Heh https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t1.0-9/486694_467187566724623_2128209998_n.png
[12:47] <MooDoo> DJones: oh that's fab :)
[12:48] <DJones> Made me smile anyway
[12:48] <MooDoo> me too I've shared it on FB
[12:50] <DJones> Wonder how long it'll be till McDonalds, Starbucks & Burger King try to get it taken down
[13:14] <ali1234> DJones: http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/31/de/e5/31dee50261eabeeb7fd0721308fb5a2d.jpg
[13:14] <ali1234> top left is relevant, the others are amusing too
[13:14] <DJones> Top left isscary
[14:56] <foobarry> if i am configuring calendars for the evlution data server, do i need evolution app too?
[14:56] <foobarry> i want to configure calendar apps that alelgedly support eds
[14:57] <MartijnVdS> no e-d-s is separate
[15:02] <popey> nope
[15:02] <popey> i dont have evolution installed and i use eds
[15:02] <popey> (we use it on the phone too)
[15:03] <foobarry> how does one config eds?
[15:04] <awilkins> I've just ignored eds since I've never found a way to integrate it with Thunderbird / Lightning / Google Calendar
[15:04] <popey> i only know the answer for ubuntu
[15:04] <awilkins> Is there a Calendar lens?
[15:05] <foobarry> popey: what's the answer for ubuntu pls?
[15:05] <foobarry> would be a start
[15:05] <popey> cog -> online accounts
[15:17] <foobarry> !info evolution-ews
[15:22] <foobarry> not in 12.04 :(
[15:38] <aquarius> popey, ping: what would you want to see in a syncthing indicator?
[15:39] <popey> aquarius: is it running, is there an update (shush about packaging), any transfers pending, whether every other machine is in sync or not
[15:40] <aquarius> OK, cool.
[15:41] <aquarius> I'll look at the updates stuff
[15:42] <popey> aquarius: buttons to pause/restart sync would be handy
[15:42] <popey> dunno if syncthing has an api to pause/restart sync
[15:44] <diplo> I couldn't get syncthing to work last time I tried
[15:44]  * diplo sets as a TODO for tomorrow 
[15:45] <popey> updated mine to 0.8.2 today
[15:45] <aquarius> afaict you can't pause and restart from the web gui
[15:45] <aquarius> so there's no API
[15:45] <aquarius> the feature may not even exist
[15:45] <aquarius> you can of course entirely stop syncthing
[15:45] <aquarius> but how you do that is massively system-dependent
[15:46] <aquarius> on my machine you'd do "stop syncthing" but on yours probably not :P
[15:47] <diplo> https://github.com/calmh/syncthing - That the right one ?
[15:47] <popey> yes
[15:47] <diplo> Great thanks
[15:48] <popey> i love it ☻
[15:48] <diplo> I really like the look of it but couldn't get it to run between my machines
[15:48] <diplo> Would like to also do windows machines that I had an issue with
[15:53] <diplo> Do you just use it locally popey ?
[15:53] <popey> i use it between 3 machines at home
[15:53] <popey> i haven't yet exposed it to the outside
[15:54] <diplo> ah right, probably what I want to do.. but I'll try between this machine and a VM for a start I guess
[15:56]  * peng42phone waits for the bus back from Alton towers
[15:57] <Laney> man
[15:57] <Laney> aren't rainbow just a great band
[15:57]  * Laney inches closer to becoming his dad
[15:58] <peng42phone> Who?
[15:58] <Laney> rainbow
[15:59] <peng42phone> Never heard of them
[15:59] <Laney> i recommend changing that fact
[15:59] <bashrc> what genre?
[16:00] <Laney> i suspect you'd probably call them classic rock nowadays
[16:01] <peng42phone> A.t. was pretty much empty, walk on to most stuff (especially as single rider) and the weather has been great
[16:01] <peng42phone> Laney: what year where they big?
[16:03] <Laney> second half of the 70s to the 80s
[16:04] <peng42phone> Hmm, I do know a lot of the softer 70s stuff and more common stuff
[16:04] <Laney> you probably know since you've been gone
[16:06] <peng42phone> And anyway when people say rainbow I think zipper and bungle
[16:06] <peng42phone> Y
[16:07] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/pz32na7dtmsk65k/IMG_20140429_170456.jpg
[16:07] <daftykins> glad these aren't for me
[16:07] <Laney> srsly
[16:08] <Laney> can't you get third party ones :(
[16:08] <daftykins> you can if you don't want them to last
[16:08] <ali1234> popey: i rewrote all my jquery and it works now in webbrowser-app... weird
[16:08] <daftykins> far too much cheap knock off stuff going on for lightning, if you check out amazon the reviews are not great
[16:09] <aquarius> popey, wanna try the indicator? It doesn't talk to actual syncthing yet because calmh hasn't written the events API, but you can experiment with it and send fake events
[16:10] <ali1234> i notice that webbrowser-app follows the same none-standard behaviour of safari and chrome, where it won't autoplay html5 video unless the user clicks the player once
[16:10] <Laney> webbrowser-app handily triggers a nouveau bug which locks up my machine
[16:11] <ali1234> this "feature" would be fine if there was a way to do feature detection on it, but there isn't :(
[16:11] <ali1234> the only way to detect it is to try to autoplay a video, wait 5 seconds, and then test if the video is hanging
[16:11] <peng42phone> Ali1234: hmm that sounds a reasonable feature frankly
[16:11] <ali1234> or do browser sniffing. both ways really suck
[16:12] <ali1234> yeah it's reasonable. it's only a feature on mobile devices
[16:12] <ali1234> so iphone and android
[16:12] <aquarius> that's not non-standard.
[16:12] <popey> aquarius: sure, in an hour, on a call.
[16:12] <ali1234> show me where it is documented how to tell whether a webbrowser will do this or not then
[16:13] <daftykins> auto video playback should be banned
[16:13] <aquarius> that you can't tell whether it's doing it or not does not mean that you're not allowed to do it. :)
[16:13] <peng42phone> Ali1234: I think I'd like it on desktop as well
[16:13] <aquarius> the standard actively encourages browser vendors to require user interaction
[16:13] <ali1234> you can disable autoplay on deskop too
[16:13] <aquarius> I agree that it's annoying that you can't tell whether it's happened!
[16:13] <aquarius> although...
[16:13] <ali1234> but the way it is implemented also prevent any site that wants to have a play button that is outside the video window
[16:14] <aquarius> can't you just check one second after the page loads whether the video is in playing state?
[16:14] <ali1234> and rather than say, just doing nothing, if you call playVideoById() on one of the non-standard implementations, it hangs the player on a black screen
[16:14] <ali1234> aquarius: no, because i am not trying to autoplay a video
[16:15] <ali1234> i am trying to implement a playlist, remember?
[16:15] <ali1234> the only problem for me is that 1. i need an annoying workaround in the code just for this case and 2. the user has to click twice instead of once before they can watch a video
[16:16] <aquarius> you could make the "play" button *be* the video element, and then just move it when they click on it ;)
[16:16] <ali1234> user has to click the playlist item for the video, and then click the play button in the video window. but only on mobile devices
[16:16] <bashrc> is there any way of showing bank holidays on the calendar, as in KDE?
[16:16] <ali1234> aquarius: no, impossible, because i am using youtube embeds
[16:16] <aquarius> ah
[16:21] <aquarius> popey, nw, let me know when
[16:42] <popey> aquarius: yo, around
[16:44] <aquarius> popey, git clone https://github.com/stuartlangridge/syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.git
[16:45] <aquarius> popey, edit syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.py line 58 and set it to wherever your syncthing is
[16:45] <aquarius> popey, run "python testserver.py" in a terminal
[16:45] <aquarius> popey, run "python syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.py" in another terminal
[16:46] <aquarius> then you can generate events in the testserver.py terminal by pressing keys 1-5
[16:46]  * peng42phone passes a sign 'Beware! Bikers'  I wonder if that's aims are 2 or 4 wheeled readers
[16:47] <popey> i see a cloud
[16:48] <aquarius> good. If you hit 3 in the testserver window, which is a "PULL_START" event (a file has started syncing down to this computer), the cloud should indicate that syncing is going on
[16:48] <aquarius> and there is information in the menu that syncing is going on
[16:48] <popey> the cloud does, it's grey though so hard to see
[16:49] <aquarius> hitting 4 in the testserver window will send a "PULL_COMPLETE" event (that file has now successfully synced to this machine), and the cloud should stop indicating that syncing is happening
[16:49] <popey> yup, that all works
[16:49] <aquarius> grey? shouldn't be; the cloud is white
[16:49] <aquarius> screenshot?
[16:50] <aquarius> basically, you've seen what it does, now -- the question is, what else should it show, and how? and does it need all the info that it currently displays?
[16:50] <popey> https://imgur.com/PS8ZUnA
[16:50] <popey> dropbox sync thing tells you which specific file is being synced which is nice to know
[16:51] <popey> "Oh, it's doing that giant file"
[16:51] <popey> "Oh, why is it syncing that, i thought I'd deleted it"
[16:51] <popey> etc
[16:51] <aquarius> ah, that's a good idea, yeah, I can do that
[16:51] <aquarius> wtf?
[16:51] <aquarius> ah.
[16:51] <popey> dropbox also has a recently changed files thing
[16:52] <aquarius> I used the same icon names as the sync menu
[16:52] <aquarius> I bet it's using the sync menu icons for you, not mine (which are very similar)
[16:52] <aquarius> I'll fix that
[16:52] <aquarius> and I'll show currently syncing files
[16:52] <popey> cool, thanks!
[16:52] <aquarius> and recent files (perhaps in a submenu)
[16:53] <shauno> 'recently changed' is ftw, that's the most common reason I use the dropbox icon rather than the folder
[16:53] <popey> its not stopping when i CTRL+C
[16:53]  * popey kills
[16:54]  * popey wanders off for a bit
[17:04] <popey> aquarius: also, notifications
[17:05] <popey> e.g. I see "17:14:45: Connection to Desktop closed: ping timeout" in the web UI
[17:05] <popey> that would do as a notification
[17:05] <popey> maybe
[17:36] <aquarius> popey, most of that stuff now fixed
[17:36] <popey> ooh
[17:36] <aquarius> popey, ^C works; you should get my icons now; recently synced and currently syncing
[17:36] <aquarius> I'm not sure about notifications
[17:37] <aquarius> it's really really irritating to get a zillion notifications...
[17:37] <aquarius> popey, update with "git pull", I think
[17:38] <popey> still grey
[17:38] <aquarius> rly?
[17:39] <popey> and ctrl+c still fails to kill it
[17:39] <aquarius> does "grep client-idle syncthing-ubuntu-indicator.py" show any lines?
[17:39] <aquarius> ok, I don't think you've got the newest version :)
[17:39] <aquarius> try "git pull origin master"
[17:39] <popey> oh, hang on
[17:39] <aquarius> man, I hate git :)
[17:40] <popey> pull failed because I edited it
[17:40] <aquarius> ah
[17:40] <aquarius> yeah
[17:40] <aquarius> you could edit it back
[17:40] <popey> nvm
[17:40] <popey> delete, re-clone
[17:40] <aquarius> or "git fetch" or "git merge" perhaps
[17:41] <aquarius> but just bin it and reclone is prolly easier ;)
[17:41] <popey> too much effort
[17:41] <popey> new ugly icon ☻
[17:42] <mapps> evening folks
[17:42] <aquarius> popey, ha!
[17:42] <aquarius> popey, bust out inkscape and do better ;)
[17:42] <popey> ☻
[17:44] <aquarius> popey, the rest should work though
[17:49] <popey> yup
[17:50] <aquarius> good. Anything else you think it should do, or that it does do that you think that it does not need?
[17:50] <aquarius> (note: it also will tell you about updates, if there are any)
[17:54] <aquarius> annoyingly, it needs a config window, I think
[17:54] <aquarius> unless reading syncthing's own config file is kosher
[18:06] <popey> aquarius: a link to the support disqus site?
[18:08] <aquarius> I think that reading syncthing's config file is kosher, so I'm gonna do that.
[18:08] <aquarius> No config windows for me; that's rubbish
[18:08] <aquarius> it makes the indicator feel like a separate app rather than part of syncthing.
[18:34] <TheProphet[S]> Hi all, trying to connect to wife from console, but dhclient hangs on dhcpdiscover
[18:34] <TheProphet[S]> To WiFi sorry
[18:35] <daftykins> lol
[18:35] <TheProphet[S]> I'm using wpa supplicant and the wext driver
[18:35] <daftykins> i was going to say, that protocol hasn't been refined yet
[18:35] <daftykins> does static addressing work?
[18:36] <neuro> GOOD EVENING PEOPLE, IT IS I, THE NEURO
[18:36] <daftykins> oh crikey not you!
[18:36] <daftykins> :D
[18:36] <ali1234> popey: git reset --hard HEAD && git clean -d -f
[18:37] <neuro> daftykins: YES, TIS I
[18:37] <daftykins> *gasp*
[18:38] <davmor2> neuro: seeing that statement now makes me wonder if it is actually you, or just an elaborate double bluff :)
[18:38] <neuro> TIS NOT AN ELABORATE BLUFF
[18:38] <neuro> LOOK AT MY USE OF CAPITALS
[18:38] <daftykins> ooh my, drama and intrigue in #ubuntu-uk
[18:38] <TheProphet[S]> Daftykins not sure about static addressing
[18:39] <daftykins> give it a try?
[18:39] <davmor2> neuro: but I haven't seen you use one yet I mean no LONDON, EDINBURGH nothing
[18:39] <daftykins> TheProphet[S]: though often no DHCP communications suggests a bad driver, or failed wireless key auth
[18:40] <neuro> London? Edinburgh?
[18:40] <neuro> I am in neither of these places
[18:41] <davmor2> neuro: no but they are CAPITALS :P
[18:42] <neuro> jpc
[18:42] <TheProphet[S]> I guess "network is unreachable" is not a good message to get when trying to ping
[18:42] <neuro> nope
[18:42] <daftykins> ^
[18:43] <TheProphet[S]> Maybe the syntax is wrong, but I followed how to on Ubuntu forum
[18:44] <mapps> hm
[18:44] <mapps> 9eps behind on hannibal serie 2
[18:46] <daftykins> TheProphet[S]: sometimes routers/APs in mixed-mode WPA1 and 2 can trip things up
[18:47] <TheProphet[S]> I'm probably doing something wrong
[18:49] <TheProphet[S]> I start with ifconfig wlan0 up
[18:51] <TheProphet[S]> Then wpa_supplicant -B -Dwext -iwlan0 -c/etc/wpa_supplicant.conf
[18:52] <TheProphet[S]> The conf file contains network={
[18:52] <TheProphet[S]> ssid="abcd"
[18:52] <TheProphet[S]> psk="pass"
[18:52] <TheProphet[S]> }
[18:53] <daftykins> !paste
[18:53] <daftykins> hopefully you have a space there "-c /etc/wpa_su..."
[18:54] <TheProphet[S]> I'm actually typing it sorry, I'm using my phone to chat because of no connection on PC
[18:54] <TheProphet[S]> There's no space on man pages between -c and path to file
[18:55] <daftykins> that seems odd
[18:56] <TheProphet[S]> I think wpa_supplicant works with no spaces, same goes for the driver wext option -D which becomes -Dwext
[18:58] <TheProphet[S]> Problem could be that when I start wpa_supplicant as stated above the daemon starts successfully but I get an Invalid Argument error twice
[18:58] <daftykins> yeah that's definitely not good
[18:58] <daftykins> your interface definitely is wlan0 then and not eth1 or something odd?
[19:02] <MartijnVdS> I installed a new machine last week, and it ended up with "p1p1" and "p3p1" instead of eth0 and eth1
[19:04] <TheProphet[S]> Yes it is wlan0
[19:05] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: heh, funky drivers?
[19:07] <MartijnVdS> 05:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller (rev 06)
[19:07] <MartijnVdS> apparently these names are "less confusing"?
[19:08] <MartijnVdS> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/biosdevname/+bug/1293633
[19:09] <MartijnVdS> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2012-August/035670.html
[19:09] <MartijnVdS> it's because it's a server install
[19:10] <daftykins> hrmm
[19:16] <diddledan> morning
[19:16] <daftykins> howdy
[19:20] <czajkowski> aloha
[19:21] <daftykins> a wild czajkowski o/
[19:21] <diddledan> in the wild, too
[19:21] <czajkowski> nope actually in the UK and working
[19:22] <czajkowski> although boggling at gmail
[19:22] <czajkowski> webmail shows 88 in inbox
[19:22] <czajkowski> desktop client shows 112
[19:22] <czajkowski> no idea why the difference
[19:25] <daftykins> my Nexus 4 tells me i have '1 unread' when the inbox is at 0
[19:25] <daftykins> drives me mad but if you go through pages and pages not one appears unread XD
[19:25] <daftykins> could it be threading?
[19:26] <czajkowski> hmm possibly
[19:26] <czajkowski> trying to get to 0 before Friday
[19:26] <daftykins> *mission impossible theme*
[19:29] <diddledan> htf have I got 16.85million emails in my gmail account?!
[19:29] <diddledan> (apple's mail.app is still syncing after setting it up yesterday)
[19:29] <daftykins> O_O
[19:30] <daftykins> mail clients are so 2000's
[19:30] <czajkowski> I do love thunderbird
[19:30] <czajkowski> nothing has come close to replacing it
[19:30] <diddledan> yeah, but I like to pgp
[19:32] <daftykins> ugh i have a client with thunderbird, its' settings for accounts and storage just became far too confused
[19:32] <daftykins> they're too tight to let me have them all standardised with google apps
[19:32] <daftykins> mainly 'cause their current mail host keeps forgetting to charge them for anything, so their current fee = £0
[19:37] <penguin42> it's embarrassing when you realise a supplier has never asked you to pay for something
[19:38] <daftykins> :D
[19:38] <czajkowski> hah #78 take that
[19:38] <daftykins> a clients web hoster had a unique approach to finally asking for some money
[19:38] <daftykins> pulling the website with no warning
[19:38] <daftykins> \o/
[19:38] <penguin42> nasty
[19:39] <penguin42> daftykins: I've seen it where an electricity company only asked us to pay for 1 of 6 meters in a company I worked for - it took us a year or two to convince them we should be paying, and we were running a few 100A off it
[19:39] <daftykins> lol
[19:40] <daftykins> classic
[19:41] <penguin42> daftykins: It was after I went to look about adding more capacity and went to track down the details that I had to go look at the bill, and came to the conclusion we hadn't been paying for about 5 years
[19:42] <daftykins> that is some impressive stuff
[19:42] <penguin42> anyone got any idea what  http://imagebin.org/308206   text is - it's overlayed (with a load of other computery text) on 'The Smiler's funky displays
[19:44] <daftykins> hmm certainly getting nothing from Google from a guess of 'callPanelDivFreqInput'
[19:44] <aquarius> popey, syncthing indicator now reads your config file to know where syncthing is, so no more editing needed for you
[19:45] <popey> aquarius: sweet!
[19:45] <popey> thanks for working on that
[19:46] <aquarius> nw
[19:46] <aquarius> makes sense
[19:46] <aquarius> I'm the one who customised his syncthing port, after all :P
[19:49] <ali1234> penguin42: it's the log from some mobile phone
[19:49] <ali1234> http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:4EzzENTDmFgJ:home.educities.edu.tw/fushiyun2000/gameconsole_jxd_jxd_200_hardware_uart.htm+&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=ubuntu
[19:50] <penguin42> ali1234: Since that says 'game console' and the other thing I found said playstation maybe it's more game dev?
[19:50] <ali1234> http://www.tripleoxygen.net/files/cybergame/log/minicom.cap1
[19:51] <ali1234> it's from some chinese fake-iphone thing that doesn't know if it's a phone or a games console
[19:52] <penguin42> oh weird, mention of eCos as well
[20:03] <aquarius> popey, something to think about: it's rare that you'd open the menu without a reason, which means that you are likely not to see that there's an update to syncthing
[20:04] <aquarius> popey, this suggests that there should be an icon for "there's an update available". So, two questions: what does it look like, and more importantly what happens if there's an update available *and* a file is syncing?
[20:04] <aquarius> perhaps some sort of "download arrow" overlay? but it's a pretty small icon to show that sort of thing
[20:05] <popey> it should change colour

[20:06] <directhex> um...
[20:06] <directhex> rip off sparkleshare? a down arrow overlay for downloading, an exclamation mark for "look at me"
[20:06] <directhex> (plus corresponding up arrow)
[20:06] <aquarius> to what? there's no standard highlight colour, I can't think of any particular colour which means "there are updates", symbolic icons are monochrome, and I'm already worried about what it looks like with the radiance theme :)
[20:06] <popey> blue
[20:06] <popey> messaging menu
[20:07] <aquarius> directhex, what happens if it needs looking at *and* it's downloading?
[20:07] <popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MessagingMenu/
[20:07] <aquarius> I already have circle arrows for "stuff is syncing" and an exclamation point (plus red icon) for "there is an error"
[20:07] <popey> arrow in it, and blue
[20:07] <aquarius> popey, ya, but that's calling for attention. Is "there's an update" worthy of calling for attention?
[20:07] <popey> yes
[20:08] <popey> rarely enough
[20:08] <ali1234> why aren't updates handled by the normal package manager?
[20:08] <popey> they could be if it was packaged
[20:08] <aquarius> ali1234, because nobody's packaged it yet
[20:08] <ali1234> seems like the answer is obvious then
[20:08] <aquarius> sure thing. Let me know when you've packaged it. :)
[20:09] <ali1234> i don't even use it. why would i package it?
[20:09] <ali1234> i don't even know what it is :)
[20:09] <aquarius> you said the answer was obvious; I assumed you meant that it was clear that you should package it ;)
[20:09] <aquarius> you can't have meant it was obvious that *I* should package it; I know nothing about debian packaging. :)
[20:10] <ali1234> no, i mean the answer is you shouldn't worry about it
[20:10] <popey> I'm inclined to agree. you shouldn't have to
[20:10] <popey> that way lies windows nagware
[20:10] <aquarius> the reason knowing about updates is important is that it's still moving really fast, and if you upgrade one node it breaks all the others :P
[20:10] <ali1234> when there are updates it should pop up a fullscreen modal dialog saying "please package this application"
[20:10]  * aquarius laughs!
[20:11] <aquarius> I don't understand why you're not on the design team. I think they're missing an important voice. :)
[20:11] <directhex> no no no, you're going about it all wrong
[20:11] <directhex> it should not report that it has updates
[20:11] <directhex> the standalone updater app, with its own tray icon, has that job
[20:11] <aquarius> so, two suggestions so far: go blue (popey), overlay some sort of icon (directhex)
[20:11] <directhex> this also works around your "how to show update AND sync icon" dilema
[20:12] <ali1234> yes, bring back the update notifier tray icon
[20:12] <directhex> the updater app can show a modal dialogue on boot!
[20:12] <ali1234> removing it was stupid, now i have to deal with that weird popup thing stealing focus all the time
[20:12] <ali1234> of course this won't help if it isn't packaged, but there you go
[20:13] <popey> "all the time"
[20:13] <popey> I never see it
[20:13] <directhex> the updater app can also helpfully install a browser toolbar on every update, unless you tick the hidden tickbox
[20:13] <ali1234> it pops up multiple times every day
[20:13] <ali1234> it pops up after every time i do "sudo apt-get update"
[20:14] <diddledan> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVwAodrjZMY lol @ the bot
[20:14] <ali1234> and then it pops up again when "sudo apt-get dist-upgrade" finishes, to tell me to reboot
[20:14] <ali1234> and if i just close it, it pops up again after about 8 hours
[20:15] <ali1234> also all of my indicators are broken - whenever i try to use them i get dbus permission errors, ever since i installed ubuntu-sdk
[20:17] <ali1234> gnome-15 is also broken
[20:18] <ali1234> looks like installing ubuntu-desktop^ and ubuntu-sdk turned my system into a locked-down mobile-style thing where i can't touch anything or it crashes
[20:24] <ali1234> i think placekitten has banned me :)
[20:25] <penguin42> oh dear, ff29 is rolling out to trusty - and changing the whole layout to users during a normal upgrade
[20:25] <ali1234> nah, it's barely different
[20:25] <ali1234> the biggest difference is the fugly tabs
[20:25] <penguin42> ali1234: The hidden menu bar is the problem
[20:25] <ali1234> it's not hidden tho
[20:25] <penguin42> well, it certainly changed
[20:26] <penguin42> ali1234: I bet that'll fox a lot of non-technical users
[20:26] <aquarius> menu bar isn't hidden; the global menu is still just as it was before, according to chrisccoulson
[20:26] <penguin42> aquarius: Bzzt - not here
[20:26] <ali1234> yes, or if you use a real desktop, you get a real menu bar just as before
[20:26] <ali1234> you have the unremovable hamburger thing as well
[20:26] <penguin42> ok, on Kubuntu it changed
[20:26] <aquarius> ah. I don't know about Kubuntu.
[20:26] <ali1234> works fine on xfce
[20:27] <penguin42> It's easy enough to find the preferences thing and reenable display of menubar, but it's going to fox non-techies
[20:27] <ali1234> non-techies should not be using KDE
[20:27] <chrisccoulson> i suspect these non-techies (ie, the other 400 million firefox users) probably won't care about the menubar when the functionality they use is accessible via the main menu panel
[20:27] <penguin42> chrisccoulson: They'll need showing where it is
[20:28] <aquarius> it's going to fox non-techies who are running Ubuntu and have installed an alternative desktop, yep. Why aren't Kubuntu distro-patching it, then? Ubuntu are, in order that it fits in with their desktop.
[20:28] <penguin42> aquarius: Because it's not their fault - it's Firefox's/packagers for changing the default like that
[20:28] <ali1234> xfce certainly haven't patched it and it has a menu bar by default - or at least if you upgrade your profile
[20:28]  * penguin42 doesn't know this is only KDE - I'm just saying what I just hit as the upgrade hit here
[20:29] <aquarius> chrisccoulson, I am mildly disappointed that we need to distro patch it and FF upstream aren't doing that -- I bet they are for Mac, for example.
[20:29] <ali1234> i have even disabled all the ubuntu extensions
[20:29] <ali1234> maybe if you have never ever toggled the menu bar on/off it will hide it by default
[20:30] <chrisccoulson> aquarius, there's a bug open, but I just don't have time to drive our patch through their review process atm. somebody is more than welcome to pick that up (and mozilla are open to having that functionality included)
[20:30] <aquarius> chrisccoulson, ah, they're happy to take it? Then fair play, and I apologise for doubting; if it's just going to take time to have that happen, that's cool with me
[20:30] <penguin42> It's going to be a PITA for people with non-tech relatives/or labs full of stuff
[20:31] <chrisccoulson> penguin42, it's nobodies fault. the UX design of firefox doesn't include a menubar, because it doesn't really need one. the only reason unity (and mac) have one is because there's a global menubar that isn't part of the app
[20:31] <chrisccoulson> seriously, 400 million users are not going to be complaining that they no longer have a menubar that they didn't previously need to use anyway
[20:31] <chrisccoulson> you're in a very small minority

[20:32] <aquarius> man, it really isn't. It works on at least two major Ubuntu desktops without change; Firefox shows you a nice upgrade thing; it's now the same as Chrome; and saying "the menu is now here" is really not hard. My dad adapted to the window buttons being on the other side in seconds, he really did, despite everyone saying that naive users would now abandon their computers for abaci because of it
[20:34] <ali1234> neither is saying "right click on the new menu thing and tick menu bar"
[20:36] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i suspect it's not going to be a problem. chrome doesn't have a menubar, and I don't think IE11 does either (i could be wrong there)
[20:36] <chrisccoulson> the small number of people who want to reenable it in firefox will be able to figure out how to
[20:36] <ali1234> chrome is really horrible for webdev :/
[20:36] <chrisccoulson> in fact, the firefox menubar has been disabled on non-linux platforms since firefox 4 anyway
[20:37] <chrisccoulson> IIRC, they used the firefox button on the left-hand side instead
[20:37] <ali1234> yeah. you could enable that in ff28 by hiding the menu bar, but now that's gone unless you use classic theme restorer
[20:43] <penguin42> chrisccoulson: My concern here isn't the lack/presence of it - my concern is just the change
[20:50] <penguin42> curious, I've been out all day and the number of from-internet surewall warnings has been much lower than previous days, but it seems to have started going back up after I got in and started browsing - I wonder if I'm blocking something useful or it's just something spots an active IP somehow
[20:52] <diddledan> it's the NSA have spotted you're at home - they were attacking your phone while you were out
[20:53] <diddledan> :-p
[20:53] <diddledan> sorry, been watching snowden
[20:53] <penguin42> yess....
[21:49] <czajkowski>  whooo #36
[21:49] <czajkowski> may have to call it a night!
[21:53] <diddledan> o_O
[22:16] <maps|wrk> hai
[22:45] <diddledan> ello maps|wrk
[22:51] <maps|wrk> hey diddledan
[22:51] <maps|wrk> up to much?
[22:53] <diddledan> right at this second I'm reading that harry split with his g/f (prince harry)
[22:53] <diddledan> other than that nowt
[23:03] <maps|wrk> http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b042m637/My_Brother_the_Terrorist/
[23:03] <maps|wrk> watching that atm
[23:31] <maps|wrk> pah barmy women, her son gets convicted of terrorist activities, trying to make bombs all that lot and she says he 'deserves' anothger chance
[23:31] <maps|wrk> pff
[23:32] <shauno> I'm glad there was no such thing when I was a kid.  because a lot of what I called "being a kid" would probably be called domestic terrorism these days
[23:33] <maps|wrk> heh
[23:34] <maps|wrk> this guy was in his 20s and buying chemicals trying to make bombsa
[23:34] <maps|wrk> think his mum struggles to understand tyhe meaning of the word 'deserves'
[23:54] <diddledan> I've just got to the bit
[23:54] <diddledan> "he spent all his time online" <-- that's me
[23:54] <maps|wrk> yea and how he played games..yea because thats likely the cause
[23:55] <maps|wrk> il scour iplayer see if theres anything else i fancy watching :)
[23:57] <maps|wrk> hmm madagascar on there..not seen that