[13:55] <belkinsa> dholbach, working on getting the Hangout up?
[13:55] <dholbach> yes
[13:55] <belkinsa> Alright, just checking.
[13:56] <dholbach> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYezOmrGG6RMkrpKJ5busGYaORG2gr7Kc3FXVGc_kEsrEM1EYA for whoever wants to join
[13:58] <belkinsa> You said that you redoing it, right, dholbach?
[13:59] <dholbach> belkinsa: yep, but you can join as well if you like
[13:59] <dholbach> belkinsa: the hangout is started already
[13:59] <belkinsa> Oh, it's the same one?
[14:00] <dpm> o/
[14:00] <belkinsa> o/
[14:00] <belkinsa> It made already.
[14:01] <dholbach> etherpad: http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1406-community-roundtable
[14:01] <philipballew> do we have a link again?
[14:01] <belkinsa_web> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYezOmrGG6RMkrpKJ5busGYaORG2gr7Kc3FXVGc_kEsrEM1EYA
[14:01] <philipballew> belkinsa, yeah, and I was wondering if someone could paste it here
[14:01] <belkinsa_web> Bah, too many people
[14:02]  * czajkowski hugs dholbach 
[14:02] <czajkowski> soo many dates
[14:02] <czajkowski> why not merge them into one
[14:02] <czajkowski> one busy week of crazyness
[14:03] <czajkowski> and then do them at differnt times of the day so people can join them
[14:03] <czajkowski> even try a saturday
[14:03] <ahayzen> core app hack days \o/
[14:03]  * dholbach hugs czajkowski back :)
[14:04] <czajkowski> I think some people are finding we have so many online events that people cannot find the time to attend them all
[14:04] <czajkowski> and there is a masssive overlapping in them
[14:04] <czajkowski> I think doing it over the weekend would help mhall119
[14:04] <czajkowski> meeting people half way would help a lot to increaase particpation
[14:05] <belkinsa_web> Yeah, we have three zones, Europe, Asia, and the Americas
[14:05] <czajkowski> what about looking at doing the same session
[14:06] <czajkowski> twice  aday
[14:06] <czajkowski> a day at differnet times?
[14:06] <czajkowski> so you get the community attending at a time that suits
[14:06] <czajkowski> but as dpm points out it is down to the driver of the meeting
[14:06] <czajkowski> it may not always be so easy
[14:06] <belkinsa_web> Twice a day could work or have a full day of doing it, 24 hours for different people.
[14:08] <czajkowski> dpm: indeed I don't think it would work for all sessions but be nice to vary it a little.
[14:08] <dpm> yeah
[14:09] <dholbach> do we have any other subjects which should be discussed during the roundtable as well?
[14:09] <belkinsa_web> So, panels wouldn't work for people?
[14:09] <czajkowski> popey: indeed for presentations it's not needed
[14:09] <czajkowski> dholbach: not sure if this has been brought up already, but can we set in stone the dates now for the next online UDS?
[14:10] <czajkowski> so people know in advance I know this was raised a while back
[14:10] <belkinsa_web> Agreed, we need maybe a month in advance of a motice.
[14:10] <dholbach> czajkowski, sure... we can pick one, discuss it here, propose it to release team (and others), then announce
[14:10] <belkinsa_web> notiice*
[14:10] <czajkowski> dholbach: bingo
[14:10] <dholbach> the last time we did it this way
[14:10] <dholbach> and I think that worked well
[14:12] <czajkowski> oh you should do the 24hr madness again
[14:12] <czajkowski> if only to see how crazy you go
[14:12] <mhall119> no
[14:12] <mhall119> no, no no
[14:13] <czajkowski> ah go on
[14:13] <belkinsa_web> Maybe research some communities and see what they do for these type of things?
[14:13] <czajkowski> just because the event goes on longer doesnt mean we need to fill every hour.  can leave like a lunch time gap/nap time and break up the day
[14:13] <PabloRubianes> people are working!, we need this sessions on weekends!
[14:16] <czajkowski> which will be hard
[14:16] <czajkowski> for Emea for holidays as well
[14:16] <czajkowski> so people take a lot of time off as well
[14:16] <belkinsa_web> Alining them?
[14:16] <belkinsa_web> Yeah, I agree.  I have classes during that time of the UOS's.
[14:16] <mhall119> czajkowski: are you able to join the hangout?
[14:16] <czajkowski> mhall119: in set up for my event :)
[14:16] <czajkowski> mutlitasking sorry :/
[14:18] <dholbach> PabloRubianes, which session would you like to see on weekends? things like demo sessions?
[14:18] <dholbach> or presentations?
[14:18] <PabloRubianes> dholbach: at least the community session
[14:19] <PabloRubianes> maybe some week days and a saturday
[14:20] <PabloRubianes> not all in the weekend but one day that people don't work
[14:20] <PabloRubianes> like the bug jams
[14:20] <belkinsa_web> PabloRubianes: I like that thought
[14:21] <PabloRubianes> I am having an awful connection so I am not watching the hangout
[14:21] <PabloRubianes> :(
[14:21] <belkinsa_web> I'm in the Hangout and my computer is not handling it well
[14:21] <mhall119> hangouts like to turn my CPU into a furnace
[14:21] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, it's getting too hot?
[14:22] <dholbach> PabloRubianes, bah :-/
[14:22] <belkinsa_web> Funny, no. But too many people in one just lags my computer
[14:23] <PabloRubianes> dholbach: yeah
[14:23] <belkinsa_web> User days were
[14:23] <belkinsa_web> on weekends
[14:24] <PabloRubianes> also taking from the LoCo council perspective, we give a session on this summit for the time availability,
[14:24] <PabloRubianes> we did not*
[14:24] <belkinsa_web> Maybe we could have a LoCo UOS on the weekend of the UOS week?
[14:25] <czajkowski> community folks give up their weekends to work on Ubuntu
[14:25] <belkinsa_web> czajkowski: Indeed.
[14:25] <PabloRubianes> belkinsa_web: we had a plan to have a similar idea, but we need to plan it right
[14:25] <czajkowski> so I don;t think it's completely unreasonable to give up one day over a weekend by Ubuntu enginners to work on Ubuntu once a cycle
[14:26] <cheesehead> If doing four summits a year, should try one on a weekend.
[14:26] <dpm> czajkowski, engineers also need life back on the weekend, we've got people working 12 hours a day during the week too
[14:27] <belkinsa_web> I think we need to plan now and be ready for the next one a month before it
[14:27] <czajkowski> dpm: I do agree, but you could and I would argue community people give up their days adn evenings they too would like  a life also at the weekend or the evneings when they give it up for bug jams
[14:28] <cheesehead> dpm, I don't think anyone is proposing weekend work _in addition_ to weekday duties. When my employees need to time-shift duties, I make it possible.
[14:28] <dpm> well, I've been (and I am :) on both sides, and that would mean engineers have an obligation to work both during the week and weekends
[14:29]  * belkinsa_web really wants a new powerful computer ;/
[14:32] <PabloRubianes> dpm: I am not taking about enginners, am talking about community session
[14:32] <dpm> PabloRubianes, yeah, I understand, I was replying to Laura
[14:32] <belkinsa_web> We need to focus on the community folks too.
[14:33] <Murazaki> He's Michael Hall's room taking flight ? ^^' Is it a lighted fan ?
[14:33] <belkinsa_web> Maybe the classroom team could get some track/session ideas on the UOS and have them on Hangouts on Air.
[14:33] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UtopicUnicorn/ReleaseSchedule
[14:33] <balloons> Murazaki, you guessed it
[14:33] <mhall119> Murazaki: just a fan, looks better on video than in real live
[14:34] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, sure
[14:34] <belkinsa_web> Work item?
[14:35] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, sorry, I meant to say that the classroom would surely have some ideas :)
[14:35] <belkinsa_web> Yeah
[14:36] <belkinsa_web> How would a testing session work?  Just wondering.
[14:36] <balloons> belkinsa_web, what do you mean a testing session?
[14:37] <mhall119> belkinsa_web: running through checkbox and such
[14:37] <mhall119> or generally using the dev release and reporting bugs
[14:37] <balloons> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Jams/Testing
[14:38] <belkinsa_web> I need to think on what I just asked
[14:39] <dholbach> do we have any other subjects to discuss in this community roundtable?
[14:40] <belkinsa_web> Maybe packing into big events might be a good idea (with UOS).
[14:40] <czajkowski> July tends to be conference season
[14:40] <czajkowski> Oscon
[14:40] <belkinsa_web> Or have UOS styled events.
[14:40] <balloons> yea.. summer in general isn't a good time, heh
[14:41] <czajkowski> balloons: it really isn't
[14:42] <cheesehead> No time will be great every three months. There will always be interference and conflicts. But not everybody needs to show up at every event.
[14:42] <czajkowski> july 20-24
[14:42] <belkinsa_web> Maybe we need to see how many folks are attending the UGJ by poll or something.
[14:43] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, ask by poll to see if we don't overlap with another conference?
[14:44] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, or in general to see how many attend global jam events?
[14:44] <belkinsa_web> dholbach: The latter might work the best.
[14:44] <dholbach> we sort of do that with loco.u.c
[14:45] <belkinsa_web> That works, mhall119
[14:45] <dholbach> last time: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/global/2656/
[14:46] <dpm> anyone on IRC running Ubuntu Hours events?
[14:46] <popey> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/global/2662/
[14:47] <dholbach> do we have any other topics apart from "events in this cycle" we want to discuss?
[14:47] <belkinsa_web> I like that idea, the weekly cimmunity hour on Hangouts on Air
[14:48] <belkinsa_web> Try for another track today or tomorrow?
[14:49] <belkinsa_web> Maybe we can have both suvery and Hangout?
[14:50] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, the survey is going to happen in any case
[14:50] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, which hangout would you like to do?
[14:50] <belkinsa_web> Hangout on Air after the UOS to talk about what needs to work on and that tsuff.
[14:50] <belkinsa_web> stuff*
[14:52] <belkinsa_web> I think with the ones who gone to Community and Users tracks.
[14:54] <belkinsa_web> Thanks for the session.
[14:54] <dholbach> thank you :)
[14:54] <sil2100> o/
[14:55] <sil2100> dholbach: will you start the HO for the next session?
[14:55] <dholbach> yep
[14:55] <dholbach> on it
[14:55] <xnox> \o/
[14:56] <dholbach> sil2100, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYdbntNZ9rVjC1nliza-Y-O9uhGvpwU6IdYLpvVb5FjkTdzt5A
[15:01] <xnox> Going live in 5...
[15:01] <xnox> 4...
[15:01] <xnox> 3...
[15:01] <xnox> 2...
[15:01] <xnox> 1...
[15:01] <xnox> =)
[15:02] <xnox> previous session slides are:
[15:02] <xnox> https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/10SbMhkHuTpgVEncv8Fp_A8is0stDKwuMiCAYEFNiw40/edit?usp=sharing
[15:02] <xnox> http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/
[15:04] <dholbach> please keep your questions coming! :)
[15:24] <dholbach> do we have questions for Łukasz?
[15:31] <mwenning> is there a link for  basic lander training?
[15:32] <mwenning> QUESTION: is there a link / doc for basic lander training?
[15:32] <xnox> mwenning: i'll ask that to sil2100 right after current question.
[15:38] <dholbach> any more questions? :)
[15:41] <sil2100> Thank you o/
[15:41] <sil2100> Oh, an now my firefox crashed even, yay
[15:42] <mwenning> thanks, good stuff
[15:42] <dholbach> yeah, I'm super happy with all the great work you and others put into getting the landings right
[17:27] <dholbach> who's kicking off the documentation team hangout? belkinsa, pleia2 maybe? if not, I could do it as well
[17:27] <belkinsa> I am doing it
[17:28] <belkinsa> On it
[17:29] <belkinsa> I know that someone is kicking off the Kubuntu one
[17:32] <belkinsa> Almost ready
[17:34] <belkinsa_web> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw?authuser=0&hl=en
[17:34] <belkinsa> To join ^^
[17:36] <dholbach> belkinsa, brilliant, thanks
[17:44] <belkinsa> The roundtable will start in less than 20 minutes in #ubuntu-uds-community-1 and the Hangout link is (to join):  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw?authuser=0&hl=en
[17:49] <belkinsa> The roundtable will start in 10 minutes in #ubuntu-uds-community-1 and the Hangout link is (to join):  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw?authuser=0&hl=en
[17:51]  * belkinsa waits
[17:53] <belkinsa> The roundtable will start in less than 10 minutes in #ubuntu-uds-community-1 and the Hangout link is (to join):  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw?authuser=0&hl=en
[17:54] <belkinsa> dholbach, are you free for this session?
[17:56] <belkinsa> The roundtable will start in less than 5 minutes in #ubuntu-uds-community-1 and the Hangout link is (to join):  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw?authuser=0&hl=en
[17:57] <belkinsa> Who is here for the round table?
[17:57] <belkinsa>  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw?authuser=0&hl=en to join
[17:57] <knome> <- kind of
[17:58] <belkinsa> IRC or Hangout, knome?
[17:58] <knome> just irc, and even that a bit on/off
[17:58] <belkinsa_web> Okay.
[17:59] <knome> just ping me if you need me to answer or give an opinion on something
[17:59] <belkinsa_web> Okay, but I think you are only one here
[17:59] <knome> well, that's ok
[17:59] <knome> i mean, for me
[17:59] <knome> i'll have the hangout open
[18:00] <knome> or the stream tbe
[18:00] <knome> i can try to catch if you ask me something there ;)
[18:00] <belkinsa_web> The link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=JmBVSRVIWY4
[18:00] <knome> yeah, i have it open
[18:00] <belkinsa_web> pmatulis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=JmBVSRVIWY4
[18:01] <belkinsa_web> Pad: http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1406-community-1406-ubuntu-documentation-team
[18:01] <dholbach> belkinsa_web, yes, I can attend
[18:01] <belkinsa_web> Alright, just checking
[18:01] <knome> yay for dholbach on the camera
[18:02] <raub> Are the nickname and pw the ones used for launchpad?
[18:03] <belkinsa_web> raub: you can use any, but the LP one be better
[18:03] <raub> Or I can just type here?
[18:03] <belkinsa_web> You can.
[18:03] <dholbach> is anyone else joining in?
[18:03] <dholbach> joining the hangout I mean
[18:03] <belkinsa_web> Or join the hangout if you want: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=JmBVSRVIWY4
[18:03] <dholbach> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw
[18:04] <belkinsa_web> dholbach has the right link
[18:04] <dholbach> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1406-community-1406-ubuntu-documentation-team is the pad
[18:04] <raub> I will then type here since I am at work
[18:04] <belkinsa_web> Okay
[18:05] <pmatulis> belkinsa_web: you can talk about the poll idea
[18:05] <dholbach> is nobody of the docs team joining the hangout?
[18:06] <raub> I am trying, but the data squirrels are slow today
[18:06] <belkinsa_web> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2014-June/018962.html
[18:07] <pmatulis> how do i join the hangout?
[18:07] <belkinsa_web> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2014-May/018920.html
[18:07] <belkinsa_web> pmatulis: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw
[18:07] <mhall119> pmatulis: there should be a link just above the video
[18:07] <raub> pmatulis: the plus.hangout link dholbach put up
[18:07] <raub> ^^^^
[18:08] <raub> I type slowly
[18:08] <raub> Though I am still waiting for the hangout to let me in :(
[18:09] <belkinsa_web> Fixed that link
[18:10] <mhall119> are we having technical difficulty?
[18:10] <belkinsa_web> It's fixed
[18:10] <raub> I am. Can't join the hangout
[18:10] <belkinsa_web> The hangout link was wrong
[18:10] <belkinsa_web> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw is the link
[18:11] <raub> I am still in a "Please Wait..." screen in the hangout
[18:13] <knome> xubuntu uses docbook to write the docs, we can export the same stuff to web
[18:13] <knome> so the docs are available in both places
[18:13] <knome> making it web only is a restriction as well
[18:13] <belkinsa_web> Agreed, we needboth forms
[18:14] <knome> though i understand the pros of not being tied to (release) schedules
[18:14] <raub> Risking sounding like certain companies that steal their customer's souls, would it be possible to record how often a given machine access the docs?
[18:14] <raub> So we can have actual data
[18:15] <mhall119> raub: local docs?
[18:15] <raub> yeah
[18:15] <mhall119> I don't think that would be possible/acceptable
[18:16] <mhall119> we could maybe use popcon to see how many have installed the docs packages, if (a) they are separate -doc packages and (b) they aren't isntalled by default or as a recommends
[18:16] <knome> mhall119, that's not the number we want; all regular xubuntu installations *have* the docs
[18:17] <knome> we'd like to know how many actually *use* them
[18:17] <mhall119> right, so we'd have record and report file access.....that won't be popular
[18:17] <knome> yeah, not really
[18:17] <raub> I wonder how to get data without being google
[18:17] <mhall119> take it away and count how many people complain :)
[18:18] <knome> mhall119, how do the people who have no internet access and need the offline docs complain? ;)
[18:18] <knome> also, vocal minority
[18:18] <raub> pmatulis: Where would we find the average desktop user so we can put the poll there?
[18:18] <mhall119> yeah, no good way to get this info
[18:19] <knome> you could keep the same infra, and have packaged docs, and online (web) docs
[18:19] <knome> the packaged docs could point to the "updated" online docs
[18:19] <knome> which could be updated regardless of where you are in the release schedule
[18:20] <dholbach> could you guys join the hangout as well? :)
[18:20] <mhall119> couldn't we also SRU new docs after release?
[18:20] <belkinsa_web> Link: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfs-LezOGpwYbtjHH5WGSrWEWJlDz0_qvciVDrRmseAly4gtw
[18:20] <knome> dholbach, can't right now, i'm afraid
[18:20] <dholbach> maybe try different browsers if your current doesn't work
[18:20] <dholbach> knome, ok
[18:20] <knome> mhall119, yeah, that too
[18:21] <knome> mhall119, but peter's main argument seems to be "the bureaucracy slows down our progress"
[18:21] <raub> What if the in-computer docs will have enough useful info to get the basics running, including getting online? Then the online docs would be more abridged
[18:22] <raub> er, UNabridged
[18:22] <knome> yep, happening, and we will land an SRU for xubuntu 14.04.x
[18:22] <raub> i.e. more crap
[18:22] <dholbach> I was just looking at https://help.ubuntu.com/14.04/ubuntu-help/whats-new.html
[18:22] <raub> I do agree that too much bureaucracy does slow things down
[18:23] <knome> ubuntu community help
[18:23] <knome> dholbach, help.ubuntu.com/community
[18:23] <dholbach> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/utopic/ubuntu-docs/utopic I guess
[18:24] <raub> mhall119: I think there should be enough docs in the desktop to get it up and running and connected to the net
[18:24] <knome> pmatulis, you can keep on working on the documentation after the freezes, and put the latest revisions online
[18:25] <knome> yeah, the release team should be relatively liberal on updating docs after freezes..
[18:26] <belkinsa_web> We still have no driver for Desktop
[18:26] <knome> i think the only reason why freezes happen as soon as they do now is that there needs to be some time to handle the uploads
[18:26] <knome> dholbach, ^
[18:27] <raub> Are there any people from the desktop team here?
[18:27] <knome> so if there was a person or two who could commit uploading the docs later, the freezes could happen later easily
[18:28] <knome> dholbach, i agree. but that's what the doc team wiki says.
[18:28] <dholbach> ok :)
[18:28] <raub> About docs deadline, why not just have one deadline a year? I mean, how much should it change between pickls.04 and pickles.10?
[18:28] <belkinsa_web> We can't, we have cycles that are 6 months long.
[18:29] <raub> belkinsa_web: how much does the releases really change between cycles?
[18:29] <knome> pmatulis, sure, i understand. but what are the late changes you need to do?
[18:29] <belkinsa_web> Good point.
[18:29] <knome> pmatulis, i mean, why weren't they been done earlier?
[18:30] <knome> the rest of the community can (kind of) commit to schedules, why can't documentation?
[18:30] <knome> or why is it so different for documentation?
[18:31] <belkinsa_web> I think we don't have enough man power.
[18:31] <belkinsa_web> As pmatulis says
[18:31] <knome> then the problem is not the bureaucracy or the processes but the amount of contributors.
[18:31] <belkinsa_web> Recruitment issues.
[18:31] <bregma> with an LTS release, it may be possible to defer the final docs until the .01 point release to give more time for revision and translation cycles
[18:32]  * raub is guilty of that
[18:32] <knome> would the more appropriate question be how the developers of certain apps/parts of the system can help the documentation team?
[18:33] <bregma> developers make very poor documenters
[18:33] <raub> knome: that would be a good question
[18:33] <dholbach> I'm adding notes right now (http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1406-community-1406-ubuntu-documentation-team)
[18:34] <bregma> documentation is an ideal entry point for non-technical contributers, perhaps that should be stressed in the "how can I contribute?" material
[18:35] <bregma> QUESTION: is there a definitive list of "official" documention, who owns it, and how to get involved or contribute to each?
[18:35] <belkinsa_web> Maybve that link can be included on the main page?
[18:35] <belkinsa_web> The main COmmunity Help Wiki page
[18:35] <cheesehead> Is the recruiting problem that nobody wants to help? Or do new helpers get scared/demotivated and drop away?
[18:36] <knome> dholbach, re: gunnar, i don't know, i believe he was only going to pick up ubuntu-docs
[18:36] <belkinsa_web> Ali talked about that and we are missing that link
[18:36] <dholbach> knome, in that case, he could probably help with other packages or apply for upload rights for them too, or somebody else should apply
[18:37] <dholbach> it's not overly bureaucratic - either throw up a merge proposal or file a bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
[18:37] <knome> dholbach, i think the answer to the question if he'd like to do that was "not really", so yeah, somebody else needs to..
[18:37] <dholbach> let me know if stuff doesn't get sponsored
[18:37] <knome> dholbach, i understand that and it's not a problem for our team, but i was thinking about the documentation stuff generally
[18:37] <dholbach> to me it doesn't look like the biggest problem in the whole docs process - I'm happy to help with sponsorship as well
[18:37] <pmatulis> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam
[18:38] <knome> some packages always seem to be stalling for a reason or another :/
[18:38] <knome> dholbach, probably not
[18:38] <dholbach> some stuff might stall, yes - I agree and I'm not saying it's perfect
[18:38] <dholbach> let me know if things stall
[18:39] <dholbach> after a few sponsored uploads, some doc member can apply for upload rights themselves then :)
[18:39] <knome> i don't think you need to be a member of any team to do a merge proposal
[18:39] <knome> mhall119, ^
[18:39] <dholbach> knome, no, you don't
[18:39] <dholbach> ah sorry
[18:39] <dholbach> I misunderstood :)
[18:39] <dholbach> ignore me :)
[18:40] <knome> i can help with upgrading the community help wiki frontpage (to ensure it keeps looking good)
[18:40] <raub> Good because I do not know how to go anymore from the main ubuntu site to the server docs
[18:40] <raub> shame on me!
[18:40] <belkinsa_web> pmatulis: can you post it here too?
[18:41] <pmatulis> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/UbuntuDesktopGuide
[18:42] <dholbach> knome, I noted down an action for you :)
[18:42] <knome> For information on contributing see the Ubuntu Documentation Team wiki page.
[18:42] <knome> help.ubuntu.com says that ^
[18:43] <ahoneybun> lots of people
[18:43] <raub> Why not have links to the, say, intro to bazaar?
[18:43] <raub> on the main doc page?
[18:43] <raub> or how to use this thing
[18:43] <belkinsa_web> For the Kubuntu Doc team roundtable, who is kicking it off?
[18:43] <raub> If you already know how to use it, don't click th elink
[18:43] <ahoneybun> valorie: want to kick us off?
[18:44] <belkinsa_web> I will be joining too, but not kicking it off.
[18:44] <knome> raub, contributions on improving the team page are welcome
[18:44] <belkinsa_web> But thank you, ahoneybun.
[18:44] <ahoneybun> for belkinsa?
[18:45] <belkinsa_web> Giving me a update.
[18:45] <ahoneybun> oh I'll kick us off if I need to
[18:45] <knome> pmatulis, that makes me think if canonical could help with that at all.
[18:46] <knome> the documentation team wiki is a bit sloppy
[18:46] <belkinsa_web> Maybe in this cycle, we can clean it up?
[18:46] <ahoneybun> knome: throw me a link to it and I'll look at it
[18:46] <knome> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam
[18:47] <knome> to me it looks like the wiki might overcomplicate some things.
[18:47] <knome> pmatulis, they aren't called documentation any more
[18:47] <knome> pmatulis, it's called community help wiki now
[18:48] <ahoneybun> I mean we don't really work on that as that is the main ubuntu docs team page, but I'll help if I can
[18:49] <belkinsa_web> Yeah, they are just help guides
[18:49] <belkinsa_web> The UF are
[18:49] <belkinsa_web> and AskUbunti
[18:49] <belkinsa_web> Ubuntu*
[18:49]  * ahoneybun is confused
[18:50] <raub> knome: point taken
[18:50] <ahoneybun> the kubuntu session has not started right
[18:50] <belkinsa_web> ahoneybun: everyone is googling for the answer
[18:50] <belkinsa_web> Oh, sorry
[18:51] <ahoneybun> 19:00 is 3pm to New york
[18:51] <knome> got to go. thanks belkinsa_web, dholbach for running the meeting
[18:51] <belkinsa_web> Not a problem
[18:51] <belkinsa> ahoneybun, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS/Sessions
[18:51] <belkinsa> Look at this
[18:54] <belkinsa_web> Is the timer off?
[18:54] <belkinsa_web> Its' 54 not 55
[18:55] <ahoneybun> https://plus.google.com/events/c2nq9rtu3gubkj4927ulpglm1ps
[18:56] <mhall119> dholbach: I managed to freeze Unity
[18:56] <dholbach> thanks guys! :)
[18:56] <dholbach> mhall119, oopsie
[18:56] <mhall119> thanks everyone
[18:56]  * mhall119 goes to reboot
[18:56]  * belkinsa_web needs one too
[18:56] <dholbach> is anyone going to run the kubuntu docs meeting?
[18:57] <valorie> ahoneybun: do you need to invite me or something?
[18:57] <valorie> the link you posted only allows me to "watch"
[18:57] <dholbach> valorie, ahoneybun: are you setting up the hangout? :)
[18:58] <ahoneybun> dholbach: I got it set up just need to send links
[18:58] <valorie> ah got it
[18:58] <barsook> What;s the hangout link?
[18:59] <barsook> the one to join?
[18:59] <valorie> https://plus.google.com/events/c2nq9rtu3gubkj4927ulpglm1ps
[18:59] <ahoneybun> do I air it?
[18:59] <valorie> but I think there is another one
[18:59] <ahoneybun> start broadcast?
[19:00] <barsook> What is it again?
[19:00] <belkinsa_web> https://plus.google.com/events/c2nq9rtu3gubkj4927ulpglm1ps
[19:00] <valorie> ahoneybun: did you follow the uds/sessions link?
[19:00] <dholbach> button at the bottom
[19:00] <belkinsa_web> Yeah, it's not the one
[19:01] <dholbach> you're live!
[19:01] <SilverLion> ahoneybun: pls DO wear headphones!
[19:01] <belkinsa_web> ahoneybun: it's the one that you get when in the hangout and the sound needs to be fixed
[19:01] <SilverLion> your background noises are terrible :(
[19:01] <belkinsa_web> Headphones please.
[19:02] <ahoneybun> better?
[19:02] <ahoneybun> there is a delay
[19:02] <SilverLion> your ac is killing the sound
[19:02] <ahoneybun> ok turned that off
[19:03] <ahoneybun> how do I invite people to the hangout
[19:03] <dholbach> ahoneybun, just paste the URL in here
[19:03] <ahoneybun> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcJruxQy3tuc0JL7-Q6EQzyP02oFJS0JqiRdfzgqnz76VTmPg?authuser=0&hl=en
[19:03] <valorie> oh thank goodness
[19:04] <ahoneybun> valorie: did that work?
[19:04] <belkinsa_web> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcJruxQy3tuc0JL7-Q6EQzyP02oFJS0JqiRdfzgqnz76VTmPg?a...
[19:04] <belkinsa_web> Yes
[19:05] <shadeslayer> hey ho
[19:05] <belkinsa_web> Hangout link to join: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcJruxQy3tuc0JL7-Q6EQzyP02oFJS0JqiRdfzgqnz76VTmPg?a...
[19:05] <valorie> yes, that works
[19:05] <ahoneybun> awesome
[19:05] <valorie> thank you belkinsa_web
[19:05] <shadeslayer> ahoneybun: there's usually a delay
[19:05] <ahoneybun> shadeslayer: you made it
[19:05] <shadeslayer> I'm cooking dinner/practicing my violin, I'll pipe in if required
[19:05] <shadeslayer> via IRC
[19:06] <shadeslayer> can't do 3 things at once
[19:06] <SilverLion> how do you folks get these banners with the icons where your names are on?
[19:06] <ahoneybun> SilverLion: hangout tool
[19:07] <ahoneybun> left handside
[19:08] <shadeslayer> ahoneybun: document process  on the wiki! :P
[19:10]  * ahoneybun is bad at this lol
[19:10] <belkinsa_web> Its' cool, you are learning.
[19:10] <shadeslayer> ^^
[19:11] <shadeslayer> ahoneybun: apachelogger moved the wiki
[19:14] <ahoneybun> shadeslayer: oh he did?
[19:14] <shadeslayer> ahoneybun: yes, everything is on community.kde.org now
[19:14] <shadeslayer> see ML
[19:15] <belkinsa_web> I think I like how the wiki is on the KDE site.  You have the Discussion page/tab.  Lucky you.  ;)
[19:17] <belkinsa_web> Your LP project page is outdate: https://launchpad.net/kubuntu-docs
[19:17] <s-lion> can someone repost hangout link?
[19:17] <belkinsa_web> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcJruxQy3tuc0JL7-Q6EQzyP02oFJS0JqiRdfzgqnz76VTmPg?a...
[19:17] <s-lion> thnx
[19:17] <s-lion> you'll get a Lubuntu visitor ;)
[19:17] <belkinsa_web> And a Ubuntu one too
[19:18] <shadeslayer> FYI I've lost the stream
[19:18] <shadeslayer> so best ping me on IRC
[19:20] <belkinsa_web> Is there a Ubuntu Comms team, by any chance.
[19:20] <belkinsa_web> SilverLion just gave me an idea
[19:20] <shadeslayer> and back, and gone
[19:20] <valorie> belkinsa_web: not as such
[19:20] <valorie> but we're trying to get a group together
[19:21] <belkinsa_web> I figured since the Ubuntu Marketing team is dead
[19:21] <ahoneybun> ubuntu comms?
[19:21] <belkinsa_web> Yeah
[19:21] <belkinsa_web> I think Ubuntu needs one too
[19:21] <belkinsa_web> Turn off your mic!
[19:23] <belkinsa_web> I think a Comms teams might be better for this case rather than marketing.
[19:23] <belkinsa_web> Or that.
[19:24] <belkinsa_web> Sounds like a recruiting for the starting point
[19:25] <belkinsa_web> Developers don't docuement anything
[19:25] <belkinsa_web> That's the problem.
[19:26] <sgclark2> I will try to spend some time with documentation between packaging
[19:26] <belkinsa_web> But I think pleia2 is trying to get developers to give updates.
[19:27] <sgclark2> re-inventing the wheel
[19:27] <valorie> hey sgclark2
[19:27] <sgclark2> hello!
[19:29] <sgclark2> agree
[19:29] <sgclark2> plus another 24 hours in a day
[19:29] <sgclark2> it is a full time job keeping all that up
[19:29] <belkinsa_web> lol
[19:30] <sgclark2> oh?
[19:31] <belkinsa_web> sgclark2:https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcJruxQy3tuc0JL7-Q6EQzyP02oFJS0JqiRdfzgqnz76VTmPg?a...  if you want to join
[19:32] <belkinsa_web> Don't forget the action items!
[19:34] <belkinsa_web> Like https://help.ubuntu.com/ would something like that?
[19:35] <belkinsa_web> Looks clearer.
[19:35] <belkinsa_web> CLeaner*
[19:37] <sgclark2> I can't seem to get the plugin to work
[19:37] <belkinsa_web> What's the problem, sgclark2?
[19:38] <valorie> yes, however, we've had trouble getting themes to be uniformly applied
[19:39] <belkinsa_web> We are all USA folks
[19:39] <ahoneybun> thank you belkinsa_web
[19:39] <belkinsa_web> 3:39 PM here
[19:39] <ahoneybun> belkinsa: same time here
[19:41] <sgclark2> 12:40 pm here
[19:41] <sgclark2> that is what I am packaging
[19:41] <ahoneybun> nice sgclark2
[19:44] <belkinsa_web> ahoneybun: carefull, Twitter was hacked into today
[19:44] <valorie> oh yes, I saw a tweetdeck exploit
[19:45] <s-lion> lubuntu comms was using tweetdeck ;)
[19:46] <valorie> yikes
[19:46] <valorie> i'm sure it will be fixed soon
[19:46] <s-lion> it definetly will
[19:46] <belkinsa_web> Yeah, I quit Twitter though.
[19:46] <s-lion> belkinsa_web: no need to quit the whole twitter ;)
[19:47] <belkinsa_web> Well, I don't use it anymore.
[19:47] <belkinsa_web> ANd I get my updated via feeds.
[19:47] <s-lion> I'll head out of the hangout now
[19:48] <s-lion> returning to Lubuntu Comms Works ;)
[19:48] <belkinsa_web> Alright.
[19:48] <valorie> nice to see you Harry
[19:48] <belkinsa_web> Thank for coming
[19:48] <ahoneybun> thanks s-lion
[19:49] <s-lion> I'll be around as silverlion though
[19:49] <s-lion> you'll find me in the lubuntu area if needed or belkinsa can make contact ;)
[19:49] <belkinsa_web> Just a wonder, I think Recruiting or comms can work
[19:50] <belkinsa_web> Marketing makes me think of selling it
[19:50] <valorie> exactly
[19:50] <belkinsa_web> Promo could work too
[19:50] <sgclark2> Promoting sounds good to me
[19:52] <belkinsa_web> ahoneybun: you use e-mail client?  I do to.
[19:52] <ahoneybun> I really like kmail belkinsa, I only need to use browser email for my steam code
[19:52] <sgclark2> more than one will need to help with social, it is alot of work, I did it for a long time and finally ran off screaming haha
[19:53] <valorie> I agree
[19:53] <belkinsa_web> See ya, computer needs to charge
[19:53] <valorie> & can hardly stand social media these days
[19:53] <ahoneybun> belkinsa: thanks for coming belkinsa
[19:53] <belkinsa_web> Not a problem
[19:54] <belkinsa_web> Glad to help and I think we may have a larger problem in the COmmunity of Ubuntu and it's flavours.
[19:54] <belkinsa_web> If only two teams have a Comms/Promo/Recruiting team.
[19:54] <valorie> what larger problem?
[19:54] <valorie> ah
[19:54] <valorie> well, I'm part of my LoCo
[19:54] <valorie> and do promo there
[19:54] <sgclark2> see you in irc!
[19:54] <ahoneybun> I am too but I can't go to Orlando for the meetings
[19:55] <belkinsa_web> I try to but it's quiet in Ohio
[19:55]  * valorie goes afk for awhile.....
[19:55] <ahoneybun> sgclark2: what time are you in >?
[19:55] <sgclark2> Pacific US
[19:56] <ahoneybun> how do I put for public view?
[19:56]  * SilverLion is located in UTC + 2 (CET) :D
[19:57] <SilverLion> I have to go offline for updates ... be back later!
[19:58] <belkinsa> mhall119, do you know which flavours have a Comms/Promo/Recruiting team to help new people to get involved?
[19:59] <mhall119> belkinsa: I don't, no
[19:59] <mhall119> Kubuntu might?
[19:59] <belkinsa> Kubuntu will as I heard.
[20:00] <belkinsa> Alright, I was just wondering.  You think Ubuntu needs one?
[20:00] <mhall119> belkinsa: I missed this session, what would such a team do?
[20:01] <belkinsa> It could be used to help new people to get involved.  Like a starting point where that person can be lead to the othher teams within that flavour.
[20:52] <knome> belkinsa, that's a hard, and probably in ways a wrong question
[20:52] <knome> belkinsa, xubuntu doesn't have a specific, designed team for that, but we are all pretty open to help anybody with anything they might need
[20:53] <knome> belkinsa, so a bit more organic than how some of the other flavors (ubuntu GNOME, lubuntu) have structured their teams and helping out new people
[21:02] <belkinsa> knome, ah, I see.
[21:02] <belkinsa> Do you use your main flavour mainling list for it?
[21:02] <belkinsa> mailing*
[21:22] <knome> we have a -devel list
[21:22] <knome> but some of us do follow the -users list as well
[22:15] <belkinsa> mhall119, this was suggested to me on the doc team's IRC about your item in the Doc Team's Roundtable: [17:17] <GunnarHj> belkinsa: A link to http://community.ubuntu.com/contribute/documentation/ might be what should be on top of help.ubuntu.com