[06:24] <soee> good morning
[06:34] <apachelogger> Riddell, shadeslayer: libkubuntu continues to not be reviewed?
[07:43] <lordievader> Good morning.
[08:12] <Riddell> apachelogger: ah yes maybe that's what I want to do this morning
[08:16] <apachelogger> you know
[08:16] <apachelogger> pointless upgrades really annoy me
[08:16] <apachelogger> a lot
[08:19] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: is the homerun bzr branch not used anymore? if so, please remove it or something
[08:34] <Quintasan> hi
[08:35] <apachelogger> hello mister Quintasan
[08:39] <apachelogger> ScottK: bug 1341473
[08:39] <apachelogger>   Uploading homerun_1.2.5-0ubuntu0.14.04.1_source.changes: done.
[08:39] <apachelogger> Successfully uploaded packages.
[09:14] <Riddell> void Kubuntu::LanguagePrivate::transactionError() 
[09:14] <Riddell> auth error reply! 
[09:14] <Riddell> apachelogger: my plasma 5 desktop missing something that qapt needs?
[09:14] <Riddell> ↑
[09:16] <apachelogger> Riddell: yes
[09:17] <Riddell> maybe I should just reinstall utopic, could test the locale changes while I'm at it
[09:18] <apachelogger> I cannot find my fix for it though :@
[09:19] <apachelogger> Riddell: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7792648/
[09:19] <apachelogger> Riddell: I am actually not sure how to best go about this in kubuntu
[09:20] <apachelogger> we could possibly force all autostarts to /etc/xdg/autostart, but if they don't have proper onlyshowin=kde that will make them start everywhere (which is a controllable defect, a defect nonetheless)
[09:22] <apachelogger> -DKDE4_AUTOSTART_INSTALL_DIR="etc/xdg/autostart" as global option apparently
[09:22] <apachelogger> still needs a rebuild of the affected packages though
[09:22] <apachelogger> it's a bit of a drag really
[09:22] <apachelogger> upstream didn't want to deal with this, maybe you should poke them with a stick :P
[09:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: http://markmail.org/thread/n7htglbcxjk3qcee
[09:27] <Riddell> apachelogger: hmm interesting
[09:27] <Riddell> can we fix ksmserver to just look in the kde 4 dir?
[09:27] <apachelogger> Riddell: we can set that XDG_ env var I mention in the mail
[09:28] <Riddell> any downside of that?
[09:28] <apachelogger> that still leaves the problem of what if we don't want a certain file in plasma5
[09:28] <Riddell> package conflict then surely
[09:28] <apachelogger> maybe, I have not looked what is affected
[09:29] <apachelogger> perhaps the more reasonable approach would be to selectively manually copy/link the autostarts we know we need and want
[09:30] <apachelogger> which is what I did with neon, then again neon doesn't have the luxury of conflicting with things, so that's the only reasonable option there ^^
[10:07] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: oi
[10:08] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: while we took into account multi-arch, we did not take into account lib transitions
[10:08] <shadeslayer> and stuff
[10:08] <shadeslayer> ( re no -data packages )
[10:08] <shadeslayer> so now we can't have libkf5auth5 and libkf5auth5abi1
[10:08] <shadeslayer> or atleast I don't think so
[10:08] <apachelogger> what?
[10:09] <shadeslayer> libkf5auth5 and libkf5auth5abi1 are not co installable because of locales?
[10:09] <apachelogger> are we now dropping data packages for multiarch Oo
[10:09] <apachelogger> libkf5auth5abi1 cannot happen
[10:09] <shadeslayer> why not
[10:09] <apachelogger> kauth is a framework and abi stable, if upstream breaks abi there'll be auth6
[10:09] <shadeslayer> its not like upstream hasn't broken ABI before
[10:10] <shadeslayer> and gone yolo
[10:10] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: upstream now has CI that detects ABI breakage
[10:10] <apachelogger> at any rate
[10:10] <shadeslayer> mmm .. not that I know of
[10:10] <apachelogger> why are we removing data packages from libs?
[10:10] <yofel> doesn't change the fact that auth5 and auth6 won't be co-installable
[10:10] <apachelogger> yofel: they need to be as they are libsies
[10:10]  * yofel only ever commented on multiarch, locales should never be in libs
[10:10] <yofel> apachelogger: right
[10:11] <apachelogger> data packagaes make sense for libs
[10:11] <apachelogger> they do not make sense for 99% of application packages
[10:11] <shadeslayer> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7792816/
[10:12] <shadeslayer> ^^ something that I reckon was decided on Friday
[10:18] <shadeslayer> so, should I revert?
[10:18] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: yofel ^^
[10:19] <shadeslayer> looking at https://code.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-packagers , all of the data packages were dropped
[10:19] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[10:20] <yofel> why did we drop them again? apachelogger complaining about ETOOMNY packages?
[10:20] <apachelogger> yeah
[10:20] <apachelogger> that was about workspace though, not frameworks
[10:20] <shadeslayer> uf
[10:21] <apachelogger> eitherway, as I said, there is not supposed to be ABI breakage so I don't think the data packages are strictly necessary
[10:23] <shadeslayer> so basically
[10:23] <shadeslayer> all of tier 1 has data packages
[10:23] <shadeslayer> tier 2 most likely doesn't, I haven't checked all of them yet
[10:23] <yofel> didn't you say all were dropped?
[10:23] <shadeslayer> seems quite inconsistent
[10:23] <shadeslayer> not for tier 1
[10:23] <yofel> ah
[10:23] <yofel> add them back IMO, at least to the point where libfooX only has 2 files in it
[10:24] <shadeslayer> sigh
[10:25] <yofel> they're not strictly needed indeed, but I would rather not end up having to add a transitional package like for analitza
[10:25] <shadeslayer> also, sgclark messed up changelogs for tier 1 :(
[10:25] <shadeslayer> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging-next/karchive/revision/31
[10:26] <yofel> I get the feeling that she's not using dch..
[10:28] <shadeslayer> ^^
[10:28] <apachelogger> too many tools I say
[10:28] <apachelogger> too many
[10:28] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: what's the messup though?
[10:28] <yofel> this *is* linux :P
[10:29] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging-next/kcompletion/revision/38
[10:31] <shadeslayer> yofel: \o/ from last night
[10:31] <yofel> :D
[10:32] <shadeslayer> much fun was had
[10:32] <shadeslayer> everyone was cheering for Germany at the pub
[10:32] <yofel> it was fun how many people had fireworks left in the basement ^^
[10:33] <shadeslayer> also, the pub's name was quite oxymoronic
[10:33] <shadeslayer> "The Quiet Man" -> wasn't quite quiet
[10:33] <yofel> hehehe
[10:35] <apachelogger> http://www.theonion.com/articles/german-team-hoping-to-lift-nations-spirit-followin,36416/
[10:36] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[10:38] <shadeslayer> much fun
[10:38] <shadeslayer> sgclark removed the data package, but not the dep on the data package :p
[10:39] <apachelogger> time for CI? :P
[10:39] <shadeslayer> yes plz
[10:39] <yofel> time for making debuild actually fail hard on lintian ^^
[10:55] <shadeslayer> mmm
[10:55] <shadeslayer> thoughts on replacing a build dep on qt5-default with a export QT_SELECT=5 in debian/rules
[11:08] <shadeslayer> hurray, kauth tests don't actually run
[11:10] <yofel> sure they do, but anything that needs that extra cmake parameter needs a special setup
[11:10] <yofel> so most frameworks tests are useless for us
[11:11] <shadeslayer> no they don't 
[11:11] <shadeslayer> basically
[11:12] <shadeslayer> the second test waits for a dbus interface to be available
[11:12] <shadeslayer> and that interface is only provided by the package
[11:12] <shadeslayer> and since the package isn't installed
[11:12] <shadeslayer> so the dbus interface never comes up
[11:12] <yofel> right, works fine if you build it, install it, set it up and run the tests
[11:12] <shadeslayer> right
[11:13] <shadeslayer> ala autopkgtests :)
[11:13] <yofel> pitti will be happy :P
[11:13] <shadeslayer> /tmp/buildd/kauth-5.0.0/debian/tmp/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/qt5/plugins/kauth/helper/kauth_helper_plugin.so > that's currently in our bin package, sounds quite wrong
[11:13] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: prolly related to https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=330058
[11:13]  * apachelogger wonders whether that bug should be moved to ECM
[11:13] <apachelogger> :S
[11:13] <yofel> why is a plugin being in -bin wrong?
[11:14] <yofel> it's not a lib, so do you want to add an extra -plugins package?
[11:14] <shadeslayer> well, it should be something like qtdeclarative5-kauth
[11:14] <shadeslayer> or not?
[11:14] <yofel> ah
[11:14] <apachelogger> yofel: most libraries that do work with plugins need at least one plugin to do anything
[11:15] <apachelogger> or well, not crash or qcritical or something
[11:15] <shadeslayer> One would think that -bin only has /usr/bin , /bin or /sbin
[11:15] <apachelogger> so splitting out the plugin into a different package actually doesn't do anything
[11:15] <yofel> apachelogger: uh, how did I disagree with that o.O? sure they do
[11:16] <apachelogger> also, there's a two way ABI linkage there
[11:17] <apachelogger> on the one hand the plugin implements the well defined interface of the lib, so if that changes (which is not part of the lib ABI fwiw) the plugin cannot be loaded anymore, and the other way around the plugin mostly will use the library itself to do stuff and so breakage of the actual lib ABI will also make the plugin unloadable
[11:18] <yofel> hm, yeah..
[11:18] <yofel> guess it doesn't really matter where they are then
[11:19] <apachelogger> so if you have /plugin/bar.so as a plugin of /lib/foo.so.0 and foo breaks ABI on either end /plugin/bar.so cannot be loaded unless rebuilt against this new version
[11:19] <yofel> as long we never SRU a new ABI
[11:19] <apachelogger> you could split out bar.so but that doesn't do anything but allow foo to be installed
[11:19] <shadeslayer> yeah, I'm going to rename -bin to -plugins
[11:20] <apachelogger> assuming bar is essential to foo the library will actually not do anything without bar, so you have a complicated problem anyway
[11:20] <shadeslayer> hm
[11:21] <apachelogger> so IMO everyone is better served if a possible libfoo1 then actually conflicts with libfoo0 because when plugins are involved and the plugins actually conflict by name or path you have to do a full archive transition
[11:21] <yofel> hence why IMO plugins should have an ABI sub-dir, but nobody does that
[11:21] <apachelogger> the other option would be to drop the plugins from foo0 (which would then defunct the library) in order to be able to include the plugins of foo1
[11:22] <apachelogger> so it's very much a judgement call, what is better.. a library that does nothing and breaks the applications at runtime or a breakage on package level that prevents the applications from getting broken
[11:22] <apachelogger> yofel: phonon does :P
[11:22] <yofel> phonon++
[11:24] <apachelogger> phonon even used to be forwards *and* backwards compatible, you could run a 4.0 backend with a 4.4 library despite the interface definition being divergent and you could run a 4.4 backend with a 4.0 library (as long as you did not use new lib api of course)
[11:24] <shadeslayer> the question is, what does debian think
[11:24] <apachelogger> much madness had bene had there xD
[11:35] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: yofel so what's the situation with the plugin stuff
[11:37] <apachelogger> I'd stuff it in with the lib
[11:45] <shadeslayer> ok
[12:20] <sgclark> Riddell: good morning, I am finding some of the changelogs all history seems to be gone, does that seem right?
[12:23] <sgclark> shadeslayer: ^ looks like this occurred when you released, history starts over when released?
[12:52] <ScottK> Riddell: It'd be nice to see kapidox out of New.
[13:08] <Riddell> ScottK: gotcha, in a min
[13:09] <Riddell> sgclark: shadeslayer will have tidied up the history to make the changelog reflect the history of the package in the ubuntu archive rather than just in a PPA
[13:09] <Riddell> although I guess it could point to bzr for the back history
[13:09] <ScottK> Thanks.
[13:12] <sgclark> Riddell: so all of my hard work never happened? interesting.
[13:16] <Riddell> sgclark: of course it did!
[13:17] <Riddell> he should have kept your name in the changelog
[13:17] <Riddell> shadeslayer: stop taking all scarlett's glory!
[13:17] <sgclark> Riddell: ok so take a look kguiaddons, even bzr it is being removed
[13:18] <sgclark> I am being erased from kf5 history and I am a very sad panda
[13:19] <ScottK> The history is still there, right?
[13:21] <Riddell> ScottK: bzr log  history is still there, shadeslayer is clearing the debian/changelog before the upload to the archive
[13:22] <apachelogger> sgclark: http://i.imgur.com/ydHKEyp.png you're still there :)
[13:22] <ScottK> sgclark: You can add the packages to https://www.ohloh.net/p/kubuntu-packaging if you want a better sense of it.
[13:23] <Riddell> which I think is sensible enough, but I can see how it grates
[13:23] <Riddell> and he shouldn't take the credit in the changelog
[13:23] <apachelogger> oh my ohloh still exists
[13:23] <apachelogger> Riddell: we should just stop doing changelogs
[13:23] <apachelogger> autogen from bzr
[13:23] <apachelogger> be done with it
[13:23] <Riddell> yes that would be best
[13:23] <Riddell> I wonder what the easiest way to do that is
[13:24] <apachelogger> ScottK: did someone write a script to set all the branches or how did that happen?
[13:24] <ScottK> apachelogger: I was very bored and did a few at at time.
[13:24] <Riddell> not yet
[13:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: expand bzr-buildpackage I guess(tm)
[13:24] <ScottK> I didn't get them all done.
[13:24] <sgclark> All-time Commits: 1 woot! I am rocken... what have I been doing? how do I add there?
[13:24] <apachelogger> ScottK: oh :)
[13:25] <apachelogger> I wonder if ohloh has an api
[13:25] <ScottK> sgclark: None of the kf5 packages are in there yet.
[13:27]  * ScottK just added kapidox
[13:28] <apachelogger> apparently the ohlohohohlou has api nowadays
[13:28] <apachelogger> http://meta.ohloh.net/2014/07/ohloh-will-be-in-read-only-mode-for-a-potentially-long-time/ Oo
[13:29] <Riddell> oh oh?
[13:29] <shadeslayer> sgclark: 1) Purging PPA history was agreed upon by me and Riddell , 2) your contributions are not really lost, you're still there in bzr, 3) regarding your name being dropped from the changelog, that's all dch's fault, since I'm using dch to modify changelogs
[13:30] <Riddell> excuses excuses..
[13:30] <shadeslayer> ...
[13:30] <Riddell> ola dantti, you're the debconf-kde man?
[13:30] <ScottK> That doesn't bode well.
[13:30] <dantti> Riddell: yup
[13:31] <apachelogger> https://www.ohloh.net/accounts/apachelogger
[13:31] <apachelogger> ohlohohohoh doesn't appreciate my elitist ruby knowledge :'<
[13:31] <Riddell> dantti: I hear there's a port ongoing?
[13:32] <shadeslayer> sgclark: sorry about the changelog messup though
[13:32] <dantti> Riddell: well I didn't know but it seems apachelogger has been doing some of it
[13:32] <apachelogger> dantti: it's all done, sorry that I jumped the gun but it was blocking qapt which is blocking everything else ;)
[13:32] <dantti> actually I'd like to get rid of kf5 deps as it is basically only using k18n
[13:33] <dantti> apachelogger: np, I've been quite busy lately with some other projects
[13:33] <apachelogger> dantti: FWIW I think ki18n is a worthwhile thing, otherwise all users of debconf-kde need to set a qtranslator which I totally see people not doing
[13:34] <shadeslayer> I don't want to manually edit every changelog though :(
[13:34] <shadeslayer> it's so much more work
[13:34] <dantti> apachelogger: well the could do that I think
[13:34] <dantti> *the lib
[13:34] <Riddell> dantti: the whole point of kf5 is you can use a bit without bringing in the whole of kdelibs, makes sense to use ki18n, it's small and makes translations sane
[13:34] <apachelogger> drop everything, keep ki18n ;)
[13:35]  * apachelogger tries something
[13:35] <dantti> right but I also would like to get rid of all gui it has, so I think not even ki18n would be needed
[13:35] <dantti> I say that because of QML
[13:37] <apachelogger> dantti: ah yeah, I have been thinking about that, you'll probably want to coordinate with apol
[13:38] <apachelogger> dantti: fwiw, you could just split the gui bits and put them in libdebconf-kde-widgets (assuming they are actually useful ^^)
[13:38] <dantti> well they would be usefull for I while I guess
[13:39] <apachelogger> also quick info on the deps KF5TextWidgets could be dropped  other than that only i18n and kdecore remain and i18n deps kdecore, so nothing lost there
[13:39] <dantti> maybe creating a new libdebconf-qt repo and have the -kde carry the gui thing
[13:39] <apachelogger> *nod*
[13:39] <apachelogger> well
[13:40] <apachelogger> dantti: there's no reason why the gui couldn't live in the same repo, qapt does that
[13:40] <dantti> yes, but long term it would be qt only thing
[13:41] <dantti> qml users would probably create their own uis
[13:42] <apachelogger> dantti: qapt is qt only, it  just happens to build a bunch more stuff when kdelibs is present
[13:42] <apachelogger> anyway, best talk to apol, as usual I do not comprehend the big picture so I can't really give much input :)
[13:43] <dantti> okay
[13:45] <shadeslayer> btw has anyone been working on 4.14?
[13:45] <shadeslayer> we had a new release and stuff
[14:09] <shadeslayer> soo
[14:10] <shadeslayer> how come we have libkf5auth-data and libkf5auth-dev
[14:10] <shadeslayer> but libkf5auth5 and libkf5auth5-dbg
[14:12] <sgclark> the latter is due to sonames matching lintain, why we remove on debug and dev is not known to me, Riddell?
[14:12] <sgclark> err data
[14:12] <sgclark> though data packages are going away
[14:12] <shadeslayer> nope
[14:12] <shadeslayer> the data packages have to stay
[14:13] <Riddell> shadeslayer: nope, that's a definate TODO
[14:13] <sgclark> sigh
[14:13] <shadeslayer> see logs from this morning
[14:13] <sgclark> would someone enlighten me as to what is going on?
[14:13]  * sgclark feels she is being pushed out
[14:13] <Riddell> shadeslayer: libkf5auth5 cos that's the soversion, libkf5auth5-dbg cos nobody knows is the soversion should be in there or not but only opinion I got from debian kde dudes is to have it
[14:14] <Riddell> libkf5auth-dev because you don't need an soversion there unless you expect to have two of the library in the archive at any time
[14:14] <Riddell> likewise -data
[14:14] <shadeslayer> mhm
[14:15] <Riddell> apachelogger: I don't seem to be getting a ~/.kde/env/setlocale.sh libkubuntu file when i set language, should I?
[14:15] <apachelogger> yes
[14:15] <apachelogger> Riddell: get kdebug output plz
[14:15] <apachelogger> or well, I think it uses qdebug
[14:15] <apachelogger> eitherway, terminal output will tell us more :P
[14:16] <Riddell> apachelogger: hmm, this time I do
[14:16] <Riddell> apachelogger: http://paste.kde.org/p11mzecpw  es_US ?
[14:17] <Riddell> american dialect of spanish?
[14:17] <apachelogger> that can't be the right libkubuntu
[14:17] <apachelogger> oh actually I don't have spanish
[14:17] <apachelogger> Riddell: please rune locale -a
[14:17] <apachelogger> who knows, maybe es_US exists xD
[14:17] <apachelogger> but I doubt it
[14:17] <apachelogger> I rather think you might be having the wrong libkubuntu loaded for some reason
[14:21] <shadeslayer> sgclark: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/07/14/%23kubuntu-devel.html#t10:07
[14:21] <Riddell> apachelogger: don't think I do http://paste.kde.org/p72i0z21v
[14:21] <shadeslayer> sgclark: discussion from this morning about -data pacakges
[14:21] <shadeslayer> *packages even
[14:22] <apachelogger> Riddell: remove the file then try again
[14:23] <apachelogger> btw, something I am a bit worried about: if kconf_update can be triggered before the new lib file is actually in place it could try to create a broken setlocale using the old lib
[14:23] <apachelogger> I am not sure that can happen though
[14:23] <apachelogger> Riddell: actually
[14:24] <sgclark> shadeslayer: I messed up changelogs?
[14:24] <shadeslayer> yus
[14:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: pmap -p `pidof kcmshell4`
[14:24] <shadeslayer> sort of
[14:24] <shadeslayer> minor stuff really
[14:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: assuming you use kcmshell4
[14:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: I am still not convinced that is the right libkubuntu :P
[14:24] <shadeslayer> sgclark: I released a package -> you made some changes -> added entries to already realeased part
[14:25] <shadeslayer> what you should have done is run dch -i , then added your modifications there
[14:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: and what's the output of locale -a?
[14:26] <Riddell> apachelogger: huh, locale -a does include es_US.utf8
[14:26] <apachelogger> :P
[14:27] <apachelogger> my code reigns supreme clearly
[14:27] <apachelogger> I really do wonder what's off with kdelibs/cmake btw
[14:28] <apachelogger> qdebugs are as of late not enabled anymore it appears
[14:28] <apachelogger> Riddell: or did you use ok?
[14:29] <Riddell> apachelogger: I did
[14:29] <apachelogger> Riddell: random note of the day: due to kcms being very shitty ok in all kcms that do something more than write a config value will result in undefined behavior because for some reason at least kcmshell does not wait for the kcms to actually return from save()
[14:29] <apachelogger> it's all very weird
[14:29] <shadeslayer> oh
[14:29] <apachelogger> you can also observe this in the phonon kcm for example on some pulseaudio setting or the other
[14:29] <shadeslayer> I found the flag to not mess with changelogs
[14:30] <Riddell> apachelogger: if I set it to spanish with british english as fallback I get only.. >cat ~/.kde/env/setlocale.sh 
[14:30] <Riddell> export LANGUAGE=es:en
[14:30] <apachelogger> perfect then
[14:30] <Riddell> apachelogger: so I guess there is no british dialect of spanish
[14:31] <Riddell> what will I speak when I go home?!
[14:31] <apachelogger> mustn't go home clearly 
[14:31] <apachelogger> otherwise you cause a paradox that will make time collapse in on itself :O
[14:32] <Riddell> I guess by then I'll be going home to the independent kingdom of scotland and gibralter and we can fix posix locales
[14:32] <apachelogger> hrrrhrr
[14:32] <Riddell> apachelogger: so libkubuntu looks lovely to me
[14:33] <Riddell> apachelogger: locales in /usr/share/locale-kdelibs4/ working good too, what did you think needed tested there?
[14:44] <apachelogger> Riddell: can't recall
[14:44] <apachelogger> everything :P
[14:44] <shadeslayer> Riddell: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/07/14/%23kubuntu-devel.html#t10:07
[14:46] <sgclark> shadeslayer: I just want to note, I do use dch, and it would have worked had I not been completeely removed from changelog, I was unaware of this when I was doing all of these packages removing data packages.
[14:47] <shadeslayer> sgclark: what command did you use?
[14:47] <sgclark> dch as I was told
[14:47] <shadeslayer> yeah, thats why, you forgot -i
[14:47] <shadeslayer> to increment the version when the package has already been uploaded
[14:48] <shadeslayer> Riddell: spotify:track:3QxgOiZSkuyq7hALKV3fJa < much dark
[14:49] <shadeslayer> Riddell: http://open.spotify.com/track/3QxgOiZSkuyq7hALKV3fJa
[14:50] <sgclark> shadeslayer: not forget, did not know, I did it the same wway I have been doing it for months, so the difference here is because it in archive or what?
[14:51] <Riddell> shadeslayer forgot to tell you
[14:51] <shadeslayer> what
[14:51] <shadeslayer> stop blaming me for everything :(
[14:52] <sgclark> I am just trying to learn here, I want to do things properly
[14:52] <Riddell> yeah, now for packages in the archive use dch -i  to add a new version after each upload to the archive so 5.0.0-0ubuntu1 gets a new entry for 5.0.0-0ubuntu2 ready for the next upload
[14:52] <shadeslayer> sgclark: workflow is always : make changes -> upload -> make changes -> bump version -> make more changes -> upload -> repeat
[14:52] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: because of you argentina lost, how dare you cause riots like that
[14:52] <shadeslayer> what
[14:53] <shadeslayer> yay
[14:53]  * yofel recommends not using -i, dch will figure that out itself
[14:53] <sgclark> see I remember being told that ^
[14:53] <shadeslayer> I should henceforth be crowned grand chancellor of deutschland 
[14:53] <shadeslayer> someone tell Merkel that plz ^^
[14:53] <sgclark> and yet I still mess things up 
[14:54] <yofel> sgclark: if you used that your last changelog edits should not have been possible...
[14:54] <sgclark> guess that is why I am removed
[14:54] <shadeslayer> also, free tickets to all future futbol matches
[14:54] <yofel> dch should not edit the current changelog if it's not UNRELEASED
[14:54] <sgclark> yofel: my last chanelog edit were removed completely, not by me
[14:54] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: I think they spell it fütbol
[14:54] <shadeslayer> k , fütbol then
[14:54] <shadeslayer> my keyboard doesn't do funny accents
[14:55] <apachelogger> mine either
[14:55] <yofel> sgclark: ah, I meant when you edited old entries. That's for a different reason
[14:55] <shadeslayer> sue me
[14:55] <apachelogger> had to google it :S
[14:55] <shadeslayer> I am the grand chancellor of deutschland
[14:55] <yofel> the guys just decided to not keep the PPA history for the archive
[14:55] <yofel> if you do that all the changelog has on upload is a first entry with "initial upload" in it, that's all
[14:56] <sgclark> right and all of my work is gone. I am rather distrubed by this, but alas
[14:56] <shadeslayer> no it's not
[14:57] <shadeslayer> the history is all there in bzr for everyone to see
[14:57] <sgclark> anyway. that is why dch failed, I was aware of all of this changing
[14:57] <yofel> it's not gone... it's in bzr. And the first upload changelog is a single line, no matter how much work it was and how many people worked on it
[14:57] <shadeslayer> ^^
[14:57] <shadeslayer> for eg. Debian will sanitize changelogs too
[14:57] <shadeslayer> and remove all the ubuntu ones
[14:58] <apachelogger> ^ it's why those manually written 1980's changelogs are so very pointless
[14:58] <shadeslayer> sgclark: I'm trying to preserve the person who did the original package now
[14:58] <shadeslayer> though it's more work 
[14:59] <yofel> how is that work, just edit without using dch -r o.O?
[14:59] <sgclark> well it felt like a kick in the shins, I guess I am going to have to get used to it then. Now onto other matters..
[14:59] <sgclark> data packages need to return?
[15:00] <shadeslayer> yofel: I have to copy over original author since last author was Riddell
[15:00] <shadeslayer> so you still lose the original packager
[15:00] <yofel> ah
[15:00] <shadeslayer> in order to preserve that ... more work
[15:00] <apachelogger> write a scrypt
[15:00] <shadeslayer> so much work
[15:00] <apachelogger> scrüpt as the germans would say
[15:01] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: how so?
[15:01] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: how do you recommend finding original package creator
[15:01] <shadeslayer> waaa
[15:01] <yofel> very bottom of changelog o.O?
[15:01] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: last line of the file?
[15:02] <shadeslayer> usr/lib/*/libKF5XsltKde.a
[15:02] <shadeslayer> doesn't look good at all
[15:02] <apachelogger> It'S CamElCaSe aLL RiGHt
[15:02] <shadeslayer> :D
[15:03] <shadeslayer> yofel: apachelogger not necessarily, last line is sometimes also a carriagereturn :p
[15:04] <sgclark> can someone please confirm data packages need to be restored?
[15:05] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: ^^
[15:08] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: well, I dunno
[15:08] <apachelogger> make a poll on some poll site and poll
[15:08] <shadeslayer> wat
[15:08] <Riddell> gosh no
[15:08] <shadeslayer> I've already uploaded tier 2 with -data
[15:08] <shadeslayer> keep them I say
[15:08] <Riddell> yes I think -data packages are needed for libraries
[15:09] <apachelogger> as far as I am conerned the entire pile should be generated automagically from one single packaging branch
[15:09] <shadeslayer> there, it's decided
[15:09] <shadeslayer> :p
[15:09] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: cam
[15:09] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: can't be
[15:09] <apachelogger> sure it can
[15:09] <shadeslayer> tests and other shizzle need fancy setup
[15:09] <apachelogger> so you need different rules
[15:09] <yofel> apachelogger: scripts welcome
[15:09] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: lets work this out at randa
[15:09] <shadeslayer> automate all the things
[15:10] <apachelogger> you don't need 3000 manually maintained changelogs, nor 3000 compat files doing the same, nor 3000 control files doing the same nor 3000 source dirs doing same...
[15:10] <yofel> please do it in a way that debile will still consider sane ^^
[15:10] <yofel> erm... debian
[15:10] <shadeslayer> roger roger
[15:10] <apachelogger> it's why debian package is frowned upon, because there's so much pointless shit no one gives a rats ass about
[15:12] <shadeslayer> sigh
[15:12] <shadeslayer> there's no .so in kdocbook
[15:12] <shadeslayer> so we have to install libKF5XsltKde.a
[15:12] <apachelogger> wut?
[15:13] <shadeslayer> yeah, it's a static lib
[15:13] <apachelogger> wut?
[15:13] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: doctools you mean?
[15:13] <shadeslayer> yes
[15:13] <shadeslayer> src/CMakeLists.txt:add_library(KF5XsltKde STATIC xslt.cpp xslt_kde.cpp)
[15:14] <apachelogger> Oo
[15:14] <shadeslayer> ^083a5dc tier2/kdoctools/src/CMakeLists.txt (Jenkins CI            2013-12-18 00:45:18 +0000  24) add_library(KF5XsltKde STATIC xslt.cpp xslt_kde.cpp) > ofcourse
[15:14] <shadeslayer> thanks jenkins CI
[15:15] <apachelogger> why ever would that install a static lib
[15:15] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: file a bug or something
[15:15] <shadeslayer> if only we had sensible history
[15:15] <shadeslayer> right
[15:15] <apachelogger> that's le bad
[15:16] <apachelogger> it likely was made static for tests or something but installing a static lib is just rubbish
[15:17] <apachelogger> brrr
[15:17] <apachelogger> that even predates the repo
[15:17] <shadeslayer> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=337442
[15:18] <shadeslayer> kubotu: np
[15:18] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: http://quickgit.kde.org/?p=kdelibs.git&a=commit&h=a0400773e0d4dd5f9099934ecdd06f9783956c03
[15:18] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: tell apol he made that
[15:19] <shadeslayer> he be talking to d_ed , will let him know
[15:19] <Riddell> shadeslayer: kdbusaddons failed?
[15:19] <shadeslayer> whhhhhaaaaatttt
[15:23] <shadeslayer> Riddell: builds fine on my machine
[15:24] <Riddell> shadeslayer: builds fine on i386
[15:24] <shadeslayer> yay
[15:24] <Riddell> but not anything else
[15:24] <Riddell> is there something arch dependent?
[15:24] <shadeslayer> still fails when rebuilding
[15:24] <shadeslayer> not really
[15:24] <shadeslayer> it's failing when running tests
[15:25] <Riddell> nope, nothing arch dependent
[15:25] <shadeslayer>  1/2 Test #2: kdbusservicetest .................***Failed 0.01 sec
[15:25] <shadeslayer> ohoho
[15:26] <Riddell> does override_dh_auto_test: need an export for dbus-launch ?
[15:26] <shadeslayer> I'll have a look at it tomorrow
[15:46] <kubotu> feed branches-next had 13 updates, showing the latest 6
[16:00] <shadeslayer> Tier 2 all up
[16:00] <Riddell> awooga
[16:01] <sgclark> I reverted all of my data removals, I am sure I messed it up  somehow, I have to step away though to clear my head. I will see you all tomorrow.
[16:02] <Riddell> thanks a lot sgclark, sorry for the conflicting advises
[16:03] <Riddell> sgclark: hope you find something nice and relaxing to do now
[16:46] <kubotu> feed branches-next had 9 updates, showing the latest 6
[17:13] <Riddell> dpkg: error processing archive /var/cache/apt/archives/sddm_0.1.0~git20140624-0ubuntu1~ubuntu14.10~ppa1_i386.deb (--unpack): trying to overwrite '/etc/dbus-1/system.d/org.freedesktop.DisplayManager.conf', which is also in package lightdm 1.11.4-0ubuntu1
[17:13] <Riddell> shadeslayer: ↑ still an issue
[17:14] <lordievader> What is the support channel for Project Neon5? Is that #kubuntu or #project-neon?
[17:21] <Riddell> lordievader: either, I guess #project-neon is usually quiet though
[17:25] <lordievader> Check, I figured #kubuntu was only for 'stock' Kubuntu.
[17:26] <Riddell> lordievader: yes I think officially it is but no point being too fussy if there's nowhere better
[18:06] <Riddell> ...
[18:06]  * Riddell rolls drums
[18:06]  * Riddell rolls more drums
[18:06] <Riddell> Tier 2 accepted into the archive!
[18:07] <shadeslayer> yay
[20:01] <ochosi> hey ScottK 
[20:01] <ScottK> Hello ochosi 
[20:01] <ochosi> xubuntu project lead here, was following the discussion in -meeting
[20:01] <ScottK> OK.
[20:01] <ScottK> I didn't have anything specific in mind.
[20:01] <ochosi> so i thought i'd stop by about the "lessons learnt about trello"
[20:01] <ScottK> Just wanted to make sure you knew.
[20:01] <ochosi> yeah, we actually looked at your board when discussing whether to use trello
[20:02] <ScottK> FYI everyone, Xubuntu is using trello too.
[20:02] <ochosi> we also have a trellobot
[20:02] <ochosi> if that is of interest to you
[20:02] <ochosi> (for irc)
[20:07] <ScottK> apachelogger: trellobot?
[20:09] <DalekSec> It's been mentioned, the result was that since the trello gem/module is ruby, it'd be more useful to rewrite it for kubotu.
[20:16] <ochosi> right
[23:09] <apachelogger> insomnia, insomnia, oh my precious insomnia
[23:10] <apachelogger> ochosi: what's the trellobot do?
[23:12] <apachelogger> Riddell, shadeslayer: going to upload libkubuntu to utopic, does one of you want to handle the sru?
[23:12] <ochosi> apachelogger: for now it mostly reads trellocards
[23:13] <ochosi> feel free to ask Unit193 for more, he's maintaining it
[23:19] <apachelogger> why I am too shy for that (:
[23:22] <apachelogger> ScottK: what feature exactly are you looking for?
[23:23] <ScottK> It might be nice to see the trello changes in channel like the commits.
[23:23] <ScottK> It would save me the trouble of reading my mails.
[23:24] <apachelogger> :S
[23:24] <apachelogger> that hardly seems worth writing an rbot plugin for TBH
[23:25] <ScottK> It would certainly be easier for me if you did it.
[23:25] <ScottK> Besides, I figure for a Ruby god such as yourself, it's a 5 minute job.
[23:26] <DalekSec> apachelogger: ruby-trello
[23:27] <DalekSec> It supports webhooks.
[23:27] <apachelogger> flattery aint going to help there, because one would need to store stuff in the cache and the last time I tried to do things with the rbot cache some kittens died xD
[23:31]  * ScottK wonders if they were delicious?
[23:45] <apachelogger> ScottK: quite possibly