[00:43] <laze1989> https://bugs.launchpad.net/appmenu-qt5/+bug/1323853
[00:43] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1323853 in appmenu-qt5 "No menubar for QtQuick.Controls based applications" [Undecided,New]
[04:36] <pitti> Bonjour tout le monde !
[07:36] <willcooke> behold my magnificent cloak
[07:43] <laze1989> https://bugs.launchpad.net/appmenu-qt5/+bug/1323853
[07:43] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1323853 in appmenu-qt5 "No menubar for QtQuick.Controls based applications" [Undecided,New]
[07:47] <TheMuso> Hey willcooke, hope you're feeling better.
[07:48] <willcooke> hey TheMuso - worse if anything :)
[07:48] <TheMuso> willcooke: Thats no good.
[07:49] <willcooke> :)  It just a cough and a cold, but yeah - still feel "meh"
[07:49] <TheMuso> Either way, its annoying.
[07:49] <TheMuso> Anyway...
[07:49]  * TheMuso off for the evening.
[07:51] <willcooke> cya TheMuso
[08:03] <Laney> yoho
[08:04] <willcooke> lo
[08:04] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[08:04] <seb128> hey Laney
[08:04] <seb128> hey willcooke
[08:04] <willcooke> hello!
[08:04] <seb128> how is everyone today?
[08:04] <willcooke> tired, grumpy and feeling ill.
[08:04] <willcooke> you>?
[08:05] <seb128> urg
[08:05] <willcooke> :)
[08:06] <pitti> bonjoujr seb128
[08:06] <seb128> I'm good thanks, not fully awake yet though, I woke up early, read my emailed and worked for like an hour then fall like snoozing for another hour, which was good but made me a bit sleepy ;-)
[08:06] <pitti> hey willcooke
[08:06] <seb128> pitti, lut ! wb ! did you have good holidays?
[08:06] <willcooke> hi pitti
[08:06] <Laney> got to climb, so GREAT!
[08:06] <pitti> hey Laney
[08:06] <seb128> Laney, ;-)
[08:07] <pitti> seb128: I did, yes. the paragliding was again cancelled due to bad weather, but otherwise it was really relaxing
[08:07] <Laney> willcooke: seb128: good weekends?
[08:07] <Laney> hey pitti!
[08:07] <seb128> Laney, yes, weather is not so great but otherwise it was fun ;-)
[08:08] <seb128> you?
[08:08] <Laney> been to the poezenboot yet?
[08:08] <Laney> climbing and board games in the pub and cinema and climbing and cake baking
[08:09] <seb128> Laney, lol, no, but thanks for the suggestion ;-)
[08:09] <seb128> any good movie?
[08:09] <Laney> \o/
[08:09]  * seb128 meant to check was is playing atm but didn't yet
[08:09] <Laney> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_Help_the_Girl_(film)
[08:09] <Laney> it was quite cute
[08:10] <Laney> also I think desrt likes this band so maybe would be interested ;-)
[08:15] <seb128> nice
[08:19] <Laney> seb128: can you try running the gnome-desktop stuff please?
[08:19] <Laney> did you see my comments? it's buggy for me
[08:20] <seb128> Laney, let me look, I didn't but I don't think I receive emails for those projects
[08:20] <Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/unity-settings-daemon/xrandr/+merge/224548/comments/561618
[08:20] <seb128> Laney, is there a ppa or something or did you just try to build u-s-d and u-c-c?
[08:21] <Laney> I just merged the 3 branches
[08:21] <seb128> k
[08:22] <Laney> could build i386 debs if you want
[08:22] <seb128> I can do that, no worry
[08:22] <seb128> those projects are easy to build ;-)
[08:23] <Laney> k
[08:23] <Laney> enjoy the merge conflict of doom
[08:33] <darkxst> Laney, that makes sense (you are trying to run 2 instances of code), try running its against gnome3-staging ppa
[08:35] <darkxst> well atleast the first warnings, not sure about the missing dbus interface though
[08:37] <Laney> darkxst: 2 instances of what code?
[08:37] <darkxst> idlemonitor
[08:38] <Laney> wasn't renamed?
[08:40] <darkxst> Laney, yes functions were renamed
[08:41] <Laney> well lemme try building it against 3.10 then
[08:41] <Laney> I guess the type wasn't
[08:41] <Laney> what's the one about xsettings?
[08:48] <seb128> Sweetshark, hey
[08:49] <seb128> Sweetshark, have you seen https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1357700 ?
[08:49] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1357700 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "package libreoffice-base 1:4.3.0-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/libreoffice/program/libjdbclo.so', which is also in package libreoffice-base-drivers 1:4.3.0-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[08:49] <darkxst> Laney, could be caused by two copies of xrandr stuff running
[08:51] <seb128> Laney, there is also a "dpkg : erreur : --compare-versions prend trois paramètres : <version> <relation> <version>"
[08:52] <Laney> ?
[08:53] <Laney> hmm, there's a lightdm u-s-d being left around
[08:54] <Laney> kill that> no duplicate xsettings manager
[08:57] <Laney> darkxst: the GsdIdleMonitor type still exists in newer gnome-desktop, think we need to rename it in usd
[08:57] <Laney> and now there's the gnome_xkb_info_free_var_defs thingy, I remember there being a commit to fix that
[08:58] <Laney> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=b462e65
[09:01] <darkxst> Laney, I though I fixed that in u-s-d?
[09:01] <Laney> not in trunk apparently
[09:01] <Laney> did you do a merge for just this one?
[09:01] <darkxst> yes I did a MP just for xkb stuff
[09:01] <seb128> Laney, still need me to try it? from the backlog it seems you identified real code issues for robert_ancell to sort out (so it's going to be buggy for me as well)
[09:02] <Laney> darkxst: link?
[09:02] <Laney> seb128: it's ok
[09:02] <Laney> although fixing xsettings didn't get me a proper theme again
[09:03] <darkxst> Laney, looks like it was never merged https://code.launchpad.net/~darkxst/unity-settings-daemon/xkb/+merge/224919
[09:04] <darkxst> and ignore the last comment, ended up overriding branch
[09:04] <Laney> alright, thanks, I'll link it in a comment as it should go with this stuff
[09:04]  * Laney is trying with renamed GsdIdleMonitor
[09:05] <darkxst> yeh, robert was meant to merge that already!
[09:05] <Laney> the train makes it easy to forget to merge stuff sometimes
=== dgadomski_ is now known as dgadomski
[09:06] <Laney> ccache++
[09:09] <Laney> hmm still fails
[09:11] <seb128> robert_ancell doesn't know how to use the CI landing
[09:11] <seb128> so he doesn't
[09:11] <seb128> don't wait on him to land stuff in there
[09:12] <seb128> you could wait for a long time
[09:12] <Laney> haha
[09:12] <Laney> that would explain it ...
[09:14] <darkxst> Laney, there is no GsdIdleMonitor in gnome-desktop
[09:14] <darkxst> it was already renamed, I guess
[09:15] <darkxst> Laney, do you get any more info setting G_MESSAGES_DEBUG?
[09:16] <darkxst> ^=all
[09:23] <Laney> darkxst: no
[09:25] <darkxst> Laney, I suppose you are ending up with no running u-s-d
[09:26] <Laney> it does run
[09:26] <Laney> but I'm not sure how functional it is
[09:26] <Laney> no media keys, no theme
[09:26] <darkxst> but then does it die?
[09:26] <Laney> nein
[09:27] <darkxst> Laney, you would probably loose your mouse cursor, if the u-s-d is running, but idle monitor is messed up
[09:28] <Laney> I do have that
[09:29] <darkxst> and then there is the missing dbus interface which is also provided by u-s-d
[09:30] <laze1989> When using QtQuick Controls with ApplicationWindow -> MenuBar the menubar is not drawn in Ubuntu. This is due to some limits on appmenu-qt5 (https://bugs.launchpad.net/appmenu-qt5/+bug/1323853). I wanted to start with Qt (5.2.1) and build an UI using QML. Does anyone know how to workaround this circumstance (e.g., get Ubuntu Global Menu) and use QML?
[09:30] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1323853 in appmenu-qt5 "No menubar for QtQuick.Controls based applications" [Undecided,New]
[09:30] <seb128> laze1989, hey, why do you keep repeating that url? we saw it the first time
[09:31] <seb128> not sure about a workaround
[09:31] <seb128> Mirv, sil2100: ^ do you know?
[09:32] <laze1989> Checked out appmenu-qt5. It just looks for QMenuBar but QML seems to use something different. But fixing this seems to be beyond my current knowledge.
[09:33] <Mirv> seb128: no known workaround, probably a valid bug and appmenu-qt5 would need to support Quick Controls' menu bar too
[09:34] <sil2100> hmmm
[09:34] <seb128> Mirv, do you know who would be there right person to work on that?
[09:34] <seb128> is that sil2100? ;-)
[09:34] <sil2100> That would normally be me ;)
[09:34] <Mirv> seb128: yes, but anyone can of course volunteer :)
[09:34] <sil2100> I would love to work on that, just need to find some spare cycles
[09:35] <seb128> sil2100, can you triage the bug at least?
[09:35] <sil2100> seb128: sure, let me take a look at it
[09:36] <seb128> thanks
[09:36] <darkxst> Laney, can you push you builds to a ppa, I will try and take a look after dinner
[09:36] <Laney> darkxst: kay, I commented again btw
[09:36] <Laney> just summarising what we just did
[09:39] <darkxst> Laney, did you restart u-s-d after killing the lightdm one?
[09:41] <Laney> yep
[10:08] <Laney> darkxst: ppa:laney/experimental should get them soon
[10:11] <darkxst> Laney, ok
[10:12] <darkxst> btw why do you dislike giraffe's! are you short ?
[10:13] <Laney> they see too much
[10:19] <darkxst> gah, apt-add-repository doesnt like your ppa
[10:20] <darkxst> has to manually add sources and gpg key
[10:20] <Laney> are you a giraffe?
[10:20] <darkxst> correction: apt-add-repository does not like any ppa's
[10:21] <Laney> it's a new feature to keep them away
[10:21] <darkxst> Laney, 6'4, maybe as tall as a baby giraffe!
[10:21] <Laney> hah
[10:22] <qengho> bonjour, seb128. chromium-browser from trusty works, if you need a workaround. I expect to have it fixed today.
[10:22] <seb128> qengho, thanks, I downgraded but now it's give me "your profile can't be used because it's from a newer chromium version" errors
[10:23] <seb128> well, that downgrading to previous utopic version
[10:23] <seb128> not trusty
[10:23] <qengho> seb128: the version in T is the same version. It won't do that.
[10:23] <seb128> I'm going to wait for today's update to have the fix
[10:23] <qengho> Okay.
[10:23] <seb128> thanks
[10:43] <darkxst> charles, are you planning to look at indicator-power port for upower 0.99?
[10:44] <darkxst> charles, I took I quick glimpes at the code, the resuming signal needs to use PrepareForSleep (False)
[10:44] <darkxst> from logind
[10:44] <darkxst> device-changed signals need to become notify signals
[10:45] <darkxst> I would probably suggest dropping dbus calls, and just use the upower api directly
[10:46] <darkxst> I suspect you can drop you queue changed signals stuff now
[10:47] <Laney> device-added and device-removed still exist
[10:48] <darkxst> Laney, device-changed is gone
[10:48] <Laney> yep
[10:48] <darkxst> device-remove has changed sig
[10:48] <darkxst> indicator-power queues all the device-changed signals to process them "soon"
[11:03] <Sweetshark> seb128: yeah, saw that one. Some libs sneaked from libreoffice-base-drivers to libreoffice-base. will fix that ASAP.
[11:03] <seb128> Sweetshark, good morning
[11:03] <Sweetshark> seb128: ;)
[11:03] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
[11:03] <seb128> Sweetshark, did you see the postinst syntax error as well?
[11:04] <Sweetshark> seb128: yes, that one should be fixed with the latest upload (-3ubuntu1). Did you see a report against -3ubuntu1?
[11:05] <seb128> Sweetshark, I was updating my utopic laptop this morning, so yes? or is it running the script from the previous version once on upgrade?
[11:05] <Sweetshark> seb128: so the postinst syntax error should never have gone out of -proposed.
[11:05] <Sweetshark> seb128: ah, yeah. it is the postrm from the one you had from before.
[11:07] <Sweetshark> seb128: which is why it would have been a pain if that one would have been widely deployed as it only hits when you move _away_ from the broken package.
[11:07] <seb128> Sweetshark, well, I don't have proposed enabled, so I only followed versions on utopic
[11:08] <Sweetshark> seb128: hmm ...
[11:10] <seb128> Sweetshark, I had 1:4.2.4-0ubuntu4
[11:11] <seb128> well, according to the dpkg log
[11:11] <Sweetshark> seb128: so, lets detangle this mess. We had the _postrm_ fail (bug 1354557). You are seeing a _postinst_ issue though, not a _postrm_ one. On which package exactly and updating which version to which version?
[11:11] <ubot5> bug 1354557 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[ppa][packaging]libreoffice-base post-rm script syntax fail" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1354557
[11:13] <Sweetshark> seb128: FWIW, libreoffice-base.preinst in 1:4.3.0-3ubuntu1 doesnt look faulty syntaxwise on first glance.
[11:14] <Sweetshark> anyway ...
[11:15] <seb128> Sweetshark, on current utopic
[11:15] <seb128> libreoffice-base.postrm:if [ "$1" = abort-upgrade ] && dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt 1:4.3.0~beta1-1; then
[11:15] <seb128> that seems buggy
[11:15] <seb128> no?
[11:15] <seb128> "dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt 1:4.3.0~beta1-1"
[11:16] <seb128> or do you compare version with the output of another dpkg --compare-versions in a weird way?
[11:17] <Sweetshark> seb128: arrgh. no. thats "git merge" running amok, I guess.
[11:18] <Sweetshark> seb128: however, if you just updated to that, you should have run the postrm yet. That pleasure should happen only once you update/remove that pkgs, no?
[11:21] <seb128> Sweetshark, if the previous version doesn't have the same bug
[11:21] <seb128> or the upgrade would have run the script from the previous version and displayed the warning
[11:22] <seb128> well, anyway I don't think that made the upgrade buggy, the file conflict did
[11:22] <darkxst> Laney, xsettings error seems due to u-s-d not shutting down cleanly
[11:23] <Laney> darkxst: right, that's why it goes away when killed
[11:23] <Sweetshark> seb128: hohum, if that is a merge error it isnt mine :/ -- this is on debian too
[11:24] <darkxst> probably also why you were getting lightdm owned u-s-d in your session
[11:24] <seb128> Sweetshark, still worth fixing I guess ;-)
[11:25] <Sweetshark> seb128: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commitdiff;h=d4e4101a7ca952fdf3b30df7524afb5435c90bde;hp=d0c14b827d15da3e92eb061146223155134a4f47
[11:26] <Sweetshark> seb128: yeah sure. ;_
[11:26] <seb128> thanks
[11:27] <Sweetshark> seb128: I just feel better about my day, if I only missed it in review and at least didnt mess that up myself. ;)
[11:28] <seb128> yeah, makes sense ;-)
[11:28] <seb128> ok, on that note, time for lunch
[11:28] <seb128> bbiab
[11:28] <Sweetshark> seb128: have fun!
[11:28] <seb128> thanks
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch
[11:39] <darkxst> Laney, and u-s-d has no debug symbols ;( guess I will rebuild
[11:39] <Laney> darkxst: you should install pkgbinarymangler in your build env
[11:39] <Laney> then you get ddeb package
[11:39] <Laney> s
[11:40]  * darkxst was using your ppa 
[11:40] <Laney> :(
[11:40] <darkxst> I do get ddebs when I build locally ;)
[11:42]  * darkxst sometimes forgets that its really only the gnome3-team ppa that has ddebs
[11:44] <Laney> it's a special per-ppa option
[11:45]  * Laney tries new dbus
[11:45] <darkxst> Laney, and probably the only ppa with a retracer ;) thats a super-fu special byo option ;)
[11:46] <Laney> you guys got the powerz
[11:49]  * happyaron builds the new ibus
[11:51] <Laney> late night happyaron
[11:51] <happyaron> Laney: 19:52 beijing time
[11:52] <happyaron> will be off after building it, :)
[11:52] <Laney> happyaron: yeah I'll be gone by then :P
=== alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g
[12:25] <darkxst> Laney, idle monitor looks like a namespace clash but I am not seeing it in the code ;(
[12:49] <desrt> Laney: nice.  will have to check it out.
[12:50] <willcooke> attente_, hey - had to push our 1:1 back because of a clash this week, hope that's ok, let me know if not and I will move it again
[12:50] <willcooke> hey desrt!  Welcome back
[12:51] <desrt> thanks :)
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
[12:51] <willcooke> Nice break?
[12:51] <desrt> yes.  quite relaxed.
[12:51] <willcooke> ha, all change now, eh?
[12:51] <desrt> my giant inbox says: "yes"
[12:51] <willcooke> :D
[12:51] <desrt> i'll smile in three days after i'm out from under it :p
[12:52] <willcooke> lol
[12:54] <attente_> willcooke, sure
[13:05] <dgadomski> hello everyone
[13:06] <dgadomski> I could really use the desktop team expertise with creating a workaround for precise
[13:06] <seb128> hey dgadomski
[13:06] <dgadomski> hi seb128
[13:06] <seb128> sure, just ask your question ;-)
[13:06] <dgadomski> the main issue is in glibc: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/+bug/1214352
[13:06] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1214352 in LibreOffice Productivity Suite "GUINT32/64_SWAP_LE_BE macros do not enclose val argument in parentheses" [Critical,Confirmed]
[13:06] <seb128> oh, that one, tricky one
[13:07] <dgadomski> so we suffer from a bug that renders in libreoffice and is caused by this error being propagated to gvfs
[13:07] <dgadomski> I would like to keep the scope of the fix as small as possible
[13:08] <dgadomski> ideally replacing those macros with correct ones in gvfs should solve the problem
[13:08] <dgadomski> I wanted to create an additional header file fixing those macros and including it after glib headers in gvfs
[13:09] <dgadomski> that way we could release a patched version of gvfs as a workaround
[13:09] <dgadomski> I would appreciate your opinion on this idea, do you see any threats of this approach?
[13:14] <seb128> desrt, hey, wb, do you have an opinion on ^
[13:15] <seb128> dgadomski, we discussed it with Sweetshark before, and we saw it as risky to change gvfs, since that's a service and interact with other components, it could be that using different macro on the "clients" and the service could make some client which currently work start misbehaving
[13:20] <dgadomski> I was worried it may prove risky
[13:21] <dgadomski> then I think we need to convince the customer that there is not much we can do about it
[13:24] <seb128> dgadomski, I think Sweetshark suggested maintaining a ppa/special build if they really wanted a version with the change, knowing it might have side effects/create other issues
[13:26] <dgadomski> that's a good idea seb128, I will think about providing a workaround via ppa and ask the customer to give it a try in a test system
[13:26] <seb128> dgadomski, thanks
[13:27] <dgadomski> thanks seb128
[13:27] <seb128> yw!
[13:31] <desrt> ouch.
[13:35] <desrt> seb128: in terms of managing SRUs i don't have much opinion here, i guess
[13:35] <desrt> but i doubt that this would be a 'negative' change for someone...
[13:37] <seb128> desrt, could there be any issue if we rebuild gvfs with fixed macros but not other components? e.g could we end up with 2 components trying to communicate in an incompatible way?
[13:37] <desrt> seb128: it's pretty rare that we would use a specific (ie: nonhost) endianness for communication on the local machine
[13:38] <desrt> pretty much never on API
[13:59] <Laney> wb desrt
[14:00] <desrt> Laney: thanks :D
[14:00] <desrt> Laney: ready for your skip across the pond?
[14:00] <Laney> I checked that my esta is still valid
[14:01] <Laney> yeah totally ready!
[14:02] <desrt> the US is a fairly unfortunate place to hold conferences :(
[14:02] <Laney> last year in Switzerland a few people were saying they wouldn't go
[14:03] <desrt> s/wouldn't/can't/ in some cases due to ESTA stupidity
[14:03] <Laney> it'll be fun, and I get to go on a turboprop plane which is exciting
[14:03] <Laney> ya
[14:03] <desrt> or just straight-out no-explanation visa-rejection if you're not even on the ESTA list
[14:03] <desrt> never done turboprop before?
[14:03] <Laney> nop
[14:03] <desrt> random!
=== Estilanda_ is now known as Estilanda
=== BigW is now known as BigWhale
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
[14:18] <charles> darkxst, yes it'll probably be me to do the indicator-power refresh
[14:19] <charles> darkxst, time is the main constraining factor right now, I have a very full TODO list
[14:19] <charles> darkxst, but I want to go back into indicator-power not just to update to the new version of upower, but also to re-enable the brightness slider and make the brightness slider's DBus calls nonblocking
[14:19] <darkxst> charles, time is the problem, FF is very close
[14:20] <darkxst> charles, brightness api has changed in gnome-desktop 3.10+
[14:21] <charles> ya...
[14:24] <darkxst> charles, and we are still waiting on a gnome-desktop transition from last cycle.... :(
[14:25] <darkxst> (in addition to upower)
[14:32]  * charles waves "good morning" at alesage
[14:35]  * Sweetshark needs to torture someone for autotools sins!
[14:37] <Sweetshark> ^^ volunteers?
[14:44] <willcooke> Sweetshark, anything I can help with?
[14:44]  * alesage waves back at charles
[14:45]  * alesage resumes coffee
[14:55] <Sweetshark> willcooke: nah, nothing really. autotools itself is guilty of being a pain as usual. :/
[15:00] <Sweetshark> seb128: btw http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commit;h=c2846add79b0d73a3049abb2aa3210fd40e3dd4a and will go to Debian too, just like http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commit;h=209627561277d1cf3bfed676f617e712be41e011 ...
[15:02] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
=== m_conley_away is now known as m_conley
[16:43] <Sweetshark> seb128: please review and sponsor http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/utopic/libixion_0.7.0-2ubuntu1_source.changes
[16:43] <seb128> Sweetshark, k
[16:45] <Sweetshark> seb128: thx
[16:45] <seb128> yw!
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|EOD
[17:56] <seb128> Laney, saw bug #1344386?
[17:56] <ubot5> bug 1344386 in gnome-do (Ubuntu) "Do.exe crashed with SIGABRT in __GI_raise()" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1344386
[17:56] <seb128> desrt, ^
[17:56] <desrt> Do.exe, hm?
[17:56] <seb128> glib update seems to make mono buggy from what barry wrote there
[17:57] <desrt> could be the gobject interface restriction stuff?
[17:58] <desrt> huh.  inside gtk_main()... not likely.
[17:58] <desrt> any way to get a retrace done on that?
[17:59] <seb128> desrt, not from this bug, asked on #ubuntu-devel to barry if he can get a bt
[18:00] <desrt> thanks
[18:00] <seb128> yw!
[18:00] <seb128> thanks for looking at it ;-)
[18:02] <desrt> i'm sure this is going to be fun
[18:02] <desrt> mono program triggers abort inside of glib while initialising gtk 2...
=== m_conley is now known as m_conley_away
[21:53] <sarnold> Trevinho|holiday: holiday!? something to greet you when you return: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1358504
[21:53] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1358504 in unity (Ubuntu) "Screensaver leaks password key-presses through to applications" [Undecided,New]
=== m_conley_away is now known as m_conley
=== RAOF_ is now known as RAOF