[03:27] <nvrpunk> anyone had any luck with evolution-ews?  I seem to hang after adding my office365 mailbox
[04:35] <nvrpunk>  /join #ubuntu-devel
[07:48] <lordievader> Good morning.
[12:48] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[14:10] <miyako> hi everyone! apologies for my lack of google-fu / general ubuntu development process knowlege; I was wondering if anyone could give me a general idea if running the current pre-release is essentially equivalent to running Debian Sid, and can I just up date my /etc/apt/sources.list to those repos and upgrade, or is there a significant expectation of breakage without doing a clean install?
[14:10] <penguin42> you'd need to do a clean
[14:11] <miyako> ah, okay, I thought there was a good chance that was true but I hoped it wouldn't be :)
[14:11] <penguin42> miyako: I'm not exactly sure the point at which +1 split but it does fork at a point from debian, and then it's inconsistent with that; there are also a range of ubuntu specific patches on packages and some packages that are more recent in ubuntu than debian
[14:12] <miyako> penguin42: oh, sorry, I am currently running ubuntu 14.04, I just meant can I track +1 instead of stable in ubuntu as I would be able to do tracking sid instead of wheezy in debian
[14:13] <penguin42> oh, yeh, if you want to switch from 14.04 to 14.10 run do-release-upgrade -d
[14:13] <ikonia> I'd advise against that
[14:13] <ikonia> as it WILL break
[14:13] <penguin42> miyako: It'll update your sources and also has some fixes in occasionally for other screwups
[14:14] <miyako> ikonia: is that "it will break" on the same scale as running Sid / Rawhide / Arch / etc. or "it will break" as in "we, the developers, are actively creating a system with known breakages in preperation for the next release"?
[14:14] <ikonia> miyako: no as in it will break, refuse to boot and you'll need to re-install
[14:14] <miyako> ikonia: ah, okay
[14:15] <miyako> I'm getting the feeling that if what I want is Sid I might be better off to just install Sid and be done with it, honestly it's just that I got all of my power management and SSD stuff tuned on this laptop and I didnt' want to do a clean install of anything and have to do that work again if I could help it
[14:16] <ikonia> miyako: if you want something that works like sid - install sid
[14:17] <miyako> I really wasn't sure how similar the ubuntu development model was, I have had ubuntu on this laptop for a while because, laptop, and ubuntu seemed, at least a couple of years ago, to work with less fuss on a laptop than anything else
[14:17] <miyako> but I'm really more familiar with debian anyway
[14:17] <miyako> and I'm not sure I want to wait for 14.10 to be able to have the new Qt stuff since until then I'll be stuck developing on Windows
[14:18]  * penguin42 would still upgrade to 14.10 - if you know how to wrangle Debian problems you should be fine
[14:18] <penguin42> it's working fine here
[14:19] <miyako> I suppose if I assume I need to re-install, do my backing up and creating new install media first, then if I try the upgrade the worst-case scenario is I just clean install Sid as planned
[14:20] <miyako> life would be much easier if Qtcreator didnt' segfault when running under virtualbox =\
[14:21] <penguin42> that's pretty unusual
[14:22] <miyako> penguin42: I've done a lot of research into this the last few days, apparently it has to do with a specific interaction between the OpenGL rendering extensions that are being used for previewing accellerated qtquick UI widgets and the virtualbox 3D accellerated video drivers
[14:22] <penguin42> ah ok, that does make sense
[14:23] <miyako> since I'm doing game development just turning off OpenGL isn't really an option or I'd just do that
[14:24] <miyako> but as it stands right now the only dev environment I have that's actually working properly is my Windows 8 machine, and having to use windows for programming should be a violation of the geneva convention
[14:25] <penguin42> yeh, that's a bit grim
[17:34] <knitt1> I'm unable to boot with nvidia drivers under utopic
[17:34] <knitt1> i tried to install with software & updates
[17:35] <knitt1> (ubuntu gnome)
[17:35] <knitt1> nouveau forces my system to reboot unfortunately
[17:36] <knitt1> which was already happening under older versions of ubuntu as well
[17:37] <BluesKaj> knitt1, it;s the new kernel module that doesn't support nvidia , you obviously upgraded your kernel , it's not the desktop at fault. I have the dame problem and run KDE
[17:37] <BluesKaj> same
[17:38] <knitt1> BluesKaj: oh. I see. so I have two options: downgrade kernel or wait for an nvidia update?
[17:39] <BluesKaj> knitt1, what do you mean nouveau forces reboot , is the system crashing ?
[17:40] <knitt1> BluesKaj: screen freezes, and after a few seconds screen goes black and I'm at the POST screen of bios
[17:40] <BluesKaj> knitt1, or run with the older kernel , it works, I tried it
[17:41] <BluesKaj>  try 3.16.0-10 in grub knitt1
[17:41] <knitt1> BluesKaj: ok, I will try later
[17:42] <knitt1> so much stuff to re-install in a new system :)
[17:42] <knitt1> and also finally switched from x86 to amd64
[17:44] <BluesKaj> clean install to 64biit
[17:44] <BluesKaj> ?
[17:44] <knitt1> yes
[17:45] <knitt1> it was time
[17:45] <knitt1> I think x86 gets tested less and less :]
[17:45] <BluesKaj> most apps are 64 now, just a few 32 bit die hards still around
[17:48] <knitt1> I think nouveau is overwriting some memory it's not supposed to write to
[17:49] <knitt1> my VRAM is pretty limited, maybe that's a problem
[17:53] <BluesKaj> my nvidia card is entry level 8400gs  with 256mb memory and it wasn't a problem before the kernel upgrade , don't see how that should change if nouveau works almost as well as the 331 driver
[17:54] <knitt1> BluesKaj: well, it doesn't with my card. I had these problems with 14.04 too (and I think even with debian jessie)
[17:54] <knitt1> mine has 128M dedicated (displays as 256M in nvidia-settings)
[17:54] <knitt1> VRAM is almost always used 95% with nvidia proprietary drivers if I have a few firefox windows open
[17:54] <knitt1> and I'm only using a single monitor to keep VRAM usage low
[17:56] <penguin42> that should be fine
[17:57] <knitt1> 95% is fine?
[17:58] <BluesKaj> hey penguin42 , would you know if the nvidia recommended driver bug has been fixed ? I haven't seen any nvidia upgrades yet
[17:59] <knitt1> but crashen happen mainly when browsing images on the webz with firefox
[18:00] <BluesKaj> knitt1, could be a flash problem
[18:01] <knitt1> there's no flash most of the time
[18:02] <knitt1> sometimes I can trigger a reboot by going to the activities view of gnome-shell
[18:03] <penguin42> BluesKaj: I don't, I mostly run Radeon
[18:04] <BluesKaj> penguin42, ok
[18:04] <knitt1> or maybe my gpu gets too hot with nouveau?
[18:05] <knitt1> hm. 63 °C isn't too bad
[18:06] <knitt1> but my mouse is really really sluggisw …
[18:06] <knitt1> * sluggish right now
[18:21] <knitt1> hmmm. 3.16.0-10 with nvidia-304-updates boots with gallium llvmpipe and low resolution :( will try to install nvidia-331-updates and reboot
[18:21] <knitt1> suggested package nvidia-...-uvm – should I install it?
[18:23] <knitt1> but damn that last boot was fast :]
[18:26] <knitt1> meh. still nouveau :(
[18:26] <knitt1> do I still need to create an xorg.conf file?
[18:27] <knitt1> Xorg.0.log says: Failed to load module "nvidia" (module does not exist, 0)
[18:27] <knitt1> am I missing something?
[18:28] <elfy> knitt1: I've just updated and upgraded in recovery mode - reinstalled nvidia and am booted with the newest kernel and nvidia
[18:28] <elfy> fixed package ubuntu-drivers-common - version 0.2.98.1
[18:29] <knitt1> elfy: so a system upgrade should fix it for me?
[18:29] <elfy> possibly - I reinstalled the nvidia driver too
[18:29] <knitt1> which version exactly? and with CLI or with the software & updates gui?
[18:30] <elfy> version of what?
[18:30] <knitt1> nvidia driver
[18:30] <elfy> and I did it in recovery mode
[18:30] <elfy> well I use -331-updates - no idea what you use :)
[18:31] <knitt1> I tried several today, none worked :D
[18:31] <elfy> well they'd not have done ;)
[18:32] <knitt1> elfy: I don't have any updates to install :(
[18:32] <elfy> dpkg -l ubuntu-drivers-common
[18:34] <knitt1> maybe my ubuntu mirror lags behind
[18:34] <knitt1> ubuntu-drivers 1:0.2.98
[18:35] <elfy> knitt1: that's the current one - good
[18:35] <elfy> what nvidia card do you have
[18:36] <knitt1> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation G86GLM [Quadro FX 360M] (rev a1)
[18:37] <elfy> try nvidia-331-updates
[18:38] <knitt1> that's what I have installed right now
[18:38] <elfy> ok - and have you apt-get install --reinstall'd it?
[18:38] <knitt1> will try to reinstall: apt-get install --reinstall nvidia-331-updates
[18:38] <knitt1> I freshly installed it before the last reboot
[18:39] <knitt1> do I need the *-uvm package?
[18:42] <elfy> if it's saying it wants it
[18:42] <knitt1> ok, output of apt-get looks fine. dkms modules built for both kernel versions
[18:42] <elfy> right
[18:42] <knitt1> it's only in the "suggested packages" list
[18:42] <knitt1> "… contains unfied memory kernel module". hmm.
[18:43] <elfy> not installed here
[18:43] <knitt1> hm. switched mirrors to main server, and now I have an update for ubuntu-drivers-common
[18:44] <knitt1> let's update and then reinstall nvidia once gain
[18:44] <knitt1> * again
[18:44] <elfy> oops - fed you a bum steer there - read the 1 at the beginning at the end
[18:45] <elfy> ii  ubuntu-drivers 1:0.2.98.1 <- here
[18:45] <knitt1> yup, have updated it now
[18:45] <knitt1> my local mirror lags behind
[18:45] <knitt1> will use the main server for further dev release testing :]
[18:45] <elfy> I'm in the uk - I use the main server
[18:48] <knitt1> will try reboot in a few minutes
[18:58] <knitt1> elfy: I must be doing something wrong. my Xorg.0.log still contains the line "Failed to load module "nvidia{" (module does not exist)"
[19:00] <elfy> mmm - not sure then
[19:00] <knitt1> will try older kernel once again
[19:00] <knitt1> also installing the -uvm package, maybe that helps
[19:01] <elfy> I'd just let it install what it wants to - I don't know what *buntu you're using either
[19:01] <knitt1> ubuntu gnome 14.10 fresh install from beta 1 live cd
[19:01] <knitt1> + updates
[19:02] <elfy> http://pastebin.com/bH4vHmF5
[19:02] <elfy> that's what versions I've got nvidia working with
[19:04] <knitt1> http://pastebin.com/wejbPXwx mine looks identical
[19:04] <elfy> yep
[19:07] <elfy> knitt1: really no idea what's going on, if you've done the same as me, updated/reinstalled it
[19:07] <elfy> sorry
[19:07] <knitt1> no problem. thanks for your help :)
[19:55] <knitt1> elfy: are you using upstart or systemd?
[19:55] <elfy> upstart at the moment
[19:56] <elfy> if you're using systemd - I have during this cycle had issues with upgrades to nvidia when using that - had to boot upstart to complete the job iirc
[19:56] <knitt1> ok. just booted with the -10 kernel again, still nouveau :(
[19:56] <knitt1> I'm on upstart too
[19:57] <knitt1> Xorg.0.log still says "module does not exist". weird
[19:57] <elfy> yea
[19:57] <elfy> did you purge nvidia at anytime?
[19:59] <elfy> perhaps - purge nvidia and autoremove the ones left
[19:59] <knitt1> not that I remember
[19:59] <elfy> then boot the -11 kernel and then reinstall nvidia
[19:59] <knitt1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-drivers-common/+bug/1363675 same error in log, reported 1 day ago
[20:00] <elfy> I might well have purged nvidia amongst all the things I did over the weekend
[20:00] <knitt1> but I have that update already
[20:00] <knitt1> ok, I will do an apt-get purge nvidia-*
[20:01] <knitt1> and then after my next forced reboot I will reinstall 331-updates
[20:01] <knitt1> or maybe I'll try another version
[20:02] <elfy> knitt1: afaik it's -331, -current (which is -304 I believe) and -34something with xorg-edgers ppa
[20:03] <knitt1> I also have -173, -310 and -319 in my apt-get autocompletion list
[20:04] <elfy> 173 is legacy, not sure about the other 2
[20:06] <knitt1> maybe I have more luck with the legacy drivers
[20:06] <knitt1> after all my laptop is 6 years old
[20:07] <elfy> perhaps - but the driver list lists yours :)
[20:08] <elfy> I don't think you're the only one that's still having issues - someone on forum is still not booting properly
[20:09] <knitt1> at least I'm booting :)
[20:09] <knitt1> constantly :D
[20:10] <BluesKaj> knitt1, so is my desktop 6 yrs old , it seems the nvidia kernel module is being prevented from usage even tho it appears to be installed with 'glxinfo | grep openGL' , but 'lspci -knn | egrep -A 3 'VGA|3D' shows the nouveau driver as in use]
[20:11] <knitt1> from xorg log I assume that the kernel module is either missing or cannot be found
[20:12] <knitt1> I have purged all nvidia* now
[20:12] <penguin42> BluesKaj: Has nvidia dropped support for your 6 year old card?
[20:12] <BluesKaj> knitt1, that shouldn't be necessary
[20:13] <knitt1> I'll wait for a few more days
[20:13] <BluesKaj> thecard isn;t 6 yrs old , but the pc is
[20:13] <elfy> BluesKaj: possibly not - but I was just going through what I'd done to get it working here :)
[20:14] <BluesKaj> think the nvidia kernel module is disabled
[20:15] <elfy> anyway - I'[ve gtg now - good luck knitt1 - I'll leave you to have fun :)
[20:48] <Zer000> so I'm on 14.10 and I did a partial distribution upgrade and lightdm won't start and I have to run startx manually. It's complaining about a missing unit file http://dpaste.com/2AE8NBX could someone help?
[20:49] <penguin42> why did you do a partial dist upgrade?
[20:49] <Zer000> penguin42, it asked me
[20:49] <Zer000> the automatic update thing I mean
[20:51] <penguin42> looks like some systemd stuff; my 14.10 upgrade box (that was upgraded very early) doesn't seem to be using systemd yet
[20:52] <Zer000> penguin42, could you please check if you have a directory /etc/systemd/user and if anything's in it?
[20:52] <penguin42> I have it, but there's nothing in it
[20:52] <usr13> I've never heard of a "partial dist upgrade"  Is that something that really exists?
[20:53] <usr13> ... or what is it ....?
[20:54] <Zer000> penguin42, ok
[20:54] <penguin42> Zer000: there seem to be a couple of bugs about that error message but they both seem to suggest it's a harmless error
[20:54] <penguin42> (note I'm running kubuntu not ubuntu, but it does have the systemd-logind stuff)
[20:59] <Zer000> usr13, well you know how the GUI prompts you to update packages? Once in a while it asks if I want to do a partial dist upgrade or "continue". This happened before and it just upgraded lots of packages (btw I was still on 14.10 it wasn't an actual upgrade). So I ran it again today and it just broke some stuff :(
[21:00] <penguin42> Zer000: What happens if you do an apt-get dist-upgrade ?
[21:00] <penguin42> Zer000: I wonder if it's some packages being held back for some reason
[21:00] <penguin42> but that shouldn't break anything
[21:01] <Zer000> penguin42, nothing. everything's up to date.
[21:02] <penguin42> Zer000: I'd have a dig about in /var/log/lightdm
[21:03] <darkangel> Hello is this a place to contact Ubuntu team at to discuss features that 1 is working on and such?
[21:04] <usr13> darkangel: Why don't you just ask a question and see if you get a response.
[21:18] <Zer000> penguin42, so lightdm was just crashing (segfaulting?) so I replaced it with xdm. It's fugly but it works!
[21:37] <penguin42> Zer000: Oh that shouldn't happen!