/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/09/04/#xubuntu-devel.txt

Unit193So, the saucy docs branch seems to still be getting translations...00:01
ali1234dbl_click_time seems unused00:06
ali1234it isn't in here http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfwm4/tree/defaults/defaults00:08
ali1234xfce bug 633400:17
ubottuxfce bug 6334 in General "[xfce]Double click title bar actions use different speed than text selection" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=633400:17
ali1234http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfwm4/commit/?id=7d94a9c54ec7cf17b063484846250c7a9786685300:19
ali1234also http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfwm4/log/?qt=grep&q=633400:19
ali1234bluesabre: ^00:20
ali1234"dbl_click_time" no longer appears in xfwm4 source00:20
ali1234it's coming from the xubuntu defaults00:21
bluesabregot it, thanks ali1234... I'll drop that key from our settings00:23
Unit193knome: Should I renew for xubuntu-docs?05:24
=== ochosi_ is now known as ochosi
elfyanother day another breakage - lightdm this time 06:26
Unit193Uh oh, better not restart then. :/06:46
Unit193    - Rework logind code that gets session ID. The previous method was racy06:49
Unit193      and a change in lightdm 1.11.7 led to a lockup when this race occurred.06:49
Unit193      (LP: #1364725)06:49
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1364725 in lightdm (Ubuntu Trusty) "logind session ID not used due to race condition" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/136472506:49
Unit193elfy: Better now?06:53
elfyochosi bluesabre - you been fiddling with desktop settings again? 06:53
Unit193"Reduce number of workspaces to 1"?06:53
elfyone workspace and try setting seperate wallpaper when you've got desktops back to a sane default06:54
elfymaking sure that you set it so you want different wallpaper - and then try and move the dialogue to the next desktop06:54
Unit193Bleh, the "wrap desktops" thing, that one hit me (other one didn't, alerady had messed with the number.)06:55
* Unit193 goes to fix.06:55
Unit193Hrm.06:56
elfyso if you're going to set desktops to 1 - something needs to be done so people can easily reset that and the wrap so other things work as expected06:57
Unit193Yep, found it.06:58
elfyif random decisions are just going to be made in here by two people then I'm in the wrong place06:58
Unit193Mmm, it is getting tedious.06:59
elfywell I've certainly had enough of it all 06:59
elfyfeels like it's 'have some discussions in *other* channel' have a quick chat in here and jfdi07:01
elfyUnit193: and no - not better - in the other install - everything but lightdm updated and nvidia reinstalled now it's got a working kernel/nvidia pair :) 07:03
Unit193Hrm, OK.  I just got a lightdm update that looked like it might do it.07:03
elfywasn't a replacement from main server 10 minutes ago07:04
Unit193I wasn't on .8 yet, am now.07:04
elfyI was - I'm on .7 in this install ;)07:04
Unit193So back to "don't reboot", got it.07:05
elfyyep07:05
elfyyou *can* get in via tty1 and startx - but it's all wrong, get blue window title bars for a start07:06
Unit193Right, you need to set a few vars to get it right.07:06
elfyor expect upgrades not to break things :p07:06
Unit193http://paste.openstack.org/show/ecrRO2Xm5SdFUjnlkaeN/ is what I had from so long ago.07:06
elfythanks Unit193 07:07
Unit193No idea if it still works, but that's my .xinitrc07:08
elfy:)07:08
elfybooting the broken one again to report bug07:11
Unit193Ah, typo there, DEFAULTS_PATH07:11
elfyback in a few07:11
elfythat made no difference Unit193 - reported for better or worse bug 136533607:27
ubottubug 1365336 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "Lightdm update=No desktop" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/136533607:27
ochosielfy: monring08:13
ochosimorning08:13
ochosithere was a discussion about it, and i didn't feel that changing these settings warranted a big discussion as it is a consequence of earlier decisions (namely removing workspace-switcher from the panel, disabling scrolling on desktop to switch workspaces)08:14
ochosialso, there was no discussion about it on any other channel08:14
ochosiand it wasn't just two people08:14
ochosijust to correct you there :)08:14
ochosiif you disagree with the decision, let's discuss it. rants really don't help anyone08:15
elfythe decision to change things have ramifications - changing default wrap - makes the change to wallpaper pointless08:17
ochosichange to wallpaper?08:22
elfythe desktop settings - set wallpaper different on workspaces - try moving the dialogue now - when you've added a desktop08:23
ochosielfy: ^08:23
ochosiah08:23
ochosiis there a bug or are you just pointing out that you can't set different wallpapers for workspaces with only one workspace?08:23
elfyany idea about how many people actually only use 1 desktop?08:24
ochosino, but we didn't base the decision on quantitative analysis08:24
elfyochosi: the first thing I did was set to 2 desktops 08:24
elfythen as I got hit by a lightdm bug - I booted the other one - managed to add nvidia - now that bug is fixed - then I found you're removed wrap when I tried to move the dialogue to set wallpapers 08:25
ochosiright08:26
elfyso we say Move this dialogue - but it's impossible to do without resetting a bunch of things08:27
ochosiin that case that's a clear bug in xfdesktop, it shouldn't show that infobar if workspaces=108:27
elfyor workspaces shouldn't =108:27
ochosino, that's not really the point08:28
elfyit is for me08:28
ochosiwhat you're describing is a misleading infobar08:28
ochosiwhich can easily be hidden08:28
=== paolo_ is now known as paolo
ochosisry, gotta go, bbl08:34
Noskcajbluesabre, Does the 4.12 ppa still need the 4.10 one? ANd should the description still be "these are pre-release versions, which may contain annoying bugs and/or crash. Use them at your own risk.", since all the packages i pushed are in the official archives08:38
NoskcajAnd we use "staging" for the stuff that is not recommended for normal use08:42
elfyochosi: bug 1365382 and xfce 1113408:54
ubottubug 1365382 in xfdesktop4 (Ubuntu) "Infobar in desktop settings alludes to impossible scenario" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/136538208:54
ubottuxfce bug 11134 in General "Desktop Settings Infobar gives move option when unavailable" [Normal,New] https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1113408:55
brainwashinteresting that no one has noticed (and reported) this before08:58
brainwashbtw we've lost a customer08:58
brainwashread https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-power-manager/+bug/1271169/comments/408:58
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1271169 in xfce4-power-manager (Ubuntu) " Let Xubuntu users disable/enable hibernation from Xfce Power Manager" [Wishlist,Invalid]08:58
ali1234gnome-session-fallback doesn't have 5 years of support09:25
ali1234lol09:25
ali1234some people...09:25
brainwashhe closed his report at least :)09:25
ali1234yeah he loves closing bugs, i think that's all he does09:26
slickymasterWorkUnit193: you have doubts?! Of course you must renew (not should)!!!09:43
slickymasterWorkUnit193, knome, since Saucy is EOL, can't we just close the lp:xubuntu-docs/saucy branch?09:46
bluesabreelfy: got it, re-enable workspace drag. As I said before, I want to discuss all the default settings with everyone. Created this pad, where we can have a quick overview: http://pad.ubuntu.com/diA31J1P9e10:10
bluesabreif anybody has any questions, or wants to change or revert, please, let's discuss10:10
Noskcajbluesabre, That's all the xfce stuff done for trusty backport ppa (and your packages)10:11
bluesabreworking on a larger google doc that shows xfce, 14.04, and 14.10 defaults: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kU58YbatuIjM9OF7DDjajw-QzTVNBDIoKg9ZiV2cPDE/edit?usp=sharing10:11
bluesabreNoskcaj: thanks, I moved several xfce packages to the 4.12 ppa10:12
bluesabreI'll update the description like you indicatored10:12
Noskcajcool10:12
bluesabre*indicated10:12
NoskcajSHould i also prep our non-xfce stuff? e.g. gnome-mines, abiword, etc.10:13
Noskcajg'night10:14
slickymasterWorkknome, there's a typo in one of the strings we wrote for including the pkexec policy files in favor of gksu in the documentation10:14
slickymasterWorkknome: the string in question is "Please note that for an application to run successfully with <application>pkexec</application>, it will need to ship a pkexec policy file. All default applications in Xubuntu that might need to be ran with adminstrative rights come with pkexec policy files."10:15
slickymasterWorkit has to be 'administrative' not adminstrative10:16
slickymasterWorksince now I'm not able to push it, I'll do it tonight at home, if you haven't done it yet10:17
bluesabreelfy: Re-enabled wrap workspaces on window drag, changes committed to bzr, not yet uploaded to ubuntu10:23
bluesabrelet me know if we need to change something else10:23
ochosihey bluesabre 10:23
bluesabreand please, add comments to the pad if you disagree with any setting10:23
bluesabrehey ochosi10:24
ochosifwiw, wrapping workspaces also breaks the tiling feature of xfwm4 for left/right10:26
bluesabreyeah, but that doesn't matter if only one workspace is used10:27
ochosihaven't tested that yet10:27
bluesabrethat's the setting I usually have, 1 workspace, fun with tiling10:27
Unit193bluesabre: Exactly, it's just annoying to people adding more.10:27
ochosibluesabre: it does break it here for me10:28
bluesabreUnit193: right, so fixed in the next release10:28
Unit193Yep, so I saw.10:28
ochosiah wait10:28
ochosiit doesn't :)10:28
bluesabreUnit193: any comment on the defaults?10:28
ochosibluesabre: do you still have that bug with the greeter staying black after a while?10:29
bluesabreochosi: haven't tested lately10:29
bluesabrebeen busy with other things10:29
Unit193bluesabre: 1. Only I still disagree with xfwm workspace = 1.  2. There's also the scroll on titlebar change to add, no?  3. The xfce4-panel isn't complete is it?  Doesn't have where the indicators fit for example.  Rest of the stuff on there I'm generally indifferent to.10:31
Unit193I personally use: separator (expands), xfpm, indicator, systray10:32
bluesabrescroll on titlebar was added for 14.0410:32
Unit193I see.10:32
bluesabrebut I'll put that in there10:32
Unit193Eh, it's not a utopic change, couldn't remember for sure when it was.10:32
bluesabregood catch on the indicators10:33
bluesabrefor the number of workspaces, I'd be fine with restoring as well if most of the team thinks it would be best to leave as is... I want to have settings we all agree on10:36
Unit193Well, we won't have that part for sure, but still. :P10:37
ochosii'm really a fan of trying new settings in 14.1010:38
ochosigathering feedback and then re-evaluating them for 15.0410:38
ochosii think the lts+1 release is ideal for that10:38
ochosi(less people think about upgrading immediately)10:39
knomeslickymasterWork, re: saucy branch, yes10:39
slickymasterWorkmorning knome 10:40
slickymasterWorkyeah, it would be the sane thing to do10:40
slickymasterWorkwho does it?10:40
knomei can do that if i still have the access for that10:41
knomeand remember how it's done...10:41
slickymasterWorkok, did you saw what I said re our changes to the pkexec strings in the  -docs?10:42
knomedone.10:42
slickymasterWorklol10:42
knomei did10:42
bluesabrewon't be around for most of the day again today10:42
bluesabreso...10:42
slickymasterWorkthanks for that knome 10:42
knomei guess i could fix the string soon as well10:43
knomewhich file was it?10:43
slickymasterWorkI can do it tonight if you're swapped with your real 'work'10:43
knomei am, but... that happens, and clients can wait! ;)10:43
bluesabre!team | please see the xubuntu-default-settings etherpad and discuss settings... what's missing, what you think should change: http://pad.ubuntu.com/diA31J1P9e10:43
slickymasterWorkdon't remember it now10:43
bluesabre(that never works for me)10:44
knomeok, i'll grep for it10:44
knomebluesabre, :D10:44
slickymasterWorkis not that urgent that it can't wait a few hours and I'll do it tonight10:44
knome!team | ^10:44
ubottu^: bluesabre, elfy, GridCube, jjfrv8, knome, lderan, micahg, mr_pouit, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, skellat, slickymaster, Unit19310:44
knomebluesabre, weird.10:45
slickymasterWorkthe bot doesn't likes bluesabre 10:45
bluesabrethe bot only listens to knome D:10:45
slickymasterWork;)10:45
knomeheh10:45
knomemaybe it's set to ignore him :P10:45
bluesabremakes sense10:45
knomei don't know... it shouldn't really10:45
knomesometimes people set ignores on trolls10:45
bluesabre:'(10:46
knomemaybe one of those is too broad10:46
knomeasking for other factoids work?10:46
bluesabre!fi | knome10:46
ubottuknome: Tämä kanava on tarkoitettu vain englanninkieliselle keskustelulle. Jos haluat suomenkielistä apua (K)ubuntun ongelmiin, liity kanavalle #ubuntu-fi / #kubuntu-fi :-)10:46
knomeyep, weird10:46
slickymasterWorkah ah ah10:46
knomebluesabre, what if you ask for the same factoid again?10:46
slickymasterWorkthat's why, the bot only understands finnish10:47
Unit193I don't see bluesabre!~bluesabre@ubuntu/member/bluesabre matching any.10:47
bluesabre!team | sorry the the unnecessary ping (please see the more important ones above)10:47
ubottusorry the the unnecessary ping (please see the more important ones above): bluesabre, elfy, GridCube, jjfrv8, knome, lderan, micahg, mr_pouit, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, skellat, slickymaster, Unit19310:47
* knome shrugs10:47
bluesabrewho knows10:47
knomemaybe the bot doesn't want you to call the same factoid twice in a row10:47
slickymasterWorkhey Unit193. Did you saw my answer to the question you made to knome re your renewal?10:48
ochosibluesabre: about the greeter bug, i've never been able to reproduce, just remembered that you had that issue at some point10:48
bluesabreanyhoo, np10:48
Unit193slickymasterWork: Yeppers.10:48
knomehuh.. i have some weird docs branch10:48
bluesabreI'll send out a call for package translations today10:48
slickymasterWorkweird how knome?10:49
knomehas some hardcoded paths10:49
bluesabre(and include a note to remember the docs translations)10:49
knomebluesabre, cheers ;)10:49
slickymasterWorkbluesabre: finishing menulibre and heading on to mugshot10:49
slickymasterWorkeh eh bluesabre, thanks10:49
Unit193knome: bzr status / log?10:49
bluesabreslickymasterWork: thanks10:50
knomeUnit193, gone already, diff didn't show anything to keep10:50
slickymasterWorkbzr is acting up10:50
Unit193Always is, what's up this time?10:51
knometypo fix with updated pot pushed10:51
slickymasterWorkgreat knome, thanks10:51
slickymasterWorkthat string is the only one missing in my translation10:52
knomeheh10:52
knomegood for the portugues10:52
slickymasterWorkthe finnish guys are loosing the race :P10:52
Unit193Already missed today's 6am cutoff.10:52
knome+e10:52
knomeUnit193, "aww" :P10:52
knomeslickymasterWork, hah, as if it mattered as long as all the strings were there on release;)10:53
slickymasterWorkknome:  don't forget menulibre and mugshot10:53
Unit193Oooh!  It's 7am, still a couple minutes! :P10:53
slickymasterWorkyeah, just messing with you10:53
knomeslickymasterWork, yep.10:53
slickymasterWorkUnit193: in six months time the answer to the renewal question will be the same :P10:55
Unit193Meh, could change, I don't do a a ton with them as-is.10:56
slickymasterWorkyou're work is need, and awesome, behind the spotlights  10:57
slickymasterWorks/you're/your10:57
slickymasterWorks/need/needed10:57
* slickymasterWork wonders off to smoke a cigarette10:58
elfybluesabre: thanks - looked at pad also, looks sane enough 11:10
bluesabreelfy: if you have any changes, let me know11:11
bluesabrenot trying to pull anything over anybody's eyes, I like to work in the open and well before freezes11:11
knomeslickymasterWork, you are right... nothing quite gives me the same warm, happy feeling than Unit193 contributing to xubuntu...11:12
slickymasterWork:) you and me alike knome 11:12
bluesabreslickymasterWork, knome: me too11:12
bluesabreI feel all fuzzy now11:12
* slickymasterWork considers him a must have11:12
Unit193I sware knome is on something.11:12
knomei'm always on something11:13
elfybluesabre: the wrap one was the issue for me - adding a workspace is easy - but with wrap gone I had to report 2 bugs ;)11:13
bluesabreelfy: gotcha11:13
bluesabrealrighty, I'll be out for a while now, bbl11:13
elfyhave a good day :)11:13
bluesabreyou too11:13
knomeyep, good day to bluesabre 11:13
* elfy is now on 3 and a half day weekend11:14
slickymasterWorkdamn elfy, how I envy you :P11:14
ochosittyl bluesabre 11:14
elfyslickymasterWork: until payday ;)11:15
knomeconsidering taking tomorrow off as well, but unlikely to happen11:15
slickymasterWorkwell, if you knew the payday amounts these days over here elfy 11:15
elfyimage is broken with this lightdm bug - if that's what it is12:08
bluesabredidn't add any new settings changes yesterday, so not my fault12:09
elfylol12:09
elfygot the same issue in my other install atm12:09
Unit193Carp, don't reboot or update the other 'un.12:11
elfyit's this one that works 12:12
elfythe other better one is unfortunately updated12:12
Unit193We're not the only ones in here using utopic right?12:13
elfydon't thinks so 12:13
knometeam factoid updated.12:25
elfythanks knome 12:25
knomenp12:27
=== lderan_ is now known as lderan
=== halfie_ is now known as halfie
=== halfie is now known as 1JTAABIAE
slickymasterWorkbluesabre, I believe there's a typo in one of the Mugshot's strings in https://translations.launchpad.net/mugshot/trunk 14:40
slickymasterWorkin the string: "This stable release fixed a crash that occured when saving user details in a non-English locale. This release also included an updated translation template and new translations."14:40
slickymasterWorkshouldn't it be 'occurred' instead of 'occured'?14:40
elfyochosi bluesabre - found another oddity it seems - window manager theme is set to default - which is blue, thought it was supposed to be greybird 14:50
elfyoh nvm14:51
elfyusing startx it appears it starts the xfce session instead of xubuntu14:52
elfybrb14:53
=== brainwash_ is now known as brainwash
ochosislickymaster: please keep the guidelines for xfce docs in mind when taking screenshots (theme+icons)17:32
ochosiremember when we worked on xfdesktop17:32
elfyevening ochosi 17:35
brainwashNoskcaj: MRE for xfdesktop4 should be doable or? http://lpaste.net/11050417:52
brainwashif no, maybe we should just cherry pick one or more patches17:54
ochosipleia2: how's the xfce bounty marketing thingy coming along?18:12
* elfy hasn't had time to look at his action from last meeting yet ochosi 18:13
pleia2oh, I should do that18:14
elfythanks pleia2 - I'll change the logs :D18:15
pleia2ochosi: I'll make some plans tonight and let you know if I have questions18:15
ochosipleia2: thanks, that's great!18:15
ochosielfy: would be great if you could look into it until the meeting, otherwise we'll just carry it forward till the next meeting18:16
elfyif I can I will 18:19
ochosibbl18:19
elfyUnit193: had to create a .rules file to get lightdm to work19:02
elfyhttp://pastebin.com/BL3ADDMG if you're interested19:03
brainwash"Simply logging off provokes the back screen symptom (!)"19:35
brainwashthis sounds familiar19:35
Noskcajbrainwash, yeah, we can. Could you file it?20:07
brainwashNoskcaj: maybe20:08
brainwashwhat about the regression potential?20:08
brainwashwe got a lp report20:08
brainwashit's a bit confusing.. elfy confirmed that a patch has fixed the desktop freezing bug, but other users continued to experience it, so the patch was removed upstream (before 4.11.7)20:15
brainwashNoskcaj: did your first mre request have any success?20:16
brainwashthe panel plugin one20:17
Noskcajbrainwash, It's been ignored20:17
brainwashouch :(20:17
Noskcajbluesabre, Could you look at bug 133991120:18
ubottubug 1339911 in xfce4-clipman-plugin (Ubuntu) "[MRE] Please update xfce4-clipman-plugin to 1.2.6" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/133991120:18
Unit193xubutrello: card 85 link22:58
Unit193I'd hope this late it won't land, and nothing really has hit the tracking bug #1358209.22:58
xubutrellohttps://trello.com/c/lgQiG8tA/85-update-the-docs-networking-section-for-the-new-networkmanager22:58
ubottubug 1358209 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Please update Network Manager version to 0.9.10.0 or 0.9.8.10" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/135820922:58
Unit193Bug #135197722:59
ubottubug 1351977 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "New upstream release 0.9.10.0" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/135197722:59
ochosiUnit193: are there grave differences?23:11
* ochosi hadn't even noticed there was a new release23:11
Unit193IIRC, nm-tool no longer exists, which we talk about in the doc.  nmcli is the newer, cooler one (TUI, ncurses).23:12
ochosiUnit193: ah right, maybe we have in fact talked about it23:19
Unit193ochosi: We have.23:19

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