[00:12] <bluesabre> hey guys
[00:18] <RobertJDohnert> Whats up
[01:03] <Unit193> bluesabre: What's up, doc?
[01:05] <bluesabre> Unit193, RobertJDohnert - not much
[01:05] <bluesabre> working on my wiki page since its out of date
[01:06] <bluesabre> again
[01:06] <bluesabre> :D
[01:06] <Unit193> Oooh!  Going for motu?!
[01:06] <bluesabre> oh, not yet
[01:06] <bluesabre> lol
[01:06] <bluesabre> seems like I should not restart until the next lightdm release
[01:07] <Unit193> Only reason to update it, going for something. :P
[01:07] <Unit193> That's what it looks like to me, yep.
[01:07] <bluesabre> or adding what I've already got
[01:07] <Unit193> bluesabre: He did ping with a rules file you could edit and use.
[01:07] <Unit193> I haven't touched mine since getting membership, thus it'd be a major pain to go for packageset or motu.
[01:07] <bluesabre> you can dooooo it
[01:08] <Unit193> I think I can make it in time for 16.04. :P
[01:28] <skellat> bluesabre: This needs a look: http://askubuntu.com/questions/516314/xubuntu-14-04-disable-desktop-and-panel
[01:28] <bluesabre> skellat: sorry about that, will try to tackle it tonight
[01:28] <skellat> No problemo
[02:12] <pleia2> ochosi, knome (and anyone else who wants to log in to review a donations page): http://xubuntu.org/?page_id=2712
[02:13] <pleia2> this was the blocker to social media-ing bountysource, want to have this in place in case people ask about donations more generally
[03:03]  * pleia2 frowns at isos
[03:03] <pleia2> I need some help from elfy tomorrow
[03:05] <bluesabre> issues pleia2?
[03:05] <pleia2> yeah, virtualbox is muy unhappy with both isos
[03:06] <bluesabre> like, garbage video?
[03:06] <pleia2> 32-bit loads up the decision screen with no background (just black) and won't load live
[03:06] <bluesabre> ah
[03:06] <pleia2> 64-bit is garbage video, won't even give me a choice
[03:06] <pleia2> just black and does weird things when I move my mouse
[03:06] <bluesabre> for the bad video,  <host>-F1/F7 to VT switch it back to life
[03:07]  * pleia2 will give that a try
[03:09] <pleia2> aha, that was in the release notes but I guess I didn't understand it D:
[03:10] <pleia2> woohoo, now 64-bit won't load a live session, just like 32-bit
[03:10] <bluesabre> yay, improvement..? :D
[03:11] <pleia2> at least it's consistent now :)
[03:11] <pleia2> thoughts on filing bug for this?
[03:11] <bluesabre> it might already be a known issue, apparently today's lightdm is broken pretty bad
[03:12] <pleia2> ah
[03:12] <bluesabre> Unit193: is this related to what you guys were seeing earlier?
[03:13] <pleia2> ah, maybe https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1365336
[03:13] <Unit193> Yeah, elfy said the isos were borked and don't upgrade (or reboot at least) your utopic session.
[03:13] <Unit193> Mhmm.
[03:13] <bluesabre> I already updated my packages, so I'm making sure to not log out or let light-locker send me to the login screen :)
[03:13] <pleia2> hehe
[03:13] <Unit193> No light-locker, so I'm set.
[03:16] <bluesabre> getting pretty tired, going to retire early... back in the morning
[03:18] <pleia2> night bluesabre 
[07:15] <elfy> ochosi: http://pad.ubuntu.com/QAIncentive
[07:59] <ochosi> pleia2: looks good to me! i'd add an icon for each section, but text-wise this is fine
[08:00] <ochosi> elfy: thanks for the pad and for adding it to the meeting agenda!
[08:00] <elfy> bluesabre: you might need a nvidia rules file - there are a bunch to choose from on the bug report :)
[08:00] <ochosi> makes sense
[08:00] <elfy> ochosi: welcome
[08:00] <ochosi> we'll mostly have to discuss the stuff in line 24 i guess
[08:01] <elfy> yea
[08:01] <ochosi> although if you'd want, you could get in touch with pleia2 and knome about it even beforehands and add info about it
[08:01] <ochosi> cause you can never know whether they'll be there for the meeting
[08:03] <elfy> well I know I won't be ;)
[08:10] <elfy> running through a core install against the testcase - then I'll do a call for that - pointless though it might well be
[08:18] <ochosi> pleia2, knome: could you take a peek at this pad (especially the last line) and add some info about that? http://pad.ubuntu.com/QAIncentive
[08:18] <ochosi> bbl
[08:19] <knome> i did and commented on the pad :P
[08:19] <elfy> thanks knome 
[08:21] <knome> np
[08:21] <elfy> alternate/mini installs take so loooooong :(
[08:22] <elfy> I'm really pleased we don't do those anymore generally
[08:22] <knome> mhm
[08:23] <elfy> lightdm bug is now an nvidia one - and likely to affect amd as well 
[08:23] <knome> duh
[08:23] <elfy> which just about covers anyone who's not using nouveau or the amd opensource thing
[08:24] <knome> :|
[08:24] <knome> what's the bug?
[08:24] <elfy> it seems to have been my cycle for finding nvidia issues lol
[08:24] <elfy> bug 1365336
[08:26] <elfy> seems to be some sort of odd interaction with vbox as well - yesterday with nouveau - couldn't get our daily to boot in vm
[08:27] <knome> hrr hrr
[08:27] <elfy> yea awesome ... 
[08:31] <knome> ahh
[08:31] <knome> well at least it has a solution now
[08:32]  * knome just read the bug comments and is relieved
[08:32] <elfy> :)
[08:32]  * elfy got a bit fed up of reboots :p
[08:32] <knome> lol, i can imagine
[08:33] <elfy> could have been worse I suppose - I could have rebooted with different .rules and they all fail :D
[08:33] <knome> heh, yep
[08:37] <elfy> I guess I should try with systemd as well at some point - unless Unit193's got that covered :)
[08:38] <Unit193> drivers: ati,radeon   Other system no longer uses systemd.
[08:39] <elfy> and do they work with lightdm .8?
[08:40] <elfy> and why are you awake lol
[08:40] <knome> *psst* he's weird
[08:40] <elfy> :)
[08:41] <Unit193> I've been too afraid to reboot. :P
[08:42] <elfy> heh 
[08:44] <elfy> Unit193: I'll get the -core test call out today - then we can clear that off \o/
[08:46] <Unit193> Great, I'll grab a new mini.
[08:46] <elfy> running through it now on 64bit - working so far :)
[09:00] <james0r> added the xubuntu staging repo and updated yesterday, just noticing now that the power manager no longer has an option to display icon in system tray. where would this be handled?
[09:23] <knome> bluesabre, ping
[09:23] <knome> where's micahg?
[09:24] <knome> ochosi, ping too
[09:47] <slickymasterWork> ochosi: re: the guidelines for xfce docs when taking screenshots (theme+icons) I'm maintaining what we've used before as defined in http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:sceenshot-stds 
[09:47] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre: did you notice this: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/09/04/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t14:40
[09:52] <knome> slickymasterWork, sceenshots ;)
[09:54] <slickymasterWork> morning knome 
[09:54] <slickymasterWork> did get it knome?!
[09:54] <slickymasterWork> s/did/didn't
[09:55] <slickymasterWork> ah ah now I see it
[09:56] <slickymasterWork> weel it was jjfrv8 that created that link :P
[09:57] <slickymasterWork> s/weel/well
[10:04] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork, yeah, just translate it as though it was fine
[10:04] <bluesabre> knome: pong
[10:05] <slickymasterWork> ok bluesabre, it's the only string left there
[10:05] <elfy> morning bluesabre slickymasterWork 
[10:05] <elfy> someone point me at the xfpm wiki please :)
[10:05] <bluesabre> morning elfy forestpiskie
[10:05] <slickymasterWork> hey elfy, top of the morning to you
[10:05] <bluesabre> http://wiki.smdavis.us/doku.php?id=xfpm-docs:start
[10:05] <elfy> bluesabre: lol
[10:06] <elfy> ty
[10:06] <slickymasterWork> here you go elfy  http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=xfpm-docs:start
[10:06] <slickymasterWork> lol bluesabre beat me to it
[10:07] <elfy> :)
[10:07] <slickymasterWork> elfy take in consideration this http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:sceenshot-stds when taking screenshots
[10:09] <elfy> yep
[10:15] <elfy> http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-050914-111416.php 
[10:15] <elfy> core test call sent now \o/
[10:18] <bluesabre> woo!
[10:20] <elfy> it's even got a test result reported ;)
[10:21] <elfy> woohoo - my lightdm bug is now critical for a whole bunch of nvidia/fglrx stuff :p
[10:21]  * bluesabre really needs to remove lightdm as one of his notification keywords
[10:21] <slickymasterWork> I'll try to make same testings later on the afternoon
[10:22] <elfy> lol @ bluesabre 
[10:22] <elfy> slickymasterWork: the core one takes a while to do 
[10:23] <slickymasterWork> hmm, I'll go with the dailys then as I'll be slickymasterWork and not slickymaster
[10:23] <elfy> yep - thought I would tell you 
[10:24] <slickymasterWork> thanks elfy 
[10:25] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre: mugshot, menulibre and x-d-s all translated
[10:26] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: fantastic :)
[10:28] <knome> bluesabre, would you mind dropping better descriptions for the -dev PPA's?
[10:29] <bluesabre> "dropping" is one of those odd words with a double meaning
[10:29] <bluesabre> "adding" or "removing"?
[10:33] <knome> :P
[10:33] <knome> adding
[10:33] <knome> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xubuntu-staging
[10:33] <knome> that isn't exactly useful...
[10:33] <knome> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/extras
[10:33] <knome> nor that
[10:34] <knome> most importantly, they do not describe how they fall into our procedures, or in which situation is one supposed to use them
[10:34] <bluesabre> knome: ochosi, should I drop packages from the ppas for unsupported releases (only shipping 12.04, 14.04, 14.10)
[10:34] <bluesabre> knome: ok
[10:34] <knome> nor do they link to the package trackers (they probably should, if we need testing for those packages)
[10:35] <knome> do we have a lot of non-supported stuff then?
[10:35] <knome> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/ppa is a bit weird
[10:35] <bluesabre> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xfce-4.10
[10:36] <knome> it seems to overlap with other PPA's
[10:36] <knome> not sure about that...
[10:37] <bluesabre> creating a pad
[10:37] <knome> mhm
[10:37] <elfy> I thought we discussed at the beginning of the cycle sorting all that PPA stuff out
[10:37] <knome> elfy, apparently not :)
[10:37] <dkessel> ochosi: i am just updating the mugshot translation for "de". should i check "someone should review this translation"?
[10:37] <knome> elfy, we've created a few new PPA's, which are the first two mentioned - they itself do not document waht they are (for) though
[10:38] <knome> dkessel, if you feel like you're not sure about the translation
[10:39] <dkessel> knome, i am. ok, mugshot done ;)
[10:39] <slickymasterWork> dkessel are you translating in reviewer mode?
[10:39] <knome> nice
[10:39] <knome> dkessel, how's the doc translation coming up?
[10:39] <dkessel> slickymasterWork: yes i am
[10:39] <dkessel> knome: it's making progress. german is at about 24% and the reviewer is unable to catch up ;)
[10:40] <slickymasterWork> well it will be considered as a final translation then
[10:40] <dkessel> so... 24% reviewed
[10:40] <slickymasterWork> like knome if you certain about it just don't check the box
[10:40] <slickymasterWork> + said
[10:42] <dkessel> it is not very easy to get into the german translation team with review rights (which is ok), so it will take some time until xubuntu-docs are done
[10:43] <slickymasterWork> dkessel, can't you poke someone in https://translations.launchpad.net/+languages/de
[10:45] <slickymasterWork> correction, https://launchpad.net/~lp-l10n-de
[10:46] <dkessel> slickymasterWork: i wonder how that team relates to the terman ubuntu translators team
[10:47] <bluesabre> knome: we can work from here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/vQ8LL4MVaW
[10:48] <bluesabre> ochosi ^
[10:49]  * bluesabre will contribute later, has to get ready for work now
[10:49] <slickymasterWork> dkessel, the Launchpad German Translators is a member of https://translations.launchpad.net/+groups/launchpad-translators and https://translations.launchpad.net/+groups/mahara-translation-group only
[11:01] <knome> some work done on the pad
[11:18] <knome> slickymasterWork, bug 165082
[11:18] <knome> slickymasterWork, do you think we'd like/want something like that in the website/docs?
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> knome, the idea is remarkable and it would be great to have it on the website
[11:25] <slickymasterWork> but there's one thing that makes me wonder, can we even grasp the amount of research work that is/would be necessary to achieve it
[11:28] <knome> depends what the scope should be
[11:30] <slickymasterWork> knome, from the bug description. "...the history of xubuntu and xfce in ubuntu and how everything started...
[11:31] <slickymasterWork> and I think that's correct, if is to be done, I believe that the scope should be global, i.e., from the 'beginning of times' ;) 
[11:31] <knome> lol
[11:32] <knome> i believe catching mr_pouit some day would give us most of the information we want..
[11:32] <slickymasterWork> Lionel you mean?
[11:43] <knome> yep
[11:47] <bluesabre> so, who wants to be ~xubuntu-historian
[11:47] <bluesabre> :D
[11:48] <brainwash> the good old days
[11:49] <brainwash> bluesabre: any idea which component/package we could blame instead?
[11:49] <brainwash> bug 1357090
[11:49] <bluesabre> honestly... it's probably the greeter and his hardware does not support DPMS
[11:50] <bluesabre> but, don't comment yet
[11:50] <bluesabre> but yeah, original bug was black screen when you re-entered your session
[11:50] <bluesabre> *not* black screen at login screen
[11:51] <bluesabre> and if he confirms that it still happens when he removes the package, I don't imagine that xfce4-power-manager is to blame
[11:51] <brainwash> right, black screen can be caused by various bugs or broken stuff
[11:52] <brainwash> we simply don't know yet what to blame
[11:52] <bluesabre> yup
[11:52] <brainwash> it was filed against xubu default settings, so I've changed it to xfpm
[11:53] <bluesabre> we basically need to confirm when exactly he sees it/has seen it
[11:53] <bluesabre> and if anything happens between
[11:53] <bluesabre> what driver
[11:53] <bluesabre> inxi -G
[11:54] <bluesabre> try to narrow down the information
[11:55] <brainwash> yeah, almost feels like he's the only one affected by the problem
[11:55] <brainwash> other people just did not hit the apply button twice yet
[11:55] <brainwash> in lls
[11:55] <bluesabre> ultimately, there is not much that can be done with the various combinations of hardware, software, user config, personal workarounds -- when he have a bugfix that has been verified by many people
[11:56] <bluesabre> (and is probably unrelated to his bug)
[11:56] <bluesabre> I'll comment on it tonight
[11:56] <bluesabre> might try a combo of an xfpm setting and xscreensaver
[11:57] <brainwash> alright, thanks for getting involved :)
[12:34] <dkessel> hmm which package contains the translation string for the context menu when a user right clicks on a file?
[12:34] <knome> thunar?
[12:38] <dkessel> if i translate what's missing using the transifex website, will that get pushed to xubuntu?
[12:44] <knome> eventually, with new releases
[13:11] <ochosi> dkessel: as long as you feel comfortable with your translations, there's no need to ask for review
[13:12] <knome> ochosi, ping!
[13:12] <ochosi> knome: pong
[14:45] <eduardojunio> Hello! :D
[14:46] <elfy> hi eduardojunio :)
[14:51] <dkessel> I have another translation question. Is this the right place to put the name of contributors to a translation? https://translations.launchpad.net/xubuntu-docs/utopic/+pots/desktop-guide/de/483/+translate 
[14:52] <eduardojunio> dkessel, I want too help with translation but the links are broken. :\ http://wiki.xfce.org/translations
[14:59] <dkessel> eduardojunio: the only thing i found for xfce translations is the transifex site
[14:59] <eduardojunio> dkessel, but the link to transifex site are broken :\
[15:00] <eduardojunio> https://www.transifex.com/projects/p/xfce/
[15:01] <dkessel> eduardojunio: hmm right. Have you tried asking in #xfce ?
[15:01] <eduardojunio> dkessel, not yet
[15:02] <dkessel> eduardojunio: there should be people who can tell you what to do
[15:03] <eduardojunio> dkessel, ok, thanks! :)
[15:07] <slickymasterWork> no dkessel, the contributors names are added by a script
[15:07] <slickymasterWork> hey eduardojunio, have you considered translating https://translations.launchpad.net/xubuntu-docs/utopic
[15:08] <dkessel> slickymasterWork: OK thanks
[15:08] <slickymasterWork> np dkessel 
[15:09] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, nope, I'll see! Thanks!
[15:09] <slickymasterWork> np eduardojunio 
[15:11] <slickymasterWork> eduardojunio: also, consider these: https://translations.launchpad.net/catfish-search, https://translations.launchpad.net/light-locker-settings, https://translations.launchpad.net/menulibre, https://translations.launchpad.net/mugshot and https://translations.launchpad.net/xubuntu-default-settings
[15:11] <slickymasterWork> it might seem too much, but each of the packages doesn't contain more then 30 strings to be translated
[15:12] <slickymasterWork> besides catfish :P
[15:12] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, ok XD
[15:14] <slickymasterWork> and thanks for jumping in and helping eduardojunio
[15:15] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, nop, It's all for <3 to Xubuntu :D
[15:15] <slickymasterWork> :)
[16:02] <slickymasterWork> ochosi: re: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/09/02/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t15:31 on a fresh install of today's daily, fully updated, I'm getting the same scenario in the 'System' tab
[16:17] <pleia2> ochosi: commented on QAIncentive
[16:17] <elfy> slickymasterWork: installing to check 
[16:17] <elfy> hi pleia2 - thanks :)
[16:17] <slickymasterWork> hey pleia2 o/
[16:18] <pleia2> elfy: so at the CC hangout yesterday balloons mentioned they hadn't done much work on the tracker lately, do you get the impression they will be? there are some particular pain points
[16:18] <pleia2> slickymasterWork: hey hey
[16:18] <elfy> pleia2: pain points?
[16:18] <pleia2> filter bugs by not ubuntu-kylin would be awesome D:
[16:18] <elfy> oic 
[16:18] <pleia2> (not specifically ubuntu-kylin perhaps, but those are the most annoying because chinese)
[16:19] <pleia2> or by packageset, I don't care about lxde or unity bugs on xubuntu images
[16:19] <pleia2> it's so tedious to mouseover 30 bugs
[16:19] <elfy> yea - not only that but for me the major pita is See Removed and Superseded builds too
[16:19] <elfy> try that one ... 
[16:19] <elfy> you might not hang the tracker 
[16:19] <pleia2> where is?
[16:19] <elfy> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/315/builds
[16:20] <elfy> just above where you'd pick something to test -at the top
[16:20]  * pleia2 waits
[16:20] <elfy> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/315/history
[16:20] <pleia2> not looking good :)
[16:20] <elfy> telling me ;)
[16:20] <knome> pleia2, put in a comment on pad
[16:21] <pleia2> so yeah, the tracker needs some love
[16:21] <elfy> that's bug 1126449
[16:21] <pleia2> I am quite committed to Xubuntu and it's annoying me enough to make me go all "boo testing"
[16:21] <knome> well, here's the thing
[16:21] <elfy> pleia2: you're one is bug 994812
[16:21] <knome> i did some improvements for the UI, and they are waiting for stgraber to go through them
[16:22] <knome> now if he merged those, it would be much easier to work on other things on the tracker..
[16:22] <pleia2> knome: <3
[16:22] <knome> also it would be easier if it was not drupal >__<
[16:22] <pleia2> heh
[16:22] <pleia2> well, that won't change any time soon
[16:22] <knome> no.
[16:23] <pleia2> elfy: ooh, it loaded
[16:23] <knome> the worst thing is that i never had enough patience to actually get a testing tracker running.
[16:24] <elfy> pleia2: quick then :p
[16:25] <elfy> pleia2: so to answer your original question - not looking good for things to get looked at ;)
[16:25] <elfy> not meaning things that people like knome have done there
[16:26] <knome> the history page looks like it's loading way too much stuff at once
[16:26] <pleia2> elfy: I'll see balloons in person next week, any in person nudging I should do?
[16:26] <elfy> knome: even if you've only got xubuntu filtered in left pane - it grabs EVERYTHING and then filters it - it's that quick you can see it 
[16:26] <pleia2> x_x
[16:27] <knome> elfy, yep.
[16:27] <elfy> stgraber I think is the one - that right knome ?
[16:27] <knome> yeah, balloons is not working on the tracker code
[16:27] <knome> but sure it helps to prod him about issues
[16:27] <elfy> yep
[16:27] <knome> maybe we should gather a complete list of issues we see with the tracker
[16:27] <pleia2> yeah, he's the community guy whose job it is to make this easier on us
[16:28] <pleia2> yeah, biggest pain points
[16:28] <knome> if they are bugs, then create some pad or blueprint that gathers them all
[16:28] <pleia2> getting just a few things fixed would make my life 100x better
[16:28] <pleia2> aside from filtering, mouseover bugs is the worst idea ever
[16:28] <knome> lol
[16:28] <knome> yeah
[16:29] <knome> hmm
[16:29] <pleia2> I ended up sourcing the page last night and looking at it that way
[16:29] <knome> i made a patch that makes sure the tooltips are *visible*
[16:29] <knome> doesn't look like that landed in production either..
[16:30] <elfy> nope
[16:30] <elfy> commented against comments in QA pad
[16:30] <knome> bugs in a list would be awesome.
[16:30] <knome> it would be even more awesome if you could hide some bugs
[16:30] <pleia2> I'm not being nice, someone thought mouseover bugs was a good idea once, I shouldn't trash it, just grumpy
[16:30] <elfy> bugs in anything readable would be awesome
[16:31] <knome> and if you could see against which product they were filed against...
[16:31] <pleia2> yeah
[16:31] <elfy> yea - filtering and history - 2 things - fix them - makes the whole thing more usable
[16:32]  * pleia2 nods
[16:33] <elfy> one even made it onto QA incentive pad ;)
[16:33] <pleia2> that's what triggered my rant
[16:33] <elfy> he he he 
[16:33] <pleia2> "yeah, that's annoying, also.." :)
[16:35] <pleia2> knome: wait, django or drupal?
[16:36] <knome> i guess both..
[16:36] <knome> the site runs drupal, but apparently most of the code is written in django/python
[16:37]  * pleia2 boggles
[16:37] <pleia2> I didn't know that was possible
[16:37] <knome> so, python is out of question for me
[16:37] <knome> and drupal is teeth-grinding
[16:37] <knome> yes, the stupid bugs have bugged me enough to *still* write some stuff for the trackers
[16:37] <knome> hey, another thing i did
[16:38]  * elfy once again is pleased code is a foreign country to him 
[16:38] <pleia2> haha
[16:38] <knome> was when you drag+drop a bug link to the "bug" fields
[16:38] <knome> it will automatically format it correctly
[16:38] <knome> (adds ", #####" at the end of the input box)
[16:39] <pleia2> neat
[16:39] <knome> (regardless of what position you dropped the link at)
[16:39] <knome> that's not the best implementation
[16:40] <knome> but that's much better than having to copy bug numbers manually
[16:43] <elfy> slickymasterWork: can confirm that xfpm behaviour in vbox - also appear to have Devices tab in that - not got that here on hardware
[16:46] <elfy> slickymasterWork ochosi bluesabre - system tab in xfpm - my install and vm http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-050914-174552.php
[16:47] <slickymasterWork> yes elfy, that's on a vbox for me also, haven't tried it on hardware yet
[16:48] <slickymasterWork> elfy: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=xfpm-docs:preferences
[16:48] <slickymasterWork> also getting the 'Devices' tab
[16:56] <pleia2> elfy: what's the deal with Xubuntu core? I don't see an iso to download
[16:57] <knome> pleia2, read the mailing list
[16:57] <pleia2> :D
[16:57] <pleia2> that's not fair, it was just 2 hours ago
[16:58] <pleia2> thanks :)
[16:59] <knome> you're welcome
[16:59] <knome> well, you didn't use the best excuse
[16:59] <knome> "i must have missed the mailing list discussion since i wasn't around then"
[16:59] <knome> courtesy of a semi-frequent visitor on this channel
[17:00] <pleia2> I haven't checked that mailbox this morning!
[17:00] <pleia2> the question was actually from last night, when I was testing isos, I just remembered it :)
[17:01] <knome> heh
[17:04] <elfy> pleia2: I think that to have a download to grab from the tracker - we'd need 2 - 1 for each arch
[17:05] <elfy> pleia2: ok - so booting images is a faff currently :)
[17:06] <pleia2> :)
[17:06] <elfy> best plan is to start install from usb boot at the beginning and fail the livesession
[17:07] <elfy> but I'm holding fire on the bug till the image gets respun tomorrow
[17:08] <elfy> knome: though I guess I could request rebuild on the tracker? 
[17:08] <elfy> never done that for anything but milestones
[17:10] <elfy> pleia2: I think there is an issue with images re lightdm - there was a bug for that, which is now actually nvidia-* and flgrx 
[17:10] <knome> you could, but is the image fixed?
[17:11] <elfy> the bug I had is fixed 
[17:11] <knome> well, you got your answer from balloons already ,)
[17:11] <elfy> yep :)
[17:12] <elfy> personally I think it is fubar and will still be 
[17:13] <elfy> unignoring queuebot for a while
[17:21] <knome> heh
[17:22] <knome> with a decent irc client, you can ignore everything, then unignore parts of that
[17:24] <elfy> I ignore it unless I want to not
[17:26] <pleia2> ochosi, knome: updated with logos http://xubuntu.org/?page_id=2712
[17:26] <pleia2> knome: feel free to update for prettierness
[17:26] <knome> cool!
[17:27] <knome> what's the rationale for the order?
[17:27] <elfy> a-z
[17:27] <elfy> :)
[17:28] <knome> except "contribute your time" ;)
[17:28] <elfy> which should be plastered everywhere :p
[17:28] <pleia2> hehe
[17:28] <elfy> a-z-a then knome :D
[17:28] <knome> i would prefer if the order was bountysource, unixstickers, canonical, <hr /> (!), contribute
[17:28] <pleia2> but yeah, a-z for vendors, then reminder that people can dontate time
[17:28] <pleia2> donate too
[17:29] <knome> what if i want to dontate?
[17:29] <pleia2> you can do whatever you like
[17:29] <slickymasterWork> i'LL MAIL YOU MY ACCOUNT NUMBER THEN knome 
[17:29]  * slickymasterWork hides
[17:29] <knome> lol
[17:29] <knome> i'll let don t. eat it then..
[17:30] <knome> pleia2, so what do you think of my suggestion?
[17:30] <pleia2> sure
[17:30] <knome> another possibility is to order them by:
[17:30] <knome> nah
[17:30] <pleia2> I don't care much about order :) there aren't so many that anyone gets buried
[17:30] <knome> that didn't make sense..
[17:31] <knome> just that canonical isn't really our preferred way, even if it's not bad
[17:32] <pleia2> k, refresh
[17:32] <knome> besides, it's different... the donator doesn't get anything
[17:32] <knome> and we might not get (if we didn't apply) either
[17:32] <knome> yep, better
[17:32] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, I have already translated 100% the Catfish to Brazilian Portuguese! :D https://translations.launchpad.net/catfish-search/trunk/+pots/catfish/pt_BR/+translate
[17:32] <pleia2> I don't want to edit this anymore, and I have to get back to work, feel free to tweak and I'll publish on Monday or so
[17:32] <slickymasterWork> great work eduardojunio, thanks for that
[17:33] <knome> hehe, sure, hf pleia2 
[17:33] <pleia2> :)
[17:33] <slickymasterWork> eduardojunio: I have to finish the portuguese one :P
[17:33] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, XD
[17:33] <elfy> cya sunday pm pleia2 :)
[17:34] <slickymasterWork> eduardojunio: when translating the other links I posted, feel free to recur to the portuguese translations I've made
[17:35] <slickymasterWork> besides a few things, the idiom is pretty much the same ;)
[17:35] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, ok :)
[17:35] <slickymasterWork> and again thanks for jumping in and help
[17:37] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, I'm newbie translating, so, after I translate the Catfish to brazilian portuguese, when the program will update the taranslation?
[17:37] <eduardojunio> translation*
[17:37] <slickymasterWork> in the next release eduardojunio 
[17:37] <slickymasterWork> knome: https://translations.launchpad.net/xubuntu-docs/utopic/+pots/desktop-guide/fi/+translate still missing 4 strings :P
[17:37] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, oh, ok! thanks :D
[17:37] <knome> slickymasterWork, i know ;)
[17:37]  * slickymasterWork hides once again
[17:38] <knome> slickymasterWork, keeping them untranslated to make you feel uncomfortable
[17:38] <slickymasterWork> the french one is getting there knome 
[17:38] <slickymasterWork> lol
[17:38] <elfy> knome: LOL
[17:38] <slickymasterWork> with friends like these...
[17:39] <elfy> ha ha 
[17:39] <knome> hey, you're the one reminding me daily of the strings ;)
[17:39] <slickymasterWork> well, you showed me who to get things done during your XPL days knome 
[17:39] <knome> hehe
[17:39] <knome> true
[17:40] <knome> s/who/how/ too ;)
[17:40] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, you are "David Pires"?
[17:40] <slickymasterWork> lol knome 
[17:40] <slickymasterWork> yes, indeed I am eduardojunio 
[17:40] <eduardojunio> slickymasterWork, ok :D
[17:40] <elfy> nice to see people pitch up - ask if they can help - and then do something 
[17:41] <slickymasterWork> yes, elfy
[17:41] <elfy> happened a bit lately :)
[17:41] <knome> yes, i especially like the last point ,)
[17:41] <elfy> knome: me too :)
[17:41] <slickymasterWork> knome: seems to have lost an eye
[17:43] <elfy> off for a bit - back later to see how the image is 
[17:43] <knome> yep...
[17:43] <knome> too much poking from slickymasterWork !
[17:43] <slickymasterWork> hey, I'll also be leaving in a few minutes
[17:44] <slickymasterWork> have fun elfy 
[17:47] <knome> meh, that one string should have <userinput> and not <code>
[17:48] <slickymasterWork> which one knome?
[17:48] <knome> If the program you wish to run as an administrator is graphical, such as the <application>Mousepad</application> text editor, run the command prefixed with <code>pkexec</code> in the command line. For example, to run <application>Mousepad</application> with administrative rights, run the command <code>pkexec mousepad /path/to/file</code>.
[17:49] <slickymasterWork> yeah, you're right, we missed that one
[17:50] <slickymasterWork> it's  an easy fix anyway
[17:50] <slickymasterWork> change a change in the tags
[17:50] <slickymasterWork> s/change/just
[17:50] <slickymasterWork> I can do it this weekend
[17:51] <knome> yes, but it means translations will be invalidated :P
[17:51] <slickymasterWork> yeah, that's the down side
[17:52] <slickymasterWork> but I think it's necessary, for the sake of consistency
[17:52] <slickymasterWork> or do you disagree
[17:52] <slickymasterWork> ?
[17:52] <knome> sure
[17:52] <knome> i'll land the change now
[17:53] <slickymasterWork> dkessel, FYI ^^ (not sure if you got there yet)
[17:53] <ochosi> pleia2: looks nice!
[17:53] <slickymasterWork> hey ochosi 
[17:53] <knome> pushed
[17:53] <slickymasterWork> thanks knome 
[17:54] <knome> translation template should propagate to launchpad... sometime
[17:54] <slickymasterWork> :)
[17:55] <knome> i really like that we are attributing translators
[17:55] <slickymasterWork> yes, and people do feel good when they some how see their effort recognized
[17:55] <dkessel> thanks slickymasterWork . luckily I didn't get there yet.
[17:56] <slickymasterWork> ochosi: quick nag http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/09/05/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t16:02
[17:56] <knome> yes, and they potentially benefit from it in other ways too
[17:56] <slickymasterWork> oh ok dkessel 
[17:56] <slickymasterWork> that's true knome 
[17:57] <dkessel> Oh BTW. The chapter about simple scan is wrong. It say you have to use a documents menu... But there is no such menu anymore. You directly click the scan button...
[17:58] <knome> dkessel, mind to file a bug?
[17:58] <slickymasterWork> knome beat me to it
[17:59] <slickymasterWork> there's still time to fix that before release
[18:00] <ochosi> slickymasterWork: interesting. couldn't reproduce that previously, but i'll take a look soon
[18:00] <ochosi> maybe also ping bluesabre about it
[18:00] <ochosi> might be a packaging issue
[18:00] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/09/05/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t16:02
[18:01] <dkessel> knome: if I remember it the other day. Too tedious from the phone ;)
[18:04] <knome> dkessel, i'll file it now and you'll fill in the details (if needed) later. deal?
[18:04] <slickymasterWork> I'm off guys, cy later
[18:07] <dkessel> knome: ok
[18:08] <knome> bug 1366150
[18:24] <brainwash> ochosi: now that you are familiar with xdg-utils, please take a look at bug 1366153
[19:09] <ochosi> brainwash: that's an obvious issue, i only fixed the inhibition for xubuntu/xfce
[19:10] <ochosi> but anyway, i'm waiting for ll 1.6 which will have a proper dbus interface, so that can then go upstream to xdg-utils
[20:31] <Unit193> Made some comments on the pad as well.  Also, re: ppas.  Can we remove all saucy and quantal packages?
[20:35] <knome> Unit193, see pad
[20:42] <knome> we could chat here too
[20:42] <knome> i talked with ochosi,
[20:42] <knome> and the idea is to make bluesabre the owner of that team, in a way or another
[20:43] <Unit193> Ooooh, then I can bribe him to add me.
[20:43] <knome> the reason why i raise this up is that if you go to http://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive , this is the default repository...
[20:43] <Unit193> I'm not saying that it's needed, just that that's what we used it for.
[20:43] <knome> yeah, it seems a bit ambiguous though
[20:43] <knome> especially it being the default repository, and it having that ambiguous description
[20:43] <knome> "here is something."
[20:44] <knome> even the "extra" name is a bit... ugh :)
[20:44] <knome> imo it would be better as "preview" or sth
[20:44] <knome> well, that's not good either
[20:44] <elfy> back
[20:44] <knome> but extra sounds like xubuntu-restricted-extras to me :P
[20:45] <knome> or sth similar
[20:45] <knome> it doesn't communicate "these are very prone to break your system"
[20:45] <elfy> I'd agree with 'preview' - communicates what they are
[20:45] <Unit193> "Extras" to me is stuff outside the official repository that may well be of interest to Xubuntu users.
[20:45] <knome> preview sounds like "beta" too
[20:46] <knome> Unit193, exactly.
[20:46] <knome> but since they are not really tested...
[20:46] <Unit193> Meh, kind of tested.
[20:46] <knome> yeah, i guess it kind of describes what the PPA is
[20:46] <knome> except we tell people not to rely on the PPA for features
[20:46] <knome> well, in the new description
[20:46] <knome> but that's how i see it anyway
[20:47] <knome> it shouldn't be a very stable repository
[20:47] <knome> i mean, stuff will either get included, or then not, and then it should be dumpe.
[20:47] <knome> +d
[20:48] <Unit193> Mid cycle updates, updates after release, easier uploading, etc, etc.
[20:48] <knome> but that's just how i see it, feel free to prove me wrong.
[20:48] <knome> but shouldn't those be by design in staging?
[20:49] <knome> how many times we have a new version of package X of which we are not sure if we want to land or not?
[20:49] <knome> well i guess there are use cases
[20:49] <knome> but from my POV, those are for staging anyway
[20:49] <Unit193> That more implies that it'll be in Xubuntu ${develRelease} rather than something you can install, or something that'll actually get updated after Utopic is released.
[20:49] <knome> "let's test if this new fix works"
[20:50] <knome> if it doesn't, of course it won't land
[20:50] <knome> but the intention is to land that
[20:50] <knome> and the point of the staging repository is to notice bugs..
[20:51] <knome> well maybe i should explain from where i'm coming from in larger scale:
[20:51] <knome> staging: anything we want to xubuntu, be it a new package, package version or a bug fix
[20:51] <knome> extras: anything we're considering to maybe include at *some point* (release: n+1)
[20:52] <knome> once a social decision is made to include something, it should theoretically be dropped to staging
[20:52] <elfy> ochosi: Toz is pointing people at core :)
[20:53] <knome> Toz?
[20:53] <knome> Unit193, ^ did what i just said make any sense to you?
[20:54] <ochosi> elfy: good good :)
[20:54] <knome> ochosi? ^
[20:54] <Unit193> knome: It's kind of the idea of 4.12 PPA, post release updates that won't get SRU'd.  Yes it makes sense, and tat's pretty much how we're doing it with extras, none of those (didn't know thunar-dropbox was going to) will make it to utopic, but maybe V.
[20:54] <ochosi> knome: sry, i haven't been following and have no time to read the backlog right now
[20:55] <knome> Unit193, sure, but xfce 4.12 is a special case, which is why it has a separate PPA anyway :)
[20:55] <knome> i'm not saying we should drop the xfce PPA's, they probably serve a good cause.
[20:55] <knome> but in the mindset we have, where does the "main"/default PPA stand?
[20:55] <Unit193> So, no.  There will be no updates one, I'll go back to doing that on my own. :)
[20:56] <knome> we can do an updates one, but then it should be called updates, not "ppa for xubuntu developers"
[20:56] <Unit193> Hah. :P
[20:56] <knome> and in the same mindset,
[20:56] <Unit193> I'd say 4.12 is "default".
[20:57] <knome> extras is like "alpha" to main/seed, where staging is like "beta" to main/seed
[20:57] <Noskcaj> knome, +1 to a updates PPA, that's sort of what i'm doing with ppa:noskcaj/xubuntu.
[20:57] <knome> Unit193, go to https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive
[20:57] <Noskcaj> And my thoughts exactly
[20:57] <knome> Unit193, you're redirected to the random ppa with random packages and an ambiguous description
[20:58] <knome> Noskcaj, that's not my interest in this discussion, nor something i'll decide, poke ochosi/bluesabre/Unit193 :(
[20:58] <knome> :) that is...
[20:58] <Unit193> Why poke me?
[20:58] <knome> dunno. you're doing something like that
[20:59] <knome> i just don't know how useful those PPA's are
[20:59] <knome> most of the important stuff should be SRU'd or in the proposed or whatever repo
[20:59] <Noskcaj> I poked bluesabre, he copied most of it to the 4.12 ppa
[20:59] <knome> for non-LTS releases, the support window is now 9 months so it makes no sense to backport/land a lot of updates
[21:00] <Unit193> Depends, if you have to do all the SRU paperwork, I'd agree.
[21:00] <knome> Noskcaj, right, but that's 4.12 stuff, so it's a different story
[21:00] <skellat> edrrrrrr
[21:00]  * skellat didn't realize his cat wanted to use IRC just moments ago
[21:01] <Unit193> elfy: Also, yes.  Mini's do tend to take heck of a long time...
[21:02] <knome> Unit193, of course it depends on how important the patch/update is. but if it isn't important enough to get it in the main repositories (whatever pocket), i'm not sure if it's important enough for an official (though unsupported) PPA..
[21:02]  * Unit193 shrugs.
[21:02] <knome> yeah, i don't have the answer either...
[21:03] <brainwash> Noskcaj: I did not attach any debdiff to the MRE request for xfdesktop4, it's basically the package from utopic with a different version string and build target, or?
[21:04] <Unit193> Basically, I'm not sure how much I agree but it's an easy enough workaround that I don't have to care.
[21:05] <knome> i'm most interested in the fact that each PPA has a good enough purpose AND the appropriate description so that end-users who end up in the PPA page in any possible way, will KNOW what the PPA is for and understands what they can expect from the PPA
[21:05] <knome> considering they read the description; if not, then they are lost souls anyway
[21:05] <brainwash> Noskcaj: oh, the changelog needs to be changed too, so it auto closes the lp reports... which need to be re-opened for trusty.. what a mess
[21:06] <Unit193> knome: Yes, that part of course sounds like a plan.
[21:07] <elfy> sounds like a topic or sticky ... 
[21:07] <elfy> :p
[21:07] <knome> also, if there is overlap between PPA's, that should be removed to clear out all possible confusion, for users, developers, testers or anybody else
[21:08] <Noskcaj> brainwash, You branch lp:ubuntu/trusty/xfdesktop4 , then do the least possible changes, then make a -0ubuntu0.1 release
[21:08] <Noskcaj> Can you do it or do you want me to?
[21:09] <brainwash> Noskcaj: branch the trusty branch?
[21:09] <Noskcaj> yeah. We want as few changes as possible
[21:10] <brainwash> I thought that we just pick the utopic release and basically backport it
[21:12] <brainwash> or do you want to cherry pick the patches?
[21:13] <brainwash> sru vs mre
[21:13] <brainwash> I'm confused
[21:15] <Noskcaj> Both are the same, you modify the trusty branch.
[21:15] <Noskcaj> So in this case, just put the debian/ into the new release's tarball, then updat the changelog
[21:16] <brainwash> I can try that
[21:20] <Noskcaj> or bzr branch lp:ubuntu/trusty/xfdesktop4 && cd xfdesktop4 && bzr merge-upstream && dch -v 4.11.7-0ubuntu0.1 && bzr diff
[21:26] <Unit193> knome: So in your model, where do skippy-xd, xfce4-soundmenu and xfdashboard go?  I'd think extras because they target "Maybe in N+1 or +3", but just wonderin'.
[21:27] <knome> Unit193, if there is no social decision that they "will be" in a release, then they should be in extras
[21:28] <knome> everything that is in any other place than the "default ppa" is in the right place from my POV atm
[21:28] <Unit193> Great.
[21:28] <knome> the descriptions are just a bit bad, and without your description for the "default ppa", i wouldn't know what it was for
[21:29] <knome> so for that kind of situations, i'd just create a new sandboxed PPA :)
[21:34] <Unit193> #action bluesabre to update the descriptions, remove the "default" repo, remove all saucy and quantal packages, and add Unit193 to xubuntu-dev.
[21:34] <Unit193> :-------------------------_D
[21:36] <knome> hah!
[21:36] <Noskcaj> Also add Noskcaj
[21:36]  * knome facepalms
[21:43] <Unit193> I think someone missed the trollface.
[21:48] <elfy> reported no desktop in livesession now bug 1366206
[21:49] <elfy> in case anyone tries 
[21:50] <Unit193> vbox too?
[21:50] <elfy> that is vbox
[21:50] <elfy> ought to say so in bug
[21:51] <Unit193> Checked, didn't see it.  OK.
[21:51] <elfy> it didn't say it :) I meant I ought to say so :)
[21:52] <elfy> well - I'm off now - night all