[01:34] <bluesabre> brainwash: still in progress, first fixes for lp 1320560 
[01:34] <bluesabre> first batch of fixes (utopic) uploaded here: https://launchpad.net/~smd-seandavis/+archive/ubuntu/lp1320560
[01:34] <bluesabre> the xscreensaver one might be minimized a bit more
[01:37] <bluesabre> bbl
[03:17] <writing_novel> Hello all
[03:18] <writing_novel> I am trying out Xubuntu and am unhappy with the mangling of the XFCE interface. The entire idea behind XFCE (originally) was to retain the GNOME2 look and feel, which stands absent in Xubuntu. Is there any way I can engage to normalize the XFCE back to the GNOME2 look it was created to represent?
[03:23] <skellat> Are you sure you haven't confused us with MATE?
[03:24] <writing_novel> NO. I was told that Ubuntu had an XFCE type interface and it was called Xubuntu
[03:24] <writing_novel> Mate is NOT ubuntu
[03:24] <writing_novel> I know that is a fact unless you are confused about it.
[03:25] <writing_novel> Mate is NOT an ubuntu product at all
[03:25] <writing_novel> if you read MATE's website you can learn that
[03:25] <Unit193> Nor is Xfce, Ubuntu uses it.
[03:25] <Unit193> https://ubuntu-mate.org/
[03:25] <writing_novel> you have entirely confused me
[03:26] <writing_novel> I am looking to run an actual Ubuntu system with a normal XFCE interface
[03:26] <writing_novel> thats all I want
[03:26] <writing_novel> is that possible?
[03:26] <skellat> Yes
[03:26] <skellat> To do that you would have to install from the minimal installer disc...
[03:26] <skellat> ...and then select the xfce4 metapackage
[03:27] <writing_novel> OK, I willing to do that!
[03:27] <Unit193> Quite, or you caan remove the Xubuntu packages and reset your config, normally by deleteing ~/.config/
[03:27] <writing_novel> I do not know what packages to remove
[03:28] <skellat> Unit193: That's usually a lot more catastrophic.  A clean install from mini.iso would probably be safest.
[03:28] <writing_novel> ok
[03:28] <writing_novel> I am willing to reinstall it
[03:28] <writing_novel> I am using a Virtual Machine to do it anyway, its no big deal
[03:29] <Unit193> skellat: Basically just xubuntu-default-settings, xubuntu-artwork, and xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin too for extra credit.
[03:29] <skellat> Unit193: That won't catch any Suggests that were installed, though, if memory serves.
[03:30] <writing_novel> I am trying to find this mini.iso thing on the website
[03:30] <writing_novel> no luck yet
[03:30] <Unit193> skellat: Suggests aren't installed, perhaps you mean recommends?  That'll still give you more of a stock Xfce.
[03:30] <Unit193> !mini | writing_novel 
[03:32] <writing_novel> Is there a CD I can download so I could do an install like that on a machine that were not internet connected?
[03:32] <writing_novel> that I could aggregate everything I needed to do an offline install?
[03:33] <writing_novel> brb - need to run to the washing machine
[03:39] <writing_novel> back
[03:40] <writing_novel> By the way the menu at the bottom is missing too!
[03:41] <writing_novel> (the "Mac like" menu I mean)
[04:52]  * Unit193 scratches head at gtk-theme-config.
[07:46] <knome> writing_novel, the "mac like" menu you are asking for is not in the default xfce installation, nor in the default xubuntu installation.
[07:46] <knome> writing_novel, fwiw, the idea behind xfce never was to retain the GNOME2 look
[08:08] <brainwash> bluesabre: does the xubuntu/xfce session export GDMSESSION?
[08:10] <brainwash> or lightdm
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> elfy: re: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/09/06/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t14:39 no you don't, that font isn't installed by default
[11:28] <slickymasterWork> you have to do it yourself. You can get it here: http://www.fontsquirrel.com/fonts/Bitstream-Vera-Sans-Mono
[11:39] <slickymasterWork> Unit193: what exactly does http://paste.openstack.org/show/cZed8nUINAyyEi0HxMKP/ do?
[11:48] <Unit193> Changes how and when the validation is run?
[11:49] <slickymasterWork> lol, are you asking me?
[11:49] <slickymasterWork> but I'm assuming that in relates to the translations, right?
[11:49] <slickymasterWork> s/in/it
[11:50] <Unit193> Mainly, but also validates the English ones now too.
[11:51] <slickymasterWork> ah, ok
[11:51] <slickymasterWork> thanks for the clarification U
[11:51] <slickymasterWork> Unit193: 
[11:51] <elfy> mmm - so why use that font
[11:52] <slickymasterWork> because that's what was considered the default template for all the xfce documentation elfy 
[11:59] <slickymasterWork> elfy: FWIW I've marked bug 1365815 as a duplicate of bug 1366206
[12:00] <elfy> slickymasterWork: I wish you hadn't - they are different bugs :)
[12:01] <slickymasterWork> hmmm, different in what way?
[12:01] <slickymasterWork> I think I'm able to revert it anyway
[12:01] <elfy> they are completely different things - 1365815 is just about there being no wallpaper at the try/install screen
[12:01] <elfy> I undid the dupe
[12:02] <elfy> and THAT bug is a dupe of one we had during trusty/saucy at times 
[12:02] <elfy> just can't find it :)
[12:03]  * slickymasterWork admits he's puzzled 
[12:03] <elfy> 1366206 is after you've worked around 1365815
[12:03] <slickymasterWork> yeah, I see that now
[12:04]  * slickymasterWork now sees the difference between the two
[12:05] <slickymasterWork> btw elfy, thanks for opening the xfpm bug
[12:06] <slickymasterWork> lunch time ->
[12:09] <elfy> slickymasterWork: seems that is a bug in vm only - unless you can say differently
[13:42] <Unit193> ochosi: https://launchpad.net/~unit193/+archive/ubuntu/xfce/+packages?field.name_filter=xfdashboard boop.
[13:43] <slickymasterWork> nopes elfy, I wouldn't. I'm also inclined to VM bug only
[13:49] <brainwash> speaking of bugs.. where are the people who test dev releases and report bugs? or is xubuntu 14.10 almost bug-free? :)
[13:50] <Unit193> I just test 'em, I don't report 'em.
[13:50] <Unit193> ...Nah, I just nag Sean about them. ;)
[13:52] <brainwash> so, even when apport appears, you simply click on the close button?
[13:55] <Unit193> Heh, kidding, I just don't like reporting, still do it.  Generally when it's apport, for some reason or another it's unreportable, so can't file one.
[14:06] <elfy> brainwash: I think there are about 5 people who test dev 
[14:06] <elfy> probably not a good idea to go there just now ;)
[15:04] <ochosi> Unit193: thanks, copied
[16:01] <slickymasterWork> knome ping
[16:01] <knome> slickymasterWork pong
[16:02] <slickymasterWork> just a quick doubt
[16:02] <slickymasterWork> I've merged yesterday jjfrv8 proposal -> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~slickymaster/xubuntu-docs/xubuntu-docs/revision/240
[16:02] <slickymasterWork> but it isn't showing in the brach, do you have any idea why
[16:02] <slickymasterWork> ?
[16:02] <slickymasterWork> s/brach/brach
[16:03] <slickymasterWork> sihg
[16:03] <elfy> :)
[16:03] <slickymasterWork> bah
[16:03] <slickymasterWork> branch
[16:03] <knome> what isn't showing?
[16:04] <slickymasterWork> jjfrv8's new string
[16:04] <knome> did you update the pot?
[16:04] <slickymasterWork> yeaps, revision 241
[16:04] <knome> revision 241 isn't available in the main branch
[16:05] <knome> only your own branch..
[16:05] <slickymasterWork> yes, correct, that's because the branches diverged, so I had to fix it
[16:05] <knome> i also see revision 242 on your branch, but not the main branch
[16:05] <slickymasterWork> I believe it was fixed with revision 242
[16:05] <slickymasterWork> so that's the problem
[16:05] <knome> main branch has revision 240 though...
[16:05] <slickymasterWork> how do I go about fixing that?
[16:05] <knome> main branch being lp:xubuntu-docs
[16:05] <knome> well get the main branch
[16:05] <knome> run the command
[16:06] <knome> and run: bzr push lp:xubuntu-docs
[16:06] <slickymasterWork> which command the commit one?
[16:06] <knome> *sighs* ;)
[16:06] <knome> first, get the latest main branch:
[16:06] <knome> bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs
[16:06] <knome> then, run the translation pot update script:
[16:07] <knome> ./scripts/get-pot.sh
[16:07] <knome> then do a commit
[16:07] <slickymasterWork> so far that's what I've done
[16:07] <knome> bzr commit -m "Update translation template"
[16:07] <slickymasterWork> and the push
[16:07] <slickymasterWork> then
[16:07] <knome> then push it to the MAIN branch:
[16:07] <knome> bzr push lp:xubuntu-docs
[16:07] <slickymasterWork> that's what I did knome 
[16:08] <knome> nope, you have pushed your changes twice to your own branch
[16:08] <knome> that is, lp:~slickymaster/xubuntu-docs/xubuntu-docs
[16:08] <knome> as we see at https://code.launchpad.net/~slickymaster/xubuntu-docs/xubuntu-docs
[16:08]  * slickymasterWork could almost swear that he pushed it to the main branch
[16:09] <slickymasterWork> ok, I'll go through the motions once again, when I get home
[16:09] <knome> but as we can see at https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/xubuntu-docs/utopic (alias lp:xubuntu-docs), there's no revision 241
[16:09] <knome> i can do that too
[16:09] <slickymasterWork> let me try to do it once again knome, just to see if I'm doing things correctly, or not
[16:10] <knome> done.
[16:10] <knome> sorry...
[16:10] <knome> you can do that the next time
[16:10] <knome> you did everything else correctly except the last bit
[16:10] <knome> note that if you have pulled from your own branch
[16:10]  * slickymasterWork is sad
[16:10] <knome> then the default :parent is that branch
[16:10] <knome> so if you want to force pushing to the main branch, you'll have to type lp:xubuntu-docs
[16:11] <slickymasterWork> yeah and the strange thing is that I don't have any doubts about the all process 
[16:11] <knome> :)
[16:11] <slickymasterWork> can't imagine what might have gone wrong
[16:11]  * knome shrugs
[16:11] <knome> everything else seemed to have gone with no problems
[16:12] <knome> since the commits were in your branch
[16:12]  * slickymasterWork scratches his head 
[16:14] <slickymasterWork> knome, this was the command I issued -> bzr commit -m "bla bla" && bzr push lp:xubuntu-docs
[16:14] <knome> yeah,
[16:14] <knome> something still went wrong...
[16:15] <slickymasterWork> I'm getting the idea that Unit193 is right about bzr
[16:15] <slickymasterWork> it's evil
[16:15] <knome> well it's probably true in some way with all version control systems
[16:15] <slickymasterWork> :)
[16:18] <slickymasterWork> knome, as you're at it, can you please also push to the main branch http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~slickymaster/xubuntu-docs/xubuntu-docs/revision/241
[16:18] <slickymasterWork> beacuse that's the one which have the updated changelog
[16:20] <knome> hrhrr :)
[16:21] <knome> done
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> you're a gentleman
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> (me bows
[16:22]  * slickymasterWork bows
[16:23] <knome> yw
[17:10] <pleia2> knome: all good for publishing donate page?
[17:11] <knome> i would probably consider the page title
[17:12] <knome> it's ok to put it in the navigation as "Donate"
[17:12] <knome> but as title, it's a bit meh
[17:14]  * pleia2 shrugs
[17:16] <pleia2> other suggestions?
[17:17] <knome> i would try to link it with "helping xubuntu"
[17:18] <slickymasterWork> knome, pleia2, sorry for stepping in, but why not "Donate now - Support Xubuntu" as a title?
[17:20] <pleia2> so the point of this page is that we don't actually accept donations but people really want a donate button
[17:20] <pleia2> as long as that's communicated, I don't care about the title :)
[17:21] <pleia2> I also don't know how to have a different link for title and link text
[17:21] <slickymasterWork> well, knome knows how to do that, for sure
[17:24] <knome> yep
[17:24] <knome> "Help us build Xubuntu?" ?
[17:24] <knome> err -?
[17:24] <knome> or create
[17:24] <knome> or sth
[17:24] <pleia2> how useful are any of these things really?
[17:25] <knome> it *looks* better than "Donate"
[17:25] <pleia2> money is kind of meh, we want contributors
[17:25] <knome> right
[17:25] <knome> well
[17:25] <slickymasterWork> that's almost our motto for contributors
[17:25] <knome> we do list contributing as an option
[17:25] <pleia2> but if all you have is money...
[17:25] <knome> so, in a way "donate" is not even appropriate
[17:25] <knome> "Help Xubuntu and friends" ?
[17:26] <pleia2> my problem with "help xubuntu.." is that it doesn't help a whole lot ;)
[17:26] <knome> i understand
[17:26] <pleia2> I don't want to steer them away from contributing
[17:26] <slickymasterWork> that does sound kinda of needy .
[17:26] <knome> "Don't help Xubuntu, but buy a better conscience"
[17:26] <pleia2> that's how you actually help xubuntu
[17:26] <knome> that's better then...
[17:26] <pleia2> lol
[17:26] <knome> "Give your money away"
[17:27] <slickymasterWork> most people do that this days
[17:27] <knome> "How to spend money but not help Xubuntu at all"
[17:27] <pleia2> "don't pour a bucket of ice water on your head"
[17:27] <slickymasterWork> lol
[17:28] <knome> somebody is riding on the elevator ALL THE TIME
[17:28] <knome> stupid person
[17:28] <knome> stupid sound
[17:28] <pleia2> same person?
[17:28] <knome> who knows
[17:28] <knome> but i'd imagine so
[17:28] <pleia2> haha
[17:29] <knome> "Donation options"
[17:29] <slickymasterWork> hey, why not "Pitch in"
[17:29] <knome> slickymasterWork, they are not pitching in in xubuntu
[17:29] <knome> *in the pleia2 voice*
[17:29] <knome> they aren't all really even donations.
[17:29] <pleia2> :P
[17:30] <knome> if you buy stickers, it's commercial activity.
[17:30] <slickymasterWork> well, they'd be endowing xubuntu with something
[17:30] <knome> unixstickers.com makes money out of it.
[17:30] <knome> then we might get some too
[17:30] <knome> for giving away
[17:30] <pleia2> it eventually results in something being donated to us :)
[17:30] <knome> so it doesn't really help us..
[17:30] <knome> i guess
[17:30] <slickymasterWork> that was my impression
[17:30] <knome> "yay, i got free stickers for all of my hard work since 2008"

[17:31] <slickymasterWork> lol, I'm going to redecorate now, finally 
[17:31] <knome> could make a shirt out of that
[17:32] <knome> "i contributed to foss for 6 years and all i got was the sticker sticked to this shirt (disclaimer: t-shirt self-paid)
[17:32] <knome> "
[17:32] <knome> i don't know
[17:32] <knome> what do we want to tell them?
[17:32] <knome> if "help xubuntu" isn't communicating the right thing, then "donate" isn't either
[17:32] <pleia2> the stickers help our marketing team, not our contributors
[17:32] <knome> maybe we should switch the content the other way
[17:32] <knome> talk about contributing first
[17:33] <knome> then "if you can't contribute..."
[17:33] <pleia2> sure
[17:33] <knome> then maybe we could call the page "help xubuntu..."
[17:33] <knome> does that sound any better to you?
[17:33] <pleia2> ok
[17:34]  * slickymasterWork still thinks that it sounds kinda of needy
[17:35] <pleia2> we are needy :D
[17:36] <slickymasterWork> :)
[17:36] <slickymasterWork> why not "Support Xubuntu..." knome ?
[17:36] <knome> because they are not supporting xubuntu...
[17:37] <knome> *in the pleia2 voice*
[17:37] <pleia2> my concern is that they'll click that instead of contribute
[17:37] <pleia2> but if we add contributing to the first line, it's ok then
[17:37] <elfy> if no-one can decide what this is actually about - then perhaps the decision should be whether to actually do it 
[17:37] <pleia2> plus I kind of wanted an obvious donate button, but I got out voted :)
[17:38] <pleia2> elfy: people on social media are always asking how to donate money, I don't want to advertise the bounty program without somewhere to point them
[17:38] <elfy> donate money to Xubuntu - they can do that at ubuntu.com - kind of
[17:38] <pleia2> elfy: yes, did you see the draft donate page?
[17:39] <pleia2> have to log in: xubuntu.org/?page_id=2712
[17:40] <elfy> yea I did 
[17:40] <elfy> don't particularly agree with the order
[17:40] <slickymasterWork> thing is that first paragraph clashes with what we intend to mean
[17:41] <slickymasterWork> in the title that is
[17:42] <elfy> title -> perhaps a question rather than statement 
[17:42] <elfy> Can I donate?
[17:42] <elfy> no - not exactly - but you could do this
[17:42] <pleia2> wfm
[17:43] <elfy> bountysource should be at the bottom though - that one 'might' help xubuntu - but on the other hand it might not as well 
[17:43] <slickymasterWork> yeah, that might be a good idea to go around the all issue
[17:43] <pleia2> elfy: could argue that for any of them
[17:44] <elfy> yea - but the Canonical one - we can get some - we just have never asked
[17:44] <elfy> stickers - if someone buys one we get a % of them
[17:45] <elfy> bounty - if someone gets money and we don't actually make any use of that - it goes to xfce not us
[17:45] <pleia2> for certain values of "us" (two of our members participate in it)
[17:45] <elfy> yea 
[17:45] <elfy> anyway - not really interested enough to argue anymore 
[17:46] <knome> heh
[19:58] <brainwash> Noskcaj: maybe we should wait until xfdesktop 4.11.8 is ready and mre it to trusty
[19:58] <Noskcaj> ok
[19:58] <brainwash> so we don't run into any regressions like https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11078
[19:59] <brainwash> which has a patch
[22:06] <Unit193> bluesabre: xfpm now supports 0.7.0, so changed the dep for the daily build to reflect this.
[22:14] <writing_novel> I am experimenting with "Ubuntu GNOME" to see how well it works in classic mode, the initial load of it (absent the installation of the fallback debs) still did not really give a basic GNOME2 style menu, but I will see what the fallback does, perhaps it will give me the full GNOME2 style menuization and that.
[22:15] <writing_novel> I have to say, it is nice to have a virtualized environment to test all this stuff!?!
[22:16] <writing_novel> Seems like Metacity wins the prize!
[22:17] <knome> writing_novel, unless you have a discussion that is related to xubuntu development, can you take it to an offtopic channel, like #xubuntu-offtopic? thanks.
[22:20] <writing_novel> Well I was testing it with standard Ubuntu, but yes, I had been working with Xubuntu earlier to see how XFCE would look. I was quite surprised to see that Xubuntu did not have a standard XFCE interface but something very bastardized.
[22:22] <writing_novel> Being interested to have a GNOME2 style interface, and seeing how close XFCE is on Debian, I presumed Xubuntu would instantiate similar functionality, however, it was shocking in the absence of such equitable function and I was met with that silly whisker junk. Thus, yesterday, I was asking here how to get a more standardized GNOME2 look from XFCE which most XFCE installs seem to yield.
[22:22] <writing_novel> shocking=shockingly
[22:23] <knome> i noticed the discussion, and even replied, but it isn't in the scope of this channel.
[22:26] <writing_novel> Well what the scope of the discussion was, was how to get a GNOME2 like interface, that is and was what I was asking from the start (yesterday), although initially, Xubuntu was my intended vehicle to arrive at that configuration.
[22:26] <writing_novel> But, again, I do appreciate everyone's input and I now know what I need to get the configuration I desire with Ubuntu
[22:27] <knome> if you need help in configuring xubuntu, you can ask the support channel #xubuntu
[22:27] <writing_novel> (woops, the initial discussion I referenced was in #Xubuntu not the devel group!)
[22:27] <writing_novel> I apologize I didn't even realize I had clicked in here
[22:27] <writing_novel> I much have been watching it yesterday
[22:27] <writing_novel> sorry
[22:27] <knome> that's okay :)
[22:28] <knome> and following/lurking in here is fine as well
[23:27] <bluesabre> Unit193: thanks, I need to upload lxpanel to the ppa, we have dependency wait on trusty
[23:28] <Unit193> Ahhh, right.
[23:28] <Unit193> Fun times.
[23:28] <knome> lxpanel? X|
[23:28] <bluesabre> xfpm build deps
[23:28] <knome> since when did we start maintaining lxde packages
[23:28] <bluesabre> because we are nice folks
[23:28] <Unit193> knome: xfpm lxpanel plugin, we/I had to fix lxpanel's package to include headers.
[23:28] <knome> bluesabre, DEP?
[23:28] <bluesabre> build-dep
[23:29] <knome> right...
[23:29] <knome> hr hr
[23:29]  * bluesabre goes to maintain gnome-something