[06:47] <popey> morning dholbach !
[06:47] <dholbach> good morning
[06:47] <popey> :D
[06:50] <dholbach> hello popey
[07:11] <Mirv> mzanetti: hey! you've submitted the upstream commit 'move loading of testability driver from QApplication to QGuiApplication'. now that our distro patch for tests enablement env var doesn't work anymore, could you potentially submit such a thing to the correct place?
[07:11] <Mirv> mzanetti: it was originally at https://codereview.qt-project.org/#/c/63026/ - the last time I will submit a patch from someone else as mine, since it never really progressed :)
[07:12] <Mirv> mzanetti: I guess for now, I can change the distro patch to add the same three lines in somewhere QGuiApplication instead
[07:12] <mzanetti> Mirv: wait
[07:12] <mzanetti> what do you want me to do?
[07:13] <Mirv> mzanetti: if it's trivial for you, submit something similar to https://codereview.qt-project.org/#/c/63026/ but that applies to current dev
[07:14] <Mirv> mzanetti: we have that as a distro patch (since that never went in), and I'm now trying to add the same environment variable support somehow to qguiapplication.cpp. but you would be better suited to answer any questions about the proposal.
[07:15] <mzanetti> hmm... am I?
[07:15] <mzanetti> :)
[07:15] <mzanetti> well, can try
[07:15] <Mirv> mzanetti: considering you've touched the code in question, surely yes :)
[07:15] <mzanetti> Mirv: I never submitted this actually
[07:16] <mzanetti> I only added the -testability flag to QGuiApplication, as otherwise only QApplication loads it
[07:16] <mzanetti> but iirc I failed to get any reviewers for that too
[07:18] <Mirv> mzanetti: moved, not added? https://codereview.qt-project.org/#/c/66513/
[07:19] <Mirv> so that got merged to 5.3.2, which is why the support for env var http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/8363327/ doesn't apply anymore
[07:19] <mzanetti> interesting
[07:20] <mzanetti> didn't know this got merged in the end
[07:21] <Mirv> mzanetti: ah, I see, quite a gap in between proposal and merging :) so I was thinking about http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/8363333/
[07:22] <mzanetti> yeah... I proposed this back I was in QA still
[07:22] <mzanetti> and I barely can remember it
[07:22] <Mirv> ok. maybe I can just update my proposal (or, Thomi's, but he didn't want to submit to upstream) and see if it would progress this time.
[07:22] <mzanetti> Mirv: well... I guess I can try to...
[07:22] <Mirv> mzanetti: you have much more credibility in there :)
[07:22] <thomi> hmmm?
[07:23] <mzanetti> I doubt that... but lets see
[07:23] <mzanetti> hi thomi :)
[07:23] <Mirv> thomi: you remember https://codereview.qt-project.org/#/c/63026/ ? ;)
[07:23] <Mirv> thomi: it's still a bit in progress!
[07:23] <Mirv> thomi: so next time you get to submit patch yourself :)
[07:23] <thomi> I love fast, responsive upstreams!
[07:25] <Mirv> mzanetti: actually, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/8363356/ is more according to the comments received. the only problem was that there were two commenters and they had differing suggestions.
[07:26] <thomi> I'll leave it in your capable hands.
[07:26] <Mirv> the other suggestion was to use qIsEnvironmentVariableSet("") instead
[07:31] <mzanetti> ok. I'll give it a try
[07:32] <Mirv> thanks!
[07:32] <Mirv> I can then eventually abandon my submittal
[08:35] <Mirv> right, loadTestability instead of load_testability, and I get a build even...
[08:40] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Country Music Day! :-D
[10:01] <romuill> Hi all! I use adb push to copy translations (.mo files) to the device, but something changed and all I've got is an error messages: device offile
[10:01] <romuill> any idea?
[10:06] <nhaines> romuill: adb is no longer available unless you set a PIN or passphrase and turn on developer mode (System Settings > About this phone > Developer Mode)
[10:07] <romuill> nhaines: I set a PIN code and activated Developer mode, but still got the error
[10:12] <Mirv> tsdgeos: could you give unity8 some testing with https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-019 , or are you already running with the patch?
[10:13] <tsdgeos> Mirv: i was already running with the patch
[10:13] <tsdgeos> since yesterday
[10:13] <tsdgeos> self compiled ftw
[10:14] <Mirv> tsdgeos: ok, that should be then good enough for unity8. thanks.
[10:16] <romuill> Can somebody help me? I set PIN code and Developer Mode, restarted the device and I've got the same error: device offline.
[10:41] <ybon> I don't get which channel I need to provide to "ubuntu-device-flash" to get the rtm promoted image, any hint? :)
[10:56] <nik90> ybon: ubuntu-touch/ubuntu-rtm/14.09
[10:56] <nik90> ybon: try out ubuntu-device-flash --list-channels
[10:56] <nik90> it shows all available channels
[11:09] <ybon> thanks nik90 :)
[11:10] <ybon> humm, Flashing version 1 from ubuntu-touch/ubuntu-rtm/14.09
[11:10] <ybon> I thought it was #41
[11:10] <nik90> hmm strange
[11:20] <ahmed___> ubuntu touch  can i  installing in any smart  phone  soon
[11:22] <anpok> yes for certain definitions of any
[11:25] <ahmed___> help me     can  i   root  any smart phone on ubuntu
[11:26] <popey> !devices | ahmed___
[11:26] <popey> that link tells you probably all you need to know
[11:27] <ahmed___> ubuntu supported    tecno phone
[11:48] <tvoss> nik90, around?
[11:49] <nik90> tvoss: hey, yeah
[11:49] <tvoss> nik90, had a chance to test the silo?
[11:49] <nik90> tvoss: I wasn't able to install it :/ last nite...I am going to give it a shot again now
[11:50] <nik90> tvoss: strangely before the new adb stuff, I was testing silos perfectly fine
[11:52] <nik90> tvoss: I will report back with the testing results in about 15-20 mins..I just tried adding the ppa again and it seems to work with phablet-shell
[11:55] <tvoss> nik90, ack
[12:11] <popey> nik90: you can manually add ppa's by adding the lines to /etc/apt/sources.list.d/foo.list if add-apt-repository is busted
[12:11] <nik90> popey: yes. I tried add-apt-repository again and it seemed to work with phablet-shell.
[12:12] <popey> ok
[12:51] <jgdx> Anyone have a good way to layout to dialogs that become really long?
[12:51] <jgdx> Dialogs does not seem to currently handle many stacked items at once.
[13:01] <nik90> tvoss: hey it doesn't seem to work
[13:01] <tvoss> nik90, some more detail would be appreciated :
[13:01] <tvoss> )
[13:01] <nik90> tvoss: in the process of explaining :)
[13:02] <sil2100> bfiller: hey!
[13:02] <nik90> tvoss: I clean wiped my phone and then installed a new clock package with some console debug statements. When I open the clock app, I got the location trust store prompt. I deliberately pressed Deny. However the source error output shows "No Error".
[13:03] <nik90> tvoss: I used the following code to print out the source error for different conditions http://paste.ubuntu.com/8364914/
[13:03] <tvoss> nik90, okay, let me see
[13:03] <ahayzen> Is there any reason why i should keep a bug reported against indicator-network via apport-cli private? (eg sensitive info in there?) or do all apport bugs go private first?
[13:04] <pitti> ahayzen: the latter; if you vet the stack trace or other info that it doesn't have sensitive, it's fine to make it public
[13:04] <nik90> tvoss: I have a test branch at lp:~nik90/ubuntu-clock-app/implement-location-finding
[13:04] <ahayzen> pitti, ok thanks :)
[13:04] <pitti> ahayzen: like your wifi passwords or so (unlikely for the indicator)
[13:05] <ahayzen> pitti, heh
[13:10] <tvoss> nik90, ah, interesting
[13:11] <tvoss> nik90, so, in the qtlocation source package: The error is initalized to NoError and not initialized with the error from the actual position source in qdeclarativepositionsource.cpp
[13:11] <tvoss> nik90, I set the error at construction, at which time I cannot emit a signal
[13:11] <nik90> tvoss: oh
[13:12] <tvoss> or better: I can emit a signal, but no one will be connected
[13:12] <tvoss> kalikiana, could you help out in patching the src package?
[13:15] <jgdx> kenvandine, hey, silo 1 from yesterday tested fine, btw.
[13:18] <gatox> kenvandine, hi
[13:19] <kenvandine> jgdx, thx!
[13:19] <kenvandine> hey gatox
[13:19] <kenvandine> gatox, can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/update_mgr_singleton/+merge/234420
[13:20] <gatox> kenvandine, hello... i was wondering if you could help me with something.... i have always have trouble trying to tests my system settings branches in the phone..... and  i was wondering how are you doing it, to see if maybe you are doing something different..... because i waste a lot of time to try to get this to build and test it
[13:20] <kenvandine> jgdx, i decided to hold off on the api bump branch, until we're sure the testplan is accurate
[13:20] <gatox> kenvandine, sure
[13:21] <kenvandine> gatox, sure... "testing" you mean finding updates to test?
[13:21] <kenvandine> not building it for the phone...
[13:21] <kenvandine> i wait for CI to build for me... which sucks
[13:21] <kenvandine> but to get updates, i figured out a nice trick
[13:21] <gatox> kenvandine, nono..... that part i can do it..... i mean run my branch on the phone
[13:21] <kenvandine> i unregister the latest version of some clicks :)
[13:21] <kenvandine> ah...
[13:21] <gatox> kenvandine, so..... waiting for CI and then installing the deb?
[13:21] <kenvandine> that's hard..
[13:21] <kenvandine> i wait for debs
[13:21] <kenvandine> yeah
[13:22] <kenvandine> i've spent so much time trying to get cross builds that work... and gave up
[13:22] <jgdx> kenvandine, ack. Get a look at the wifi branch? I've identified some issues, but the main lines seems to work.
[13:22] <gatox> kenvandine, yes!! me too......
[13:22] <jgdx> gatox, kenvandine me too
[13:22] <gatox> jgdx, :(
[13:23] <gatox> there is something really wrong with that :S
[13:23] <jgdx> I'll buy anyone who fixes that five beers
[13:23] <kenvandine> jgdx, the dialog branch right?
[13:23] <jgdx> kenvandine, yesh
[13:23] <kenvandine> i didn't get to look at it yet.. sorry
[13:23] <kenvandine> i'll do that this morning
[13:23] <jgdx> kenvandine, np. Thanks
[13:23] <kenvandine> gatox, so my branch fixes keeping the updates available count in sync with the updates page
[13:24] <kenvandine> it doesn't fix the issue with having it find updates after starting and changing visibility
[13:24] <kenvandine> i have a hack in there to use a timer, and do the checkForUpdates after 60s, but only if the model is empty
[13:24] <kenvandine> but i disabled it for now
[13:24] <gatox> kenvandine, i'll review it now
[13:25] <kenvandine> i figure with the timer, if you go into the updates page it'll populate the model and so we don't need to do it on start in the entry on the main view at all
[13:25] <kenvandine> and it'll show up if you initiate a check on the updates page or about page
[13:26] <kenvandine> but... for now i disabled the timer and have it check at start to match the current behavior
[13:26] <kenvandine> at least it fixes the count not matching the updates bug
[13:26] <jgdx> gatox, do you think you could add some transition magic to the "Updates available?" As a heavy Ubuntu System Settings user, I often mispress due to it's sudden appearance. :P
[13:26] <jgdx> s/it's/its
[13:26] <kenvandine> and i'll get some feedback from design on what to do at start
[13:26] <kenvandine> jgdx, we're going to resolve that :)
[13:26] <jgdx> wee
[13:26] <kenvandine> that's what i was just talking about :)
[13:27] <kenvandine> i experimented with deferring the check so it doesn't show up quickly
[13:27] <jgdx> the transition as well? nice
[13:27] <kenvandine> and chances are when you go into settings, you'll probably navigate into another page within 60s
[13:27] <jgdx> welllll
[13:27] <kenvandine> so you won't even see it when it appears, but it'll be there when you come back
[13:27] <jgdx> what if I see the badge and want to install the updates?
[13:28] <kenvandine> i know that's a hack too... but i figure it's better than what we have now
[13:28] <kenvandine> that takes you right to the updates page
[13:28] <kenvandine> actually...
[13:28] <kenvandine> the notification does
[13:28] <kenvandine> i don't know what happens from the launcher with the badge
[13:28] <jgdx> you just launch uss
[13:28] <kenvandine> if you open it from the push notification it takes you right to updates
[13:29] <jgdx> right, that's good
[13:29] <kalikiana> tvoss, nik90: so this is a qtlocation distro patch?
[13:30] <Laney> you want a s-i-dbus API which tells you if it already knows about an update without doing any remote operation
[13:31] <kenvandine> Laney, yeah, so right now we get an updateAvailableFound signal pretty quickly after doing the start
[13:31] <kenvandine> but not quick enough
[13:32] <Laney> yes, I think you want a method
[13:32] <kenvandine> a sync method?
[13:32] <Laney> I imagine you'd call it synchronously
[13:32] <kenvandine> but that method would need to happen outside of the plugin then
[13:32] <kenvandine> in whatever loads the entries
[13:33] <kenvandine> i think what we really need is to drop the entry complete and add a badge to the updates icon in the grid
[13:33] <Laney> why's that?
[13:33] <Laney> battery plugin does something like this
[13:33] <kenvandine> because of the dynamic visibility
[13:34] <kenvandine> the loader needs to determine visibility before it loads the plugin
[13:34] <kenvandine> or it'll load invisible until we toggle it
[13:34] <kenvandine> which is what happens now
[13:34] <Laney> it's done in the constructor which is blocking (AFAIK)
[13:34] <Laney> for battery
[13:34] <Laney> there's no jumping around there
[13:35] <kenvandine> i'll look at that
[13:35] <kenvandine> oh... i see
[13:35] <kenvandine> so in the constructor we call a sync method to set visibility
[13:35] <Laney> right
[13:35] <Laney> the behaviour you want is "do you already know about an update?" I think
[13:36] <Laney> not "go and find out if there is one"
[13:43] <gatox> kenvandine, +1 looks good
[13:43] <kenvandine> gatox, thx
[13:44] <tvoss> kalikiana, it would be in the worst case, just looking through the other plugins in the source package
[13:46] <sil2100> bfiller: so, we noticed that dialer-app is failing in ubuntu-rtm smoketesting for both mako and krillin
[13:47] <bfiller> sil2100: ok we'll take a look
[13:48] <sil2100> bfiller: thanks :)
[13:48] <bfiller> sil2100: might be related to this regression with snap deciosins https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ux/+bug/1368862
[13:51] <bfiller> sil2100: can you point me at the failures? seeing a lot of failures on dashboard across the apps. want to make sure I'm looking at the right links
[13:52] <sil2100> bfiller: sure, for instance here: http://ci.ubuntu.com/smokeng/utopic/touch_stable/mako/42:20140917:20140903.1/10510/dialer_app/
[13:55] <bfiller> sil2100: thanks
[13:57] <dobey> anyone know why i wouldn't be able to flash my nexus4? i keep getting errors about cache formatting or recovery image
[13:57] <dobey> like: 2014/09/17 09:48:56 Cache formatting was not successful, flashing may fail, check your partitions on device
[14:00] <dobey> 2014/09/17 09:59:53 Cannot cleanup /cache/recovery/ to ensure clean deploymentexit status 255
[14:00] <dobey> now that
[14:00] <dobey> i am lost :(
[14:05] <om26er> salem_, Hi!
[14:05] <om26er> salem_, did you look at bug 1370106 yesterday ?
[14:06] <salem_> om26er, sorry, I read the bug report but didn't have time to actually work on it.
[14:07] <om26er> salem_, can you look at that now, please.
[14:12] <dobey> 2014/09/17 10:12:05 Cannot push /home/dobey/.cache/ubuntuimages/pool/ubuntu-cbe7b905c3a6b174f5e650d248091dbb6d69a7ed68d2be650d4495f6cbaa1a4a.tar.xz.asc to device: free space on /cache/recovery is unknown
[14:12] <salem_> om26er, yes, just need to finish something else first.
[14:12] <dobey> what does that mean?
[14:12] <om26er> salem_, ok, btw I faced the crash again today :)
[14:15] <dobey> searching for the "free space on /cache/recovery" on ddg just gives me links to unanswered questions on askubuntu :(
[14:18] <dobey> wtf
[14:25] <dobey> if i try to adb push the ubuntu or device tar.xz, it just exits with no info at all. but the files aren't on the phone
[14:30] <mhall119> so many new goodies in r243!
[14:32] <dobey> 2014/09/17 10:32:12 Cache formatting was not successful, flashing may fail, check your partitions on device
[14:33] <dobey> how the heck can i get ubuntu back on this mako?
[14:34] <dobey> E:Can't mount /cache/recovery/ubuntu_command
[14:35] <dobey> weird
[14:35] <dobey> why is it trying to mount logs and such
[14:37] <om26er> jdstrand, Hi!
[14:40] <om26er> jdstrand, can you please look at bug 1369512 ?
[14:45] <kenvandine> jgdx, the dialog sizing when the OSK shown is awkward
[14:46] <dobey> whee, and now it's stuck at the android bouncy balls boot screen
[14:46] <kenvandine> jgdx, but i'm not sure what we can do about that when using a dialog
[14:46] <jgdx> kenvandine, yeah, it's really bad.
[14:46] <kenvandine> it is...
[14:46] <kenvandine> without the OSK it's nice :)
[14:46] <kenvandine> sigh...
[14:47] <kenvandine> we must have prior art for this
[14:47] <kenvandine> oh... look at the dialogs used in the various pin setting/changing pages
[14:47] <kenvandine> i think there is some hacks in there from mterry to adjust the size so they fit better
[14:47] <jgdx> kenvandine, I did, but can't see an immediate solution. It's just too long.
[14:48] <kenvandine> i copied/pasted his hacks :)
[14:48] <jgdx> :)
[14:48] <kenvandine> well if the dialog stays above the OSK, at least it can scroll
[14:48] <mterry> yeah I just shrunk the  spacing  :(
[14:48] <kenvandine> mterry, ok... so probably not enough for what we're doing
[14:48] <om26er> rsalveti, Hi! you work on powerd, right ?
[14:48] <mpt> jgdx, Wellark, abeato: I’m testing bug 1356239 and I notice that the IP address is in an editable text field. That isn’t right, it is? You can’t change your IP address just by editing a field
[14:49] <rsalveti> om26er: I did a few patches, yes :-)
[14:49] <rsalveti> om26er: what's up?
[14:49] <mterry> kenvandine, how big is your dialog!?
[14:49] <om26er> rsalveti, sometimes auto-brightness stops working and when I dial a call the screen does not turn off when I bring it near my ear.
[14:49] <jgdx> mpt, is it editable? Can you type in stuff?
[14:49] <om26er> that's on mako.
[14:49] <jgdx> mpt, no, you can't change the ip.
[14:49] <kenvandine> mterry, it's for connecting to a hidden wifi AP
[14:49] <om26er> rsalveti, My device is currently in that state, but powerd seems to be running fine i.e. didn't crash.
[14:49] <kenvandine> so varies
[14:50] <mpt> jgdx, huh, my mistake, the cursor flashes but I don’t get a keyboard
[14:50] <mpt> I guess that’s a toolkit bug
[14:50] <rsalveti> om26er: hm, but probably in a broken state, as it's the one responsible for the proximity sensor
[14:50] <jgdx> mpt, but right, that field isn't up to spec.
[14:50] <om26er> rsalveti, any logs that I could gather, right now ?
[14:51] <rsalveti> om26er: is it at least shutting off the screen after the call? (after the 60s timeout)
[14:51] <om26er> rsalveti, didn't try that but the screen does turn off on its on if I leave the device.
[14:51] <om26er> want me to test that ?
[14:52] <rsalveti> no, that means the basic things are working, can you start up another voicecall to see if proximity is still broken?
[14:52] <rsalveti> wonder if this was a side effect of another bug we had in mediahub
[14:52] <jgdx> mpt, fyi I have a branch coming up fixing the broken "Disconnect" behaviour in that same page.
[14:52] <rsalveti> that was leaving a suspend blocker and the screen was always on after that
[14:53] <jgdx> mpt, not sure if you filed a bug or not? /me looks
[14:53] <rsalveti> om26er: see if you can find a way to reproduce the issue, and please open a bug against powerd, adding your syslog and steps
[14:53] <rsalveti> om26er: and tag it to rtm14
[14:53] <mpt> jgdx, this is the first time I’ve seen this screen, so no :-)
[14:53] <om26er> rsalveti, the proximity sensor is not working.
[14:54] <om26er> rsalveti, the problem is random though. saw that twice in a week.
[14:54] <jgdx> mpt, ah
[14:54] <rsalveti> om26er: can you give me the output of 'powerd-cli list'?
[14:54] <rsalveti> yeah, it could be many things =\
[14:54] <om26er> rsalveti, System State Requests:
[14:54] <om26er>   None
[14:55] <om26er> the screen does turn on on incoming calls
[14:55] <rsalveti> right, then just the proximity that might be broken
[14:55] <rsalveti> maybe the sensor is not giving the right output, or a bug in powerd itself
[14:55] <mpt> jgdx, so I guess as long as bug 1286282 isn’t fixed, a read-only text field is the only way of making the value copyable?
[14:56] <jdstrand> om26er: done
[14:58] <jgdx> mpt, I could not find other ways, no. It could/will be styled to look like a listitem value, though.
[14:58] <om26er> jdstrand, it started happening recently, was there any policy change ?
[14:59] <om26er> jdstrand, 3 apps are affected.
[14:59] <jgdx> mpt, correction, will.
[14:59] <jdstrand> no policy change. perhaps an underlying change to mediahub
[14:59] <om26er> jdstrand, and the apps are trying to access the camera flashlight
[15:00] <jdstrand> om26er: that might be related. jhodapp, can you comment on that ^. torch apps wanting to use the camera flash light are requiring access to media-hub
[15:01] <jhodapp> jdstrand, that's weird...are they trying to play audio?
[15:01] <jhodapp> jdstrand, my guess is they have an Audio element in their QML
[15:02] <jdstrand> om26er: I will have an update to the camera policy group that allows access to the media-hub, but I'm surprised they need to talk to media-hub if they are only using the camera flash
[15:02] <jdstrand> om26er: can you respond to jhodapp?
[15:03] <om26er> jhodapp, jdstrand I don't think so. they are very simple apps, no sound
[15:04] <jhodapp> they'd have to, otherwise they shouldn't be getting media-hub
[15:04] <jhodapp> media-hub does nothing with the camera yet
[15:04] <jdstrand> I have one of those on the phone
[15:04] <jdstrand> let me look
[15:05] <jdstrand> om26er: is com.ubuntu.developer.majster-pl.utorch one?
[15:05] <om26er> jdstrand, the code for utorch is in lp:utorch if you want to inspect
[15:05] <om26er> jdstrand, yes
[15:07] <jdstrand> jhodapp: grep -ri audio ./* shows nothing
[15:07] <tvoss> nik90, mind updating
[15:07] <jdstrand> jhodapp: I'm guessing it is:
[15:07] <jdstrand>     Camera {
[15:07] <jdstrand>         id: camera
[15:07] <jdstrand>         flash.mode: utorch_main.torchOn ? Camera.FlashVideoLight : Camera.FlashOff
[15:07] <jdstrand>     }
[15:07] <nik90> tvoss: sure
[15:08] <jhodapp> jdstrand, oh I know why, because the click sound for camera is in qtubuntu-camera, which using the Camera object in QML would utilize
[15:08] <jhodapp> jdstrand, the real bug seems to be that we need to move the click sound out of qtubuntu-camera, and let each app play a click sound if they need it
[15:09] <jdstrand> yeah, that makes sense
[15:09] <jhodapp> tvoss, what do you think, this is a design/architecture decision ^
[15:09] <jhodapp> tvoss, see my last comment about moving the click sound out of qtubuntu-camera
[15:10] <tvoss> jhodapp, +1, if apps want, they can use QML's audio {}
[15:10] <jdstrand> this would also address the tagger and authenticator apps
[15:10] <jhodapp> indeed
[15:10] <om26er> jamesh__, Hi!
[15:10] <jhodapp> tvoss, ok thanks, I agree
[15:10] <jdstrand> which, I have not uploaded that policy yet
[15:10] <tvoss> nik90, thank you
[15:12] <jdstrand> jhodapp: so, based on your previous comment that actual access to the camera will be handled via media-hub, seems I should still upload my policy change for camera
[15:12] <jhodapp> jdstrand, which change exactly?
[15:12] <om26er> jdstrand, will that fix the apps not starting issue ?
[15:12] <jdstrand> jhodapp: but, in the future when apps want the click sound, they'll need to add the audio policy group
[15:12] <jhodapp> jdstrand, agree with that
[15:12] <om26er> jamesh__, can you please look into bug 1369539
[15:14] <jdstrand> jhodapp: the change to camera policy group:
[15:14] <jdstrand> +dbus (receive, send)
[15:14] <jdstrand> +     bus=session
[15:14] <jdstrand> +     path=/core/ubuntu/media/Service{,/**},
[15:14] <jdstrand> om26er: it should, yes
[15:14] <jhodapp> jdstrand, ah right, sounds good to me
[15:15] <om26er> jdstrand, should I move the bug to apparmor ?
[15:18] <tvoss> nik90, any luck?
[15:19] <nik90> tvoss: I just ran apt-get update and then dist-upgrade. But I don't see any new qtlocation or platform-api packages.
[15:19] <nik90> tvoss: I see qtubuntu-sensors though
[15:19] <nik90> is that it?
[15:19] <om26er> rsalveti, Can you tell if bug 1370091 is pulseaudio ?
[15:19] <taiebot> hey just coming back from abroad and still facing this bug. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1323837 . I would like to know if there was some little terminal hack which would let me enable my network from the phone. I am stuck with a useless phone every time i leave the UK and i have to ask my girlfriend for her phone to enable my simcard.
[15:21] <rsalveti> om26er: it's not, but let me update the bug
[15:21] <tvoss> nik90, our qtlocation plugin is part of qtubuntu-sensors
[15:21] <nik90> tvoss: ok..2 mins then :)
[15:21] <tvoss> nik90, ack
[15:22] <rsalveti> om26er: can you better describe why do you think it's currently broken?
[15:22] <rsalveti> om26er: just updated the bug
[15:24] <jdstrand> om26er, jhodapp: I rearranged bug #1369512 a bit for this
[15:24] <jdstrand> jhodapp: I assigned you to the qtubuntu-camera task, but feel free to adjust
[15:24] <jhodapp> jdstrand, that's perfect...can you tag that for rtm14 and for the 25th milestone?
[15:24] <jdstrand> jhodapp: I did just now
[15:25] <om26er> rsalveti, I think I was expecting the audio to fade-out/fade-in instead of just reducing down and increasing at once. And then the time after which it is turn-up is a bit long that I would expect.
[15:26] <rsalveti> om26er: right, that's because it takes a while for the dtmf stream to go off
[15:26] <jdstrand> jhodapp: there is a media-hub project task. I am unable to remove it
[15:26] <rsalveti> om26er: that can probably be worked on
[15:26] <rsalveti> om26er: yeah, the fading is not yet supported, but I know it's indeed a bit annoying
[15:27] <om26er> rsalveti, when I reported I was in a silent room with music at full so it annoyed me when it turned down and then came back to loud noise. I agree fading will make it better.
[15:30] <nik90> tvoss: bah my dist-upgrade is installing all sorts of language packs and generating locales for every one of them which is taking time :P. .will ping when ready
[15:32] <ogra_> dont use dist-upgrade on phones !
[15:32] <rsalveti> om26er: thanks for the bug report, will try to take a look at that hopefully soon :-)
[15:33] <rsalveti> after the critical bugs are gone
[15:33] <nik90> ogra_: I had to after installing a silo to install packages from the PPA :)
[15:33] <om26er> rsalveti, thanks
[15:33] <nik90> ogra_: or did you mean I should use apt-get upgrade instead?
[15:33] <kenvandine> barry, how would you feel about adding a synchronous method to system-image-dbus that i can call to see if there is already a known update?
[15:33] <ogra_> nik90, evem then, dont call dist-upgrade
[15:34] <davmor2> nik90: just install the silo packages it it safer
[15:34] <ogra_> nik90, no, upgrade only refreshes the package lists
[15:34] <kenvandine> barry, just returning a boolean and i can wait for UpdateAvailableStatus to get the details
[15:34] <ogra_> nik90, what davmor2 said ... apt-get update and then apt-get install the silo packages individually
[15:34] <nik90> davmor2: yeah I realise that now after all these locale generations which it has been doing for the past 10 mins
[15:34] <barry> kenvandine: you mean like Information()?  `man system-image-dbus` :)
[15:35] <nik90> ogra_: ack.
[15:35] <ogra_> if it would only locale generations :)
[15:35] <ogra_> *only be
[15:35] <barry> kenvandine: hmm, well, that doesn't give exactly whether there's a known update but it was added to provide a last check date
[15:35] <kenvandine> barry, that returns if there is a known update?
[15:36] <barry> kenvandine: that isn't really possible because trying to figure out if there is an update available requires a check with the server, which can be slow, so must be async.
[15:36] <kenvandine> i need to determine if the updates-available entry needs to be visible or not when the main view loads
[15:36] <nik90> ogra_: :)
[15:36] <kenvandine> why?
[15:36] <kenvandine> barry, if we already have an emblem on the launcher, that there is an update available
[15:36] <kenvandine> s-i-d should know without doing a check right?
[15:37] <kenvandine> barry, right now in that scenario, we get the updateAvailableStatus signal quickly, which is good... but we can't block loading of the entry on that
[15:37] <barry> kenvandine: no, i don't think so.  it has to check with the server, get teh blacklist keyring, check the signatures etc
[15:38] <kenvandine> barry, i need a really quick check to see if we already know
[15:38] <barry> kenvandine: so the response would be: 1) yes, there is at least an update available, but it might not be the latest; 2) i can't tell, i have to check the server
[15:39] <kenvandine> right, but not do the check
[15:39] <kenvandine> unless i ask
[15:39] <barry> kenvandine: asking would be calling CheckForUpdate
[15:39] <kenvandine> right
[15:40] <nik90> tvoss: ping (good and bad news)
[15:40] <kenvandine> barry, i'll call the checkForUpdate a little later
[15:40] <tvoss> nik90, shoot
[15:40] <barry> kenvandine: right now, we don't cache the information about whether an update is available, so that would be a new feature request.  i would have to think about it some more, do some experiments, etc.  could you open a wishlist bug on system-image (upstream)?
[15:40] <kenvandine> but i want to determine visibility on load
[15:40] <kenvandine> barry, so what adds the emblem to the launcher icon?
[15:41] <nik90> tvoss: so the good news is that when I "deny" clock app access in the location trust store, then it shows the correct source error "do not have permissions to access service...".
[15:41] <barry> kenvandine: i'm not sure since i don't know the system-settings code, but i do believe they call CFU and wait for the UAS signal
[15:41] <nik90> tvoss: bad news is that when I stop the location-service by "sudo stop ubuntu-location-service" and then restart clock app, I get the same error instead of the "location service is disabled error"
[15:41] <kenvandine> barry, when the emblem is there that there is a pending update, i do get the signal from s-i-d very quickly, so it shows the entry less than a second after loading
[15:41] <kenvandine> barry, system-settings doesn't add the emblem
[15:42] <taiebot> awe: trying to find a workaround on #1323837 i am currently not able to connect to my GSM operator due to a recent travel abroad. I have notice that the status in the ./list-operators of my operator says forbidden is there anyway i can override this to available?
[15:42] <nik90> tvoss: so PositionSource.ClosedError signal is not being fired
[15:42] <kenvandine> something in the shell does
[15:42] <Laney> DownloadUpdate() has the documentation "No-ops if … CheckForUpdate() was not called first"
[15:42] <Laney> So I belive s-i-dbus stores the information about available updates somehow
[15:42] <barry> Laney: if an update has been downloaded previously, and it's still valid (after a check) then it won't be redownloaded
[15:43] <barry> but the check still occurs
[15:43] <taiebot> ls
[15:43] <barry> that *can* be pretty fast, but i know when i've tailed the si log file, i see the check activity happen pretty soon after swiping in
[15:44] <jhodapp> ogra_, MTP should not mount when toggling off developer mode, right?
[15:44] <jhodapp> ogra_, automount
[15:44] <nik90> tvoss: another good news is that my location was detected in about 3-4 secs using AGPS :)
[15:44] <tvoss> nik90, perfect
[15:44] <Laney> barry: The docs make it sound like in manual mode you need to check before downloading
[15:44] <ogra_> jhodapp, sure it should, dev mode shouldnt affect mtp functionality at all (except that the gadget needs to be reconfigured which forces a disconnect)
[15:45] <awe> taiebot, I don't really understand how you intend to workaround that bug:
[15:45] <barry> within a single si-dbus process, it will cache the last check, but that isn't cached on disk so it won't survive an si-dbus suicide
[15:45] <awe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1323837
[15:45] <awe> ( I like real bug URLs )
[15:45] <jhodapp> ogra_, ah, I don't know how it works so just making sure
[15:45] <kenvandine> barry, i see...
[15:45] <jhodapp> ogra_, seemed weird to me
[15:46] <kenvandine> does s-i-d exit after some inactivity?
[15:46] <awe> taiebot, when running list-operators, are you running as root?
[15:46] <ogra_> jhodapp, what exactly ?
[15:46] <barry> Laney: that's correct.  you always have to check explicitly.  in auto-mode it will download if the check finds an update, so that a subsequent DownloadUpdate will essentially noop.  in manual mode the DU does the download if an update is available
[15:46] <taiebot> awe: no as phablet
[15:46] <awe> taiebot, maybe you could try and describe what you're trying to do in an email?
[15:46] <jhodapp> ogra_, I can't seem to adb shell in on rtm image 46
[15:46] <barry> kenvandine: yes
[15:46] <awe> taiebot, that won't work
[15:46] <barry> kenvandine: 10m by default iirc
[15:46] <ogra_> jhodapp, dev mode enabled and pin/pw set ?
[15:46] <jhodapp> ogra_, just that the nautilus dialog pops up when I turn developer mode on
[15:46] <jhodapp> ogra_, yes
[15:46] <ogra_> are you sure ?
[15:46] <kenvandine> barry, ok, so the feature request would be to cache that on disk and add a sync function to check it
[15:46] <barry> kenvandine: with si 2.4 (waiting for a silo now) it will also exit on any internal exception in the dbus api
[15:46] <awe> taiebot, are you working on a High or Critial bug related to this?
[15:46] <jhodapp> possitive
[15:47] <Laney> barry: so you need to DownloadUpdate() before it times out I guess
[15:47] <jhodapp> positive
[15:47] <ogra_> jhodapp, works here on 244 (which is identical but mako)
[15:47] <jhodapp> ogra_, I typed in the pin to unlock the screen, and I just toggled developer mode off then on
[15:47] <ogra_> and there were no changes in the last three images that could affect it ...
[15:47] <jhodapp> ogra_, I think bfiller sent an email expressing a similar problem on krillin
[15:48] <barry> Laney: in manual mode, yes.  in auto-mode, if there's an update available and it gets auto-downloaded, then si-dbus exits, and re-activated, it *will* recheck with the server, but if the downloaded files are still valid, it will not re-download them
[15:48] <jhodapp> ogra_, adb shell just sits and hangs
[15:48] <kenvandine> barry, btw, great job on the API docs... i was pleasantly surprised to fine them :)
[15:48]  * Laney nods
[15:48] <barry> kenvandine: \o/
[15:48] <jhodapp> ogra_, and the ssh server is not running
[15:48] <ogra_> jhodapp, dont use the password link from the dev mode page in system settings, there is a bug open for that
[15:48] <ogra_> jhodapp, indeed, why would we run an ssh server
[15:48] <Laney> The u-s-s usecase is that there we want to know if we already know about an update, but not to actually go off and find out ourselves
[15:49] <jhodapp> ogra_, well I had it auto starting
[15:49] <Laney> so something like what kenvandine is asking for is right I think
[15:49] <ogra_> jhodapp, nothing in the image would/could change that
[15:49] <kenvandine> barry, Laney: i'll file the bug
[15:49] <Laney> if it's cleared e.g when an update is applied and so on
[15:49]  * Laney nod
[15:50] <barry> kenvandine: i'd say the new feature would be to add a "quick check for update" feature that wouldn't hit the server.  not entirely sure how i'll implmenent that or return a response, but i can work that out.  do mention that you want "quick check" to be synchronous"
[15:50] <kenvandine> barry, or... can i just add s-i-d to the current settings bug
[15:50] <ogra_> jhodapp, there was a bug in phablet shell that stopped sshd ...did you use phablet-shell ?
[15:50] <barry> kenvandine: what's the bug#?
[15:50] <jhodapp> ogra_, no
[15:50] <Laney> 'synchronous' just means a method with a return value
[15:50] <Laney> it's up to the client to call it sync or async
[15:50] <barry> right
[15:50] <ogra_> then i dont understand how a persistent property wouldnt be set anymore ... there is no code that could unset or even touch it
[15:51] <jhodapp> ogra_, ok, so unsetting the pin and then resetting it from system settings allows me to adb shell in now
[15:51] <jhodapp> ogra_, must have been that bug you mentioned
[15:51] <barry> Laney: iow, from the service side, it returns the results immediately rather than sending them in a signal
[15:51] <ogra_> jhodapp, yeah, the password page from dev mode behaves a bit badly
[15:51] <Laney> barry: yep
[15:51] <taiebot> awe: As explained in the bottom of the bug when i go abroad i can not access any GSM network as i need to trigger my simcard to roam and this can only be done via the sim toolkit. I am only looking for a work around i do not have the skills to do this myself. I understand you are busy and this is not top of your list but i would appreciate if i could solve this manually via the terminal.
[15:51] <jhodapp> ogra_, seems to...that's a bad bug :)
[15:51] <ogra_> jhodapp, though i still dont get why ssh would be disabled ...
[15:51] <kenvandine> barry, bug 1355803
[15:51]  * barry looks
[15:52] <jhodapp> ogra_, not a big deal, I can re-enable it now myself
[15:52] <ogra_> jhodapp, in any case "android-gadget-service enable ssh" from the terminal app should get it back for you
[15:52] <tvoss> nik90, the closederror thingy is a subtask
[15:52] <ogra_> next time :)
[15:52] <nik90> tvoss: subtask?
[15:52] <tvoss> nik90, as long as your receive the error signal, we are good
[15:52] <nik90> tvoss: yup
[15:53] <tvoss> nik90, making sure that certain error conditions are reported correctly @subtask
[15:53] <jhodapp> ogra_, never heard of android-gadget-service...different than doing sudo start ssh?
[15:53] <tvoss> nik90, which image and device did you test on?
[15:53] <barry> kenvandine: please create a new bug.  we can cross-reference them, but i don't want si-dbus discussions to intermingle with ux discussions
[15:53] <awe> taiebot, I'll discuss with some of my co-workers tomorrow and will update the bug
[15:53] <kenvandine> barry, ok
[15:53] <ogra_> jhodapp, ssh, adb, rndis and a few other things are handled via properties ... sudo ssh start only starts it til reboot
[15:53] <awe> we have a weekly hangout for telephony/network, so I'll put it on our agenda
[15:53] <nik90> tvoss: Mako, image 244
[15:54] <tvoss> nik90, thanks
[15:54] <nik90> tvoss: thnx for the fix :)
[15:54] <tvoss> nik90, sure
[15:54] <jhodapp> ogra_, ah, so android-gadget-service also makes it auto start...nice
[15:54] <ogra_> jhodapp, android-gadget-service is a dbus service providing user access to these properties
[15:54] <barry> kenvandine: thanks!  also, please indicate whether this is rtm-worthy or not.  i hadn't currently planned on much more work after 2.4 for rtm
[15:54] <kenvandine> barry, i think it's a must for rtm
[15:54] <jhodapp> ogra_, very nice
[15:54] <barry> kenvandine: ack
[15:54] <ogra_> :)
[15:54] <taiebot> awe: thanks will keep an eye  on it
[15:54] <kenvandine> i'll have it tagged appropriately
[15:55] <barry> kenvandine: awesome
[15:55] <ogra_> jhodapp, i'll create a DeveloperMode wikipage on the weekend describing all the bits and pieces
[15:55] <jhodapp> ogra_, sounds good, thanks!
[15:58] <nik90> MacSlow: ping
[15:58] <Laney> hah, just saw who filed that bug :-)
[16:00] <barry> btw, do we have a standing FFe for phone stuff?
[16:00] <Laney> no(t yet)
[16:00] <barry> maybe we will by the time i add this new feature :)
[16:00] <Laney> sil2100 was looking at that a little while ago
[16:00] <kenvandine> barry, bug #1370586
[16:01] <kenvandine> pmcgowan, ^^^ can you set the appropriate priority?
[16:01] <barry> kenvandine: thanks
[16:01] <sil2100> barry: if you feel strong enough, feel free to fill in the FFe ;) We should have it but no one did that yet
[16:01] <sil2100> barry: I wanted to do that too but I'll only have time tomorrow
[16:02] <MacSlow> nik90, what's up?
[16:02] <pmcgowan> kenvandine, you proposing for rtm blocker?
[16:02] <nik90> MacSlow: hey I saw the new design for notifications for alarm at https://imgur.com/2Fu8Cg7
[16:02] <kenvandine> pmcgowan, i think design would think so :)
[16:02] <nik90> MacSlow: 2 questions..
[16:02] <kenvandine> pmcgowan, but i'll let you decide :)
[16:02] <barry> sil2100: i don't yet, but if i get to kenvandine's bug before then, i will probably do one for system-image at least
[16:02] <barry> sil2100: i'm calling 2.4 a bug fix release :)
[16:02] <nik90> MacSlow: Is it by design we show the ubuntushape border for the alarm icon?
[16:03] <sil2100> hah ;)
[16:03] <nik90> MacSlow: also does both buttons have to be without color?
[16:03] <MacSlow> nik90, no that's a "bug" of that notification not using the x-canonical-non-shaped-icon hint
[16:03] <MacSlow> nik90, same for hte buttons... notification isn't using the latest button-tint hints...
[16:03] <nik90> MacSlow: I remember you adding it to indicator-datetime though sometime back
[16:03] <nik90> MacSlow: ah
[16:04] <nik90> MacSlow: would you able to provide a fix for that in indicator-datetime? Or should I ask charles?
[16:04] <MacSlow> nik90, I've an example in lp:unity-notification/examples using the latest bits
[16:04] <pmcgowan> barry, kenvandine whats the target date for that, 9/25?
[16:04] <MacSlow> nik90, I'm to filled up... but I can help charles with it
[16:04] <nik90> MacSlow: ack
[16:04]  * barry defers to kenvandine 
[16:05] <kenvandine> pmcgowan, sounds good to me
[16:05] <pmcgowan> done
[16:05] <pmcgowan> you are committed
[16:05] <kenvandine> :)
[16:05] <nik90> MacSlow: cool, I will report a bug report and also branch the examples to see if I can help as well
[16:05] <charles> nik90, MacSlow, I'm pretty sure indicator-datetime does set an x-canonical-non-shaped-icon hint already; I'll confirm
[16:06] <MacSlow> nik90, charles: the two-over-one button layout is possible too by now... not sure if you say one of the more recnet screencats I did showing that off
[16:07] <charles> MacSlow, no, I didn't see that. url?
[16:07] <nik90> MacSlow: we got "Snooze" for alarms now. :)
[16:07] <nik90> MacSlow: so I am cool with 2 actions
[16:08] <MacSlow> charles, nik90: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXvTBWcnTI1M1n66KdFJRyakGlANTTbfQ
[16:08] <MacSlow> charles, nik90: check video "preview 22"
[16:08] <nik90> MacSlow: preview 24?
[16:08] <nik90> ah ok
[16:09] <MacSlow> charles, nik90: the two-over-one example can be found in lp:unity-notifications/examples/sd-example-event-reminder.py
[16:10] <MacSlow> charles, nik90: or am I mixing up calendar-triggered notifications with clock-triggerd notifications
[16:10] <MacSlow> charles, nik90: anyway... it's all possible now
[16:13] <nik90> MacSlow charles: It is supposed to look like https://imgur.com/Y8SHGnw from what I see in the video (preview 22 00:48)
[16:13] <charles> MacSlow, where does NON_SHAPED_ICON_HINT get used in unity-notifications?
[16:14] <MacSlow> nik90, that's the latest I remember from Design... have not heard about changes to this
[16:15] <nik90> MacSlow: ack
[16:19] <nik90> charles: 1370594
[16:19] <nik90> charles: bug 1370594
[16:21] <charles> nik90, I'm a little unsure on what the fix for this is
[16:22] <charles> MacSlow, nik90, here's what indicator-datetime is passing to unity-notifications: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8365999/
[16:23] <charles> MacSlow, nik90, so it doesn't look like it's a lack of x-canonical-non-shaped-icon being sent
[16:25] <charles> MacSlow, what needs to be changed in http://paste.ubuntu.com/8365999/ to reach https://i.imgur.com/Y8SHGnw.png ?
[16:27] <MacSlow> charles, doing that in d-feet?
[16:27] <charles> MacSlow, also the only place I see NON_SHAPED_ICON_HINT being used in unity-notifications/src/ is in NotificationServer::GetCapabilities(), where is it actually used to change the appearance?
[16:28] <charles> MacSlow, dbus-monitor
[16:28] <charles> MacSlow, I don't know of a way to run d-feet on the phone; would be happy to be wrong about that :)
[16:29] <MacSlow> charles, ah ok... in lp:unity-notifications is only used to indicate its support/availability... actual code affected by it is in lp:unity8 (notification-renderer)
[16:29] <charles> MacSlow, thanks for that :)
[16:29] <MacSlow> charles, you can get the examples from lp:unity-notifications to run on the phone...
[16:30] <MacSlow> charles, bzr branch lp:unity-notifications (on the phone) and a few python-related dependencies and you good to go to play with all the provided examples
[16:30] <MacSlow> charles, I never used dbus-monitor that extensively to know how to exercise all notification-feautures
[16:31] <MacSlow> charles, you will have to enable developer-mode and make the phone-image writable to be able to apt-get things these days
[16:32] <charles> naturally
[16:32] <MacSlow> charles, if you run into issues... ask... I'll be here a bit longer still
[16:32] <charles> nik90, MacSlow, ok, looking at the unity8 code, looks like the needed key is 'x-canonical-private-button-tint'
[16:32] <MacSlow> charles, nope... that's old
[16:33]  * charles does a bzr pull
[16:33] <MacSlow> charles, since design wanted to have positive and negtive buttons be tintable individually there are new hints...
[16:33] <charles> x-canonical-private-affirmative-tint
[16:34] <MacSlow>  and "x-canonical-private-rejection-tint"
[16:34] <MacSlow> correct
[16:34] <charles> MacSlow, ok, thanks for that. I'll test that out; what was throwing me off was your saying the problem was a missing x-canonical-non-shaped-icon
[16:34] <MacSlow> charles, sorry for the confusion
[16:34] <charles> all good now
[16:35] <MacSlow> charles, but weren't you also having issues with getting rid of the ubuntushape masking on the icon?
[16:37] <charles> MacSlow, with http://paste.ubuntu.com/8365999/ I'm still seeing the border around the icon as in https://i.imgur.com/2Fu8Cg7.png
[16:39] <MacSlow> charles, hm... just guessing... make the variant boolen true variant string "true"
[16:39] <MacSlow> charles, I'm explicitly checking for the hint-value to be "true"
[16:39] <charles> MacSlow, I'll test that
[16:40] <charles> MacSlow, if that's the problem, it's a bug
[16:41] <MacSlow> charles, there was a reason to go for explicit string-hints for those...
[16:41] <charles> MacSlow, that's done for the affirmative and rejection tint checks too
[16:41] <MacSlow> charles, correct
[16:42] <charles> MacSlow, that's so wrong :-)
[16:42] <MacSlow> charles, there was a reason for it... I currently don't recall which
[17:29] <Geniack_> hello
[17:29] <Geniack_> i am trying to get ubuntu touch running on my nexus 10
[17:29] <Geniack_> following this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/DualBootInstallation instructions
[17:30]  * ogra_ doesnt think dual boot has ever worked with N10
[17:30] <Geniack_> i've choose "utopic-customized" even though there was several flavours of "utopic" (as suggested in the article), problem now is that i can see the ubuntu logo spinning but it seems to take ages for the system to come up
[17:30] <Geniack_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices#Working_with_phablet-flash
[17:31] <Geniack_> nexus 10 is listed
[17:31] <ogra_> for native installss, yes
[17:31] <Geniack_> "native installs" ?
[17:31] <ogra_> real installs
[17:32] <ogra_> non dual boot installs
[17:32] <Geniack_> whats the issue with dual boot ?
[17:32] <Geniack_> the kerneL?
[17:32] <ogra_> dunno
[17:32] <Geniack_> nice
[17:32] <ogra_> i dont use it and it was never officially supported ... i know it works for some people on nexus4 and 7
[17:32] <Geniack_> so i can probably sell the device
[17:33] <ogra_> the wiki clearly says that though
[17:33] <Geniack_> i mean
[17:33]  * dobey wants multiboot with different versions of ubuntu
[17:33] <ogra_> * A Nexus 4 device (other supported Nexus devices should in theory work but have not been tested at the time)
[17:33] <Geniack_> mmh
[17:33] <Geniack_> did you have a nexus 10 ?
[17:33] <ogra_> so all that was tested by the developers was N4
[17:33] <Geniack_> *do
[17:34] <ogra_> i know that some people ran it on N7 and chatted about that here
[17:34] <ogra_> yes, but i do work on it
[17:34] <ogra_> and done plan to flsh any android
[17:34] <Geniack_> you work on your nexus?
[17:34] <ogra_> *dont
[17:34] <Geniack_> ah
[17:34] <Geniack_> you run only ubuntu on your tablet?
[17:35] <ogra_> sure, and on my phone
[17:35] <Geniack_> mmh
[17:35] <ogra_> it is hard to develop an OS you dont run :)
[17:36] <Geniack_> but i fear ubuntu touch is so much touch optimized
[17:36] <Geniack_> i was planning to have an android
[17:36] <Geniack_> and a normal ubuntu/whatever linux dual boot
[17:36] <Geniack_> with a keyboard
[17:36] <ogra_> because android is more desktop optimized ?
[17:36] <Geniack_> to transform it into a real working machine
[17:36] <Geniack_> no its not
[17:36] <Geniack_> i just wasnt thinking about ubuntu touch
[17:37] <Geniack_> i have to research on that
[17:37] <Geniack_> maybe thats what i am looking for
[17:37] <dobey> it's still just a tablet. and those dual boot instructions are for running android and ubuntu touch, afaik
[17:37] <bdmurray> ev__: what happened with your whoopsie upstart change? http://paste.ubuntu.com/8357005/
[17:37] <ogra_> there are surely ways to connect a BT keyboard to it, there is just no support in the BT UI for this
[17:37] <ogra_> (in ubuntu)
[17:38] <Geniack_> the "touch addition" of ubuntu touch isnt just a desktop environment?
[17:38] <ogra_> ubuntu touch is the next gen desktop environment ... it just hasnt seen much work on the desktop side yet
[17:39] <Geniack_> ogra_: dont get me wrong, but i wouldnt be able to just install another WM and switch to it?
[17:39] <ogra_> no
[17:39] <mhall119> has anybody else had a problem adding a Facebook account on r243?
[17:39] <Geniack_> ogra_: why? ^^
[17:39] <ogra_> you would need a WM thats capable of using the Mir display server
[17:39] <mhall119> I deleted my old one and have tried 3 times now to add it back
[17:39] <ogra_> there is no X anymore
[17:40] <Geniack_> ah mir
[17:40] <mhall119> first time it froze at the account add screen (with the embedded facebook window)
[17:40] <mhall119> the next 2 times it took me back to the accounts list after pressing Login but the Facebook account wasn't added
[17:40] <Geniack_> now i know why i dont ubuntu touch
[17:40] <Geniack_> *need
[17:40] <ogra_> ?
[17:41] <mhall119> Geniack_: you want to use an X11 desktop window manager on a non-X11 phone?
[17:41] <ogra_> Geniack_, if i had said wayland (which wouldnt change a thing, it wouldnt work for you either) ... you would want ubuntu touch ?
[17:41] <Geniack_> i want to switch to a usable linux os with dualboot not another touch based media station
[17:42] <mhall119> heh, 4th time's the charm it seems
[17:42] <kenvandine> mhall119, i just added a facebook account on 244
[17:42] <mhall119> kenvandine: it finally worked for me, not sure what went wrong the first 3 tries
[17:42] <mhall119> Geniack_: a usable linux os on a phone that doesn't use a phone interface?
[17:43] <Geniack_> ogra_: naw i just dont want to be locked inside a blind alley
[17:43] <ogra_> whats blind about that ?
[17:43] <mhall119> Geniack_: it sounds like you're trying to fit a square peg into a round hole
[17:43] <Geniack_> mhall119: no, on a nexus 10 (which has a 10" display) connected with a keyboard
[17:43] <jenna_> hi, i'mm looking for some pointers in getting ubuntu-touch up and running.  i have a new-in-box nexus7 (flo) and i followed the steps on the ubuntu website to flash this os.  it finished without error and the tablet booted up to show the ubuntu screen with a progress bar and then kicked back to a custom recovery with a ubuntu logo.  now its stuck at the google logo at the very start of boot.
[17:44] <mhall119> Geniack_: ah, in that use case Unity 8 will gain a more traditional desktop-oriented window management
[17:44] <mhall119> that's not written yet, but that's the plan
[17:44] <Geniack_> mhall119: http://www.tabletaccessories.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/nexus-10-keyboard-case1.jpg
[17:44] <Geniack_> something like this
[17:44] <mhall119> Geniack_: yes, our goal is to make it work like Unity 7 when you plugin like that
[17:44] <Geniack_> yeah i think i saw this on some demo before
[17:45] <kenvandine> convergence!
[17:45] <Geniack_> ubuntu touch on the phone and once you plug it to something with a display and a keyboard it becomes desktop os
[17:45] <Geniack_> i like that
[17:45] <mhall119> yeah, we ran Unity (5? maybe 4) off an Android phone at one point
[17:45] <mhall119> we're working out to that, should be ready in a year's time
[17:45] <mhall119> working *our* *way* to that
[17:46] <kenvandine> for now at least you'd get a tablet optimized experience
[17:46] <Geniack_> ok can you tell me in the mean time how i can get gentoo running in dual boot on the nexus?
[17:46] <mhall119> Unity 8 has gained a few desktop features in the Unity Next ISO, but it's been mostly behind the scenes integration work so far
[17:46] <Geniack_> :P
[17:46] <mhall119> Geniack_: no idea, you'd need to get help from Gentoo on that
[17:47] <Geniack_> yeah sure ;)
[17:47] <mhall119> I know that we had X.org working on the 2012 Nexus 7, I don't know how much more work it would be to get it working on the Nexus 10
[17:47] <Geniack_> well i would be fine having only a shell in dual boot
[17:47] <Geniack_> without X even
[17:48] <mhall119> Geniack_: in that case you can probably just create a Gentoo chroot on top of Android
[17:48] <jenna_> does it matter that i have a 32GB nexus7 instead of 16GB?
[17:48] <mhall119> I think people have done that with Debian
[17:48] <mhall119> jenna_: as long as it's the 2013 non-3G model it should work
[17:49] <jenna_> ok, im trying the "ubuntu-device-flash --channel=devel --bootstrap" command again and see how far it gets
[17:52] <jenna_> :( it boots into a custom recovery and installs the rom and then reboots and gets stuck at the "Google" logo with the unlocked icon at the bottom
[17:52] <mhall119> jenna_: give it a bit of time
[17:52] <jenna_> shouldnt it jump to something besides the google logo?  i thought that just the bootloader?
[17:53] <mhall119> jenna_: if it's copied the new images over it takes some time to install them (I just waited on my nexus 4 at the google logo screen after a big upgrade)
[18:04] <jenna_> mhall119: how long are we talking?  its going on 10 minutes now.
[18:07] <mhall119> jenna_: hmmm, that is a bit long, you're not getting anything output from ubuntu-device-flash?
[18:09] <jenna_> this is the output.  http://pastie.org/private/pcbemrgqexfnk4stfzedyg
[18:10] <charles> nik90, https://code.launchpad.net/~charlesk/indicator-datetime/lp-1370594-refresh-notifications-to-match-design/+merge/235025
[18:10] <jenna_> when i boots into recovery, i can adb into it and look round.  but when its done installing, it just cant boot up.
[18:10] <nik90> charles: thnx a lot. Will test when jenkins produces a armhf deb.
[18:11] <charles> nik90, this fixes the two items you listed as "the main differences include..."  in #1370594
[18:11] <mhall119> ogra_: sergiusens: can either of you help jenna_? I've reached the limit of my knowledge
[18:11] <nik90> charles: yup that should be enough
[18:12] <charles> nik90, if there are other differences that need to be addressed, please add them to the ticket so that I can fix 'em
[18:12] <nik90> charles: will do
[18:12] <charles> nik90, if there aren't other differences that need to be addressed, please edit the bug ticket to say so :-)
[18:12] <nik90> charles: :-)
[18:13] <sergiusens> jenna_: mhall119 it's not clear to me if this is flo or grouper
[18:13] <jenna_> this is flo
[18:13] <mhall119> sergiusens: u-d-f identifies it as flo
[18:13] <sergiusens> jenna_: was your android userdata encrypted?
[18:14] <jenna_> i dont think it was.  this was a new-in-box tablet
[18:14] <sergiusens> mhall119: btw, we took extra care getting this properly written http://developer.ubuntu.com/start/ubuntu-for-devices/installing-ubuntu-for-devices/
[18:15] <sergiusens> jenna_: oh, then when in fastboot, can you try running fastboot format data and then fastboot format cache and then proceed?
[18:16] <jenna_> $ fastboot format data formatting 'data' partition... Formatting is not supported for filesystem with type ''. FAILED ()
[18:17] <jenna_> it worked for the cache partition.
[18:17] <mhall119> sergiusens: you mean it wasn't just copy/pasted from the wiki? :)
[18:17] <jenna_> fastboot format userdata works
[18:18] <cwayne> jenna_: new in box as in android was never setup? i remember that being an issue when we flashed for MWC
[18:19] <ogra_> yeah, you need to boot once into android ...
[18:19] <ogra_> it initializes the partition somehow IIRC
[18:20] <jenna_> i set it up far enough to enable adb
[18:20] <ogra_> you mean you enabled adb under android ?
[18:21] <ogra_> like ... you did it let put a key in place for the connection ?
[18:21] <sergiusens> mhall119: no, david calle was involved in making it human readable
[18:21] <sergiusens> :-)
[18:21] <sergiusens> jenna_: right; data/userdata; the one that works
[18:22] <ogra_> yeah, follow sergiusens
[18:23] <jenna_> sergiusens: that seemed to have fix it.
[18:23] <jenna_> i'm up to the velcome screen :)
[18:24]  * sergiusens reminds himself to add a bug to u-d-f to bring back formatting
[18:24] <ogra_> ++
[18:24] <sergiusens> it spawns some issues with broken devices... but those are broken already :-P
[18:24] <ogra_> right
[18:28] <mhall119> jenna_: enjoy :)
[18:28] <mhall119> thanks sergiusens
[18:32] <sergiusens> np
[18:33] <mhall119> oh, "External Drives"....that's new
[18:34] <mhall119> oh, right, no SD card slot on the Nexus 4 :(
[18:35] <jenna_> there is otg cable and usb drives though
[18:36] <mhall119> yeah, just tried that, didn't do anything, I need to check the logs to see if it's recognizing it
[18:39] <jenna_> whats this error all about?  "No network connection on your device..." in the ubuntu-sdk?
[18:39] <jenna_> ive setup wifi on my tablet and it appears to be talknig to the internet
[18:41] <mhall119> zbenjamin: ^^
[19:02] <SturmFlut> Anybody running unity8-desktop-session-mir on a desktop? Should this session currently work?
[19:06] <tedg> kenvandine, Do you know why we're storying whether info should be send to the greeter in accounts service?
[19:06] <tedg> kenvandine, It seems like something that we don't actually need to know on the greeter.
[19:07] <kenvandine> tedg, what info?
[19:07] <tedg> Perhaps mterry as well ^
[19:07] <tedg> kenvandine, The setting on whether to export data to the welcome screen.
[19:07] <kenvandine> oh, i think because it needs to be available in the greeter
[19:07] <kenvandine> the settings
[19:08] <tedg> I don't see a reason it needs to be, because at that point you either have the data or you don't :-)
[19:08] <mterry> tedg, in split greeter world we didn't know who would be consuming that setting, so my thinking is that the split copy of the indicator might need to read it
[19:08] <kenvandine> dunno... mterry would know
[19:09] <tedg> mterry, Seems like it should always be consumed in the session though. You're saying "don't let the data escape" more than "don't visualize it."
[19:09] <mterry> tedg, if that's no longer true -- that a split greeter copy of the indicator doesn't need to read the setting, it doesn't need to be in AS
[19:10] <mterry> tedg, well which setting exactly are we talking about?
[19:10] <tedg> I'm for putting it in ubuntu-touch-schemas then.
[19:11] <tedg> mterry, WelcomeScreenMessages
[19:12] <mterry> tedg, that's libusermetrics info, right?  In which case, it is about visualization
[19:12] <mterry> tedg, because we want to keep collecting the data in libusermetrics, even if that setting is off
[19:12] <tedg> No, it's not about visualization, it's about export. Visualization is secondary.
[19:12] <mterry> tedg, so that when we turn the setting back on, we can show what was missed
[19:12] <tedg> Hmm, so you're saying we collect it in the open still?
[19:13] <tedg> I thought we collected the data in teh session, and exported the graphic.
[19:13] <mterry> tedg, well I don't believe it's "open" as in world readable
[19:13] <tedg> The graphic is still exported in the user session.
[19:13] <tedg> Hmm, too late for pete-woods
[19:13] <mterry> tedg, it's not an exported graphic, it's exported data
[19:13] <mterry> via libusermetricsoutput
[19:16]  * tedg is trying to remember how this works.
[19:21] <tedg> Ah, so this all ends up in the /var/lib/usermetrics dir as the usermetrics user.
[19:21] <tedg> Then the graphics themselves are generated by the greeter user?
[19:22] <tedg> K
[19:22] <tedg> So then we need the AS key for knowing whether to turn the  data into graphics.
[19:29] <Ploppz> Is there a device made for Ubuntu Touch already, or is it only the OS, for installing on other kinds of phones?
[19:29] <Ploppz> And is it in a release state?
[19:30] <nhaines> Ploppz: it's only the OS, only for installing on Ubuntu phones, although a couple Nexus phones are supported so that we have something to develop on, and a couple other phones have community ports (<3 my Nexus 5).
[19:30] <nhaines> It'll be in a release state when you see the phones for sell at ubuntu.com.
[19:30] <nhaines> Which will be in December.
[19:31] <nhaines> If you have a Nexus 4 or Nexus 5 though, it'd be a shame not to root it, install MultiROM Manager, and dualboot and try it out.  :)
[19:31] <tedg> mterry, So there's two, stats on welcome screen and messages on welcome screen: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityAndPrivacySettings#Phone
[19:31] <Ploppz> Ah. I have Motorola Moto G atm..
[19:32] <tedg> mterry, I care about messages, stats is user metrics.
[19:32] <Ploppz> nhaines: but what do you mean when you say "Ubuntu phones"?
[19:32] <nhaines> Ploppz: I mean a phone that you walk into a store, give them money, and walk out with it, that has Ubuntu preinstalled.
[19:32] <nhaines> Or, buy online as the case will probably be at frist.
[19:33] <mterry> tedg, ah, then one reason we still might be interested in a split world is for device-wide messages from ofono -- not sure who should be responsible for filtering those
[19:33] <Ploppz> Oh. Where would I look for a Ubuntu phone?
[19:33] <nhaines> Ploppz: ubuntu.com in December.
[19:33] <tedg> mterry, I think those should be messaging menu or unity notifications, no?
[19:33] <Ploppz> Ah ok.
[19:33] <nhaines> Although Meizu announced they're taking preorders starting... soon.  Oops, can't remember when.  This month or next.  :)
[19:33] <tedg> mterry, Or are you thinking that there'll be two telephony services.
[19:34] <mterry> tedg, right but which one?  the split greeter would need to be able to handle those in some cases (like user session not running -- encrypted home or whatever)
[19:34] <nhaines> Ploppz: September 25th.  http://blog.meizu.it/ubuntu-disponibile-meizu-mx4-partire-dicembre/
[19:34] <tedg> mterry, But what are we worried about in that case? Seems like you could send the message, but you wouldn't know private data, right?
[19:35] <mterry> tedg, I don't follow -- imagine split greeter as the only thing running -- it would need to consider that setting
[19:36] <tedg> mterry, Why? What could it possibly share that the user wouldn't want?
[19:36] <tedg> It doesn't know anything.
[19:36] <mterry> tedg, that setting is meant to filter incoming SMS texts, right?  split greeter would see those
[19:37] <tedg> mterry, But it'd never show them, right? I'd expect them to come from the user session or not at all.
[19:39] <mterry> tedg, it needs to show them.  Your phone can't stop being a phone just because you haven't logged into your session yet.  ofono is a device-wide thing.  Imagine multiple users on a phone (something design once envisioned at least for business use cases) -- which session should handle texts?
[19:39] <mterry> tedg, or imagine a multi-user tablet with a SIM card (which can happen, right?)
[19:42] <tedg> mterry, Hmm, okay. So in those cases we're talking about whether they should be shown, not whether the info should be leaked, because it already is (effectively).
[19:42] <mterry> tedg, if by leaked you mean stored outside the user's HOME then yes.  ofono is a system wide daemon
[19:42] <mterry> tedg, there are channels of information like skype and otherwise that would be user-specific though
[19:43] <mterry> maybe 'stored' isn't the right term.   ofono broadcasts them system wide anyway
[19:43] <tedg> Yeah
[19:44] <tedg> I feel like at a technical level it might make sense to split these.
[19:44] <tedg> Even if we show them at the user level as one switch.
[19:44] <tedg> They're different ideas
[19:45] <mterry> tedg, well user services can look at the AS setting and not export messages -- the greeter can look at the AS setting and not show ofono messages, why have two settings for that?
[19:45] <tedg> Because I feel like "dont' export" and "don't show" feel like different things.
[19:48] <mterry> tedg, I don't much care if you split the setting, though I'm not sure when they would have different values.  I just wanted to explain the above use cases for why I started with an AS setting
[19:48] <tedg> Yeah, thanks I do understand now.
[19:48] <tedg> It just feels like we're inserting two thoughts. But I guess we can split it out later.
[19:52] <mterry> tedg, the whole split greeter timeframe made me default to sticking a lot of stuff in AS  :)
[20:10] <it_dont_work> hey, is there a guide anywhere about getting the ubuntu-sdk to talk to the real device running ubuntu-touch so i can run apps there?
[20:11] <it_dont_work> it shows the serial nember but thats about all it can do.
[20:12] <nhaines> it_dont_work: go into System Settings > About this phone > Developer Mode and turn on developer mode.
[20:12] <it_dont_work> ive done that
[20:13] <it_dont_work> when i toggle that, in teh ubuntu-sdk, i see the "Current state" goes from a yellow dot with "connected" to a red dot with "Disconnected".  i cant get it to show a green dot to save my life
[20:13] <nhaines> That's all I've got.
[20:14] <it_dont_work> clicking the "test" button shows a window displaying ssh error.
[20:14] <it_dont_work> SSH connection failure: Private key file error: No such file or directory
[20:15] <lool> ogra_: you might want to checkout jodh's suggestion in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lxc-android-config/+bug/1370697
[20:15] <lool> ogra_: if you could test his proposed changes and land them, that's be nice  :-)
[20:22] <it_dont_work> does anybody else here have this ssh working?
[20:38] <cyphermox> mzanetti: I commented on bug 1357321; and reassigned it to you. I think you know more about the Qt infrastructure than I do
[20:39] <cyphermox> feel free to reassign it to somebody else if you're not the right person to look into it
[20:43] <mzanetti> cyphermox: mhm, ok...
[20:44] <cyphermox> I'm not really sure what else to do with this :)
[20:44] <mzanetti> me neither... but lets see
[20:50] <cyphermox> so, the reproducer should help testing a possible fix; the first line is the flags from QNetworkConfigurationManager, then whether QNetworkAccessManager thinks it's online
[20:50] <cyphermox> some of it is obviously wrong when you start the program while disconnected, and then connect
[21:11] <mhall119> bah, I can't adb into my phone anymore on r234!
[21:12] <mhall119> sergiusens: ogra_: halp!
[21:12] <mhall119> adb devices doesn't show my phone
[21:13] <mhall119> developer mode is enabled
[21:14] <mhall119> QtCreator says it's disconnected too, even though it's plugged in
[21:18] <mhall119> ok, ignore the mild panic, it works after rebooting the phone, so I just crashed something
[21:26] <popey> heh
[23:20] <sergiusens> mhall119: popey ogra_ I think there's an adb issue; I saw that too this morning and discarded it like you just did ;-)
[23:20] <sergiusens> I solved it by disabling/enabling dev mode from the ui
[23:21] <popey> i never use adb
[23:22] <popey> well, i probably do under the covers with qtc I guess
[23:22] <sergiusens> popey: you always use it, you just don't know it ;-)
[23:34] <popey> hehe