[06:31] <Kilos> morning all
[06:34] <nlsthzn> hey uncle Kilos :)
[06:35] <Kilos> hiya nlsthzn hows you
[06:35] <Kilos> my boet will be near there soon
[06:35] <Kilos> i think about on the 5th he will be at rotek head office in dubai
[06:37] <nlsthzn> cool
[06:57] <Kilos> when a server is booting how do you stop or slow down the thing so you can read an error message
[06:57] <Kilos> much to fast for me to see
[06:58] <Kilos> something about a bus
[06:58] <Kilos> hitting pause/break does nothing
[07:07] <nlsthzn> best to try and check logs I suspect
[07:08] <Kilos> sjoe
[07:09] <Kilos> im so lost without a gui or being able to ssh to it
[07:09] <Kilos> we still suckling with iptables stuff
[07:09] <nlsthzn> that is some of the more tricky things for sure :)
[07:11] <Kilos> lol. very weird, it worked on 10.10 but something in 14.04 is not playing along
[07:14] <Kilos> hi magespawn gremble 
[07:14] <gremble> Hey Kilos 
[07:15] <magespawn> howdy Kilos gremble 
[07:19] <Kilos> so you clever okes
[07:19] <Kilos> if you have 2 drives in a pc
[07:20] <Kilos> is virtualization the only way to use the second one as a server
[07:20] <Kilos> cant you ssh or something to it as if it was on another pc
[07:21] <gremble> No, you'll have to make it believe that it is another PC
[07:21] <gremble> So you'll have to use virtualisation
[07:21] <Kilos> and that will use lotsa resources the same as using virtualbox?
[07:22] <magespawn> yup 
[07:22] <Kilos> eish
[07:22] <gremble> There is a virtualisation technology that uses the virtualisation built into the kernel
[07:22] <gremble> So you don't run another kernel and cut ram etc
[07:22] <gremble> It shares better on the local machine
[07:22] <Kilos> tell me more
[07:22] <gremble> I can't remember what it is called though :/ I know that it uses KVM
[07:23] <Kilos> oh i know someone who knows about that
[07:23] <Kilos> spoke about it last night actually
[07:44] <Kilos> sjoe, many much readings and many few understandings
[07:48] <Kilos> but might be the answer
[07:59] <Kilos> looks like kvm is the way to go
[07:59] <gremble> Getting breakfast is the way to go.. 
[08:00] <Kilos> hahaha
[08:00] <gremble> It is too early to be struggling with a windows laptop
[08:00] <gremble> :/
[08:00] <gremble> HP only supports win 8 on this laptop
[08:00] <Kilos> eish anytime is not good to struggle with windows
[08:00] <Kilos> there is a quick fix for that though
[08:01] <gremble> Linux doesnt want to install
[08:01] <gremble> I tried it last night with ElementaryOS
[08:01] <gremble> Keeps failing on the grub install
[08:01] <Kilos> aha
[08:01] <Kilos> is it a bought with windows lappy
[08:02] <gremble> Disabled secure boot, put Legacy mode, everything
[08:02] <gremble> No cigar
[08:02] <Kilos> sjoe
[08:02] <gremble> Yup
[08:02] <gremble> Bought with windows 8
[08:02] <gremble> But I couldnt save the OS
[08:02] <gremble> There was so much malware on that laptop, I thought it had Ebola
[08:02] <Kilos> ooo someone was offering win8 dvd last night
[08:03] <Kilos> but there must be a way to fix it
[08:03] <Kilos> when i struggle like that i boot from win 98 cd and go with fdisk
[08:04] <Kilos> wipe the whole drive install 98 then install ubuntu
[08:05] <Kilos> there is also a lekker tool , lemme check what its called
[08:06] <gremble> I don't want to go through too much effort, she may come back after a week and tell me that she hates linux
[08:07] <Kilos> ai!
[08:08] <Kilos> install ubuntu then tell her to come here for help
[08:08] <Kilos> peeps swopping from windows to linux need lotsa guidance in the beginning
[08:10] <gremble> Not even I can get ubuntu to work as intended. I am not going to give it to her to try :P
[08:10] <Kilos> lol
[08:11] <Kilos> kubuntu is lekker man
[08:12] <Kilos> i cant find that tool now but will remember sometime what it is called
[08:12] <Kilos> repairs drives
[08:13] <gremble> I hate that I forget where I put my cds
[08:13] <Kilos> can do everything, even to rewriting the mbr
[08:13] <gremble> I have a very nice piece of malware that breaks the windows validation thing
[08:13] <Kilos> ya sorting them is always the biggest mistake
[08:18] <Kilos> i think its called ubcd
[08:19] <Kilos> http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/download.html
[08:28] <Kilos> also had one motherboard that actually had a virus or malware or whatever that got into the bios
[08:30] <gremble> Wow
[08:30] <Kilos> ya bad and it stuffed up 4 drives
[08:31] <Kilos> had to flash the bios to get things back to normall, but the drives had to be wiped
[08:32] <Kilos> there are bad things online for windows peeps
[08:38]  * Squirm looks around
[08:38] <Squirm> hello
[08:38] <Squirm> nuvolari_: looks like I may be joining you down South
[08:39] <Kilos> oh my
[08:39] <Kilos> hi Squirm you also heading to thew cape
[08:39] <Kilos> the
[08:47] <gremble> Anyone here familiar with windows system administration/
[08:52] <Cantide> you kid, surely :D
[08:53]  * Cantide checks the channel name again
[08:53] <Cantide> :D
[08:53] <Kilos> haha hi Cantide 
[08:53] <Cantide> hello '-';;
[08:53] <gremble> Hey, people do various things in their life
[08:54] <gremble> Unfortunately working with Windows is still one of those things. I was hoping someone may have experience with it
[08:56] <Kilos> what do you need to do gremble 
[08:57] <Squirm> gremble: I know my way around a bit
[08:57] <Squirm> what's up?
[08:57] <Squirm> and Kilos, I think so...
[08:57] <Squirm> got a decent offer and I think I could make it work
[08:59] <Kilos> good
[08:59] <Kilos> but not a lekker place for a banana boy
[08:59] <Kilos> weather all mixed up
[08:59] <Kilos> rains in winter
[09:00] <gremble> What is a banana boy?
[09:00] <Kilos> natal person
[09:00] <psytab> hi Kilos
[09:00] <Kilos> hipsy
[09:00] <Kilos> ai!
[09:00] <Kilos> hi psytab 
[09:00] <psytab> tipsy hipsy!
[09:02] <gremble> Squirm: there is a windows channel on freenode, so I got them to help me. Thanks
[09:02] <Kilos> sjoe so early
[09:02] <psytab> hehe
[09:02] <psytab> hi gremble
[09:02] <gremble> Somewhere it is always happy hour
[09:02] <gremble> Hey psytab 
[09:03] <psytab> I've seen people sitting on trams here in Poland who were drinking at 7 am
[09:03] <Kilos> the trams were drinking?
[09:03] <Kilos> sjoe
[09:04] <psytab> the people were
[09:05] <Kilos> lol
[09:14] <gremble> People get thirsty in the mornings as well
[09:14] <gremble> I drink a lot in the mornings
[09:14] <gremble> Water when I wake up, some english tea
[09:14] <Kilos> ya tea or coffee
[09:15] <gremble> Depends on what time I am leaving, I may have more
[09:20] <Kilos> i dont like water much
[09:21] <psytab> but beer at 7 am?
[09:21] <gremble> That is quite unfortunate seeing as you are about 70% water
[09:21] <Kilos> na water not lekker
[09:21] <Kilos> tea and coffee
[09:40] <Kilos> egrep -c ‘(svm|vmx)’ /proc/cpuinfo
[09:40] <Kilos> bash: syntax error near unexpected token `('
[09:40] <Kilos> what am i doing wrong
[09:41] <gremble> Doesn't bash want ` instead of '?
[09:41] <Kilos> i have no idea
[09:41] <gremble> I am no good at bash scripting :P
[09:41] <Kilos> lemme try that though
[09:42] <Kilos> all i want is to know if my cpu can do the kvm thing
[09:43] <gremble> Did it work/
[09:44] <Kilos> it didnt complain but i see no output
[09:45] <Kilos> oh ya it gave a 2 which is good enough
[09:45] <Kilos> yay
[09:45] <Kilos> i dont see the diffs in them things
[09:46] <Kilos> i just used the ' below the " and it worked
[09:46] <Kilos> ty gremble 
[09:46] <Kilos> where is that other caracter
[09:47] <Kilos> sjoe
[09:47] <Kilos> Maaz, spell character
[09:47] <Maaz> Kilos: That seems correct. Carry on
[10:58] <psytab> hi theblazehen
[10:58] <psytab> hu bmg505
[10:59] <Kilos> i go eat
[10:59] <psytab> Kilos, you may find this interesting, http://tegenlicht.vpro.nl/afleveringen/2014-2015/digitaal-geheugenverlies.html
[10:59] <psytab> but I don't think your bandwidth is sufficient to watch it
[11:00] <psytab> enjoy
[11:22] <psytab> hoi smile :)
[11:22] <smile> hoi! :)
[11:23] <Kilos> whats it about psytab 
[11:23] <Kilos> hi smile 
[11:23] <smile> hi kilos :p
[11:25] <psytab> Kilos, ways of preserving our collective memory in the face of economic measures causing us to lose data over the past 20 years of our information age, mostly in English but with Dutch commentaries
[11:26] <psytab> smile, maybe also interesting to you, http://tegenlicht.vpro.nl/afleveringen/2014-2015/digitaal-geheugenverlies.html
[11:26] <Kilos> oh you mean in the head memory?
[11:27] <psytab> no, things like The Internet Archive and similar initiatives
[11:27] <Kilos> oh
[11:27] <psytab> I watched it when I was at my father's place in the Netherlands
[11:27] <Kilos> there was something called traceback or something like that
[11:27] <psytab> and I found it quite interesting
[11:27] <psytab> yes
[11:29] <smile> psytab: :D
[11:30] <smile> where can I watch ;)
[11:30] <psytab> on that page :)
[11:30] <psytab> or using the NPO Android app
[11:31] <psytab> it's not blocked here in Poland, so I don't think it's in Belgium either
[11:31] <smile> Firefox is not loading that page properly here :p
[11:31] <smile> Chrome is :)
[11:31] <psytab> ok :)
[11:36]  * smile is watching
[11:37]  * psytab is also watching
[11:42] <Kilos> sorry 
[11:42] <Kilos> had to log out and back in according to a kvm link im following
[11:47]  * Kerbero[dsp] kijkt ook
[11:48] <Kerbero[dsp]> meh :( internet is te traag
[11:48] <psytab> :(
[11:48]  * psytab geeft Kerbero[dsp] sneller internet
[11:48] <Kerbero[dsp]> ...en floppies van 10 jaar geleden kan geen masjiene meer lezen |
[11:49] <Kerbero[dsp]> bedankt psytab
[11:55] <Kerbero[dsp]> youtube to the rescue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GC8HG1vBsA
[11:55] <Kerbero[dsp]> can stream in lower quality
[11:55] <psytab> graag gedaan
[11:55] <psytab> ah cool
[11:55] <Kerbero[dsp]> :D
[12:08] <superfly> did we use floppies 10 years ago? i don't think so
[12:08] <superfly> i recall usb flash drives bbeing the big thing
[12:09] <superfly> (sorry, one handed typing)
[12:13] <Kerbero[dsp]> yes you're right
[12:18] <theblazehen> hi psytab
[12:26] <psytab> but 15 years ago they were still in use
[12:26] <Kerbero[dsp]> "nederlandse geschiedenis die naar egipte gaan. ik snap er niks van"
[12:26] <Kerbero[dsp]> lol
[12:26] <psytab> haha
[12:27] <psytab> I was talking about it to my father as we were watching
[12:28] <psytab> it seems everything in the Netherlands is being decided on the basis of money or profitability
[12:28] <psytab> many famous bookshops are also closing down
[12:30] <psytab> whereas I can see that Poland is going through a knowledge boom with lots of cheap books being available, many of which are translations from books published either recently or as long as 10, 20 or 30 years ago
[12:31] <psytab> I think all libraries in the Netherlands should prepare for being closed down and their books being shipped to Alexandria lol
[12:31] <Kerbero[dsp]> haha ja
[12:36] <superfly> psytab: not just the netherlands
[12:38] <psytab> hi superfly
[12:38] <superfly> hi
[12:38] <psytab> it's the only country where I've lived long enough to notice it
[12:39] <psytab> but I can find a lot more in bookstores here in Poland than I can even at the biggest ones in Rotterdam or The Hague
[12:58] <smile> bye :)
[12:58] <smile> (testing some software)
[12:58] <smile> vpro program was interesting, psytab :p
[12:58] <psytab> bye smile :)
[12:58] <psytab> inderdaad :D
[12:58] <smile> enjoy your stay with Kerbero[dsp] ;)
[12:58] <psytab> haha
[12:58] <psytab> thanks :)
[13:17] <Kilos> ohi superfly hows the little one?
[15:54] <Kilos> hmm... you guys have been quiet
[16:13] <charl> good evening all
[16:13] <charl> Maaz: coffee on
[16:13]  * Maaz starts grinding coffee
[16:17] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charl!
[16:17] <charl> Maaz: thanks
[16:17] <Maaz> charl: Okay :-)
[16:26] <Kilos> hi charl 
[16:36] <magespawn> howdy charl 
[17:01] <psytab> I was asleep
[17:01] <psytab> hi charl :)
[17:02] <psytab> hello magespawn
[17:02] <magespawn> hi psytab 
[17:07] <Kilos> hehe
[17:33] <theblazehen> hey all
[17:34] <Kilos> hi theblazehen 
[18:12] <theblazehen> hey guys, what is address for minetest?
[18:36] <ThatGraemeGuy> theblazehen: minetest.net
[18:37] <ThatGraemeGuy> or you mean the server we played on?
[18:37] <theblazehen> ThatGraemeGuy: yeah, I'm looking for the server
[18:37] <psytab> hi theblazehen
[18:37] <theblazehen> Already have it from repo
[18:37] <theblazehen> hi psytab
[18:37] <psytab> hi ThatGraemeGuy
[18:37] <ThatGraemeGuy> mt.donaldson.za.net port 30000
[18:37] <ThatGraemeGuy> its a bit of a ghost town though, i don't even play there anymore
[18:37] <theblazehen> ty
[18:37] <theblazehen> Mostly to explore ATM
[18:37] <ThatGraemeGuy> kinda boring when you are the only one playing for weeks on end, i've made a new home on a US server
[18:38] <theblazehen> yeah
[18:39] <ThatGraemeGuy> and that seems to be particularly laggy tonight :-/
[18:39] <ThatGraemeGuy> guess i'll join our regular for a bit
[18:39] <theblazehen> kk
[18:39] <Kilos> hi ThatGraemeGuy 
[18:40] <ThatGraemeGuy> 'lo
[18:44] <theblazehen> the big r? lets see...
[18:45] <Kilos> theblazehen, you can join our minetest channel too #minetest-za
[18:46] <theblazehen> kk
[18:47] <theblazehen> ThatGraemeGuy: I fell in a hole... Halp? Can i just dig up?
[18:47] <Kilos> lol
[18:55] <Squirm> evening
[18:57] <Kilos> hi Squirm 
[18:57] <psytab> evening Squirm
[19:05] <inetpro> good evening
[19:07] <Kilos> hi inetpro 
[19:07] <Kilos> you all well?
[19:07] <Kilos> tired again i spose
[19:10] <inetpro> always
[19:10] <Kilos> hehe
[19:11] <Kilos> so how do i stop a kvn server from stealing my mouse
[19:11] <Kilos> when its running if i click on it to copy paste the ip it gives my mouse disappears
[19:19] <Kilos> hi Vince-0 
[19:20] <Vince-0> Hi
[19:25] <Kilos> inetpro, i need some help please with rsync. i have installed a quemu-kvm server on this unity, im happy to see it is connected to the internet
[19:26] <Kilos> how do i rsync /var/cache/archives/ from unity to that server
[19:26] <Kilos> as in how do i find the path
[19:37] <Kilos> hi StonedAlchemist 
[19:38] <StonedAlchemist> Kilos, howdy
[20:40] <charl> hi Kilos 
[20:40] <Kilos> haha
[20:40] <charl> sorry for the delay
[20:40] <charl> just came back from restaurant
[20:40] <Kilos> aha
[20:41] <Kilos> tummy full
[20:41] <Kilos> someone was looking for you the other day
[20:41] <charl> yes it was delicious !
[20:41] <charl> ah, who was it ?
[20:41] <Kilos> i said you were touring
[20:41] <Kilos> psytab  i think
[20:41] <charl> yeah true
[20:42] <charl> although my holiday is almost over
[20:42] <charl> my last week tomorrow then back to work we week after
[20:42] <psytab> hi charl
[20:42] <charl> hey psytab :)
[20:42] <charl> how are you doing
[20:42] <psytab> I'm doing fine, thanks :)
[20:42] <psytab> I was on holidays too
[20:42] <charl> nice, did you go somewhere ?
[20:42] <psytab> in the Netherlands
[20:42] <charl> ah cool !
[20:43] <psytab> yeah
[20:43] <charl> i have been all over, my mother is visiting so we've been touring around
[20:43] <charl> been to amsterdam, leiden, utrecht, gouda, munster and a bunch of smaller places
[20:43] <psytab> that's really nice, I noticed you weren't online at all
[20:43] <psytab> but that's a good reason to be offline
[20:43] <charl> yeah :D
[20:43] <psytab> :D
[20:44] <charl> but i'm almost done with my holiday now, completely tired
[20:44] <charl> i'm literally tired from holiday, now still need to take a few days just resting and then back to work
[20:44] <charl> otherwise i have to go back to work to rest out :D
[20:44] <psytab> I also had some interviews and I will hear where I am going to tomorrow or the day after
[20:44] <Kilos> haha you guys that go to work to rest after hols and weekends
[20:44] <psytab> hehe
[20:44] <charl> yup :D
[20:45] <charl> i've gotten amazing news a few days back
[20:45] <charl> completely contrary to the expectation i got a permanent position now
[20:45] <charl> so i'm settled for the time being
[20:45] <charl> i've done some interviews but didn't like what i found
[20:45] <psytab> wow, that's great
[20:45] <charl> i ended up applying for work at this one company, an absolutely amazing company to work for except for one very big flaw
[20:46] <charl> the only thing they do there outside of android is microsoft
[20:46] <charl> windows/c#/microsoft sql server/etc
[20:46] <charl> so that wasn't going to work :)
[20:46] <psytab> people have been contacting me for many jobs
[20:46] <psytab> haha
[20:46] <charl> but a great company in all other respects, a real pityt
[20:46] <charl> you been applying in NL ?
[20:46] <psytab> I don't know any of that stuff really
[20:46] <charl> the job market is amazing right now
[20:46] <charl> best time to be in the market, everybody is hiring
[20:46] <psytab> in NL too, yes
[20:47] <charl> completely different than last year
[20:47] <psytab> but also PL, HU and IE
[20:47] <charl> last year i applied at 5 companies and got one disappointing offer
[20:47] <charl> this year i say no and they still don't want to let me go
[20:47] <charl> insist on trying to win me over
[20:47] <charl> what a major difference to last year, it's amazing
[20:47] <psytab> I went to hoofddorp for interviews
[20:47] <charl> but yeah it helps that NL is out of recession now for the last 6 or so months ...
[20:47] <psytab> haha
[20:48] <charl> ah hoofddorp is close to amsterdam right ?
[20:48] <psytab> so maybe hibernating in PL wasn't that bad an idea for me
[20:48] <psytab> yes, it is
[20:48] <psytab> but I'm probably going to dublin
[20:50] <charl> ah yes lots of jobs in dublin, mostly international companies
[20:50] <charl> i've also been contacted out of dublin by ericson some time ago
[20:50] <charl> but wasn't interested in moving to dublin
[20:50] <charl> i've been to dublin, didn't like it
[20:50] <psytab> and there I will be close to the google offices, I may be able to apply and get in at some point if I don't have any perspectives for growth at the company I'm going to work for now
[20:51] <psytab> oh, I see
[20:51] <psytab> well, I think I could manage there for some time
[20:51] <psytab> just like I have done here in PL
[20:52] <charl> i think you're much more flexible than i am
[20:52] <charl> dublin isn't a bad place though
[20:52] <charl> just extremely expensive
[20:52] <charl> coffee sets you back 2x what it does in NL
[20:52] <psytab> I will be on a plane to some place often enough anyway, just like now :)
[20:52] <psytab> yes
[20:53] <charl> yeah precisely
[20:53] <psytab> it's too expensive in my opinion
[20:53] <charl> i just came back from the restaurant, a luxury restaurant where i live
[20:53] <psytab> but I need growth in my career
[20:53] <charl> a cup of coffee is 2 euro, in dublin it would have been 4 or 5 at a regular coffee shop
[20:53] <psytab> the other option is going to hirschberg in germany
[20:54] <charl> oh germany! i love germany
[20:54] <charl> i would obviously have opted for that instead :P
[20:54] <psytab> do you know how IE became that expensive?
[20:54] <charl> i have no idea but from what i've heard that country used to have practically no economy
[20:54] <charl> the economy that there is now was largely developed thanks to EU grants
[20:55] <psytab> well, a girl working at google wants me to be in dublin because she is getting bored there :P
[20:55] <charl> but lots of international companies like google have their european headquarters settled in dublin now
[20:55] <psytab> yes, but it's weird
[20:55] <charl> ah, there's a girl ... i could have guessed :D
[20:55] <superfly> anyone wanna go work for Facebook?
[20:55] <charl> nope definitely nost
[20:55] <psytab> PL is actually on the right track
[20:55] <charl> *not
[20:55] <charl> i despise facebook
[20:56] <psytab> you can earn good money and life is still cheap there
[20:56] <charl> yeah it's all cost of living versus income at the end of the day
[20:56] <superfly> I know a couple people who work for them, but that's not to say I want to.
[20:56] <charl> pay me 10.000 euro per month and i would also go live in dublin
[20:56] <psytab> I would have opted to stay here if I got a good offer to develop my career
[20:57] <superfly> Just been getting a few mails from them recently
[20:57] <psytab> yes
[20:57] <psytab> charl, that is my plan, to increase my value and let them fight over me
[20:57] <charl> precisely
[20:57] <psytab> whoever pays more can hire me
[20:57] <charl> well just be really good at what you do and develop your skill, then you end up going wherever the work is
[20:58] <charl> that is somewhat nomadic thinking but it's the way to grow your career really
[20:58] <psytab> that's something I learned from my uncle
[20:58] <psytab> yes
[20:58] <charl> there are jobs now for senior developers in germany, 60.000 to 80.000 per year !
[20:58] <charl> now we're talking :P
[20:58] <psytab> yeah!
[20:58] <psytab> :D
[20:58] <charl> i have more faith in germany than in NL right now
[20:59] <charl> we might still have a higher gdp per capita at the moment but i think they will overtake us in the not too distant future
[20:59] <charl> the german work ethic is really good, in NL i find the work ethic lacking
[20:59] <psytab> I think NL really got messed up because of politics too
[20:59] <charl> nah well the politics are crazy in all countries
[21:00] <charl> i sometimes listen to germany and i also shake my head at merkel
[21:00] <psytab> a country that functioned well is being ruined until only rich people can stay
[21:00] <charl> not all is good in the bundesrepublik
[21:00] <psytab> I know
[21:01] <charl> yeah but in NL i think people have had too much money for too long
[21:01] <charl> and too much chasing after internationalisation instead of focusing on simply doing good work
[21:01] <charl> going back to basics, focusing on technology and manufacturing, that's what germany is doing
[21:01] <charl> they are doing it because they have a good work ethic, they are thorough in their approach, they focus on growing their own economy
[21:01] <psytab> I am actually thinking of working in IE/DE for some time and then just buying some property in PL
[21:02] <psytab> yes, good plan
[21:02] <charl> buying property in PL is probably a good investment
[21:02] <psytab> also the cost of housing is half over there
[21:02] <charl> although it's impossible to say where the future will take us
[21:02] <charl> the cost of buying a house where i live is relatively low and still very expensive imho
[21:03] <charl> relatively low for dutch standards i mean
[21:03] <psytab> yes
[21:03] <psytab> I don't think I'm going to buy anything in NL
[21:04] <psytab> because I don't see myself living there in the longer term
[21:04] <charl> well look at what happened a couple of years ago
[21:04] <charl> after the decades of increase in value in housing, the market collapsed
[21:04] <charl> in NL i mean
[21:04] <charl> before that people would have said it's a great investment but what do people say now
[21:05] <charl> but problem is, nobody will know what happens in the long term, right
[21:05] <psytab> it was just a bubble, but it hasn't completely burst
[21:05] <charl> well it will probably start to climb again soon enough
[21:06] <charl> now that the country is out of recession again but yeah, who knows
[21:06] <charl> i was a bit frightened about the recent chaos in the ukraine as well in terms of living in the east of europe though
[21:06] <charl> it's a different culture that i have very little grips on
[21:06] <charl> but i'm sure that doesn't reflect on poland in any way
[21:06] <psytab> I can understand that but poland is quite safe
[21:07] <psytab> especially if you are on the western side where poznan and wroclaw lie
[21:07] <psytab> that's practically germany
[21:07] <charl> yeah but i'm quite interested to know more about the east european culture because i don't understand the way they think and work at all
[21:07] <charl> ah interesting, yeah it depends a lot on where you are
[21:08] <charl> from the outside it looks like there are massive differences in the culture between east and west in europe
[21:08] <psytab> they are quite smart and work hard
[21:08] <charl> yeah i've heard that from a lot of people
[21:08] <psytab> I don't really see much difference between NL and PL
[21:09] <charl> interesting, although i don't know if that's a good thing (for PL) :P
[21:09] <psytab> but yeah LT, LV and EE are more developed because of scandinavian investments :D
[21:09] <psytab> haha
[21:09] <charl> i sometimes think people in NL have forgotten what life is really about, its all money money money
[21:09] <psytab> yes
[21:10] <charl> people get greedy everything turns to sh*t
[21:10] <psytab> PL is very capitalist too, but there is still a human face to it
[21:10] <charl> a
[21:10] <charl> *ah
[21:10] <psytab> cheap goods and free toilets at malls
[21:10] <charl> i'm quite interested to brush up my german though
[21:10] <charl> especially after i've been to munster two weeks ago
[21:11] <psytab> friendliness and politeness that you are used to
[21:11] <charl> munster was AH-MAY-ZIJNG
[21:11] <charl> i could most definitely live there
[21:11] <charl> that promenade is also especially beautiful
[21:12] <charl> we walked a full 4,5 KM by foot on that trail
[21:12] <charl> and then went into the centre of munster, amazing shopping, great feel
[21:12] <charl> and the midweek market at the dom is awesome
[21:12] <psytab> I like german cities too
[21:13] <psytab> I've been to many of them
[21:13] <charl> and it's close by NL so i can easily come visit friends and family
[21:13] <psytab> but still I think PL may overtake them in the future
[21:13] <psytab> here everything is open 7 days a week
[21:14] <psytab> it's like they are more capitalist than even the US lol
[21:15] <psytab> but yeah, my niece told me last week I'm a pole now do what am I doing in NL
[21:15] <charl> that's not good though
[21:16] <charl> they will end up like NL
[21:16] <psytab> it allows for the economy to develop faster, but I hope they will not only value money
[21:17] <charl> that's the danger yeah
[21:17] <charl> oh well
[21:17] <charl> we'll see what the future holds :)
[21:18] <charl> although i don't like the EU at least one benefit is that we can move around as we want
[21:18] <charl> so there are plenty of opportunities
[21:18] <psytab> still paying just 300 euros a month for a place to live including all costs is nice :)
[21:18] <psytab> yes
[21:18] <charl> ah i'm paying almost twice that
[21:18] <charl> but that said i rent 75m2 right in the centre of the city
[21:18] <charl> walking distance from all the major shops
[21:18] <psytab> maybe 150 euros for food
[21:19] <psytab> yes, that's great for the netherlands
[21:19] <charl> not bad indeed
[21:19] <psytab> I guess I got spoiled living here
[21:20] <psytab> maybe even become somewhat of a cheapskate
[21:20] <psytab> but everything is just so cheap over here
[21:20] <charl> i live 6km from my work (and can go by bicycle almost line of sight) so it's good as well, i like that living here
[21:21] <psytab> yes
[21:21] <charl> brb
[21:22] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[21:36] <charl> back
[21:37] <psytab> welcome back
[21:38] <charl> thanks :)
[21:39] <psytab> you're welcome :)
[21:40] <charl> lol
[21:40] <charl> we've very polite this evening :D
[21:41] <charl> i installed skype for my mom today but did it inside a VM
[21:41] <charl> she runs ubuntu 14.04.1 on her macbook pro
[21:41] <charl> as the host operating system
[21:41] <charl> so i first installed virtualbox and then inside that i installed another copy of ubuntu 14.04.1 as a guest operating system
[21:41] <charl> and then inside that i installed skype
[21:42] <charl> the reason for it is so that i can isolate the potentially malicious piece of software (skype) from the rest of the operating system
[21:42] <charl> so that what she does on her host should in principle remain safe
[21:42] <charl> i'm actually just using virtualisation to sandbox the application
[21:42] <charl> but that got me thinking, i should do more with virtual appliances like that
[21:43] <charl> for that you actually need a version of ubuntu that is super minimalist with a minimal footprint
[21:44] <charl> only for the purpose of running a single or small set of desktop applications
[21:44] <charl> a bit like osv but then for desktop applications instead of servers
[21:45] <psytab> yes, you're right
[21:45] <psytab> I think this kind of sandboxing should be a basic part of an operating system
[21:46] <psytab> or basic functionality rather
[21:47] <psytab> but doesn't linux already have something like that?
[21:47] <psytab> I know solaris has zones
[21:49] <charl> there is docker that creates a type of application container but i'm not sure how well it isolates and how secure it is
[21:49] <charl> you need to isolate not only the file system but also the memory space, etc
[21:52] <psytab> yes indeed
[21:52] <psytab> but maybe it can be made more transparent using some kind of kvm instance
[21:53] <psytab> I'd have to look into that once I've moved to my new place
[21:55] <charl> yeah it's interesting stuff
[21:56] <charl> three years ago i was working on this https://github.com/ushahidi/dpr
[21:56] <charl> i want to take that to the next level now
[21:58] <psytab> that's a great project
[21:59] <psytab> I would like to have something without any persistence whatsoever even running from a normal installation
[22:00] <psytab> but too much linux software assumes writing to system files and logs
[22:02] <charl> well that's exactly what i did there with dpr
[22:02] <charl> it makes use of aufs and tmpfs to achieve that
[22:02] <charl> it effectively functions like a live cd
[22:03] <charl> ro from disk and rw to tmpfs, all changes get written to tmpfs and not to disk
[22:03] <charl> https://github.com/ushahidi/dpr/blob/master/rootaufs.sh
[22:04] <charl> i hear my bed calling me... nn !
[22:05] <psytab> night!