[00:31] well! === zmoylan is now known as zmoylan_pi === zmoylan_1i is now known as zmoylanpi === zmoylanpi is now known as zmoylan-pi [06:24] morning boys and girls. [06:24] moin [06:24] guten morgen Myrtti [06:43] remember the old update manager that didn't pop up and steal focus at 7:45 EVERY DAY? it just had an indicator when there were updates [06:43] is that still available somewhere? [06:48] you can change it to notify once a week... [06:48] but yeah, that notification icon would be lovely [06:55] well. It's a good thing I didn't strip the bed for washing the bedsheets... [06:56] * jussi01 waves [07:51] popey: Have you updated your map yet? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-29330265 [07:51] 23GB free disk space. The full world is approximately 20GB uncompressed. [07:55] bigcalm: May something your interested in as well ^^ [07:55] * brobostigon will need to get his external hdd out, for enough space to download it. [07:56] aw man [07:56] my laptop has a dead bright pixel [08:08] Good morning all; happy Punctuation Day! :-D [08:14] morning JamesTait [08:28] DJones: download link? [08:28] http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/innovate/developers/minecraft-map-britain.html [08:28] Myrtti: thats the most annoying thing [08:29] foobarry: the dead bug is more annoying - it's bigger [08:29] :( [08:29] i've been bitten alive by bugs lately [08:29] must have 25 bites on me [08:39] foobarry: you must be tasty [08:40] popey: Just downloaded & tried, there's no readme file in the zip archive, but I just dumped it into my saves folder & unziped & works fine [08:41] my wife says she doesn't get them because marmite [08:41] foobarry: yeah they get their feet stuck in marmite if you plaster yourself with it [08:42] :-p [08:50] foobarry: :( [08:50] i have a nice big ulcer on my tongue [08:51] i'm due some ulcers after eating pringles [08:51] mouth is too narrow for 5 at once [08:57] heh [09:06] http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/23/6834755/samsung-to-end-laptop-sales-in-europe [09:06] including chromebooks [09:07] weird. i thought chromebooks sold well [09:07] ALL laptop sales? [09:07] wow [09:09] in the UK you can withdraw from most ATM's for free right? I heard in the US sometimes a bank rquires you to use its own ATMs, I just signed up for Nationwide Plus, so just curious if I coud be charged using Lloyds ATms [09:10] ujjain, yes most are free, you get charged for using some third party ones but most banks don't charge now [09:10] It tells you on the ATM anyway [09:14] ah great [09:14] czajkows1i: You need to get yourself one of the http://goo.gl/SZYlXV [09:14] right, some atms in clubs charge like 2 pounds [09:14] DJones: oh I do indeed [09:15] DJones: instead I give you https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/514487093129908225/photo/1 [09:15] ujjain, yeah and places like Theme parks etc and some pubs [09:16] czajkows1i: I saw that last night as twitter scrolled past, very worrying [09:16] and events, but places like Supermarkets, banks etc all are free [09:26] the builder who is quoting our extension says we need to get the party wall agreement sorted...what does that mean? [09:27] do you share a wall with a neighbour? [09:27] do you plan to share? [09:27] foobarry: http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/mar/14/home-extensions-plans-party-wall [09:28] mmm. or that [09:28] the extension will go to the boundary [09:28] there you go then. [09:29] "You need to serve notice on all the owners of every neighbouring property affected by the works, both freeholders and leaseholders." [09:29] seems confusing as i thought the planning permission covers this [09:29] https://www.gov.uk/party-wall-etc-act-1996-guidance "The act covers new building on or at the boundary of 2 properties" [09:29] since the council write to the neighbours [09:51] that "cat" in the topic looks like a koala. :) === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [10:17] http://www.net-security.org/secworld.php?id=17392 [10:17] replacement for truecrypt [10:25] foobarry: too late for me - I've moved to encfs [10:25] i just keep all my naked selfies on iCloud, so i don't have any false sense of security from using an encrypted filesystem [10:27] directhex: this isn't for naked selfies - those I don't encrypt [10:27] directhex: this is for things like ssh certs [10:29] I need them on all my systems but there's no reasonable way of doing that without a third-party involved (that I've found) [10:32] just store it on github. use quadruple-rot13 for encryption [10:43] yey http://www.geek.com/apple/iphone-6s-are-being-bent-in-peoples-pockets-including-mine-1605177/ [10:58] meh [10:59] "pressure of fabric against your skin" [10:59] = being sat on? [10:59] tight jeans and front pocket [10:59] lots of forces applying pressure [10:59] bend to sit, the fabric goes taught [11:07] doesn't this happen every year? every time there's a new iphone, people suddenly re-discover that when you bend things, they bend [11:09] apple will have to give all users a free titanium non bendy case :-) [11:09] or are they going to say that they're meant to bend? [11:10] they're not meant to not bend [11:12] they aren't meant to be subjected to warping forces [11:16] what % put their phone in their pocket? [11:16] the majority? [11:17] probably for teenagers and those in 20s maybe but i suspect it falls after that [11:18] chances are, when field-testing the phone, everyone had it in a bulky case designed to hide its true shape [11:19] also, all apple staff wear tan-colored cargo trousers, which have deep loose pockets [11:19] and they didn't have it going through enough bars in hipsters pockets this release :-) [11:19] mine lives in my pocket. I just don't extend that to sitting on them [11:19] My coat has a phone pocket, I put it in there [11:20] i reckon my nokia dumbphone will be safe in my back pocket when i occasionly stick it there it i'm not wearing a fleece/jacket with pockets [11:21] lol. your nokia dumbphone will be safe when only cockroaches rule the world [11:21] nothing wrong with nokia dumb phones if it's all you want :) [11:21] http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/226/893/tumblr_lwve5bG5781qewacoo1_r1_500.jpg :P [11:21] i did use one of it's predecessors a nokia n70 to bang a nail into a door frame to make a point to my boss about how a crappy nokia was better than his shiny new ruggedised pocket pc [11:23] I had a friend with a 'ruggedised' phone a good 7-8 years ago. chocolate-block style but dressed up so it looked like it was a car tyre [11:23] he dropped it in a pint to prove it was waterproof. it never worked again [11:23] my boss dropped his pocket pc onto carpet and battery shook lose. i threw the n70 at ceiling knocking out tile and let it bounce off floor on way down and it was grand [11:24] I've tipped a bottle of water over my LG G Watch :D [11:24] and taken it in the shower once [11:25] this kinda stuff cracks me up though; http://forums.androidcentral.com/htc-one-m8/381873-bent-m8.html [11:25] bend your android phone, it's a "curiousity". bend an iphone, and it's bend-gate! [11:25] shauno: I'm sure you could find similar posts about the iphone 5 ;) [11:26] oh I know you can [11:26] www.lg.com/us/mobile-phones/gflex ! [11:27] hehe [11:28] shauno: "bendghazi" === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [13:46] I'm trying to find out what power supply a Mad Catz Strike 7 keyboard takes, nowhere seems to mention it, frustrating. [13:54] Azelphur: no power specs written on the device? [13:54] daftykins: it says "Operating voltage 5V" but that could mean practically anything since it's not the input. [13:55] :/ [13:55] weird [13:55] nothing beside the socket at all? [13:56] daftykins: nope, the socket is just a wire [13:57] ie there's a wire that comes out of the keyboard with a female socket for you to plug the power into [13:58] oh that's weird [13:58] the G19 does the same thing [13:59] what does it say on the wall-wart they provided? [13:59] wall-wart? [13:59] mains adapter [13:59] I don't have it, if I had it that'd make life a whole lot easier ;) [13:59] i suspect Azelphur has been without from the start [13:59] indeed [14:00] seems odd to me to provide a powered keyboard without an adapter [14:00] i suspect it's second hand ;) [14:00] indeed [14:01] you could get a multivolt adapter and try your luck [14:01] diddledan: well was hoping to know without trying my luck and destroying it :P [14:01] although, I think it's broken already tbh. [14:01] but if it's 5v internally then I suspect it'll be 5v input [14:01] wow. #muslimapologies is the oddest hashtag i ever read [14:02] foobarry: is it bad? [14:02] its weird. supposed to be ironic messages from muslims "aplogising" for things they shouldn't have to apologise for [14:03] Azelphur: it won't be less than 5v because that's what it uses internally, so assuming it's 5v input your only concern is the polarity [14:03] indeed, that was my thinking [14:04] I get the impression that most DC adapters these days are + on the inner-pole [14:04] * zmoylan-pi sees diddledan in immediate future holding smoking piece of hardware cursing that assumption :-) [14:05] zmoylan-pi: I tend to check like Azelphur is doing [14:05] hehe [14:05] if it's unclear then I'll only use the same brand of adapter [14:06] e.g. most netgear boxes for consumerland tend to be the same power requirements [14:06] oh well, I gotta go for now, if anyone happens to find it let me know :) [14:14] Azelphur: open it up and see where the wire goes, will be very easy to see which is +ve and which is -ve [14:15] -ve will go to some ground plane, +ve may well even be marked on the board, and will go to the power pins of whatever ICs are in it [14:22] Dear Agony Aunt, am I normal? I'm a 34 years old nerd and I'm considering making the information leaflet to be included with the wedding invitations with LaTeX. PLZ REPLY SOON!!!111 xxx Myrtti xxx [14:23] using LaTeX makes you a fetishist [14:23] some people have allergies. you gotta remember that [14:24] so for them you'll have to use something other than LaTeX [14:25] putting the details in a qr code so guests can scan the info directly into their phones makes you a nerd [14:25] zmoylan-pi: don't give her ideas! [14:25] with klingon translation... :-p [14:25] QR code confetti [14:27] QR is already a given, I'm marrying this man https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/mobile-barcoder/?src=userprofile [14:28] Duncan Sample? that's a rare surname. [14:29] saw a brochure the other day that had a page full of QR codes in such low res that none of them worked. obviously the people putting it together had no clue what a QR code was and how to test it [14:29] http://picturesofpeoplescanningqrcodes.tumblr.com/ [14:30] lmao [14:30] is that indicative that nobody scans qr codes? [14:30] i scanned one at oggcamp once [14:30] because the url was so long [14:30] diddledan: yes [14:30] i take pics of them and scan them when i get home :-) === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [14:35] i know someone who has a qr code for their wifi [14:35] so you just scan it and you're connected without having to type the pw in [14:36] how does that work? [14:36] oh cool [14:36] standard feature on android [14:36] she has it hanging in her lounge [14:36] i was gonna do that for mine [14:36] she also but an nfc tag behind the picture [14:36] but really i don't want everyone jumping on mine :D [14:36] well, it's on the inside of her house [14:36] good if you have multiple SSID [14:36] I like that idea popey, may have to look at doing that! [14:36] if strangers are in her lounge, she has bigger things to worry about [14:36] visitors SSID [14:36] yeah [14:37] shame ubuntu phone doesn't do that yet [14:37] i have to type the silly long key in [14:37] i have friends of friends pop by sometimes, wouldn't necessarily want them all :) [14:37] what phones will ubuntu phone work on? [14:37] it currently works on nexus 4 [14:37] new phone will be available very soon [14:38] i was hoping my next phone would be ubuntu but i ran out of waiting time [14:38] i just tell people i'll email them the wifi key :-) [14:38] is the wifi key your email address? ☻ [14:39] And done! [14:39] Will test it when I get home :) [14:39] * popey needs to finish his talk for xda developer conf [14:41] * dutchie needs to finish oggcamp talk [14:41] * popey is re-using his xda talk for oggcamp ☻ [14:56] popey: cheapskate, we'll start calling you jono ;) [15:13] anyone have virgin's 152Mb cable? [15:13] theoretically i've had it a few days - but i cant say ive seen speed change at all. [15:14] I have the 60 and rarely get above ~ 25-30Mbit/s [15:14] Because this is mostly OK for my needs, I haven't bothered complaining [15:15] But "speed" is a vague definition [15:15] i "had" 60, and usually got 60ish [15:15] Latency? You're unlikely to see improvements [15:15] i now "have" 152, apparently... and i'm getting 50-60 still :D [15:15] Yeah, but is the limit at your end, or the server? [15:42] I had the 60 it got upgraded so now I'm on 100 I get between 80-100 normally but it can be fairly low sometimes depending on the site [15:50] i ave 100 now... [15:50] well ~105 [15:52] * foobarry installing MAAS [15:52] MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS [15:55] Monkeys As A Service? [15:56] MAAS as a service [15:56] yey monkeys! [15:56] I expect shakespear in a week [15:56] http://i.imgur.com/MzdbQSj.jpg [15:57] what you doing? [15:57] lotsa putes [15:57] we haz 20 computers [15:57] \o/ [15:57] for running openstack testing [15:57] aah [15:58] not for bitcoining then ? :-p [15:58] nah, not my thing [15:58] dual network? red + blue? [16:00] it's annoying that switch vendors are shoving extra fibre ports on them to justify keeping the price high [16:00] I see 4 on that unit? [16:01] AFAIK u need dual homed nodes [16:08] anyone try gnome alongside unity here? [16:08] i'm dying to try it again, been 2 years since i've looked [16:08] but i can't risk my unity environment. [16:09] is 13.10 or 13.12 stable enought to install and run in tandem with unity? [16:09] i'm on 14.04.. [16:12] and this is an example of why version numbers on their own are useless - try being more explicit :-) [16:13] 13.10 == saucy. 13.12 == beta of trusty? [16:13] blurg, sorry, haha, no, Gnome versions 13.10 and 13.12.. not ubuntu versions [16:13] >.< [16:13] :) [16:13] i think you mean 3.10 and 3.12 [16:14] ..... arrg [16:14] i want to stab my own face through the internet now [16:14] here, let me do that for you [16:14] *pokity poke poke* [16:14] so back to the question,, has anyone installed Gnome 3.10 or 3.12 alongside unity on ubuntu 14.04? [16:15] any experience on the install proceedure, or making sure your unity doesn't 'splode on you:? [16:16] if you have the space to spare I'd suggest dual-booting with ubuntu-gnome (is that the right name?) [16:17] http://ubuntugnome.org/ [16:22] Good morning peeps :) [16:22] Is there a utility to test the health of an SSD? [16:23] Standard disk utility? [16:23] The cogwheely thing has a SMART / selftest menu [16:23] The what? [16:24] For each disk, there is a button with a cogwheel when you select it [16:24] Okay [16:25] Mine says 1 bad sector [16:25] I'll reboot into Ubuntu and hope the system stays stable long enough to run a test [16:25] Not sure eSata supports full SMART [16:25] Or maybe SSD doesn't support it [16:26] Lots more stats on my spinning rust [16:26] usb doesn't support smart usually afaict [16:26] esata should be just as capable as internal sata - it's only a different connector otherwise the same [16:27] Nope... not sure if this eSATA port is just a USB one mounted on a header inside the case or not [16:27] But some SMART [16:27] So I guess it's just that the disk doesn't support some metrics [16:27] 841 power cycles! [16:27] 1 failed sector [16:28] a lot of the standard hdd smart stuff is not needed on ssd so they just don't expose it [16:28] NET||abuse: ubuntu heavily patches gtk which causes a lot of problems in gnome [16:29] but the patches are only active if unity is installed [16:29] installing gnome along side unity is unlikely to break unity and very likely to break gnome [16:30] yey? [16:30] :-p [16:30] * bigcalm drums fingers [16:32] Self-test in progress -- 90% remaining [16:32] It's been like that for a while [16:32] Air temp has increased from 37C to 42C [16:33] Is there any need for swap these days? [16:39] Oo, 20% done [16:47] bigcalm: depends what you do with the computer [16:55] popey: what's it good for? [16:55] I don't use sleep or hibinate [16:58] so nobobdy tried gnome 3.xx in tandem with unity on 14.04? [16:58] i know you suggested using gnome respin, but I don't have the disk space. [16:59] certainly not the will to repartition :) [17:44] bigcalm: I generally don't bother with swap [17:44] intrbiz: collecting the keys to our new house on Monday. Unlikely that I'll be attending badminton :S [17:45] bigcalm: no worries, seems like an important excuse [17:45] Contracts were exchanged today. Flipping stressful time [17:45] Ta [17:48] bigcalm: and then you've got to move [17:48] intrbiz: We gave our 1 month notice to our landlady today. So we have a little time [17:49] But the sooner we're out, the less I have to spend on bills for 2 properties [17:51] sure [17:52] bigcalm: how is the ssd? [17:52] intrbiz: still running the SMART test [17:53] The machine hasn't frozen yet [17:53] bigcalm: right, is it hanging or panicing? [17:53] I'm going to reinstall Ubuntu later just to be on the safe side and see how it copes tomorrow [17:54] intrbiz: the system appears to slow down over about 10 seconds and then freezes. Have to do a hard reset to use the machine again [17:54] Thing is, once I've done a hard reset, it works for the rest of the day without problem [17:54] bigcalm: got swap? how much ram? [17:56] 8gb ram. Swap is 4.3gb, but swap is off [17:56] intrbiz: the freezing happens even if I do nothing with the system [18:00] What should I look for in syslog? [18:00] I assume that syslog is where kernel panics go [18:01] bigcalm: oh nice on the house keys dude :) [18:01] bigcalm: often a panic only get logged to the console [18:02] bigcalm: Whats the issue with the SSD? Its not a silly boot issue where half the time it fails to boot & goes into a text loop is it? [18:02] bigcalm: the last thing in messages before the report might be of interest [18:03] DJones: I don't know if there's a problem with the SSD. Just something worth checking [18:04] bigcalm: have you tried running memtest, might be worth ruling out dodgy memory [18:04] intrbiz: yep, left it running for 2 passes (that takes a long time). No errors [18:06] bigcalm: hmm, ok [18:07] syslog - http://paste.ubuntu.com/8419845/ [18:08] There's not /var/log/messages in Ubuntu :| Does it all get sent to syslog instead? [18:11] lastlog and faillog are just full of ^@ [18:12] bigcalm: /var/log/syslog is essentially /var/log/messages, different files names in different distros [18:13] Right [18:13] SSD check just finished and it passed okay from what I can see [18:14] dmesg.0 doesn't show anything helpful that I can see [18:15] Xorg.0.log.old - http://paste.ubuntu.com/8419888/ [18:16] It's not included at the bottom of that paste, but it's full of ^@ when I view the file with less [18:17] What other logs might I look at? [18:20] what's the SMART data on the SSD? smartctl -a /dev/sdX [18:23] http://paste.ubuntu.com/8419943/ [18:24] bigcalm: smart looks fine [18:25] \o/ six giffgaff SIMs active! [18:25] thats 8 total in this house [18:25] ETOOMANYPHONENUMBERS [18:26] bigcalm: ah have you read about the firmware bug with them, it was meant to only be causing poor read speeds after 6+ months of use, but there may well be an update available [18:54] ah they must not have released it yet [18:57] popey: thanks god for addressbooks right ;) [18:58] heh [19:03] popey: it's the best quiz in the world http://www.buzzfeed.com/hannahjewell/can-you-guess-how-old-these-kittens-are?bffbuk#4g9h0q8 [19:07] 15 out of 15 [19:46] haven't got any cashback on Gigggaff in yonks [19:50] i fear my new phone results in requiring new data plan cos i'm browsingn faster now [19:50] haha [19:57] my father in law just bought iphone for him and m-i-l [19:57] i sent him a couple of giffgaff sims for them [19:57] another pair lost ;) [19:59] my gg sim was old as not a push-out microsim option, so i had to cut with scissors [19:59] just roughly cut round another micro sim. seems to work ok [20:00] i was in a similar situation when i bought my Nexus 4. i popped along the high-street here, my telco didn't offer any help but a mate works in a rival telco and chopped it down with a glorified holepunch for me \o/ [20:00] yeah, i cut my first sim manually when i switched from htc hero to iphone [20:01] htc hero AKA jimmy hill [21:12] joy. amazon aws/ec2 two days' notice of reboot [21:13] what, are they running windows or something? :-) [21:14] amazon? [21:14] I would figure they're running amazon linux [21:14] diddledan: I got about 1 months notice for a reboot on mine [21:15] intrbiz: we did on another machine but this is specifically highlighted as short-notice [21:15] diddledan: does it have local storage? [21:15] the email is subjectified: "Near-term AWS maintenance event notice" [21:17] they also state "You will not be able to stop/start or re-launch instances in order to avoid this maintenance update." [21:18] right [21:21] where do ubuntu folk tend to put there server ssl certs / keys? [21:26] intrbiz: I believe we're moving to /srv/domain.example.com/ssl with the related website at .../htdocs [21:26] but that's just my co [21:27] not an official word [21:27] diddledan: ok [21:28] diddledan: I personally do /etc/apache2/ssl.key and /etc/apache2/ssl.crt [21:28] the problem with that is you're then limited to one cert [21:28] so you can't vhost [21:28] they are folders containing domain.name.crt or domain.name.key [21:29] aah [21:29] I figured files [21:29] sorry, I should have been clearer [21:29] I shouldn't have assumed - "assumption is the mother of all flip-ups" [21:31] diddledan: it sure is, but I'm fairly sure life without assumptions is impossible [21:31] or at least rather impractical [21:31] and now I need to find somewhere that has that movie [21:31] :-p [21:32] (Under Siege 2: Dark Territory) [21:32] and yes that is from memory [21:32] :-p [21:33] diddledan: I have a copy here [21:34] I think I've got a copy on DVD but that's sooo last millenium [21:34] shamefully along with a few other Seagal films [21:55] intrbiz: /etc/ssl/private for the key & csr /etc/ssl/certs for the cert [21:55] I think that might be a debian thing as well [21:56] * bigcalm backs up stuff before reinstalling [21:56] Going to be a fun evening [21:56] bigcalm: yeh, but I really dislike sticking server cers in with a bunch of other certs [21:56] certs* [21:56] intrbiz: don't put them in the certs dir then, make your own [21:57] :) [21:57] The private dir will only have snake oil in it [21:57] yeh [22:18] intrbiz, i use /etc/ssl/certs/hostname.pem and /etc/ssl/private/hostname.key [22:34] yeah we like to keep the cert/key on the same filesystem as the website so that in the cloud we can just spin up a new ubuntu machine with our filesystem attached and have everything magically work