[04:56] Good morning [04:57] good morning pitti === thumper is now known as thumper-afk [06:15] morning [07:19] good morning desktopers! [07:20] hey seb128 [07:20] lut didrocks ;-) [07:24] hey seb128 [07:24] hey darkxst [07:25] seb128, empathy is working fine under gnome now with my Adwaita patch in Bug 1339352 [07:25] bug 1339352 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.12" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1339352 [07:26] darkxst, great [07:29] darkxst, btw I just commented on the gnome-desktop ffe, you are sure than updating gnome-session is ok? [07:29] they dropped the gtk session dialogs iirc and those are needed in some session types? [07:33] "13_display_session_properties.patch, Dropped session UI is gone " [07:33] that also I think is not true, I don't see it being dropped in 3.10 === maclin_ is now known as maclin [08:05] bounjour tout le monde [08:08] Laney, salut, ça va bien ? [08:12] pas mal [08:12] et toi? [08:13] ça va bien merci ! [08:13] I ordered the new aphex twin album from japan and now I'm getting emails in japanese [08:13] it has my address in it so I am going to assume it means 'this has been sent' [08:14] haha [08:14] send the email to didrocks, he can read it for you ;-) [08:14] some training before he goes there! [08:14] ahah, "yeah yeah" [08:15] this is the crucial line [08:15] ご注文いただいた商品を本日、Amazon.co.jp が発送し、ご注文の処理が完了しましたので、お知らせいたします [08:16] lot of weird chars in there, but it's from amazon.co.jp I can tell you :p [08:17] arigato [08:28] 14.10 top errors are funny [08:28] mostly new phone stuff [08:28] that's what is the most tested/run in utopic [08:28] you think there are no desktop users? [08:28] I don't believe that [08:29] the top one has 69 occurrences which is also not believable to me [08:29] I think that they full test/autopilot/etc 100 times a day each [08:29] they don't* [08:29] well [08:29] in previous cycles we had the top ones at like 10 a day [08:29] wait, I had it on day [08:29] now those counts are better [08:30] but yeah, I didn't say we don't have desktop users [08:30] but lot of those turn off reporting/dismiss the prompts/etc I think [08:30] and they don't run a full testsuite in loop [08:31] so I think we just exercice more stress testing on the phone image [08:31] it's noised out desktop issues [08:31] well, set the arch filter on amd64 [08:31] that's probably representative of desktop [08:32] ubuntu-push-client url-dispatcher at the top?! [08:32] yeah, people working on touch and installing unity8 stuff on their desktop and hitting those bugs [08:40] anyway, I thought that the goal of errors was to allow us to prioritise issues users are hitting [08:41] Canonical QA reporting to the same instance as end users isn't furthering that IMHO [08:41] how do you suggest resolving the problem you describe? [08:41] to me the problem is not new [08:41] somehow allowing these reports to be subtracted [08:42] the number of reports we get in unstable series is not significant enough to be useful [08:42] like in previous cycles we had the most reported issues being at 10 instances a day and they falling to 5 - 4 -3 -1 -1 [08:43] e.g not enough report to have a statistically useful set [08:43] it's more useful than knowing that every time url-dispatcher is run on the phone it crashes in the same way [08:43] then when we flag stable that jumps and the bugs topping a vastly different [08:43] or maybe we just say errors is a waste of time for unstable releases [08:44] +1 [08:44] that's my feeling for several cycles [08:44] which is kind of crap because it should be a good way of telling us what to work on [08:44] and nothing new/specific to the fact that touch runs some qa [08:44] well, we can't invent users [08:44] our unstable userbase is just too small [08:44] or they don't report issues through whoopsie [08:44] dunno about that [08:44] or those issues fail to retrace [08:45] I bet they just disable whoopsie [08:45] or whatever [08:45] or a combinaison of those [08:45] yeah, likely [08:45] Moin. [08:45] hey Sweetsha1k [08:45] Laney, well, I don't say we have not enough users [08:45] ricotz: 4.3.2~rc2 seems to be good to go for the PPA. === Sweetsha1k is now known as Sweetshark [08:45] but maybe we need 1M users to have enough datas for an useful e.u.c view [08:45] and we only have 100k [08:45] dunno [08:45] (making up numbers" [08:47] Laney, but on the daily view, if you skip the touch stuff, the first desktop issue is an apport one with 11 reports [08:47] that could be one user having a problem and trying to report it 10 times [08:47] Sweetshark, no [08:48] 'week' is more useful than 'day' [08:48] Sweetshark, hi, i cc'ed you to a bug [08:48] Laney, same issue, there one apport high, then the second seems to be an apport with 36 reports in a week, that means 5 a day, for what we know that could be pitti while hacking on it all day :p [08:48] hey seb128 [08:49] Sweetshark, this is a good example to hold of the copying to the dedicated versioned ppa a bit [08:49] seb128: so, hibernate is indeed still supposed to be disabled in polkit-desktop-privs [08:49] seb128: you are sure you didn't enable it locally to test something? [08:49] pitti, hey ;-) [08:49] pitti, it's disabled ... do you have the hibernate item in your indicator-session menu? [08:49] seb128: no, I don't [08:49] hum [08:49] so maybe I hacked up something and I don't remember :/ [08:50] pitti, the pkla from polkit-desktop-privs is correct [08:50] pitti, what would an override for that be copied to? [08:50] $ gdbus call --system -d org.freedesktop.login1 -o /org/freedesktop/login1 -m org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.CanSuspend [08:50] ('yes',) [08:50] $ gdbus call --system -d org.freedesktop.login1 -o /org/freedesktop/login1 -m org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.CanHibernate [08:50] ('na',) [08:50] seb128: can you try that? [08:51] 'yes' for both [08:51] seb128: could go into /var, or perhaps also /etc/polkit-1/ [08:51] seb128: (warning, you can't read that dir as user) [08:51] $ sudo find /etc/polkit-1/ -type f [08:52] should find 51-ubuntu-admin.conf, 50-localauthority.conf, 50-nullbackend.conf [08:52] /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/10-vendor.d/com.ubuntu.desktop.pkla is the only one referring to hibernate [08:52] and it has "no" [08:53] /etc only has those 3 files [08:53] hm, that's odd then [08:53] is there a way to ask polkit what file it loads/in what order? [08:55] seb128: we can try with pkcheck [08:55] need to change train, bbl [08:55] pitti, k [08:56] pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/8424103/ [08:56] hmm, 'yes' for me too [08:56] how did you get that output? [08:56] * Laney just knows pkcheck --action-id [08:56] pkaction --action-id org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate --verbose [08:57] nice [08:57] Laney, do you have an hibernate in your session indicator? [08:57] no [08:57] :-( [08:57] logind still says 'na' [08:57] for some reason [08:57] * ogra_ is sure that means "yes" in *some* language :) [08:58] seb128 or anyone, does 14.04 or 14.10 adapts to HiDPI screens automatically by scaling things up? [08:58] ypwong, 14.04 [08:58] well, >= 14.04 [08:59] not sure if it's automatic [08:59] we have a slider in the settings [08:59] seb128, yes, wanna know if it's automatic [08:59] Trevinho, ^ [09:00] are there any enhancements of hidpi support in 14.10? [09:00] some bugfixes but those are being SRUed as well [09:01] got it [09:05] ypwong, I think unity tries to be clever with hidpi and apply settings automatically on start but I'm unsure, Trevinho should be able to help when he's around [09:05] I think pkaction is bogus [09:05] it's telling me 'yes' for hibernate even though I made it not authorised any more [09:06] seb128, ok, will check with him when he's around [09:08] Laney, what would be the right check? [09:09] pkcheck --action-id foo --process $$ && echo authorised [09:09] seb128: pkaction is just querying the .policy files (not the overrides), you want pkcheck [09:10] yeah, just shows you the default [09:10] the docs don't explain this very well [09:10] seb128: indeed, the pk priv is true for me, too [09:11] seb128: I suppose hibernate is n/a for me as I don't have swap [09:11] seb128: is there a bug # for this? [09:11] ah, me neither [09:11] anyway I fixed pk-d-p [09:11] seb128: maybe the recent sponsored upload broke some syntax [09:11] $ pkcheck --action-id org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate --process $$; echo "right" [09:11] right [09:11] there's a bunch of other actions which imply hibernate [09:11] one second [09:12] hm, the override file looks alright [09:12] yeah [09:12] it didn't change [09:12] did logind change? [09:13] not recently, we've had 208 for months [09:13] but then again, not sure how long this regression has existed [09:13] that's buggy since I'm on utopic [09:13] if that added these new actions then it's this [09:13] for that matter, we sohuld at least disable org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate-multiple-sessions [09:13] pitti, ^ [09:13] exactly that [09:13] I noticed it much earlier in the cycle [09:13] in the policy file you can see these 'imply' .hibernate [09:13] so it's not enough to disable this one action [09:13] but there was too much going on, I never took the time to try to debug it [09:14] aah! [09:14] [09:14] org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate [09:15] http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/policykit-desktop-privileges_0.19_all.deb [09:15] try that [09:15] Laney, that fixes it [09:16] Laney: ah, you're on it? I just built a fixed source package [09:16] policykit-desktop-privileges_0.19.dsc [09:16] Laney, pitti, how come you guys didn't have that entry? because you have no swap? [09:16] erk, http://paste.ubuntu.com/8424201/ [09:16] seb128: right [09:16] I have 16 GB of RAM, what do I need swap for :) [09:17] pitti, you changed name? ;-) [09:17] erk, used dch -m :) [09:17] lol [09:17] pitti: 25/09 10:11:23 anyway I fixed pk-d-p [09:17] :-) [09:17] Laney: cheers, i'll discard mine then [09:18] yeah. 32 GB -> no swap [09:18] my laptop has this bug though, guess I never noticed there [09:18] 4G i386 here [09:18] swap :p [09:18] it's time for a refresh [09:18] bbl [09:20] seems like it [09:21] still 8 months on this old beast for me [09:21] it'll be 5 years old then, which is like 125 in laptop years [09:21] yeah, mine is over 4 years now [09:21] I had the refresh in june 2013 [09:22] never used it? [09:22] but I want an xps 13 and I keep being delayed [09:22] first I wanted to haswell refreshed hwd [09:22] then desrt got it and told me about the noise issues [09:23] since I'm waiting for the new motherboard which resolves those [09:23] they apparently start rolling those out a few weeks ago [09:23] hopefully it should be good now ;-) [09:24] http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/laptop/f/3518/p/19538215/20674604#20674604 [09:25] nice, time to order [09:27] indeed [09:28] is there a bug # for this hibernate issue btw? [09:28] seb128: i was considering that laptop too but i'd rather wait for others' reports on new issues before ordering - after all, it's not exactly cheap [09:29] seb's got money to burn [09:29] lol [09:29] :] [09:29] his mattress is stuffed with 500 euro notes [09:29] FACT [09:30] Laney, I bet you 1k€ it's not true [09:30] :p [09:31] * Laney runs [09:31] searching the european dell site for "ubuntu" turns up a laptop featuring "linux ubuntu 11.11" [09:32] urg, don't ctrl-r IRC [09:32] Laney, I missed you reply I bet :p [09:33] morning from Lond [09:33] on [09:33] hey willcooke [09:33] not Swed [09:33] en? [09:34] right, what happened there? [09:34] They found a volunteer from PES to go instead. Flights for me meant that I wouldnt get there until lunch time, so there wasn't much point [09:34] so I'm here instead [09:35] nothing more uplifting to the soul than a trip to London anyway [09:35] seb128: do you know of a bug for the hibernate issue? [09:36] willcooke: if you're at blue fin find cyphermox and invite him out for a beer, he'll appreciate that :) [09:36] Laney, no, but I can open one if you want [09:36] nah [09:36] davmor2, I'll see what I can do :) [09:37] ah, we haven't even met before [09:37] someone stand up and wave [09:37] cyphermox: then it's a perfect excuse for a beer :) [09:37] We might have in passing cyphermox [09:37] indeed [09:38] beer good [09:38] though maybe it's a little early for that today ;) [09:38] is it me or the whole ci infra is slow? [09:38] :D [09:38] davmor2: did you notice/experience that? ^ [09:39] like, even sshing to a machine and typing is slow like death [09:39] willcooke: meet cyphermox he works on network manager, cyphermox meet willcooke he is a user of network manager, there now you have some common ground and willcooke knows to blame you for all of his network manager woes :P [09:39] hey willcooke [09:39] seb128: ah, when I got my new ThinkPad I considered waiting for haswell too, but in the end I thought that the previous one (Ivy Bridge?) was good enough :) [09:39] davmor2: another interesting fact is that he almost had to manage me ;) [09:40] seb128: still impressive how much better they get; 4 -> 16 GB RAM, faster, bigger/faster SSD, and still it eats even less power than my x201 [09:40] pitti, well, I was decided like a month before the new model was coming out [09:40] cyphermox: man that was a lucky escape for willcooke ;) [09:40] yeah [09:40] pitti, and it's always nice to be able to have some extra hours on battery ;-) [09:41] I get like 2.5 hours [09:41] seb128: yeah, the next flight to DC will come for sure :) [09:41] Laney: urgh [09:41] it's going to be weird having good battery life [09:41] * pitti pats 10 hours [09:41] woah [09:41] and that's without haswell [09:41] it would be like 13 otherwise ;-) [09:41] i. e. 8 to 9 W drain and a 100 Wh battery [09:42] seb128: I can get it to 13 without wifi/USB tethering, i. e. on the plane [09:42] but the effing mobile phone draws quite a lot -- I wish there was a "don't charge over USB" button [09:43] anyway, "first world problems" :) [09:43] hehe [10:04] pitti: 13 hours laptop battery on a plane in flight mode? [10:04] that's pretty impressive [10:04] my laptop lasts only about 2 hours [10:04] but it might also be caused by playing Kerbal Space Program ;) [10:06] pitti: you could always not plug the effing phone into the usb :P [10:07] davmor2: -ENOINTERNET then :) (I'm tethering) [10:07] * didrocks grumbles on docker automatically created images regressing again and go back to a local created image [10:08] pitti: ah sorry mis-read it as without wifi or usb tethering, ie on the plane [10:12] hmmm, my firefox lost all the stored passwords yesterday .... [10:33] first medium tests passing in the CI infra \o/ [10:34] phew, now, let's put in real test runs === thumper-afk is now known as thumper [11:29] hello desktop team [11:30] some of the users are affected by Bug 445333 on precise & trusty [11:30] bug 445333 in Ubuntu "remember password on printing to windows printers does not work" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/445333 [11:31] I have analysed the possibility to backport it and it's fairly easy for trusty [11:31] could one of the sponsors could take a look and mark it as affecting precise & trusty? [11:34] jdstrand, hey, how do I turn off apparmor for click apps on touch? [11:35] dgadomski, hey, you should be able to propose a nomination for a serie no? [11:35] it's one of the link under the bugtable at the top [11:38] seb128: I have "Also affects project" and "Also affects distribution/package" there, didn't see series there [11:38] dgadomski, hum, maybe it's restricted to some teams [11:38] seb128: could you give me a hint under which of them I should look? [11:38] you don't have it I guess [11:38] targetted utopic now [11:39] I doubt we are going to backport to precise [11:40] and it also affects gtk+2.0 (the user experiences this in firefox) [11:40] I have prepared debdiffs for trusty (for gtk3 and gtk2) [11:41] great, thanks [11:41] I've added gtk2 to the list [11:41] ok, I will upload them and appreciate having a look at them [11:41] thanks [11:41] is the issue fixed in 3.12? [11:41] if not we need to get the fixes in utopic first [11:42] let me check that [11:43] unfortunately not, it's since 3.13.8 [11:43] k [11:43] so we need that in utopic first [11:43] ok, I will make a debdiff for utopic first [11:44] thanks [11:44] seb128: thank you :) [11:45] btw. there is also another issue: bug 1104230 [11:45] bug 1104230 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "DisplayPort 1.2 MST support is missing in the Intel driver" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1104230 [11:45] the fix for it can be easily cherry-picked for utopic [11:45] are you aware if the utopic kernel is available for trusty in any package? [11:46] I was told that there are those -lts- packages that may provide it [11:46] dgadomski, can you mention it to mlankhorst on #ubuntu-devel? [11:46] seb128: sure, thanks! [11:46] thanks === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [12:06] mvo: does update-manager have support for pulling people out of old-releases? [12:06] Laney: it should do that, yes [12:07] Laney: like if you want to go from "unsupported1 -> unsupported2 -> barely-supported" ? [12:07] Laney: that should work [12:07] I was just dealing with a friend in this situation [12:07] Laney: did it not work? [12:07] he was on quantal(!) but his sources.list was I guess still on a.u.c [12:08] hmm, I maybe misremembering but I thought it would rewrite to something sensible on do-release-upgrade [12:08] he said 'something' went wrong but I was helping remotely so not sure what happened exactly [12:08] Laney: what commend did you run? do-release-upgrade/update-manager -d? [12:09] I just got him to put old-releases in sources.list and will take a look myself tomorrow [12:09] ok [12:09] the interesting thing here might be that release+1 is also on old-releases [12:09] just wondering if this scenario is supported at all [12:09] Laney: yeah, I think that works, but it will be a bit of a pain as it takes a long time [12:09] Laney: to upgrade and then to upgrade agian [12:09] again [12:10] to do it properly is q->r->s->t [12:10] Laney: might be quicker to install trusty with the keep-home-intact option of the installer [12:10] yep [12:10] just concerned that he got left in a tricky situation [12:11] lucky that he knows someone who can drive apt ... [12:11] did update-manager not show him that he should upgrade? was that the issue? [12:11] (its always painful for me to hear these stories where a super-hero needs to come in to save the day :/ [12:12] I will see what u-m is telling him tomorrow [12:12] thanks [12:31] seb128, was just renamed for 3,11, but gah maybe I pushed the wrong branch [12:31] 3.10 even [12:32] darkxst, well the changelog has 3.10 [12:32] darkxst, did you see my comment about the gtk dialog and wether they are required for fallback sessions? [12:33] seb128, look through emails now [12:35] seb128, I don't know if it breaks fallback [12:36] update was actually blocked on api changes that cause crashes [12:36] right, well I looked at the git log [12:36] and it drops the gtk dialogs [12:36] which I'm pretty sure Laney needs [12:37] (to mention somebody using a gnome-panel type of session) [12:38] seb128, gnome-session can stay at 3.9.x whatever, its no big deal [12:38] darkxst, I've no strong opinion, just pointing out what I see as an issue [12:38] we can also update and revert the gtk dialog dropping in a patch [12:39] seb128, does unity use those? [12:39] darkxst, btw empathy looks good, does Jackson or you want to merge propose the change so we can turn the bug into a ffe request? [12:39] darkxst, no, unity has its own dialogs [12:41] seb128, so why revert? session-properties or whatever its called was just renamed for 3;12 [12:41] dropped in 3.14 [12:42] darkxst, revert what? [12:42] there are 2 things there [12:42] 1 is the gtk logout dialogs [12:42] the other one is the capplet to manage autostarts [12:42] the dialogs are needed, otherwise people using gnome-panel sessions can't logout anymore I think [12:42] which is what I suggest reverting [12:43] what = the dropping of the dialog [12:43] unity and gnome-shell have their own dialogs [12:43] but gnome-panel doesn't [12:43] [12:43] in debian/panel I don't have logout or shutdown dialogs any more [12:43] the capplet issue is orthogonal [12:43] Laney, with the ppa for gnome-desktop right? [12:43] no, unstable [12:43] oh [12:43] well, same issue likely [12:43] same thing [12:44] gnome-session 3.10 dropped them [12:44] just saying [12:44] well [12:44] do you consider that acceptable? [12:45] it's not great [12:45] seb128, ok, happy to leave gnome-session whereever its at [12:45] how hard is it to keep them? [12:45] are panel upstream going to fix that? [12:45] mitya57: do you know? [12:46] Laney, last I heard alberts was fighting with upstream trying to get maintainership [12:46] Laney, I think it's basically reverting https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-session/commit/?id=705699b2799a3434d1a8f35c9a92868a5057f73e [12:46] Laney, which should be fine at least for this cycle [12:46] try that [12:47] but as far as a the gnome-desktop transition, gnome-session can stay as is, just a rebuild [12:47] cool [12:48] doesn't it use idle monitor? [12:48] Laney, no [12:49] k I believe you [12:49] * Laney goes to lunch [12:49] gnome-session runs way before idle-monitor is relevant [12:49] * darkxst goes to sleep] [12:49] unstable is mostly fixed for gi now [12:50]