[04:56] <pitti> Good morning
[04:57] <sarnold> good morning pitti
[06:15] <didrocks> morning
[07:19] <seb128> good morning desktopers!
[07:20] <didrocks> hey seb128
[07:20] <seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
[07:24] <darkxst> hey seb128
[07:24] <seb128> hey darkxst
[07:25] <darkxst> seb128, empathy is working fine under gnome now with my Adwaita patch in Bug 1339352
[07:26] <seb128> darkxst, great
[07:29] <seb128> darkxst, btw I just commented on the gnome-desktop ffe, you are sure than updating gnome-session is ok?
[07:29] <seb128> they dropped the gtk session dialogs iirc and those are needed in some session types?
[07:33] <seb128> "13_display_session_properties.patch, Dropped session UI is gone "
[07:33] <seb128> that also I think is not true, I don't see it being dropped in 3.10
[08:05] <Laney> bounjour tout le monde
[08:08] <seb128> Laney, salut, ça va bien ?
[08:12] <Laney> pas mal
[08:12] <Laney> et toi?
[08:13] <seb128> ça va bien merci !
[08:13] <Laney> I ordered the new aphex twin album from japan and now I'm getting emails in japanese
[08:13] <Laney> it has my address in it so I am going to assume it means 'this has been sent'
[08:14] <seb128> haha
[08:14] <seb128> send the email to didrocks, he can read it for you ;-)
[08:14] <seb128> some training before he goes there!
[08:14] <didrocks> ahah, "yeah yeah"
[08:15] <Laney> this is the crucial line
[08:15] <Laney> ご注文いただいた商品を本日、Amazon.co.jp が発送し、ご注文の処理が完了しましたので、お知らせいたします
[08:16] <seb128> lot of weird chars in there, but it's from amazon.co.jp I can tell you :p
[08:17] <Laney> arigato
[08:28] <Laney> 14.10 top errors are funny
[08:28] <Laney> mostly new phone stuff
[08:28] <seb128> that's what is the most tested/run in utopic
[08:28] <Laney> you think there are no desktop users?
[08:28] <Laney> I don't believe that
[08:29] <Laney> the top one has 69 occurrences which is also not believable to me
[08:29] <seb128> I think that they full test/autopilot/etc 100 times a day each
[08:29] <seb128> they don't*
[08:29] <seb128> well
[08:29] <seb128> in previous cycles we had the top ones at like 10 a day
[08:29] <Laney> wait, I had it on day
[08:29] <Laney> now those counts are better
[08:30] <seb128> but yeah, I didn't say we don't have desktop users
[08:30] <seb128> but lot of those turn off reporting/dismiss the prompts/etc I think
[08:30] <seb128> and they don't run a full testsuite in loop
[08:31] <seb128> so I think we just exercice more stress testing on the phone image
[08:31] <Laney> it's noised out desktop issues
[08:31] <seb128> well, set the arch filter on amd64
[08:31] <seb128> that's probably representative of desktop
[08:32] <Laney> ubuntu-push-client url-dispatcher at the top?!
[08:32] <seb128> yeah, people working on touch and installing unity8 stuff on their desktop and hitting those bugs
[08:40] <Laney> anyway, I thought that the goal of errors was to allow us to prioritise issues users are hitting
[08:41] <Laney> Canonical QA reporting to the same instance as end users isn't furthering that IMHO
[08:41] <seb128> how do you suggest resolving the problem you describe?
[08:41] <seb128> to me the problem is not new
[08:41] <Laney> somehow allowing these reports to be subtracted
[08:42] <seb128> the number of reports we get in unstable series is not significant enough to be useful
[08:42] <seb128> like in previous cycles we had the most reported issues being at 10 instances a day and they falling to 5 - 4 -3 -1 -1
[08:43] <seb128> e.g not enough report to have a statistically useful set
[08:43] <Laney> it's more useful than knowing that every time url-dispatcher is run on the phone it crashes in the same way
[08:43] <seb128> then when we flag stable that jumps and the bugs topping a vastly different
[08:43] <Laney> or maybe we just say errors is a waste of time for unstable releases
[08:44] <seb128> +1
[08:44] <seb128> that's my feeling for several cycles
[08:44] <Laney> which is kind of crap because it should be a good way of telling us what to work on
[08:44] <seb128> and nothing new/specific to the fact that touch runs some qa
[08:44] <seb128> well, we can't invent users
[08:44] <seb128> our unstable userbase is just too small
[08:44] <seb128> or they don't report issues through whoopsie
[08:44] <Laney> dunno about that
[08:44] <seb128> or those issues fail to retrace
[08:45] <Laney> I bet they just disable whoopsie
[08:45] <Laney> or whatever
[08:45] <seb128> or a combinaison of those
[08:45] <seb128> yeah, likely
[08:45] <Sweetsha1k> Moin.
[08:45] <seb128> hey Sweetsha1k
[08:45] <seb128> Laney, well, I don't say we have not enough users
[08:45] <Sweetsha1k> ricotz: 4.3.2~rc2 seems to be good to go for the PPA.
[08:45] <seb128> but maybe we need 1M users to have enough datas for an useful e.u.c view
[08:45] <seb128> and we only have 100k
[08:45] <seb128> dunno
[08:45] <seb128> (making up numbers"
[08:47] <seb128> Laney, but on the daily view, if you skip the touch stuff, the first desktop issue is an apport one with 11 reports
[08:47] <seb128> that could be one user having a problem and trying to report it 10 times
[08:47] <ricotz> Sweetshark, no
[08:48] <Laney> 'week' is more useful than 'day'
[08:48] <ricotz> Sweetshark, hi, i cc'ed you to a bug
[08:48] <seb128> Laney, same issue, there one apport high, then the second seems to be an apport with 36 reports in a week, that means 5 a day, for what we know that could be pitti while hacking on it all day :p
[08:48] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:49] <ricotz> Sweetshark, this is a good example to hold of the copying to the dedicated versioned ppa a bit
[08:49] <pitti> seb128: so, hibernate is indeed still supposed to be disabled in polkit-desktop-privs
[08:49] <pitti> seb128: you are sure you didn't enable it locally to test something?
[08:49] <seb128> pitti, hey ;-)
[08:49] <seb128> pitti, it's disabled ... do you have the hibernate item in your indicator-session menu?
[08:49] <pitti> seb128: no, I don't
[08:49] <seb128> hum
[08:49] <seb128> so maybe I hacked up something and I don't remember :/
[08:50] <seb128> pitti, the pkla from polkit-desktop-privs is correct
[08:50] <seb128> pitti, what would an override for that be copied to?
[08:50] <pitti> $ gdbus call --system -d org.freedesktop.login1 -o /org/freedesktop/login1 -m org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.CanSuspend
[08:50] <pitti> ('yes',)
[08:50] <pitti> $ gdbus call --system -d org.freedesktop.login1 -o /org/freedesktop/login1 -m org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.CanHibernate
[08:50] <pitti> ('na',)
[08:50] <pitti> seb128: can you try that?
[08:51] <seb128> 'yes' for both
[08:51] <pitti> seb128: could go into /var, or perhaps also /etc/polkit-1/
[08:51] <pitti> seb128: (warning, you can't read that dir as user)
[08:51] <pitti> $ sudo find /etc/polkit-1/ -type f
[08:52] <pitti> should find 51-ubuntu-admin.conf, 50-localauthority.conf, 50-nullbackend.conf
[08:52] <seb128> /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/10-vendor.d/com.ubuntu.desktop.pkla is the only one referring to hibernate
[08:52] <seb128> and it has "no"
[08:53] <seb128>  /etc only has those 3 files
[08:53] <pitti> hm, that's odd then
[08:53] <seb128> is there a way to ask polkit what file it loads/in what order?
[08:55] <pitti> seb128: we can try with pkcheck
[08:55] <pitti> need to change train, bbl
[08:55] <seb128> pitti, k
[08:56] <seb128> pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/8424103/
[08:56] <Laney> hmm, 'yes' for me too
[08:56] <Laney> how did you get that output?
[08:56]  * Laney just knows pkcheck --action-id
[08:56] <seb128> pkaction --action-id org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate --verbose
[08:57] <Laney> nice
[08:57] <seb128> Laney, do you have an hibernate in your session indicator?
[08:57] <Laney> no
[08:57] <seb128> :-(
[08:57] <Laney> logind still says 'na'
[08:57] <Laney> for some reason
[08:57]  * ogra_ is sure that means "yes" in *some* language :)
[08:58] <ypwong> seb128 or anyone, does 14.04 or 14.10 adapts to HiDPI screens automatically by scaling things up?
[08:58] <seb128> ypwong, 14.04
[08:58] <seb128> well, >= 14.04
[08:59] <seb128> not sure if it's automatic
[08:59] <seb128> we have a slider in the settings
[08:59] <ypwong> seb128, yes, wanna know if it's automatic
[08:59] <seb128> Trevinho, ^
[09:00] <ypwong> are there any enhancements of hidpi support in 14.10?
[09:00] <seb128> some bugfixes but those are being SRUed as well
[09:01] <ypwong> got it
[09:05] <seb128> ypwong, I think unity tries to be clever with hidpi and apply settings automatically on start but I'm unsure, Trevinho should be able to help when he's around
[09:05] <Laney> I think pkaction is bogus
[09:05] <Laney> it's telling me 'yes' for hibernate even though I made it not authorised any more
[09:06] <ypwong> seb128, ok, will check with him when he's around
[09:08] <seb128> Laney, what would be the right check?
[09:09] <Laney> pkcheck --action-id foo --process $$ && echo authorised
[09:09] <pitti> seb128: pkaction is just querying the .policy files (not the overrides), you want pkcheck
[09:10] <Laney> yeah, just shows you the default
[09:10] <Laney> the docs don't explain this very well
[09:10] <pitti> seb128: indeed, the pk priv is true for me, too
[09:11] <pitti> seb128: I suppose hibernate is n/a for me as I don't have swap
[09:11] <pitti> seb128: is there a bug # for this?
[09:11] <Laney> ah, me neither
[09:11] <Laney> anyway I fixed pk-d-p
[09:11] <pitti> seb128: maybe the recent sponsored upload broke some syntax
[09:11] <seb128> $ pkcheck --action-id org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate --process $$; echo "right"
[09:11] <seb128> right
[09:11] <Laney> there's a bunch of other actions which imply hibernate
[09:11] <Laney> one second
[09:12] <pitti> hm, the override file looks alright
[09:12] <seb128> yeah
[09:12] <seb128> it didn't change
[09:12] <Laney> did logind change?
[09:13] <pitti> not recently, we've had 208 for months
[09:13] <pitti> but then again, not sure how long this regression has existed
[09:13] <seb128> that's buggy since I'm on utopic
[09:13] <Laney> if that added these new actions then it's this
[09:13] <pitti> for that matter, we sohuld at least disable org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate-multiple-sessions
[09:13] <seb128> pitti, ^
[09:13] <Laney> exactly that
[09:13] <seb128> I noticed it much earlier in the cycle
[09:13] <Laney> in the policy file you can see these 'imply' .hibernate
[09:13] <Laney> so it's not enough to disable this one action
[09:13] <seb128> but there was too much going on, I never took the time to try to debug it
[09:14] <pitti> aah!
[09:14] <pitti>        <action id="org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate-multiple-sessions">
[09:14] <pitti>                 <annotate key="org.freedesktop.policykit.imply">org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate</annotate>
[09:15] <Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/policykit-desktop-privileges_0.19_all.deb
[09:15] <Laney> try that
[09:15] <seb128> Laney, that fixes it
[09:16] <pitti> Laney: ah, you're on it? I just built a fixed source package
[09:16] <pitti> policykit-desktop-privileges_0.19.dsc
[09:16] <seb128> Laney, pitti, how come you guys didn't have that entry? because you have no swap?
[09:16] <pitti> erk, http://paste.ubuntu.com/8424201/
[09:16] <pitti> seb128: right
[09:16] <pitti> I have 16 GB of RAM, what do I need swap for :)
[09:17] <seb128> pitti, you changed name? ;-)
[09:17] <pitti> erk, used dch -m :)
[09:17] <seb128> lol
[09:17] <Laney> pitti: 25/09 10:11:23 <Laney> anyway I fixed pk-d-p
[09:17] <Laney> :-)
[09:17] <pitti> Laney: cheers, i'll discard mine then
[09:18] <Laney> yeah. 32 GB -> no swap
[09:18] <Laney> my laptop has this bug though, guess I never noticed there
[09:18] <seb128> 4G i386 here
[09:18] <seb128> swap :p
[09:18] <seb128> it's time for a refresh
[09:18] <pitti> bbl
[09:20] <Laney> seems like it
[09:21] <Laney> still 8 months on this old beast for me
[09:21] <Laney> it'll be 5 years old then, which is like 125 in laptop years
[09:21] <seb128> yeah, mine is over 4 years now
[09:21] <seb128> I had the refresh in june 2013
[09:22] <Laney> never used it?
[09:22] <seb128> but I want an xps 13 and I keep being delayed
[09:22] <seb128> first I wanted to haswell refreshed hwd
[09:22] <seb128> then desrt got it and told me about the noise issues
[09:23] <seb128> since I'm waiting for the new motherboard which resolves those
[09:23] <seb128> they apparently start rolling those out a few weeks ago
[09:23] <seb128> hopefully it should be good now ;-)
[09:24] <seb128> http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/laptop/f/3518/p/19538215/20674604#20674604
[09:25] <Laney> nice, time to order
[09:27] <seb128> indeed
[09:28] <Laney> is there a bug # for this hibernate issue btw?
[09:28] <ochosi> seb128: i was considering that laptop too but i'd rather wait for others' reports on new issues before ordering - after all, it's not exactly cheap
[09:29] <Laney> seb's got money to burn
[09:29] <seb128> lol
[09:29] <ochosi> :]
[09:29] <Laney> his mattress is stuffed with 500 euro notes
[09:29] <Laney> FACT
[09:30] <seb128> Laney, I bet you 1k€ it's not true
[09:30] <seb128> :p
[09:31]  * Laney runs
[09:31] <ochosi> searching the european dell site for "ubuntu" turns up a laptop featuring "linux ubuntu 11.11"
[09:32] <seb128> urg, don't ctrl-r IRC
[09:32] <seb128> Laney, I missed you reply I bet :p
[09:33] <willcooke> morning from Lond
[09:33] <willcooke> on
[09:33] <seb128> hey willcooke
[09:33] <Laney> not Swed
[09:33] <Laney> en?
[09:34] <seb128> right, what happened there?
[09:34] <willcooke> They found a volunteer from PES to go instead.  Flights for me meant that I wouldnt get there until lunch time, so there wasn't much point
[09:34] <willcooke> so I'm here instead
[09:35] <Laney> nothing more uplifting to the soul than a trip to London anyway
[09:35] <Laney> seb128: do you know of a bug for the hibernate issue?
[09:36] <davmor2> willcooke: if you're at blue fin find cyphermox and invite him out for a beer, he'll appreciate that :)
[09:36] <seb128> Laney, no, but I can open one if you want
[09:36] <Laney> nah
[09:36] <willcooke> davmor2, I'll see what I can do :)
[09:37] <cyphermox> ah, we haven't even met before
[09:37] <Laney> someone stand up and wave
[09:37] <davmor2> cyphermox: then it's a perfect excuse for a beer :)
[09:37] <willcooke> We might have in passing cyphermox
[09:37] <cyphermox> indeed
[09:38] <cyphermox> beer good
[09:38] <cyphermox> though maybe it's a little early for that today ;)
[09:38] <didrocks> is it me or the whole ci infra is slow?
[09:38] <willcooke> :D
[09:38] <didrocks> davmor2: did you notice/experience that? ^
[09:39] <didrocks> like, even sshing to a machine and typing is slow like death
[09:39] <davmor2> willcooke: meet cyphermox he works on network manager, cyphermox meet willcooke he is a user of network manager, there now you have some common ground and willcooke knows to blame you for all of his network manager woes :P
[09:39] <didrocks> hey willcooke
[09:39] <pitti> seb128: ah, when I got my new ThinkPad I considered waiting for haswell too, but in the end I thought that the previous one (Ivy Bridge?) was good enough :)
[09:39] <cyphermox> davmor2: another interesting fact is that he almost had to manage me ;)
[09:40] <pitti> seb128: still impressive how much better they get; 4 -> 16 GB RAM, faster, bigger/faster SSD, and still it eats even less power than my x201
[09:40] <seb128> pitti, well, I was decided like a month before the new model was coming out
[09:40] <davmor2> cyphermox: man that was a lucky escape for willcooke ;)
[09:40] <cyphermox> yeah
[09:40] <seb128> pitti, and it's always nice to be able to have some extra hours on battery ;-)
[09:41] <Laney> I get like 2.5 hours
[09:41] <pitti> seb128: yeah, the next flight to DC will come for sure :)
[09:41] <pitti> Laney: urgh
[09:41] <Laney> it's going to be weird having good battery life
[09:41]  * pitti pats 10 hours
[09:41] <Laney> woah
[09:41] <seb128> and that's without haswell
[09:41] <seb128> it would be like 13 otherwise ;-)
[09:41] <pitti> i. e. 8 to 9 W drain and a 100 Wh battery
[09:42] <pitti> seb128: I can get it to 13 without wifi/USB tethering, i. e. on the plane
[09:42] <pitti> but the effing mobile phone draws quite a lot -- I wish there was a "don't charge over USB" button
[09:43] <pitti> anyway, "first world problems" :)
[09:43] <seb128> hehe
[10:04] <cyphermox> pitti: 13 hours laptop battery on a plane in flight mode?
[10:04] <cyphermox> that's pretty impressive
[10:04] <cyphermox> my laptop lasts only about 2 hours
[10:04] <cyphermox> but it might also be caused by playing Kerbal Space Program ;)
[10:06] <davmor2> pitti: you could always not plug the effing phone into the usb :P
[10:07] <pitti> davmor2: -ENOINTERNET then :) (I'm tethering)
[10:07]  * didrocks grumbles on docker automatically created images regressing again and go back to a local created image
[10:08] <davmor2> pitti: ah sorry mis-read it as without wifi or usb tethering, ie on the plane
[10:12] <Sweetshark> hmmm, my firefox lost all the stored passwords yesterday ....
[10:33] <didrocks> first medium tests passing in the CI infra \o/
[10:34] <didrocks> phew, now, let's put in real test runs
[11:29] <dgadomski> hello desktop team
[11:30] <dgadomski> some of the users are affected by Bug 445333 on precise & trusty
[11:31] <dgadomski> I have analysed the possibility to backport it and it's fairly easy for trusty
[11:31] <dgadomski> could one of the sponsors could take a look and mark it as affecting precise & trusty?
[11:34] <seb128> jdstrand, hey, how do I turn off apparmor for click apps on touch?
[11:35] <seb128> dgadomski, hey, you should be able to propose a nomination for a serie no?
[11:35] <seb128> it's one of the link under the bugtable at the top
[11:38] <dgadomski> seb128: I have "Also affects project" and "Also affects distribution/package" there, didn't see series there
[11:38] <seb128> dgadomski, hum, maybe it's restricted to some teams
[11:38] <dgadomski> seb128: could you give me a hint under which of them I should look?
[11:38] <seb128> you don't have it I guess
[11:38] <seb128> targetted utopic now
[11:39] <seb128> I doubt we are going to backport to precise
[11:40] <dgadomski> and it also affects gtk+2.0 (the user experiences this in firefox)
[11:40] <dgadomski> I have prepared debdiffs for trusty (for gtk3 and gtk2)
[11:41] <seb128> great, thanks
[11:41] <seb128> I've added gtk2 to the list
[11:41] <dgadomski> ok, I will upload them and appreciate having a look at them
[11:41] <seb128> thanks
[11:41] <seb128> is the issue fixed in 3.12?
[11:41] <seb128> if not we need to get the fixes in utopic first
[11:42] <dgadomski> let me check that
[11:43] <dgadomski> unfortunately not, it's since 3.13.8
[11:43] <seb128> k
[11:43] <seb128> so we need that in utopic first
[11:43] <dgadomski> ok, I will make a debdiff for utopic first
[11:44] <seb128> thanks
[11:44] <dgadomski> seb128: thank you :)
[11:45] <dgadomski> btw. there is also another issue: bug 1104230
[11:45] <dgadomski> the fix for it can be easily cherry-picked for utopic
[11:45] <dgadomski> are you aware if the utopic kernel is available for trusty in any package?
[11:46] <dgadomski> I was told that there are those -lts- packages that may provide it
[11:46] <seb128> dgadomski, can you mention it to mlankhorst on #ubuntu-devel?
[11:46] <dgadomski> seb128: sure, thanks!
[11:46] <seb128> thanks
[12:06] <Laney> mvo: does update-manager have support for pulling people out of old-releases?
[12:06] <mvo> Laney: it should do that, yes
[12:07] <mvo> Laney: like if you want to go from "unsupported1 -> unsupported2 -> barely-supported" ?
[12:07] <mvo> Laney: that should work
[12:07] <Laney> I was just dealing with a friend in this situation
[12:07] <mvo> Laney: did it not work?
[12:07] <Laney> he was on quantal(!) but his sources.list was I guess still on a.u.c
[12:08] <mvo> hmm, I maybe misremembering but I thought it would rewrite to something sensible on do-release-upgrade
[12:08] <Laney> he said 'something' went wrong but I was helping remotely so not sure what happened exactly
[12:08] <mvo> Laney: what commend did you run? do-release-upgrade/update-manager -d?
[12:09] <Laney> I just got him to put old-releases in sources.list and will take a look myself tomorrow
[12:09] <mvo> ok
[12:09] <Laney> the interesting thing here might be that release+1 is also on old-releases
[12:09] <Laney> just wondering if this scenario is supported at all
[12:09] <mvo> Laney: yeah, I think that works, but it will be a bit of a pain as it takes a long time
[12:09] <mvo> Laney: to upgrade and then to upgrade agian
[12:09] <mvo> again
[12:10] <Laney> to do it properly is q->r->s->t
[12:10] <mvo> Laney: might be quicker to install trusty with the keep-home-intact option of the installer
[12:10] <Laney> yep
[12:10] <Laney> just concerned that he got left in a tricky situation
[12:11] <Laney> lucky that he knows someone who can drive apt ...
[12:11] <mvo> did update-manager not show him that he should upgrade? was that the issue?
[12:11] <mvo> (its always painful for me to hear these stories where a super-hero needs to come in to save the day :/
[12:12] <Laney> I will see what u-m is telling him tomorrow
[12:12] <mvo> thanks
[12:31] <darkxst> seb128, was just renamed for 3,11, but gah maybe I pushed the wrong branch
[12:31] <darkxst> 3.10 even
[12:32] <seb128> darkxst, well the changelog has 3.10
[12:32] <seb128> darkxst, did you see my comment about the gtk dialog and wether they are required for fallback sessions?
[12:33] <darkxst> seb128, look through emails now
[12:35] <darkxst> seb128, I don't know if it breaks fallback
[12:36] <darkxst> update was actually blocked on api changes that cause crashes
[12:36] <seb128> right, well I looked at the git log
[12:36] <seb128> and it drops the gtk dialogs
[12:36] <seb128> which I'm pretty sure Laney needs
[12:37] <seb128> (to mention somebody using a gnome-panel type of session)
[12:38] <darkxst> seb128, gnome-session can stay at 3.9.x whatever, its no big deal
[12:38] <seb128> darkxst, I've no strong opinion, just pointing out what I see as an issue
[12:38] <seb128> we can also update and revert the gtk dialog dropping in a patch
[12:39] <darkxst> seb128, does unity use those?
[12:39] <seb128> darkxst, btw empathy looks good, does Jackson or you want to merge propose the change so we can turn the bug into a ffe request?
[12:39] <seb128> darkxst, no, unity has its own dialogs
[12:41] <darkxst> seb128, so why revert? session-properties or whatever its called was just renamed for 3;12
[12:41] <darkxst> dropped in 3.14
[12:42] <seb128> darkxst, revert what?
[12:42] <seb128> there are 2 things there
[12:42] <seb128> 1 is the gtk logout dialogs
[12:42] <seb128> the other one is the capplet to manage autostarts
[12:42] <seb128> the dialogs are needed, otherwise people using gnome-panel sessions can't logout anymore I think
[12:42] <seb128> which is what I suggest reverting
[12:43] <seb128> what = the dropping of the dialog
[12:43] <seb128> unity and gnome-shell have their own dialogs
[12:43] <seb128> but gnome-panel doesn't
[12:43] <seb128>  
[12:43] <Laney> in debian/panel I don't have logout or shutdown dialogs any more
[12:43] <seb128> the capplet issue is orthogonal
[12:43] <seb128> Laney, with the ppa for gnome-desktop right?
[12:43] <Laney> no, unstable
[12:43] <seb128> oh
[12:43] <seb128> well, same issue likely
[12:43] <Laney> same thing
[12:44] <seb128> gnome-session 3.10 dropped them
[12:44] <Laney> just saying
[12:44] <seb128> well
[12:44] <seb128> do you consider that acceptable?
[12:45] <Laney> it's not great
[12:45] <darkxst> seb128, ok, happy to leave gnome-session whereever its at
[12:45] <Laney> how hard is it to keep them?
[12:45] <Laney> are panel upstream going to fix that?
[12:45] <Laney> mitya57: do you know?
[12:46] <darkxst> Laney, last I heard alberts was fighting with upstream trying to get maintainership
[12:46] <seb128> Laney, I think it's basically reverting https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-session/commit/?id=705699b2799a3434d1a8f35c9a92868a5057f73e
[12:46] <seb128> Laney, which should be fine at least for this cycle
[12:46] <Laney> try that
[12:47] <darkxst> but as far as a the gnome-desktop transition, gnome-session can stay as is, just a rebuild
[12:47] <seb128> cool
[12:48] <Laney> doesn't it use idle monitor?
[12:48] <darkxst> Laney, no
[12:49] <Laney> k I believe you
[12:49]  * Laney goes to lunch
[12:49] <darkxst> gnome-session runs way before idle-monitor is relevant
[12:49]  * darkxst goes to sleep]
[12:49] <Laney> unstable is mostly fixed for gi now
[12:50] <seb128> hum
[12:50] <seb128> Laney, darkxst, https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-desktop/commit/?id=545c774e967fa2f21f9b8ee1acbb50bffcee01d0
[12:50] <seb128> is GnomeIdleMonitor *monitor; from gnome-desktop?
[12:51] <seb128> ups
[12:51] <seb128> ignore that
[12:51] <darkxst> seb128, yes
[12:51] <seb128> I got confused by https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=707533
[12:51] <darkxst> but that is in roberts code that moved to u-*
[12:52] <jdstrand> seb128: you cannot "turn off apparmor" for click apps on touch for all apps (they'll fail to launch). what is it that you are trying to do and I can tell you how to disable it for a specific app
[12:52] <darkxst> I never worked out why that crashes, but it only apples to gnome-desktop 3.8 with gnome-session 3.9.91
[12:52] <jdstrand> s/disable/do something equivalent/
[12:53] <seb128> jdstrand, hey, in fact I don't need it anymore, we have a bug about importing pictures leading to blank image and I was trying to debug it
[12:53] <seb128> jdstrand, gallery-app triggers chmod denies in apparmor log and I was wondering if it's the issue, but it's not
[12:53]  * darkxst really sleeps now, bye all!
[12:53] <seb128> that might still be worth looking at though
[12:53] <seb128> darkxst, night
[12:54] <jdstrand> seb128: no, that is bug 1359831. it is a legitimate denial. it is harmless
[12:54] <jdstrand> seb128: (in terms of app functionality)
[12:54] <jdstrand> seb128: though I really wish someone would fix it cause it causes confusion
[12:54] <seb128> jdstrand, great, thanks
[13:20] <Sweetshark> huhum
[13:21] <Sweetshark> seb128: Could you please tell me "Nobody cares about LibreOffice Base anyway?" -- it would be convenient for a decision to make ...
[13:21] <seb128> Sweetshark, you know that's not true though ;-)
[13:24] <Sweetshark> seb128: yeah, but I got a build that is using mergedlibs again (thus being fast in startup again and quite a bit of a smaller package) and it passes unittests, but it seems to cause bug 1373928, which admittedly is kind of a bummer for base.
[13:24] <seb128> :-/
[13:25] <Sweetshark> O<- rock
[13:25] <Sweetshark>     hard place -> O
[15:00] <willcooke> cyphermox, my afternoon meeting was cancelled so I decided to dash home while it was still off peak.  Beer next time?
[15:00] <cyphermox> yeah, no worries
[15:00] <cyphermox> I'm kind of tired anyway, I didn't sleep so much
[15:01] <happyaron> Laney: please cancle the nmu, I've prepared the update already
[15:02] <Laney> happyaron: no need, if you upload then the nmu will just bounce
[15:02] <happyaron> Laney: was waiting g-i to make sure the behavior are the same across archs. 4.2.8.5-1 was sucessfully built on some archs..
[15:02] <happyaron> ok
[15:02] <happyaron> Laney: still prefer to cancle it, or I can do that
[15:06] <Laney> happyaron: eh, feel free if you're sure you will upload it. :)
[15:06] <Laney> this source package builds a lot of binaries
[15:08] <happyaron> I'm definately sure for fcitx...
[15:08] <happyaron> :P
[15:08] <Laney> I don't want to be responsible for RC bugs
[15:08] <Laney> hence nmuing stuff
[15:08] <happyaron> understand
[15:20] <Laney> happyaron: btw .gir files go in the -dev package conventionally
[15:22] <happyaron> ok
[15:31] <didrocks> fginther: s-jenkins going to shutting down?
[15:32] <fginther> didrocks, yes, there is a lab network outage coming shortly
[15:32] <fginther> didrocks, there was an email "Planned Maintenance Advisory (Service Affecting)", please let me know if you did not receive
[15:34] <didrocks> fginther: right, but it was supposed to be at noon, without telling which timezone. I took it as being UTC :)
[15:34] <didrocks> fginther: but ok, in the end, there is another time, with UTC, so in 25 minutes
[15:35] <didrocks> fginther: would be cool to take into account the shutdown of machines into that time though
[15:35] <fginther> didrocks, :/ right. that is a little unclear
[15:35] <didrocks> fginther: no worry, thanks for confirming :)
[15:36] <didrocks> I guess that's why I got some '404' not found in "Can't download (504): Gateway Time-out"
[15:36] <fginther> didrocks, I'll pass that along for future notices. the time (and timezone) should be painfully obvious and mentioned first thing
[15:36] <didrocks> fginther: indeed, thanks! :)
[16:39] <desrt> Laney: around?
[16:40] <desrt> Laney: remember that gnome-do bug where the app wasn't taking the gtk lock before gtk_init() and was therefore silently unlocking a not-yet-locked mutex?
[16:40] <desrt> Laney: turns out that dropbox does the same....
[16:41] <desrt> upstream gtk wrote a workaround for the problem -- perhaps we should take it
[16:41] <desrt> (ie: as a backport)
[16:41] <desrt> see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1374030
[16:41] <desrt> we could also reduce the fatality level of the assert in glib -- make it just a critical for now
[16:42] <desrt> i prefer this to the gtk patch which imho is a bit of a hack
[16:43] <Laney> mmm...
[16:44] <Laney> critical seems a bit nicer
[16:44] <Laney> you want to do that upstream?
[16:45] <desrt> i'm thinking about it -- discussing it in #gtk+ right now
[16:45] <Laney> 'kay
[16:45] <desrt> i may do a new glib 2.42 soonish
[16:45] <desrt> probably i'm going to disable the property deprecations as well :(
[16:45] <desrt> at least on the stable branch
[16:45] <desrt> folks are pretty upset
[16:47] <Laney> the warnings?
[16:47] <desrt> ya...
[16:47] <desrt> i kinda agree that it's of somewhat limited usefulness to have it in a stable release
[16:48] <desrt> it's almost certainly going to cause more grief to innocent users than it helps by warning actual devs
[16:51] <Laney> I see that, I only resisted on the basis that I didn't like this being an Ubuntu only solution really - feels like it should come from upstream
[16:52] <Laney> do that in a 2.42 stable and we'll get it through the normal channels
[16:52] <desrt> probably will be an upstream stable-only solution
[16:52] <desrt> and we can reevaluate each stable release if we should do it again
[16:52] <desrt> hopefully we get to a point where we can stop...
[16:52] <Laney> I patched some testsuites for this last week ...
[16:53] <Laney> should be tending towards being less of a problem
[16:53] <Laney> I wonder why dropbox is still working for me
[17:04] <Laney> night chap{pesse,}s
[17:04] <Laney> hopefully this vps host will have sorted out its io load before long
[17:11] <willcooke> l8r Laney
[17:11] <willcooke> popey, FYI ^^^^
[17:18] <popey> thanks!
[18:23] <didrocks> see you guys!
[18:39]  * willcooke EOD