[02:23] <rick_h_> widox: woot, motox shipped here thurs
[02:23] <rick_h_> widox: so no chc with it though
[02:29] <cmaloney> rick_h_: Did you see that Pebble now has a backgrounding api?
[02:29] <cmaloney> Which means it's a pedometer. :)
[02:29] <rick_h_> cmaloney: yea, they were working on that api a long while ago
[02:30] <rick_h_> I didn't realize it wasn't out yet
[02:30] <cmaloney> Released today.
[02:30] <rick_h_> yea
[02:31] <rick_h_> grrrr stop disconnecting ssh wtf
[03:49] <cmaloney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84NI5fjTfpQ <- This is not a parody
[03:49] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/ui3DSy - Introducing Windows 10 - the best Windows yet - YouTube
[04:18] <jrwren> cmaloney: omg. laughing so hard at that
[04:23] <cmaloney> jrwren: Yeah, it's so unintentionally terrible.
[11:50] <wolfger> Watching the Win 10 video posted last night... OMG, the hair!
[11:51] <rick_h_> they didn't go windows X ? :P
[11:51] <wolfger> it's like a sideways mullet had a baby with a Beatles cut
[12:33] <mrgoodcat> morning
[12:33] <mrgoodcat> i think bookiebot needs a full rewrite
[12:34] <mrgoodcat> i'm through chasing down stupid bugs because i was too stupid or lazy to do it the right way
[12:34] <mrgoodcat> going to redo it with twisted and sqlalchemy i think
[12:34] <cmaloney> Good morning
[13:09] <wolfger> http://askubuntu.com/questions/530991/how-do-i-remove-bash
[13:09] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/6GM76M - How do i remove bash? - Ask Ubuntu
[13:11] <mrgoodcat> oh dear god
[13:11] <mrgoodcat> i don't even know if i should click that
[13:12] <brousch_> finally, the answer is to install Windows!
[13:12] <wolfger> Welcome to the year of Linux on the Desktop. It has finally arrived.
[13:12] <cmaloney> dd if=/dev/null of=/dev/sda bs=4k
[13:12] <cmaloney> sudo !!
[13:13] <wolfger> although the question does make me wonder what would happen if I opened a bash shell and typed "sudo apt-get uninstall bash"
[13:13] <dzho> the memory resident copy would just chortle along, like anything else that gets updated
[13:14] <dzho> this is what vm's are for: playing with this sort of thing
[13:14] <dzho> I think you'd get stopped cold in your tracks just due to dependency hell, but that's probably what the link mentions so meh
[13:20] <mrgoodcat> apt-cache rdepends bash
[13:21] <mrgoodcat> apt-cache rdepends bash | grep -v i386 | wc -l
[13:21] <mrgoodcat> i get 42 dependencies of bash on my system
[13:22] <mrgoodcat> worth noting that this is direct dependencies and the dependency tree is likely a lot bigger
[13:22] <wolfger> now recurse dependancies of those 42
[13:22] <wolfger> hmm... 42.... curious number ;-)
[13:22] <mrgoodcat> lol
[13:25] <mrgoodcat> 51 on my arch laptop
[13:26] <mrgoodcat> there are definitely some curious dependencies actually...
[13:26] <mrgoodcat> i wonder why nano would require bash
[13:28] <mrgoodcat> wow... 608 dependencies on my arch system if you check recursively...
[13:34] <dzho> I wonder how many of those things really need bash versus could be fine with dash
[13:34] <dzho> or "sh"
[13:35] <dzho> I find it curious that /bin/sh does not go through alternatives, but straight to /bin/dash
[13:35] <dzho> I'm sure there's a reason.
[13:37] <wolfger> doesn't dash depend on bash?
[13:38] <wolfger> hmm. I does not. I must have read that wrong earlier
[13:38] <jrwren> no. dash has nothing to do with bash.
[13:39] <jrwren> as for /bin/sh alternatives, I htink if you search you'll find nice debian discussiosn on that.
[13:39] <wolfger> bash depends on dash
[13:39] <jrwren> https://wiki.debian.org/Shell
[13:39] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/X56Efa - Shell - Debian Wiki
[13:39] <jrwren> bash depends on dash? Is that some nonsense debianism too?
[13:41] <wolfger> must be
[13:41] <jrwren> I don't see where bash depends on dash.
[13:42] <wolfger> http://packages.ubuntu.com/utopic/bash
[13:42] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/4E60YS - Ubuntu – Details of package bash in utopic
[13:42] <jrwren> wolfger: bash-completion & bash-doc   not bash.
[13:42] <jrwren> wolfger: and those are suggests and recommends not depends
[13:43] <jrwren> wolfger: I always roll with --no-install-recommends :)
[13:43] <wolfger> jrwren: what are you talking about?
[13:43] <jrwren> wolfger: there is no depends on bash at the link you pasted.
[13:43] <wolfger> that is the bash package, showing it depends on dash
[13:44] <wolfger> which you said you didn't see
[13:44] <jrwren> wolfger: so weird. dpkg -p on trusty does not have that same list.
[13:45] <wolfger> hmm
[13:45] <jrwren> it likely isnt' a real dep, but one which comes from dash being deeply engrained in the heart of debian.
[13:46] <mrgoodcat> apt-cache rdepends bash doesn't show a dependency on dash
[13:46] <mrgoodcat> wait thats reverse
[13:46] <jrwren> whoa, apt-cache show does show dash listed as dep, but dpkg -p does not
[13:47] <jrwren> well, pre-depends. whatever that means.   sounds like a health product.
[13:47] <wolfger> rofl
[13:47] <wolfger> pre-depends, for when you almost lose control
[13:48] <mrgoodcat> a dependency will halt the installation, a pre-dependency won't even let it start
[13:48] <jrwren> oh, yup, its a debian packaging ism. pre-depends is so that the package can be unpacked.
[13:48] <mrgoodcat> usually it has to do with tools used during the install process
[13:49] <jrwren> you need a shell to run preinst script.
[13:49] <jrwren> except that you don't, because /var/lib/dpkg/info/bash.preinst is an ELF binary
[13:50] <jrwren> its only /var/lib/dpkg/info/bash.postrm that uses dash.  LAME!
[13:50] <wolfger> nerd. :-D
[13:51] <wolfger> also: lame is not at all a dependency.
[13:51] <jrwren> nerd. :)
[13:53] <mrgoodcat> that ELF may use dash in some way
[13:55] <wolfger> Wow. Dick's Sporting Goods just sent me an e-mail about a golf driver that's "only" $249 ($150 off original price). They do realize that I *just* bought an entire set of clubs from them for $85, right? Are they trying to scare me away from the sport?
[13:56] <wolfger> and who spends $399 on a single golf club? That's nuts.
[13:56] <jrwren> mrgoodcat: strings the elf :)
[13:56] <mrgoodcat> not sure what my driver cost
[13:56] <mrgoodcat> but it was more than i'd care to pay
[13:56] <jrwren> who golfs?
[13:56] <mrgoodcat> got it as a gift
[13:56] <mrgoodcat> i golf
[13:56] <wolfger> I golfed once. Liked it enough to buy the cheapest set of clubs I could find.
[13:57] <jrwren> i golfed a few times. I decided i do not like it.
[13:57] <wolfger> what part do you not like: the sunshine, the fresh air, or the exercise?
[13:58] <wolfger> but back on topic, sort of....
[13:59] <wolfger> I know an elf that uses dash. SqueakyHoHo.
[13:59] <jrwren> I don't like the golf.
[13:59] <mrgoodcat> lol
[14:00] <mrgoodcat> mostly the golfing part
[14:00] <jrwren> sunshine, fresh air and exercise are had countless other ways.
[14:00] <mrgoodcat> mountainbiking :)
[14:00] <jrwren> i like that.
[14:00] <mrgoodcat> i spend more time mountainbiking than just about any other outdoor activity
[14:00] <jrwren> roadbiking, basketball, tennis, anything but golf plz.
[14:00] <mrgoodcat> maybe waterskiing
[14:00] <mrgoodcat> i waterski a lot
[14:01] <mrgoodcat> but mountainbike is year round for me, waterski is not
[14:01] <jrwren> year round in MI?
[14:01] <cmaloney> wolfger: Who buys $400 clubs? People who think gaining an extra 5 yards is worth $400
[14:02] <cmaloney> even though you could argue the club has nothing to do with it.
[14:02] <wolfger> ...
[14:02] <wolfger> people who think the *possibility* of gaining 5 yards is worth $400
[14:02] <brousch_> mrgoodcat: Are you the one who used to waterski in an artificial lake near Grand Rapids?
[14:02] <wolfger> I need to meet more of these people, because they have lots of money and little sense.
[14:02] <brousch_> cmaloney: The club has something to do with it once you go beyond a minimum skill level
[14:03] <cmaloney> brousch_: Bull. I'd argue it's more about what properties you imbue into the club than actual club-dynamics
[14:03] <brousch_> wat?
[14:03] <mrgoodcat> jrwren: yea
[14:03] <cmaloney> I used to play golf when I was a kid. I sucked horribly.
[14:03] <mrgoodcat> brousch_: also, yes
[14:04] <brousch_> mrgoodcat: What was that place called?
[14:04] <jrwren> mrgoodcat: isn't that code?
[14:04] <brousch_> My mom didn't believe me when I told her about it, and I couldn't find it anywhere
[14:04] <mrgoodcat> cmaloney: club quality has a much bigger effect than you might guess
[14:04] <mrgoodcat> jrwren: if you mean cold, then sometimes
[14:05] <mrgoodcat> brousch_: placid waters
[14:05] <cmaloney> mrgoodcat: I'll give you that carbon fiber or graphite shafts may have more "whip" than the old steel shafts
[14:05] <cmaloney> or the wood shafts.
[14:05] <cmaloney> but not much beyond that
[14:05] <mrgoodcat> i like stiffer shafts actually. i like my steel shaft
[14:05] <cmaloney> All of the aerodynamics nonsense for the driver is rubbish
[14:06] <mrgoodcat> the heads are a lot bigger now, and the club faces are shaped differently and made of different metals
[14:06] <mrgoodcat> so you get more control
[14:06] <mrgoodcat> the new clubs are a lot easier to hit
[14:06] <mrgoodcat> and the high-end clubs are a lot lighter, so it takes less muscle to control the club head the same way
[14:06] <cmaloney> I'll bet you in 5 years the club heads will get smaller because someone will win a tourney with smaller heads.
[14:06] <cmaloney> and then the aerodynamic nonsense will kick in again
[14:07] <brousch_> It's more about club face shape, materials, internal reinforcement, etc
[14:07] <mrgoodcat> i think more likely it will be a rule change that makes the large heads disallowed
[14:07] <mrgoodcat> the large head clubs are stupidly easy to hit with
[14:07] <brousch_> There is already a limit on head size
[14:07] <mrgoodcat> yea, i think it will be smaller soon though
[14:07] <jrwren> linux people play golf. I need to become a BSD people. Moar anti-establishment hippie bears there.
[14:07] <brousch_> In the PGA
[14:07] <mrgoodcat> the pros are already complaining
[14:07] <cmaloney> jrwren: I have a set of clubs that are yours for the taking
[14:08] <jrwren> cmaloney: i have a set of clubs that are yours for the taking.
[14:08] <cmaloney> circa 1989
[14:08] <cmaloney> jrwren: Hah.
[14:08] <brousch_> I used to play golf ~40 times/yr, now i play probably 5
[14:08] <wolfger> Man, I wish I'd know there were clubs for the taking before I bought some :-p
[14:09] <mrgoodcat> there's also a limit on the coefficient of restitution on both club heads and balls
[14:09] <wolfger> and if the large drivers are "stupid easy", I must be beyond stupid because I suck with the driver. My best drives at the range are with my hybrid.
[14:10] <mrgoodcat> lol
[14:10] <mrgoodcat> or, you bought an 85$ set and your club is heavy as shit because it has the large head thats all the rage but inexpensive materials
[14:10] <wolfger> that could be too
[14:11] <wolfger> maybe I need to buy a driver that costs 4-5 times the entire price of my set so I play better. :-P :-P :-P
[14:11] <brousch_> It usually means there is a fundamental problem with your swing
[14:11] <mrgoodcat> yea
[14:11] <brousch_> Until you have a good, consistent swing, your clubs don't matter much
[14:11] <mrgoodcat> i'd fix the swing before spending money on new clubs
[14:11] <wolfger> brousch_: that's what I figured too
[14:11] <mrgoodcat> i play with a super old set just fine
[14:12] <mrgoodcat> my driver is my only club less than 10 years old
[14:13] <brousch_> I played for 2 years with small, wooden headed 1,3,5 woods to force a controlled, consistent swing. After that i went back to real drivers and picked up 40 yards on my drives and eliminated slicing
[14:13] <mrgoodcat> most of mine are ~1995ish
[14:15] <wolfger> I have an urge now to rewatch Caddyshack and Happy Gilmore
[14:16] <cmaloney> Thank goodness we didn't get into talking about Bowling Balls.
[14:16] <wolfger> Heh. I'm perfectly happy with rental balls
[14:16] <brousch_> I used to bowl as often as I golfed. I still do
[14:18] <wolfger> What Michigan needs more of is curling.
[14:18] <widox> rick_h_: ooo. nice!
[14:20] <mrgoodcat> bowling is fun but i can never seem to get over the 150-160 hump
[14:21] <brousch_> PRactice your spares
[14:21] <wolfger> I thought the 150-160 hump was in golf... :-D
[14:21] <brousch_> yikes
[14:22] <wolfger> actually, I have no idea what my golf score was the one time I played. I doubt it was that bad
[14:22] <wolfger> I also doubt it was good, or anything approaching good
[14:23] <mrgoodcat> i'm usually +7 or so per 9 holes
[14:23] <mrgoodcat> sometimes better sometimes a lot worse
[14:31] <wolfger> Oh geez. I just realized I still had a button on Chrome saying "Note in Reader", which was for Google Reader. *sigh* RIP, dear Reader.
[14:32] <cmaloney> wolfger: newsblur is the new hotness.
[14:34] <wolfger> Yes, I love Newsblur. I still miss GReader though
[14:41] <wolfger> They're making a live-action Tetris movie? This has to be a hoax. Please let it be a hoax.
[14:41] <wolfger> http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-29443728
[14:41] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/QAorz6 - BBC News - Tetris to become movie blockbuster
[14:42] <cmaloney> wolfger: I'm sure they're using "blockbuster" in the ironic sense
[14:42] <cmaloney> as in it's a movie about blocks, and it's sure to be a bust.
[14:43] <wolfger> one line at a time....
[14:43] <wolfger> well, 4 lines at a time if you're good
[14:45] <cmaloney> They've been threatening this movie for a while.
[14:46] <wolfger> I wish they would resume threatening us with a Neuromancer movie.
[14:46] <wolfger> I think Johnny Mnemonic killed that for us though.
[14:47] <cmaloney> wolfger: I doubt they'll make a workable version of that.
[14:58] <wolfger> cmaloney: just give it to Marvel Studios. They can do no wrong, apparently.
[15:00]  * wolfger willfully forgets the first Wolverine movie and the Hulk movies
[15:01] <mrgoodcat> i didn't completely hate the hulk movies
[15:05] <cmaloney> "i didn't completely hate" is a pretty damning endorsement
[15:05] <cmaloney> "It was film and did not make my eyes bleed"
[15:08] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
[15:08] <bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Belligerence by Nuclear
[15:08] <cmaloney> rar rar rar rar
[15:51] <greg-g> a coworker shared this video in our staff channel, and I appreciated it and it actually made me homesick for the midwest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYws8biwOYc
[15:51] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/biH46 - Spose - I'm Awesome - YouTube
[15:51] <greg-g> that won't give you any context to what you're about to watch/hear
[15:57] <cmaloney> Yay, new tips for my ER headphones
[15:57] <cmaloney> now I can't hear anything from the outside world. :)
[15:58] <cmaloney> Also: new OMC release after an unexpected hiatus.
[16:13] <wolfger> cmaloney: +1 to shutting out the outside world
[16:32] <greg-g> er headphones?
[16:34] <wolfger> http://www.breakingfittslaw.com/comic/office-bulldozer/
[16:34] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/NszHlw - Breaking Fitts's Law » Office Bulldozer
[16:43] <cmaloney> Entymotic Research
[16:44] <cmaloney> greg-g: ^^
[16:49] <greg-g> ahh
[17:06] <brousch_> I don't suppose any of you are participating in this weekend's Code Michigan event?
[17:11] <brousch_> http://www.eventbrite.com/o/code-michigan-4265518069
[17:11] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/PkujUu - Code Michigan - Eventbrite
[17:11] <_stink_> looks neat, but no
[17:13] <cmaloney> Again, first I'm hearing of it.
[17:13] <cmaloney> And it appears either sold out or needs Facebook to access (which is blocked)
[17:14] <brousch_> cmaloney: You are so out of touch
[17:15] <brousch_> Ah, Detroit is sold out. Newago still has slots
[17:35] <wolfger> Head up to Marquette...
[17:41] <cmaloney> How about "no".
[17:54] <brousch_> Marquette may get snow this weekend
[17:56] <wolfger> Well yeah... It is October after all.
[18:08] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
[18:08] <bookiebot> squeekyhoho's last track - Defleshed by Nuclear on Jehovirus [1 Oct 2014, 15:40]
[18:08] <cmaloney> bah
[18:09] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
[18:09] <bookiebot> squeekyhoho's last track - Defleshed by Nuclear on Jehovirus [1 Oct 2014, 15:40]
[18:10] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
[18:10] <bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Scarlatti: Sonata in E Major, L. 430/K. 531 by Wendy Carlos on Switched-On Boxed Set: Highlights
[18:10] <cmaloney> There we go
[18:11] <cmaloney> Probably the only way I'll ever afford the digital recordings of these albums: http://www.amazon.com/Switched-On-Boxed-Johann-Sebastian-Bach/dp/B00002DDS5
[18:11] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/yoSSWb - Amazon.com: Switched-On Boxed Set: Music
[19:07] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
[19:07] <bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Vol. 1 - Prelude by Neurotech