/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/10/31/#xubuntu-devel.txt

jjfrv8apologies to slickymaster for my not being around earlier to comment on his glossary suggestion00:25
jjfrv8I think the glossary idea is a bit more than I was originally considering00:25
jjfrv8my main concern was pretty much limited to the potential for Settings Manager confusion caused by there being two ways to get to it and three names for it00:25
jjfrv8would it be out of the question to just remove the icon from the bottom of the whisker menu?00:25
jjfrv8I think that would just about take care of both problems00:25
jjfrv8bbl, but not for the meeting, unfortunately01:03
smlalgun lugar de ayuda en espaƱol?01:38
Unit193New xfpm upload fixes Debian #763713 with upstream commit.01:39
ubottuDebian bug 763713 in xfce4-power-manager "xfce4-power-manager-settings: minimum window size is too big" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/76371301:39
Unit193sml: Generally English.01:39
smlthanks01:40
Logan_Unit193: aw, I could've helped him03:33
* Unit193 has been rather out today.04:50
=== ObrienDave is now known as andbot
=== andbot is now known as ObrienDave
NoskcajUnit193, bluesabre: I've merged thunar in a bzr if you guys haven't already. I was using it as an example to teach a person trying to join ubuntu as a developer, so if we could wait a few days to see if he can merge it, that would be great05:46
bluesabreNoskcaj: np, let me know when its ready to upload/sponsor09:52
ochosi!team | Reminder: meeting in ~45 mins10:13
ubottuReminder: meeting in ~45 mins: bluesabre, elfy, jjfrv8, knome, lderan, micahg, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, skellat, slickymaster, Unit19310:13
ochosimorning bluesabre 10:14
bluesabremorning ochosi10:14
ochosistill busy php-ing? :)10:14
bluesabredrafting a study guide now10:14
ochosifor yourself or for others?10:15
bluesabreme10:15
bluesabre:)10:15
ochosi:)10:15
brainwashcan we disable the pink highlight in vivid now?10:16
bluesabrewill do this weekend10:17
bluesabrethe code is already in xubuntu-default-settings trunk, so if you have the xubuntu-staging ppa installed in vivid, it should be gone10:17
brainwashok, that's nice10:17
brainwashany thoughts on http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfdesktop/commit/?id=7e8e8669606e662d1ee1e85815000f068f48acd9 ?10:18
ochosihaven't tried it yet, but it sounds like something that i'll activate in greybird once we have it10:19
slickymasterWorkI can confirm that brainwash 10:19
brainwashgreat, hopefully it's not a cpu hog10:20
slickymasterWorkand morning everyone10:20
brainwashslickymasterWork: hi10:20
brainwashconfirm what?10:20
slickymasterWorkwhat bluesabre stated10:20
brainwashok :D10:20
ochosislickymasterWork: well, it'll only hog the cpu once when loading xfdesktop10:21
ochosibut yeah, it's something to monitor10:21
slickymasterWorkyeaps10:22
slickymasterWorkbut as it's a testing box it's not a big deal ochosi 10:22
slickymasterWorkit's meant for destruction, one way or the pther :P10:23
slickymasterWorks/pther/other10:23
* slickymasterWork is not sure if he'll be able to really follow the meeting properly because of the constant annoying TTLs10:39
slickymasterWorkjjfrv8, not sure if I understood you correctly. Do you mean remove the Settings icon from whisker itself?10:41
slickymasterWorkknome ^^ (http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/10/31/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t00:25)10:41
dkesselelfy: I hope you don't mind - I extended the QA pad with an item for discussion of priorities for autopilot tests. If the topic comes up in today's meeting, that would be nice.10:48
knomedkessel, just bring it up after any other items under "discussion", or you can just simply add it to the agenda at it will be brought up10:58
ochosi!team | meeting time everyone!10:59
ubottumeeting time everyone!: bluesabre, elfy, jjfrv8, knome, lderan, micahg, Noskcaj, ochosi, pleia2, skellat, slickymaster, Unit19310:59
bluesabreo/ here~ish10:59
ochosiyeah, that would've been my next question10:59
knomei'm -ish too, but will be at least loosely following :)10:59
ochosiwho's around?10:59
ochosiright10:59
knomeand can comment, but not always swiftly ;)11:00
slickymasterWorktrying to keep myself here11:00
ochosijust in case nobody apart from me is *really* around, i guess i'd postpone the meeting to wednesday or something11:00
knomehuhu :P11:00
ochosiotherwise i'd just be talking to myself with a few folks lurking and occasionally commenting and that'd be weird :)11:00
bluesabrethat's how meetings are every now and then :)11:01
ochosialright then, so let's do this and we'll see how far we get11:01
ochosi#startmeeting11:01
meetingologyMeeting started Fri Oct 31 11:01:51 2014 UTC.  The chair is ochosi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.11:01
meetingologyAvailable commands: action commands idea info link nick11:01
knomewell, we can also do a "loose agenda" meeting11:02
knomewhere people can bring up stuff they want to discuss11:02
ochosi#topic Open action items11:02
ochosihm sure11:02
knomeand then we'll #endmeeting at noon11:02
knomei guess there aren't too many team updates11:02
ochosiknome: how about your action items?11:02
knomelet me see what there was11:02
slickymasterWorkat OK Corral knome? ;)11:03
knomeno formal proposal yet11:03
knome#action knome to write a more formalized proposal about the QA process improvements with elfy after N days of comments/feedback for the pad 11:03
meetingologyACTION: knome to write a more formalized proposal about the QA process improvements with elfy after N days of comments/feedback for the pad11:03
ochosidoes anybody know about whether pleia2 contacted unixstickers?11:03
ochosiotherwise i'd carry that forward too11:03
knomethe "translations important for xubuntu" list is now at the wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes#Package_translations11:04
knomeshe did11:04
knomelet me see if i can dig that up11:04
knomeit was #done in the previous meeting already11:04
ochosi#done elfy mail the -devel list to garner comment on pad https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2014-October/010448.html11:05
knomefor the record:11:05
knome23:07  pleia2: #DONE pleia2 to contact unixstickers11:05
knome23:24  pleia2: #info unixstickers has sold plenty of Xubuntu items, so we just  need to let them know what we want for the reward based QA program11:05
knome23:24  pleia2: #info unixstickers will also be producing t-shirts soon,  production info here: 11:05
knomehttp://www.unixstickers.com/tshirts/underground-t-shirts/the-ultimate-pirate-bay-tshirt11:05
ochosiah good11:05
slickymasterWork#action slickymaster to start a series of run calls for "translations important for xubuntu" list defined in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes#Package_translations11:06
meetingologyACTION: slickymaster to start a series of run calls for "translations important for xubuntu" list defined in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes#Package_translations11:06
ochosinice11:06
ochosianything else you think we should carry forward?11:07
ochosito me it seems like the rest is probably #done one way or the other11:07
knomeyep11:09
ochosi#topic Team updates11:09
knomeoh11:09
ochosiok, if you got anything, #info it now11:09
knome#action Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers 11:09
meetingologyACTION: Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers11:09
ochosii'd rather move on to discussion after this and leave things open11:09
knome^ that11:09
ochosioh11:09
ochosi#undo11:09
meetingologyRemoving item from minutes: ACTION11:09
ochosi#undo11:09
meetingologyRemoving item from minutes: TOPIC11:09
knomehah11:10
ochosi#action Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers11:10
meetingologyACTION: Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers11:10
ochosi#topic Team updates11:10
ochosifixed11:10
bluesabre#info Vivid branches for each xubuntu package/project are now open11:10
ochosinice work bluesabre 11:10
knome#info Vivid series are up on the QA trackers (which are down ATM)11:10
bluesabre#info Daily builds of xubuntu-artwork, xubuntu-default-settings, and (soon) xubuntu-docs for Vivid are up at https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xubuntu-staging11:11
bluesabre#info All other daily packages across our PPAs have been updated to build for vivid as well11:12
ochosi#info Greybird already has basic Gtk3.14 fixes, ping ochosi when you notice bugs11:12
ochosi#info All other themes will still need fixes for Gtk3.1411:13
bluesabre#info upower 0.99.x landed yesterday, our packages have been rebuilt to support it... watch for breakage!11:13
qwebirc11992grrr11:13
bluesabrelanded, or is landing... couldn't keep up with lp notifications :)11:14
bluesabreI think that's all I have currently11:14
ochosiyeah, pitti spammed all our inboxes :)11:14
ochosiqwebirc11992: any team updates from your side?11:14
=== qwebirc11992 is now known as slickymasterWork
slickymasterWorkthe re-write of the section about upgrading is done and already merged to the main branch11:16
ochosicould you #info that properly plz?11:17
slickymasterWorkthanks for the excellent work elfy done11:17
slickymasterWork#info the re-write of the section about upgrading is done and already merged to the main branch11:17
ochosithanks11:18
ochosiok, let's just open the floor for everyone...11:18
ochosi#topic Discussion11:19
ochosiwould be nice to get some feedback on the blueprint sprint11:19
ochosii mean: on the result of the blueprint sprint, which is the workitems11:19
bluesabreNice. work. everyone.11:19
knomeit's a good start ;)11:19
ochosiif you feel that we've covered our basis well, or something is still missing/overlooked11:19
knomei mean, i'm happy to see that there are many work items registered11:19
ochosior something that needs review11:19
knomethat gives us a more realistic view on how much work there is to be done11:20
ochosiindeed11:20
knomeeven if we most likely will need to change some wording and add even more smaller blueprints11:20
bluesabrethe dev blueprint is in good shape, and I'm glad to see others contributing to it11:20
dkesselI would like to have some feedback on this QA item: http://pad.ubuntu.com/xubuntu-qa-v-autopilot11:20
dkesselthere is this old utopic specification with a large list of applications on the wiki - I think it would be better to have priorities11:21
dkessellike, which applications should get tests first. As I don't believe we will get autopilot tests for 30 apps done this cycle ;)11:22
ochosihm, that is a difficult one11:24
knomei guess it's obvious, but i'd start with those which work with autopilot ;)11:24
bluesabreI think it would be a good effort for sure... haven't looked into it myself, but I'd be curious to know to what extent we are testing with autopilot11:24
ochosii remember knome was considering to write a proposal to drop abiword and gnumeric11:24
knomeyeah... i wouldn't start with those anyway11:24
knome(even if we kept them)11:25
knomecatfish  parole  settings manager  run program  app finder  mousepad  screenshot  xfburn  ristretto  task manager11:25
bluesabrestart with simpler apps and build a core test suite11:25
knomethose are something i think might be good places to start11:26
knomeand yeah, in the order bluesabre mentioned, easier first11:26
* ochosi agrees11:26
knomerun program should be relatively easy11:26
bluesabreagreed... xfburn might be more difficult to create a meaningful test11:26
dkesselin that order? (see pad)11:27
knomei looked through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Utopic/Autopilot and thought which of the "works" items would be somewhat "essential" or "important" to xubuntu11:27
knomemaybe that11:28
knomegrouped things being "equally important"11:28
knomeor, "pick whichever you please"11:28
dkesselsounds good for a start!11:29
dkesselthanks!11:29
knomebut that's just my opinion :)11:29
dkesselwhat do the others think?11:29
bluesabreI agreed already ;)11:29
* ochosi too11:29
knomedid you look at the pad?11:29
knomei did some subordering on the items i mentioned before11:30
ochosihm, actually, app-finder == run program11:30
* slickymasterWork lost the arguments but as a matter of principle, agrees with his fellow team members11:30
ochosiand functionally == whiskermenu11:30
=== ObrienDave is now known as andbot
ochosiso i'm somewhat wondering whether we really need to test it that much, as it isn't as important anymore as it used to be11:31
knomei'd bet people migrating from other systems *cough* windows *cough* still use it a lot11:31
ochosihm, not sure, i mean whiskermenu does pretty much all that appfinder does too11:32
knomewell run a poll for users11:32
ochosimy guess would be that catfish is actually more important11:32
=== andbot is now known as ObrienDave
ochosibut either way, we don't have to do a poll to prove or disprove anything11:32
dkesselI guess that's all I need for now11:36
ochosidkessel: great!11:41
ochosilooking forward to the tests11:41
bluesabreso, we're considering swapping evince to evince-gtk... there doesn't seem to be a functional difference, and it reduces gnome dependencies11:43
knomeany downsides?11:43
ochosiyeah, i tried -gtk and it looked/behaved the same11:43
bluesabrenone discovered so far... I'm thinking it might be a good idea to go ahead and switch now since we're so early in the cycle11:43
ochosi+111:44
knomethen a +1 and "go ahead" from me11:44
bluesabreand we can reevaluate at a later point as needed11:44
bluesabregot it11:44
slickymasterWork+1 from also11:44
bluesabrewill do tonight/tomorrow11:44
ochosiyeah, better switching now and having more time11:44
ochosifwiw, i don't have the feeling that people really noticed that XChat is gone11:44
ochosithe only shitstorm i saw was about the pink highlights11:45
slickymasterWorkyeah, there's no public nagging about it11:45
ochosi(and even that was not very excessive)11:45
slickymasterWorkabout XChat that is11:45
ochosiyeah11:45
ochosidid any others of you hear anything?11:45
ochosior: read11:45
bluesabrenope11:45
knomethe next time we plan to drop something, just change the highlight color at the same time and nobody notices11:45
slickymasterWorknopes11:45
bluesabre:D11:46
ochosi:D11:47
ochosialrighty11:54
ochosisince time is pretty much up and there aren't many new topics brought up i'd say we end today's meeting11:55
ochosithanks to everyone for participating!11:55
knomeyep11:55
bluesabrealrighty11:55
bluesabrettyl11:55
ochosi#topic Schedule next meeting11:55
ochosi#info bluesabre to schedule the next meeting11:56
ochosi#endmeeting11:56
meetingologyMeeting ended Fri Oct 31 11:56:08 2014 UTC.  11:56
meetingologyMinutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-10-31-11.01.moin.txt11:56
slickymasterWorkthanks ochosi 11:56
ochosiminutes will be up in a bit11:56
brainwashochosi: is it worth to include the qt theme selection file in xubuntu-default-settings?12:09
brainwashto fix bug 138274112:09
ubottubug 1382741 in xubuntu-default-settings (Ubuntu) "Some apps are displaying a very old styled theme as oppose to greybird" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/138274112:09
ochosiiirc bluesabre already had a patch for that12:10
ochosihttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/xubuntu-default-settings/trunk/revision/53312:10
brainwashah nice12:11
brainwashbranch should be added the report then :)12:11
ochosisure, feel free to do that ;)12:11
ochosimeeting minutes are up12:11
brainwashbluesabre: the lp number is wrong http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/xubuntu-default-settings/trunk/revision/53312:15
brainwash1373887 is commit 53012:16
brainwashbluesabre: you could also add the extra keybinding for screen locking, bug 103317412:19
ubottubug 1033174 in xubuntu-default-settings (Ubuntu) "Improvement in the default keyboard shortcuts (lock screen and shutdown menu)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/103317412:19
brainwash"Add <Ctrl><Alt>l shortcut for screen locking (xflock4)"12:20
brainwashfrom upstream12:20
brainwashthe launchpad report also requests "CTRL+ALT+DEL for firing the shutdown menu"12:21
brainwashnot sure if we could add this too (xubuntu only)12:21
* slickymasterWork needs a good serach engine to find something in the logs12:23
slickymasterWork*search12:23
brainwashbluesabre: I guess not, CTRL+ALT+DEL is triggering xflock4 atm12:24
brainwashpeople are used to this binding12:24
bluesabreslickymasterWork: https://www.google.com/#q=site:irclogs.ubuntu.com13:03
bluesabrebrainwash: thanks, will take a look tonight13:04
elfy<ochosi> #action Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers13:18
elfyummm 13:18
elfyso perhaps if people in team could actually read things I send to the list - that would be awesome :D13:18
pleia2elfy: I read it!13:20
pleia2but that meeting confused me, I think we had a duplicate agenda from last meeting :)13:20
elfy:)13:21
elfyxchat suddenly appears to have decided to be old school in appearance13:25
jjfrv8slickymasterwork, yes, my suggestion was to remove the default All Settings icon from whisker: http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/menu0020.php13:48
jjfrv8with just the one way to get to Settings from the menu, all of our references to [icon]-> Settings would be unambiguous13:48
jjfrv8now that we have the searchable Settings in the category pane of whisker, I don't see any need to have the extra icon13:48
knomeochosi, bluesabre: opinions ^ ?13:51
jjfrv8gotta go, back later13:59
slickymasterWorklol, bluesabre, that I already have14:04
slickymasterWorkI was just nagging with myself ;)14:05
slickymasterWorkjjfrv8, right, but that goes way beyond the -docs scope so the project and the technical leads in particular and the team at large will have to have a say on it14:07
slickymasterWorkhmmmm15:17
slickymasterWorkknome, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/vivid/+source/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+pots/ubiquity-slideshow-xubuntu is set yet15:17
slickymasterWork*isn't15:17
knomewhat a shame15:17
knome;)15:17
slickymasterWorkjust saying it because of the call for translation mail to -devel15:18
knomei'll set it up in a minute once i have coffee in my mug15:18
slickymasterWorkI'm going to mention it and people will start complaining about an invalid link, for sure15:18
slickymasterWorkok, I'll fix the link in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes15:19
slickymasterWorkknome ^^^ fixed15:21
knomeactually..15:21
ochosiknome, jjfrv8: i don't have a strong opinion on that. i don't think ppl will really miss it there since we have the category. otoh i don't think the "ambiguity" of the docs is a really a big issue in that respect15:21
knomei think it'll show up when there's the first upload for that package15:21
slickymasterWorkbut the url is going to be that one, right?15:22
knomeyes15:22
slickymasterWorkit's not a big issue ochosi, but an issue nevertheless 15:22
knomesince we've had the icon already, i think it's better to keep it15:23
knomeand solve the ambiguity docs-internally15:23
* slickymasterWork nods15:23
ochosislickymasterWork: btw, shall we take another look at the powerman docs sometime next week?15:23
* ochosi doesnt really remember where we left off15:24
knomecoffee is yummy15:24
slickymasterWorkyes ochosi, I've been postponing that because of work/son 15:24
slickymasterWorkbut things are calmer these days15:24
* slickymasterWork was wondering when would ochosi poke him about that ;)15:25
ochosi:)15:25
ochosiyeah, same here tbh15:26
ochosii was also busy and it's not on the top of my priority-list15:26
slickymasterWorklol, knome, I received that one (in the PM) during today's meeting15:26
knomeyes :|15:27
knometalk about wasting bandwidth15:27
slickymasterWork:)15:28
slickymasterWorkknome: about http://pad.ubuntu.com/outdated-debian-screenshots do you know if it's required some form of an account in debian to upload the screenshots?16:21
knomeyou should ask bluesabre 16:22
slickymasterWorkI'm planning to start working on it this weekend16:23
slickymasterWorkbluesabre ^^16:23
slickymasterWorkor Unit193 (for that matter) ^^16:24
knomeanyway, don't let them not answering keep you back... if you take new screenshots, keep them somewhere until they know where to put them :)16:28
slickymasterWorkyeah, that goes without saying16:28
slickymasterWorkknome, thanks for adding  that item to the blueprint16:48
knomenp16:48
elfyevening all17:37
knomehello elfy 17:39
elfyhi knome 17:39
elfyso then knome ... 17:39
knomeyes? :)17:39
elfywhat shall we call N days then :)17:39
elfyhas to be more than 14 or we've done that :S17:39
elfyD17:39
knomeyeah, it's a random integer from 1 to 30 that changes every day17:40
knomeand the only way to get out of this loop is that the random integer matches the day number we're on.. eg. so the deadline is "today"17:40
elfyif we postpone that till after the 6th I've got a week off and can just blast it out17:40
knomehasn't happened yet, so we're still stuck17:40
knomethis weekend and forthcoming week generally look better (less busy) than the weeks before, so fingers crossed :)17:41
elfyyea - I like that deadline should just always equal either yesterday or tomorrow17:42
elfyI've got little time this weekend - and next week it's only be evenings - if I manage to find any of that elusive commodity17:42
knomeyep17:43
knomelet's try to coordinate some time17:43
knometomorrow day is bad for me, but eveningish is good17:43
elfyno chance this weekend 17:43
knomeoh17:44
knomeduh17:44
* knome misread17:44
knome:D17:44
elfy:)17:44
elfythere's no rush - I'm happy to leave it till the 2nd week of November 17:44
knomemhm17:44
elfyI'm more concerned about other things atm - incentive/scheduling testing/starting testing than the process page17:46
knomeyep17:46
knomei'm generally interested on the process page because that's a good way to pass on information17:46
elfyI agree - I'm not *did-interested* - just less interested ;)17:47
elfys/did/dis17:47
knomeit's okay :P17:47
knomeand yeah, got that17:47
knomejust get used to me nagging about that page ;)17:47
elfythat's fine - I'll treat it the same way as people do when I ask for them to test images ;)17:48
knomehaha17:48
knomefair deal17:48
elfy:)17:48
elfyknome: to be fair, I've done a bit more on that pad in the last N days - the draft proposal is certainly different than it was 18:01
knomehaven't looked at it, but judging from what you've said in this channel, i guessed it would be :)18:04
elfy:)18:04
elfyhi brainwash 18:15
brainwashhey elfy 18:17

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