[00:25] <jjfrv8> apologies to slickymaster for my not being around earlier to comment on his glossary suggestion
[00:25] <jjfrv8> I think the glossary idea is a bit more than I was originally considering
[00:25] <jjfrv8> my main concern was pretty much limited to the potential for Settings Manager confusion caused by there being two ways to get to it and three names for it
[00:25] <jjfrv8> would it be out of the question to just remove the icon from the bottom of the whisker menu?
[00:25] <jjfrv8> I think that would just about take care of both problems
[01:03] <jjfrv8> bbl, but not for the meeting, unfortunately
[01:38] <sml> algun lugar de ayuda en español?
[01:39] <Unit193> New xfpm upload fixes Debian #763713 with upstream commit.
[01:39] <Unit193> sml: Generally English.
[01:40] <sml> thanks
[03:33] <Logan_> Unit193: aw, I could've helped him
[04:50]  * Unit193 has been rather out today.
[05:46] <Noskcaj> Unit193, bluesabre: I've merged thunar in a bzr if you guys haven't already. I was using it as an example to teach a person trying to join ubuntu as a developer, so if we could wait a few days to see if he can merge it, that would be great
[09:52] <bluesabre> Noskcaj: np, let me know when its ready to upload/sponsor
[10:13] <ochosi> !team | Reminder: meeting in ~45 mins
[10:14] <ochosi> morning bluesabre 
[10:14] <bluesabre> morning ochosi
[10:14] <ochosi> still busy php-ing? :)
[10:14] <bluesabre> drafting a study guide now
[10:15] <ochosi> for yourself or for others?
[10:15] <bluesabre> me
[10:15] <bluesabre> :)
[10:15] <ochosi> :)
[10:16] <brainwash> can we disable the pink highlight in vivid now?
[10:17] <bluesabre> will do this weekend
[10:17] <bluesabre> the code is already in xubuntu-default-settings trunk, so if you have the xubuntu-staging ppa installed in vivid, it should be gone
[10:17] <brainwash> ok, that's nice
[10:18] <brainwash> any thoughts on http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfdesktop/commit/?id=7e8e8669606e662d1ee1e85815000f068f48acd9 ?
[10:19] <ochosi> haven't tried it yet, but it sounds like something that i'll activate in greybird once we have it
[10:19] <slickymasterWork> I can confirm that brainwash 
[10:20] <brainwash> great, hopefully it's not a cpu hog
[10:20] <slickymasterWork> and morning everyone
[10:20] <brainwash> slickymasterWork: hi
[10:20] <brainwash> confirm what?
[10:20] <slickymasterWork> what bluesabre stated
[10:20] <brainwash> ok :D
[10:21] <ochosi> slickymasterWork: well, it'll only hog the cpu once when loading xfdesktop
[10:21] <ochosi> but yeah, it's something to monitor
[10:22] <slickymasterWork> yeaps
[10:22] <slickymasterWork> but as it's a testing box it's not a big deal ochosi 
[10:23] <slickymasterWork> it's meant for destruction, one way or the pther :P
[10:23] <slickymasterWork> s/pther/other
[10:39]  * slickymasterWork is not sure if he'll be able to really follow the meeting properly because of the constant annoying TTLs
[10:41] <slickymasterWork> jjfrv8, not sure if I understood you correctly. Do you mean remove the Settings icon from whisker itself?
[10:41] <slickymasterWork> knome ^^ (http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/10/31/%23xubuntu-devel.html#t00:25)
[10:48] <dkessel> elfy: I hope you don't mind - I extended the QA pad with an item for discussion of priorities for autopilot tests. If the topic comes up in today's meeting, that would be nice.
[10:58] <knome> dkessel, just bring it up after any other items under "discussion", or you can just simply add it to the agenda at it will be brought up
[10:59] <ochosi> !team | meeting time everyone!
[10:59] <bluesabre> o/ here~ish
[10:59] <ochosi> yeah, that would've been my next question
[10:59] <knome> i'm -ish too, but will be at least loosely following :)
[10:59] <ochosi> who's around?
[10:59] <ochosi> right
[11:00] <knome> and can comment, but not always swiftly ;)
[11:00] <slickymasterWork> trying to keep myself here
[11:00] <ochosi> just in case nobody apart from me is *really* around, i guess i'd postpone the meeting to wednesday or something
[11:00] <knome> huhu :P
[11:00] <ochosi> otherwise i'd just be talking to myself with a few folks lurking and occasionally commenting and that'd be weird :)
[11:01] <bluesabre> that's how meetings are every now and then :)
[11:01] <ochosi> alright then, so let's do this and we'll see how far we get
[11:01] <ochosi> #startmeeting
[11:01] <meetingology> Meeting started Fri Oct 31 11:01:51 2014 UTC.  The chair is ochosi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[11:01] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[11:02] <knome> well, we can also do a "loose agenda" meeting
[11:02] <knome> where people can bring up stuff they want to discuss
[11:02] <ochosi> #topic Open action items
[11:02] <ochosi> hm sure
[11:02] <knome> and then we'll #endmeeting at noon
[11:02] <knome> i guess there aren't too many team updates
[11:02] <ochosi> knome: how about your action items?
[11:02] <knome> let me see what there was
[11:03] <slickymasterWork> at OK Corral knome? ;)
[11:03] <knome> no formal proposal yet
[11:03] <knome> #action knome to write a more formalized proposal about the QA process improvements with elfy after N days of comments/feedback for the pad 
[11:03] <meetingology> ACTION: knome to write a more formalized proposal about the QA process improvements with elfy after N days of comments/feedback for the pad
[11:03] <ochosi> does anybody know about whether pleia2 contacted unixstickers?
[11:03] <ochosi> otherwise i'd carry that forward too
[11:04] <knome> the "translations important for xubuntu" list is now at the wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes#Package_translations
[11:04] <knome> she did
[11:04] <knome> let me see if i can dig that up
[11:04] <knome> it was #done in the previous meeting already
[11:05] <ochosi> #done elfy mail the -devel list to garner comment on pad https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2014-October/010448.html
[11:05] <knome> for the record:
[11:05] <knome> 23:07  pleia2: #DONE pleia2 to contact unixstickers
[11:05] <knome> 23:24  pleia2: #info unixstickers has sold plenty of Xubuntu items, so we just  need to let them know what we want for the reward based QA program
[11:05] <knome> 23:24  pleia2: #info unixstickers will also be producing t-shirts soon,  production info here: 
[11:05] <knome> http://www.unixstickers.com/tshirts/underground-t-shirts/the-ultimate-pirate-bay-tshirt
[11:05] <ochosi> ah good
[11:06] <slickymasterWork> #action slickymaster to start a series of run calls for "translations important for xubuntu" list defined in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes#Package_translations
[11:06] <meetingology> ACTION: slickymaster to start a series of run calls for "translations important for xubuntu" list defined in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes#Package_translations
[11:06] <ochosi> nice
[11:07] <ochosi> anything else you think we should carry forward?
[11:07] <ochosi> to me it seems like the rest is probably #done one way or the other
[11:09] <knome> yep
[11:09] <ochosi> #topic Team updates
[11:09] <knome> oh
[11:09] <ochosi> ok, if you got anything, #info it now
[11:09] <knome> #action Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers 
[11:09] <meetingology> ACTION: Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers
[11:09] <ochosi> i'd rather move on to discussion after this and leave things open
[11:09] <knome> ^ that
[11:09] <ochosi> oh
[11:09] <ochosi> #undo
[11:09] <meetingology> Removing item from minutes: ACTION
[11:09] <ochosi> #undo
[11:09] <meetingology> Removing item from minutes: TOPIC
[11:10] <knome> hah
[11:10] <ochosi> #action Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers
[11:10] <meetingology> ACTION: Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers
[11:10] <ochosi> #topic Team updates
[11:10] <ochosi> fixed
[11:10] <bluesabre> #info Vivid branches for each xubuntu package/project are now open
[11:10] <ochosi> nice work bluesabre 
[11:10] <knome> #info Vivid series are up on the QA trackers (which are down ATM)
[11:11] <bluesabre> #info Daily builds of xubuntu-artwork, xubuntu-default-settings, and (soon) xubuntu-docs for Vivid are up at https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xubuntu-staging
[11:12] <bluesabre> #info All other daily packages across our PPAs have been updated to build for vivid as well
[11:12] <ochosi> #info Greybird already has basic Gtk3.14 fixes, ping ochosi when you notice bugs
[11:13] <ochosi> #info All other themes will still need fixes for Gtk3.14
[11:13] <bluesabre> #info upower 0.99.x landed yesterday, our packages have been rebuilt to support it... watch for breakage!
[11:13] <qwebirc11992> grrr
[11:14] <bluesabre> landed, or is landing... couldn't keep up with lp notifications :)
[11:14] <bluesabre> I think that's all I have currently
[11:14] <ochosi> yeah, pitti spammed all our inboxes :)
[11:14] <ochosi> qwebirc11992: any team updates from your side?
[11:16] <slickymasterWork> the re-write of the section about upgrading is done and already merged to the main branch
[11:17] <ochosi> could you #info that properly plz?
[11:17] <slickymasterWork> thanks for the excellent work elfy done
[11:17] <slickymasterWork> #info the re-write of the section about upgrading is done and already merged to the main branch
[11:18] <ochosi> thanks
[11:18] <ochosi> ok, let's just open the floor for everyone...
[11:19] <ochosi> #topic Discussion
[11:19] <ochosi> would be nice to get some feedback on the blueprint sprint
[11:19] <ochosi> i mean: on the result of the blueprint sprint, which is the workitems
[11:19] <bluesabre> Nice. work. everyone.
[11:19] <knome> it's a good start ;)
[11:19] <ochosi> if you feel that we've covered our basis well, or something is still missing/overlooked
[11:19] <knome> i mean, i'm happy to see that there are many work items registered
[11:19] <ochosi> or something that needs review
[11:20] <knome> that gives us a more realistic view on how much work there is to be done
[11:20] <ochosi> indeed
[11:20] <knome> even if we most likely will need to change some wording and add even more smaller blueprints
[11:20] <bluesabre> the dev blueprint is in good shape, and I'm glad to see others contributing to it
[11:20] <dkessel> I would like to have some feedback on this QA item: http://pad.ubuntu.com/xubuntu-qa-v-autopilot
[11:21] <dkessel> there is this old utopic specification with a large list of applications on the wiki - I think it would be better to have priorities
[11:22] <dkessel> like, which applications should get tests first. As I don't believe we will get autopilot tests for 30 apps done this cycle ;)
[11:24] <ochosi> hm, that is a difficult one
[11:24] <knome> i guess it's obvious, but i'd start with those which work with autopilot ;)
[11:24] <bluesabre> I think it would be a good effort for sure... haven't looked into it myself, but I'd be curious to know to what extent we are testing with autopilot
[11:24] <ochosi> i remember knome was considering to write a proposal to drop abiword and gnumeric
[11:24] <knome> yeah... i wouldn't start with those anyway
[11:25] <knome> (even if we kept them)
[11:25] <knome> catfish  parole  settings manager  run program  app finder  mousepad  screenshot  xfburn  ristretto  task manager
[11:25] <bluesabre> start with simpler apps and build a core test suite
[11:26] <knome> those are something i think might be good places to start
[11:26] <knome> and yeah, in the order bluesabre mentioned, easier first
[11:26]  * ochosi agrees
[11:26] <knome> run program should be relatively easy
[11:26] <bluesabre> agreed... xfburn might be more difficult to create a meaningful test
[11:27] <dkessel> in that order? (see pad)
[11:27] <knome> i looked through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Utopic/Autopilot and thought which of the "works" items would be somewhat "essential" or "important" to xubuntu
[11:28] <knome> maybe that
[11:28] <knome> grouped things being "equally important"
[11:28] <knome> or, "pick whichever you please"
[11:29] <dkessel> sounds good for a start!
[11:29] <dkessel> thanks!
[11:29] <knome> but that's just my opinion :)
[11:29] <dkessel> what do the others think?
[11:29] <bluesabre> I agreed already ;)
[11:29]  * ochosi too
[11:29] <knome> did you look at the pad?
[11:30] <knome> i did some subordering on the items i mentioned before
[11:30] <ochosi> hm, actually, app-finder == run program
[11:30]  * slickymasterWork lost the arguments but as a matter of principle, agrees with his fellow team members
[11:30] <ochosi> and functionally == whiskermenu
[11:31] <ochosi> so i'm somewhat wondering whether we really need to test it that much, as it isn't as important anymore as it used to be
[11:31] <knome> i'd bet people migrating from other systems *cough* windows *cough* still use it a lot
[11:32] <ochosi> hm, not sure, i mean whiskermenu does pretty much all that appfinder does too
[11:32] <knome> well run a poll for users
[11:32] <ochosi> my guess would be that catfish is actually more important
[11:32] <ochosi> but either way, we don't have to do a poll to prove or disprove anything
[11:36] <dkessel> I guess that's all I need for now
[11:41] <ochosi> dkessel: great!
[11:41] <ochosi> looking forward to the tests
[11:43] <bluesabre> so, we're considering swapping evince to evince-gtk... there doesn't seem to be a functional difference, and it reduces gnome dependencies
[11:43] <knome> any downsides?
[11:43] <ochosi> yeah, i tried -gtk and it looked/behaved the same
[11:43] <bluesabre> none discovered so far... I'm thinking it might be a good idea to go ahead and switch now since we're so early in the cycle
[11:44] <ochosi> +1
[11:44] <knome> then a +1 and "go ahead" from me
[11:44] <bluesabre> and we can reevaluate at a later point as needed
[11:44] <bluesabre> got it
[11:44] <slickymasterWork> +1 from also
[11:44] <bluesabre> will do tonight/tomorrow
[11:44] <ochosi> yeah, better switching now and having more time
[11:44] <ochosi> fwiw, i don't have the feeling that people really noticed that XChat is gone
[11:45] <ochosi> the only shitstorm i saw was about the pink highlights
[11:45] <slickymasterWork> yeah, there's no public nagging about it
[11:45] <ochosi> (and even that was not very excessive)
[11:45] <slickymasterWork> about XChat that is
[11:45] <ochosi> yeah
[11:45] <ochosi> did any others of you hear anything?
[11:45] <ochosi> or: read
[11:45] <bluesabre> nope
[11:45] <knome> the next time we plan to drop something, just change the highlight color at the same time and nobody notices
[11:45] <slickymasterWork> nopes
[11:46] <bluesabre> :D
[11:47] <ochosi> :D
[11:54] <ochosi> alrighty
[11:55] <ochosi> since time is pretty much up and there aren't many new topics brought up i'd say we end today's meeting
[11:55] <ochosi> thanks to everyone for participating!
[11:55] <knome> yep
[11:55] <bluesabre> alrighty
[11:55] <bluesabre> ttyl
[11:55] <ochosi> #topic Schedule next meeting
[11:56] <ochosi> #info bluesabre to schedule the next meeting
[11:56] <ochosi> #endmeeting
[11:56] <meetingology> Meeting ended Fri Oct 31 11:56:08 2014 UTC.  
[11:56] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2014/xubuntu-devel.2014-10-31-11.01.moin.txt
[11:56] <slickymasterWork> thanks ochosi 
[11:56] <ochosi> minutes will be up in a bit
[12:09] <brainwash> ochosi: is it worth to include the qt theme selection file in xubuntu-default-settings?
[12:09] <brainwash> to fix bug 1382741
[12:10] <ochosi> iirc bluesabre already had a patch for that
[12:10] <ochosi> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/xubuntu-default-settings/trunk/revision/533
[12:11] <brainwash> ah nice
[12:11] <brainwash> branch should be added the report then :)
[12:11] <ochosi> sure, feel free to do that ;)
[12:11] <ochosi> meeting minutes are up
[12:15] <brainwash> bluesabre: the lp number is wrong http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/xubuntu-default-settings/trunk/revision/533
[12:16] <brainwash> 1373887 is commit 530
[12:19] <brainwash> bluesabre: you could also add the extra keybinding for screen locking, bug 1033174
[12:20] <brainwash> "Add <Ctrl><Alt>l shortcut for screen locking (xflock4)"
[12:20] <brainwash> from upstream
[12:21] <brainwash> the launchpad report also requests "CTRL+ALT+DEL for firing the shutdown menu"
[12:21] <brainwash> not sure if we could add this too (xubuntu only)
[12:23]  * slickymasterWork needs a good serach engine to find something in the logs
[12:23] <slickymasterWork> *search
[12:24] <brainwash> bluesabre: I guess not, CTRL+ALT+DEL is triggering xflock4 atm
[12:24] <brainwash> people are used to this binding
[13:03] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: https://www.google.com/#q=site:irclogs.ubuntu.com
[13:04] <bluesabre> brainwash: thanks, will take a look tonight
 #action Elfy to mail -devel re where we support testers
[13:18] <elfy> ummm 
[13:18] <elfy> so perhaps if people in team could actually read things I send to the list - that would be awesome :D
[13:20] <pleia2> elfy: I read it!
[13:20] <pleia2> but that meeting confused me, I think we had a duplicate agenda from last meeting :)
[13:21] <elfy> :)
[13:25] <elfy> xchat suddenly appears to have decided to be old school in appearance
[13:48] <jjfrv8> slickymasterwork, yes, my suggestion was to remove the default All Settings icon from whisker: http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/menu0020.php
[13:48] <jjfrv8> with just the one way to get to Settings from the menu, all of our references to [icon]-> Settings would be unambiguous
[13:48] <jjfrv8> now that we have the searchable Settings in the category pane of whisker, I don't see any need to have the extra icon
[13:51] <knome> ochosi, bluesabre: opinions ^ ?
[13:59] <jjfrv8> gotta go, back later
[14:04] <slickymasterWork> lol, bluesabre, that I already have
[14:05] <slickymasterWork> I was just nagging with myself ;)
[14:07] <slickymasterWork> jjfrv8, right, but that goes way beyond the -docs scope so the project and the technical leads in particular and the team at large will have to have a say on it
[15:17] <slickymasterWork> hmmmm
[15:17] <slickymasterWork> knome, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/vivid/+source/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+pots/ubiquity-slideshow-xubuntu is set yet
[15:17] <slickymasterWork> *isn't
[15:17] <knome> what a shame
[15:17] <knome> ;)
[15:18] <slickymasterWork> just saying it because of the call for translation mail to -devel
[15:18] <knome> i'll set it up in a minute once i have coffee in my mug
[15:18] <slickymasterWork> I'm going to mention it and people will start complaining about an invalid link, for sure
[15:19] <slickymasterWork> ok, I'll fix the link in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Processes
[15:21] <slickymasterWork> knome ^^^ fixed
[15:21] <knome> actually..
[15:21] <ochosi> knome, jjfrv8: i don't have a strong opinion on that. i don't think ppl will really miss it there since we have the category. otoh i don't think the "ambiguity" of the docs is a really a big issue in that respect
[15:21] <knome> i think it'll show up when there's the first upload for that package
[15:22] <slickymasterWork> but the url is going to be that one, right?
[15:22] <knome> yes
[15:22] <slickymasterWork> it's not a big issue ochosi, but an issue nevertheless 
[15:23] <knome> since we've had the icon already, i think it's better to keep it
[15:23] <knome> and solve the ambiguity docs-internally
[15:23]  * slickymasterWork nods
[15:23] <ochosi> slickymasterWork: btw, shall we take another look at the powerman docs sometime next week?
[15:24]  * ochosi doesnt really remember where we left off
[15:24] <knome> coffee is yummy
[15:24] <slickymasterWork> yes ochosi, I've been postponing that because of work/son 
[15:24] <slickymasterWork> but things are calmer these days
[15:25]  * slickymasterWork was wondering when would ochosi poke him about that ;)
[15:25] <ochosi> :)
[15:26] <ochosi> yeah, same here tbh
[15:26] <ochosi> i was also busy and it's not on the top of my priority-list
[15:26] <slickymasterWork> lol, knome, I received that one (in the PM) during today's meeting
[15:27] <knome> yes :|
[15:27] <knome> talk about wasting bandwidth
[15:28] <slickymasterWork> :)
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> knome: about http://pad.ubuntu.com/outdated-debian-screenshots do you know if it's required some form of an account in debian to upload the screenshots?
[16:22] <knome> you should ask bluesabre 
[16:23] <slickymasterWork> I'm planning to start working on it this weekend
[16:23] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre ^^
[16:24] <slickymasterWork> or Unit193 (for that matter) ^^
[16:28] <knome> anyway, don't let them not answering keep you back... if you take new screenshots, keep them somewhere until they know where to put them :)
[16:28] <slickymasterWork> yeah, that goes without saying
[16:48] <slickymasterWork> knome, thanks for adding  that item to the blueprint
[16:48] <knome> np
[17:37] <elfy> evening all
[17:39] <knome> hello elfy 
[17:39] <elfy> hi knome 
[17:39] <elfy> so then knome ... 
[17:39] <knome> yes? :)
[17:39] <elfy> what shall we call N days then :)
[17:39] <elfy> has to be more than 14 or we've done that :S
[17:39] <elfy> D
[17:40] <knome> yeah, it's a random integer from 1 to 30 that changes every day
[17:40] <knome> and the only way to get out of this loop is that the random integer matches the day number we're on.. eg. so the deadline is "today"
[17:40] <elfy> if we postpone that till after the 6th I've got a week off and can just blast it out
[17:40] <knome> hasn't happened yet, so we're still stuck
[17:41] <knome> this weekend and forthcoming week generally look better (less busy) than the weeks before, so fingers crossed :)
[17:42] <elfy> yea - I like that deadline should just always equal either yesterday or tomorrow
[17:42] <elfy> I've got little time this weekend - and next week it's only be evenings - if I manage to find any of that elusive commodity
[17:43] <knome> yep
[17:43] <knome> let's try to coordinate some time
[17:43] <knome> tomorrow day is bad for me, but eveningish is good
[17:43] <elfy> no chance this weekend 
[17:44] <knome> oh
[17:44] <knome> duh
[17:44]  * knome misread
[17:44] <knome> :D
[17:44] <elfy> :)
[17:44] <elfy> there's no rush - I'm happy to leave it till the 2nd week of November 
[17:44] <knome> mhm
[17:46] <elfy> I'm more concerned about other things atm - incentive/scheduling testing/starting testing than the process page
[17:46] <knome> yep
[17:46] <knome> i'm generally interested on the process page because that's a good way to pass on information
[17:47] <elfy> I agree - I'm not *did-interested* - just less interested ;)
[17:47] <elfy> s/did/dis
[17:47] <knome> it's okay :P
[17:47] <knome> and yeah, got that
[17:47] <knome> just get used to me nagging about that page ;)
[17:48] <elfy> that's fine - I'll treat it the same way as people do when I ask for them to test images ;)
[17:48] <knome> haha
[17:48] <knome> fair deal
[17:48] <elfy> :)
[18:01] <elfy> knome: to be fair, I've done a bit more on that pad in the last N days - the draft proposal is certainly different than it was 
[18:04] <knome> haven't looked at it, but judging from what you've said in this channel, i guessed it would be :)
[18:04] <elfy> :)
[18:15] <elfy> hi brainwash 
[18:17] <brainwash> hey elfy