[04:25] <map> hey all
[04:28] <daftykins> mornin'
[04:40] <map> ordered a new laptop:D
[04:40] <map> couldnt resist..need a bigger screen;p
[04:41] <map> il take my samsung rv520 back to my dads when back in UK and he can try ti fix:D
[04:47] <daftykins> quitter!
[04:47] <daftykins> screen for the watching of things i take it?
[04:49] <zmoylan-pi> reminds me of the time i went back to my desk after lunch and found my boss had sold my monitor. he still expected me to finish some code of course...
[04:52] <daftykins> lmao
[04:53] <daftykins> how'd that afternoon go?
[05:00] <zmoylan-pi> i sat at keyboard and typed randomly into what was a text editor before i left to make a point
[05:04] <map> and yea daftykins
[05:04] <map> quitter? gonna fix the samsung..i hope;D
[05:05] <daftykins> why don't you just get a TV
[05:06] <map> well i dont have anything to ut it on
[05:06] <map> unless it was a small ish one
[05:07] <map> only got 2 like drawers
[05:24] <map> weird thing was couldnt order it to gib
[05:24] <map> jhad to send it to my friends girlfriend in Marbella
[05:36] <daftykins> 0o
[05:37] <map> strange eh
[05:50] <zmoylan-pi> islands are strange beasts to most delivery organisations, makes me think they're staffed by vampires or something :-p
[05:51] <zmoylan-pi> and enclaves are just islands without the water
[05:51] <map> but the deliver to spain
[05:51] <map> O_o
[05:52] <zmoylan-pi> because the border between gibraltar and spain is not a happy fluffy one
[05:54] <map> :D
[05:58] <daftykins> i used to buy stuff from the UK arm of the swedish (i think) etailer, komplett
[05:59] <daftykins> when you looked at the tracking, things would come down from Sweden and bounce between Germany and England, then England and Denmark... before eventually deciding where the Channel Islands i'm on, are
[06:00] <zmoylan-pi> and a lot of sites will say free shipping to the uk until you select channel islands.  thus reinforcing my vampire theory :-)+
[06:02] <daftykins> ;)
[06:02] <daftykins> not sure how those connect but ok!
[06:02] <daftykins> zmoylan-pi: what happened with the sold monitor tale!?
[06:05] <zmoylan-pi> my other boss looked at him like a complete eejit and told him off for selling the monitor.  it was a wacky cga/av monitor we used in a video shop point of sales system where it be showing movies until they flipped to the pos system
[06:06] <zmoylan-pi> because by that point they were hard to get and expensive so it killed one machine in the office for a few days and we couldn't even get the code off it till a new monitor was sourced
[06:07] <daftykins> >_<
[06:07] <zmoylan-pi> also didn't help as the computer was also the fax machine using a horrible dos based tsr piece of software for a fax/modem
[06:07] <daftykins> eww
[06:08] <zmoylan-pi> so when you heard the fax line ringing you had 3 seconds to save before your program was flushed from memory for fax software to be loaded.  fun system
[06:08] <zmoylan-pi> on an xt computer which wasn't known for it's speed
[06:09] <zmoylan-pi> so you could corrupt the file if you tried to save 50% of the time.  now *THAT'S* how you learn to make quick decisions! :-D
[06:10] <daftykins> :>
[06:13] <zmoylan-pi> the last computer i used with a cga monitor...
[06:16] <map> time for brooklyn nine nine yay
[06:16] <daftykins> aaah, what to do... to sleep or to stay up
[06:17] <zmoylan-pi> face monday after some sleep?
[06:17] <map> what time u gotta be up
[06:18] <daftykins> none especially
[06:19] <map> ;D
[06:19] <map> watch tv in bedand doze off
[06:20] <map> beter than trying to sleep
[06:20] <daftykins> heh i don't have one in the bedroom
[06:22] <map> i use my laptop:
[06:22] <map> ;D
[06:23] <zmoylan-pi> i watch tv shows and movies on 7" tablet
[06:23] <daftykins> i just turned off my HTPC
[06:24] <daftykins> hrmmm
[07:35] <daftykins> good morning all
[07:35] <daftykins> time to nip down the coffee shop i think
[07:42] <MooDoo> morning all
[08:08] <Guest36722> Hi, I installed ubuntu first it worked fine no problem there, and when my system crashed i installed xp os on c drive this erased ubuntu which was alresdy installed. so now whn i try to install ubuntu it does not detect my xp os and prompts to install ubuntu on full 160gb hard drive. so is there any on who can help me dual boot ubuntu along side xp without losing data?
[08:10] <MooDoo> have you seen this? - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WindowsDualBoot#
[08:10] <MooDoo> oh gone
[08:11] <jake__> yes
[08:11] <jake__> it does not solve my problem
[08:11] <jake__> any one there
[08:11] <MooDoo> this one? - http://www.wikihow.com/Dual-Boot-Windows-XP-and-Ubuntu
[08:11] <jake__> yep
[08:11] <MooDoo> ah not sure then, sorry.....
[08:12] <jake__> okay thanx
[08:12] <jake__> bye
[08:14] <jhonny> hi
[08:14] <jhonny> hi
[08:14] <jhonny> i am not able to dual; boot ubuntu along side xp
[08:14] <MooDoo> how come you logged out an then in again as another nick?
[08:15] <jhonny> i am not nick
[08:15] <MooDoo> nickname not nick, you went from jake__ to jhonny strange.
[08:15] <jhonny> no idea
[08:15] <jhonny> can you solve my problem
[08:16] <MooDoo> I can't as I said, but I'm sure if someone is about who can, they will speak up. but it's early so not that many people will be around.
[08:16] <jhonny> okay thanx any way bye
[08:53] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[09:12] <ujjain> Hello.
[09:12] <popey> Morning all
[09:12] <ujjain> My company wants to give me flu shots.
[09:14] <czajkowski> aloha
[09:14] <czajkowski> ujjain: nice of them
[09:14] <ujjain> i dont' want flu
[09:14] <ujjain> do they actually work?
[09:17] <foobarry> they can tend to give you symptoms too for a bit
[09:17] <davmor2> ujjain: yes they help, but they target only one type of flu that tends to be the most common that year
[09:23] <ujjain> ah ok,
[09:23] <ujjain> I'll take it
[09:23] <ujjain> I tend to get at least sick once a year, sometimes I stay in bed for a few days, I hate that.
[09:23] <ujjain> but I feel healthy today, except for a tiny hangover.
[09:26] <foobarry> my household has been sick constantly for 3 months
[09:26] <foobarry> my wife has been bedridden for 3 days with sick bug
[09:26] <foobarry> relief to be at work
[09:34] <christel> :o
[09:34] <christel> nothing too sinister i hope
[09:35] <foobarry> she has chronic fatigue so these things hit her harder
[09:35] <christel> must be hard for you all
[09:36] <foobarry> yes it is :(
[09:53] <Seeker`> davmor2: for large values of one. The current vaccine has 3-4 strains of 'flu
[09:54] <Seeker`> generally, flu jab gives you one or two days of feeling a little rough. If you actually get flu, you can't get out of bed for 2 weeks
[09:55] <foobarry> YMMV
[09:55] <Seeker`> foobarry: on which part?
[09:55] <DJones> ujjain: My wife gets a flu jab every year, she gets the flu at least once a year (but she's a community nurse, so see's lots of patients affected anyway), I've never had a flu jab or the flu, a guess a sample of 2 isn't a good size, but it works for me
[09:55] <foobarry> getting really ill from flu vaccinees
[09:56] <Seeker`> foobarry: the vast majority of people dont
[09:56] <foobarry> anecdotally, all of the mums at thte ante natal class who had the wine flu jab caught something akin to swine flu/bad cold
[09:56] <Seeker`> foobarry: how long after the jab?
[09:56] <foobarry> similar for my nan and the flu jab each year
[09:56] <foobarry> very soon
[09:57] <Seeker`> it takes 2 weeks for the vaccine to kick in
[09:57] <foobarry> which one? swine flu or flu jab
[09:57] <foobarry> 2 weeks is still very soon
[09:57] <DJones> At the end of the day, the jab gives you a mild form of the flu, so its understandable to mild symptoms of flu afterwards while your body builds the antibodies to fight it for the future
[09:57] <foobarry> within 2 weeks is probably more likely
[09:58] <Seeker`> I mean it takes 2 weeks for you to build up immunity
[09:58] <foobarry> my son will have the nasal flu vaccine soon
[09:58] <DJones> What Seeker` said ^^
[09:58] <Seeker`> so if you get exposed to the flu virus within about 10 days of the jab you can still get the flu
[09:58] <foobarry> yep
[09:58] <diplo> Any one recommend a router to replace a BT Home Hub ? I'm guessing BT are not like Sky and don't want you to replace it ?
[09:58] <foobarry> but strange that the ante natal mums all had a terrible cold and the non vaccine mums didnt
[09:59] <foobarry> in late preganncy , if you catch a cold, it stays
[09:59] <Seeker`> diplo: I don't have any problems using a non-BT router for infinity (some EoL Netgear router)
[09:59] <Seeker`> foobarry: exclusively?
[09:59] <diplo> OK great, will take a look around, not looked at routers in years.. always have Drayteks from work
[10:00] <diplo> But a bit out of price range for my dad :)
[10:00] <Seeker`> But as DJones said, the body reacts as if the virus is real, so a temperature etc. for a day or two is normal
[10:01] <Seeker`> because thats how your body fights viruses
[10:01] <foobarry> Seeker`: wasn't performed under scientific conditions but it was along the lines of "you guys have a terrible cold, did you have the swine jab"? and you guys without a cold, did you have it?
[10:01] <Seeker`> foobarry: you probably ignored the non-vaccine people that were too ill to come to the class :P
[10:02] <foobarry> heh
[10:02] <DJones> foobarry: Easily explained, the nurse giving the flu jab had a cold, breathed on everybody getting the jab, and couldn't breath on the others because they were getting coffee in a different room while the jabs were done :)
[10:02] <DJones> ........Problem solved.....
[10:03] <Seeker`> and there is a difference between "bad cold" and "flu"
[10:03] <Seeker`> if you have flu, you won't be out of the house
[10:03] <foobarry> also, mums with colds during preganncy are more likely to have baby with asthma
[10:03] <foobarry> so if vaccine->cold then ?
[10:04] <Seeker`> what? How do you think that would work?
[10:04] <foobarry> huh?
[10:04] <foobarry> what would work
[10:04] <Seeker`> how would the flu vaccine cause someone to get a cold?
[10:05] <Seeker`> or do you mean if they have the vaccine it must be a cold?
[10:05] <foobarry> i am convinced the vaccine does cause a cold in many people
[10:05] <foobarry> especially the obvserved results in old people and pregnants
[10:06] <foobarry> The nasal spray is well tolerated and the most commonly reported side effects are mild and include runny nose, nasal congestion and cough.
[10:07] <foobarry> and only recommended for "healthy"
[10:07] <Seeker`> How do you think the flu vaccine gives someone a cold? It gives them cold-like symptoms, but the symptoms you get are the immune response, which is what you would expect
[10:07] <Seeker`> hence "feel rough for a few days"
[10:08] <foobarry> "Low-grade fever, headache and muscle aches also may occur"
[10:08] <foobarry> so even if you are non-contagious , you essentially get a "cold"
[10:08] <Seeker`> no. You get an immune response
[10:09] <Seeker`> you need to have an infection with a cold virus to have a cold
[10:10] <DJones> Have to agree with Seeker` "Flu" is a different virus to "cold" so symptoms might be similar, but flu jab can't give you a cold, just a mild form of flu
[10:10] <Seeker`> DJones: it doesn't even give you a mild form of flu.
[10:10] <foobarry> well that is the definition fo the vaccine
[10:10] <foobarry> vaccine IS a mild form of the flu
[10:10] <foobarry> and gives you cold symptoms
[10:11] <Seeker`> foobarry: you don't get an active infection
[10:11] <DJones> Seeker`: Yeah agreed, mild symptoms caused by the vaccine as it causes the body to generate antibodies
[10:11] <Seeker`> calling it "mild flu" is FUD
[10:11] <foobarry> whether it is active or not , you still feel ill
[10:12] <Seeker`> foobarry: yes. You feel rough for a day or two. That is vastly better than having flu. Several orders of magnitude better
[10:13] <Seeker`> however, even if you do feel rough, you don't have a cold. You don't have the flu.
[10:13] <foobarry> thats why i said you essentially get a "cold"
[10:13] <Seeker`> you don't
[10:14] <Seeker`> because to have a cold you need to have an active infection with a cold virus
[10:14] <foobarry> it looks like a cold and smells like a cold
[10:14] <Seeker`> but it isn't
[10:14] <foobarry> whether it is active or not is largely irrelavent to the sufferer
[10:15] <DJones> foobarry: Bunged up nose, can't smell anything whether its a cold or the flu :)
[10:16] <TwistedLucidity> Anyone aware of a F/OSS OpenStack-type thing that can be privately hosted?
[10:16] <popey> uh, openstack?
[10:17] <ujjain> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ultra-Compact-Lipstick-Sized-Portable-External-Technology/dp/B005QI1A8C < this is not a 2amp charger
[10:17] <ujjain> right?
[10:17] <ujjain> hahaha :P
[10:17] <ujjain> opensource openstack = openstack?
[10:18] <ujjain> that's the point of openstack, build your own cloud
[10:18] <ujjain> except that it's kind of difficult
[10:18] <TwistedLucidity> Sorry, finger-fudge
[10:18] <Seeker`> foobarry: calling everything that results in a bunged up nose a "cold" just isn't correct
[10:18] <SuperMatt> ujjain: well yeah, it's virtualisation with a great deal of flexibility. it ain;t gonna be easy
[10:19] <TwistedLucidity> *AHEM* Anyone aware of a F/OSS **StackExchange**-type thing that can be privately hosted?
[10:19] <popey> ujjain: it says 1A on it.
[10:19] <ujjain> popey, ah ok, I didn't get that, that sucks then.
[10:19] <popey> TwistedLucidity: fedora have one..
[10:19] <popey> https://askbot.com/
[10:20] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy World Orphans Day! :-D
[10:20] <ujjain> it's not opensource right?
[10:20] <popey> oh, maybe not
[10:20] <popey> surprising
[10:20] <popey> https://ask.fedoraproject.org/en/questions/ i assumed it would be
[10:20] <ujjain> maybe it is actually
[10:20] <ujjain> http://www.mkyong.com/featured/top-5-open-source-qa-systems/
[10:20] <Seeker`> foobarry: and while it might be irrelevant to the sufferer, saying that the flu vaccine causes "flu", "mild flu" or a "cold" is incorrect. It simply isn't accurate.
[10:20] <ujjain> TwistedLucidity check that link
[10:21] <ujjain> http://www.osqa.net/ seems perfect
[10:21] <TwistedLucidity> Ta
[10:21] <TwistedLucidity> That does look like the shizzle.
[10:24] <JamesTait> TwistedLucidity, something like discourse?
[10:24] <ujjain> Askbot is a free open source Question and Answer (Q&A) forum software written in Django and Python. < GPL too btw.
[10:24] <TwistedLucidity> That's a forum type thing, no?
[10:25] <TwistedLucidity> ujjain: GPL will probably be knee-jerk refused.
[10:25] <ujjain> http://try.discourse.org/
[10:25] <ujjain> ah ok, I don't know which FOSS license, if that matters.
[10:25] <popey> discourse isn't a Q&A
[10:25] <JamesTait> TwistedLucidity, yeah, you're right, actually.
[10:26] <TwistedLucidity> I can find out, was just struggling to find examples
[10:26] <popey> have heards of Shapado before
[10:26] <JamesTait> I just made the mental link with Jeff Atwood. :)
[10:27] <foobarry> ok who signed me up to the mellow mushroom e-club?
[10:29] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[10:30] <popey> Yes.
[10:32] <davmor2> JamesTait: that's an oxymoron if ever there was one, what have orphans got to be happy about ;)  Happy orphan adoption day I could go with :)
[10:32] <davmor2> morning bigcalm
[10:34] <popey> http://www.linuxvoice.com/raspberry-pi-model-a/
[10:34] <popey> neato
[10:34] <ujjain> there is a 15 pound one now!
[10:37] <davmor2> man that nearly a stone
[10:38] <bigcalm> 1st 1lb
[10:54] <JamesTait> davmor2, I did think that as I was typing it, and I refrained from wishing everyone a happy cancer awareness day for the same reason. :-/
[10:56] <davmor2> JamesTait: hahaha, yeah it's hard to judge which would be worse there......oh wait combining the two would definitely be the worse option
[10:57] <Myrtti> just as I was planning to set a trigger to reply to everything davmor2 says with "*groan*" he actually says something that isn't an awful dad joke or a pun.
[10:57] <Myrtti> what a lost opportunity
[10:58] <bigcalm> :D
[10:59] <davmor2> Myrtti: haha like it :)
[11:00] <Myrtti> I was starting to suspect you communicate only by puns
[11:00] <Myrtti> faith in davmor2 having atleast some shred of mental health left: restored
[11:01] <JamesTait> Myrtti, that won't last long. ;)
[11:01] <SuperMatt> http://www.meetup.com/Linux-Open-Evening-Hayes-West-London/events/218005122/ - rackspace open evening for linux techs next wednesday
[11:01] <davmor2> Myrtti: yeah don't worry I have a cold I'm not feeling well ;)
[11:03] <JamesTait> davmor2, I hope you didn't have that when you bear-hugged me on Friday.
[11:03] <davmor2> JamesTait: no wifey had it then, passed it to me over the weekend cause she's nice like that
[11:04] <foobarry> too much kissy wissy
[11:06] <JamesTait> davmor2, aww, how sweet - you even share your pathogens!
[11:07] <davmor2> JamesTait: you mean you and your family don't :P
[11:08] <JamesTait> davmor2, ìf it means me getting what Connagh's had the lat couple of weeks, I hope not. :-P
[11:08] <davmor2> JamesTait: oh that sounds rough
[11:09] <JamesTait> davmor2, it's "only" a cough. But it's the kind of cough that keeps him (and us) up half the night and he's struggling to shake it.
[11:10] <bigcalm> davmor2: chances of you coming to the LUG this week?
[11:10] <JamesTait> davmor2, coughing-induced vomiting has become a regular highlight, unfortunately.
[11:12] <davmor2> bigcalm: if it is this week hopefully high depending on the cold
[11:12] <davmor2> JamesTait: ouch yes not fun, and what makes it worse is the acid reflux would trigger more coughing thus starting the cycle off again :(
[11:13] <bigcalm> davmor2: if you're not there, do you want me to give Ron a tenner for you?
[11:13] <JamesTait> davmor2, precisely. :(
[11:13] <davmor2> bigcalm: that would be awesome if you could. thanks
[11:14] <bigcalm> davmor2: erm, I mean £5
[11:14] <bigcalm> davmor2: unless you're bringing a +1
[11:14] <davmor2> bigcalm: no just me
[11:14] <bigcalm> Okay
[11:15] <davmor2> Myrtti: see I can be serious
[11:17] <bigcalm> Like Hamlet, davmor2 pretends to be mad as a March hare to confuse his peers
[11:19] <davmor2> bigcalm: no I am as mad as a march hare, I just have moments of lucidity :)
[11:20] <davmor2> bigcalm: it's the lucid bits that worry people the most ;)  Don't know why :)
[11:38] <DJones> ali1234: Thanks for that ssd recommendation, picked one up at the weekend & works nicely, not sure if I notice much of a speed difference compared to the old hdd though
[11:45] <Seeker`> DJones: speed up doing what?
[11:46] <DJones> Just general speed, I wasn't expecting much difference
[11:46] <DJones> From experience so far, it bears out what I expected
[11:54] <Myrtti> http://finland.fi/Public/default.aspx?contentid=315671&nodeid=37588&culture=en-US
[11:54] <Myrtti> :-D
[12:04] <foobarry> our equallogic SAN almost at its 5yr warranty expiry
[12:05] <foobarry> first disk has just died
[12:05] <foobarry> uptime 1114 days
[12:05] <foobarry> great bit of kit
[12:17] <MooDoo> :)
[12:18] <zmoylan-pi> did it travel around the planet a few times crossing the international date line so it thinks it's after it's expiration date? :-)
[12:28] <foobarry> new raspberry pi a+
[12:29] <foobarry> http://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-model-a-plus-on-sale/
[12:30] <foobarry> £15
[12:32] <zmoylan-pi> while i understand that it's mostly used for embedded tasks i really think it needed 2 usb ports
[12:54] <foobarry> convenient that the wall berlin came down around this time of year. it means they do not have to mention ze war
[12:55] <zmoylan-pi> also came down same day as krystalnacht so drowns that out a smidge too
[12:56] <foobarry> yes
[12:58] <zmoylan-pi> OR it could be seen as a country that something appaling happened in got's its act together and did something wonderful a few years later?
[14:41] <foobarry> and so it starts all over again: tv ads showing e-cigs
[14:43] <zmoylan-pi> well they've already started banning vaping in public spaces so it may not be on tv long
[14:43] <foobarry> unless it makes money
[14:43] <foobarry> some rules haven't been updated yet
[14:44] <foobarry> a colleague is vaping in the office, but it irritates my throat and i can taste it
[14:44] <zmoylan-pi> well it may take less time to get it off air.  though how they'll ban the vaping not shown vaping ads will be interesting
[14:44] <foobarry> H&S unofficially advised that it is banned
[14:44] <zmoylan-pi> i still fondly remember the funny hamlet ads in the 80s
[14:44] <foobarry> but no clear comms coming centrally means awkward convos arising rather than a global email saying don't vape indoors
[14:45] <zmoylan-pi> true but we live in a huggy feely don't want to hurt anyones feelings hr world
[14:45] <davmor2> zmoylan-pi: the first introduction most kids got to classical music ...... oh that's the hamlet music
[14:45] <diddledan> waht's wrong with vaping?
[14:45] <zmoylan-pi> bad for you
[14:45] <foobarry> its more likely that it takes ages for issues to be decided upon
[14:46] <foobarry> if a colleague does it indoors we all breathe it
[14:46] <foobarry> it irritates my throat
[14:46] <foobarry> and tastes nasty
[14:46] <foobarry> it's not just water vapour
[14:46] <brobostigon> in theory, vaping makes smokers more productive, as its saves on the time, they would use to go out for a smoke, to actually doing producitve things in the office.
[14:47] <zmoylan-pi> while annoying the other users of the office
[14:47] <TwistedLucidity> Simple, just doc smokers 1 hours wage every day to compensate for wasted time.
[14:47] <foobarry> dont hire smokers
[14:47]  * TwistedLucidity await fireworks...
[14:47] <brobostigon> that has been known to happen already, TwistedLucidity
[14:47] <ujjain> well, let people smoke but judge them on their productivity
[14:48] <ujjain> just don't judge non-smokers badly if they spend an hour away frmo their desk during their day
[14:48] <foobarry> 1hr ?
[14:48] <ujjain> but who am I, i'm going to spend3pm to 5pm playing pool
[14:48] <foobarry> i had a colleague who spent 1hr at his desk
[14:48] <foobarry> and the rest in the smoking room chatting up the ladies
[14:48] <ujjain> ah, good life.
[14:48] <foobarry> smoking room = common non-work room
[14:48]  * brobostigon used chewing tobacco in his last office, he got the micotine, was productive, and didnt annoy anyone with bad smells etc.
[14:49] <foobarry> the vaper uses patches+vape
[14:49] <foobarry> +cigs
[14:49] <zmoylan-pi> just as long as his spitoon was emptied...
[14:49] <ujjain> yeah, hehe, a lot of people get away with it, a lot of pepople also seem to be 3 or 4 times as prodcutive as others and just make the same money
[14:49] <diddledan> http://www.itwire.com/business-it-news/open-source/66014-systemd-fallout-joey-hess-quits-debian-project
[14:49] <foobarry> greybeards...
[14:49] <diddledan> I wonder where he'll go?
[14:49] <brobostigon> isnt that what tissues were invented for ?, zmoylan-pi ?
[14:49] <zmoylan-pi> the elder sandals, they should not be dismissed as they are wise
[14:50] <brobostigon> and bins
[14:50] <TwistedLucidity> Ceilings?
[14:50] <diddledan> under the desk
[14:50] <zmoylan-pi> actually no brobostigon, kleenex were invented to remove makeup, they put up a suggestion box for other uses till someone added a disposable hankerchief
[14:50] <TwistedLucidity> No wait, that's wet tissue paper
[14:50] <diddledan> oh wait, that's schools
[14:51] <diddledan> heh, double "oh waits"
[14:51] <brobostigon> and to remove mucus from ones nasel passages.
[14:51] <foobarry> and "other things"
[14:58] <ujjain> Me: Sorry, I can’t accept this booking. I could never meet the deadline.
[14:58] <ujjain> Client: Why?
[14:58] <ujjain> Me: Well, because it’s at least 45 hours of work.
[14:58] <ujjain> Client: So? The deadline is 48 hours away. (clientsfromhell.net)
[14:59] <zmoylan-pi> just read that on rss
[15:00] <foobarry> my old boss
[15:00] <foobarry> "this data will take 3 hrs to copy"
[15:00] <foobarry> "i'm back from lunch in 1hr , have it done"
[15:00] <foobarry> "but physics..."
[15:02] <zmoylan-pi> i'd sit staring at the machine and tell him i'm willing the computer to do the job faster
[15:02] <foobarry> he'd already left
[15:02] <brobostigon> pretend to be the opposite to scotty, i am no miracle worker.
[15:03] <foobarry> turns out his lunch took 3 hrs and he just wanted to try to dominate me
[15:03] <zmoylan-pi> set all the clocks in the office back 2 hours... and claim some sort of time dilation has delayed the copy
[15:03] <foobarry> sociopath
[15:03] <brobostigon> :(
[15:03] <foobarry> he made people cry often
[15:03] <brobostigon> some people are very cruel.
[15:03] <zmoylan-pi> i used to throw my boss down the stairs when he said things that were extra stupid. was the office punishment
[15:04] <diddledan> 50 shades of grey
[15:04] <foobarry> :-|
[15:04] <brobostigon> "50 shades of being a nutter of a boss"
[15:05] <foobarry> i left because of irrational behaviour like that
[15:05] <foobarry> kept acquiring companies and sacking their IT
[15:05] <foobarry> because i'd managed to consolidate their stuff before,
[15:06] <foobarry> it set a new baseline for expectations
[15:06] <foobarry> if you don't like failure, you will end up breaking yourself as the pressure increases to breaking point
[15:07] <foobarry> i see that in alan sugar too
[15:07] <foobarry> why would anyone give him the time of day?
[15:07] <foobarry> yes lord sugar, thankyou lord sugar for the oporutnity to be your slave
[15:08] <diddledan> foobarry, was he the archetype for the book?: http://www.theguardian.com/books/2012/aug/24/fifty-shades-grey-domestic-violence-campaigners
[15:09] <foobarry> i think he was textbook sociopath
[15:09] <diddledan> sounds like the book alright
[15:09] <diddledan> :-p
[15:10] <diddledan> seriously I don't get why women found the book empowering
[15:10] <foobarry> whats that business with the guy who killed those 2 girls in hong kong?
[15:10] <foobarry> its bizarre
[15:10] <diddledan> not sure I'm aware of that one
[15:10] <foobarry> how do you make the step from wall st -> lord of the flies
[15:10] <foobarry> google rurik jutting
[15:11] <foobarry> On his final day at work Rurik Jutting cleared his desk and recorded a new voicemail message.
[15:11] <foobarry> Part of it read: “I am out of the office. Indefinitely. For urgent inquiries or indeed any inquiries please contact someone who is not an insane psychopath.”
[15:11] <diddledan> ah yes
[15:11] <diddledan> eek
[15:13] <diddledan> seriously mucked up that is
[15:13] <zmoylan-pi> that sort of job attracts psychopaths anyway i thought
[15:14] <diddledan> ooh, my gmail has hit 7.99GB
[15:14] <foobarry> i used to work with them
[15:14]  * diddledan waits for it to clock-over
[15:14] <foobarry> and the wannabees too
[15:14] <zmoylan-pi> i just delete anything more than 2 years old in my gmail and have it stored locally for backup
[15:15] <foobarry> why not setup a ***2@gmail.com and archive it there?
[15:15] <zmoylan-pi> it's pretty sad thay there's no way to detach attachments and safe space that way without forwarding silliness
[15:17] <foobarry> offlineimap
[15:17] <foobarry> download and re-upload
[15:17] <zmoylan-pi> not worth the bandwidth for such a simple task
[15:18] <zmoylan-pi> it was requested a few months after gmail started and has never been done
[15:19] <diddledan> how many spaces does google give a freebie account these days?
[15:19] <zmoylan-pi> 10gb?
[15:19] <diddledan> (mine is a business)
[15:20] <zmoylan-pi> ah 15gb
[15:20] <diddledan> 15 by the looks
[15:20] <diddledan> yeah
[15:21] <zmoylan-pi> my laptop is ripping a dvd so was slow firing up a browser logged into google
[15:21] <Myrtti> "6.18 GB (24%) of 25 GB used"
[15:22] <Myrtti> more than ten years of email, with lots of filters
[15:23] <zmoylan-pi> 57% of space used with 2 years of gmail and a few months of kittykam images
[15:44] <DJones> 1.66 GB (6%) of 25 GB used
[15:46] <ali1234> can i use a network scanner on linux? like document scanner, not nmap
[15:46] <foobarry> another job offer turned down :(
[15:46]  * zmoylan-pi twitches involuntarily at mention of network scanners
[15:47] <DJones> ali1234: I'm pretty sure my HP8600 works over wifi, but may well depend on which version of Ubuntu you're using, I think there were issues before 14.04
[15:47] <ali1234> but how do i find it and connect to it?
[15:48] <ali1234> i have a HP M175nw and the printer part works okay
[15:49] <DJones> From what I'm reading, the scanning is supported through the hplip drivers, just try firing up xsane
[15:49] <DJones> From memory, that just finds it
[15:50] <ali1234> ah, you have to run sudo hp-setup, which installs some extra plugin for scanning
[15:51] <DJones> Have you found this link https://help.ubuntu.com/community/sane
[15:51] <DJones> Basically only says wha you just said about hp-setup though
[15:52] <ali1234> yeah, you just run it, it's a wizard that does it all automatically
[15:52] <DJones> Spotted this as well https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ScanningHowTo#HP_All-in-One_devices
[15:52] <ali1234> it's working now
[15:58] <popey> nice!
[15:58] <popey> i had no idea that stuff Just Works ™
[15:58] <zmoylan-pi> it's scarey sometimes when that happens
[15:59] <zmoylan-pi> what bit did i miss nags you for ages...
[15:59] <zmoylan-pi> like the cup of screws you always have left over after fixing a computer...
[18:18] <Azelphur> Got an old Latitude D600 I'm trying to install Xubuntu on, it's so old it doesn't have PAE, can I still install Xubuntu on it?
[18:24] <zmoylan-pi> what happens when you boot live cd or usb?
[18:39] <DJones> Azelphur: Maybe try a livecd, I seem to remember having a d600 with 12.04 (but may have been older) that worked ok
[18:39] <Azelphur> DJones, I got the answer, I had to put forcepae in the kernel options
[18:39] <DJones> Heh
[18:39] <Azelphur> thanks though :)
[18:40]  * DJones waits for the force16gb ram kernel option
[19:29] <diddledan> what does forcepae do?
[19:29] <diddledan> you can't magic pae support out of thin sillycon if it wasn't there to begin with
[19:29] <shauno> similar to a stern glare
[19:33] <shauno> ah, there you are.  the D600 has a pentium M 'Dotham', which have a very annoying trait - they support PAE, but don't list it in their flags
[19:33] <shauno> or is it the one before that
[19:34] <shauno> yeah, I'm wrong, I'll shut up now :)
[19:36] <celesteh> Hi folks. I use AIFF files very frequently, and I was just attempting to test one by playing it in QuodLibet, but that program won't open it. Neither will clementine. Is there some issue with consumer-level music players and aiff?
[19:38] <brobostigon> have you tried something like vlc?
[19:45] <daftykins> Azelphur: is that some Pentium M beast? :>
[19:45] <daftykins> i remember the D505s well
[20:19] <DJones> One thing I've learned at the weekend, Currys/PC World doesn't sell Windows instore
[20:41] <ujjain> is it possible to get a burnout at work without having too much work?
[20:42] <zmoylan-pi> carry a ups from bottom of building up to top of building 3-4 times?
[20:43] <directhex> ujjain, definitely
[20:44] <directhex> the issue often isn't being overworked, it's a feeling of futility
[20:44] <directhex> i.e. your work makes no difference so sod it all
[20:45] <ujjain> Yeah, it even makes me feel worse when people dont undersstand how I can´t enjoy being able to spend 40 hours a week on Facebook, anything etc.
[20:47] <daftykins> wait what, is facebook your job? D:
[20:47] <directhex> lack of work kis a major cause of burnout
[20:47] <zmoylan-pi> http://www.theguardian.com/culture-professionals-network/culture-professionals-blog/2012/may/24/burnout-advice-recognise-prevent-deal
[20:48] <directhex> ubisoft have an office filled with junior devs they need to keep on the payroll for millions in kickbacks from the canadian government, but no work to do. it's commonly regarded as torture by those sent there
[20:49] <ujjain> there is a lack of work, and when there is work, it´s rebooting servers
[20:51] <directhex> invest your spare time on your personal development?
[20:52] <ujjain> Yeah, I´ve done that a few months, but I have a hard time still enjoying it.
[20:53] <zmoylan-pi> setting personal goals can be hard, find someone else there to work with?
[20:57] <ujjain> Yeah, I guess. :) At least I had an interview in a different taem last Friday, but I didnt feel that good, not like I could nail the interview.
[20:57] <ujjain> The technical questions yes, but there were 40% non-technical, like character questions, ¨what is your biggest mistake¨, I dont feel that good at my job, so I didnt feel I had a good story
[21:03] <popey> "this interview"
[21:04] <map> hi all
[21:22] <map> going into spain later again:D
[21:22] <daftykins> D:
[21:23] <map> went to charlies steak place tonight..first time ive had prawns!
[21:23] <map> cant say im too fussed either
[21:23] <map> don't get the big deal
[21:23] <daftykins> they have to be had with marie rose sauce
[21:23] <daftykins> which looks pink
[21:23] <map> no idea what that is:D
[21:23] <daftykins> then they are the food of the gods
[21:23] <map> but it just seemed like well a lot of effort..for not much meat
[21:23] <daftykins> it's like tomato ketchup and mayo mixed i think
[21:23] <map> taking shell off etc
[21:23] <diddledan> map, what's the point going to a steak place and not having .. yaknow .. steak
[21:23] <daftykins> oh if they're not peeled then yeah, i'm not into that
[21:23] <map> diddledan,  i had mixed grill dude
[21:24] <map> and it had 2 king prawns
[21:24] <map> yea daftykins  its like an effort and for bugger all edible meat;p
[21:24] <map> and they taste a bit bland?
[21:24] <daftykins> yep not much to them
[21:24] <daftykins> just like lobster really
[21:24] <map> never had that either
[21:24] <Azelphur> daftykins: yup it was :)
[21:25] <popey> prawns in garlic butter >>>>>> prawns in marie rose sauce
[21:25] <diddledan> o_O
[21:25] <daftykins> if you think prawns were bad, lobster is like a day job to get to food
[21:25] <Azelphur> runs really well on Xubuntu 14.10 amusingly, only fault I found was that the boot screen is a mess
[21:25] <map> heh
[21:25] <map> nice place though
[21:25] <daftykins> Azelphur: neat! RAM must be low?
[21:25] <map> sucks you all live in the uk
[21:25] <zmoylan-pi> try lubuntu to use less resources for a performance bump?
[21:25] <map> with no such cool places
[21:25] <map> :D
[21:25] <daftykins> well i don't ;)
[21:25] <Azelphur> daftykins: 1GB
[21:25] <daftykins> lubuntu is too ugly imo ;)
[21:26] <Azelphur> hehe
[21:26] <map> i like lubuntu
[21:26] <popey> Azelphur: seen http://ubuntu-mate.org/ ?
[21:26] <map> an xubuntu
[21:26] <zmoylan-pi> an acquired taste to be sure
[21:26] <popey> Azelphur: 14.04 version should be coming this week, 14.10 already done.
[21:26] <map> like prawns
[21:26] <Azelphur> popey: I haven't, looks cool
[21:26] <popey> retro ☻
[21:26] <Azelphur> indeed :)
[21:26] <Azelphur> I did it because he said all he used was chrome, and he was running XP
[21:26] <Azelphur> so he had to move to something :)
[21:27] <daftykins> good man. XP needs killing everywhere we find it
[21:27] <map> what did you do?>!
[21:27]  * zmoylan-pi upgrades those systems to win 3.11 :-)
[21:27] <daftykins> map: yeah well you like netbooks so you don't get an opinion ;)
[21:27] <map> gah
[21:27] <map> ;[
[21:28] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ek1fogzr3a3dqf9/IMG_20140711_142615.jpg?dl=0
[21:28]  * diddledan sings "can you feel the love tonight"
[21:28] <daftykins> still love this build i did
[21:29] <daftykins> map: changed your tubes to pay for what you're actually getting, yet? :>
[21:29] <diddledan> blinking nora, that's a huge heatsink
[21:29] <daftykins> yip! it's my main clients desktop box, the thinking was to go overkill so it'd require less maintenance ;)
[21:30] <daftykins> but that's a kentsfield Q6700 core 2 quad under there
[21:30] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/5c535s9knaxtrjn/AAC5wT3RKy-ip5zE6HbXOxQ8a?dl=0
[21:30] <diddledan> .. until you need to vacuum the thing
[21:30] <daftykins> never happened :)
[21:30] <daftykins> it's kinda funny, the whole system is stable, but it got a lightning strike once and so some USB ports are fried
[21:31] <diddledan> \o/
[21:31] <daftykins> i'd been using it undressed on the bench there for a long time, decided to get the cheapest case i saw online
[21:31] <diddledan> I love how ocz don't actually tell you how many giganuts they've put into the ssd
[21:31] <daftykins> plus it's my PSU ;D
[21:31] <daftykins> that's a 120GB i believe
[21:31] <map> nah
[21:31] <map> emailed em daftykins
[21:31] <map> but no reply
[21:32] <daftykins> map: but you're burning money D:
[21:32] <diddledan> o_O
[21:32] <diddledan> I'll gladly take any money that needs burning
[21:32] <map> heh
[21:33] <map> i havent paid a bill yet daftykins  and no direct debit
[21:33] <map> so hoping they sort it out and then charge me or something
[21:33] <daftykins> diddledan: the thought occurs to me that that box is a good graphics card away from being quite the gaming machine - for someone that doesn't mind quirky USB :D
[21:33] <map> whats wrong with it
[21:34] <daftykins> i already said map :P
[21:34] <penguin42> daftykins: If a lightning strike only took out USB ports I'd count it as lucky!
[21:34] <map> ah
[21:34] <map> what specis it
[21:34] <daftykins> penguin42: it is :D it also murdered the base station of a cordless phone tha the secretary was using at the time
[21:34] <daftykins> she was a bright flash and then got cut off
[21:35] <penguin42> haha
[21:35] <daftykins> weird part is everything's UPS'd on that affected PC
[21:35] <daftykins> i think it went over the network cabling somehow
[21:35] <map> thats luck it still works..dont surge protectors stop anything getting fried in lightning etc?
[21:35] <daftykins> lol no
[21:35] <map> hm
[21:35] <map> thought they would
[21:35] <penguin42> map: There are surges and there are OMG it's lightning
[21:36] <daftykins> electricians have told me in the past that 'surge protecting' power strips are utter lies
[21:36] <map> yea
[21:36] <map> so what can u do about lightning to protect electrics
[21:36] <map> and how did it happen
[21:36] <penguin42> map: You can do some stuff with gas filled spark gaps but you also have to design it all really well, and still you need to get lucky
[21:36] <daftykins> have a lightning rod on the property, ideally
[21:37] <daftykins> if i knew how it happened i... don't think there'd still be anything that could be done
[21:37] <daftykins> i think we did lose a switch that day too, not sure
[21:38] <diddledan> arc attack !
[21:38] <daftykins> i kept bugging about fitting a lightning rod but he's never had anything done
[21:39] <daftykins> unlikely to happen again though i suspect :)
[21:39] <penguin42> right.......
[21:39] <daftykins> hmm?
[21:39] <diddledan> lightning never strikes the same place twice
[21:39] <daftykins> it was interesting a telco engineer telling me the other day that they're not allowed to do much work when there's a storm brewing :D
[21:39] <diddledan> that's a load of bollards, by the way
[21:39] <daftykins> lol
[21:40] <diddledan> daftykins, I don't suppose they fancy going up a tower with sparks flying
[21:40] <penguin42> or holding onto the end of a load of cables going who-knows-where
[21:41] <diddledan> although theoremetically if you're on the inside you'll be fine
[21:41] <penguin42> diddledan: Not if you're holding a load of cables going to the outside
[21:41] <map> daftykins,  im no expert in all this..but lightning can come in and screw up anything electric?
[21:41] <daftykins> diddledan: even under-road junction boxes etc
[21:41] <daftykins> map: yep, zap-zap-zap
[21:41] <diddledan> dang
[21:41] <diddledan> zzzzzap
[21:41] <daftykins> Zap Brannigan
[21:41] <map> lool
[21:41] <map> i like the text affects;p
[21:42] <daftykins> you can even hear it if you say it out loud ;D
[21:42] <diddledan> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1b6ko1I00A
[21:42] <daftykins> ooooh now i remember
[21:42] <daftykins> yep it totally murdered a 24 port rackmount netgear gigabit switch
[21:42] <diddledan> I hope it was a cheapo
[21:42] <daftykins> i had to put in a tiny spare temporarily to get the essentials going again
[21:42] <diddledan> and not l2-managed
[21:43] <daftykins> nah this is a domestic affair, so it was ~£200?
[21:43] <diddledan> few
[21:43] <map> so whats to stop it hitting you then daftykins ?
[21:43] <diddledan> few?
[21:43] <diddledan> phew*
[21:43] <map> heh
[21:43] <daftykins> well luckily his secretary was on a cordless phone
[21:43] <daftykins> she could've had a zap zap zap to the ear otherwise :/
[21:43] <daftykins> so that phone's base station was toast too
[21:43] <diddledan> daftykins, wireless charging
[21:43] <map> would it be bad?
[21:43] <diddledan> :-p
[21:44] <daftykins> people can get burns, sure
[21:44] <map> i thought inside you were safe as ouses;p
[21:44] <daftykins> what's really nasty is i had to make his desktop usable the best i could
[21:44] <diddledan> a lightning up the bottom can kill
[21:44]  * penguin42 squirms
[21:44] <daftykins> to start with all USB were dead entirely, so ahead of ordering a USB PCI card, i had to setup his laptop on his main screen RDP'd to his desktop over LAN =|
[21:45] <diddledan> lol
[21:45] <daftykins> that felt like such an ugly bodge
[21:45] <daftykins> the laptop couldn't even nearly drive the 2560x1600 30" Dell LCD he has
[21:45] <penguin42> daftykins: Lucky they hadn't used the USB hub in that
[21:46] <daftykins> eventually though i was opening up the PC to put the PCI USB card in, decided to pull the PSU's mobo connectors... USB reset \o/
[21:46] <daftykins> some ports came back, some were dead
[21:46] <daftykins> penguin42: hah yeah that would've been pricey
[21:47] <daftykins> so lovely quad core machine that, but a wonky motherboard
[21:47] <daftykins> it only gets used if i pop in and need to do things, i should take it home really
[21:47] <daftykins> but i don't need two quad core desktops
[21:49] <joshua__> Hey guys, am trying to use update-alternatives on precise 12.04 box to point to my packaged version of imagemagick, but it's throwing this error: https://gist.github.com/joshmyers/befde20b91bac2245865
[21:49] <joshua__> the symlink has been made, /etc/alternatives/animate
[21:49] <joshua__> but it's not been updated so it's not currently being used....any ideas?
[21:56] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/74hccewvuoznfxg/IMG_20140702_164202.jpg?dl=0
[21:56] <daftykins> that's the other thing i have spare kicking around
[21:59] <diddledan> speaking of burnt usb - a colleage at work a while back plugged a 12v feed into a usb hub accidentally (same connector type, both on the desk next to each other) - the laptop started smoking
[21:59] <penguin42> oops
[21:59] <diddledan> luckily it only killed the usb2 chip
[22:00] <diddledan> usb3 still works
[22:00] <daftykins> X|
[22:00] <daftykins> if it's Dell they'd still replace it under warranty ;D
[22:01] <diddledan> he's been plagued with that lappy tho - he's currently got a nice dead-centre vertical stripe of 1p width dead screen
[22:01] <diddledan> px*
[22:02] <penguin42> ah that's annoying
[22:03] <diddledan> especially as ubuntu unity has a dock on the left offsetting a maximised window's center point - otherwise it wouldn't be so bad becasue a terminal could be split into 4 without noticing the dead line
[22:03] <daftykins> dead or lit?
[22:04] <diddledan> (he mainly uses that screen for teminals cos it's smaller than his external)
[22:04] <diddledan> it's lit red
[22:04] <diddledan> I think
[22:04] <daftykins> ooh-err
[22:04] <diddledan> might be white
[22:04] <daftykins> check out this phone i was checking out today :D i was seeing if a newer wireless headset could be plugged into it
[22:04] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/i1ehtkiiddd3wdd/AAA3BeNv8b2akuLTPFjYbND0a?dl=0
[22:05] <penguin42> 'wireless headset could be plugged into it'
[22:05] <diddledan> lol
[22:05] <daftykins> "supplied by Guernsey Telecoms" (they've not been called that for over 10 years) aaaand 1991 supply date!
[22:05] <daftykins> it's not as crazy as it sounds :D
[22:05] <daftykins> most Plantronics gear seems to work by plugging into the 4P4C sockets on the sides of phones, intercepting the handset
[22:06] <penguin42> ah yes
[22:06] <daftykins> they even have crazy handset-auto-lifting devices to take them off the hook O_O
[22:07] <penguin42> nice
[22:07] <diddledan> haven't they heard of solid-state circuitry
[22:07] <diddledan> ?
 a lightning up the bottom can kill
[22:07] <map> * penguin42 squirms
[22:07] <map> sounds funier than it is
[22:07] <map> heh
[22:07] <daftykins> penguin42 wsn't meant to find out what i wired his chair to
[22:07] <diddledan> mechanical hook seems a bit.. weird
[22:08] <daftykins> i phoned up Plantronics asking for whether their wireless contraption would work, but the guy kinda just dumbed down the response to a 'not likely'
[22:09] <daftykins> i wanted to know if i could re-work the 4P4C pinout and pop it into an 8P8C to make it work myself ;D
[22:09] <diddledan> he wanted to sell you a new one
[22:09] <daftykins> actually he didn't
[22:09] <daftykins> because they only sell the headset portion, kinda thing
[22:09] <daftykins> so there's a wireless base station which needs to plug into a wired desk phone, and the headset itself
[22:10] <daftykins> but they don't really do the phone bits anymore
[22:13] <Azelphur> hey folks, how do I do a filesystem check on an ext4 drive?
[22:13] <diddledan> fsck /dev/drive
[22:14] <Azelphur> thanks :)
[22:14] <diddledan> sdxx
[22:14] <diddledan> if it's your / partition tho you'll need to do it on boot in safemode or by getting it to autocheck at next bootup by creating /forcefsck as an empty file
[22:14] <Azelphur> also this is a little frustrating, I can't unmount it because its in use, but lsof isn't telling me what's using it
[22:14] <Azelphur> nah, it's another drive
[22:15] <diddledan> are you cd'd into a path within the mountpoint in any terminals?
[22:15] <daftykins> have you got a terminal sat inside its' path?
[22:15] <diddledan> ^
[22:15] <daftykins> diddledan: +1
[22:15] <Azelphur> diddledan: nope
[22:16] <diddledan> the alternative is some program has the mountpoint or a path within set as it's CWD
[22:16] <Azelphur> aha, nfs-kernel-server was locking it
[22:17] <diddledan> if you started any programs from the shell while CDd there it might do that
[22:17] <Azelphur> google helped :)
[22:17] <diddledan> or that
[22:17] <diddledan> google, how dare you be smarter than me!?!
[22:17]  * diddledan pouts
[22:17] <Azelphur> hehe
[22:17] <Azelphur> hopefully this drive isn't fucked, getting errors and it has been going into read only
[22:17] <diddledan> language timothy
[22:17] <Azelphur> then again, I have had power failures recently
[22:17] <Azelphur> sorry :x
[22:18] <diddledan> oh dear
[22:18] <diddledan> hopefully fsck can fix it
[22:18] <Azelphur> had a 1TB fail only a few weeks ago too
[22:18] <diddledan> ouch
[22:18] <Azelphur> not having much luck with drives recently.
[22:19] <Azelphur> Error reading block 724570564 (Attempt to read block from filesystem resulted in short read) while getting next inode from scan.  Ignore error<y>?
[22:20] <Azelphur> that doesn't sound good :<
[22:21] <daftykins> Azelphur: show us the smartctl -a /dev/sdx before wasting time with file system repairs, sir
[22:21] <Azelphur> 9 of those errors
[22:21] <Azelphur> daftykins: yea, I just had that brain wave, gonna do it after fsck finishes
[22:22] <daftykins> ;_;
[22:23] <daftykins> and now it's gonna be a long long time, 'til touchdown... </Elton John>
[22:23] <daftykins> i swear i have some talent for finding dead disks
[22:24] <Azelphur> I know the 1TB is dead dead, it went click of death :<
[22:24] <daftykins> <#ubuntu user> so i have this... <dafty> smartctl. she's dead jim.
[22:24] <Azelphur> haha
[22:29] <brobostigon> lol.
[22:35] <Azelphur> daftykins: I broke fsck!
[22:35] <daftykins> \o/
[22:35] <brobostigon> fsck kicked its own bucket.
[22:35] <Azelphur> WARNING: PROGRAMMING BUG IN E2FSCK! OR SOME BONEHEAD (YOU) IS CHECKING A MOUNTED (LIVE) FILESYSTEM.
[22:36] <daftykins> Azelphur: does Linus know you by name yet? ;) granted this is more GNU...
[22:36] <Azelphur> It's not mounted, so...programming bug in E2FSCK?
[22:36] <daftykins> is it actually paused or was that a warning mid-process?
[22:36] <Azelphur> mid-process
[22:37] <daftykins> i'd run the smartctl anyway sir, it can talk to the disk controller in parallel to the fsck
[22:37] <Azelphur> http://pastebin.com/FkpGx4kB yea, just did
[22:37] <Azelphur> fsck finished now anyway
[22:38] <daftykins> oh she's toast
[22:38] <daftykins> toaster than toast
[22:38] <daftykins> 1792 reallocated, 16 pending, streaming raw read errors
[22:39] <Azelphur> :<
[22:39] <Azelphur> fml
[22:39] <daftykins> you got much on it?
[22:39] <Azelphur> daftykins: nah it's just a backup drive
[22:40] <Azelphur> I rsnapshot a lot, and that's the drive I rsnapshot to
[22:40] <daftykins> ah ok
[22:40] <Azelphur> so nothing is gone, just need a new one.
[22:40] <daftykins> if you dd zero fill it, you can force all the reallocations to complete
[22:40] <daftykins> the disk might still be toast, but you'd be able to see whether it stops getting worse or not
[22:41] <Azelphur> daftykins: I see
[22:42] <daftykins> i keep using a 2TB disk for unimportant storage in my desktop as it only developed 4 bad sectors
[22:42] <daftykins> dd zero, that reallocated them, then all is happy :D
[22:42] <Azelphur> daftykins: I'm kinda hoping to pick up an extra drive in black friday anyway, so I'll grab a new one anyway
[22:42] <Azelphur> and then play with it
[22:42] <daftykins> ah yes i forgot that sale event has firmly planted itself in the UK now too
[22:43] <Azelphur> daftykins: oh please, I have Bitcoin ;)
[22:43] <Azelphur> last time I went black friday shopping I ended up importing about 30TB of drives for me, family and friends.
[22:43] <daftykins> what does that influence?
[22:43] <daftykins> lol
[22:43] <Azelphur> daftykins: can buy stuff from USA :)
[22:44] <daftykins> remind me to bug you the next array upgrade i do ;)
[22:44] <Azelphur> daftykins: well I'm hoping for good deals again this year, 2 years ago I bought 3TB drives for £70 each
[22:45] <diddledan> I was curious what Steve Gibson was up to lately - https://www.grc.com/sr/whatitdoes.htm - proof that spinrite is nothing special in the video trying to prove it's special
[22:46] <daftykins> i've heard it called snake oil
[22:48] <diddledan> the site hasn't had much of any work done on it stylewise since 2000
[22:49] <diddledan> although he does now have the menu on the right-hand side in non-mobile-friendly dimensions
[22:50] <zmoylan-pi> make vague promises and include buzz words, stanard business model since they invented the plough probably
[22:51] <daftykins> =]
[22:53] <awilkins> Spinrite? Total horse manure, isn't it?
[22:54] <daftykins> i'd think so
[22:54] <daftykins> nothing ddrescue probably doesn't do
[22:55] <daftykins> iirc he tries to claim it is a great recovery tool because it 'tries in many ways' to read data on given sectors etc
[22:55] <diddledan> he promotes it as "preventative maintenance" because "hard drives have data protection built-in"
[22:55] <awilkins> How many ways other than "telling the drive to read that sector" can you do?
[22:56] <daftykins> by avoiding using the disk's abstraction mechanisms apparently
[22:56] <awilkins> Wouldn't that require rewriting the firmware of the drive... and using your own abstraction mechanism?
[22:58] <daftykins> meh, i'm not defending the guy :>
[22:58] <penguin42> I don't think there's any other way of reading it via the standard IDE interface
[22:58] <awilkins> https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!original/comp.dcom.xdsl/Vm2xVSu6prk/jpfCIyPj7poJ
[22:58] <daftykins> ATA? :(
[23:00] <daftykins> lol he attempted to re-use the production list of bad sectors
[23:00] <daftykins> that sounds terrible
[23:01] <penguin42> yeh, very bad move
[23:02] <ali1234> in fact there are some tricks you can use
[23:02] <ali1234> for spinning disks anyway
[23:02] <ali1234> the blocks you read directly before the bad one can affect whether it is readable or not
[23:03] <daftykins> i'm sure there was some stuff about reading backwards to a spot, vs. forwards or some jazz
[23:04] <ali1234> basically. bit more complicated though, since the surface is 2 dimensional
[23:04] <penguin42> which doesn't really make that much sense assuming it's rotating and you're reading stuff off as it spins
[23:04] <penguin42> I certainly think it's worth regularly reading the whole disk to give the drive a chance to find corectable errors; but I don't know how real it is
[23:05] <ali1234> disks do that on their own
[23:06] <daftykins> i know my 3ware arrays do an auto verify every friday night :D
[23:06] <daftykins> 'cause i get an email!
[23:06] <ali1234> drive firmware runs smart self tests at regular intervals - that means attempting to read each block
[23:07] <ali1234> it's done during idle time of course, so you won't notice
[23:07] <ali1234> you can also manually schedule such a test with smartctl
[23:07] <daftykins> i sincerely doubt any disk is testing every single one 0o
[23:07] <ali1234> tha's exactly what they do
[23:08] <daftykins> if that were true, they'd have a chance to reallocate prior to write operations uncovering them, slowing things down as they do so
[23:09] <ali1234> reallocating destroys data, which is why reallocation only happens on write
[23:18] <diddledan> does anyone have any more-than-meh recommendations for an openwrt router?
[23:20] <daftykins> how about just a good one? :>
[23:21] <diddledan> I'm in the market for getting a new router but I want to openwrt it, so was just testing the water of what people preferred/had good experience with
[23:23] <daftykins> ah
[23:23] <daftykins> i think that newest model Linksys ended up being a disappointment :(
[23:24] <zmoylan-pi> isn't that what linksys specialise in' selling disappointments :-)
[23:24] <shauno> I think they've gone full meta
[23:25] <shauno> linksys itself is now the disappointment that companies sell to each other
[23:26] <diddledan> yeah, cisco no longer love linksys - I lost track of who got it after that
[23:26] <shauno> I think it's belkin this week, but I might be out of date on that too
[23:26] <daftykins> hah, always detested Belkin gear
[23:26] <daftykins> the one thing i trusted them for though... patch leads ;)
[23:27] <shauno> everyone has their happy accidents.  like msft actually make some respectable mice
[23:27] <zmoylan-pi> i like belkin.  sufficently generic they don't try to be clever with just enough brand name that they want the hardware to work and not fail every 5 minutes.  ymmv
[23:28] <zmoylan-pi> microsoft the software company make great hardware while apple the hardware company does great software.  says a lot about the world that :-D
[23:29] <daftykins> specialise in the thing you don't want to be good at! hey wait :(
[23:30] <zmoylan-pi> some people say i'm cynical but i say they haven't watched the i.t. industry since mid 80s :-)
[23:30] <penguin42> find me a good IT guy who isn't cynical
[23:31] <penguin42> cynical, bitter, twisted....
[23:31] <diddledan> if it actually worked, I'd be happy to stay with the router I've got - but the giganet switch doesn't do packets
[23:32] <zmoylan-pi> the law of odds sugests there's one person who's worked in industry forever and never had piece of hardware fail.  _ever_
[23:32] <diddledan> the 10/100 does fine tho
[23:35] <diddledan> seriously? the bt home hub has openwrt target?
[23:37] <shauno> it sounds like you just want a router :)
[23:37] <shauno> er
[23:37] <shauno> switch
[23:37] <shauno> damnit
[23:37] <ali1234> you probably won't find one where the ADSL works
[23:37] <diddledan> shauno, I need the router to be able to output more than 100Mbit
[23:38] <shauno> no you don't :)
[23:38] <shauno> (also, aside; apple's a software company ;)
[23:38] <diddledan> so a giganet switch doens't help because the router only has 100Mbit
[23:39] <daftykins> if i wanted to burn money i'd use my huawei as the VDSL2+ modem and get a router with a wired WAN port
[23:45] <shauno> I'm still using two routers.  it's pretty messed up :)
[23:45] <daftykins> you break the internets
[23:47] <shauno> what doesn't break them only makes them stranger :)
[23:47] <daftykins> http://arstechnica.com/science/2014/11/italian-courts-acquits-seismologists-convicted-of-manslaughter/
[23:48] <daftykins> ugh
[23:48] <shauno> "Each scientist had been sentenced to six years in prison along with a government official. "
[23:48] <shauno> prison is bad enough, but being imprisoned with a govt official?  is that not 'cruel and unusual' ?
[23:49] <penguin42> haha
[23:50] <daftykins> :D
[23:50] <daftykins> "you must also talk politics"
[23:50] <daftykins> noooooooooooooooooooooo!
[23:52] <daftykins> g'night everyone
[23:52] <zmoylan-pi> italy: jailing scientists since gallileo...
[23:55] <shauno> daftykins: really?  it's still yesterday!
[23:55] <zmoylan-pi> or yesterdays tomorrow
[23:55] <daftykins> i know :( i stayed up all night and worked 'til 3pm
[23:55] <daftykins> then slept 'til 7pm
[23:55] <daftykins> so now is sleep part 2, the sleepening
[23:55] <shauno> nn
[23:56] <zmoylan-pi> sleep well
[23:56] <daftykins> ty!