[00:08] <diddledan> the whole net neutrality thing in the US at the moment - what a load of morons!
[00:08] <diddledan> the constitution probably could be interpreted to dictate that all internet traffic in the US be neutrally treated
[00:09] <diddledan> all men are created equal and all that jazz
[00:10] <diddledan> gotta love this one: https://twitter.com/SenTedCruz/status/531834493922189313
[00:10] <diddledan> because obamacare is obviously bad
[00:22] <shauno> he's not far off though
[00:28] <shauno> 'obamacare' is obviously bad.  they took a concept that, on the face of it, seems perfectly sensible.  and then shoe-horned it into their existing dsyfunction
[00:29] <shauno> they didn't actually fix the dysfunction, just tried to force everyone to participate in it
[00:30] <shauno> my worry with net neutrality is that they'll do the same.  they'll label it a utility so that it earns 'common carrier' status
[00:30] <shauno> and in the process it'll become elligible for all the existing ways the govt gets to interfere with utilities
[00:32] <shauno> they have a track record of taking "the right idea" and finding the worst possible implementation.  so even when they sound like they're catching on, I still worry
[00:45] <penguin42> shauno: Things like the no traffic shaping, seems like a bad idea if it means they can't prioritize things like low latency traffic over bulk
[06:24] <map> hey
[07:51] <MooDoo> morning all
[07:53] <map> morning
[07:53] <map> another nightmare night MooDoo ;p
[07:53] <map> ive just moved country doing same thing
[07:53] <MooDoo> map: why what's going on?
[07:54] <map> drinking and smoking:(
[07:54] <map> i smoked when i was out in UK
[07:54] <map> now its so cheap im smoking 20 a day
[07:54] <MooDoo> well stop it :)
[07:55] <map> easier said than done
[07:56] <map> im worried drinking and smokiing will kill me
[07:56] <map> i came here to get away from it all
[07:56] <map> but as usual i cant
[07:56] <MooDoo> e-cig?
[07:57] <map> never tried
[07:57] <map> i wasnt smoking so much before
[07:57] <map> but its so cheap here
[07:57] <map> i was smoking like 10 on nights oiut
[07:57] <map> now im back to my old ways 20 a day
[07:59] <MooDoo> maybe try ecig or something, then again i've never smoked so what do I know
[08:00] <map> i smoked for 12 years
[08:00] <map> then quit
[08:00] <map> smoked a bit on and off in stoke
[08:00] <map> now im smoking everyday in gib
[08:45] <map> ugh
[08:45] <map> not looking forward to my flight home
[08:46] <map> gotta get from Heathrow -> Kensington
[09:31] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Origami Day! \o/
[09:33] <zmoylan-pi> i fold and go home
[09:35] <JamesTait> zmoylan-pi, ba-dum, tsch!
[09:35] <zmoylan-pi> tip your waitress, try the veal
[09:38] <JamesTait> zmoylan-pi, I prefer my waitresses upright, thanks. ;)
[10:06]  * davmor2 fold JamesTait into an envelope and sends him to south africa, cheapest flight you'll ever have ;)
[10:06] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[10:08] <lornajane> morning bigcalm
[10:08] <popey> pip pip
[10:08] <lornajane> hey popey :)
[10:08] <bigcalm> Oh, hey there lornajane :)
[10:08] <popey> Yo!
[10:09]  * popey is using gnuplot for the first time
[10:09] <bigcalm> Ho ho and a bottle of rum
[10:09] <lornajane> bigcalm: don't look now, I'm completely reinstalling my laptop before I start my new job :)
[10:09] <popey> heh
[10:09] <bigcalm> Ha#
[10:09] <zmoylan-pi> new distro or just flushing the chaff?
[10:09] <JamesTait> davmor2, warmer there, too. ;)
[10:09] <bigcalm> lornajane: as long as you have virtual box and vagrant working, it doesn't matter what you're running :)
[10:10] <lornajane> zmoylan-pi: new hard drive.  This currently has a spindle disk in it that's been giving me errors for months, and it's running 13.10
[10:10] <bigcalm> A working system does help though
[10:10] <lornajane> so, big new SSD, from-scratch ubuntu install <-- the plan
[10:10] <bigcalm> A good plan that should just work (TM)
[10:10] <lornajane> bigcalm: yeah this one is working but has been neglected.  The ubuntu release cycle fits absolutely horribly against conference seasons
[10:11] <zmoylan-pi> using linux has given me a new problem.  with windows no install lasted more than 6 months, with linux i have systems that have been upgraded but not wiped for a few years.  odd things have been tested and forgotten on them which can make them behave /oddly/ :-)
[10:11] <davmor2> JamesTait: And you know people there, I was sending you there to be evil it was a nice thing I was doing :)
[10:11] <JamesTait> davmor2, you're just a big softie, really. :-P
[10:11] <lornajane> I'm currently copying the windows partitions over to the new disks, they're the thing I'm most worried about
[10:11] <zmoylan-pi> hopefully plan means that the backups are both fresh and tested...
[10:12] <lornajane> zmoylan-pi: yep
[10:12] <popey> lornajane: new job = new contract or new permie thing?
[10:12] <popey> (if you dont mind me asking)
[10:12] <lornajane> popey: part time, permanent, remote.  I'll be working with bigcalm at siftware from Monday
[10:12] <popey> Oh!
[10:12] <lornajane> about 3 days a week though, to fit in some other training/consulting and community stuff
[10:12] <popey> Congrats and commiserations!
[10:13] <lornajane> this machine hasn't been from-scratch reinstalled in about 18 months and it's always nightmarish just for the sheer volume of toolchains that I have
[10:14] <lornajane> I love being polyglot but I'm not right excited about getting it all working again :)
[10:14] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[10:17] <bigcalm> popey: some how I feel involved in the commiserations bit
[10:17] <popey> haha
[10:17] <bigcalm> Hi brobostigon
[10:17] <popey> i kid
[10:17] <bigcalm> :P
[10:18] <brobostigon> hi bigcalm
[10:19] <lornajane> bigcalm: I am confident we can all survive this.  You will probably want to kill me at some point but luckily it's a remote company ;)
[10:19] <bigcalm> \o/
[10:20] <zmoylan-pi> we need a deity of distro installs to make offerings too...
[10:22] <bigcalm> lornajane: I'm going to be in the office 2-3 days a week. Hopefully see you there occasionally. As I have a standing desk at home, it's going to feel lazy to be back in an office chair there though
[10:22] <zmoylan-pi> dig a hole in floor... :-p
[10:23] <lornajane> bigcalm: I expect to be in the office approximately monthly so will definitely see you
[10:24] <bigcalm> Nice
[10:30]  * popey glares at gnuplot
[10:30] <popey> plot "/tmp/tmp.h64nvRQ5QM" using 1:2
[10:30] <popey> "/tmp/tmp.cREQfnSCeg", line 13: Bad format character
[10:30] <popey> what is wrong with that plot line?
[10:32] <zmoylan-pi> expecting something after the /'
[10:32] <zmoylan-pi> expecting something after the /'s
[10:32] <zmoylan-pi> ?
[10:32]  * popey fiddles some more
[10:33] <SuperMatt> https://twitter.com/sprmtt/status/532118829741408256/photo/1 - oh customers!
[10:34] <bigcalm> Bwuhaha
[10:37]  * popey makes notes not to let SuperMatt near his boxes
[10:38] <SuperMatt> hey, I covered everything that's not common knowledge
[10:41] <bigcalm> Looking at devices connected to my router, I can see a device that doesn't have a host name (it's just "?"). Going to the allocated IP address I get the "Apache2 Debian Default Page" page. I can't find a Debian VM running on any of my machines. How might I track this one down?
[10:42] <zmoylan-pi> emp? :-)
[10:42] <zmoylan-pi> nmap and see what else is there, sometimes it'll list an os
[10:42] <diplo> nmap, see what ports are open and try and connect
[10:42] <diplo> :D
[10:43] <bigcalm> Oh dear
[10:43] <bigcalm> I just SSHd to the IP address. It's my laptop connecting on wifi as well as eth0
[10:43] <bigcalm> Grr
[10:43] <shauno> heh
[10:44] <zmoylan-pi> or... your alternate universe self connecting to your network to see waht you're up to :-)
[10:44]  * bigcalm disables wifi
[10:46] <lornajane> I have absolutely no idea what's on our network, don't think I could even draw the wired topology accurately
[10:46] <lornajane> this is what happens when you marry your sysadmin
[11:06] <czajkowski> lornajane: morning
[11:06] <lornajane> hi czajkowski
[11:06] <czajkowski> I know my server room downstairs in the basement is well a a pile of cables everywhere.  downside to geek men who like gadgets and aren't tidy
[11:06] <czajkowski> lornajane: nice blog post this morning  you mentioned
[11:07] <czajkowski> the don't be a dick when contributing
[11:08] <czajkowski> hmmm may have in fact killed my laptop it no longer recognises I have a battery - only works when it's plugged in . feck
[11:09] <lornajane> yeah, I loved this post.  To be fair, I love most of what snipe writes but I've been saving this one for linktuesday
[11:09] <bigcalm> czajkowski: do you mean that the indicator only shows up when it's plugged in, or that the laptop doesn't work when it's not plugged into the mains?
[11:09]  * lornajane now has a non-booting machine that won't recognise the bootable USB
[11:09] <czajkowski> bigcalm: the latter
[11:09] <bigcalm> czajkowski: ouch
[11:09] <czajkowski> it was working fine yesterday and no issue
[11:10] <zmoylan-pi> having a mass of untidy cables is kerplunk security where trying to add or move something will trigger instantly noticeable errors :-p
[11:10] <czajkowski> may have to push for new laptop sooner
[11:10] <czajkowski> just know if I do that they are gonna give me a mac and I will in fact curl up and cry
[11:10] <zmoylan-pi> shutdown, remove the battery and reinstall to be sure?
[11:10] <czajkowski> it's an ultra book cant even unpplug the battery easily
[11:10] <czajkowski> and also day 5 of new job kinda need it to work
[11:10] <czajkowski> feck
[11:12] <lornajane> okay livecd booting now, definitely going in the right direction
[11:13] <lornajane> czajkowski: what's the new job?
[11:13] <bigcalm> czajkowski: does that mean that Matt has moved to the Mac side?
[11:13] <czajkowski> lornajane: developer community manager at couchbase
[11:13] <czajkowski> bigcalm: yup
[11:14] <zmoylan-pi> so much politer than cat herder :-p
[11:14] <bigcalm> Oh my
[11:14] <czajkowski> zmoylan-pi: I get paid to talk to geeks
[11:14] <lornajane> czajkowski: nice!  Have fun with that :)
[11:14] <czajkowski> I get paid to talk - not like I've a problem in that area
[11:14] <bigcalm> Heh
[11:14] <czajkowski> lornajane: so far so good. lot to learn and pick up
[11:14] <czajkowski> but enjoying it
[11:15] <czajkowski> this week I need to be in london for 3 days. and need to learn at the same time so may start pulling hair out soon if laptop doesn't behave
[11:25] <christel> tbf you are already pretty skilled at talking so i wouldn't worry about there being a lot to learn ;)
[11:26]  * czajkowski hugs christel how's you darling 
[11:27] <christel> not too shabby! thyself? :)
[11:28] <czajkowski> not bad
[11:33] <lornajane> that's either hilarious or embarrassing.  Just realised that I don't have access to my password manager from Windows :)
[11:35] <bigcalm> Boss man has insisted that we move from Keepass to 1Password as he's now a Mac user. It doesn't look very good to me
[11:36] <lornajane> does that work on your platform, bigcalm?
[11:36] <davmor2> bigcalm: Ha Ha! ;)  does keepass not work on mac then?
[11:36] <bigcalm> lornajane: windows version runs in wine on Ubuntu 14.04
[11:36] <bigcalm> davmor2: not very well it would seem
[11:36] <lornajane> yeah I can't point at a windows interface.  This is going to be fun
[11:37] <foobarry> keepass is on mac too
[11:37] <foobarry> keepassX
[11:37] <bigcalm> lornajane: I use wine for 1Password and SQLyog. Everything else I've managed to get working natively
[11:38] <shauno> there's a third-party 'macpass' too, which is easier than messing around with mono
[11:38] <foobarry> http://www.keepassx.org/downloads
[11:39] <bigcalm> lornajane: the TeamWork Timer app took a little symlinking fun to get it working in Ubuntu, but it does work
[11:52] <MooDoo> bloomin nickserv
[11:53] <davmor2> MooDoo: I blame the user trying to break it, sounds a far more like cause of the problem to me ;)
[11:53] <bigcalm> lornajane: the only windows thing that I haven't got working in Linux is a VPN for one of our clients. For that I'm currently using a windows VM from modern.ie. I really hope the hosting company sorts out Linux access for me soon
[11:54] <bigcalm> lornajane: and it's a project that you'll be working on with me, so they really need to get it sorted :)
[11:55] <MooDoo> davmor2: yeah i just keep getting kicked about :(
[11:55] <bigcalm> Anybody know how to route traffic for selected IP addresses via a VM?
[11:56] <davmor2> MooDoo: which op did you upset with your witty banter ;)
[11:56] <davmor2> MooDoo: I bet it's all this Fedora talk on facebook ;)
[11:56] <czajkowski> hmmm is there any way I can make my machine see my battery
[11:57] <czajkowski> currently when I click on battery status is saying 00:00 to charge
[11:57] <czajkowski> s it's like it doesn't see it has a battery any more
[11:57] <davmor2> czajkowski: plug the battery into the machine?
[11:57] <bigcalm> czajkowski: maybe the firmware on the battery itself is fried
[11:57] <czajkowski> bigcalm: I'm thinking that but wondering what update would do that
[11:57] <czajkowski> davmor2: it's plugged in smartie
[11:57] <bigcalm> czajkowski: try booting from a livecd and see if it works then
[11:57] <MooDoo> davmor2: havn't run FEdora on my laptop in a couple of weeks so it can't be that
[11:58] <czajkowski> oh nt a bad idea
[11:58]  * bigcalm frames it and puts on a wall
[12:09] <bigcalm> I think we've just helped ddos gnome.com
[12:13] <bigcalm> Oh, and the freenode blog
[12:13] <christel> \o/
[12:14] <bigcalm> gnome.com worked eventually for me and I made a donation
[12:14] <christel> good lad!
[12:14] <SuperMatt> is this about the groupon name scandal?
[12:15] <bigcalm> The hint is in the URLs
[12:15] <Myrtti> yup
[12:18] <czajkowski> think the folks hosting gnome.org may want to do something with their servers ;)
[12:18] <czajkowski> I'd like to know how much they've already raised as well
[12:19] <czajkowski> given it's a foundation it does have funds for this type of issue and to run the foundation
[12:20] <Myrtti> I thought this year the Women's Outreach had depleted their funds
[12:21] <popey> yh
[12:21] <popey> bigcalm: surely you mean gnome.org?
[12:21] <bigcalm> popey: I do, I suck
[12:27] <czajkowski> wel it's a foundation so should have public accounts I think
[12:27] <czajkowski> not saying it's not a worthy cause
[12:27] <czajkowski> but equally this much exposure and people donating just want to make sure it's  for the actual cause in the long run
[12:28] <ali1234> it says right on the donation page that anything left over will be used "to improve gnome"
[12:28] <czajkowski> grr viber on desktop has stopped :(
[12:28] <popey> exactly.
[12:28] <ali1234> so in other words whatever they feel like
[12:28] <ali1234> and yes they do have public accounts
[12:29] <foobarry> viber sounds too much like tindr and grinr
[12:30] <czajkowski> it works though and useful when travelling
[12:30] <czajkowski> as whatspp can be blocked on hotels wifi in some places
[12:30]  * popey chuckles at "Pownce"
[12:30] <popey> which used to exist, dunno if it still does
[12:32] <MooDoo> shutdown in 2008
[12:35] <foobarry> viber is like whatsapp?
[12:35] <popey> one of the many chat apps
[12:35] <foobarry> i did a google hangouts call by accident the other day. the voice quality was far superior to stnadard mobile call
[12:36]  * popey found the last time pownce was mentioned here...
[12:36] <popey> http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/2008/01/05/%23ubuntu-uk.html
[12:36] <popey> also
[12:36] <popey> * MooDoo runs 2gb and that's more than enough
[12:36] <popey> ☻
[12:38] <ali1234> yeah, who could have predicted all the amazing innovations that would happen, requiring more than 2gb?
[12:38] <ali1234> innovations such as...........
[12:38] <popey> here it comes..
[12:38] <ali1234> well i'll let you know if i think of any
[12:39] <bigcalm> I can haz hot coffee!
[12:39] <bigcalm> Ow, hot
[12:41] <MooDoo> jeez
[12:42] <popey> I fought GNU Plot, and I won! http://popey.mooo.com/mirror/clicks/graph.png
[12:43] <ali1234> graph makes no sense
[12:43] <ali1234> is it per day?
[12:44] <penguin42> popey: Congratulations
[12:44] <popey> is the title at the top not clear?
[12:44] <ali1234> no
[12:44] <popey> how so?
[12:44] <ali1234> because you have a continuous variable on the x axis and a discrete variable on the y axis
[12:44] <MooDoo> looks clear enough to me
[12:45] <ali1234> pick a time and date from the bottom and read off a value. the result makes no sense
[12:45] <ali1234> y axis need sto be "click per <time period>"
[12:46] <popey> y is number of clicks in the store on that day
[12:46] <ali1234> right, and it doesn't say that
[12:46] <popey> clicks in store by date, clicks on left, date at bottom
[12:46] <ali1234> a date isn't a time period
[12:47] <popey> i didnt say it wa, you did
[12:47] <ali1234> no, i said that the graph doesn't specify a time period, and it doesn't
[12:48] <popey> I don't understand how it's not clear, sorry.
[12:48] <penguin42> popey: It's a confusion between whether the Y access value represents the total clicks upto the point on the X axis, or is the number of clicks on a particular day
[12:48] <penguin42> access? axis!
[12:48] <penguin42> heck, my brain really does think in sound
[12:48] <ali1234> it could also represent clicks per hour, minute, second, week, month...
[12:49] <popey> so if the label on x says "Total Clicks" that would clear it up?
[12:49] <ali1234> however, none of these are equivalent to "clicks"
[12:49] <ali1234> no, because then it would just be plain wrong instead of just ambiguous
[12:49] <ali1234> the y axis should be labelled "clicks per day"
[12:49] <popey> i dont think click means what you think it means
[12:49] <popey> no, it shouldn't
[12:49] <popey> its the number of click packages in the store
[12:50] <popey> not clicks on mouse buttons
[12:50] <foobarry> Cumulative chart of clicks packages in store
[12:50] <ali1234> so it is the total?
[12:50] <popey> yes
[12:50] <foobarry> ah
[12:50] <ali1234> okay, then it's correct
[12:50] <popey> \o/
[12:50] <popey> I'm glad we had this time together. I will cherish it.
[12:50] <ali1234> but you should write "click packages" in order to avoid confusion
[12:50] <popey> kk, will do
[12:51] <ali1234> because most people seeing that graph would just think mouse clicks
[12:51] <penguin42> popey: I've been playing with web based graph packages lately; grafana in particular
[12:51] <popey> i see
[12:51] <popey> refresh
[12:51] <popey> fixed?
[12:51] <penguin42> popey: it's the type of thing that lets you zoom into areas and the like; they do look a bit prettier but also require a bit more setup
[12:52] <penguin42> popey: You could say click packages instead of clicks
[12:52] <popey> ok
[12:52] <popey> i say that at the top
[12:52] <popey> but ok
[12:52] <ali1234> or if you don't wwant to write "click packages" (like because style guide says always call them "clicks" you could say "clicks available"
[12:53] <ali1234> but yeah, that is much clearer
[12:53] <foobarry> mathematica is nice for this stuff
[12:53] <foobarry> but non free
[12:54] <popey> Thanks for the help chaps!
[12:55] <ali1234> next thing to do is add labels for events like app showdown
[13:00] <popey> yeah, i also want to split off scopes from apps
[13:00] <popey> and canonical vs community
[13:01] <willcooke> ali1234, got my minimus this morning, had to make a very minor change to your code to get it to compile,  seems like LUFA's "VERSION_BCD" has gone from expecting (1.00) to (1,0,0)
[13:01]  * willcooke knows nothing about C though
[13:01] <willcooke> seemed to work
[13:01] <ali1234> willcooke: yes, LUFA changes quite often
[13:02] <willcooke> fun!
[13:02] <ali1234> also, you know that raspberry pi has SPI right? you don't have to bitbang
[13:02] <ali1234> SPI is bitbanging done in hardware
[13:02] <willcooke> ali1234, for the 433 rxer?  It's not SPI is it?
[13:02] <ali1234> yes
[13:02] <willcooke> txer
[13:03] <ali1234> the avr version uses the SPI port to generate the bitstream
[13:03] <willcooke> humm
[13:03] <ali1234> with SPI, instead of turning the pin on and off manually, you just tell it the frequency and hand it 8 bits at a time
[13:03] <ali1234> and it turns on and off for you in hardware
[13:04] <ali1234> this is far more power efficient and greatly simplifies the code
[13:04] <willcooke> oh!  wow!
[13:04] <ali1234> it interrupts when it's finished
[13:04] <willcooke> I'll read up
[13:04] <ali1234> that might be a problem on a not-real-time OS like linux
[13:06] <ali1234> typically there's a small FIFO to prevent underrun
[13:07] <willcooke> I'm looking at your AVR main.c now...
[13:07] <willcooke> I see the high, low, float and sync defined
[13:08] <willcooke> as a bit stream
[13:08] <ali1234> yes
[13:08] <Azelphur> what size drive is the best £/TB atm?
[13:08] <Azelphur> I'm guessing 3, maybe 4?
[13:08] <willcooke> ali1234, how does it know how long a "on" is?
[13:08] <ali1234> the protocol encodes 1 as long on, short off, and 0 as short on, long off
[13:08] <ali1234> this is equivalent to 1110 and 1000 respectively
[13:09] <willcooke> ahhh
[13:09] <willcooke> ali1234, so is the pulse length controller by the clock speed on the avr?
[13:09] <foobarry> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/winter-sports/30005830
[13:09] <foobarry> wow. so much corruption
[13:10] <ali1234> willcooke: indirectly, yes, there are some regsters which set a divider
[13:10] <ali1234> lines 57-62
[13:10] <willcooke> ah, kk
[13:10] <ali1234> you'll have to read the datasheet to find out what they mean, because i can't remember
[13:10] <willcooke> ali1234, sure thing, I'll do that - thanks
[13:10] <ali1234> i'm not using the normal SPI port, i'm using the serial port in M-SPI mode, so that i can use the uart fifo
[13:11] <willcooke> :) clever
[13:12]  * willcooke needs to log out and back in to get himself in the right groups
[13:12] <bigcalm> I hate that
[13:12] <bigcalm> Why do we still have to do it?
[13:13] <ali1234> you don't, you can use newgroup
[13:13] <popey> Year of the linux desktop
[13:13] <willcooke> how about getting udev to re-read the rules?  Could I sighup udev?
[13:13] <Dave2> I installed Arch last night, it has a very user-friendly process
[13:14] <ali1234> no, because you still won't be in the right groups unless you run newgroup
[13:14] <ali1234> you make udev reload the rules by doing udevadm --control reload
[13:14] <ali1234> (with sudo)
[13:14] <Dave2> Certainly is the top candidate for being the distro to push linux to the mainstream
[13:15] <ali1234> if you just added the minimus rule to let you reprogram it without root you need to do that or reboot as well as getting into the correct group
[13:16] <willcooke> need to work out how to flash the thing now
[13:16] <ali1234> "make flash"
[13:17] <willcooke> ali1234, you've thought of everything :)
[13:17] <ali1234> yes.
[13:17]  * willcooke installs dfu-programmer
[13:18] <ali1234> i even have a default template project from which i can fork when i need to write something new: https://github.com/ali1234/lufa-template
[13:19] <willcooke> ali1234, yay!  it's flashed and the smjctrl app doesnt' complain about not being able to see the device - so I think it's just some light soldering and I'm away
[13:19] <willcooke> ali1234, thanks for the help, much appreciated
[13:20] <ali1234> some day i want to rewrite this so it can send arbitrary bitstreams/bitrates
[13:20] <ali1234> then you could define the protocol on PC side, and be able to control much more devices...
[13:21] <willcooke> ha, nice
[14:25] <lornajane> yay, new ubuntu installed, took about 15 mins.  Now I spend 2 hours swearing at it and turning off all the orange/pretty malarkey
[14:25] <popey> "yay"
[14:33] <foobarry> geri halliwell is marrying christian horner of red bull :-|
[14:35] <SuperMatt> this is a little off topic ;
[14:39] <Seeker`> SuperMatt: lots of what goes on here is
[14:39] <SuperMatt> yeah, I know
[14:39] <SuperMatt> I just thought we were a little immune to the idea of celebrity goss
[14:40] <foobarry> i am , but i like f1
[14:41] <foobarry> and i thought CH was more discerning man ;)
[14:41] <foobarry> just remined me of when the geek chooses the dolly bird on "take me out" instead of the amy ferrer fowler that he would be a great match for
[14:43] <foobarry> does anyone else run cron jobs on odd days only? does "5    10 1-31/2  *  * root /root/script.sh" look ok?
[15:19] <shauno> should work, just beware it won't actually be "every 2 days"
[15:20] <foobarry> tru dat
[15:20] <foobarry> not sure there is a better soln
[15:20] <shauno> (eg, it'll run on the 31st and the 1st, not 2 days apart)
[15:35] <diddledan> my voice is my passport, verify me
[15:36] <willcooke> are you interested in astronomy?
[15:36] <diddledan> I've got shares in setec astronomy
[15:36] <willcooke> :)
[15:36] <zmoylan-pi> open the pod bay doors please hal
[15:37] <zmoylan-pi> i loved that tv show just for using scifi movies as voice passwords...
[16:09] <foobarry> can anyone recommend a nice implementation of a nice expanding menu for a web page?
[16:09] <foobarry> css, javascript, whatever
[16:10] <diplo> If you want easy to use, could just use bootstrap
[16:11] <Myrtti> I was going to say
[16:11] <diplo> http://getbootstrap.com/components/#alerts
[16:11] <diplo> bah
[16:11] <diplo> http://getbootstrap.com/components/#dropdowns
[16:12] <foobarry> nice. i'm after expandable menu rather than dropdowns, for a side bar tree menu ..maybe they have something
[16:14] <diplo> Can do it for side as well
[16:15] <foobarry> i see
[16:15] <foobarry> thsnl~kd
[16:15] <foobarry> thanks
[16:16] <diplo> http://www.bootply.com/uBoT3zP1P2
[16:16] <foobarry> ok i like this one
[16:16] <foobarry> where's that from?
[16:17] <diplo> Bootstrap
[16:17] <diddledan> that's interesting - the same script I use for development of web stuffs runs twice as fast on ubuntu as it does on os x
[16:18] <diddledan> all it is, is a load of rsyncs and some sass/compass stuff
[16:18] <diplo> http://www.jeffmould.com/2013/12/15/create-twitter-bootstrap-vertical-drop-menu/
[16:31] <shauno> diddledan: I'd suspect rsync there, osx's version is from 2006
[16:31] <diddledan> wow
[16:32] <shauno> same reason they canned samba.  they won't touch gplv3
[16:32] <MartijnVdS> thanks, Ob^H^HStallman
[16:35] <zmoylan-pi> they're free to contribute, gpl v3 doesn't hold them back
[16:42] <foobarry> diplo: bit confused about where the actual code is to use :S
[16:50] <knightwise> Mornin peeps
[16:50] <knightwise> clear
[16:50] <knightwise> mornin peeps
[16:52] <knightwise> hey guys
[16:55] <zmoylan-pi> people are probably involved in evening commute now
[16:55] <knightwise> I feel their pain.
[16:55] <zmoylan-pi> full contact hand to hand combat no prisoners in sodding rain
[16:55] <knightwise> Listened to the last Ubuntu-uk podcast
[16:55] <diddledan> oooh that was a weird bug to squish - amazon server with no ssh access
[16:55] <diddledan> turns out No != no
[16:55] <knightwise> very nicely surprised about the underwhelmed response to 14.10
[16:56] <knightwise> it means Ubuntu is growing up
[16:57] <camason> I... didn't even realise it was out
[16:58] <Myrtti> it's past third thursday of October
[16:58] <knightwise> great discussion on the podcast. Made me think that Ubuntu is indeed becoming very mature
[16:59] <camason> we have it on every device here at the office. Solid as a rock
[16:59] <knightwise> Been using it for my freelance company now for almost a year (fulltime)
[16:59] <knightwise> and i'm passed the "'gotta try the latest" thing.
[16:59] <directhex> i'm scared to upgrade, tbh
[16:59] <knightwise> even elementary (12.04) runs great on my Macbook air
[16:59] <knightwise> i'm hoppin LTS's
[16:59] <camason> not even the 'strange' OS any more. We have Steam installed on most of them. We have a nice mix of PCs and Macs and it all works nicely together
[17:00] <knightwise> indeed :)
[17:00] <knightwise> now all we need is an X86 tablet we can run it on (working on my Surface 1 at the moment, wish it could run Ubuntu :) )
[17:00] <camason> I think Android ubiquity has a lot to do with the general acceptance of 'other' platforms now
[17:00] <directhex> nope
[17:01] <directhex> it has lots to do with samsung's $20bn marketing budget
[17:01] <camason> that doesn't really contradict what I said
[17:02] <knightwise> True.. .but what Samsung does with android is abismal
[17:02] <knightwise> Love my note 3 , but hate the samsung skin
[17:02] <zmoylan-pi> samsung and software never ends well
[17:02] <knightwise> thinking about a oneplus or a Nexus 6 for my next phone.
[17:02] <camason> We have this Samsung Note 10.1 2014 edition. Speedy as hell, nice and high res.... but the Samsung OS additions... ugh D:==
[17:02] <directhex> people have android because the saleschimp in the phone store sold them on android
[17:02] <directhex> they sold them on android due to the commission samsung pay, from their marketing budget
[17:02] <knightwise> whats the alternative ? An iPhone ? (no thanx)
[17:03] <camason> directhex or just the fact that there are lots of Android devices available that have always been much cheaper than the Apple alternative
[17:04] <knightwise> I dont know .. but do you guys think that Ubuntu phone/touch stands a chance ?
[17:04] <camason> No :/
[17:04] <popey> of course ☻
[17:04] <knightwise> popey you are a tad biased :p
[17:04] <knightwise> but, look at firefox os , no big impact there (yet)
[17:05] <knightwise> and even windows phone has a hard time getting more traction.
[17:05] <popey> define "big"
[17:05] <czajkowski> knightwise: limited counteries to get it
[17:05] <popey> its only been out a while
[17:05] <camason> just look at Firefox itself. Interesting story there
[17:05] <popey> you can't beat android in under a year
[17:05] <zmoylan-pi> i think mobiles have moved beyond os.  if an ubuntu phone does make it to for sale it will be able to acess a lot of apps.  and that interests a fair few people
[17:05] <knightwise> camason firefox is starting to behave like IE4.5 on my pc
[17:05] <camason> lol
[17:05] <knightwise> zmoylan-pi your right on that account
[17:05] <knightwise> its true ! its becoming the jabbah the hut of the browser family
[17:05] <Azelphur> I think the only one that stands a hope so far is sailfish
[17:06] <popey> thats one reason we're focussed on scopes and not so much on apps
[17:06] <Azelphur> *controversial opinion*
[17:06] <zmoylan-pi> i have a nokia feature phone as i got sick of phones with battery lives that needed topping up during the day
[17:06] <knightwise> Firefox : Looks like chrome, eats ram like IE
[17:07] <zmoylan-pi> i would love to see firefox os do well.  but i also want a phone with a qwerty keyboard (not a blackberry)
[17:07] <shauno> are there any numbers for ffOS?
[17:07] <camason> Thing is, the biggest manufacturers of devices are now comitted to their OS choices. It would take something seismic to shift over to Ubuntu, which would launch with a tiny app selection for comparison (IMO)
[17:07] <camason> I'd love to see it, but I doubt it will happen. Interestingly, I have a phone on my desk - the Nokia N900. Ran 'Maemo', a Debian-based OS iirc
[17:08] <camason> was touted as being able to run almost any linux app, so no redevelopment needed. But it fell very flat.
[17:08] <popey> camason: seen the Jolla keyboard?
[17:08] <popey> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2028347278/tohkbd-the-other-half-keyboard-for-your-jolla
[17:09] <camason> ah nice - looks like the N900's big brother with that thing on :)
[17:09] <zmoylan-pi> ffos is doing well where it is sold. 20%+ i think in south america.  it's just they are avoiding eu and usa and concentrating on other markets so we don't see it
[17:09] <knightwise> I miss my Treo 750 :)
[17:11] <camason> off home - night
[17:22] <ali1234> Azelphur: that is not really a very controversial opinion
[17:23] <Azelphur> ali1234: apparently not
[17:25] <zmoylan-pi> it needs to get a lot more attention before it even gets on anyones radar
[17:55] <diddledan> oh dear, gnome needs our monies! http://www.linuxtoday.com/it_management/gnome-starts-campaign-to-protect-its-trademarks.html
[17:56]  * brobostigon tries to count how much money he would have earnt, for everytime that news has been mentioned.
[17:56] <zmoylan-pi> groupon seems to be a bit silly.  well sillier.  well seeking attention
[17:56] <diddledan> first time I've seen it
[17:57] <zmoylan-pi> you're probably just tuning out all gnome news since 3.0 :-p
[17:58] <diddledan> in other news: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2LOukDIgAA4HYk.jpg
[17:59] <penguin42> diddledan: Oh dear, that is a little fluffball
[18:02] <zmoylan-pi> our current new feral kitten turning up for food.  https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9j38UmSYjCldFhIcTlpRndFNzA/view?usp=sharing
[18:06] <Myrtti> wittle tongue :-þ
[18:09] <zmoylan-pi> kittens are +10 adorable but the tongue makes it extra soppy :-)
[18:09] <diddledan> I don't even! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2NGqI6FqeQ
[18:10] <diddledan> you can stop after the bars
[18:10] <diddledan> it was a shorter video on facebook
[18:11] <zmoylan-pi> i worry about the kids in the olympics.  by the time they hit 30 many of them seem to have diseases you usually only see in the joints of those in 70s and 80s
[18:13] <penguin42> zmoylan-pi: Is it any worse than kids do anyworse with sports?
[18:16] <Myrtti> aw that wittle pawwwww
[18:20] <zmoylan-pi> cute fluffy paw that in a millisecond can switch to can razor ripping claws
[18:21] <diddledan> today is the birthday of an awesome person - james bond. apparently it's also my sister's birthday
[18:21]  * zmoylan-pi wonders which diddledan remembers first...
[19:02] <diddledan> http://new.livestream.com/accounts/362/events/3544091 European Space Agency livestream
[19:02] <diddledan> ... landing on a comet - rosetta/philae
[19:02] <zmoylan-pi> hope they make it
[19:02] <zmoylan-pi> is it landing or docking considering the gravity?
[19:04] <shauno> I think 'capture' would be closest
[19:05] <shauno> okay, it boggles my mind when they give some times as UTC, some as CET, and some as both
[19:05] <shauno> just pick one.
[19:05] <zmoylan-pi> throw in a few metric and imperial measurements and we'll do a beagle
[19:06] <shauno> I don't do imperial, I'm not that old :)
[19:06] <diddledan> lol @ beagle
[19:06] <diddledan> that was just a farse
[19:06] <diddledan> farce
[19:06] <zmoylan-pi> it was a bargin basement budget mission, if it had of worked it would have been epic
[19:07] <diddledan> oh yeah, I wish it had worked considering the epicness of it
[19:16] <diddledan> an irishman
[19:16] <diddledan> ?
[19:16] <diddledan> or just a "european"
[19:25] <willcooke> ali1234, it works!  Thanks for your help!
[20:49] <foobarry> anyone have powerline adapters?
[20:49] <foobarry> just testing them. getting 100mb/s on 1gb/s network
[20:49] <foobarry> argh
[20:49] <foobarry> sorrry
[20:50] <daftykins> that's pretty poor, which models?
[20:50] <ali1234> yes i do
[20:50] <foobarry> nope, just realised one i/face is at 100mb
[20:50] <foobarry> unless ethtool lying
[20:50] <daftykins> ah :D
[20:50] <ali1234> you are lucky to get 100mb
[20:50] <daftykins> isn't ethtool depricated 0o
[20:50] <daftykins> or deprecated, spelling dependant :D
[20:51] <foobarry> [ 2136.742416] e1000e: eth0 NIC Link is Up 100 Mbps Full Duplex, Flow Control: Rx/Tx
[20:51] <ali1234> ifconfig is deprecated, nobody cares though
[20:51] <foobarry> maybe adsl router is 100mb
[20:51] <ali1234> quite possibly
[20:51] <ali1234> the powerline links probably only doing about 20mb anyway
[20:52] <foobarry> i just tested with 2g file and netcat
[20:52] <foobarry> got 90mb/s
[20:52] <ali1234> in the same room?
[20:52] <diddledan> MB or Mb?
[20:52] <foobarry> Mb
[20:52] <diddledan> so your 2g file - is that Gb or GB?
[20:52] <foobarry> 2GB
[20:53] <daftykins> lol such notation fail
[20:53] <diddledan> and you took care of the differentiation?
[20:53] <foobarry> need to eliminate the 100mb switch
[20:53] <daftykins> c'mon guys express your units properly :P
[20:53] <foobarry> draws a line
[20:53] <foobarry> -------------
[20:53] <zmoylan-pi> is that a metric line or an imperial line? :-p
[20:53] <popey> foobarry: yes, i have powerline things
[20:54] <diddledan> I only ask because 90MB/s is approximately 1Gb/s
[20:54] <popey> have had them on my network for years
[20:54] <daftykins> dead-disk-dafty is at it again, user with two dead disks called out in #ubuntu
[20:54] <foobarry> no fires?
[20:54]  * popey iperfs
[20:54] <diddledan> daftykins, be honest, you seek them out
[20:54] <popey> [  3]  0.0-10.1 sec  54.2 MBytes  45.1 Mbits/sec
[20:54] <daftykins> yes :(
[20:54] <daftykins> popey: with what TCP window size? :>
[20:55] <popey> the default
[20:55] <popey> TCP window size: 85.0 KByte (default)
[20:55] <diddledan> and MTU? :-p
[20:55] <diddledan> teehee
[20:55]  * diddledan giggles like a girlie
[20:56] <ali1234> i have a quite complex powerline setup with 4 adapters, one of which is also a wifi access point
[20:57] <ali1234> getting them all to talk to each other was a pain
[20:57] <diddledan> how does one "turn on" jumbo frames?
[20:57]  * diddledan wanders off towards googlie
[20:57] <ali1234> the network would split in various ways
[20:57] <daftykins> hmm they must've packaged up iperf sanely
[20:58] <ali1234> diddledan: my nas has an option to turn on jumbo frames, i haven't seen it in any other devices
[21:03] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[21:03] <foobarry> ifconfig eth0 mtu 9000
[21:03] <foobarry> but ifconfig em1 mtu 9000 fails
[21:03] <foobarry> ok, direct i get 177mb/s
[21:03] <diddledan> em1?
[21:05] <daftykins> funky interface names for funky interfaces
[21:05] <penguin42> it's stuff where it's named by the bios
[21:06] <penguin42> it's supposed to be a bit more predictable on any one machine
[21:06] <foobarry> but it ends up less predictable
[21:06] <daftykins> seems to just anger people expecting eth#
[21:07] <foobarry> its annoying
[21:07] <foobarry> and ifconfig aint working with it
[21:07] <daftykins> seen quite a lot of 'rename' requests in #ubuntu among other places
[21:07] <penguin42> yeh but when you've got a machine with 9 ethers on you start to appreciate it
[21:07] <foobarry> i still don't
[21:07] <diddledan> I thought udev was supposed to name ethernet devices consistently?!
[21:08] <foobarry> consistent = where they appear in pcie ports
[21:08] <foobarry> but annoying for puppetised machines
[21:08] <penguin42> diddledan: You can give it fixed naming if you want
[21:08] <diddledan> i.e. eth0 will always be eth0 and swapping the card will result in eth0 disappearing and eth1 arriving in it's stead
[21:10] <foobarry> popey: on 100mbit or 1gbit network?
[21:10] <foobarry> are they 100mbit powerlines?
[21:10] <popey> 200Mb/s powerlines
[21:10] <popey> (lies)
[21:10] <popey> on GbE
[21:11] <foobarry> my mate is offering me these at £20
[21:11] <foobarry> i heard they tend to break after 1yr or so
[21:15] <camason> My friend has had multiple sets - never had decent performance with them
[21:54] <shauno> so the gnome stuff is over?
[21:55] <daftykins> it is?
[21:56] <shauno> https://engineering.groupon.com/2014/misc/gnome-foundation-and-groupon-product-names/
[21:58] <daftykins> ah good news!
[22:55] <popey> foobarry: I've had mine for years