[13:59] <elopio> hello.
[14:03] <dobey> herro?
[14:04] <balloons> howdy.. sorry, hangout giving us grief, need to make a new one
[14:05] <balloons> alecu, elopio seems to be working now in the same hangout :-)
[14:05] <balloons> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcnybsqTdWWFHnASp4O0c5IWrxnbrexBgoJ_s87w0ZUK8bewQ?authuser=0&hl=en
[14:05] <balloons> I haz da button!
[14:07] <balloons> reload the page and we should be live in a moment
[14:09] <dkessel> yes you are
[14:11] <elopio> here is an introduction to GTest by mandel - https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/158tvIlZFuFU2ltmnPmOyH3QYKjZzydolky0R8iBiO9s/edit#slide=id.p
[14:11] <elopio> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vVnnphFGYY
[14:13] <elopio> and scope tests by alecu's team here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/unity-scope-click/trunk/files/head:/scope/tests/
[14:14] <alecu> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Process/Merges/TestPlan/unity-scope-click
[14:27] <elopio> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/unity-scope-click/trunk/files/head:/autopilot/unityclickscope/
[14:28] <alecu> btw, there are more click scope test cases here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/unity-scope-click/trunk/files/head:/libclickscope/tests/
[14:55] <t1mp> hello everyone
[14:55] <t1mp> next up is the design session
[15:01] <CheeseBurg> Um where is the video?
[15:02] <akiva-thinkpad> hey all
[15:02] <dobey> missing, apparently
[15:03] <t1mp> mhall119: hello
[15:03] <t1mp> mhall119: I think I configured everything correct, but the video is not appearing
[15:04] <CheeseBurg> Good so I am not the only one
[15:04] <mhall119> t1mp: let me check
[15:04] <gventuri> hi everybody
[15:04] <mzanetti> now you're live :)
[15:04] <mhall119> t1mp: you just had them in the wrong field, i've fixed it, everybody refresh the page
[15:04] <mzanetti> now it does
[15:05] <t1mp> mhall119: ok thank you
[15:05] <dobey> there it is
[15:05] <CheeseBurg> Ok I can see the video now
[15:05] <akiva-thinkpad> I can see it
[15:05] <akiva-thinkpad> hello!
[15:06] <t1mp> if you have questions, prefix them here with QUESTION: so I can easily pick them in the irc channel
[15:10] <CheeseBurg> Can they full screen this powerpoint?
[15:10] <dobey> QUESTION: Can you full screen the presetnation?
[15:10] <t1mp> done :)
[15:11] <aquarius> QUESTION: are you basically expecting that most apps will be grey in colour?
[15:14] <swordfish90> Yes guys, I can see you...
[15:18] <aquarius> QUESTION: the Ubuntu browser icon is a compass, which I imagine was chosen because that's what iPhone uses for Safari. In general would you recommend that Ubuntu app designers use icons from other platforms rather than trying to define a new brand?
[15:18] <t1mp> you don't have to save your questions in the end, especially if you have a question about the currently discussed section
[15:18] <mzanetti> QUESTION: some while back the design team did a so called "App Clinic" where they've been looking at apps and gave feedback. I found that quite useful. Are you considering bringing that back?
[15:18] <aquarius> +1 mzanetti :)
[15:19] <nik90> +1
[15:19] <dobey> aquarius: i'd say you should use the same basic icon for your app, on all the platforms you ship it on :)
[15:20] <dobey> aquarius: but should fit apprproiately on each platform
[15:23] <mzanetti> true. gventuri is very reachable. What I meant is that I liked watching the video of the tipps you gave to other people when I had some lazy time
[15:27] <mzanetti> TV ! :)
[15:27]  * mzanetti wants a portable Ubuntu TV on his phone :)
[15:27] <CheeseBurg> QUESTION: Have convergence guildlines being worked on?
[15:28] <dobey> because compiling libreoffice on a nexus4 is not really feasible :)
[15:29] <dobey> i don't. i expect TVs to have interaction by voice and hand waving
[15:30] <CheeseBurg> QUESTION: Are these design guidelines just for phone just now or are they for tablet too?
[15:31] <t1mp> dobey: who says a phone cannot do that? :)
[15:31] <dobey> LG is already shipping TVs that work that way, running WebOS :)
[15:31] <stephwilson> CheeseBurg: Just phone :)
[15:31] <dobey> t1mp: sure, you can wave at your phone to control your tv if you want :)
[15:31] <CheeseBurg> stephwilson: That's weird, isnt a tablet coming out soon with Ubuntu?
[15:32] <dobey> no
[15:33] <dobey> there are two nexus tablets as reference platforms, but the OS and apps are still primarily developed for phones at the moment
[15:33] <t1mp> CheeseBurg: eventually we want ubuntu on everything :) but right now we are making the phone as good as possible
[15:34] <CheeseBurg> t1mp: Makes sense. I just thought there was focus on the tablet this cycle too.
[15:34] <mzanetti> QUESTION: I'm having troubles with using the Header in the reminders app, because on phone it's just one page, on tablet it's side by side. and each side would need it's own header. Any advice there?
[15:35] <mzanetti> it's exactly like the last example with phone & tablet in the slides currently visible
[15:37] <CheeseBurg> I know there is limited manpower at Canonical, especially for the design team, but it seems like we have been just focusing on phone design for a long time. It's not really an issue but I am a little concerned with the pace.
[15:39] <CheeseBurg> Then again this pace could be totally normal.
[15:39] <dobey> we're trying to bring a phone to market
[15:39] <dobey> our pace is actually quite fast, as far as bringing a phone OS to market, is concerned
[15:41] <CheeseBurg> dobey: It probably is. Just feels slow because this whole process is new to me (and probably others).
[15:41] <stephwilson> Header blog : http://design.canonical.com/2014/03/new-apps-header/
[15:41] <akiva-thinkpad> Is the header now transparent?
[15:41] <mzanetti> my internet connection died... need to catch up with the 3 minutes , sorry :/
[15:41] <dobey> CheeseBurg: it's new to everyone :)
[15:42] <dobey> CheeseBurg: it might seem slow if you're used to the normal 6 months stable releases of ubuntu
[15:43] <CheeseBurg> Very true
[15:47] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: On Header; If all I want on my app is to have a Title with a custom component, and a right button representing Tabs; can this new design accomodate this flexibility better in the past?
[15:48] <akiva-thinkpad> Problem before was that it forced me to have 3 buttons and one title.
[15:48] <akiva-thinkpad> And I had to find coding workarounds which were ugly
[15:49] <akiva-thinkpad> than in the past
[15:49] <akiva-thinkpad> *
[15:50] <akiva-thinkpad> Can I contact you later on; this was actually for the filemanager app.
[15:50] <akiva-thinkpad> yah
[15:51] <akiva-thinkpad> yah the overflow is what I want.
[15:51] <akiva-thinkpad> and just the title.
[15:52] <akiva-thinkpad> mmmmmm no... you need to see the implementation.
[15:52] <stephwilson> If anyone wants to see the guidelines, drop me your email here and I can send it. Would be brilliant to have all your feedback
[15:52] <dobey> why do you want that interaction model anyway?
[15:52] <akiva-thinkpad> meh
[15:52] <t1mp> almost out of time, so if you have more questions, be fast
[15:53] <akiva-thinkpad> What I want is to easily disable the left button
[15:53] <t1mp> akiva-thinkpad: on the left side of the header? That's possible, I made a change for that recently
[15:53] <t1mp> akiva-thinkpad: I can look up the details for you after the session
[15:53] <mzanetti> thanks guys! designers interacting with app devs is much appreciated!
[15:53] <akiva-thinkpad> t1mp, okay thanks
[15:54] <akiva-thinkpad> t1mp, if you saw what I was trying to do, it would make a bit of sense. try "bzr branch ubuntu-filemanager-app+"
[15:55] <dkessel> read "something for a rainy day" and smiles
[15:55] <akiva-thinkpad> errm
[15:55] <akiva-thinkpad> bzr branch lp:ubuntu-filemanager-app+
[15:56] <akiva-thinkpad> lol
[15:56] <nik90> thnx for the session guys
[15:56] <akiva-thinkpad> yah thanks it was interesting
[15:57] <gventuri> nik90: akiva-thinkpad: it was our pleasure
[15:57] <stephwilson> Thanks everyone!
[15:57] <nik90> t1mp: lol, you should register your nick so you don't lose this one as well :D
[15:57] <t1mp> nik90: I have it registered :)
[15:57] <gventuri> t1mp: how do you register a nick?
[15:58] <mzanetti> gventuri: http://wiki.foonetic.net/wiki/Nickserv_Commands
[15:58] <gventuri> mzanetti: thanks
[15:58] <nik90> gventuri: https://freenode.net/faq.shtml#registering
[15:58] <balloons> ^^ good idea
[15:58] <nik90> damn late by few seconds
[15:59] <balloons> don't worry when you forget your password the friendly freenode staff will help you reset it, so long as you have email access
[15:59] <popey> the dekko session is about to start
[15:59] <popey> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfXUqoofx4fv7LPUnC-CmS8BQbkQeit1YYvIFW0ZWPKH7K04Q?authuser=0&hl=en
[16:00] <popey> hi boren
[16:00] <popey> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfXUqoofx4fv7LPUnC-CmS8BQbkQeit1YYvIFW0ZWPKH7K04Q?authuser=0&hl=en
[16:01] <popey> thats the hangout url
[16:03]  * balloons stares at the standby screen
[16:03] <popey> DanChapman: joining?
[16:04] <boren> Setting up the computer
[16:04] <popey> ok
[16:06] <balloons> I see you!
[16:06] <DanChapman> dam
[16:09] <popey> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1411-dekko-planning
[16:09] <CheeseBurg> Is there a reason why you can the Trojita guys split ways? Or is that a sensitive topic?
[16:13] <nik90> Letozaf_: hey
[16:13] <DanChapman> o/ Letozaf_
[16:13] <popey> Letozaf_: you listening in?
[16:13] <Letozaf_> hi guys :) yes I am listening
[16:13] <popey> yay
[16:13] <Letozaf_> o/
[16:14] <DanChapman> \o/
[16:14] <balloons> :-p
[16:15] <popey> balloons: you in another session?
[16:15] <popey> we need help mocking email server
[16:15] <balloons> DanChapman, I know you also know how to write them, so don't be afraid ;-)
[16:16] <Letozaf_> guys if you need autopilot tests I will help :)
[16:20] <popey> \o/
[17:23] <cm-t> can't see hangout :/
[17:33] <seb128> cm-t, it's lunch slot, no session
[17:33] <cm-t> yes, I said that, and just after I forgot about those UTC/CET convert :)
[17:34] <cm-t> s/forgot/thought
[17:36] <jdstrand> popey, balloons: I was listening to the dekko-planning sessions. re armhf packages and the store: fat packages should adress all of that
[17:36] <jdstrand> popey, balloons: that solves dekko and binary core apps
[17:36] <popey> jdstrand: yeah, ETA?
[17:37] <jdstrand> popey, balloons: I was just going to say I don't know the status of that. I think they work at the click install level, but no idea on the SDK
[17:37] <popey> ☻
[17:37] <jdstrand> ah, you just mentioned that in the session :)
[17:37] <popey> nik90: ^^
[17:37] <jdstrand> (fat that is)
[17:37] <bzoltan> jdstrand: who mentioned the word SDK?
[17:38] <nik90> popey: yup got it
[17:38] <popey> bzoltan: ☻ fat packages, when?
[17:38] <jdstrand> you will want to confirm fat packages with click support
[17:38] <bzoltan> popey: not very soon
[17:38] <jdstrand> bzoltan: me? :)
[17:38] <bzoltan> jdstrand:  :) yeps.. i have a highlight for that
[17:39] <jdstrand> bzoltan: I don't know how to create fat packages. I don't know how well supported they are now at the low level, and I don't know your plans :)
[17:39]  * popey has a highlight for marmite which triggers surprisingly often
[17:40] <jdstrand> I do know that solves testing core apps and dekko on emulator and desktop
[17:40] <bzoltan> popey: jdstrand: nik90: creating fat packages is not a big deal. All it requires to run all the build configs for s project what th emanifest file defines . It requires some QtC changes. It is on the backlogs right after the qmake support, what is due in 1-2 weeks
[17:40] <nik90> popey: you will be surprised how many times I get from the ci-eng channel about the keyword "wake" :D
[17:40] <nik90> I get pinged*
[17:40] <jdstrand> bzoltan: oh! neat
[17:40] <jdstrand> oh and the store. I think the store is all good on that already
[17:40] <bzoltan> popey: so i would say, that if all goes well it might land this year
[17:40] <nik90> bzoltan: awesome
[17:40] <jdstrand> the click-reviewers-tools has some tests for them too
[17:41] <popey> nik90: heh ☻
[17:41] <jdstrand> here is a fun highlight to have: regression
[17:41] <jdstrand> the security team uses that and man that comes up often! :P
[17:41] <bzoltan> nik90: popey: jdstrand: the only trouble is that QtC was not made for running multiply times the same action with different Kit ... so it will be tricky
[17:41] <jdstrand> (not for us of course ;)
[17:42] <nik90> :)
[17:44] <popey> bzoltan: write a shell script, that's what you usually do ㋛
[17:46] <bzoltan> popey:  ohh, that one is done :) already ... but I think it should be a real feature
[17:49] <bzoltan> popey: because obviously it can be done by creating two click packages  and merge them with hackarounds ...
[17:49] <popey> bzoltan: yeah, that sounds plausible
[17:54] <nik90> hangout url: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYedCpSV5UY2DtIy8osrqbq5ew8xKPdqnH4sYs4fCMxoajH-oQ
[17:56] <aquarius> ohai
[17:57] <nik90> we will be live in 4 minutes :)
[17:58] <akiva-thinkpad> hey all
[17:58] <nik90> akiva-thinkpad: hey, feel free to join the hangouts
[17:58] <akiva-thinkpad> cool
[17:58] <akiva-thinkpad> wheres the link?
[17:58] <mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYedCpSV5UY2DtIy8osrqbq5ew8xKPdqnH4sYs4fCMxoajH-oQ
[17:59] <mhall119> akiva-thinkpad: ^^
[17:59] <akiva-thinkpad> neato
[18:21] <rschroll> This looks great!  One suggestions -- docs should be generated from comments in the source.
[18:29] <balloons> I take it I missed the demo?
[18:29] <sverzegnassi> When the number of components provided by UCS will increase, the component gallery will become an important part of the UCS' UX.
[18:30] <sverzegnassi> Would be nice to have an integration with QtCreator
[18:30] <sverzegnassi> balloons: yes
[18:35] <balloons> it could make it easier for the sdk team to avoid breaking lots of components
[18:35] <balloons> since they are in one place
[18:36] <bzoltan> sverzegnassi: balloons: how do you expect that integration?
[18:37] <balloons> QUESTION: it looks like there is no requirement for licensing for a component? Is that handled in any way?
[18:37] <balloons> bzoltan, ohh, I was speaking about you not breaking custom components in the store
[18:37] <balloons> you could pull the branch on updates and have a look and see if they break or not. If it's spread out, it's not really possible to do that
[18:38] <bzoltan> balloons: OK :)
[18:38] <sverzegnassi> bzoltan: I'm talking about the components gallery, mainly. A third-party QtCreator plugin would be enough. I think that users should be somehow "forced" to use the gallery for taking a look at the components
[18:39] <balloons> bzoltan, as far as "integration" perhaps something simple like a link would get you a long way without much work
[18:39] <bzoltan> sverzegnassi:  the component gallery is available from the QtC, Tools->Ubuntu menu
[18:39] <sverzegnassi> bzoltan: I mean the Ubuntu Components Store gallery
[18:39] <dobey> aquarius: haha, yes. speaking from experience, hammering lp == bad :P
[18:41] <bzoltan> sverzegnassi:  I see +1 on that
[18:41] <balloons> nik90, yes I see it shows licenses of components; is there a requirement for licenses ? Indeed, so OS license as on lp?
[18:42] <balloons> well I ask partly because folks who re-use these components need to follow the terms
[18:42] <balloons> so you need to make sure you provide it in a sane manner so that folks can do the right thing and re-use them
[18:42] <dobey> please don't shove armhf/i386/etc compiled .so binaries into bzr trees on launchpad
[18:44] <dobey> aquarius, nik90: cmake solves the test running problem
[18:45] <balloons> ^^ I agree. Pull them and implement them in a sane way so it becomes part of the build
[18:45] <dobey> exactly
[18:47] <dobey> you don't need to copy tests to a different directory from the component, to satisfy where developers put the tests for their app
[18:48] <balloons> you know the charm store has many of these issues solved / thought about
[18:48] <dobey> so does click store :P
[18:48] <balloons> include tests, individual branches, etc
[18:48] <dobey> just package them as clicks
[18:48] <balloons> dobey, I was going to tongue-in-cheek reply to your .so binaries with that suggestion
[18:48] <nik90> ooh yeah the charm store
[18:49] <balloons> I think it makes sense to "borrow" what they've done
[18:49] <dobey> aquarius: we're already doing that. have you seen the ubuntu archive?
[18:49] <balloons> I agree with aquarius about being distributed
[18:50] <dobey> distributed is great until you care about security and verification
[18:50] <aquarius> simple example of a server (in django): lp:~sil/+junk/ucs-server
[18:50] <dobey> "here, download this qml file off plain http"
[18:50] <balloons> well, by design, this is user contrib
[18:50] <balloons> you can still vet things later if you wish, even distributed
[18:51] <mhall119> dobey: ucs could verify the download against a hash from it's own database
[18:52]  * balloons still waiting for the cpan reference
[18:52] <balloons> :-(
[18:52] <dobey> cpan!
[18:53] <dobey> and then everyone else did it wrong
[18:53] <rschroll> bravo!
[18:53] <balloons> aquarius clearly has no charm
[18:54] <dobey> aquarius: pypy is actually for things from the python standard library being stripped out and backported to python2
[18:54] <balloons> thanks guys.. cool and exciting ideas