ScottKsgclark: Debian is starting to calm down.  They'll get through it.04:40
ScottKSomeone tell Sick_Rimmit when he comes back that sysvinit is perfectly usable in Debian and it will be for the Jessie release.  All the hype to the contrary is just FUD.04:41
sgclarkyeah I figured04:43
ScottKvalorie: From day one, Ubuntu has always viewed itself as a Debian derivative.  Even when it was just called No Name Yet, there were already patches to Debian packages posted on what became the Ubuntu web site for Debian maintainers to pick up.04:44
ScottKThat's not to say you'll be able to use sysvinit for Stretch, but that's a long ways off.04:44
valorieI always feel good when ScottK agrees with me05:24
=== toscalix_ is now known as toscalix
soeegood morning07:29
sittervalorie: sweet08:15
valorieI'll take it, but .... what is sweet?08:16
lordievaderGood morning.08:18
soeeindeed good, good morning :)08:19
lordievaderHey soee, how are you?08:21
soeelordievader: fine and the weather si nice so can't complain :) you ?08:22
lordievadersoee: Doing ok here :)08:23
soeeFirefox 34 released :)08:26
sittervalorie: no errors08:32
valorieyes, 'tis sweet indeed08:35
valorienow, why doesn't this old hard drive get seen by my computer?08:35
valorieit spins, but never mounts, and Bob's winbox doesn't see it either08:36
valorieI'm beginning to think it's a zombie08:36
Riddellhola chicos09:11
Riddellhttp://qa.kubuntu.co.uk/ninjas-status/build_status_14.11.97_vivid.html  applications status, now with added version numbers10:41
Riddellsgclark: you have ksaneplugin marked wip, what's the status of that?10:43
sitterwhy ever is that in the kwin-decoration package Oo10:57
sitteryofel: did you poke someone about kdeedu copyright situation already?11:09
mitya57Mirv: hi, do you think it'll be possible to have https://qt.gitorious.org/qt/qtbase/commit/f1ee10f81ac18789.patch in our 5.3 packages?11:30
mitya57I saw someone else was asking about it already here, but now it's time for myself to want it.11:31
mitya57If you don't have anything against that, I will test & commit it.11:32
Mirvmitya57: feel free, I just finished my previous qtbase landing and have nothing pending there. now I'm looking at landing a couple of qtdeclarative patches.11:40
mitya57ok, thanks11:40
Riddellnow lists missing packages at the bottom http://qa.kubuntu.co.uk/ninjas-status/build_status_14.11.97_vivid.html11:42
=== kbroulik is now known as kbroulik-lunch
Riddellkgit added to lp:kubuntu-dev-tools for quick cloning and checkout 11:55
Riddellwell quick-ish, you still have to know what directory it's in11:55
sitterwhat's the point of kgit?11:57
RiddellI keep doing a clone then forgetting to branch11:58
RiddellI keep doing a clone then forgetting to checkout11:58
sitterRiddell: so you collapsed two commands into one? :P12:03
Riddellthree, there's a cd as well12:06
sitterRiddell: no no, that's just wrong :P12:10
sitterRiddell: git clone debian:foo -b kubuntu_vivid_archive12:10
sitterexactly what your script does12:10
Riddellok nice, but still too much typing12:11
Riddellwhy is it wrong?12:11
sitterwrite an alias :P12:11
Riddellsaid the person who wrote kbzr in the first place?12:11
sitterRiddell: because in kbzr you cannot have arbitrary prefixes12:11
kubotusitter meant: "Riddell: because in bzr you cannot have arbitrary prefixes"12:12
Riddellsitter: so what sort of alias do you have?12:13
sitterRiddell: I don't have one, I am being explicit with instructions12:16
Riddellhi DrSkyLizard 12:17
sitterRiddell: your script now has a proper chdir12:19
sitterRiddell: feature suggestion ... if checkout fails create the branch?12:20
Riddellthat would be good12:22
Riddellbut alas I don't know ruby :)12:31
yofelsitter: license file is there now - but I don't think there's a note who holds the copyright12:32
sitterRiddell: ohoh here's yoru chance to learn? :P12:32
sitteryofel: yeah, the license/copyright situation of that tar is completely unknown12:34
sitterit has a license copy of every license ever and no additional information to offer12:34
yofelyou'll want to talk to jpwhiting, he added them12:34
Riddellwhat's the licence issue?12:35
Riddellyofel: git-buildpackage-ppa doesn't work for me since I bzr updated with your changes https://paste.kde.org/pgzwhsqyd12:36
sitterthere is no information12:36
sitterRiddell: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-dev-tools/trunk/revision/20012:36
yofelRiddell: what's the error?12:36
yofeler, nvm12:37
sitteruscan as broken as ever12:37
yofelRiddell: try again12:37
yofelsometimes it has a one-time failure if there was some issue, then it leaves the tmp folder in ../build-area and fails before cleanup12:38
=== kbroulik-lunch is now known as kbroulik
sitterthe coolest thing about ppa management is how when you want to delete a source you need to go to the package overview page, to get there you have to find it amongst a list of links of which one is delete PPA and uses the same icon as delete packages would on the relevant page12:39
sitternot paying attentoin and boom, ppa gone ^^12:39
Riddellyofel: nope same issue12:45
yofelRiddell: can you wipe you ../build-area folder and try again? Works fine for me...12:48
yofelI see what happened. If build-area is missing you need 3 tries until it succeeds12:53
yofelfirst try fails because uscan errors out on missing build-area, second fails because gbp didn't properly clean up after the first failure12:54
yofelRiddell: ^12:57
Riddellhah, third time lucky :)12:57
sittermkdyr to the rescue13:05
=== rdieter_work is now known as rdieter
shadeslayersitter: did you nuke a ppa13:24
yofelhe did sound like he did earlier ^^13:24
shadeslayerthat's why I'm asking13:25
sitterI did nuke some neon ppa at some point though13:26
sitternowadays I don't meddle with deletes before the second coffee of the day13:27
sitteretoodangerous ^^13:27
soeemorning sgclark but the sun is goind down here :)13:42
BluesKaj_'Morning folks13:42
soeehi BluesKaj_13:43
Sick_RimmitGood morning BluesKaj_ and sgclark13:43
BluesKaj_hey soee, Sick_Rimmit13:43
Riddellsoee: it's circular, if it does down for you it goes up for sgclark :)13:43
Sick_RimmitInput Method Configuration13:43
Sick_RimmitWe got this new I-Bus thing in 14.04 I think it was13:44
soeeso she is stealing it from me :)13:44
Sick_RimmitI had some trouble with it not passing input to Chromium13:44
RiddellSick_Rimmit: hey have I pointed you to this for fosdem? https://community.kde.org/Promo/Events/FOSDEM/2015  we need to know people and what useful stuff they can bring and what they can help out with13:44
sgclarknot up here yet13:44
Sick_RimmitToday I noticed earlier these freezes happening, which Alt+Tab seems to give me back the focus13:44
* Sick_Rimmit will look at that in a minute13:45
Sick_RimmitI know nothing about I-Bus, but on Plasma 5 it says it's not configured. I am just wondering if it might be the source of these odd lockups.13:45
Sick_RimmitBut I have no idea where to start looking13:45
sgclarkRiddell: sorry ksanplugin was done, forgot to update pad13:46
sgclarkalso updated all mine to 97 last night13:46
Riddellsgclark: oh cool13:47
Riddelllovely thanks13:47
RiddellSick_Rimmit: input methods have always been problematic, nobody understands them or how to use them13:47
Riddelland I can confirm the issue with chromium not liking it13:47
Sick_RimmitRiddell: Ah thats cool, I don;t feel bad anymore13:48
RiddellSick_Rimmit: did you get anywhere with gdb?13:48
Sick_RimmitRiddell: Nothing, nada 13:48
Sick_RimmitInterestingly, since utilising Alt+Tab I think I've only lost the system once to a reboot13:49
Sick_RimmitWhich is much more promising13:49
ScottKSick_Rimmit: re last night's conversation, sysvinit works fine on Debian Jessie and will do so when it releases, so all the whining about systemd is either FUD, confusion, or being upset about logind, not systemd as an init system.13:49
Sick_RimmitRiddell: You also mentioned speaking at FOSDEM, did you want me to do that too ?13:50
Sick_RimmitScottK: Indeed, I took a look at the Wiki pages lined from devuan.org and saw there is a short script that will enable SystemD sysint to be swithed our13:51
kubotuSick_Rimmit meant: "ScottK: Indeed, I took a look at the Wiki pages lined from devuan.org and saw there is a short script that will enable SystemD sysint to be swithed out"13:51
ScottKThat and people get the words "default" and "required" confused.13:51
RiddellSick_Rimmit: would be cool if you had something to talk about https://lists.fosdem.org/pipermail/fosdem/2014-October/002057.html13:52
ScottKMy favorite is when I point out that systemd isnt' required as an init system, the response is "it was, but due to all the complaining, they just changed it".13:53
* mamarley doesn't understand why people seem to like sysvinit so much. It is much more difficult to write sysvinit scripts than it is to write systemd or upstart scripts, and sysvinit scripts can't restart processes when they crash.13:55
yofeldebuggability, and yes, being able to grep through system logs is somewhat nice13:56
yofelOTOH, systemd has its sweet points13:56
mamarleyI completely agree about the logging.  Binary log files just seem like a bad idea.13:57
mamarleyI was talking about just init systems.  All of my complaints about systemd have to do with things other than init.13:57
sgclarkyeah the only bit that I miss is the log13:58
mamarleyI read somewhere that you can still have it write regular log files though.13:58
sgclarkthat would be nice13:58
yofelthe binary log format does make sense from a common log write/read interface POV. And I think there was a way to make journald generate a text dump of the log14:02
mamarleyThe main problem I see with the binary log is accessing it if the system won't boot (for example, if you are trying to access it from a liveUFD or something.)14:02
yofelsomeone will make a log reader for that...14:03
sgclarkyeah and that is a point when you most need your logs lol14:04
sittera server admin would probably find other more expectable use cases than system-doesnt-boot :P14:06
mamarleyYeah, there are plenty of other cases.  That was just the first one to come to mind, since it has happened to me before.14:06
ScottKBy default (at least in Debian) the systemd log thing relays on to syslog.14:06
mamarleyScottK: Will *buntu do the same?14:07
ScottKPresumably, but I don't know.14:07
mamarleyThanks.  I hope so.14:07
ScottKWe don't (as a rule) diverge from Debian in the core platform without a reason.14:07
Riddellwaa my hard disk keeps filling up with .xsession-errors cos of https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=33659214:48
ubottuKDE bug 336592 in Panel "The warning _xgeWireToEvent: Unknown extension 148, this should never happen. is flooding the .xsession logfile." [Normal,Resolved: upstream]14:48
shadeslayerRiddell: same here14:48
shadeslayerI just don't run plasma anymore xD14:49
sgclarknot here, but it has been a few since I have upgraded14:50
sgclarkand it sounds like I want to continue with my current build lol14:51
shadeslayerit's a XCB issue14:52
shadeslayerso pretty sure it has nothing to do with plasma14:52
soeekubuntu logo requires black text and blue/white logo or all can be for example white ?14:52
_Groo_hi/2 all15:03
_Groo_konsole5 is broken again (consequently breaking yakuake)... konsole5_14.11.97+git20141203.1243+14.10-0ubuntu015:03
_Groo_the redirections in konsole5 are conflicting with konsole15:04
_Groo_just an example15:04
_Groo_dpkg: warning: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/applications/org.kde.konsole.desktop', which is also in package konsole 4:14.11.97+git20141202.1208+14.10-0ubuntu015:04
_Groo_nm plasma is broken too, missing a component15:05
_Groo_btw, nm plasma was fixed today, its just konsole that is broken still15:07
Riddellwoo, today's live cd running good, installing now, wish me luck15:13
Riddellshadeslayer: hmm this feels like something we should SRU then15:13
Riddell_Groo_: remove konsole then, I'll look at that in a bit15:14
_Groo_Riddell: konsole is a hard dependency of yakuake15:15
Riddellah then yakuake probably needs that changes to depend on the konsole-kpart one15:15
* Riddell notes15:15
_Groo_Riddell: yes it does, the original redirections were made because when konsole was split into kpart, yakuake stopped working15:16
_Groo_that is the case now, 15:16
_Groo_konsole itself works15:16
_Groo_but yakuake gives that sad sad face without the terminal, just a blank window :(15:17
Riddellsitter: how's qca getting on?15:17
sitterRiddell: pending reviewery15:19
sitterRiddell: also about the kpart, I think it'd be best to look at all rdeps of konsole and check whether they need the kpart15:21
sitteroff the top of my head kdevplatform/kdevelop, yakuake, dolphin, kile (not sure), kursader, konqueror (not sure)15:22
Riddellsitter: reviewery by whom?15:23
sitterRiddell: upstream15:23
Riddellah, we may be waiting some time15:23
sitternah, he commented15:23
Riddellright, lack of comments is not usually the problem with that upstream, constructive ones is15:23
Riddellvivid installed!15:24
sitterI am getting opposition to some parts of the changes already, they are not strictly needed for our purposes though so I have some arguments I can loose ^^15:24
sitterRiddell: I'll need to do a fork anyway unless his refusal to soname-change qt5 , I would however prefer the fork to only have a delta of one line ideally15:25
sitterhence the upstreamery15:25
RiddellI don't think it needs a fork.  a branch is sufficient :)15:26
sitterit was argued that a branch could be deleted by ivan, at any rate there isn't any difference between a branch and a separate repo15:29
Riddellman pages aren't installed :(15:37
Riddellnothing is settings MAN_INSTALL_DIR15:37
Riddellah ecm does15:41
Riddellbut only if you use ecm15:41
_Groo_Riddell: i can confirm taht krusader is also broken15:42
_Groo_Riddell: and yes, it used konsole kpart15:42
Riddellwhat is krusader anyway?15:42
Riddellthe file manager thing?15:42
_Groo_Riddell: just installed and tested15:42
_Groo_Riddell: yeah, an awesome full graphical mc clone15:42
_Groo_Riddell: kde style :D15:42
Riddellsitter: latest conversion to KF5 is the ever important... kde-dev-scripts!15:49
RiddellE: oxygen-icon-theme: description-is-pkg-name Oxygen icon theme16:52
Riddellhmm, is that a problem?16:52
* Riddell ignores16:53
* mitya57 would just prepend "The "16:53
Riddellthen you get a description-starts-with-article warning :)16:53
sgclarkIcon theme for Oxygen?16:54
mitya57 /o\16:55
Riddellmeh, end of day and still lots to do on kde applications17:19
Sick_RimmitRiddell: I'm going to check my diary on FOSDEM, I won't look to talk there, but I would very much like to come and help out with KDE and Kubuntu etc...17:22
RiddellSick_Rimmit: great, sign up to the stall17:22
Sick_RimmitRiddell: I think those dates are fine, just need final check with Alison17:22
RiddellSick_Rimmit: and if you can bring hardware to demo, put what you are bringing on the wiki page17:22
RiddellSick_Rimmit: would you come by car or public transport?17:25
* Riddell out17:26
Sick_RimmitRiddell: Oh public transport, Train I think17:26
=== rdieter is now known as rdieter_work

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