didrocksgood morning06:17
desrtdidrocks: good morning!06:40
seb128good morning desktopers06:43
didrockswaow desrt! still working? :)06:45
didrockssalut seb12806:45
seb128lut didrocks06:46
desrtdidrocks: gvariant hacking for fun and profit06:51
seb128hey Sweet5hark07:09
pittiGood morning07:37
didrockshey pitti!07:43
* pitti ^5s didrocks, I just G+ed about you :)07:43
didrockspitti: it fixes the kde thingy as well :)07:43
* didrocks ^5s back :)07:43
pittididrocks: oh, does it? I didn't see his response yet, just your "it should fix"07:43
pitti(it's very likely, though)07:43
didrockspitti: he answered since07:45
didrockspitti: my best bet was that /etc wasn't mounted yet07:45
pittididrocks: ah, I guess the CC: is slower then07:45
pittididrocks: ah, got it now; do you want to do the duplication/merging dance, or shall I?07:46
didrockspitti: you are a better bts than I am :)07:48
didrocksSweet5hark: funny, I know 2 of the frenchies from https://plus.google.com/101094190333184858950/posts/TtqsYd4wBC1 (they do live in Paris, didn't know they moved to Toulouse for the hackfest) :)07:48
pittididrocks: done07:49
didrockspitti: thanks :)07:50
Sweet5harkdidrocks: the liberte0 guys?07:50
didrocksSweet5hark: yep, my wife is sometimes contracting with them as well (doing design)07:51
didrockswell s/design/visual assets/07:51
Sweet5harkdidrocks: yeah, they were interested in a11y for LibreOffice. Interesting discussion there ...07:53
seb128hey pitti, wie gehts?07:55
pittiseb128: gut, danke! ein bisschen muede, ich bin zu spaet ins Bett gegangen07:57
darkxsthey seb12808:03
darkxsticon scaling needs to be fixed in the apps08:03
seb128hey, I had a feeling that was coming08:04
seb128doesn't seem an acceptable solution though08:04
seb128"let's change gtk in an incompatible way and declare that all the apps need fixing"08:04
darkxstseb128, gtk no longer scales icons if they are outside limits set in icon theme08:04
darkxstmostly it should be as simple as setting GTK_ICON_LOOKUP_FORCE_SIZE flag when getting the icon info08:06
pittioh, is that a blocker for updateing gtk to 3.14?08:06
pittiI noticed that http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html is full of auto-imported GNOME stuff which waits for gtk 3.1408:06
darkxstnautilus is a little more complicated though since its using deprecated GtkActions to generate context menu08:06
darkxstbut I will file a bug upstream for that08:07
seb128larsu was looking at those issues yesterday and discussed them on #gtk+08:08
ari-tczewpitti: not only auto-imported, of merged as well08:08
seb128pitti, yes, it's one of the blockers08:08
seb128pitti, see http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v08:09
seb128darkxst, that still seems a behaviour change from gtk and buggy and wrong08:09
darkxstseb128, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=73846708:11
ubot5Gnome bug 738467 in general "Some icons are enormously large" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]08:11
seb128darkxst, that's not a fix though...08:12
seb128I wonder if we could revert the behaviour change in gtk08:13
darkxstseb128, how many things are broken?08:13
seb128dunno, we would need to run every single gtk rdepends in the archive and look at every icon in their ui to be able to tell08:14
darkxstmost of the GNOME things are fixed it seems except nautilus08:14
seb128on a default unity desktop, at least several indicators and nautilus08:14
seb128oh, the unity dash is having issues as well08:15
seb128but as usual, GNOME apps are the most likely to be fine08:15
seb128but they are like 1% of the gtk users08:15
seb128so they give a false summary08:15
seb128gtk users->apps using gtk08:15
seb128there are probably a lot more buggy code in !GNOME, since those don't benefit of GTK hackers fixing them as they do incompatible changes08:16
darkxstseb128, yes, probably08:17
darkxstI don't suppose there is any real harm in reverting that patch, though I haven't looked for it so far08:18
darkxstgtg be back in half an hour or so08:18
didrockspitti: on empty machine-id, I think I can create some shell script and playing with setup-machine-id/commit08:25
didrockswith a bunch of bind mounts08:25
seb128hey mlankhorst08:39
mlankhorsthey :)08:39
didrocksmorning mlankhorst08:40
mlankhorstdidrocks: do you know how compiz determines screen size? I'm trying to handle compiz inside Xmir inside u8, and I'm getting a resize event from u8 after creating a surface, need to pass that on to compiz somehow..08:42
didrocksmlankhorst: last time I checked, it was using some xrandr-like functions, but that may have changed08:42
didrocksmlankhorst: not sure there is an API to force that (apart from developping a compiz plugin of course :p)08:43
larsudarkxst: it can't be fixed in the apps in many cases (for example menus)08:52
pittididrocks: or in nspawn perhaps08:52
pittididrocks: although the current nspawn test is rather simple, it just sets up a tiny busybox file system08:53
didrockspitti: so, it means that I would run a debootstrap as part of the autopkgtests? Won't we have $random failures?08:54
didrocks(happens that debootstrap fails)08:54
pittididrocks: nah, I think that's too much effort08:54
mlankhorstdidrocks: yeah I will probably just create a 'windowed' xrandr mode which changes names every time a resize event happens08:55
pittididrocks: we do debootstrap in the sbuild and lxc autopkgtests, but they always take a while08:55
didrockspitti: I would nspawn on what then? it needs a chroot, right?08:55
pittididrocks: so I suppose setting up some bind mounts and running the unit right in the actual testbed will be better (note that you can reboot)08:55
didrocksmlankhorst: yeah, that shuld work :)08:55
didrockspitti: ah, so no nspawn then08:56
pittididrocks: i. e. you could just remove /etc/machine-id, reboot, and see if it comes back properly08:56
pittididrocks: (that one should have a "Restrictions: breaks-testbed" :) )08:57
didrockspitti: TBH, I like your nspawn idea, not sure how we can just download a ready chroot. That way, we can have a lot of integration tests08:57
pittididrocks: anyway, only if you are interested in this08:57
pittididrocks: you could download ubuntu core perhaps, or the daily LXC builds08:57
didrockspitti: maybe it's something worth digging for future tests, wdyt? (would be then easy to create broken state, ensure they are still working with newer versions…)08:58
pittididrocks: i. e. http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-core/daily/current/; they don't have systemd, so they need an apt-get install systemd-sysv call; I haven't tried that08:58
pittididrocks: for now the tests work right on the testbed itself08:59
pitti(except for nspawn, of course)08:59
didrocksyeah, but we never tried to break the testbed, did we?08:59
didrockspitti: in case it's not coming back?08:59
didrockshey willcooke08:59
pittididrocks: then the timeout will hit and the test will fail08:59
didrockspitti: and a new vanilla testbed will then run other tests?09:00
pittididrocks: qemu's reboot hook has a timeout of 5 minutes09:00
didrockspitti: ok, so each tests are running on its own testbed, tests are isolated? (I guess, by script)09:01
pittididrocks: anyway, this is low-prio; I think I want a test for the DM generators much more badly09:01
pittididrocks: yes, adt-run takes care of that09:01
didrocksok, so yeah, little need for nspawn09:02
didrockspitti: I need to find an example, but yeah, will do that09:02
pittididrocks: do you have an idea how the generators can be tested efficiently?09:02
pittididrocks: i. e. is there something faster than rebooting the VM each time for each test?09:03
pitti(although it's not *that* bad -- it takes maybe 10 seconds)09:03
larsuseb128: this is one of those times where I think we should deviate from the xdg spec09:03
didrockspitti: I guess there is a bug in "systemctl status" that I observed (status not matching the reality). I needs fixing, but clearly that means if we only use status, we are unsure about the reboot statuts09:03
larsuseb128: it's just really bad and never what you want09:03
didrockspitti: TBH, I would prefer the end-to-end user experience, meaning: choosing in debconf/postinst09:04
pittididrocks: sure, that sounds good as well09:04
didrocksand then, check which dm has been restarted09:04
didrocksit's slower, but we know we test what users will have09:04
pittiyeah, right09:04
didrockspitti: apart from prefiling debconf to choose which dm to choose, is there any other tests to manipulate postinst prompts? (I want to follow the general best practices)09:05
pittididrocks: I'm not aware of an existing autopkgtest which does that09:05
didrockssomething to pioneer then :)09:06
seb128larsu, yeah,09:07
seb128larsu, how did the discussion on #gtk+ go? was there anything more (I did read on the afternoon)09:07
larsuseb128: nah. Alex says the spec is the soec09:08
larsuI'll ask mclasen again today, he made the change09:09
seb128I'm pondering just distro reverting otherwise09:09
seb128at least to give some times for apps to be fixed09:09
seb128same as the wrapping one09:09
seb128GTK does things in a stupid way by not giving some transition time09:09
seb128it's "oh, btw, that stopped working, you better fix your code because your app is  buggy"09:09
larsuwell, we have transition time now that we're one cycle behind09:10
larsubut yeah..09:10
larsuI don't even know why he made the change...09:10
larsuthe real problem is that he didn't fix the occurences in gtk istelf (like menus)09:11
seb128is that what bites us on indicators?09:11
darkxstlarsu, hmm right, I Guess menu icons are deprecated these days also09:12
darkxstand such code paths will be problematic at best09:13
larsudarkxst: no, they're not09:14
larsuwhat do you mean by "problematic"?09:15
larsuseb128: yes, you only supply an icon name in gmenu, and gtkmodelmenuitem puts the icon there09:15
larsuseb128: there's no way to pass "force-size" there. And in fact, there's not even for gtkmodelmenuitem, becasue gtkimage doesn't support the flag09:15
larsu(this is Alex' proposed way of fixing this...)09:16
darkxstlarsu, maybe I am confusing the menus show icon setting09:17
darkxstlarsu, problematic, to fix apps that are calling into gtk (like nautilus with gtkaction's)09:17
darkxstgio has no knowledge of icon sizing09:18
larsudarkxst: of course it doesn't, it doesn't load any icons...09:20
larsudarkxst: right, that's what I mean. If it's changed it in gtk, *at least* also change the usage in gtk itself09:21
darkxstgio basically passes through a filename for the icon then nautilus stuffs that into a gtkaction, but I doubt anyone is going to fix deprecated code09:22
larsuwhat exactly is the problem in nautilus?09:24
larsudidn't someone port it to GAction already?09:25
larsuif nautilus has problems, someone will fix the code09:25
darkxstlarsu, open with menu get huge icons for gvim atleast09:26
larsuhaha, this is awesome :)09:27
larsutakes the whole screen...09:27
darkxstyeh its pretty big!09:33
=== shiznix_ is now known as shiznix
Saviqhey guys, question... when I've an external screen connected, my laptop won't suspend when I close the lid, but disconnect the internal screen instead (like the internal screen actually goes away)10:32
Saviqany idea if this is caused by hw or something?10:33
seb128Saviq, no idea, you could try to stop unity-settings-daemon and see if it does it too, but I guess in that case it's going to suspend on lid close...10:35
Saviqseb128, yeah so it doesn't seem to be hw, the screen just gets disabled in the settings10:36
seb128that would be weird10:36
seb128I guess you could stop unity-settings-daemon and put a suspend inhibitor another way10:37
seb128and close the lid10:37
seb128and see what happens10:37
Saviqseb128, nothing10:38
Saviqat least now I know what to file the bug with10:38
seb128maybe try to run it with --debug and provide the log of what happens when you close the lid10:39
seb128that doesn't make much sense to me of why it would remove the screen and how10:39
Saviqseb128, yeah, I was almost sure it was a suspend issue10:39
Saviqseb128, but then I disconnected the screen and picked up the laptop and it suspended fine10:40
Saviqand then I noticed that the external screen actually gets all of my windows10:40
seb128is the screen coming back when you reopen the lid?10:40
seb128where is the bug then?10:40
seb128if you close the lid that screen is virtually missing10:40
seb128so removing it seems right10:40
willcookeWindows has(had) an option where if you closed the lid and the machine was connected to power and an external screen then the internal screen would disappear and you'd be left with a single desktop on the external screen10:40
willcookeI wonder if this might be a BIOS thing for that?10:40
willcookeSaviq, you've got a Dell?10:41
Saviqwillcooke, yes10:41
willcookeSaviq, dual graphics cards?10:43
Saviqwillcooke, no10:43
Saviqbug #1398771 then10:52
ubot5bug 1398771 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "External screen turned off instead of suspending on lid close" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/139877110:52
Saviqseb128, willcooke, ah, so maybe what happens is that the built-in screen is turned off by hw, and the lid switch inhibitor kicks in10:57
Saviqlike if I only have the external screen on, then maybe it makes sense to not react to lid close10:57
willcookeI mean, it kinda makes sense - but feels like there should be a choice somewhere11:00
willcookethere certainly is/was with Windows11:00
Saviqwillcooke, well, there is a "when lid is closed:" setting in the power panel11:00
Saviqquestion is whether that's the desired behavior11:00
willcookeand it didnt do this in 14.10 I assume11:01
Saviqnot sure, really11:03
willcookenext strange question then: does having external power connected change anything?11:04
* willcooke installs U7 on to his desktop next machine 11:08
popeyDoes anyone have a good way to debug 993837 - got a friend with it now.11:33
popeybug 99383711:33
ubot5bug 993837 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Can't open Update Manager window after a while" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/99383711:33
popey(update manager is running, icon is there but you can't alt-tab to it to bring it to the front)11:33
willcookeSaviq, seb128 - My 15.04 desktop-next machine with ubuntu-desktop installed doesnt suspend at all when I close the lid.  When an external screen is attached the laptop screen gets disconnected11:53
willcookehaving power connected doesnt seem to have any effect11:54
Saviqwillcooke, do you have the "on lid closed: suspend" setting enabled in settings?11:54
willcookeSaviq, yeah11:54
Saviqwillcooke, and you mean it doesn't suspend even without the external screen connected?11:54
Saviqwillcooke, might be related, but mine generally suspends without an external screen11:55
* Saviq confirms11:55
Saviqhad to restart the session on resume (connected the external screen too early, probably)11:57
Saviqbut yeah, it suspended fine11:57
willcookehrm - and now it works.11:59
willcookeI was running u-s-d --debug that time, and it did suspect11:59
willcookebut with the external screen connected it doesnt12:00
popeymine locks on lid close12:01
popeydespite me having it set to "do nothing"12:01
willcookeI see "removing lid switch inhibitor" in the logs fwiw12:03
willcookelogs:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/935425712:05
willcookethat is *with* external screen connected12:05
willcookedisconnect screen, shut lid -->  now nothing is responding to a click12:07
willcookeor alt-tab etc12:07
willcookeswitch away to vty1 and back12:07
willcookeand I get a 15.04 wallpaper but no option to unlock12:07
seb128willcooke, can you summarize the issue?12:25
seb128what config/option/action/result?12:25
willcookeseb128, sure:12:26
willcookeOn my Desktop Next machine, I installed "ubuntu-desktop" so I could log in to a U7 session12:26
willcooke(just checking what I'm typing is correct)12:27
willcookeBoot up -> Log in to U7 -> System Settings -> Confirm "close lid" == "suspend"12:28
willcookeClose lid -> Nothing12:29
willcookewhere nothing means doesnt suspend12:30
seb128is that behaviour on battery or power?12:30
willcookeopen term -> stop u-s-d -> start again with --debug12:31
willcookethen close lid and it suspends12:31
willcookeso now suspend is working again, I connect external screen12:32
willcookescreen gets detected by u-s-d12:32
willcookeclose lid -> display moves to external display, no suspend12:33
willcookeopen lid -> moves back to laptop display12:33
willcookedisconnect external screen12:33
willcookedoesnt seem to effect usd12:33
willcookeclose lid -> nothing12:33
willcookequite a long summary, sorry12:34
willcookeand now if I switch to vty1 and back to 712:35
willcookeits like its locked, but there is no unlock option12:35
seb128is that on vivid?12:38
seb128does the password entry come if you move the mouse on your current12:38
seb128like it might be on the laptop or a ghost screen12:38
seb128try going far left or right12:38
seb128or up/down12:38
willcookethe mouse wont move off the screen12:39
willcookelike it knows there is only one screen12:39
seb128so it's on the screen12:39
seb128k, is that vivid?12:39
seb128^ Trevinho conveniently just timeouted :p12:40
seb128but what you describe seems like we still have an unity7 bug where the unlock prompt is not displayed in some cases12:40
seb128willcooke, bug #1311316 was supposed to be fix12:40
ubot5bug 1311316 in Unity 7.2 "After locking screen there is no input field to type password for unlock" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/131131612:40
seb128so maybe it's not fully12:41
seb128andyrock, bregma, ^12:41
willcookeok, so that's one bug, and the suspend thing is likely a different one?12:42
seb128oh, Trevinho_ is back ;-)12:43
seb128willcooke, would be interesting to have a debug log from u-s-d when it doesn't suspend on lid close and is supposed to12:43
willcookeseb128, this is interesting... it reliably works on the first lid close once I restart usd12:47
willcookethen second one breaks12:47
willcookerestart usd, works again once12:47
seb128does it break as well if you don't use external screens?12:47
willcookeyes, this is just internal screen12:48
willcookeI wonder if external screen is a red herring12:48
willcookeSaviq, ^12:48
seb128let me try on my inspiron 1112:48
seb128I upgraded it yesterday to do some unity8 testing, I've unity7 on it as well12:48
willcookeshould be the same as mine then12:48
willcookesame hardware too :D12:48
willcookedamn it - its working now12:49
willcookeI think it's related to the time between opens and closes12:50
Saviqwillcooke, for me it's rather reliable, ext screen → no suspend, no ext screen → suspend12:50
Saviqwillcooke, also, your pet peeve, for a while now I've been unable to play any videos with gstreamer on my  laptop, had to uninstall gstreamer-vaapi, otherwise was getting stream errors12:51
willcookeI think we've got a cluster of related issues then12:51
willcookeSaviq, @ vaapi - yeah, I think we know about that one12:52
seb128right, that's mentioned on bug #1075774 and we have some other bugs about similar issues12:54
ubot5bug 1075774 in gstreamer-vaapi (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gstreamer-vaapi" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/107577412:54
willcookeseb128,  @ suspend -> seems to be broken right after boot.  Log in, close lid, nada12:55
seb128willcooke, wfm on my inspiron 11 with current vivid12:55
willcookeok, I'll reinstall and see what gives.  Might just be me12:56
seb128reinstall is not going to make a difference12:56
willcookeLook!  Over there!  A wild goose12:57
seb128can you share your ~/.cache/upstart/unity-settings-daemon.log12:57
seb128after getting the issue12:57
seb128it might have useful info12:57
seb128you can also edit /usr/share/upstart/sessions/unity-settings-daemon.conf12:57
seb128to add --debug to the Exec12:57
seb128to try to get a debug log12:58
willcookeseb128, upstart log:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/935454812:58
willcookethat's ~/.cache/upstart/usd.log13:00
willcookeseb128, and this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9354555/13:02
willcookeseb128, is boot up -> log in -> close lid -> wait -> open lid13:02
willcooke(with --debug on the exec line)13:02
willcookeno external screen, battery power13:02
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch
seb128did it suspend?13:02
seb128seems like a systemd/logind issue to me13:03
seb128(unity-settings-daemon:2232): power-plugin-DEBUG: no lid-switch inhibitor13:03
seb128logind is suposed to suspend on lid close if there is no inhibitor13:03
willcookeI just closed the lid again, and it did suspend13:03
seb128didrocks, pitti, ^ can you help debugging that? is logind/systemd having any log of those events?13:03
willcookeseb128, this is from where it just worked:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/9354572/13:04
seb128willcooke, could be useful to get the output from "gdbus call --system -d org.freedesktop.login1 -o /org/freedesktop/login1 -m org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.ListInhibitors" when it fails to suspend13:04
didrocksseb128: I don't know yet, but I can look :)13:05
seb128willcooke, how do you see that it fails to suspend?13:06
seb128how much do you wait?13:06
willcookeseb128, ssh'd in, some seconds, maybe 513:06
willcooketrying again from a fresh boot...13:06
seb128I just had a case where it tooks like 15 seconds to suspend13:06
seb128make sure to wait a bit13:06
desrtoh man13:06
desrti didn't know that willcooke was a topposter13:06
seb128yeah, he is13:07
willcookedesrt, it's the future, embrace it13:07
didrocksdesrt: I guess it's part of the manager's pack13:07
willcookesomething something something dark side13:07
willcookeyou get a free top posting kit with every spreadsheet or slide deck you create13:07
desrtLevel up!  +1 to top-posting.13:08
didrocksachievement unlocked13:08
willcookeseb128, aaaaaaand - I've massively wasted your time13:08
didrocksdesrt: I'm sure they get a bonus if they succeed in us top-posting :)13:08
willcookeseb128, it was taking a long time to suspend13:09
desrtdidrocks: they just use it to decide who gets promoted to manager next :)13:09
Trevinho_seb128: getting disconnected frequently -_-13:09
=== Trevinho_ is now known as Trevinho
seb128willcooke, hahah, I can confirm that one ;-)13:09
seb128Trevinho, hey13:09
willcookeok, so generally not suspending - not a bug13:10
Trevinhoseb128: hi13:10
desrtwillcooke: on the order of 30 seconds, perhaps?13:10
willcookedesrt, yeah13:10
willcookeI can time it....13:10
desrtit's 30 seconds13:10
seb128Trevinho, willcooke is still having cases of "unity7 doesn't have an password prompt widget on the unlock screen" in current vivid13:10
desrtthat's what gnome does as a timeout for any suspend that's not directly related to an immediate lid-close13:10
Trevinhoseb128: mh, damnit... -_-13:10
desrtgot changed to (iirc) 8 seconds in a recent release13:11
Trevinhowillcooke: do you have anything intresting from auth.log?13:11
willcookeTrevinho, let me find a way to recreate it and I'll take a look13:11
didrocksdesrt: isn't that ('sleep', 'didrocks', 'GNOME needs to lock the screen', 'delay', 1000, 1352) ? (I see 1s then)13:12
Trevinhowillcooke: also, single monitor?13:12
willcookedesrt, seb128 - took exactly 1m to suspend13:14
willcookeTrevinho,I'll have to check, I've had a lot of permutations of screens in the last hour.13:15
didrockswillcooke: the gdbus call output seb128 pasted would be of help13:15
didrocksgdbus call --system -d org.freedesktop.login1 -o /org/freedesktop/login1 -m org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.ListInhibitors13:15
desrtwillcooke: weird...13:16
willcooke([('handle-power-key:handle-suspend-key:handle-hibernate-key', 'will', 'GNOME handling keypresses', 'block', uint32 1000, uint32 2227), ('sleep', 'root', 'inhibited', 'delay', 0, 694), ('sleep', 'Unity Lockscreen', 'Unity wants to lock screen before suspending.', 'delay', 1000, 2439), ('shutdown:sleep', 'Telepathy', 'Disconnecting IM accounts before suspend/shutdown...', 'delay', 1000, 2742), ('sleep', 'will', 'GNOME needs to lock the sc13:16
willcookereen', 'delay', 1000, 2227)],)13:16
willcookesecond lid close is more or less immediate13:17
willcooke~ 1 sec13:17
didrocksno weird inhibitors at least13:17
willcookeNow, with the second screen attached13:17
willcookeand the lid closed.13:17
willcookeNo suspend13:17
willcooke([('handle-power-key:handle-suspend-key:handle-hibernate-key', 'will', 'GNOME handling keypresses', 'block', uint32 1000, uint32 2227), ('sleep', 'root', 'inhibited', 'delay', 0, 694), ('sleep', 'Unity Lockscreen', 'Unity wants to lock screen before suspending.', 'delay', 1000, 2439), ('shutdown:sleep', 'Telepathy', 'Disconnecting IM accounts before suspend/shutdown...', 'delay', 1000, 2742), ('sleep', 'will', 'GNOME needs to lock the sc13:17
willcookereen', 'delay', 1000, 2227), ('handle-lid-switch', 'will', 'Multiple displays attached', 'block', 1000, 2227)],)13:17
seb128yeah, I can confirm that one13:18
seb128desrt, didrocks, pitti, does systemd suspend on lid close only if there is no external monitor?13:18
seb128and is that new behaviour?13:18
desrtseb128: yes13:18
desrtseb128: no13:18
seb128are you sure it's not new?13:18
desrtpretty sure13:18
seb128for some value of "new"13:18
seb128willcooke, anyway that's why it doesn't suspend13:19
desrti've been docking my laptop for years and with the lid closed (but external monitor connected) it would stay on13:19
didrocksseb128: I guess this is the handle-lid-switch inhibitor13:19
seb128the systemd behaviour is not really compatible with our u-c-c options13:19
desrtand here's the thing... imagine i have a laptop plugged in to an external monitor and the lid is open13:19
didrocksseb128: the pid is the one of u-s-d13:19
seb128well, it means our option on "what to do when lid closed" is not respect in case of external screens on a laptop13:19
desrtif i do:  unplug monitor, close lid   -- the result is an immediate suspend13:19
desrtbut... if i do: close lid, unplug monitor -- the result is a 30 seconds wait13:20
desrtthe reason for that is to handle the case that i do: unplug monitor, open lid13:20
seb128I see13:20
willcookeI've just unplugged monitor and closed lid ->  no suspending (currently waiting with the lid closed)13:20
desrtie: would be stupid to suspend immediately for that case13:20
desrti talked to bastien about this though because 30 seconds is too long13:20
seb128still it means our option of "what to do on lid close" is at least wrongly worded13:20
desrtand he said he was changing it to 813:20
seb128it's "what to do on lid close when no external screen are connected"13:20
desrtdunno if that ever happened13:21
desrtor maybe it stopped being his responsibility when logind took over?13:21
willcookewith second screen disconnected, then lid closed, mine isnt suspending at all13:22
willcookeeven after 2 mins13:22
willcooke([('handle-power-key:handle-suspend-key:handle-hibernate-key', 'will', 'GNOME handling keypresses', 'block', uint32 1000, uint32 2227), ('handle-lid-switch', 'will', 'Multiple displays attached', 'block', 1000, 2227), ('sleep', 'root', 'inhibited', 'delay', 0, 694), ('shutdown:sleep', 'Telepathy', 'Disconnecting IM accounts before suspend/shutdown...', 'delay', 1000, 2742), ('sleep', 'will', 'GNOME needs to lock the screen', 'delay', 10013:22
willcooke0, 2227), ('sleep', 'Unity Lockscreen', 'Unity wants to lock screen before suspending.', 'delay', 1000, 2439)],)13:22
willcookeah ha13:23
willcookeand now I have the broken lock screen13:23
seb128Trevinho, ^13:23
seb128willcooke, the "not suspend at all" is a feature13:23
seb128but it makes our settings UI confusing13:24
seb128the option apply only in "stantard laptop mode"13:24
willcookeTrevinho, auth log:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/9354644/13:24
Trevinhoandyrock: ^^^^13:24
Trevinhohe worked on delaying the suspension on the unity side (it's the right way to do, but maybe something has a race)13:25
willcookeseb128, @ feature:  ack.  makes sense13:25
ubot5Launchpad bug 1398287 in Unity "Unity 14.04 Lock button sometimes takes 30~60s to enter lock screen" [Undecided,Incomplete]13:27
willcookethis has been sat like it for a few mins now13:28
seb128didrocks, desrt, https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/tree/plugins/power/gsd-power-constants.h#n4213:28
didrocksok, 8s now13:29
willcookere-plugged in 2nd monitor, move mouse over, and now I can escape the bounds of the external screen13:29
seb128didrocks, desrt, ours is still 30s, I'm going to update it13:30
didrocksseb128: yeah, 8s sounds nicer and enough if you want to unplug and reopen your lid13:31
=== alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g
didrocksmlankhorst: is it me or the barrier sensitivity isn't working anymore? (there is an option in g-c-c to control it)13:46
didrocksmlankhorst: not sure if it's on the xorg side (I don't mind the launcher appearance itself, but the resistance between monitors)13:46
didrocksTrevinho: you might know ^13:46
didrocksah, maybe unity7 side alone13:47
didrocksTrevinho: the launcher responsivness in g-c-c is only controlling launcher reveal edge responsivness13:48
didrocksthis value was impacted in the past the edge stop velocity as well13:48
mlankhorstSweet5hark1: hah, I'm running libreoffice inside XMir inside unity 8 inside unity-system-compositor! :P13:48
didrocksas from one mouse/trackpad to another, it can be hard to go cross barriers13:48
Trevinhodidrocks: that setting is only for the launcher yes, but the monitors barrier can be configured from the display pane13:49
didrocksTrevinho: hum, we didn't handle the transition then?13:50
didrocksTrevinho: where in the display pan btw?13:50
didrocksTrevinho: there is just sticky edges yes/no13:51
didrocksno way to have a little bit (so that hidden launcher can still be reveal), but adjusting it13:51
Trevinhodidrocks: that's the only control we have for monitors13:51
didrocksTrevinho: well, the other option in the past was controlling both values13:51
didrocksTrevinho: that means that I can't reveal the anymore on one of my monitor or I have to push really strongly everytime I cross the edge13:52
didrocksTrevinho: not nice for the users to not handle the transition as we used to :/13:52
Trevinhodidrocks: nothing there changed without design input, I think, by the way: there's also a thing: if you cross the monitor, there's a small delay during which the edge is not sticky anymore13:53
Trevinhodidrocks: to fix your position, if you crossed by mistake13:53
nessitahello everyone any advice where to ask about having unity (utopic) acting up regarding: window resizing (when move the mouse pointer to the corner of a window, the pointer changes to the "resizing" pointer as expected, but when trying to actually resize, nothing happens)13:54
TrevinhoI'm not in vivid btw, not sure if xorg changed something there13:54
didrocksTrevinho: would have been great to have that discussed, as it took some times in the past to ensure that the global slider was inpacting both. My issue is not to come back to the display, is that the trackpad doesn't have enough velocity by default to cross the monitors13:54
nessitaand chromium deciding to stop accepting input from the keyboard after changing windows focus13:55
didrocksTrevinho: I mean, for me, it's fine, I can change the value back in ccsm, not great for $average_user :/13:56
didrocks(I didn't have my monitors configured left/right for a long time, up/down generally, so didn't notice)13:56
TrevinhoI agree13:56
seb128didrocks, Trevinho, I don't think the u-c-c side of the code changed, is the ccsm value working?13:57
seb128could be that the config is correctly changed but that unity doesn't use the number anymore13:58
didrocksseb128: right, so the slider is bound to launcher reveal edge responsiveness13:58
didrocksthis value (in ccsm) was a combination of all other values regarding launcher reveal and edge barrier13:58
Trevinhodidrocks: but probably the ui should have been redisegned anyway, I mean, the bhavior panel controls some stuff which is, according to what the labels say, not related to monitors... And thus in general we should have handled this in different places imho13:59
didrocksit seems now to only impact the launcher reveal pressure13:59
Trevinhodidrocks: looking at the code, I think nothing changed btw... so the options still apply to both13:59
didrocksTrevinho: that's would be weird, I didn't touch that one for ages (maybe 3 cycles ago), but didn't use that setup again until today. I'm sure I couldn't live with this barrier and I notice no change in stop velocity depending on what I set14:00
mlankhorstseb128: I have no idea who to ask, how do I start a new user upstart session?14:00
Trevinhowe just added it vertical support only14:00
mlankhorstwithout lightdm..14:01
Trevinhodidrocks: couldn't this related to xorg changes?14:01
Trevinhodidrocks: keep in mind that we had a xfixes implementation that was sligthly different to what upstream then included14:01
didrocksTrevinho: can be, but I remember seeing this values changing all others in ccsm14:01
didrockswhich isn't the case anymore14:01
Trevinhodidrocks: and, indeed we updated our code to support that, but maybe something changed in the internals14:02
Trevinhoah, ok...14:02
didrocksyeah, maybe that breakage is from that transition14:02
didrocksif only all mouse/trackpads were sending similar velocity…14:02
Trevinhoseb128: anyway ucc has a bug: if you toggle the launcher autohide the related controls get enabled once and never disabled again14:04
Trevinhoseb128: I thought I fixed that some time ago, but maybe it wasn't the case14:04
seb128mlankhorst, what do you mean "start a new user upstart session"?14:05
seb128mlankhorst, try asking on #ubuntu-devel maybe14:05
mlankhorstseb128: I want to start the full ubuntu-desktop without lightdm14:06
seb128mlankhorst, just run gnome-session --session=ubuntu14:17
mlankhorstI'm having problems with getting the unity panels to appear14:18
mlankhorstcompiz itself seems to work, but the side panel doesn't show up14:27
Sweet5hark1seb128: umm, just wondering: anything from me missing still blocking the 4.3/utopic upload?14:28
tedglarsu, Do you know why we have a setting to turn off notifications on scroll wheel adjustments of volume?14:29
tedgSeems like an odd setting that no one would find.14:30
tedgPerhaps mpt as well ^14:30
larsutedg: nope, I was wondering this myself at some point14:30
larsutedg: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-sound/+bug/122533514:32
ubot5Launchpad bug 1225335 in The Sound Menu "[regression] Scrolling over the volume indicator should optionally show the notify-osd" [Medium,Fix released]14:32
larsutedg: I think I had accidentally removed support for it at some point and promptly got this bug report ;)14:32
larsucleary some users care about this (*cough* Trevinho *cough*)14:32
* tedg is going to wash that setting right out of his hair ♫14:33
* Trevinho cough14:33
larsuTrevinho: :)14:33
larsuTrevinho: oh, I guess this bug report was more about the notification and less about the setting?14:33
larsumaybe we could remove/deprecate it?14:33
Trevinholarsu: indeed14:33
larsutedg: you want to remove it? I kind of considered gsettings keys to be API14:34
tedgEh, I don't think so.14:34
Trevinholarsu: as it was a design change propsal, I put the "option" in, but all it matters is that it works :)14:34
tedgI guess I feel like we've "burned" a name for the future, but I don't think we need to support it in the schemas anymore.14:35
larsutedg: people's apps will crash if they access the key... (I assume noone does this, though)14:35
larsuTrevinho: right, it makes sense to show the notification. The setting, not so much14:36
tedgI assume everyone has the same cut-and-paste code to work around that API :-/14:36
tedgBut no one should use a gsettings key in another package.14:36
seb128Sweet5hark1, no, thanks for the reminder14:36
larsutedg: "should"14:38
larsuwe do this a lot for u-s-d and u-c-14:39
tedgYeah, and unfortunately code that depends on those should *really* check for the keys.14:39
larsuthere are also some general schemas like org.gnome.desktop14:39
tedgI wish the API was more sane to allow for handling those cases.14:39
larsutedg: no... the keys should just not change, just like the names of functions in libraries14:40
tedgRuntime breakage is always bad, and hard to debug. Never a solution, always a problem.14:40
larsuright, same for functions in libraries...14:41
tedgThere are no tools for things like versioning, which there are in libraries.14:41
larsumaybe we should start having ABI checks for gsettings as well14:41
larsuwe could append an api number, like systemd does for dbus names14:41
tedgHeh, still not sure why that's not just the systemd revision number.14:42
larsubecause systemd changes faster than those interfaces14:42
larsudesrt: do you know if anyone has ever looked into checking gsettings schemas for abi compat?14:43
larsudesrt: kind of like we do for libs in debian packages14:43
tedgSure, but if you need to be able to handle multiple, you might as well have lots. Either that or they don't need versioning at all.14:43
tedgYou're problem is that you need to be able to check for key usage.14:43
tedgWhich is harder. It's easy to see what you export, but not what you use.14:44
larsuah, I was thinking more along the lines of .symbols files14:44
larsuyou get a warning when you remove lines from it14:44
larsuin a package update14:45
desrtlarsu: i suspect that nobody has14:46
larsuI wonder if this has ever been a problem in practice14:47
larsuis there a way to deprecate keys?14:47
tedglarsu, Sure, but the other aspect of symbols files is that it makes the package that depends on that library depend on the right version. So it know "> x" by which symbols it uses and when they were introduced.14:54
larsutedg: ya, that's what I mean. We could have exactly the same14:54
tedgMostly, it'd be best if it failed to build if a key was missing that it needed. That way it could be an autopkgtest.14:55
larsudo we have that for symbols?14:57
tedgYeah, it doesn't build :-)14:58
willcookeseb128, desrt - I was just about to reply to that email where I had replied inline and not top posted, but desrt beat me to the reply. ;)15:00
willcookeso yeah, seb128 if you want to start logging desktop specifics that would be a great help15:00
seb128willcooke, is that specific to Mir or do you want bugs for everything that is needed to make a desktop?15:03
seb128willcooke, like an example, handling of lid close actions on battery/power with/without external screen, u-s-d does that for us on desktop, we have nothing yet for unity8, not even sure if we need new services or where that should be done15:04
willcookeseb128, hrm.  I think we should just stick to Mir for those bugs, and perhaps start another list with another tag for more general features15:05
mpttedg, I have never seen or heard of that scrollwheel setting. Where is it?15:05
tedgmpt, It's only available via developer tools.15:06
seb128willcooke, k, do we want to list unity8 features as well15:07
willcookeseb128, yes please, but with another tag15:07
seb128willcooke, like in multi-monitor what screens should have a launcher, which one is primary15:07
seb128willcooke, have a tag name in mind?15:08
willcookekgunn, ^  any preference for a tag to id u8 features *& desktop features?  We've got gtk-mir for desrt's ones.  How about u8-desktop?15:09
kgunnwillcooke: wfm15:11
kgunnSaviq: camako ^ fyi15:13
xnoxseb128: are you going to merge https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libio-socket-ssl-perl/1.965-1ubuntu1 anytime soon?15:35
xnoxseb128: it breaks stuff.... like it doesn't talk to ssl sites that disabled sslv3 negotiation -> libwww-perl broken -> uscan is broken -> xnox is not happy and wants to cry15:36
seb128xnox, no, feel free to grab it15:37
seb128I've no interest in that package, I just did the mistake to touch it once15:37
xnoxseb128: lolz =)15:38
xnoxseb128: ok. also doesn't seem to fix my problem =( tested in sid chroot now.15:39
seb128still feel free to do the merge ;-)15:39
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|tea
=== alan_g|tea is now known as alan_g
seb128ok, calling it a day a bit earlier today, going to see a spectacle, have a good evening desktopers17:02
* Sweet5hark1 mumbles something about being a topposter being a compliment in the same way are being called three star progammer is ...20:13
* willcooke -> EOD20:17
desrtSweet5hark1: ya... three star programming is best avoided20:18
desrtafter all, who would want to limit themselves to only three?20:19
Sweet5hark1desrt: after all in C++ with a std::vector<std::shared_ptr<somthing> > you essentially get the first two stars for free in iteration!20:20
ari-tczewrobert_ancell: hi, could you sponsor one merge on bug 1338801 please?23:58
ubot5bug 1338801 in gnome-screenshot (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.12" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/133880123:58

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