[00:05] <ali1234> popey: i uploaded a new apk. it should detect resolution properly now. same url.
[00:06] <popey> k
[00:06] <ali1234> i'm really impressed with SDL android, i've had zero problems with it
[00:07] <ali1234> it took me about a week to port to GLES, and about to day to port that to android
[00:09] <popey> better
[00:11] <popey> ali1234: https://imgur.com/eXIym41
[00:11] <ali1234> that's really weird
[00:11]  * popey grabs a nexus 7 2012
[00:12] <ali1234> it definitely works there, that's what i'm testing on
[00:14] <daftykins> it was the popester, in the lounge with the N5 :o
[00:14] <ali1234> popey: that's the hudl right? so it kinda works on x86...
[00:14] <popey> yews
[00:14] <hexxington> looks like a hudl 2
[00:15] <popey> yeah, fine on nexus 7 2012
[00:15] <popey> yes, hudl2
[00:16] <hexxington> tesco refused to say who the ODM was. top secret.
[00:16] <hexxington> play.google.com lists it as "pegatron hudl 2" in the devices list
[00:16] <hexxington> morons
[00:16] <popey> pegatron
[00:16] <popey> not secret at all
[00:17] <ali1234> pegatron sounds like a knock-off transformer
[00:17] <popey> pegatron have been an ODM for ARM OEMs for years
[00:17] <hexxington> pegatron are one of the big 10 ODMs
[00:18] <penguin42> Can the new Tesco x86 based one boot arbitrary OSs?
[00:18] <daftykins> oh my bad.
[00:18] <daftykins> guess that explains why it's so big XD
[00:18] <daftykins> looks exactly like my friends red Nexus 5 :>
[00:19] <popey> its way huge-er than nexus 5
[00:19] <popey> I really like the hudle
[00:19] <popey> -e
[00:19] <popey> it's my main go-to tablet
[00:19] <hexxington> thye most complete ODM data is for laptops in 2011. pegatron were #5
[00:19] <daftykins> one of our local wholesale supermarkets is apparently selling Tesco stock these days, i wonder if they can obtain the hudl2
[00:20] <popey> of course part of the reason it's my go-to tablet is because it's the most powerful tablet in the house
[00:20] <hexxington> compal, quanta, wistron, foxconn, pegatron, inventec, flextronics, ecs
[00:21] <hexxington> almost every laptop is made by one of those 8
[00:21] <hexxington> e.g. thinkpads are wistron, macbooks are quanta
[00:22] <ali1234> what about clevo?
[00:23] <hexxington> hm, good point
[00:23] <hexxington> how did i miss clevo? they do most of the "lol, let's put SLI in a laptop" gamer laptops
[00:24] <hexxington> did you see MSI's gaming laptop w/ cherry mx mechanical keyboard?
[00:25] <ali1234> no. it sounds silly
[00:25] <hexxington> you haven't seen how it looks :>
[00:25] <hexxington> http://uk.msi.com/news/1885.html
[00:25] <popey> wat
[00:25] <hexxington> and before you ask, cherry switches are *really* deep, so they can't do the usual and put the laptop parts underneath the keyboard.
[00:26] <hexxington> so the laptop parts are above the keyboard, and the circuit board for the keyboard goes down to the bottom of the case
[00:26] <ali1234> well...
[00:26] <ali1234> it doesn't look that bad
[00:26] <hexxington> the numpad is actually a trackpad with numbers drawn on
[00:26] <ali1234> i mean if you have a large display there's always going to be wasted space on the bottom part
[00:27] <ali1234> looks like an old amiga or atari st
[00:27] <ali1234> with  screen stuck to it
[00:28] <ali1234> i think i prefer it to something like this: http://technewsday.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/msi-gt80-gaming-laptop.jpg where you have to reach over the touch pad
[00:29] <ali1234> not that i would ever buy a gaming laptop...
[00:51] <diddledan> "as well as our usual selection of carefully developed MSI gaming technologies" <-- why does that sound to me like preinstalled poo-ware?
[00:52] <diddledan> I'd rather the keyboard and smarts arrangement were the other way about, though - the smarts against your belly and the keyboard under the screen
[00:53] <diddledan> that way I still have somewhere to rest my palms
[00:53] <ali1234> they make video cards...
[00:53] <diddledan> with it as it looks in the photo I'd have to perch the lappy on the very end of my knees to have enough room to get my hands in the right place
[00:54] <diddledan> i.e. it'll fall on the floor
[00:54] <diddledan> I actually quite like my chiclet keyboards
[01:51] <daftykins> http://i.imgur.com/3Iqphls.gif
[01:51] <daftykins> skating obama gif
[04:48] <mapps> hi all
[04:48] <mapps> night shift signing in;p
[05:03] <mapps> noone up for once?
[05:31] <daftykins> never fear
[05:31]  * daftykins is here
[05:36] <mapps> ah no the usual suspect (s) are here
[05:37] <mapps> is zmoylan-1i  up too?:P
[05:37] <daftykins> :D
[05:38] <mapps> maybe not
[05:38] <mapps> hm
[06:17] <mapps> sleep time for me now;
[06:17] <mapps> ;]
[09:56] <diddledan> oh the joys of working on a sudnay
[10:16] <popey> morning
[11:01] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[11:03] <diddledan> so. I got antsy waiting for libertos and starting compiling ubuntu for the raspberry pi myself :-p
[11:06] <diddledan> I have no idea whether I've done it right tho
[11:10] <popey> how did you do it?
[11:11] <diddledan> I've got reprepro and rebuildd+sbuild
[11:11] <diddledan> I'm unsure whether rebuildd was the right way to go vs wanna-build
[11:14] <hexxington> i'll tell what i wanna-build
[11:14] <hexxington> what i really really wanna-build
[11:14] <popey> diddledan: whats the progress so far?
[11:14] <hexxington> didn't someone indiegogo AlanBell to do it? or am i misremembering
[11:15] <diddledan> slow: http://orbital.bowlhat.net:9998/dist/trusty/arch/armhf
[11:15] <diddledan> there seems to be quite a few failures
[11:15] <diddledan> but not every package is failing
[11:16] <hexxington> no way to see the list or logs from there?
[11:16] <diddledan> yeah the web interface is a bit pants
[11:22] <popey> diddledan: is it building on a pi?
[11:22] <popey> just one?
[11:23] <diddledan> no, it's building in an schroot filtered through qemu-user
[11:24] <popey> ah
[11:25] <hexxington> diddledan, many failures are because qemu-user uses your x86 /proc/cpuinfo
[11:25]  * popey has only just twigged that hexxington is directhex
[11:26] <diddledan> hexxington, oh dear
[11:31] <diddledan> this "sorry, unimplemented" appears to be happening in a lot of the failures: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9410718/
[11:36] <popey> i have 14.04 on a banana pi here, wonder if that would be easier to build on
[11:37] <popey> need to set whatever flag to make it build armv6
[11:37] <popey> diddledan: did you follow some guide online?
[11:37] <diddledan> I've read lots of different guides but the linaro ones were the most useful
[11:40] <diddledan> I tweaked it a bit but this is roughly what I followed - specifically I created an armhf chroot instead of a cross-building one: https://wiki.linaro.org/Platform/DevPlatform/CrossBuildd
[11:40] <ali1234> diddledan: qemu-user will fail hard, i already tried it
[11:41] <ali1234> qemu-system will also fail, in different ways, plus it's not actually any faster than a raspi
[11:41] <ali1234> it was nearly a year ago, they might have fixed it
[12:40] <diddledan> ok, so it seems that rebuildd isn't able to work with more-than-one system?
[12:40] <diddledan> maybe I chose wrongly
[12:42] <ali1234> maybe you can use distcc with it?
[12:43] <ali1234> also, you can build many packages in parallel
[12:43] <ali1234> on different systems
[12:44] <diddledan> time for lunch - bbiab
[13:31] <diddledan> ali1234, does rebuildd allow other systems to connect to it's database (the database is a sqlite file)
[13:32] <diddledan> from something I found just before lunch it read as though rebuildd doesn't allow distributed sbuild
[14:16] <mapps> hi all
[14:17] <hexxington> as a parent with a potty-training toddler, i long for the sweet embrace of death
[14:20] <zmoylan-pi> maybe you are dead and are in a personal hell with a potty training toddler who never learns... :-P
[14:22] <shauno> yet it's funny when monkeys do it.
[14:24] <zmoylan-pi> maybe hexxington's christmas present is the toddler presenting a chamber pot with a big poo in it and hexxington seeing the end of the horror will be happy :-)
[15:22] <isleofmandan> Just about to visit a local Ubuntu user who kicked power cord out of his PC during updates... Says it won't work.  Assuming I can get it to boot into a terminal, do you reckon sudo apt-get update, sudo apt-get dist-upgrade is the way forward?
[15:23] <isleofmandan> and can someone remind me of fsck command line switches?
[15:23] <ali1234> sudo apt-get -f install
[15:23] <ali1234> all the required files will already be downloaded
[15:23] <ali1234> since it downloads everything before installing
[15:23] <isleofmandan> ah, cheers ali1234
[15:23] <ali1234> if you are really unlucky, apt db is corrupted
[15:23] <ali1234> not sure what you do then
[15:24] <isleofmandan> Fingers crossed ;)
[15:25] <ali1234> rerun a normal update afterwards
[15:26] <isleofmandan> OK. Will do. Thanks.
[15:55] <diddledan> bbiab - heading home
[16:16] <diddledan> and home
[16:17] <penguin42> you didn't miss anything
[16:18] <diddledan> I noticed
[18:04] <BadCompany> I have installed ubuntu on my pc but for some reason i cant get the option to boot to Windows 8.1 when i start up my computer. Instead it goes straight to Ubuntu. I can see my Windows drive under devices when i click on file
[18:15] <diddledan> BadCompany, try the same question in #ubuntu - this place is pretty quiet today and I don't know the answer
[18:16] <BadCompany> dont worry i think the boot repair fixed it
[18:17] <diddledan> \o/
[18:17] <diddledan> that boot repair utility is pretty clever
[18:50] <daftykins> i've heard of it fail more times ;)
[18:52] <penguin42> I saw something about win8.1 having shared some storage between the repair partition and hte main system partition, so deleting the repair partition for space might break stuff for people
[18:53] <diddledan> it's not so much shared as it is the repair partition gets booted first
[18:54] <daftykins> ^
[18:54] <shauno> so the repair partition boots the OS?
[18:54] <daftykins> same setup in non-EFI windows vista or 7, it has the little boot partition preceeding the C: one
[18:55] <daftykins> basically any windows 8 laptop comes with a horrible mess of partitions, my favourite move would be to nuke the lot and install from scratch ;) but of course newb users coming into #ubuntu aren't going to want/be capable of that
[18:55] <diddledan> it's a misnomer to call it a repair partition - it contains the WinPE environment and an image for repairs which can be booted
[18:56] <diddledan> it's an attempt at unifying the boot process to a single point of entry for both uefi and bios
[18:58] <daftykins> O_.
[18:58] <diddledan> the "bootloader" is actually a second step - there's a bootstrap before it now which gets called by the system and the bootstrap hands off to the "bootloader" which is a WinPE executable
[18:59] <diddledan> the bootloader has mouse and graphics support now by virtue of being a WinPE thing
[19:01] <shauno> whenever people try to explain the guts of windows to me, osx starts to sound more and more sensible
[19:02] <daftykins> shauno: come back when it can actually full-screen an application like you expect it to ;)
[19:03] <diddledan> hah!
[19:03] <shauno> it .. does?
[19:03] <daftykins> not in my experience
[19:03] <diddledan> actually full-screen in yosemite isn't too bad
[19:03] <daftykins> sometimes hitting the window control makes it just tall and skinny, i mean wth is that?
[19:04] <daftykins> just for clarity - i'm not thinking of that kinda diagonal arrow one that really does take up the entire screen and hide the rest of the OS
[19:04] <diddledan> I like that with manymonitors(TM) it does each screen separately rather than like it used to where you'd fullscreen on one monitor and the others are just deadspace
[19:05] <shauno> oh you mean like maximize?
[19:05] <daftykins> yep
[19:05] <diddledan> and the fullscreens can all be independently switched
[19:05] <ali1234> lol OS X maximize
[19:05] <daftykins> sorry that would've been a far better choice of word
[19:05] <daftykins> i haven't had my coffee yet :P
[19:05] <shauno> osx doesn't have maximize.  it has 'zoom'.  they have different names because they do different things :/
[19:05] <diddledan> not sure I've ever used zoom
[19:06] <daftykins> wat
[19:06] <diddledan> ^
[19:06] <ali1234> it's exactly like maximize except sometimes it only works vertically for absolutely not reason
[19:06] <diddledan> safari used to be one of those
[19:06] <shauno> yeah.  it tries to be clever about the size of the window in relation to the size of the content
[19:06] <shauno> and 'clever' rarely is
[19:07] <m0nkey_> ugh. I hate what apple did to yosemite.
[19:07] <m0nkey_> i don't want my apps to go full screen all the time.
[19:08] <diddledan> yeah, I don't like that you can't single-click a control to full-screen/maximise the app but allow other windows in front of it
[19:08] <diddledan> instead I'm often left dragging the corners of windows about
[19:08] <m0nkey_> I kept a copy of the Mavericks installer, tempted to put that one back.
[19:11] <daftykins> and hence why window management in OS X is the worst of all :D
[19:12] <m0nkey_> Trying to sell my MacBook Air. Posted it at work, local ads, nobody seems to be buying.
[19:13] <diddledan> I think I saw you pop it on facebook, too?
[19:13] <daftykins> they sell those things with far insufficient storage
[19:13] <m0nkey_> yup
[19:15] <m0nkey_> Odd, the site I advertised it says I've had a reply. Yet, I don't see one.
[19:17] <m0nkey_> I'd even swap it for an X1 Carbon
[19:18] <daftykins> crikey
[19:18] <daftykins> shame they ruined the function keys on the X1
[19:18] <diddledan> I can't place the X1
[19:18]  * diddledan googles
[19:19] <foobarry> has no removal battery either
[19:19] <m0nkey_> That is a disappointment. But the previous generation has a much better keyboard.
[19:19] <diddledan> that looks smart
[19:20] <diddledan> I wonder why lenovo persist with their nipple?
[19:20] <foobarry> have a dilemma. do endless housework that i have been doing all weekend while not parenting? or spend time  on myself
[19:20] <m0nkey_> I like the nipple. Better than a trackpad in some cases.
[19:20] <foobarry> because nipples are innocuous for those who dont like them and useful for those who insist on them
[19:21] <diddledan> foobarry, relax for the remainder of this evening. it's sunday night, and if you can't do nothing then when can you?!
[19:21] <foobarry> exactly :(
[19:21] <foobarry> have something i want to do..
[19:21] <foobarry> work in progress http://i.imgur.com/Xq8FiRk.jpg
[19:21] <foobarry> poor quality pic :S
[19:21] <diddledan> perdy
[19:23] <foobarry> ok which one of you was trying out his xmas present early? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30369701
[19:25] <diddledan> lol
[19:26] <m0nkey_> I hate this
[19:26] <m0nkey_> I fly model aircraft.
[19:27] <m0nkey_> However, I'm also a member of a club and have insurance.
[19:27] <diddledan> m0nkey_, unfortunately most aren't as thoughtful
[19:27] <m0nkey_> In order to be insured, certain conditions have to be met. One of which is DO NOT FLY NEAR A F**KING AIRPORT.
[19:28] <daftykins> m0nkey_: where does the bad part come in?
[19:28] <m0nkey_> I always encourage people to join a club if you're flying a plane, helicopter or drone.
[19:28] <m0nkey_> daftykins, the bad part comes in when an uninsured idiot crashes his plain into a face of a 6 year old
[19:28] <m0nkey_> killing him
[19:28] <daftykins> wat, has that happened?
[19:28] <m0nkey_> yes
[19:28] <foobarry> :(
[19:28] <daftykins> D:
[19:29] <ali1234> yes, with model aircraft from years ago
[19:29] <foobarry> i got a boomering in the forehead once
[19:29] <ali1234> the type that are basically 1/10th scale actual airplanes
[19:29] <m0nkey_> ali1234, the electric motors don't stop unlike IC.
[19:29] <foobarry> at full speed
[19:29] <foobarry> i've seen the RC jet ones that go at 400mph
[19:29] <penguin42> foobarry: It explains a lot :-)
[19:30] <m0nkey_> This is why this kind of thing upsets me.
[19:30] <m0nkey_> People have been killed by idiots.
[19:30] <m0nkey_> This is another perfect example of an idiot putting the lives of 180 in danger.
[19:31] <diddledan> I think regulations concerning UAVs need to be tightened
[19:31] <m0nkey_> http://www.bmfa.org/Multi-Rotors/tabid/1425/Default.aspx
[19:31] <m0nkey_> The CAA does have regulations.
[19:31] <m0nkey_> If you fly a model, you are subject to the air navigational order
[19:32] <m0nkey_> An old colleague of mine went to work for the CAA, he approached me for input on the new regulations.
[19:32] <ali1234> "limits of not flying within 50 metres of any person or 30 metres from any person during take off and landing"
[19:32] <diddledan> the problem is there's no requirement to prove that you're capable/aware of the regs
[19:33] <m0nkey_> diddledan, this is why you join a club
[19:33] <m0nkey_> You are made very aware of the regs, you are insured, you have a safe place to fly.
[19:33] <diddledan> yeah, that's definitely good
[19:34] <m0nkey_> Every time I see somebody flying one of these things in a built up area, I always approach them and ask if they're a member of a club.
[19:34] <diddledan> is there any provision concerning use of autonomous drones?
[19:34] <m0nkey_> 99% of the time, they are not.
[19:35] <m0nkey_> diddledan, the same regs apply
[19:35] <m0nkey_> But you must be able to take control at a moments notice.
[19:35] <diddledan> aah
[19:35] <m0nkey_> You can use GPS to navigate, but you must always be able to take manual control
[19:36] <ali1234> so what regs apply to models under 7kg?
[19:36] <ali1234> because it looks to me like only 137 and 138
[19:36] <m0nkey_> Regardless of weight, you're still subject to the ANO
[19:37] <ali1234> yes, which articles of it?
[19:37] <diddledan> this was an interesting use of drones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBTWl-DtKdM
[19:38] <m0nkey_> http://bmfa.org/DesktopModules/Bring2mind/DMX/Download.aspx?Command=Core_Download&EntryId=295&PortalId=0&TabId=221
[19:39] <m0nkey_> Typically, it's 137 and 138.
[19:39] <m0nkey_> Also 166
[19:39] <m0nkey_> And now 167
[19:41] <ali1234> 167 appears to only apply to drones with cameras
[19:41] <m0nkey_> I'm including it as people now tend to put cameras on everything.
[19:41] <m0nkey_> But typically, it's 137 and 138.
[19:42] <m0nkey_> Roughly translated to, "don't be an idiot"
[19:42] <daftykins> :D
[19:42] <daftykins> fine rules
[19:42] <ali1234> the bbc story really makes it sound like any £25 drone can bring down a jet aircraft
[19:42] <m0nkey_> If you're over 7kg, you must have a cut off should the aircraft lose it's signal
[19:42] <m0nkey_> ali1234, the point is.. IT CAN
[19:42] <penguin42> m0nkey_: If it can then that's a much bigger problem
[19:43] <ali1234> the typical cheap drone people are getting for £25 weighs 11g
[19:43] <m0nkey_> That low cost flying machine lands in a jet turbine can cause the turbine to set on fire
[19:43] <shauno> I'm not sure I want to test the lower limits of fob ingress
[19:43] <m0nkey_> Hopefully them idiots are not flying anywhere near an airport.
[19:43] <shauno> (I know RR do, they have some fun videos where they throw (dead) chickens into turbines.  but still)
[19:43] <ali1234> sounds like a job for mythbusters
[19:44] <m0nkey_> ali1234, mythbusters have already done chickens vs aeroplane
[19:44] <m0nkey_> That tiny drone, vs an aircraft going several mph, turns in to a projectile.
[19:44] <ali1234> birds bring down aircraft all the time
[19:44] <penguin42> m0nkey_: If #25 drones can bring down planes then someone is going to start have to worry about terrorism
[19:45] <ali1234> large birds, like geese, that weigh several kg
[19:45] <shauno> so what's the difference between a birdstrike, and a bird made out of abs/wire/batteries?
[19:45] <penguin42> ali1234: It's rare for single birds to do it isn't it?
[19:45] <ali1234> shauno: exactly, that's what we need mythbusters to test
[19:45] <ali1234> penguin42: yes
[19:45] <penguin42> ali1234: It's normally flocks that take out multiple engines
[19:45] <ali1234> i would think the lithium ion battery is the worst bit
[19:45] <ali1234> could potentially start a fire
[19:45] <penguin42> there's only a few g of it though
[19:45] <shauno> I think not being inside controlled airspace without direction is a safe default
[19:46] <ali1234> well aside from the battery, a typical cheap drone is basically like a sparrow getting sucked into a jet engine
[19:47] <m0nkey_> So, sorry to go all militant on this kind of thing. People have been killed due to negligence.
[19:47] <shauno> I'm more of the view that people shouldn't screw with airports so that they're not driven to create more rules
[19:48] <shauno> even if the really dainty ones can't bring down a plane, they can still make life more difficult for the rest of us
[19:48] <m0nkey_> shauno, bingo. Don't mess with airports.
[19:48] <ali1234> it's pretty clear from reading the bbc story that they are just looking for an excuse
[19:49] <m0nkey_> Or any air field.
[19:49] <ali1234> they'll find one no matter what happens
[19:49] <m0nkey_> ali1234, and these idiots are giving it to them. It spoils the fun for people who are serious about the hobby (like me).
[19:49] <ali1234> no, it doesn't
[19:50] <m0nkey_> yes, it does. there has already been talk about restricting the use of model aircraft already.
[19:50] <ali1234> exactly
[19:50] <ali1234> they'll find an excuse to do it
[19:50] <m0nkey_> setting limits on weights and sizes
[19:50] <MooDoo> evening all
[19:50] <ali1234> if it's not "idiots" it will be terrorists
[19:50] <m0nkey_> mostly due to idiots flying in places they have no business being.
[20:04]  * SuperEngineer looks at sky... nope, no flying idiots here [must be a Monty Python thing I suppose]
[20:05] <penguin42> SuperEngineer: Are you saying that they should ban unlicensed flight of anything weighing more than an unladen swallow?
[20:06] <SuperEngineer> no, I'm saying there are no flying idiots flying past my window - just flying sheep.
[20:07] <penguin42> oh, that's fine then
[20:07] <penguin42> they'd just bounce off any planes
[20:07] <SuperEngineer> ;)
[20:12] <daftykins> "mehehe"