[00:04] blueheaded I thought [00:05] i thought greenheaded http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic260187_md.jpg [00:08] :D [00:09] Also, recent update of Numix did fix the indicators in VM. [00:09] yay [00:11] knome: ouch [00:11] ochosi, what? :) [00:12] Unit193: that is the exact same patch i tried back in the day when you first came up with this? [00:12] Uhhh, yes to the no with a maybe on top. [00:17] Unit193: so you wanna ask xnox for a review too? [00:17] or the ubuntu installer team or someone? [00:19] Likely a good idea. [00:30] Installer team is default, so hit that up. [00:30] Do we want an ACK from zequence and mythbuntu? [00:31] "hi mythbuntu, do you like your black login background?" [00:31] :) [00:31] haha [00:31] Haha. :D [00:32] "Yes, leave it." [00:32] i'd say it's enough if we have to wait for xnox to look... [00:32] knome: any of these sticker shots good to use? https://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2 [00:32] black is the new black [00:32] yes, this https://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/16327683452/ [00:32] k [00:32] hahah [00:32] weeee, we're handing out cats to our testers! [00:32] that's my favorite too <3 [00:33] on a more serious note, i like either one that has the colors "right", eg. the ones with a white bg [00:33] * ochosi also wants to stick one to the back of his laptop [00:33] maybe the latter one is better in composition [00:33] -> https://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/16327817801/ [00:33] Sooo, going to box up a cat, and stick it in the mail for a couple weeks? 0_o [00:33] knome: ok, wfm [00:33] why put it in a box, just staple the stamp on the cat [00:33] knome: yeah, that one, but needs a bit of retouching maybe [00:33] * knome hides [00:34] ochosi, thanks for volunteering ;) [00:34] gah [00:34] pleia2, tbh, just a pile of stickers on a table would be good [00:34] it doesn't need to look organized [00:34] * ochosi will wait for that cat that Unit193 just put in the mail... [00:34] you can even slap them down in a way you don't have to have any of the table visible if you wish [00:34] knome: but I just organized them! :) [00:34] hehe [00:34] awwh :D [00:34] well i'm sorry... :( [00:35] pleia2: throw them on the floor! throw them across the whole room! [00:35] damn. photos of beer bottles [00:35] hehe [00:35] i want beer [00:35] me too [00:35] ok, let me try a few other ones [00:35] * pleia2 back to photo box [00:35] hehe [00:40] ok, refresh the flickr url, there are 4 more [00:40] ALL MESSY [00:40] https://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/16327683452/ still shows a cat [00:40] :| [00:40] <3 [00:40] me likey [00:41] i probably like the one with the blue xubuntu logo completely visible most [00:41] but i'm not very partial [00:41] let our XPL choose [00:42] * pleia2 goes to clean up stickers [00:42] lol [00:43] polish them with wax! [00:46] pleia2, i'm wondering if we should make the blog title "Win free Xubuntu stickers!" [00:46] knome: probabl :) [00:46] or "Win Xubuntu stickers!" [00:46] probably too [00:46] more exciting than the current one.. [00:46] yeah [00:48] there, all organized again [00:48] hehe [00:48] what if you tried one more messed up photo [00:48] >:) [00:48] (just kidding) [00:48] :D [00:49] woo I even managed to fold up the cube properly [00:50] nice [00:52] bluesabre: are you going to reply to andrew's email? btw, my argument for "stable" would be: "no more features!!" :] [00:52] happy to publish this once I know what photo to use [00:53] go with the one i chose ;) [00:53] ochosi: yeah, will at some point, unless you want to [00:53] https://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/16142252590/ this one? [00:53] yeah [00:53] since it's going to be smallish, nobody will notice the blue [00:53] *blur [00:53] if you open it in gimp, autocolor it or sth [00:53] if not, then fine :) [00:54] yeah, maybe a bit of whitebalance would do it good [00:54] I don't know what that means [00:54] but i'm currently on my laptop, so i wouldn't do much good i guess [00:54] pleia2, let me do that for you [00:54] knome: thanks :) [00:54] \o/ knome does the work! [00:54] \o/ [00:54] go knome ;) [00:54] ochosi, i've done a lot of the work lately :PP [00:55] * ochosi pets knome on the head [00:55] knome: I changed the title [00:55] pleia2: as a native speaker: is there a grave diff between "pat" and "pet" in this case? [00:56] pleia2, for future reference, in gimp: colors -> auto -> white balance [00:56] ochosi: not really [00:56] knome: ah :) [00:56] I guess petting is more like rubbing and patting is more up and down [00:56] haha [00:56] nasty ple [00:56] ! [00:56] lol [00:57] it was a trap [00:57] ochosi, wasn't it you who pet me? [00:57] i'll keep that in mind [00:57] * ochosi washs his mouth with soap [00:58] something's lagging [00:58] it's not my petting [00:58] oh, just a visaul lag on thunar's file progress win [00:58] pleia2, http://temp.knome.fi/xubuntu/16142252590_9e5fa0bd31_whitebalance.jpg [00:58] wow, neat [00:58] knome: http://xkcd.com/612/ [00:58] pleia2, i did what i just said above, then edit -> fade levels to 90% since it became *really* white [00:59] * pleia2 whitebalance all the things [00:59] you might want to check what looks the best manually when tweaking [00:59] :) [00:59] yes, adjusting photo color levels... what a waste of time [01:00] i mean a what a form of art! [01:00] shall I add this to post now? [01:00] efm [01:00] ehhh [01:00] wfm [01:00] maybe cut down the original resolution [01:00] okie [01:00] i don't remember what our max file size was :P [01:01] probably either 4 or 8 [01:01] in the future, the max size we will need will be 1400 in width [01:01] no photos are ever going to be shown in bigger size than that [01:03] http://xubuntu.org/?p=2921&preview=true [01:03] or somewhere else? [01:03] that works [01:03] hmm [01:03] well [01:03] maybe after how can i participate [01:03] the rest are boring stuff [01:03] but that's important [01:04] ok, draft saved with moved [01:04] ++ [01:05] alright, I will publish my tomorrow morning and social media it [01:05] thanks [01:05] * knome is still considering the title [01:05] "Win Xubuntu stickers by testing!" ? [01:06] feels a bit odd [01:06] just telling them to win them is a bit misleading too [01:06] but works if we want to get as many views as possible [01:09] yeah [01:09] New QA Incentive: Win Xubuntu stickers! [01:10] i was thinking something like "Help the QA team and win Xubuntu stickers!" [01:10] that's good [12:19] elfy, brainwash, ochosi: just uploaded a refreshed patch for xfce4-power-manager. This further improves the light-locker integration we added previously. We removed "Enable" as its really unneccessary (lock settings can be individually disabled, but lock still works from whisker). The logind-handle-lid-switch property is also updated now with this patch. If the power manager settings are set to Suspend on lid close and lock on suspend, [12:19] this property will be true. [12:19] one the one hand, we need standard testing of locking and suspending [12:20] but some laptop testing with lids would be good too [12:21] brainwash: will work on the packaging for your MRs when I get home tonight [12:21] Unit193: will get to the -extras stuff hopefully tonight as well [12:27] Great. [12:46] bluesabre: bug 1292290 [12:46] bug 1292290 in xfce4-settings "[SRU] Window manager keybindings don't work after reboot" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1292290 [13:06] bluesabre: a refreshed xfpm patch, good news :) now we only need to fix/improve light-locker to not break the test case "lid close action: lock" [13:06] so that it does not trigger the blank screen bug [13:11] bluesabre: thanks - I assume that's to the ppa? assuming so when I get back I'll sort some sort of mail to the list out for testing it [13:11] ochosi: ^^ [13:17] elfy: i actually presume that upload went directly to vivid [13:17] also don't see any packages building in staging [13:19] https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-power-manager/1.4.2-0ubuntu5 [13:20] ochosi: ok - not looked at all - lunch time :) [13:21] does that mean that people using staging will have to disable it? [13:25] Well it won't/doesn't have the updated patch. [13:25] nice answer to a different question :p [13:29] elfy, Unit193, refreshed the patch for the PPA... If we can fix the builds, it will have it too [13:29] Hah, was right about to. :P [13:30] Did it right after uploading this morning :-) [13:32] Think a translation update will happen soon enough? :P [13:36] :) [13:38] There, I cheated. Will revert too. [13:44] bluesabre, elfy: PPA has it too now. [13:44] Cool, I'd it going to build this time? [13:45] Already has. [13:45] Awesome [13:45] * bluesabre high fives Unit193 [13:45] o/\o [14:08] bluesabre: Going to add the hack in for -settings too? I'd think there should be an actual fix though. :/ [14:24] Hey guys, just recently installed Xubuntu 14.10 on an older Acer laptop that I'm using now. Can anyone verify that the window maximise keyboard shortcut works only for the ongoing session? [14:25] The default (Alt+F7) didn't work for me initially, so I changed it to Shift+Control+F7. That worked for that session. I shut down the laptop for the night, and today it's not working, until I set it to another combo. [14:25] I only found older bugs related to keyboard shortcuts, didn't match to this behaviour. [14:28] what do you mean with "ongoing session"? [14:29] but you are correct, that shortcut doesn't work for me either.. [14:29] you mean it only works when you (re)set it, and only for that session? [14:31] Yes, if I reset it to a new value, then it works until I reboot. Could even be until a logout. [14:32] file a new bug [14:32] (or see if one is filed in xfce bugzilla) [14:32] unless you did :) [14:34] Oh, right, only checked LP. Cheers. :) [14:35] lol [14:35] bug 1292290 [14:35] bug 1292290 in xfce4-settings "[SRU] Window manager keybindings don't work after reboot" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1292290 [14:35] that's what I am trying to fix [14:35] And apparently used funny search terms. Thanks! :) [14:35] :) [14:38] astraljava, you're still a bit rusty, but that rust will fall off when you persist with contributions ;) [14:42] Hehe, indeed. :D [14:42] Well, it's been a while. ;) [14:47] that happens [14:48] * knome makes some coffee [14:55] astraljava, want some? come get ;) [15:03] Would love to, but can't. Need to prepare my presentation for an english course at the uni for Friday. :/ [15:04] ooh, back to studying? [15:04] Thanks for the invitation, though! Hopefully won't take too long until I can. :) [15:04] yep! [15:04] Yeah, trying to get the degree during 2015. [15:04] nice [16:46] astraljava: could it be this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-settings/+bug/1292290 [16:46] Launchpad bug 1292290 in xfce4-settings "[SRU] Window manager keybindings don't work after reboot" [Medium,Confirmed] [17:16] ochosi, confirmed already ;) [17:17] did you look at the backlog at all? [17:25] good morning! [17:25] hullo pleia2 [17:26] gonna publish this blog post before work [17:26] goodie [17:27] knome: we good with ... uh [17:27] forgot the title you said [17:27] Help the QA team and win Xubuntu stickers! [17:27] yes [17:27] ok, on it [17:27] Help the Community with testing and win Xubuntu stickers [17:28] works too [17:28] might be better - because currently most people ignore the QA team ... [17:28] makes it about them instead :) [17:31] oh, sec, I'll update [17:31] http://xubuntu.org/news/help-the-community-with-testing-and-win-xubuntu-stickers/ [17:31] ta-da! [17:31] i'll tweet [17:31] * elfy thanks everyone who's had a hand in that :) [17:32] elfy, you too [17:32] ty knome :) [17:33] tweeted [17:38] g+ed and facebooked [17:39] knome: next time we tweet about this, include @unixstickers in the tweet since sometimes they retweet us :) [17:39] next time is in like 10 days [17:39] yes... should do that [17:41] pleia2, https://twitter.com/Xubuntu/status/557956026767785984 [17:41] that's good for now too :) [17:41] yep [17:42] time to upload some images to twitter too, seeing 12.04 countdown banners there [17:43] what about tweeting the sticker photo? [17:43] maybe do that on feb 2nd or so [17:44] heh [17:44] sure [17:50] woo, unixstickers retweeted the first tweet too [17:50] mission accomplished [17:50] \o/ [17:50] nice [17:54] pleia2: can you remember off the top of your head if you had image burning issues during the lts cycle or was it the last one? [17:55] ochosi: Yeah, like Pasi already mentioned, it was handed to me on a silver plate. :) Thanks, and sorry for the noise! [17:56] elfy: I have weird issues here and there every cycle, usually I can get one of the two tools to work [17:57] aak ok :) [17:57] my grumpyness this cycle is that one really is broken and I'm seriously annoyed at the whole situation and how useless the docs are - they either say "use testdrive" or skip over it entirely ("now you burn a dvd or make a usb stick, then...") [17:57] just trying to get some sort of sense from it all prior to the ugj [17:58] my grumpyness is that the QA wiki is too broad to be digestable by anyway [17:58] *anybody [17:58] basically we should just reboot it completely [17:58] and if nothing else a - 'do it like this for this tool' [17:58] which is why i suggested that we quickly create some developer docs [17:58] that cover the xubuntu development related things [17:59] and we can then slowly propagate that back into the main QA stuff [17:59] knome: I'm kind of in limbo currently - but assuming that I surface from that I'm of the opinion that we should do stuff for us and have it on the website for us [17:59] and I see you're of the same opinion :D [17:59] what i think is... [17:59] :) [17:59] we should create another branch for docs [17:59] devdocs [17:59] and get that set up [17:59] and get devdocs.xubuntu.org set up [18:00] the same way as docs. [18:00] and get on with it [18:00] those should describe a lot of things that are in the processes area currently [18:00] well if we do it like that then I'll not be doing it [18:00] including the minutiae on how to join IRC channels and stuff [18:00] not trying to work out how to do it from within LP [18:01] even if that's not ideal for everybody, for the project it's important that it is managed in a branch [18:01] why? [18:01] what does it give us? [18:01] none of the wiki pages are managed like that currently [18:02] I agree with elfy here, the wiki is slow and creaky, but much easier here [18:02] history with diffs, ability for everybody to file changes [18:02] both of which is there in the wiki [18:02] more or less [18:03] i guess ultimately i'd like to not have to manage stuff like that [18:03] QA stuff should be maintained by the QA team [18:03] and that should work [18:03] yea right [18:03] it's insane that every flavor writes their own developer documentation [18:03] and then they are manager badly because there's no resources or time to do that [18:03] and for the last 2 or 3 cycles the QA for us has been 1 person for 90% of the time [18:03] and then we have 10 different guides which are all crappy [18:04] that too [18:04] s/qa/qa team [18:04] but i think the task to fix the QATeam wiki is too much for anybody [18:04] or any team [18:04] or any collection of people [18:04] insane is why we haven't done it, but I don't think we have a choice anymore, the core QA team is unresponsive to our needs [18:04] then we should worry about our own issues [18:04] pleia2, not really... [18:05] they just don't have the time to fix this and that [18:05] * knome looks at QATeam [18:05] knome: I wasn't saying "why" I was saying that they are :) [18:05] I don't see any logical reason for us not to use the wiki to build our own docs [18:05] they aren't unresponsive [18:06] elfy, i guess we can do that, but my argument stays; it's insane to duplicate work [18:06] knome: haha, well, strictly speaking they "respond" by saying "oh yeah, we should fix that" but I meant unresponsive in that they can't follow through [18:07] pleia2, maybe... [18:07] what are the main things that we are lacking from QA dev docs? [18:07] knome: you make no sense then - 5 minutes ago you wanted it all in a branch somewhere - where contrary to what you say "ability for everybody to file changes" - not it's not - it's a nightmare for anyone who's not got the slightest idea what's going on with a branch [18:08] first is that they're so confusing I can never find anything, no planning to layout [18:08] anyway - happy to have the conversation - but later - kid's wanting stuff time of the day [18:08] second is their strange focus on testdrive (and with that, virtualized testing), that I don't think anyone even uses [18:08] and we want to encourage physical hardware testing too [18:09] glossing over creation of USB sticks is easy when they are focused on virtual testing [18:09] pleia2: tbh I think that's a bit of a hangover, I've not seen anyone actually push it for ages [18:09] bbl [18:09] yep, it's old [18:10] pleia2, no i mean "what kind of documentation should we write?" [18:10] not "what is wrong with the current documentation?" [18:11] knome: oh, I thought you asked what the current docs were lacking [18:11] elfy, creating and writing dev docs aren't for everybody, you have to know how things are done before you contribute to them - we disagree, but i can live with the wiki [18:12] elfy, just let's not let the minutiae or disagreements in technology get in the way of helping people :) [18:12] so I shall reword: proper structure, focus on hardware, USB stick info, guidance on using virtualbox directly [18:12] well [18:12] if we aren't poking the QA Team wiki [18:12] you want: [18:12] - instructions on how to create USB sticks [18:12] and [18:12] - how to use virtualbox in testing [18:12] right? [18:13] are those the two things that would answer the questions everybody are asking? [18:13] we can link to existing docs to some extent for USB, but we need to have our own info around that - update with existing bugs in usb tools, remind people to try the other if the first doesn't work [18:13] I think so [18:13] elfy, does that sound correct to you? [18:14] time for work [18:14] hf [18:41] knome: I'm happy to help people do what we want - I just disagree that changing everything so it's dealt with via something that a very few people will bother with is completely the wrong thing to do :) [18:42] elfy, i understand that, but as i said, i don't expect "anybody" to be qualified to write dev docs anyway [18:45] good - but as it stands we CAN use the wiki - anyone [18:45] and that's good enough [18:45] for purpose [18:45] what we've got though is a bunch of wiki's that don't actually work for US [18:48] biab [19:52] ochosi, new xfpm is misbehaving on my desktop. I've got the black screen bug when I set to lock on suspend. [19:53] not only that, it's not even suspending anymore, it's just blanking the screen [19:56] ochosi: confirmed jjfrv8 issue here [19:57] knome: I'm still of the opinion that we should create our own information for our 'testers' [19:57] elfy, probably. [19:57] we can be more specific about bug reporting for one thing [19:58] but i don't think it's a bad idea to improve the general wiki [19:58] oh not saying that :) [19:58] always good to improve generic stuff when and where it's possible [19:58] yep [19:59] i'd rather build on that [19:59] than duplicate all the work [19:59] I'm not really sure what you mean tbh [19:59] i mean that if there is *something* we can reuse from the main stuff, let's do it, even if it means some work :) [19:59] there's no way that putting Xubuntu specific stuff on the main wiki is going to work [20:00] that isn't what i meant [20:00] oh right - two pronged attack ? [20:00] yea - got that :) [20:00] i meant that if we can say "here, look at the QA team wiki first for basic, and then come back here", it'd be good [20:01] yea [20:01] I got that eventually :D [20:01] yep [20:01] though I would rather come back here was go to there for specific info :) [20:02] mhm [20:10] I would like to see a parole build with harfbuzz support in the next xubuntu releases.in fact,it solves RTL languages issues [20:17] knome, hey i had an idea this morning [20:17] about the security doc [20:17] are you guys able to pull a link to some survey on your existing doc? [20:17] you could try and get users to provide feedback on the existing one for now [20:17] and compare later [20:17] with the new guidance, see if it's useful [20:42] I'd completely forgotten what a default trusty looks like [21:07] ochosi, more info on the xfpm problems... I keep getting this notificaton: http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/xfpmbug.php [21:07] and I can no longer change the System settings: http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/xfpmbug02.php [21:08] I'm not seeing anything like that [21:08] hmm [21:38] bbl [21:49] ali1234: whereabouts does ted gould live on irc? [21:49] #ubuntu-desktop [21:49] awesome thanks :) [21:50] I'll try and grab him about this indicator thing of mine - he decided it was pulseaudio, but I'm not sure about that [21:50] and I see the same thing with a livesession on this hardware too [21:50] have you tested this with a clean install? [21:51] elfy: Do I need to do a core test for you too here? [21:52] ali1234: not as far as actually installing it - but I can't imagine it'll be different, livesession crashes with it as well [21:52] Unit193: ? [21:52] livesession is even better i guess [21:52] have you reported it on the iso tracker? :P [21:52] perhaps I'll just report it from the live session [21:53] that's definitely what i'd do [21:53] ali1234: not yet - not reported or run any tests lately tbh [21:53] no one can complain about user misconfiguration that way [21:53] yea :) [21:53] not sure why he says pulse isn't running tbh [21:54] anyway - enough of that - thanks :) [21:56] report it using "ubuntu-bug sound" or whatever... the thing that gathers all sound card information [21:56] ubuntu-bug -s audio [21:56] I don't know that I need to - the bug tool pops up as soon as I look :) [21:57]