bschaeferSturmFlut, yeah a mir disconnect usually causes a abort00:00
SturmFlutbschaefer: Hm. Well, enough for today, it is 1 AM again. See you tomorrow!00:03
bschaeferSturmFlut, cya!00:03
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dholbachgood morning07:44
SturmFlutdholbach: Good morning!08:10
dholbachhi SturmFlut08:11
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pittisergiusens: \o/ thanks for fixing the emulator09:19
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l3on:( https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/2014/06/10000-users-of-ubuntu-phone/09:34
l3onwhere can I find ? ^09:34
JamesTaitGood morning all; happy Answer Your Cat’s Questions Day! :-D09:35
popeyl3on: looks like a redirect issue on the new site09:37
popeydpm: mhall119 ^^ looks like there's a broken redirect on the new site09:38
dpmperhaps we didn't port that blog post?09:39
popeyI don't know... but it's a broken link09:41
popey(we link to it from http://voices.canonical.com/user/163/tag/phone/ for example09:41
l3onpopey, http://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/10-000-users-of-ubuntu-phone/172909:41
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davmor2popey: goto that link you just posted in chromium do images load for you?11:15
popeyno, which is what l3on was reporting11:16
davmor2popey: ah cool11:16
sergiusenspitti: no problem11:17
sergiusenssorry for breaking it11:17
sergiusensI never thought changing from GiB to GB would break it :-/11:17
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pittisergiusens: heh -- it's rare to see a tool handling disk size which only deals with the power-2 units11:21
jgdxelopio, ping11:27
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jgdxoSoMoN, thanks for the review. I've addressed your comments, but I'm not 100% sure where to put the singleton creation callback.12:20
jgdxoSoMoN, the callback is at L549, in plugin.cpp. I'm pretty sure it does not belong in the class itself.12:23
oSoMoNjgdx, let me check12:34
oSoMoNjgdx, that looks correct to me12:38
oSoMoNjgdx, as far as I’m concerned, the MR looks all good now, but if someone who actually knows the code base could take a look that’d make for a more proper review12:39
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jgdxoSoMoN, right. I think Ken has looked it, and will look at it again when time comes.13:12
saidinesh5Elleo: out of curiosity how much memory does Ubuntu keyboard take up and how much do you think is acceptable?13:35
Elleosaidinesh5: iirc it varies between about 50 and 60MB (depending on the dictionary loaded)13:37
saidinesh5Ahh hmm...13:38
Elleosaidinesh5: a big chunk of that is memory used by Qt apps for anything (something like 15-20MB as I recall), then another big contributor is hunspell loading whole dictionaries into memory13:38
saidinesh5Sounds about the same for me13:38
saidinesh5Yup.. Hunspell was bad...13:38
Elleowe're vaguely considering a branch of hunspell that was developed for chromium, that could improve memory usage, but haven't looked into in detail yet13:39
saidinesh5Ahh yeah seen that.. Binary format right?13:39
Elleosaidinesh5: yeah13:39
saidinesh5Yeah but i wasn't satisfied with hunspell suggestions either when it comes to swipes...13:40
Elleosaidinesh5: it has pretty poor performance for suggestions too13:41
saidinesh5Oh yes, performance is another interesting issue i noticed... It drastically sucks on phone somehow13:41
saidinesh5Like the same swipes were really fast on desktop13:42
saidinesh5Compared to the tablet13:42
saidinesh5Haven't looked in detail though13:42
Elleosaidinesh5: interesting, I seem to remember it being pretty responsive when I tried your plugin on an N413:42
saidinesh5That was brute force :p13:43
Elleoah, was that with the precomputed swipes?13:43
saidinesh5Well brute force only for the words starting with the current letter13:44
ElleoI haven't tried comparing hunspell on arm to hunspell on x86, would be interesting if there is a big difference13:44
saidinesh5For me the hunspell matcher on phone performed quite worse on longer words like in your video13:45
saidinesh5But the same words were fast on desktop13:45
ElleoI'll have to have a play with that13:45
saidinesh5So nevertheless dropped hunspell matcher13:45
Elleomight be some low hanging fruit for optimisation in hunspell13:45
saidinesh5Mhm .. Also hunspell dictionaries don't account for word frequency right?13:46
Elleowe use presage for that side of things, which is typically faster too13:46
Elleobut it can be problematic if you feed presage too much training data13:47
saidinesh5Ahh ... I remember finding words like sqlite in presage , so left it for later13:47
Elleoas it can get quite slow if its database is too big13:47
saidinesh5Yup presage looks like it was designed for desktop13:47
saidinesh5N grams and sqlite and stuff13:48
Elleoand it has a few nasty bugs still (like splitting words on apostrophes)13:48
saidinesh5Ahh the interesting thing android dictionaries did was13:48
saidinesh5Add the punctuated words as dictionary words13:49
saidinesh5So you get a lot of things for free13:49
Elleoyeah, that's what most dictionaries do (hunspell does that)13:49
Elleoand we have a patch for presage to make it treat apostrophes more normally13:50
saidinesh5Ahh i thought hunspell affix files specified that13:50
Elleosaidinesh5: yeah, I'm not certain about hunspell's affix stuff; it might just be for handling less common cases13:51
saidinesh5So i was thinking of just optimizing skeyer's memory usage and ship the brute force matcher for the first version13:51
Elleosaidinesh5: but certainly commonly punctuated words are in the normal dictionary file13:51
saidinesh5Hmm.. Are there any other fossy dictionary matching algos out there?13:53
saidinesh5Libraries i mean13:53
Elleothere's libaspell, not sure how its performance compares though13:53
* saidinesh5 googles13:54
Elleosaidinesh5: http://aspell.net/13:55
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Elleosaidinesh5: their own metrics suggest its faster than hunspell, but they look rather out of date (comparing against hunspell 1.1)13:56
saidinesh5Looks quite like hunspell 0_013:56
saidinesh5The api i mean13:56
saidinesh5Also any updates on merging the mir backend into Maliit?13:59
Elleosaidinesh5: nope, I need to ping the mir folks again; I think the two people I need were on holiday last time I tried; but that was all put on hold a bit while we synced maliit and keyboard stuff between vivid and RTM14:00
Elleosaidinesh5: but we just finished that sync, so we should be clear to start doing more experimental stuff with maliit again now14:01
saidinesh5Ahh cool... I need to patch Ubuntu keyboard too so that it would be merged?14:02
saidinesh5Also how does one ship a 3rd party keyboard then?14:02
saidinesh5In the Ubuntu store... Click packages are a no go right?14:03
Elleosaidinesh5: I've already got a branch that patches the ubuntu-keyboard14:03
saidinesh5Ahh  nice14:04
saidinesh5Less work for me :p14:04
Elleosaidinesh5: at the moment there's no way to ship a 3rd party keyboard to end users easily, you can make deb packages for advanced users to install (they have to have their device setup read-write)14:04
Elleosaidinesh5: we're going to be working on 3rd party stuff this cycle, but not much has started in that respect yet (we're still mostly busy bug fixing for the upcoming release)14:05
saidinesh5Was mostly testing stuff with the skeyer demo but i think I'll stop working on matchers and start fixing maliit plugin so was14:05
Elleosaidinesh5: but the first step for 3rd party stuff will be 3rd party things from OEMs (i.e. that get shipped with the device), rather than that keyboard that can be installed from the store14:05
saidinesh5Also can't i just specify the plugin file in server.conf?14:06
Elleosaidinesh5: I'd like to get us to a stage where keyboards can be shipped as clicks, but that might be a way off for now14:06
saidinesh5Btw upcoming release = 2weeks right?14:06
Elleosaidinesh5: something in that ballpark, yeah14:07
saidinesh5Hmm... Like if you have a roadmap, i don't mind pitching in some help14:07
Elleosaidinesh5: not much of a roadmap yet, I think it'd be useful to have a meeting with all the interested parties (you, me, security team, mir folks, etc.) to work things out a bit more publicly14:09
Elleosaidinesh5: but that's not likely to be easy to organise for a little while, as everyone's attention is pretty full currently14:09
saidinesh5Mhm, maybe include the sailfish folks too ? Even they maintain a private fork of Maliit apparently14:10
Elleosaidinesh5: yeah, wouldn't hurt to chat with them; I suspect there wouldn't be a massive amount of overlap for this side of things though, since it's likely to relate mostly to click stuff and app confinement which is pretty Ubuntu specific currently14:10
saidinesh5Hmm.. Yeah14:10
saidinesh5Afaik that other guy's swipe keyboard is also quite close to release14:11
saidinesh5But that's pretty tied to sailfish atm14:11
saidinesh5Okboard or something it was..14:12
Elleosaidinesh5: it'd also be interesting to have a conversation about maybe using libskeyer directly in the existing keyboard as a default option; but I think that'd require a chat with legal people too (I have no clue about that side of things)14:12
saidinesh5Ah sure, I'll need time for that though14:12
saidinesh5Right now it's really a stupid brute force matcher :p14:13
Elleosaidinesh5: yeah, I'm thinking for the future really, my own time is pretty tied up the next couple of months with bug fixes for existing keyboard stuff and new features/improvements for our chinese keyboard stuff (which will obviously be pretty important for us in the near future too)14:14
saidinesh5By tonight i think it would at least be fast enough though... And by this weekend hopefully support for frequently mistyped words.... (This works *very* nicely during prototype)14:15
Elleosaidinesh5: cool14:15
saidinesh5But yeah even i hate the fact that at the end of all this, if things go weird pirate bay release seems like the only option lol14:16
saidinesh5Right now I'm almost working full time on this...14:16
Elleosaidinesh5: yeah, software patents make everything painful :(14:17
apricot1on which tablets/SoC can I use Ubuntu? Is it Ubuntu-touch?14:17
ogra_on nexus4 and 1014:18
ogra_nexus 7 and 1014:18
apricot1does it work on any quad-core A15 CPU?14:18
ogra_(on 4 too, but thats not a tablet)14:18
ogra_if you port it to it it will owrk  on any SoC14:18
saidinesh5Also for libskeyer to be usable on Ubuntu keyboard wouldn't it need a lot of rewriting?14:18
saidinesh5Ui wise i mean14:19
Elleosaidinesh5: not sure, I haven't looked at libskeyer in much detail from that perspective; I'd expect us to probably want to integrate it into the existing UI though14:19
Elleosaidinesh5: so we add some swipe detection to the current stuff and pass it through to libskeyer in someway14:20
saidinesh5Because currently swipe detection assumes keys are laid out in rows of 414:20
Elleoah yeah, good point14:20
saidinesh5Of 10-11 i mean14:20
saidinesh5Also then the long press part needs to be rewritten14:21
saidinesh5To allow for swipes14:21
Elleosaidinesh5: not massively, it can just switch to detecting long press swipes *after* a long press, otherwise look for skeyer style swipes14:22
saidinesh5Technically it's still doing dictionary matches of input with swipeHints though14:22
Elleosaidinesh5: but it's probably not worth spending too much time considering this sort of thing without some sort of legal goahead first though14:22
saidinesh5I've heard Firefox OS guys had to cancel a similar project14:23
Elleoah, that doesn't bode well :/14:23
saidinesh5That could also be cuz of the speed of js though :p14:23
saidinesh5Speed/memory constraints14:24
saidinesh5Of keeping the whole dictionary in memory14:24
saidinesh5The thing with hunspell was it wasn't using keyboard layouts for matching either... So the results were extremely noisy14:25
Elleoyeah, presage doesn't do that either, which is something I'd like to implement at some point14:31
saidinesh5Ah that works quite well in skeyer now14:35
saidinesh5Simple really14:35
saidinesh5But again you'd need some kind of assumption on keyboard layout then14:36
saidinesh5Now i remember why i started skeyer from scratch lol14:36
saidinesh5The layouts were qml files in Ubuntu keyboard right?14:36
Elleosaidinesh5: yep14:37
saidinesh5Yeah ... Lol that's the reason.. Then it was hard to let the backend know about keyboard layouts...14:37
saidinesh5That's why i had to start from scratch14:37
Elleosaidinesh5: yeah, I figure we'll need to basically have a duplicated spatial map in a more parsable format14:37
saidinesh5Instead of forking Ubuntu keyboard14:37
Elleosaidinesh5: might be possible to rewrite the current layout stuff to autogenerate from those though14:38
Elleosaidinesh5: whilst still leaving flexibilty for the funkier layouts like emoji, japanese, etc. to do their own thing14:38
saidinesh5Yeah qml's children elements could help maybe14:40
saidinesh5Even I'm not sure how to cleanly implement telephonic layout in skeyer14:40
kenvandinejgdx, did you figure anything out about that rtm ap test failure?14:42
jgdxkenvandine, yes, AP generates a pressAndHold as well as a click event, sometimes. That makes it fail.14:43
kenvandinebut why only on rtm?14:44
jgdxand why AFAIK only mako?14:44
kenvandinethe failure noise is driving me nuts...14:45
* kenvandine grumbles 14:45
jgdxi have a theory that it tries to scroll (pressAndHold) and then clicks, because we use scroll_to_and_click14:46
jgdxI haven't gotten around to changing that though (school)14:47
john-mcaleelywho updates the universe copy of phablet-tools?14:49
john-mcaleelyif I understand this output correctly:14:49
john-mcaleelyit looks like it's got a stale copy of the tools, compared to the PPA14:50
john-mcaleelypmcgowan, ^ ?14:50
pmcgowanjohn-mcaleely, all tools should come from the ppa14:50
john-mcaleelyhrm, so should we tell trusty people to avoid the universe copy?14:51
john-mcaleelypmcgowan, ^14:51
jgdxkenvandine, so we might need to stop abusing scroll_to_and_click14:51
pmcgowanhmm, the instructions should probably be the same for all releases14:51
john-mcaleelyis updating the trusty/universe copy an easier path? (not my call)14:52
* pmcgowan has stale tools too 14:53
pmcgowanwhat happened to my ppas14:53
john-mcaleelyphablet-screenshot may be broken then?14:53
john-mcaleelyI've seen reports that is the canary for stale tools14:53
pmcgowanjohn-mcaleely, I just used that the other day using universe version14:53
john-mcaleelypmcgowan, fair enough then14:54
pmcgowanjohn-mcaleely, but, the instructions do seem wrong to me as we are not suring this back into the archive14:54
john-mcaleelypmcgowan, ah, right14:54
pmcgowanmhall119, ^^ who manages that installation page and do you agree its incorrect?14:55
john-mcaleelysergiusens, ^^ trusty universe vs ppa versions15:11
sergiusensjohn-mcaleely: no, updating the trusty archives is not easy or straight forward15:12
john-mcaleelysergiusens, fair enough :-)15:12
sergiusensjohn-mcaleely: I would just remove phablet-tools from the archive and just keep them in the ppa15:12
john-mcaleelysergiusens, is that something I can help with (removing from the archive?)15:13
john-mcaleelyI'd be +1 on that15:14
sergiusensjohn-mcaleely: if you want to drive that great15:15
sergiusensjohn-mcaleely: it's a lot of paper work15:15
john-mcaleelysergiusens, I don't know where to start, but happy to15:15
sergiusensjohn-mcaleely: on #ubuntu-release15:16
sergiusensjohn-mcaleely: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates15:16
john-mcaleelysergiusens, thanks. I'll get reading15:17
kenvandinedavmor2, the problem you found in silo 4, can you confirm that's a regression?  i'm not sure who well manual selection has worked in the past, i know i've never been able to test it15:18
davmor2kenvandine: I can check latter running regression tests now15:21
kenvandinedavmor2, thanks15:22
pmcgowanogra_, do you know where the check for low disk is done and what the threshold is currently?15:22
kenvandinei seem to recall something in ofono, where if manual registration failed it fell back to automatic15:22
kenvandinedavmor2, and it's likely that our UI doesn't handle that well, but that might not be new in this branch15:23
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mardykenvandine: Hi! Do you have time for a couple of questions on the ContentHub (it's for a personal project)?16:10
kenvandinemardy, sure16:14
mardykenvandine: what is the difference between share and export?16:15
kenvandinemardy, from a technical pov, nothing :)16:15
kenvandineit's really just difference in the user journey16:15
kenvandineso we can have apps that identify themselves as share handlers, meaning they share the content externally16:16
kenvandinelike facebook, gmail, etc16:16
mardykenvandine: right, I guessed so, but I wanted to double check16:16
mardykenvandine: so, when I download a pic from the browser, and then I choose to open it in my app, that's "import", right?16:17
kenvandineyour app is an import handler16:17
mardykenvandine: can my app know that the pic came from the browser? That is, is it possible to get the app ID of the source app?16:18
kenvandinemardy, i think so... ContentTransfer.Source16:18
kenvandinei think16:18
mardykenvandine: it's not in the docs... I'll check the source16:20
mardykenvandine: a couple of questions more :-)16:20
kenvandineit might not be exposed16:21
mardykenvandine: if I save a pic from the browser, but I don't open my app, then save another pic, and then open my app, I see only the last picture16:21
mardykenvandine: is it the expected behaviour, or am I doing something wrong?16:22
kenvandinemardy,  it is ContentTransfer.source16:22
mardykenvandine: thanks16:22
kenvandineyou are doing something wrong :)16:22
kenvandinethe gallery handles that case16:23
mardykenvandine: ah, true16:23
mardykenvandine: I'll check16:23
kenvandinei think it just deals with multiple onImportRequested signals16:23
mardykenvandine: and about those files in ~/.cache/<my-app>/HubIncoming/, is my app responsible for clearing them?16:25
kenvandinewell, those should get purged by the service16:25
kenvandineyou are responsible for copying it if you need it to persist16:25
mardykenvandine: OK; but how does the service know that I'm done copying them?16:26
mardykenvandine: do I need to set some variable in the transfer object to close it?16:26
kenvandinemardy, set the state to Finalized16:27
kenvandinethe hub should purge it when it shuts down16:28
kenvandineeven if it's not finalized16:28
kenvandinei think :)16:28
kenvandinei'm getting a little rusty on the hub... looking forward to hacking on it soon :)16:28
mardykenvandine: OK, thanks, I think that's all; tonight I'll try using it more and will let you know16:28
jgdxdavmor2, cc me after you've run the tests? :)16:29
kenvandinemardy, cool16:29
mardykenvandine: but so far it's been a pleasure, it's very easy to use16:29
kenvandinemardy, i love hearing that :)16:29
kenvandineElleo, ^^16:29
kenvandineElleo, another happen content-hub customer :)16:30
mandelElleo, pmcgowan here you have => https://code.launchpad.net/~mandel/ubuntu-download-manager/support-data-uri/+merge/24731716:33
mandelElleo, pmcgowan will do the rmt mr in a second16:33
pmcgowanmandel, nice16:34
Elleomandel: cool16:37
mhall119Elleo: PodBird needs a "Downloaded episodes" view, so that when I'm away from my home network I can easily see what I've got available to listen to16:52
mhall119also, does it use DownloadManager?16:52
Elleomhall119: yeah, good idea; and yep it uses download manager16:53
mhall119ah, cool, so I can switch away from it while it's downloading16:53
mandelElleo, can you please test that with the browser? Or do I just have to open google images and try to get an img?16:54
mandelpmcgowan, Elleo I realized that we need to use trnnk in udm for rtm, I'm not back porting this to utopic because is not a security issue, agreed?16:55
kenvandinemandel, any progress on bug 133077016:55
ubot5bug 1330770 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu RTM) "click packages rely upon tls for integrity and authenticity" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/133077016:56
Elleomandel: yeah, downloading any thumbnail from images.google.com should replicate it16:56
mandelkenvandine, I got moved to do a more important once first, will get back to you later tonight with a fix for that one16:56
mandelElleo, ack16:56
kenvandinemandel, thx16:56
pmcgowanmandel, just need it in rtm, not 14.1016:57
Elleomandel: I'll also test it myself once the debs are built, might not get to it until the morning though, as I'll be out this evening16:57
mandelpmcgowan, yep, so that mr is the only one we need, once we have the deb I'll retest with the browser and will do all the paperwork to get a silo etc..16:58
pmcgowanmandel, ok16:59
l3onSomebody here has some doc about how software is managed in ubuntu phone? - I meant, how updates come ?... apps and core-apps are the same? The apt paradigm, with repositories and sources file, sofotware center and whatever ... is still valid in u-touch?16:59
kenvandinebfiller, pmcgowan: either of you have an rtm krillin device you can test something on?17:08
pmcgowankenvandine, indeed I do17:08
kenvandinepmcgowan, can you test the debs from that?17:09
kenvandineafter connecting to wifi in the wizard, you should see the skip button change to continue17:09
kenvandineit didn't work for me on mako17:09
kenvandineCimi, ^^ pmcgowan is going to test it17:10
CimiI am reflashing to rtm on krillin too17:12
pmcgowankenvandine, why are the versions using 20141010?17:12
kenvandinepmcgowan, where?17:13
pmcgowankenvandine, the deb versions seem odd17:14
kenvandinethat can't be right17:14
kenvandinethe debs i see have 15.04 in them17:14
pmcgowanmaybe I got the wrong zip, one sec17:14
kenvandinepmcgowan, ^^17:15
kenvandinemust be wrong zip :)17:16
kenvandinepmcgowan, also... before you reboot go into wifi and forget the wifi network17:16
kenvandineunder previous networks17:16
kenvandinejust so it doesn't automatically connect in the wizard17:16
pmcgowankenvandine, so we are testing the wizard, need to enable it17:18
kenvandinespecific the wifi page in the wizard17:18
kenvandinemake sure the button at the bottom changes from "Skip" to "Continue" when the wifi connects17:18
Cimiafter 2 secs likely17:18
kenvandinepmcgowan, we've confirmed it doesn't work on mako rtm17:19
CimiI will re-test on krillin in less than one hour, I have to flash back17:19
pmcgowankenvandine, Cimi worked17:22
Cimipmcgowan, cool17:22
kenvandinepmcgowan, thx for testing17:23
* kenvandine wonders why it doesn't work on mako17:23
Cimikenvandine, qt or driver bug17:23
kenvandinepmcgowan, ok... so should we let this land for rtm then?17:23
Cimikenvandine, I am testing again now...17:24
pmcgowanbe good to know why it didnt work17:24
Cimiit flashed quickly17:24
pmcgowanmaybe intermittent or something17:24
kenvandinepmcgowan, yeah... i tried several times on mako17:24
Cimiwell the driver tells qt "I am connected to this access point!"17:24
Cimiqt sends this with a qml plugin17:24
kenvandineCimi, and you're sure it worked on mako with vivid right?17:24
Cimiit might be something wrong in the driver17:24
Cimikenvandine, sure sure17:25
kenvandinethat's what i was thinking17:25
Cimikenvandine, just try the deb too17:25
pmcgowankenvandine, so there is an open bug on that not being reliable17:25
kenvandinepmcgowan, there is a bug?17:25
pmcgowankenvandine, check this one, scopes buys hit it https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtbase-opensource-src/+bug/141326917:26
ubot5Launchpad bug 1413269 in Canonical System Image "Qt network being unreliable establishing a connection" [Undecided,Confirmed]17:26
Cimikenvandine, it doesn't work on krillin rtm to me now17:27
Cimikenvandine, don't approve17:27
Cimikenvandine, I will dig more tomorrow17:27
kenvandineCimi, thx!17:27
pmcgowanCimi, see that bug also17:27
kenvandinethat is QNAM17:28
Cimiit worked now17:28
kenvandinemight not be the same17:28
Cimibut it didn't 10 sec ago17:28
kenvandineok, not good17:28
kenvandinepmcgowan, although the root cause of the QNAM problem could be the same as this17:29
pmcgowankenvandine, we may have a good test case17:30
kenvandineCimi, ok, on mako i can make it work17:31
kenvandineafter it connects, if i hit back17:31
kenvandineand then go in again, and it's already connected to wifi17:32
kenvandinei see continue17:32
kenvandinebut it never changes for me on connection17:32
kenvandineCimi, maybe we're not getting notified of the change?17:32
kenvandineaccessPointName not getting set?17:32
kenvandineCimi, or a race... if the networkNameChanged is emitted before the networkStatus changes?17:37
kenvandineCimi, if networkStatus isn't HomeNetwork, accessPointName gets set to ""17:38
kenvandineCimi, just a thought, maybe the order of the signals isn't reliably17:39
kenvandineCimi, perhaps if you called getAccessPointName in onNetworkStatusChanged if the status was HomeNetwork?17:39
kenvandineinstead of using 2 signals17:39
kenvandineCimi, that should work, and prevent a possible race there17:41
kenvandineof course only if it's not a driver bug :)17:44
doomlord_is there a list of devices ubuntu touch may work on and probability17:53
ubot5You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices17:56
doomlord_ok i see there is some nexus 5 support17:58
doomlord_nexus 4 and 7 still the primary focus?17:59
ogra_the phone that goes on sale soon is the primary focus :)17:59
doomlord_ah, interesting, will that have hardware support for convergance eg dock18:00
ogra_there is no support for cenvergence anywhere yet18:01
ogra_so even if the HW would support it ...18:01
doomlord_ok fair enough.  Convergance is my interest18:01
ogra_well, convergence of a hone OS requires that you have a phone OS first :)18:02
doomlord_heh ok.18:02
ogra_if that is 100% rock solid the next step is to introduce desktop apps and external displays ...18:02
ogra_... and input devices18:03
doomlord_i guess what I really want is ubuntu on the phone but I guess the focus here is a new phone OS, which is a big UI task18:03
ogra_convergence is a target for 16.04, you might see bits and pieces of it before but by then it should be good for production devices out in the field18:03
ogra_not only UI18:04
ogra_the phone OS will also be the base for the future dekstop (and perhaps server) OS18:04
ogra_snappy is the next step after ubuntu touch ... and snappy is supposed to take over the ubuntu world as underlying system18:05
doomlord_does 'ubuntu for android' still exist (a seperate project, right?)18:06
kenvandineCimi, ok... i figured it out... it's the currentNetworkMode18:06
ogra_that has been put on hold18:06
kenvandinewhen we check that, it's NetworkInfo.UnknownMode, not NetworkInfo.WlanMode18:06
ogra_u4a needs adjustments to the system you can only do together with a manufacturer ...18:06
doomlord_maybe there wasn't enough demand18:07
doomlord_shame, I think ubuntu for android is exactly what I'd have wanted18:07
ogra_well, now you will get a real ubuntu on the phone *and* converged :)18:09
ogra_right, first the phone :)18:09
doomlord_i guess a whole new OS designed for convergance will do it better18:09
dobeyi just want a phone that actually fits comfortably in my pocket, and my hand. :-/18:09
ogra_dobey, buy one then :)18:09
ogra_nobody forced you to buy that N5 :)18:10
dobeywell, i want one that i can use ubuntu on too.18:10
ogra_(or grow your hands)18:11
kenvandineCimi, indeed... we're getting onCurrentNetworkModeChanged after onNetworkNameChanged and onNetworkStatusChanged18:11
dobeywithout having to do all the work18:11
doomlord_phone is a deceptive word18:11
dobeyogra_: the time of parachute pants is long passed18:11
doomlord_even smartphone places too much emphasis on phone18:11
dobeyand on smart18:11
dobeythey are really dumb things after all18:11
dobeyand they have absolutely no tact at all :(18:11
doomlord_a pocket computer18:12
doomlord_write phone somewhere in smallprint18:12
dobeyyeah, pocket computer is a lie18:12
doomlord_it's a lie without convergance18:12
dobeyit's a lie with it18:12
dobeyit's still not a real general purpose computing device18:13
doomlord_in some ways its a more capable general purpose device. its' got integrated screen & powersupply18:13
dobeyso does my 6000lb pickup truck18:14
doomlord_integrated everything18:14
doomlord_what in your mind stops it being a general purpose computing device18:14
doomlord_^ other than the OS18:14
dobeybut nobody calls a car a motorized computer18:14
doomlord_heh wait till they self-drive18:14
dobeyno thanks18:15
=== mpt_ is now known as mpt
dobeyif i wanted to take all the joy out of driving, i'd just drive off the pier18:15
dobeyif you can't be bothered to actually drive a vehicle properly, then get a damn bus pass18:16
doomlord_self drive cars eventually could do the job of public transport much better18:17
dobeynot likely18:17
doomlord_there will be consumer resistance due to habits but eventually shrinking energy supply will demand efficiency18:17
dobeynah, we'll all be dead first18:18
doomlord_cars will be replaced with little self-drive pods18:18
doomlord_with holistic traffic AI.. collective drafting18:18
* ogra_ perfers beaming 18:19
doomlord_an AI with whole system knowledge will be able to optimize journeys better18:19
ogra_or stargates in every household18:19
doomlord_space savings for not needing parking18:19
dobeyAI is great. it will optimize out the humans18:20
doomlord_there's another solution I prefer to self drive cars, or normal car18:20
doomlord_not having to go anywhere according to anyone elses schedule :)18:20
doomlord_but not everyone has that luxury18:20
doomlord_bicycle + walking + trains between cities is enough18:21
doomlord_but most of modern society seems to retain the need for regular commuting18:22
kenvandineCimi, ok... i pushed a *fix* and proposed it against your branch18:23
dobeymy vehicles aren't really for commuting18:23
kenvandineCimi, https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/fix-1363400/+merge/24734118:23
kenvandineCimi, feels hacky... but we can't rely on currentMode and status to be set when we want it18:23
kenvandinethe NetworkInfo API isn't very QML friendly...18:24
dobeydoomlord_: and i have a laptop that is both smaller, and has longer battery life, than a nexus 6.18:26
doomlord_heh ok18:27
doomlord_i guess I feel a phone should be able to do the job of a rasperi pi, even if its' not its' primary function18:27
dobeybut let me know when you see someone running a full pro tools or ableton live suite on a phone.18:27
doomlord_and the fact it can't out of the box seems like a waste18:27
dobeya rbpi can't really do that much18:28
doomlord_not compared to a full desktop, but imagine that being the first computing device you ever had18:28
doomlord_eg introduction to 3rd world18:28
dobeywell, in terms of raw power, it's probably more than the first computing device i ever had18:29
doomlord_by orders of magnitude in my case18:30
doomlord_its like to *not* be cable of everything that a general purpose computer from some years ago was, its been artificially crippled, in my view18:30
dobeyyes, it's very limited in terms of capabilities18:31
dobeyas are phones/tablets/etc18:31
doomlord_does ubuntu-phone have a terminal app18:33
doomlord_even if not a fully converged desktop .. is an underlying OS there18:34
popeythe underlying OS is Ubuntu mostly.18:34
kenvandineCimi, actually... i have a more QML friendly fix... that removes a bunch of code :)18:35
dobeypopey: s/mostly// :)18:36
dobeyit is ubuntu. it's just running on top of the android kernel and some android bits are running inside a container18:37
popeydoomlord_: http://popey.mooo.com/screenshots/device-2015-01-21-131830.png18:37
dobeypopey: i still can't stand seeing those overlays in the screenshots18:38
doomlord_nnice , will that work with physical keyboard18:38
popeymaybe they should go more transparent over time18:38
popeydoomlord_: yes. it works on the desktop too18:38
ogra_dobey, patches accepted ;)18:39
doomlord_might it also run a desktop x session, a minimal WM , just not full desktop ubuntu DE18:39
popeywhat? on a phone 5" across?18:39
popeywe dont ship x on the phone18:40
doomlord_HDMI out18:40
dobeyogra_: sure, i just don't know what a good solution is. but having overlays that hide content is a bad thing :)18:40
dobeydoomlord_: no, we don't do convergence yet18:40
doomlord_slot phone into VR headset with lenses, virtual screen18:40
popeyI'll continue to dismiss your arguments until you come up with a solution then :)18:40
dobeypopey: "don't use a terminal on a phone" :)18:40
ogra_well, something needs to detect that both buttons are pressed ... and for the duration of the dual press the overlay should be hidden18:40
popey"don't let anything break so i have to use a terminal on a phone"18:41
dobeyogra_: oh i wasn't talking about the volume notification :)18:41
popeyhe was talking about the terminal18:41
doomlord_emacs in a terminal session, thats an OS18:41
popeyhttp://popey.mooo.com/screenshots/device-2015-01-21-131844.png just rotate the device :)18:41
ogra_ah, that18:41
popeythen they're not in the way18:42
popeywe considered lots of options18:42
popeybottom edge, hiding them completely, putting them in the kb overlay18:42
dobeyunless i'm playing doom in dosbox :P18:42
popeythis is the least-worst solution18:42
popeyright, which one of you is using Texual on a mac!?18:43
popeyOut yourself!18:43
doomlord_and on linux here, synergy18:43
dobeyi couldn't be bothered to use something with such an awful name18:44
doomlord_reclining with apple laptop, spare screen to the side connected to my desktop, with synergy18:44
ogra_popey, since you say mac ... https://plus.google.com/+TarandeepSingh/posts/5FcEBgG22tP18:45
popeyyeah, that made me chuckle18:46
popeyand sad18:46
ogra_i bet they were all runnung ubuntu in parallells18:46
popeywe can dream18:48
dobeyif only one of those people was bernie mac18:54
Cimikenvandine, I doubt it works19:11
Cimikenvandine, if it doesn't switch with currentNetworkMode it wont work19:11
Cimikenvandine, networkName is a method, not a binding... it doesn't retrigger if you switch wifi for example19:12
Cimikenvandine, if the issue is currentNetworkMode, we can ignore it19:12
krisabsinthe42I am trying to update the text of a button when I press it. I have this, any idea why its not working?19:21
krisabsinthe42onClicked: { label.text = i18n.tr("Warm up! - Walk (5 mins)") button.text = i18n.tr("Pause Workout!")19:21
* Jon9012 is away: I'm busy19:43
kenvandineCimi, my branch worked... i tried it a bunch of times19:53
kenvandinebfiller, bug 1394211 doesn't have a milestone set, it's a translation fix that we should problem land20:02
ubot5bug 1394211 in content-hub (Ubuntu RTM) "Download complete dialog is shown untranslated" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/139421120:02
kenvandinebfiller, can you get it tracked on a milestone?20:02
jgdxkrisabsinthe42, is there a line break before "button.text…" ?20:12
bfillerpmcgowan: can I add this to ww05 - just a translation fix20:17
ubot5Launchpad bug 1394211 in content-hub (Ubuntu RTM) "Download complete dialog is shown untranslated" [High,In progress]20:17
pmcgowanbfiller, sure20:18
bfillerkenvandine: done20:18
kenvandinebfiller, thx20:18
krisabsinthe42jgdx: yeah , it pasted weird20:23
jgdxkrisabsinthe42, you should use a pastebin and include more of the source20:23
kenvandinebfiller, i prepared a silo for content-hub20:27
bfillerkenvandine: thanks ken20:27
mucushello!  where would i go to find out if ubuntu touch is available for the shamu?20:32
ahoneybunI think my install is messed up20:53
ahoneybunI can't download any updates20:53
ahoneybunI got the 14 update for RTM but thats it20:53
kenvandineahoneybun, what happens in system-settings when you check for updates?20:54
ahoneybunI see the updates and I start them but nothing is downloading20:54
kenvandineclick updates or system update?20:54
ahoneybunI am on the same wifi as this laptop20:54
kenvandineso it sees updates20:55
kenvandinebut never downloads them?20:55
ahoneybunsystem was fine I moved from 13 RTM to 1420:55
kenvandineso maybe something with udm...20:55
kenvandinemandel, any suggestions for debugging that?20:55
ahoneybunand the screen is flicking20:55
ahoneybunwhen I do anything20:55
kenvandineoh.. that's alarming :)20:56
ahoneybunswiping down, up, to the right, left20:56
kenvandineahoneybun, what channel is that from?20:56
kenvandinei guess not -proposed20:56
ahoneybunrtm 1420:56
* kenvandine has no idea how to see the changes files for that... 20:56
popeyme either20:57
ahoneybunI thought that the flicking was something to do with charging but it started to do it even when not charging20:57
popeyyou on vivid?20:57
ahoneybunrtm popey20:57
popey208 is latest rtm20:58
kenvandineok, 20920:58
popeypaging ogra who probably knows better where this nonsense is20:58
mucusif i want ubutouch for my device do i have to build it myself?20:58
popeyahoneybun: what device?20:58
popeymucus: depends on the device :)20:58
popey!devices | mucus20:58
ubot5mucus: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices20:58
mucusi don't see it on that device list20:58
kenvandinebut... 208 changes isn't useful... since the promotion included lots of changes leading up to that20:58
popeymucus: no, its not.20:59
mucusso i have to build?20:59
popeymucus: someone needs to port it, the porting guide is in progress, should be ready in a couple of weeks20:59
ahoneybunpopey, nexus 420:59
popeyi dont have a nexus 4 so can't confirm20:59
kenvandinei have rtm on my mako21:00
ahoneybunOS: Ubuntu 14.10 (r14)21:00
mucusdumb, day 1 question.21:00
kenvandinewhich is 17421:00
mucusubuntu touch = ubuntu?21:00
mucuscuz. . .  i mean. . .21:01
kenvandinemucus, yes... ubuntu touch is the touch variant of ubuntu21:02
kenvandinenot sure variant is the best word there... but you get the point :)21:02
mucusso . . . i could go and put xfce on there?21:02
kenvandinemucus, no...21:02
mucusyeah, it doesn't look like it. . .21:03
mucusbut can i still apt-get -i package?21:03
kenvandineahoneybun, popey: i have rtm devel-proposed image 174 on my mako, not seeing those issues21:03
kenvandinemucus, yes21:03
ahoneybunkenvandine, reboot fixed the flicking21:03
kenvandinebut they won't all work as expected21:03
kenvandinedifferent display service, app lifecycle stuff, etc21:04
ahoneybuni have rtm kenvandine no devel21:04
kenvandineahoneybun, yeah... i know21:04
kenvandineahoneybun, so the fact that it finds the updates, means networking is fine21:04
mucusoh, so i do need phone specific apps?21:04
kenvandinethe only thing i can think is something with the download manager21:04
ahoneybunkenvandine, seems I can download the updates now21:05
kenvandinemucus, yeah...21:05
kenvandineahoneybun, cool... but concerning21:05
kenvandinepopey, how about you?21:05
popeysorry, busy talking about cookies with mhall119  :)21:05
popeyway more important21:05
popeyhe's going to make me some21:06
kenvandinemhall119, can i have some?21:08
=== salem_ is now known as _salem
mardykenvandine: hi again :-) Does the content-hub work on unity7?21:33
mardykenvandine: I'm running the webbrowser-app in desktop-mode, but when I'm saving an image it tells me that there are no installed apps to handle that content type (but my app is installed)21:34
kenvandinemardy, doesn't work on the desktop, not from the browser21:35
kenvandinemardy, it's specifically disabled, you can change that by tweaking the qml in webbrowser-app21:35
kenvandinemardy, oh... wait...21:36
kenvandinei didn't think it would even show the peer picker21:36
kenvandinemardy, verify your app is registered21:37
kenvandinegsettings get com.ubuntu.content.hub.destination pictures21:37
kenvandinemardy, i just verified it worked for me on the desktop, i guess they dropped that code that disabled it21:39
mardykenvandine: ah, my app is not registered; I think I installed it before installing content-hub, so the click hook didn't run21:40
mandelkenvandine, sorry, I was out in rugby training, what do you need to debug:?21:44
kenvandinemandel, nothing now... it magically started working21:44
kenvandineahoneybun was having trouble getting it to download updates21:45
mandelkenvandine, he, just as soon as I'm back.. I'm THAT good ;)21:45
kenvandineit found updates, but would never start downloading21:45
mandelkenvandine, strange, since system and click do use udm21:45
kenvandinewell he didn't have a system update21:45
kenvandinejust click updates21:45
mandelahh. ok21:45
kenvandinehe was on rtm, not proposed21:45
kenvandineso i was worried we had a big problem in the promoted image21:46
kenvandinethat would keep users from getting ota updates :)21:46
kenvandinepopey had the same problem21:46
kenvandinepopey, is it working for you now too?21:46
kenvandinemandel, i'm now more anxious about the check-hash stuff... is that next on your plate?21:47
popeyhang on21:47
popeyI dont know what you're on about :)21:47
kenvandinepopey, didn't you say you could update apps either?21:47
kenvandineor was that just the flicker thing?21:47
mandelkenvandine, yes, so I have to test a fix for the browser and that is the next guy to be worked on, I have a dirty branch locally already, but I want to do proper tests etc..21:47
kenvandinepopey, ok then.. carry on :)21:48
kenvandineall is right in the universe21:48
kenvandinemandel, rtm landings aren't moving to quickly, so a little stressed about getting it landed in time :)21:49
mandelkenvandine, there is a weird spanish saying "visteme despacio que tengo prisa" means "I dress slowly because I'm in a hurry". I follow it quite a lot, I don't want to land a fix that adds more bugs in the system update code21:50
mandelkenvandine, you are probably going to be stress for me ;)21:50
kenvandinemandel, did you see i landed code in the system-update code today?21:51
mandelkenvandine, no, what was fixed?21:52
kenvandinefor the diff21:52
kenvandinejust qml changes, set the state to NOUPDATES when availableUpdates < 121:53
kenvandineso it says "Software is up to date"21:53
kenvandineinstead of just an empty list... which is useless21:53
kenvandinemandel, shouldn't break anything you're doing21:53
mardykenvandine: reinstalling didn't help, I got errors about a failed connection to dconf; but I manually ran the CH hook program, and that worked21:54
kenvandinewell, click isn't all that well supported on the desktop :/21:55
mandelkenvandine, awesome! I can't wait to have a sprint, sit with you and clean this mess asap21:55
mandelif we have the time..21:55
kenvandinemandel, indeed21:55
kenvandinewell, i want this code removed... and in a service :)21:55
kenvandinemardy, so your importer works now?21:57
dobeyi wonder why system updates don't show up on 3g for me22:31
mandelElleo, everything looks ok from my side for that branch, can you do a code review please, I'll request a silo then23:10
taiebotVery sorry if this bug as already reported https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/141379123:12
ubot5Launchpad bug 1413791 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "Full Left swippe does not come back to app scope after having searched an app" [Undecided,New]23:12
mandelkenvandine, FYI working on the checksum branch23:14
mandelkenvandine, removing that python code and we can mock the udm lib to emit a fake error a success etc..23:15
Elleomandel: sure thing, will review in the morning :) (currently falling asleep on a train...)23:15
mandelElleo, in the train! is really late! I was not even expecting a reply ;)23:15
mandelElleo, have a "decent" night if you have to sleep there!23:16
ElleoI'm mostly trying not to sleep so that I don't wake up somewhere unexpected :p23:16
mandelkenvandine, I'm getting the following in udm when downloading an img => ould not rename ' /home/phablet/.cache/com.ubuntu.gallery/HubIncoming/1/Z.tmp' to ' 93193a692ef24cc9b139a3da750c12a2.jpeg' due to  Permission denied23:23
mandelkenvandine, any idea?23:23
mandelha, I asked the question and then found the reason23:24
Cimikenvandine, if you switch wifi it won't go back to "skip" I reckon23:53
Cimibut I will try tomorrow23:53

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