[00:50] bluesabre, looks pretty much the same [01:26] knome: its the only other theme we install, it must be important ;) [01:27] Noskcaj: alrighty, let's go with gtk3 for now :) [01:27] in the ppa [01:27] good job [01:27] :) [01:28] bluesabre, squeak squeak [01:43] knome: moo moo [01:43] :) [01:43] ochosi: do we want to set /xfwm4/general/borderless_maximize to FALSE in x-d-s? [01:46] bluesabre, np: Edson / I Am the Ostrich [01:47] bluesabre: wat, when does the work finally end? i thought we just *released* something big?? [01:47] and no, we don't have to [01:47] i knew we'd have questions about 4.12 in trusty... i've seen several today already [01:47] obviously you didn't read the memo (despite releasing it) http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfwm4/commit/?id=b7b62c69add6a4bf5d6bde52548b5346d3a78265 [01:47] lol [01:48] :D [01:48] I copy and paste like a champ [01:48] oh, so that's how you got your job [01:48] * knome hides [01:48] hehe [01:48] :D [01:49] working with jquery, I spend a lot of time copy-pasting, yes [01:49] hah! [01:49] that's cheating [01:49] hah [01:49] jquery is relatively easy [01:49] *i* can write it.. [01:49] yeah, I can write it no problem [01:49] ochosi, https://twitter.com/xfceofficial/status/571784832092659712 [01:49] its the libraries that use it that kill me [01:50] but thats -offtopic :P [01:50] heh [01:50] brb, time for a clean reboot [01:50] * knome prepares going to bed [01:51] hmm, what do we have in the PPA already? [01:52] All the stuff that isn't versioned as 4.12 should be done in PPA [01:53] plus dev-tools and xfdesktop4 [01:53] wait, all the stuff that is *not* ? [01:54] e.g. garcon [01:54] part of the 4.12 release, but not 4.12.* [01:54] ochosi: Noskcaj has been packaging things, going to start syncing to our PPAs [01:54] ah ok, not yet synced [01:54] that's what i wanted to know [01:54] thanks Noskcaj! [01:54] np [01:55] great that things are moving so swiftly suddenly :) [01:55] I had an issue with exo, so it's not done. [01:55] sure, but it's a great start [01:55] i mean the weekend isn't over yet ;) [01:55] :D [01:55] its only just begun [01:55] Are we ok with the xfwm4 default changes? compositing and window previews by default [01:56] bluesabre, midday sunday [01:56] tomorrow there'll be tons of 4.12.1 releases to fix oversights [01:56] Noskcaj: yes, that's fine for us [01:56] as in, that's the time now [01:56] cool [01:56] Noskcaj: sorry your weekend gets to you faster :( [01:56] ah darn, i forgot that you live in the future, Noskcaj [01:56] :) [01:56] ochosi, the new default wallpaper for 4.12 is really nice ;) [01:56] +1 [01:56] ochosi, which version did you end up using? [01:57] hehe, someone loves themselves some self-praise over here ;) [01:57] haha [01:57] * knome coughs :P [01:57] knowingly he asks! [01:57] i tweaked the colors of the v3 to work better on bad displays [01:57] ok [01:58] i'm lazy, so you should pop the latest version somewhere [01:58] well, bad displays remain bad, but at least the wall should look a little less bland there now [01:58] the source is even in the xfce-artwork tarball [01:59] on xfce.org [01:59] * ochosi did his homework [01:59] i told you i'm lazy [01:59] bah :P [01:59] gah, tomorrow i have to add redirects for all the 4.11 docs to 4.12 [01:59] craaaaap :) [01:59] heh [01:59] and make the 1.4 powerman docs the main docs and all that [01:59] hmm [01:59] doc-rotate [01:59] why isn't there the new wallpaper on frontpage? [02:00] I'll be around in the morning (your noon/afternoon) [02:00] i think that part just hasn't been touched yet [02:00] knome: front page not updated it seems [02:00] mhm [02:00] ochosi, not here: http://archive.xfce.org/src/art/xfce4-artwork/ [02:00] oh [02:00] not here? http://cdn.xfce.org/downloads/xfce_artwork.tar.bz2 [02:00] no [02:00] can't be there [02:01] nick said he updated the tarball with the svg and i trusted him [02:01] fwiw, [02:01] end of story [02:01] we should add the svg logo there [02:01] oh [02:01] it's there [02:01] i wonder which version it is [02:01] says 2005... [02:01] bluesabre: sounds good, maybe we can get some more stuff done [02:01] knome: yeah, dunno, i guess you gotta ask nick about these things [02:02] ah, it's just the mose icon [02:02] mouse [02:02] yeaah... [02:02] a moose? [02:02] that. [02:02] bluesabre: although i hope not too much will turn up until then... [02:04] * knome just switched to using the xfce wallpapers [02:12] ochosi: hopefully not [02:13] anything else you need from me before i hit the sack? [02:13] knome: go, be free [02:13] hit it! [02:14] plural? [02:17] night everybody [02:28] Noob question here, Is 15.04 going to include XFCE 4.12? [02:29] zero_x: Yes [02:29] Thanks [02:29] np [02:29] I get a star for that one [02:30] * ochosi pins a star on bluesabre's chest [02:30] yeowch! [02:31] how do you like the honor now? [02:31] :D [02:40] Should appfinder be changed to gtk3? [02:40] not sure, you could check the mem footprint and test the performance [02:40] there's not really any obvious reason to switch to gtk3 for any of those apps, other than maybe help xfce test stuf [02:40] f [02:41] ok, i'll leave it on gtk2 then test gtk3 later [02:44] Should we be trying to get whiskermenu 1.5 for 15.04? [02:44] would be nice, after all, then we can also ship the settings file in the proper place [02:45] I'll make an FFe sometime soonish then [02:45] yeah, but don't forget there that we need to move the config [02:45] for the default setup i mean [02:45] other than that, goody [02:57] Well shit. we have to rebuild all of xfce [02:57] from the ground? [02:57] libxfce4util got a SONAME bump [02:58] 0 other changes from 4.11, but rebuild time [02:59] I nominate bluesabre, since upload rights are needed for that type of thing [02:59] * bluesabre stops uploading [03:01] I've uploaded util to ppa now, just parole and exo left. [03:01] Noskcaj: I'll upload libxfce4util and libxfce4ui in the morning, trigger rebuilds of things already uploaded, and the upload everything else [03:01] cool [03:01] thanks for all your hard work [03:02] +1 [03:02] np [03:02] I'm just glad to see 4.12 released [03:02] yeah, glad to have some code we've been hacking on for a few years get the "stable" label [03:03] hopefully 4.14's gtk3, wnck3, glib2.0 won't take as long [03:04] yeah [03:04] I think this release will definitely remind people that xfce is still around [03:05] we might get more development interest [03:05] That's the dream [03:05] and people stepping up to help with porting :) [03:07] so far only big words :) [03:08] but that might change [03:11] I expect it will [03:12] so tomorrow: doc-rotate and set up 4.14 roadmap page [03:12] sweet [03:19] heading to bed, night all [03:37] One change i found with mousepad, the statusbar is gone when you change to gtk3 and when re-enabled it is twice as high. I'm not sure if that's just from the new mousepad release though [09:32] ochosi: QA incentive - same person for cycle to end of Feb and Beta, saves on postage I guess :D [09:42] lol [09:42] what's our policy on that? [09:42] i mean, do we keep sending stickers to the same person [09:42] or can you win at most one milestone/month/final per cycle? [09:45] well - I guess if I'd have thought of the scenario last cycle then I would have 1 at most per cycle [09:45] of course we could just make it include team as well - I'd only want 1 set ever :D [09:45] well we run the competition, we decide the rules :P [09:46] i guess we can see how march goes and if the same person wins again [09:46] well it's an open field currently :D [09:46] then try to get other people more interested in beating them :P [09:47] * knome looks at the doc [09:47] hmmwait [09:47] see what happens when an actual real result turns up on blog etc [09:47] that's not here [09:47] there it is.. [09:47] :D [09:47] oh good god - I see a Pasi peering at me ... [09:47] ;) [09:48] and yeah, i think the contest should include team [09:48] kind of insane not to... [09:48] I don't agree - and you know why :) [09:48] i love the boolean bit for the team column :D [09:48] ? [09:48] 0/1 [09:49] oh so it sorts easy :D [09:49] yea [09:49] well maybe with the "team person can only win once ever" [09:49] compared to "regular person can only win once per cycle" or so [09:49] if we include team then we need to do 2 each time imo - team AND user [09:50] well, [09:50] maybe [09:50] or just limit team wins to once ever as i said [09:50] it just feels wrong that jack did 57 tests and doesn't get a sticker [09:50] because he happens to be in the ~xubuntu-team LP team [09:50] oic [09:50] so team doesn't include me :( [09:50] well you too [09:51] ha :) [09:51] but i wanted to make another example :P [09:51] heh [09:51] anyway - so reasoning [09:52] I kind of expect people in team to test - or we're really bad, this was a way to get people outside more involved [09:52] but I'm happy enough Jack getting a set, and slickymaster next month [09:52] understood :) [09:53] that's a fair argument [09:53] then again [09:53] as long as we have 2 each time - User and Team [09:53] we're all doing this voluntarily... [09:53] otherwise - completely pointless and we should stop now imo [09:53] well as i said we could limit team wins to once ever [09:53] eg. once you've won, you're banned from the competition [09:54] in march, april, beta2, final, ww cycle, xx cycle, ... [09:54] with that policy, i really don't think we need to do two winners :) [09:54] if things go on like they are going on now [09:54] then I refuse to be involved in this [09:54] just my idea [09:54] the WHOLE point was to get users involved [09:54] agree [09:55] i guess we need to ask pleia2 how many stickers she has :) [09:55] pretty sure there's sufficient for this cycle [09:55] yes, without the doubles for the team [09:55] maybe [09:55] i don't remember exactly [09:55] but then [09:55] "pleia2 has 20 bundles" [09:56] if we do two sets, user/team, isn't it unfair that people on the team have advantage :P [09:56] and wouldn't that mean elfy wins every time anyway ;D [09:56] lol [09:56] I could massage the figures and not only put 50% of mine on the tracker :D [09:56] so a team category, where anybody can win at most once ever? [09:57] go down as low as 5% or something [09:57] wouldn't that be almost the same than just order stickers for everybody in the team and get on with it :P [09:57] knome: lol [09:57] because at some point, you *have* to win [09:57] with 1 test, or sth :P [09:58] because everybody else is disqualified.. [09:58] knome: yea - but who'd want to trundle over the line last at the end next cycle :p [09:58] * knome volunteers [09:59] too late - you appear to have done 2 :D [09:59] :(( [09:59] anyway ... [09:59] I don't mind team included, but then we must have 2 [09:59] or I do mind [10:00] bear in mind that when we started thinking of this - I said team not included [10:00] yes [10:00] no-one said anything [10:00] too late to start now ;) [10:00] i have no arguments against that [10:00] it's mainly that it feels bad for people who did so much more - you, jack and david [10:01] yea I understand that point for sure [10:01] not me - but them anyway [10:03] mhm [10:56] hey everyone [10:57] morning ochosi [10:59] i think it's ok that now the same person won the QA incentive twice [10:59] but we should make that public (on all channels) and tell people to give him/her more competition [11:00] the programme might even benefit from this [11:00] yes - but no need to send 2 lots of stickers [11:00] sure [11:03] if you want the certificate sent, be in touch with me :) [11:03] i'll be off most of today [11:03] but i'll be around tomorrow [11:04] I think that we should inform them and everyone else before we do any sending of anything tbh [11:04] yup [11:04] +1 on that [12:04] sure, but also nice to have the cert prepared :) [12:13] there is that :) [12:40] good morning everyone [12:41] hey bluesabre [12:41] hi bluesabre :) [12:42] oh good lord another one lol ... [12:42] yeah, we might want/need a factoid for that :) [12:42] like !ffs :p [12:42] bluesabre: finish the 4.12PPA already, ppl are getting on our nerves in #xubuntu! [12:42] elfy: hehe [12:43] Noskcaj: I think I'll upload everything that depends on libxfce4util with a dependency wait on it, then push util to trigger the rebuild [12:43] yea - good lord bluesabre - did you need sleep or something? [12:43] elfy: wife's comment last night "holy crap your eyes look black, look at those shadows" [12:43] I guess we could fiddle with topic for the moment [12:43] seems so :D [12:44] ha ha ha [12:44] bluesabre, Noskcaj: in case you were wondering, the 4util soname bump didn't happen for no reason: http://git.xfce.org/xfce/libxfce4util/commit/configure.ac.in?id=ca7a3720e193e29dbc9f20306149c93e49a81c89 [12:44] * elfy has vision of bluesabre as one of those emo weirdos [12:44] ochosi: saw [12:44] k [13:07] bluesabre: crap, i think i have another patch for greybird... [13:07] tiny one-liner, but still [13:07] ochosi: alrighty, I'll upload that one after all of xfce [13:07] :P [13:17] :) [13:25] elfy: at what time are the new dailies built? [13:26] well ... it appears to be a bit of a movable feast [13:26] used to be ~11-12UTC [13:27] all I can say at the moment it is before 13:27UTC [13:28] so, it should be safe to start uploading packages that break things in a fresh image until all is uploaded [13:28] yep - you should be good now till tomorrow [13:29] good deal [13:29] don't update for a few hours [13:29] I've just going to check a handful of buidlogs [13:31] bluesabre: ftr - it 'appears' to build roundabout 10:00UTC [13:32] this first required upload might actually get stuck since it introduces a new package [13:34] * bluesabre watches [13:35] * elfy waits an hour to update and complain [13:36] wait long please [13:36] gotta rebuild all xfce packages [13:36] er [13:36] and blueman [13:37] oh lord - no wonder I was confused - convinced I was running kubuntu :p [13:37] :P [13:37] getting pulled away by all that plasma4 business [13:37] *plasma5 [13:37] :) [13:37] I do not seem to be centered on my keyboard [13:38] I'm having trouble centering on the planet atm :) [13:38] :D [13:39] bluesabre: maybe i'll have to tweak the xfwm4 tabwin preview size [13:39] bluesabre: anyway I'll make sure not to update any 'dubious choices' till the morning [13:39] so gimme an hour or (lunch) to look into that before up'ing greybird [13:39] elfy: thanks [13:39] unless you actually want me to - then just shout [13:39] ochosi: no hurry to upload that ;) [13:40] once that one lands, going to upload so many things >.< [13:46] bluesabre: bad man - you answer him in #xubuntu now :D [13:47] lol [13:47] just give him your twitter link [13:47] * elfy is doing that :D [13:47] and did :) [13:47] :) [13:49] though will the ppa get all updated stuff in it - just wondering? [13:49] will eventually get to the xfce-412 ppa [13:51] vivid > xfce-412 ppa for utopic > ppa for trusty > trusty SRUs as needed [13:56] bluesabre: thanks for the path :) [13:56] won't affect me of course - but helps to know :) [14:48] bluesabre: going to be a long day is it ;) [14:48] since the queue might take a while, each of the new packages were pushed to https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xubuntu-staging/+packages and are building [14:48] elfy: yes [14:48] :( [14:49] is it still cold and snowy? [14:49] * bluesabre wonders if Logan can release libxfce4util [14:50] elfy: slight upgrade, cold and rainy [14:50] hmm, so that one's still stuck? [14:50] ochosi: it created a new binary package with the change [14:50] libxfce4util6 > libxfce4util7 [14:50] so it goes to NEW [14:50] yeah, makes sense [14:51] we have to wait for that to clear before pushing the others, otherwise I'll just have to rebuild everything [14:51] the devel related channels are fairly quiet today [14:51] post-b2 [14:51] nobody is around [14:51] hoping ScottK shows up and hits the button [14:51] bluesabre: I'd guess that for sure [14:51] or [14:51] b1 [14:52] w/e :D [14:52] the B1 not the ScottK that is [14:52] once it does clear, rebuilds have to go then or the new image will probably fail [14:53] so busy day... eventually [14:53] right [14:54] bluesabre, elfy: could you try the window previews option in xfwm4-advanced->compositor in alt-tab and tell me what you think about the default size of the previews? [14:54] i could specify the size in greybird too [14:54] depends on whether we think this is ok [14:56] whoops, i bumped our progress quite a bit by linking the 4.12 bugreport to our blueprint :] http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-v/group/topic-v-flavor-xubuntu.html [14:57] ochosi: it seems fine to me [14:57] ochosi: do you mean the preview when alt-tabbing? [14:57] if so - looks fine to me [14:57] and, do we want to use that as default [14:58] I'd say so [14:59] https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xubuntu-staging now has all the changes we'd like to land today [14:59] performance wise there seems to be practically no penalty [14:59] awesome sauce, bluesabre [15:00] the previews can look a bit bulky [15:01] ochosi: looks pretty well balanced here for the desktop - smaller I'd be just seeing a square circle, bigger would look too much [15:01] okeydoke, then i won't add any value in greybird [15:01] (it's based on the 64px icon size i'm already setting there anyway) [15:02] hm isn't this a duplicate? https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1426895 [15:02] Launchpad bug 1426895 in exo (Ubuntu) "exo fails to open webbrowser with link as argument" [Undecided,New] [15:02] yep [15:02] fixed in exo 0.10.3 [15:02] (not uploaded yet) [15:05] bluesabre: you want me to see if it all goes horribly wrong with an update? [15:06] i'm upgrading to the staging pkgs now [15:06] brb [15:07] I guess so then :D [15:11] ochosi, I know you've got other irons in the fire right now, but when you get a chance, can you look at the Appearance and Display doc pages? [15:11] bluesabre: could you indeed at the patch to greybird? i don't wanna do any further changes for now [15:11] jjfrv8: oh nice! i'll take a quick peek now [15:11] ochosi, if you can verify that I've got the screenshots looking right, but also I have some questions on the text on the Appearance page. [15:12] afternoon brainwash :) [15:14] jjfrv8: you can steal some screenshots from the 4.12 tour for the docs btw ;) (esp themes and icons) [15:14] jjfrv8: wrt default fonts, i'm not sure what you're asking me. for fonts there is no diff between gtk2/3 [15:15] I guess I was wondering if I gave correct examples of apps [15:16] the default font is used *everywhere* [15:16] apart from window decorations [15:16] but that's not important/interesting enough to mention there [15:16] ok [15:18] other than that, appearance is good to go from my side [15:18] nice work on that! [15:21] ok, reviewed display settings as well [15:22] i only amended some strings/wordings a little, other than that this one's perfect too! [15:22] thanks a lot jjfrv8 [15:22] i think we can move that over today or whenever we have the rest of the appearance screenshots [15:23] welcome. will make the suggested change to the text and finish the screenshots. let you know when ready. :) [15:25] awesome! [15:25] i'm prepping docs.xfce for the changes as we speak [15:25] well "speak" [15:25] ochosi is talking to himself [15:30] bluesabre: if you're bored, i guess this is something we want in 15.04 https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1307545 [15:30] Launchpad bug 1307545 in xfce4-power-manager (Ubuntu) "Power Manager settings are ignored when closing laptop lid" [Medium,Confirmed] [15:31] elfy: re: stickers, I think we agree that team shouldn't be included, they are our stickers to give out and if we want to give them to -team folks completely outside of any competition we can do that too [15:32] no need for two classes of winners or such a formal thing here [15:32]