[06:05] <larsu> good morning!
[06:18] <happyaron> morning larsu
[06:18] <larsu> hi happyaron!
[07:15] <didrocks> good morning
[09:02] <Laney> ahoy there
[09:02] <larsu> moin Laney
[09:05] <didrocks> morning Laney
[09:05] <Laney> greetings larsu et didrocks
[09:05] <Laney> seems quiet today
[09:05] <larsu> indeed
[09:05] <larsu> so, my fix to gnomed-desktop breaks nautilus
[09:05] <larsu> because it handles device scale as well
[09:05] <larsu> sigh
[09:07] <Laney> :/
[09:08] <Laney> this revert sucks
[09:08] <larsu> bah. my compiled nautilus behaves differently from the one in distro
[09:09] <willcooke> morning desktopers
[09:09] <Laney> hey willcooke
[09:10] <didrocks> morning willcooke
[09:10] <Laney> how's london?
[09:10] <willcooke> Cold and wet
[09:10] <willcooke> \o/
[09:10] <mlankhorst> hooray
[09:10] <mlankhorst> not news!
[09:10] <didrocks> you guys are selling your capital so well
[09:11] <Laney> you can join the club
[09:11] <willcooke> didrocks, can you do me a massive favour and reply-all to that email re: the issues with the store?  I won't have time today and I think it needs to be moved forwards asap
[09:11] <Laney> as a parishater
[09:11] <didrocks> I'll never have a similar speach for Paris… oh wait!
[09:11] <didrocks> willcooke: sure, doing in a few minutes then!
[09:11] <willcooke> didrocks, if you're not happy to - pas de probleme
[09:11] <larsu> didrocks: every English person I've met that doesn't live in London hates London
[09:11] <larsu> morning willcooke
[09:11] <willcooke> I dont hate London, I just dont like the weather so much :)
[09:12] <larsu> do you like it though?
[09:12] <willcooke> Erm,  I like to visit
[09:13] <willcooke> Dont think I could work here everyday
[09:13] <willcooke> or live here
[09:13] <larsu> didrocks: [rephrased] every English person I've met that doesn't live in London doesn't quite like London
[09:13] <willcooke> haha!
[09:13] <larsu> ;)
[09:14] <didrocks> heh :)
[09:15] <larsu> is noone running unitz on hidpi?
[09:15]  * larsu wonders why nobody noticed our atrocious background rendering
[09:16] <didrocks> larsu: maybe people having hdpi thought it was pixel art
[09:17] <larsu> didrocks: I made a white test wallpaper with some black pixels in a 1×1 grid. It's all blurry :(
[09:17]  * larsu should complain less and fix more
[09:18] <Laney> does gnome get it right?
[09:19]  * larsu checks
[09:23] <larsu> Laney: hm, can't switch to a gnome session
[09:23] <larsu>  /usr/share/xsessions/gnome.desktop exists...
[09:23] <Laney> can't how?
[09:24] <larsu> in lightdm
[09:24] <Laney> like no option?
[09:24] <larsu> ya
[09:24] <larsu> ah wait, those are the wrong files
[09:24]  * larsu ponders what to install
[09:24] <darkxst> gnome-session
[09:24] <larsu> no
[09:25] <larsu> that's not enough
[09:25] <darkxst> it should be, provided you have gnome-shell as well
[09:26] <didrocks> larsu: do you have /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/gnome.session?
[09:26] <larsu> wow. how many of those things do we have?
[09:26] <didrocks> (normally, that doesn't prevent the session to shows up in lightdm though)
[09:26] <didrocks> well
[09:26] <didrocks> there is the session "session"
[09:26] <larsu> darkxst: that's what I meant by "it's not enough"... ;)
[09:26] <didrocks> there is the gnome-session "session"
[09:27] <didrocks> (I'm culpurit of the second)
[09:27] <larsu> which ones are the files lightdm looks at? /usr/share/xsession/*.desktop, right?
[09:27] <didrocks> yeah, if you don't have the session, that's weird
[09:27] <didrocks> should be that one
[09:27] <didrocks> there is a condition though
[09:27] <didrocks> let me look
[09:27] <larsu> why doesn't gnome-session pull in gnome-shell, for example?
[09:27] <didrocks> larsu: TryExec=gnome-shell
[09:28] <darkxst> it was causinga  circular dep
[09:28] <didrocks> do you have the gnome-shell bin installed?
[09:28] <larsu> I do now
[09:28] <didrocks> ok, I guess restart lightdm
[09:28] <didrocks> the TryExec is evaluated at lightdm startup IIRC
[09:29] <didrocks> (and as you can see, this calls Exec=gnome-session --session=gnome)
[09:29] <larsu> unity-greeter theming seems to have broken again
[09:29] <larsu> didrocks: ya, working now
[09:29] <larsu> didrocks: thanks
[09:29] <didrocks> yw!
[09:29] <didrocks> and, keep in mind that unity needs gnome-shell
[09:29] <didrocks> oupss
[09:29] <didrocks> gnome-session
[09:30] <didrocks> so, if gnome-session was depending on gnome-shell…
[09:30] <larsu> it does? it wasn't installed for me
[09:30] <didrocks> (first, I wrote "g-s depending on g-s")
[09:30] <darkxst> didrocks, no, unity uses gnome-session-common (or -bin)
[09:30] <didrocks> ah, that changed
[09:30] <didrocks> ok, I guess gnome-session should recommends gnome-shell
[09:31] <larsu> didrocks: I agree
[09:31] <didrocks> darkxst: deps on one side, recommends on the other is fine
[09:31] <Laney> why?
[09:31] <didrocks> Laney: the package contains /usr/share/xsessions/gnome.desktop
[09:31] <Laney> If you want shell, install shell
[09:31] <didrocks> and /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/gnome.session
[09:31] <didrocks> and that's mostly it
[09:31] <didrocks> so, 2 components deeply linked to gnoe-shell
[09:31] <Laney> so shell should depend on it
[09:31] <didrocks> gnome-shell
[09:32] <larsu> Laney: to answer your question: gnome gets it wrong as well
[09:32] <Laney> /o\
[09:32] <didrocks> well, in that case, we can remove "gnome-shell" binary package
[09:32]  * didrocks doesn't think /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf.d/50-ubuntu.conf should be part of this
[09:32] <didrocks> and that's it for this package
[09:33] <xnox> Laney: on unity7 desktop which process handles the alt-f2?
[09:33] <Laney> dunno
[09:33] <Laney> probably unity
[09:34] <didrocks> xnox: unity-lens-applications
[09:34] <xnox> things launched from there lack environment that is set via user-session upstart and/or possibly gnome-session.
[09:34] <xnox> didrocks: thanks.
[09:34] <didrocks> xnox: enjoy my vala code :p
[09:34] <xnox> didrocks: hm, i don't have that running here.
[09:34] <xnox> didrocks: is it still lens in 14.04 LTS?
[09:35] <didrocks> xnox: that was renamed commands.scope
[09:35] <xnox>  /usr/bin/unity-scope-loader applications/applications.scope applications/scopes.scope commands.scope ?
[09:35] <didrocks> but it's still the same package
[09:35] <xnox> didrocks: ok, and what launches that?
[09:35] <xnox> cause it's missing environment variables =(
[09:35] <didrocks> xnox: dbus-activated through unity
[09:36] <didrocks> IIRC
[09:36] <darkxst> didrocks, 50-ubuntu.conf is in ubuntu-session also
[09:36] <Laney> gegls from outer space
[09:36] <xnox> didrocks: right, so i should be uploading enviromental variables into dbus.... however that is not in trusty's environemnt
[09:36] <didrocks> Laney: there are 2 more easter eggs :)
[09:36] <didrocks> xnox: agreed
[09:38] <xnox> didrocks: what about gnome-session variables?
[09:39] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[09:39] <xnox> didrocks: Laney: it's funny how ctrl-alt-T, clicking gnome-terminal has the env, and alt-f2 xterm does not.
[09:39] <didrocks> xnox: I think simply everything that are set to the process (so, including gnome-session variables) when you control+alt+t should be into those processes
[09:39] <xnox> SSH_AGENT is in question here.
[09:39] <didrocks> xnox: they got it at first, before being dbus-activated
[09:39] <xnox> can anyone give me a gnome-session set variable?
[09:39] <didrocks> but yeah, once it's been transitioned, I guess, that's lost
[09:40] <didrocks> xnox: XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=Unity for instance
[09:40] <didrocks> hey seb128
[09:40] <didrocks> let me ensure, one sec
[09:40] <xnox> didrocks: ok that one is set in alt-f2 xterm. horum.
[09:41] <didrocks> xnox: one sec, it's maybe not set by it if already present
[09:41] <seb128> hey didrocks ;-)
[09:42] <xnox> didrocks: where is this scope thing again - apps?!
[09:42] <didrocks> xnox: yeah, the unity-lens-applications package
[09:42] <darkxst> XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP is set by the DM, and passed through gnome-session I think
[09:43] <didrocks> yeah, it's only set if it wasn't set beforehand
[09:43] <didrocks> xnox: GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID
[09:43] <didrocks> not used anymore, but set by gnome-session
[09:44] <xnox> didrocks: upstart jobs set that as well, as far as i know. but let me see if i the value is different.
[09:44] <xnox> no it's same.
[09:48] <didrocks> weird that we reset it
[09:48] <didrocks> there is really no value in doing this
[09:48] <Laney> False
[09:48] <xnox> didrocks: yes there is.
[09:49] <xnox> didrocks: Qt looks like Windows 95 without it.
[09:49] <Laney>   [ Iain Lane ]
[09:49] <Laney>   * xsession-init: Set $GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID if we are launching a
[09:49] <Laney>     gnome-session session. Some applications (Qt4) require this to be set to
[09:49] <Laney>     any value to detect the environment in use. It was historically set by
[09:49] <Laney>     gnome-session but now this is no longer the root of the session so not all
[09:49] <Laney>     user processes are guaranteed to have it. (LP: #1305294)
[09:49] <xnox> didrocks: hm..... i'm failing to see how things are actually execed from the scope =(
[09:50] <didrocks> waow "nice"
[09:51] <xnox> didrocks: hm. i think /usr/bin/unity-scope-loader should be managed by upstart in the user session to have the right env
[09:51] <xnox> it's dbus activated at the moment as it has UPSTART_JOB=dbus env variable.
[09:52] <didrocks> xnox: yeah, I don't know at all about those changes (I wasn't in charge of unity when they did that change), maybe ask thorst?
[09:52] <xnox> hm. or it can call into upstart dbus api and do "list-env" and then import that.
[09:53] <xnox> is even the lens actually launching things? or does it simply hand over result to shell to launch stuff?!
[09:53] <didrocks> xnox: it was launching things at the time, let me have a look if this changed
[09:53] <xnox> AppInfo.launch_default_for_uri
[09:53] <xnox> Process.spawn_async
[09:53] <didrocks> yep
[09:54] <xnox>  /* Activation of standard application:// uris */
[09:55]  * xnox ponders if i should just strace it....
[09:56] <xnox> didrocks: to many if/else blocks.... if feels like half of the code there is unreachable.
[09:57] <larsu> xnox: g_desktop_app_info_launch() launches whatever's in the Exec= key or dbus-activates the application if it supports that
[09:57] <larsu> no clue why the scope would do anything but call that...
[09:57] <xnox> larsu: well i can type ~/bin/foobar in alt-f2 window.
[09:58] <larsu> oh, this is about alt+f2
[09:58] <xnox> larsu: yes.
[09:58]  * larsu apologizes
[09:58] <xnox> larsu: app_info_launched things seem to have the right env.
[09:58] <larsu> xnox: right, but alt+f2 shouldn't use that
[09:58] <xnox> larsu: didrocks: ok this is crazy ->
[09:59] <xnox> Super -> "xterm" -> Enter = has SSH_AGENT
[09:59] <xnox> Alt+F2 -> "xterm" -> Enter = does not
[10:00] <didrocks> xnox: I guess, really ask the unity API team, not sure if it's maybe just one data missing when they changed to activated scope
[10:01] <larsu> xnox: so Alt+f2 isn't passing the same env as g_desktop_app_info_launch() is
[10:01] <larsu> maybe the scope guys should fix that :)
[10:03] <xnox> bug #1433013
[10:05] <xnox> didrocks: larsu: Laney: i guess I'll experiment with launching the scope loader via initctl start, such that it has the right env.
[10:06] <larsu> xnox: I assume the env is there, otherwise g_desktop_app_info_launch() wouldn't have it. I bet whatever handles alt+f2 just doesn't pass it along
[10:08] <xnox> larsu: i get to differ $ cat /proc/`pgrep -f unity-scope-loader`/environ | grep -a SSH
[10:08] <xnox> is empty
[10:11] <larsu> xnox: it's gotta come from somewhere thoguh
[10:12] <xnox> initctl list-env has it.
[10:14] <xnox> larsu: ok, so changing the dbus to do Exec=start unity-scope-application, and moving the process to an upstart job works. And then xterm launched via alt-f2 works and has ssh environment.
[10:14] <xnox> i'll make a patch for that, and will have to see if that gets accepted.
[10:15] <larsu> xnox: shouldn't unity-scope-application inherit the environment from dbus, which is already upstart?
[10:16] <xnox> jodh: http://upstart.ubuntu.com/wiki/Stanzas is not feeling good
[10:16] <xnox> larsu: it does, but after dbus is execed, upstart's environment is modified, and it modifies the dbus process environment table, but that doesn't propagate to dbus' children.
[10:17] <xnox> larsu: if dbus child is moved to be a direct upstart child, it will mangle said childs environ
[10:17] <xnox> when people do $ initctl set-env foo=bar
[10:17]  * xnox tests
[10:17] <larsu> xnox: that's what org.freedesktop.DBus.UpdateActivationEnvironment is for
[10:17] <xnox> larsu: is that in 14.04?
[10:18] <larsu> xnox: dunno
[10:18]  * xnox thought that was added only recently
[10:18] <larsu> it was, but I don't know when
[10:18] <larsu> but running 'start' in an Exec line sounds hacky to me
[10:18] <xnox> hm. initctl set-env didn't propagate to newly execed xterm via alt-f2..... not good.
[10:19] <xnox> larsu: looks like there is UpdateActivationEnvironemt....
[10:19] <xnox> in trusty
[10:19] <larsu> \o/
[10:20] <xnox> larsu: there is no get activation environment though..... =(
[10:21] <larsu> why do you need that?
[10:21] <xnox> larsu: to check what it currently is.
[10:21] <larsu> well yeah
[10:21] <larsu> but why do you want to do that
[10:22] <xnox> to trace the SSH_* variable =)
[10:22] <larsu> oh, for debugging
[10:22] <xnox> yeah.
[10:25] <larsu> xnox: just activate some process and inspect its env ;)
[10:25] <larsu> like a terminal...
[10:32] <jodh> xnox: ergh. thanks, I'll report that...
[10:37] <xnox> 'GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.canonical.Unity.Scope.Dima was not provided by any .service files'
[10:37]  * xnox gives up
[10:47] <xnox> ok everything works, as long as initctl set-env does a call to dbus to update activation environment.
[10:47] <xnox> i can do that at post in each job or patch upstart
[14:19] <Laney> aha
[14:25] <Laney> who knows where I can get the iso smoke testsuite scripts from?
[14:29] <mvo> seb128: I'm looking into that software-center issue now, no need for dobey to duplicate work, its under control
[14:29] <mvo> seb128: looks like its a server side issue
[14:30] <Laney> bah
[14:30] <Laney> jibel: yo
[14:30] <dobey> willcooke: ^^
[14:30] <Laney> if I want to change https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/vivid/view/Smoke%20Testing/job/vivid-desktop-amd64-smoke-default/130/ this testsuite
[14:30] <willcooke> oh
[14:30] <Laney> where do I get it from?
[14:30] <willcooke> dobey, thanks
[14:35] <didrocks> happyaron: FYI, we approximatly gained 5M thanks to the fcitx switch and removal of ibus-pinyin, so size-wise, it's cool :)
[14:35] <didrocks> Laney: seb128 ^
[14:35] <didrocks> (compressed size)
[14:35] <Laney> gaining 5M isn't that great
[14:36] <didrocks> gained in the term of "less"
[14:36] <Laney> HAHA
[14:36] <didrocks> Laney: I wouldn't be that enthousiast if we grew by 5M :)
[14:36] <Laney> that is innovative use of english
[14:37] <didrocks> Laney: yeah, I see as well always this contradiction as well with "false positive"
[14:37] <mvo> willcooke: hi, happy to give you a update on the issue if you want
[14:37] <didrocks> (see how seb and I use it)
[14:37] <Laney> I thought you mean that it's okay because it is only 5 megs
[14:38] <didrocks> no no, it's ok because the image size + some manual adjustement to compensate the seed changes is approx 5M :)
[14:39] <Laney> good times
[14:40] <willcooke> mvo, could you reply-all the email, keep everyone in the loop
[14:41] <Laney> jibel: found it!
[14:41] <Laney> 'usit' ...
[14:42] <Laney> didrocks: btw this is a machine ID thing again
[14:42] <Laney> did you decide to symlink the old file?
[14:43] <didrocks> Laney: we didn't decide on anything to do on this. Do you have the case details leading to no machine ID file for dbus?
[14:44] <didrocks> (I really think the symlink is what makes sense, just need to decide where this should be done… I would say in the .service file)
[14:45] <Laney> It'll fall back to using the systemd one
[14:46] <Laney> also dbus-uuidgen --ensure will make this symlink
[14:46] <mvo> willcooke: sure, just did that after I saw your mail about it
[14:47] <willcooke> mvo, thank you!
[14:47] <didrocks> Laney: so, what's the bug is? (if it fallbacks successfully?)
[14:47] <didrocks> only the tests making the wrong assertion?
[14:47] <Laney> tests look for the old path
[14:48] <Laney> dunno if any software does
[14:49] <didrocks> *hem* oneconf probably *hem*
[14:50] <seb128> didrocks, nice!
[14:51] <didrocks> I hope the "nice" was for the won megs on the iso, not my last statement :p
[14:51] <didrocks>             with open('/var/lib/dbus/machine-id') as fp:
[14:51] <didrocks>                 hostid = fp.read()[:-1]
[14:52] <didrocks> Laney: yeah, we do have *excellent* software doing this ^
[14:53] <Laney> happy symlinking ;-)
[14:53] <didrocks> Laney: want me to deal with this?
[14:53] <didrocks> sounds quite trivial
[14:53] <Laney> if you don't mind
[14:53] <Laney> although the unit is upstream
[14:53] <Laney> :)
[14:53] <didrocks> sure (not right now, but will do)
[14:53] <didrocks> ah?
[14:54] <didrocks> they use dbus-uuidgen --ensure in the unit?
[14:54] <Laney> no
[14:54] <Laney> that is what you'd add
[14:54] <didrocks> yep
[14:54]  * didrocks just need to think if we should use that or provide the symlink manually (as it's in the boot path)
[14:55] <didrocks> I'll do some tests
[14:55] <Laney> the upstart job and init script just ran the program
[14:55] <didrocks> ok, anyway with kdbus coming, maybe doesn't worth trying to optimize this now
[14:56] <didrocks> is there a bug for those failing tests?
[14:57] <Laney> dunno
[14:57] <Laney> I'm going to fix that part anyway
[14:58] <didrocks> yeah, sounds more future-proof
[14:59] <desrt> kdbus is coming?  when?
[15:00] <larsu> whenever this canadian guy finishes writing support for it in some fringe library
[15:01] <Laney> bregma's supporting it in nux?
[15:01] <larsu> Trevinho: do you know why compiz doesn't render the background on unity? Because it doesn't handle the gradients?
[15:01] <desrt> larsu: i'm still waiting for a round of lkml patch review that doesn't turn into a total bloodbath :p
[15:02] <Trevinho> larsu: where?
[15:02] <larsu> desrt: last I heard was that it's as good as in
[15:02] <larsu> Trevinho: err, what?
[15:02] <desrt> larsu: did you hear that from lennart? :)
[15:02] <Trevinho> larsu: I mean, I'm not sure I understood what you mean
[15:02] <larsu> desrt: maybe‽
[15:03] <larsu> Trevinho: ah sorry. Right now, nautilus renders the background wallpaper in unity. We're patching it to do that because upstream stopped
[15:04] <Trevinho> larsu: ok, right...
[15:04] <desrt> in any case, i'm unlikely to spend more time working on kdbus until i have an actual API to target
[15:04] <larsu> Trevinho: and I'm pretty sure that compiz could render the background for us. Just wondering why it doesn't
[15:04] <larsu> desrt: fair enough
[15:05] <bregma> larsu, because nobody has fixed the Compiz wallpaper plugin in the last 5 years
[15:05] <Trevinho> larsu: mh, I don't know exactly the reason.. I guess it was an historic deicsion as in the past every desktop had its "desktop-bg app", and thus to keep modularity
[15:06] <bregma> also, Compiz does not support placing icons on the desktop and handling them as if it were a file browser
[15:06] <larsu> bregma: right, nautilus can keep doing that on a transparent window
[15:07] <larsu> bregma: I'm not saying we should go that route. Just wondering why we aren't
[15:07] <Trevinho> yeah, in fact... can be done at app lelve...
[15:07]  * larsu had to fix some hidpi issues in that code today
[15:07] <larsu> and it's still badly broken
[15:07] <Laney> does it support gnome's interface?
[15:07] <Laney> work with solid colours and gradients and stuff?
[15:07] <larsu> Laney: ya, I suspect it doesn't
[15:07]  * Laney would guess it is problems like this
[15:09] <bregma> we could revivie the Compiz wallpaper plugin to do the drawing, but the code has not been touched since 2009 and has not been ported to GLES
[15:10] <larsu> bregma: I think fixing the remaining issue in gnome-desktop is ok for now, but we might think about that if we want more features
[15:11] <larsu> or if we want more performant bg transitiosn
[15:11]  * didrocks is particularly afraid by the extended combinations of transformations as well to support
[15:11] <larsu> didrocks: transformations?
[15:12] <didrocks> larsu: the crop/scale/extends…
[15:12] <didrocks> (basically the various cases in libgnome-desktop
[15:13] <larsu> didrocks: wouldn't it be awesome if we did them on graphics hardware instead of the cpu?
[15:13] <larsu> same for the gradients
[15:13] <didrocks> seems you want to bother this poor GPU… :)
[15:14] <bregma> I lie, the COmpiz wallpaper plugin was ported to GLES (according to https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheets/d/1tiCs1CLXZB386-6TtD_bJsWHeMBJRjNVr8D14VVFHcY/edit#gid=0), maybe it's worth playing with for the 15.10 timeframe
[15:14] <larsu> didrocks: lol
[15:14] <larsu> bregma: I want animated wallpapers!
[15:14] <larsu> and FIRE
[15:14] <Laney> \o/
[15:15] <bregma> I want world peace and a cure for cancer
[15:15] <bregma> and a second pony, the first one is too small
[15:15] <larsu> how important is that related to animated wallpapers?
[15:15] <Trevinho> :)
[15:16] <desrt> larsu: world peace, or the pony?
[15:16]  * didrocks wouldn't say a world, been there in 98…
[15:16] <didrocks> word*
[15:17] <Laney> the world was peaceful in 1998?
[15:17] <didrocks> France won world cup
[15:17] <didrocks> that's the only thing I remember
[15:17] <didrocks> (and this is what people still refers here)
[15:18] <didrocks> (sad that I hate soccer)
[15:18] <desrt> world cup in taking dives, right?
[15:18] <Laney> I got my first laptop!
[15:18] <didrocks> desrt: pfffff
[15:18] <larsu> Laney: pretty sure I've seen you with a laptop before
[15:19] <didrocks> man… it's not Friday
[15:19] <desrt> larsu: in 98...
[15:19] <didrocks> that was obviously trolling
[15:19] <larsu> desrt: </makingajoke>
[15:19] <desrt> didrocks: dunno.  it's IRC.  context is easily lost.
[15:19] <didrocks> or is desrt trolling larsu in faking not understanding?
[15:19] <didrocks> and so, I got trolled?
[15:19] <didrocks> :)
[15:19] <desrt> and larsu is a nice guy.  i don't think he would troll like that outside of friday.
[15:19] <Laney> wow
[15:19] <Laney> was googling for the scheme that gave me it
[15:20] <larsu> desrt: that was the point of the joke...
[15:20] <Laney> my school's gone all out for Microsoft
[15:20] <Laney> http://cambridgeppf.org/vision/3/stevens.pdf
[15:20] <didrocks> Laney: planning to burn your diploma? :)
[15:20] <larsu> oh wow: http://www.newyorker.com/business/currency/the-gnu-manifesto-turns-thirty
[15:21] <Laney> https://www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=306195
[15:22] <Laney> What emerged during the first year of the pilot scheme was a renewed enthusiasm for learning. According to Valerie Winch, the students' form tutor, "their interest factor has quadrupled and their motivation has gone through the roof."
[15:22] <Laney> \o/
[15:23] <desrt> Laney: i suspect faulty calibration of interestfactorometors
[15:23] <Laney> no shit
[15:23] <Laney> we rapidly discovered (a) instant messaging (2) console emulators
[15:30] <didrocks> meeting time!
[15:30] <mlankhorst> :o
[15:30] <mlankhorst> no just wait 10 minutes, need to run!
[15:30] <mlankhorst> brb
[15:30] <didrocks> attente_, desrt, dgadomski, happyaron, FJKong, Laney, larsu, mlankhorst, qengho, Sweet5hark1, tkamppeter: hey!
[15:30] <seb128> hey :-)
[15:31] <didrocks> mlankhorst: if you are not around, I'll just get to you later on
[15:31] <Laney> HELLO
[15:31] <Laney> I AM HERE FOR THE MEETING
[15:31] <FJKong> hello
[15:31] <Laney> AT THE START OF IT
[15:31] <dgadomski> hey o/
[15:31] <desrt> didrocks is the new boss?
[15:31] <didrocks> #startmeeting
[15:31] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 17 15:31:15 2015 UTC.  The chair is didrocks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:31] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:31] <attente_> hi
[15:31]  * didrocks notes down Laney's remark :)
[15:31]  * larsu never experienced passive aggressive Laney 
[15:32] <Laney> just making sure man
[15:32] <larsu> :D
[15:32] <Laney> got my ass handed to me last week
[15:32]  * larsu remembers
[15:32] <didrocks> ahah, seems seb128 was really upseting you! :)
[15:32] <larsu> you should have subtly pinged seb128 in there
[15:32] <didrocks> let's start
[15:32] <didrocks> #topic attente_
[15:32] <didrocks> attente_: hey!
[15:33] <attente_> stop u-s-d and u-c-c from pulling in fcitx-bin on dist-upgrade, which was causing it to become default...
[15:33] <attente_> i've got ibus somewhat running under mir, but it requires a lot of user intervention and the candidate window needs debugging
[15:33] <seb128> Laney, nice to see you are on time for the meeting for once
[15:33] <seb128> :-)
[15:33] <desrt> seb128: ya.  i was surprised too.
[15:33] <Laney> didrocks: take control of these guys
[15:34] <didrocks> Laney: not really, I find that funny :)
[15:34] <didrocks> attente_: did you put on a wiki the necessary steps for setting up ibus under mir?
[15:34] <attente_> didrocks: no, i can write them up though. it is really not user friendly...
[15:35] <larsu> step 1) chown some device node to get mir running
[15:35] <didrocks> attente_: well, once think you made enough progress, it would probably be worthwile to write that down so that we can maybe help there in the automation
[15:35] <didrocks> (just an idea)
[15:36] <didrocks> attente_: anything else? (are you done?)
[15:36] <attente_> didrocks: that's it
[15:36] <didrocks> thanks attente_
[15:36] <didrocks> #topic desrt
[15:36] <desrt> sorry
[15:36] <didrocks> hey desrt
[15:36] <desrt> gotta run
[15:36] <desrt> back in 10
[15:36] <didrocks> #troll
[15:37] <desrt> i meant 10 seconds
[15:37] <desrt> anyway
[15:37] <desrt> last week i did mostly cleanup of documentation stuff in preparation for the release
[15:37] <desrt> wasted a lot of time trying to understand the weird hybrid of docbook/markdown that's in gtk-doc, then wrote some patches to fix things up
[15:37] <desrt> and did some fixes in glib itself
[15:38] <desrt> we're now at a spot where we have (almost) no warnings on building the docbook xml, so i hope to enable that by default (and throw errors when it fails) by the next release
[15:38] <desrt> i also did releases yesterday
[15:38] <desrt> and i've been working on my jhbuild-in-debootstrap-chroot stuff as well
[15:38] <desrt> that's all
[15:38] <didrocks> desrt: mind fixing systemd docbook xml as well while you are at it, seems you love that? (there are still some warnings ;))
[15:39] <desrt> i don't actually enjoy this :p
[15:39] <desrt> but uh... we always have problems with missing new symbols in glib documentation
[15:39] <desrt> and nobody notices because they're lost in the raft of other warnings
[15:39] <desrt> so we really needed to get on top of that....
[15:39]  * larsu never has this problem
[15:39] <desrt> naturally, larsu is #1 offender
[15:39] <didrocks> yeah, would be nice to be able to stop missing symbols in documentation :)
[15:39] <desrt> (...tied with everyone else)
[15:39] <didrocks> nice work desrt, even if tedious!
[15:40] <desrt> fin.
[15:40]  * didrocks got the last word as if it was a familiar language
[15:40] <didrocks> #topic dgadomski
[15:40] <didrocks> dgadomski: hey, anything to share with us this week?
[15:40] <dgadomski> hello guys
[15:40] <dgadomski> refactoring and cleaning up patch for bug #1337873
[15:40] <dgadomski> trying to get some support from upstream for kernel feature backport (bug #1104230)
[15:41] <dgadomski> verifying cyphermox's fix for bug #1386131 (waiting for actual user's preseed file to test it 'in the wild') - looks good so far
[15:41] <didrocks> nice! anything needed from us?
[15:42] <dgadomski> my email to the desktop mailing list about the mount options in nautilus still lacks response, seb128 was saying about providing some feedback to start a discussion
[15:42] <dgadomski> I would appreciate that if possible
[15:42] <didrocks> dgadomski: noting down, today he's at a sprint, but we will look at it tomorrow
[15:42] <dgadomski> cool, thanks
[15:43] <dgadomski> that's all from me today
[15:43] <didrocks> thanks dgadomski!
[15:43] <didrocks> #topic happyaron
[15:43] <didrocks> happyaron: hey, around?
[15:44] <desrt> if willcooke was running this meeting, he'd have the notes for pasting
[15:44] <desrt> just saying....
[15:44] <didrocks> desrt: I got some, but none from happyaron
[15:44] <didrocks> (fw by willcooke)
[15:44] <desrt> if willcooke was running this meeting, he'd have made some up!
[15:44] <didrocks> not sure if he got them too late
[15:44] <didrocks> ahah
[15:44] <didrocks> well:
[15:44] <didrocks> - make fcitx installed on the live
[15:45] <didrocks> - MIR for cmake-extra
[15:45] <didrocks> .
[15:45] <didrocks> DONE ;)
[15:45] <desrt> not bad ;)
[15:45] <didrocks> and all true!
[15:45] <desrt> ya.  that's the impressive part :)
[15:45] <didrocks> #topic FJKong
[15:45] <FJKong> hey
[15:45] <FJKong> continue pinyin searching now need find a key value database to store result of converting, optimize speed of converting
[15:45] <didrocks> FJKong: around? I don't have fake notes for you though :p
[15:45] <FJKong> locate problem of bug :fcitx cpu 100% in calling of dbus
[15:45] <FJKong> utuntu phone env setup and learn how to start to make a scope
[15:46] <Laney> he also fixed presage to not pull more stuff into main
[15:46] <didrocks> FJKong: oh, some scope hacking, enjoy :)
[15:46] <didrocks> FJKong: should we be concerned about the fcitx cpu bug?
[15:47] <FJKong> didrocks: I think it is cause by sogou module
[15:47] <didrocks> FJKong: keep us posted,now that fcitx is installed by default, in case is triggered by $anything
[15:47] <FJKong> so only in these who install sogou input method
[15:47] <didrocks> ok, sounds at least located, if you need help, do not hesitate
[15:48] <FJKong> didrocks: thanks
[15:48] <didrocks> yw, thanks!
[15:48] <didrocks> #topic Laney
[15:48]  * larsu wonders if Laney is even here
[15:48] <desrt> didrocks: he went for a walk ;)
[15:48] <didrocks> larsu: was going to write approx. the same :)
[15:48]  * desrt watches Laney rack up the points with each passing moment
[15:48] <Laney> :)
[15:49] <larsu> we should all stop making the same jokes
[15:49] <Laney> I was finding a cool unicode symbol
[15:49] <Laney> think I've topped all others
[15:49] <Laney> • Package new wallpapers
[15:49] <Laney> • Updates gdk-pixbuf pinta gvfs empathy intltool (in Debian too)
[15:49] <Laney> • Stab at failing image builds
[15:49] <Laney> ∘ qtquickcontrols MIR & testsuite fixes
[15:49] <Laney> ∘ fonts-* stuff
[15:49] <Laney> ∘ test failure blocking promotion from pending to current
[15:49] <Laney> • Discussions about how best to do fcitx by default for zh
[15:49] <Laney> • Merge patch to runtime detect spam software in evo
[15:49] <Laney> • Poke about making sure MSN and FB chat are disabled
[15:49] <Laney> • FFes and fun stuff like that
[15:49] <Laney> ℻
[15:49] <larsu> haha
[15:49] <didrocks> nice unicode char :)
[15:50] <didrocks> thanks for looking at the failing image builds btw, nice to get some
[15:50] <desrt> as in "and those are the ℻  about what i've been working on" ?
[15:50] <desrt> or is there some other meaning to this word?
[15:50]  * larsu mumbles something about the late 80s
[15:51] <didrocks> larsu: while you are mumbling, it's your turn!
[15:51] <didrocks> #topic larsu
[15:51] <larsu> theming week again \o/
[15:51] <Laney> there's also ㍶ btw
[15:51] <larsu> well, at least partly: I played around a lot trying to make totem's osd look nice
[15:52] <larsu> couldn't get anything good (turns out I'm not a visual designer) so I went all minimal
[15:52] <larsu> also finished up the titlebar branch a bit
[15:52] <Laney> what did -doc say?
[15:52] <larsu> nothing yet?
[15:52] <Laney> ok?
[15:52] <larsu> I think my ffe exception mail is still in some moderator queue
[15:52] <larsu> at least I didn't get a response
[15:53] <larsu> there was also quite some discussion about headerbar styling (again) this week
[15:53] <larsu> and gedit (again)
[15:53] <larsu> with no result (again)
[15:53] <didrocks> :(
[15:54] <didrocks> larsu: on -doc, IIRC, dpm has some moderation power on the ML, maybe ping him? (I may be wrong)
[15:54] <larsu> dpm: ping ^^
[15:54] <dpm> didrocks, larsu, I don't think I've got admin on that list, just ubuntu-translators
[15:55] <didrocks> larsu: got luck with the moderators hunting then!
[15:55] <didrocks> thanks dpm :)
[15:55] <dpm> sorry I couldn't help much
[15:55] <desrt> larsu: could always just join the list?
[15:56] <didrocks> yeah, let's try to get it moving, larsu tell us if you need help, I can look if I got some archives about who did what on that list
[15:56] <didrocks> ok, let's move on
[15:56] <larsu> bah sorry connection troubles
[15:57] <didrocks> no worry, anything to add?
[15:57] <larsu> something's wrong with this machine's wifi
[15:57] <larsu> ya
[15:57] <didrocks> ja*
[15:57] <larsu> did some hacking on gnome-desktop because of a background issue on ubiquity
[15:57] <larsu> in summary: our hidpi wallpaper situation is *bad*
[15:58] <larsu> as in, we scale the image down and back up
[15:58] <larsu> resulting in a blurry bg
[15:58] <larsu> I also started looking into the change password dialog in u-c-c not working, but was distracted by all the previous stuff I mentioned
[15:58] <seb128> larsu, wfm, I used today
[15:58] <seb128> the change pwd
[15:59] <larsu> seb128: oh. Not for me?!
[15:59] <larsu> interesting
[15:59] <seb128> works on my 2 laptops
[15:59] <seb128> including ecryptfs
[15:59] <seb128> so dunno, but let me know if you figure it out ;-)
[15:59] <larsu> apparently it got fixed since I looked at it last week?
[15:59] <larsu> whatevs. I'll have another look

[16:00] <didrocks> thanks larsu
[16:00] <didrocks> #topic qengho
[16:00] <didrocks> qengho: hey, how is going the chromium world?
[16:00] <qengho> It's okay. Jut one item so far this week.
[16:00] <qengho> - Working on chromium pixel-density strangeness. Old Gtk2 tab-bars perhaps fixed, needs testing. Off-screen pop-up windows still a mystery.
[16:00] <qengho> EOF
[16:01] <didrocks> oh, that was will's bug, right?
[16:01] <qengho> The second part is his.
[16:01] <qengho> THe first is a different one.
[16:01] <didrocks> ok, interesting, seems some kind of *dpi week ;)
[16:02] <didrocks> thanks qengho
[16:02] <didrocks> #topic mlankhorst
[16:02] <didrocks> mlankhorst: I gave you some additional minutes, hoping you are back now!
[16:02] <didrocks> (seems so from #ubuntu-devel)
[16:03] <didrocks> ok, let's see if he's back again later
[16:04] <didrocks> #topic tkamppeter
[16:04] <didrocks> tkamppeter: around?
[16:04] <tkamppeter> Yes
[16:04] <tkamppeter> - Organization of the OpenPrinting Summit 2015
[16:04] <tkamppeter> - hplip: Fixed another Python3 transition bug
[16:04] <tkamppeter> - Bugs
[16:04] <tkamppeter> - Moving to Brazil
[16:05] <didrocks> moving to Brazil? nice!
[16:05] <larsu> oh cool!
[16:05] <larsu> tkamppeter: where are you moving to?
[16:05] <desrt> tkamppeter: if you were sick of mitte, you could have tried kreuzburg
[16:05] <larsu> desrt: *kreuzberg
[16:05]  * larsu teaches this guy German all the way from Schlesisches Tor
[16:06] <tkamppeter> Yes, now I am in the middle of the move, the big boxes with the stuff are sent out and I will fly on Friday.
[16:06] <desrt> burg... berg... it's all bahnhof to me
[16:06] <larsu> desrt: you mean castle / mountain
[16:06] <tkamppeter> And a lot of furniture and a car have been sold.
[16:07] <Laney> not the printer collection
[16:07] <didrocks> ahah :)
[16:07] <Laney> dear god please not the printer collection
[16:07] <larsu> tkamppeter: have a safe trip!
[16:07] <didrocks> tkamppeter: good luck with the move!
[16:07] <desrt> tkamppeter: safe travels :)
[16:07] <tkamppeter> It goes to Belo Horizonte, third largest city of Brazil, capital of the state Minas Gerais, birth place of my wife.
[16:07] <desrt> tkamppeter: lots of family there, i guess?
[16:07] <tkamppeter> desrt, I had already moved from Mitte to Pankow earlier.
[16:08] <desrt> tkamppeter: yuck.  no wonder you want to move to another country ;)
[16:08] <desrt> outside the ring, man!!
[16:08] <tkamppeter> The printer collection is partially sold, mainly very old or broken printers, and three printers are in the big box.
[16:08] <larsu> desrt: don't talk down on Pankow.
[16:08] <larsu> desrt: just don't.
[16:09] <desrt> larsu: too close to home?
[16:09] <larsu> no it's actually quite far
[16:09] <larsu> but it's nice there
[16:09] <larsu> my grandparents used to live there
[16:09] <didrocks> let's continue best locations (it's Lyon anyway) discussion later on…
[16:10] <didrocks> thanks tkamppeter, and safe flight!
[16:10] <didrocks> #topic seb128
[16:10] <seb128> hey
[16:10] <tkamppeter> desrt, but it was very close to the ring, so one went more to Prenzlauer Berg for shopping and not to Pankow.
[16:10] <seb128> • updated tbe click chroot code to handle missing upstart (was making sdk env
[16:10] <seb128> creation bug)
[16:10] <seb128> • submitted fix for invalid gvariant ref handling in telephony-service,
[16:10] <seb128> thanks larsu for pointing out the problem
[16:10] <seb128> • helped robert_ancell to get sort out sync/blacklist issues for some
[16:10] <seb128> fonts packages
[16:10] <seb128> • updated uitk example gallery to use valid documentation references
[16:10] <seb128> • reported some issues with the developer website
[16:10] <seb128> • looked more at the gnome-bg hidpi issues
[16:10] <seb128> • ubuntu-system-settings
[16:10] <tkamppeter> Yes, a lot of family in BH.
[16:10] <seb128> ∘ fixed text entries not getting the initial focus in bt pairing dialog
[16:10] <seb128> (and sim forwarding)
[16:10] <seb128> • tried to make the phone advertize over bt as a phone rather than a computer with init scripts but that seems to not work reliably, need to maybe look at a different way to do that (config override?)
[16:10] <seb128> • investigated a bit bluetooth autopairing of input device (not having to confirm the 0000 number manually)
[16:10] <seb128> that's it from me ;-)
[16:10] <seb128> hey from London btw
[16:10] <seb128> thanks didrocks for handling the meeting ;-)
[16:10] <desrt> seb128: say hi to everyone there :)
[16:10]  * didrocks sends some sun to seb128
[16:11] <didrocks> seb128: yw!
[16:11] <seb128> didrocks, oh, sun from the south of France, niiiice
[16:11] <seb128> desrt, k :-)
[16:11]  * desrt waits for it
[16:11] <didrocks> seb128: so previsible
[16:11] <seb128> :p
[16:11] <didrocks> predictable*
[16:11] <desrt> *shrug* http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/previsible
[16:12] <didrocks> seb128: enjoy the rest of meetings there, thanks for stopping by!
[16:12] <seb128> thanks!
[16:12] <didrocks> #topic robert_ancell
[16:13] <didrocks> Worked on:
[16:13] <didrocks> - XMir handover
[16:13] <didrocks> - lightdm SRUs
[16:13] <didrocks> - Indic fonts
[16:13] <didrocks>  Currently working on:
[16:13] <didrocks> - TPM
[16:13] <didrocks> #topic TheMuso
[16:13] <didrocks>  * More unity 7 dash accessibility work.
[16:13] <didrocks> * Begun installer accessibility testing, to ensure no regressions.
[16:13] <didrocks> #topic didrocks
[16:13] <didrocks> Ubuntu Make:
[16:14] <didrocks> - did a minor release with user experience enhancements and bug/tests fixes (more info on https://plus.google.com/+DidierRoche/posts/EP1DNeEkknx)
[16:14] <didrocks> systemd:
[16:14] <didrocks> - upstream discussion on fsckd changes that were needed to be done. Posted patches with the suggestions. All but one were reviewed, waiting for some feedbacks.
[16:14] <didrocks> - worked on nfs-utils/data transitions, waiting now on Steve's answer.
[16:14] <didrocks> - worked on whoopsie and whoopsie-preferences systemd integration followup to fix bugs #1412719 and bugs #1431432. In vivid now. As the transition is quite complex, I would appreciate if someone could test it as well with unity control center.
[16:14] <didrocks> - started to replace during pitti's vacations handling/looking at systemd-related bugs.
[16:14] <didrocks> Misc:
[16:14] <didrocks> - media-hub and cmake-extra MIR review/acking
[16:14] <didrocks> - discussions on MIR process for components nobody doesn't really want to own and archive admin processes (with demotion and promotion of some components to "fix" tracker/grilo-plugins situations).
[16:14] <didrocks> - various fcitx/image size discussions while getting it by default on the live image.
[16:14] <didrocks> .
[16:14] <didrocks> #topic misc
[16:14] <didrocks> any pending questions?
[16:14] <didrocks> hdpi discussions that we need to have? :)
[16:14] <didrocks> or input method?
[16:14] <desrt> anyone know a launchpad hacker? :)
[16:14] <larsu> yes, we do
[16:14] <tkamppeter> Thanks and Obrigado all for the good wishes for my move!
[16:15] <desrt> this is annoying: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/335161
[16:15] <larsu> didrocks: but really, we need a sprint
[16:15] <didrocks> desrt: starts with a c ;)
[16:15] <desrt> sorry.  rather this one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/638498
[16:15] <didrocks> larsu: +1
[16:15] <desrt> it's making it more difficult to support 'jhbuild sysdeps --install' for ubuntu
[16:15] <didrocks> desrt: hum, I think we can get some urls with it, let me check after meeting
[16:16] <didrocks> the first one at least, I don't remember about the checksums
[16:16] <desrt> didrocks: i know the files are online... trouble is they're not listed in the Release file
[16:16] <didrocks> needs to check old CI train code
[16:16] <didrocks> oh really? sounds weird
[16:16] <desrt> ya...
[16:16] <seb128> desrt, try asking cjwatson maybe :-)
[16:16] <didrocks> yeah, that was my c* hint :)
[16:16] <seb128> he moved to launchpad
[16:16] <desrt> interesting
[16:17] <desrt> that sounds very promising indeed :)
[16:17] <Laney> I predict a bzr branch lp:launchpad in desrt's future
[16:17] <seb128> lol
[16:17] <didrocks> Laney: went there as well? :)
[16:17] <desrt> desrt@humber:~$ bzr
[16:17] <desrt> bash: bzr: command not found
[16:17] <desrt> *cough*
[16:17] <didrocks> desrt: if bzr is the issue, there is a cool git plugin :)
[16:17] <Laney> git bzr clone!
[16:17] <desrt> sounds too much like 'git bz'
[16:18] <desrt> anyway... one other piece of business
[16:18] <desrt> i just wanted to say that this meeting was run in an extremely excellent way
[16:18] <desrt> i quite enjoyed it
[16:18] <didrocks> thanks desrt :)
[16:18] <larsu> I'm just happy noone was on strike
[16:18] <didrocks> roh :p
[16:18] <desrt> took me a second ;)
[16:18] <larsu> didrocks: :P Thanks for running the meeting!
[16:19] <didrocks> yw guys!
[16:19] <didrocks> #endmeeting
[16:19] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 17 16:19:14 2015 UTC.
[16:19] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-03-17-15.31.moin.txt
[16:19] <didrocks> thanks everyone :)
[16:19] <larsu> so I think we should talk about headerbars, hidpi, and fcitx now
[16:20] <didrocks> oh, forgot about headbars in this "what to discuss" proposal
[16:20] <didrocks> sorry about it ;)
[16:20] <larsu> ;)
[16:20] <didrocks> headerbars*
[16:20]  * larsu prefers headbars
[16:20] <Laney> ffffffframe extents
[16:20] <attente_> what's to discuss about fcitx?
[16:20] <larsu> Laney: sigh
[16:20] <desrt> ya... we talk about them enough that saving the two extra characters may reduce RSI
[16:20] <Laney> haha
[16:20] <desrt> h7r
[16:21] <larsu> Laney: maybe we should just byte the bullet and patch gtk to not supress the decorations
[16:21]  * didrocks likes h7r
[16:22] <Laney> ...
[16:22] <Laney> let's have a h7r amnesty for a few weeks
[16:24] <seb128> didrocks, so, I'm on a slow box but u-c-c freezes for like 15 seconds when checking the whoopsie box
[16:24] <seb128> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10616144/
[16:24] <seb128> " object_path=0x3e14c70 "/com/ubuntu/WhoopsiePreferences", interface_name=0xffffffffffffffff <error: Cannot access memory at address 0xffffffffffffffff>,
[16:24] <seb128>     interface_name@entry=0x3df7960 "com.ubuntu.WhoopsiePreferences", method_name=0x1 <error: Cannot access memory at address 0x1>,"
[16:24] <seb128> the cannot access memory looks weird to me
[16:25] <didrocks> seb128: waow, everytime?
[16:25] <seb128> yes
[16:25] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'm doing some sync subprocess call
[16:25] <didrocks> that's what I wanted to check
[16:25] <didrocks> I don't think the memory address issue is linked to it
[16:25] <seb128> k
[16:25] <didrocks> but ok, you confirm that can be slow on some box
[16:25] <didrocks> I'll change that logic
[16:26] <larsu> why isn't this in gsettings?
[16:26] <didrocks> larsu: it was some conffiles before, now it's piloting enablement/disablement of a systemd service
[16:26] <didrocks> larsu: and systemd doesn't have a "start if this key is true/false"
[16:27] <larsu> didrocks: maybe we should add that :)
[16:27] <ogra_> +1 ... and while you are at it do the same for the android property service since we will need the same feature on phones
[16:27] <seb128> didrocks, thanks
[16:28] <didrocks> seb128: thank you for testing!
[16:28] <seb128> yw!
[16:29] <larsu> ogra_: what do we need that for?
[16:29] <didrocks> larsu: I think there were some opposition for that
[16:29] <ogra_> larsu, en/disabling system services when the container switches something on/off
[16:29] <didrocks> like for ConditionExec=
[16:29] <larsu> didrocks: color me surprised
[16:30] <larsu> ogra_: ah, this way around. I thought hooking it up to gsettings
[16:30] <ogra_> larsu, drivers and their managing daemons run inside the container ... the properties get set or unset by these daemons, userspace runs completely on the ubuntu side ...
[16:30] <seb128> didrocks, oh, just got a segfault...
[16:30] <ogra_> for upstart we have a "property-bridge" that handles this
[16:30] <didrocks> seb128: if you have a traceback handy… :)
[16:31] <ogra_> larsu, ah, no, no gsettings ... but the feature on the systemd side wouldnt be much different
[16:31] <larsu> indeed
[16:31] <desrt> so.. cjwatson already has a fix that he's testing
[16:31] <didrocks> seb128: the segfault is on the backend, right?
[16:31] <didrocks> seb128: that's the only part I touched
[16:32] <seb128> didrocks, http://paste.ubuntu.com/10616178/
[16:32] <seb128> didrocks, no, u-c-c, but it happens if you go out of the panel before the call returned I guess
[16:32] <cyphermox> dgadomski: could I provide you with a preseed?
[16:32] <seb128> that might not be a new bug
[16:32] <seb128> didrocks, where is the enable/disable status stored?
[16:32] <dgadomski> cyphermox: for testing?
[16:32] <didrocks> seb128: ok, I'm pretty sure something like this already existed
[16:32] <didrocks> seb128: systemd
[16:33] <didrocks> seb128: there is no "intermediate storage" anymore
[16:33] <didrocks> systemctl status whoopsie
[16:33] <dgadomski> cyphermox: sure
[16:33] <seb128> didrocks, oh, ok
[16:33] <seb128> didrocks, it's fine for touch as well?
[16:33] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, it also changes the upstart state
[16:34] <didrocks> I don't know about the first enable/disable feedback
[16:34] <didrocks> but starting/stopping can be async
[16:34] <didrocks> (it wasn't before)
[16:35] <didrocks> so I guess you already had trouble under upstart with this machine
[16:35] <seb128> it's not freezing anymore now, go figure
[16:35] <seb128> didrocks, ok, at least changing value seems to work fine
[16:35] <didrocks> seb128: it should enable/disable + starts/stops
[16:35] <didrocks> seb128: the other settings now changes /etc/whoopsie
[16:36] <didrocks> and /etc/default/whoopsie should be removed on upgrade
[16:36] <didrocks> (and transitioned)
[16:36] <seb128> that one was removed yeah
[16:36] <seb128> I looked in there first
[16:36] <seb128> so seems to work as it should :-)
[16:37] <didrocks> phew, thanks seb128 :)
[16:37] <seb128> yw!
[16:39] <cyphermox> dgadomski: yeah, for testing; I keep the preseed files around, it gets useful
[16:40] <dgadomski> cyphermox: please attach them to any of the lp bugs if applicable
[16:41] <cyphermox> ack
[16:51] <desrt> oh.  one more thing i found recently that's annoying me: 'df' is messed up
[16:52] <desrt> on my utopic system....  and on jessie it seems to be working fine
[16:52] <didrocks> desrt: btrfs?
[16:52] <desrt> it seems that the way that it works is by opening /etc/mtab and then calling stat() on each of the listed mountpoints
[16:53] <desrt> then it removes duplicates, by st_dev comparison
[16:53] <desrt> but (here's the stupid part) it shows the _last_ item for each st_dev
[16:53] <desrt> so if you do a bind mount, it will show the bind mount destination as the mountpoint
[16:53] <desrt> instead of the original one
[16:53] <desrt> so i get stupid output like /srv/mirror    1442015700 351365208 1017377232  26% /home/desrt/jhbuild/jessie-amd64-itstool/srv/mirror