[04:35] <barrydk> More almal
[05:02] <Kilos> hi Tonberry  mazal  barrydk  nlsthzn  inetpro  and others
[05:03] <Kilos> mazal  ek was oor die kole gehaal
[05:03] <mazal> Môre oom
[05:03] <mazal> Hoe so ?
[05:04] <Kilos> wat het gebeer met jou fun ding vir ons site
[05:04] <Tonberry> hi
[05:04] <mazal> Kilos: Kry nie tyd nie. Deur die dag te besig en in die aand probeer ek min tyd op pc screens spandeer. Oge gee in
[05:05] <Kilos> ai!
[05:05] <mazal> Ek sal dalk hom klaarmaak wanneer ek op verlof is.
[05:05] <mazal> My oge is rêrig gedaan. Kan nie meer al die werk op pc hanteer nie
[05:05] <Kilos> doen jou beste asb seun
[05:05] <Kilos> dis deel van oud word ne
[05:06] <mazal> Het nie gedink iemand gee rerig om nie , ek het nie eers een reply gekry nie
[05:06] <Kilos> dis omdat almal besig is met ander goed ook
[05:07] <mazal> Gedink almal is net werk werk werk hier en niemand mind van fun nie lol :)
[05:07] <Kilos> natuurlink gee ons om, dis belangrik wat jy doen want dis al wat ubuntu kort nog, die games ding
[05:08] <mazal> Party aande is dit 'n mission net om mail te lees , ek begin erg sukkel oom
[05:08] <Kilos> jy moet ander bril kry seun
[05:08] <mazal> Ek het nuwe een gekry , help nie
[05:09] <Kilos> ai!
[05:09] <mazal> En daar is fout met my kop ook. Baie erg dizzyness en kopsere
[05:09] <Kilos> dizzyness as jy vinning opkyk?
[05:09] <mazal> Dan deur die dag tap die werk als uit my uit en in die aand kom ek nie op pc nie
[05:10] <mazal> Veral daai tipe lees en tik werk wat die wiki verg is besonder moeilik teen die tyd wat die aand kom
[05:11] <Kilos> ai!
[05:11] <mazal> Soms raak ek skoon kkorsig dat die sweet sommer uitslaan en kan nie eers regop sit nie :(
[05:11] <Kilos> probeer miskien net elke naweek bietjie doen asb
[05:12] <Kilos> jy is al een wat baie games speel
[05:13] <mazal> My verlof is naby oom , dan sal ek bk werk daaraan in die oggend wanneer ek vars is ;)
[05:13] <Kilos> dankie seun
[05:14] <mazal> 3 Dekades op pc screens begin nou sy tol eis
[05:14] <Kilos> ai!
[05:14] <mazal> Ek kort ander werk , buite lug waar geen screen naby is nie :P
[05:15] <mazal> Geen screens , geen fone , en belangrikste van als , geen users
[05:16] <Kilos> sal kyk of daar plek is vir nog n straat veër
[05:16] <Kilos> hehe
[05:17] <mazal> Solank die besem 'n lang steel het. My rug is ook kapoet
[05:17] <Kilos> ai! jy word nou soos ekke
[05:18] <mazal> Ja nee , oud word is nie maklik nie
[05:18] <Kilos> hoe lank nog voor pensioen?
[05:19] <mazal> 18 jaar , baaaaaaaaaie ver
[05:19] <Kilos> sjoe
[05:19] <mazal> Ek's 42 oor 2 weke
[05:19] <Kilos> sjoe
[05:20] <Kilos> die lewe begin eers op 40 man
[05:20] <mazal> Nie myne nie :(
[05:20] <Kilos> sjoe
[05:21] <mazal> Werk en sport , en nou is dit net skete
[05:21] <Kilos> ai! sorry man
[05:21] <mazal> Knieë is ook gedaan agv al die jare se krieket
[05:21] <mazal> hehehe
[05:22] <Kilos> te veel minetest man
[05:22] <mazal> Ish , hoe het ons op die topic op ge-eindig ? Ek gaan almal skoon depressed maak :P
[05:23] <Kilos> lol
[05:23] <mazal> Ek minetest amper nooit eers meer nie. Skuif net quarries nou en dan
[05:23] <Kilos> sjoe
[05:24] <mazal> Minetest baie kopsere die jaar , baie bugs
[05:24] <mazal> Een probleem na die ander
[05:24] <Kilos> nou vat barrydk  aan die oor en leer hom wat om te doen
[05:24] <mazal> Hy gaan die minetest server run terwyl ek op verlof is :)
[05:25] <mazal> Oom moet sy projek sien wat hy mee besig is
[05:25] <Kilos> nee man leer hom om die wiki goed te doen terwyl jy agter homk staan met n sjambok
[05:25] <mazal> 'n Sorting system met 'n kis vir elke enkele ding in die game. En onthou , ek gebruik dreambuilder , daar is oor die 1800 goed wat jy kan craft en in die inventory
[05:26] <Kilos> sjoe
[05:26] <mazal> So dis 'n 1800+ kis en sorting system netwerk
[05:26] <Kilos> sjoe jy word nou erger as graeme
[05:30] <mazal> Myne is net al die basic goete wat mens actually gebruik
[05:30] <mazal> Dink myne is so 35 in totaal omtrent
[05:30] <Kilos> aha
[05:31] <Kilos> hy het tot planters want auto plant en oes en weer plant
[05:32] <mazal> Ek het net auto oes op sekere goed
[05:32] <mazal> Planters het ek noggie mee gespeel nie
[05:32] <Kilos> sjoe
[06:21] <Symmetria> sup
[06:21] <Kilos> hi Padroni  Symmetria  
[06:21] <Padroni> hi Kilos Symmetria
[06:22] <Symmetria> lol, so, I'm moderating a panel today infront of 800 people
[06:22] <Symmetria> on IT security
[06:22] <Symmetria> and have been handed a dream set of panelists that are just WIDE open for me to ask tough contraversial questions
[06:23] <Symmetria> lol the put a microsoft dev lead on the panel.... heh, I warned him this wasnt gonna be easy on him
[06:26] <Padroni> Sounds like something I would love to see
[06:27] <Symmetria> heh, padroni anyone who knows me knows that its a very dangerous thing to put me as moderator on a panel like this, because for me, a panel that has contraversy and arguments is remebered 
[06:27] <Symmetria> a panel where everyne just chats and agrees is forgotten
[06:27] <Padroni> true that
[06:28] <Symmetria> so I go in there and prepare questions designed to hit below the belt, make people think very carefully before they answer what I say (because half the time my questions are such that I can predict which way the answer is going to go and have a follow up question thats designed to trip them up)
[06:28] <Symmetria> Like "Lets talk about critical infrastructure in a country, what should be classified as critical infrastructure in terms of IT"
[06:28] <Symmetria> and I can guarantee the guy is going to say "All the infrastrucutre of the incumbent mobile provider
[06:29] <Symmetria> at which point Im going to say "Is it not a better idea to force, via regulation, that the incumbent be split into multiple entities to reduce the risk factor of all eggs in one basket"
[06:29] <Symmetria> :P and watch all hell break out
[06:30] <Symmetria> (right before the CEO of the incumbent mobile provider shoots me) lol
[07:30] <Kilos> hi TinuvaMac  
[07:36] <Kilos> hi psyatw  
[07:39] <psyatw> hi Kilos
[07:39] <psyatw> how are you doing?
[07:40] <Kilos> good ty and you
[07:40] <Kilos> wbb
[07:42] <Kilos> hmm...
[07:43] <psyatw> I am also doing all-right
[07:44] <psyatw> just arrived at work
[07:44] <psyatw> ty
[07:44] <Kilos> lol
[07:58] <Padroni> One of these days, a bike swerving through traffic between cars, while driving on the white line, will knock my car. And you will see me on the 20H00 news...
[07:59] <Padroni> Because I will be the one arrested for beating a biker to death with his helmet.
[07:59] <Kilos> lol
[08:59] <Kilos> gmail decides to spam odd mails
[08:59] <Kilos> wwk original is spam in its eyes
[09:19] <SilverCode> why the hell is za.archive.ubuntu.com resolving to an IP in Kenya
[09:20] <Kilos> because the local mirrors are sick
[09:20] <Kilos> so we got them pointed to Symmetria  
[09:21] <SilverCode> ok, because the server I'm getting i sincorectly configured
[09:22] <Kilos> shout at Symmetria  
[09:22] <Kilos> use the neology one so long it works great
[09:23] <Kilos> and always up to date
[09:24] <SilverCode> what is the "closest" to a Neotel Fibre connection?
[09:24] <Kilos> ?
[09:25] <SilverCode> least number of hops between exiting neotel and getting to the server
[09:25] <SilverCode> but I suppose there are only 3 choices, and 1 of them is broken and the other is Telkom
[09:25] <SilverCode> so Neology it is
[09:25] <Kilos> i just use the link in update manager
[09:26] <Kilos> neology is nice and fast
[09:27] <Kilos> you could also get update manager to search for the best site for you but ive had no hassles from neology
[09:27] <Kilos> one of the guys thats here or visits here works there too
[10:01] <Squirm> Morning
[10:01] <Kilos> hi Squirm  
[10:02] <Squirm> Hmm, seems it's afternoon
[10:02] <Squirm> Good afternoon
[10:02] <Kilos> that too ya
[10:02] <Kilos> hi is better it fits in with all times
[10:05] <Squirm> It's always good morning in international chat time
[10:05] <Squirm> Or whatever it's called
[10:05]  * Squirm shrugs
[10:06] <Kilos> lol like i said morning yesterday to dholbach and he had 2 hours to go till midnight
[10:07] <Kilos> now i evening him and peeps on the dark side
[11:00] <mazal> Guys is there something specific ( apart from manually changing settings ) that can break automatic updates ?
[11:00] <mazal> My pc here always does on Tuesday , but today it didn't
[11:01] <mazal> Check the settings and it's still as is
[13:11] <Padroni> laters folks
[13:28] <magespawn> good afternoon
[14:11] <Kilos> ai!
[14:28] <Kilos> sorry guyshead crashed all avy
[14:36] <Kilos> hi kulelu88  
[14:39] <kulelu88> Hey Kilos 
[14:39] <Kilos> when im away you guys must greet peeps man
[14:40] <Kilos> hi nlsthzn  
[14:43] <kulelu88> Kilos: thats not how IRC works
[14:48] <Kilos> man this is ubuntu-za we all together in the same boat
[14:50] <Kilos> so when someone falls out we dont wait for a cry of help before reaching out a hand
[14:50] <Kilos> we catch him on the way past
[17:20] <Kilos> hmm...
[17:57] <Kilos> inetpro  jy siek?
[18:30] <magespawn> good evening
[18:30] <Kilos> hi magespawn  
[18:30] <Kilos> sorry i missed you this avy
[18:31] <magespawn> no worries
[18:31] <Kilos> all ok there lad?
[18:32] <Kilos> hi clr_  
[18:33] <clr_> Hi Kilos, you never disappoint with a 'hi'
[18:33] <Kilos> lol
[18:33] <clr_> can anyone help me with a windows licensing issue?
[18:33] <Kilos> sjoe
[18:34] <Kilos> what kind of issue
[18:34] <clr_> I have a 8.1 OEM license that that I got with my laptop
[18:34] <clr_> this license allows me to run it as the host, or as a virtual machine on the same box
[18:35] <clr_> it also allows me to run it as win7 as host (in case I wanted to downgrade)
[18:35] <clr_> Thing is, I want to run it as Win7 guest in virtualbox on my linux
[18:37] <clr_> Any takers?
[18:38] <Kilos> clr_  have you asked on #windows
[18:38] <Kilos> also why you want to run 7 not 8
[18:38] <clr_> hey, did you note the 'linux' reference on my last sentence?
[18:38] <Kilos> ive just made an 8 work with the traditional start button
[18:38] <Kilos> yes i did
[18:38] <kulelu88> windows 8 is kaka firstly
[18:39] <Kilos> i dont know enough about that os to comment
[18:39] <clr_> so I figured we linux guys have this problem, where you need to run your windows (that you got with your laptop) as a guest, once you replaced the os with ubuntu
[18:40] <clr_> so I thought this the ideal place to ask the question
[18:40] <Kilos> lol
[18:40] <Kilos> kulelu88  help him
[18:43] <magespawn> back again
[18:45] <Kilos> wb magespawn  
[18:45] <Kilos> clr_  ask magespawn  he plays with windows all day
[18:46] <kulelu88> clr_: I dual boot mine just to keep the windows on it
[18:46] <magespawn> more than i would like to admit
[18:47] <kulelu88> clr_: Unless it is a work laptop, what can microsoft do to enforce that you NOT use your legitimate copy of windows on the SAME laptop in a virtualbox? 
[18:48] <kulelu88> Kinda like Builders Warehouse trying to enforce who from my family can use the hammer I BOUGHT
[18:48] <Kilos> lol
[18:48] <magespawn> there are no unusual restrictions when using windows in a virtual box, the same as applies to bare metal machines
[18:49] <kulelu88> Kudos to you for respecting the law and the license though, clr_ 
[18:50] <magespawn> in fact one of the versions comes with a virtual license for xp, i think it is 7 but it might be 8
[18:52] <clr_> well, just that I had to phone a few times when I can't activate the copy of windows
[18:52] <clr_> and it is irritating when it stops working
[18:53] <clr_> Haven't you had a copy of windows stop working because it has not been activated?
[18:55] <clr_> Unfortunately I am also one of those that have to use windows during the day
[18:55] <kulelu88> clr_: dual-boot instead of Virtualbox
[18:56] <kulelu88> dual-booting gives you the full machines power also
[18:56] <Kilos> ya i think dual boot is the best
[18:56] <clr_> No, I like the fact that I can snapshot my windows
[18:56] <Kilos> lol
[18:56] <kulelu88> well we did try
[18:57] <clr_> And if you have many clients, you can have one 'desktop' for the one and another for the other (different snapshots)
[18:57] <clr_> so if they want to install their crap on it, it does not affect the other
[18:57] <Kilos> ah
[18:57] <Kilos> what do the win peeps say about it
[18:58] <Kilos> the prob is actually from them not letting it activate not so?
[18:58] <clr_> I did post also on mybroadband, will see what reply I get
[19:00] <clr_> yes, I am sure I can run it as a win8.1 virtual machine, but that is not what I want. I would prefer it to run as a win7 virtual machine.
[19:01] <kulelu88> so download the win7 packages, burn it onto a disk or .iso image and use that as your virtual machine
[19:02] <clr_> @kulelu88, that sounds interesting, how do you do that?
[19:03] <kulelu88> the way i backed up windows is by following some tool of theirs that allows you to back the system files into a few disks. I used about 2/3 DVDs
[19:03] <Kilos> you dont need @ here clr_  
[19:04] <Kilos> ohi superfly  
[19:05] <superfly> hi
[19:06] <clr_> ok thanks for the input, enough of this windows nonsense in any case
[19:06] <Kilos> lol
[19:10] <kulelu88> superfly: how long would it take you to build a Python MVP for a basic CRUD-style application and how much code-reuse do you use?
[19:10] <magespawn> clr_:  if you keep the machine date and time fixed the 30 days never runs out
[19:10] <superfly> kulelu88: how long is a piece of string?
[19:10] <magespawn> lol
[19:10] <Kilos> lol
[19:11] <kulelu88> well that answer was in poor taste
[19:11] <superfly> kulelu88: hardly. the devil is in the details.
[19:11] <kulelu88> I was expecting a realistic estimate for someone with your skills. Either 1 month or more
[19:12] <clr_> magespawn haha, have you tried that?
[19:12] <superfly> kulelu88: it depends on what technologies I'm using, what tables are involved, and a few other variables that would need to be pinned down.
[19:13] <superfly> kulelu88: I know you can put something CRUDdy together with Django in a few hours, but then it's cruddy.
[19:13] <kulelu88> superfly: so you spend quite a bit of time planning?
[19:13] <magespawn> yes, one of my old pc's had a bios problem that as soon as it was powered off, it would reset the date and time
[19:13] <magespawn> plas havoc with things like antivirus though
[19:13] <superfly> kulelu88: enough to get a good estimate of how much work is involved
[19:14] <kulelu88> superfly: is that a soft-skill that can only be taught with experience?
[19:14] <superfly> pretty much
[19:14] <superfly> and developers are notoriously bad at estimations
[19:14] <kulelu88> I am trying to estimate a bunch a projects I want to work on, but I yak shave thinking too much about it
[19:14] <superfly> (project managers are worse)
[19:14] <superfly> hehe, I know where you're coming from
[19:15] <superfly> kulelu88: at work we prefer to take a more long-term approach
[19:15] <superfly> break what you want to do down into small features, and then estimate each feature 
[19:15] <superfly> we do JIT planning ;-)
[19:17] <superfly> Which is why I like Trello for my personal stuff. It's easy to break stuff down and make todo lists from it. Then move stories through a pipeline of sorts (To Do, Doing, Done)
[19:17] <clr_> magespawn, also calender apps are pretty useless and so on
[19:17] <magespawn> yup
[19:17] <kulelu88> superfly: are you familiar with a developer issue of premature optimization (like: don't use Python if Go can give me better performance)
[19:17] <superfly> yup
[19:18] <kulelu88> it kills me when I read up about those languages, even though python is my go-to, I feel like I am screwing myself over
[19:22] <superfly> kulelu88: the reality is that Python is fast enough
[19:23] <kulelu88> for basic scaling, right? superfly 
[19:23] <superfly> kulelu88: and how long is it going to take you to learn and become proficient in Go?
[19:23] <kulelu88> about less time than it will take to optimize something in Python
[19:23] <superfly> kulelu88: for almost anything
[19:23] <superfly> kulelu88: no, it will take more.
[19:23] <kulelu88> oh yes, sorry, I meant more
[19:24] <kulelu88> got my comparison backwards :( :D
[19:24] <superfly> :-)
[19:25] <kulelu88> superfly: with your experience, would you use any tools to help you build Android apps?
[19:25] <superfly> It took me 2 years to become really proficient in Python, and 2 years to really understand Google App Engine.
[19:25] <magespawn> hah now i am not feeling too bad
[19:26] <superfly> kulelu88: uh, I'd probably stick with Android Studio and Java
[19:26] <kulelu88> Python really is amazing. I didn't write code for sometime and quickly spun up a script in 2 hours that helped a lot
[19:26] <superfly> I know Java well enough, and with it being the language and system of choice on Android, I'll be better able to get things working if I stick with what everyone else is using.
[19:27] <kulelu88> what about app-builders that generate Java code?
[19:27] <superfly> Too true
[19:27] <superfly> I'm not fond of those.
[19:30] <kulelu88> You raise some awesome points. Finding the perfect tool will just be yak shaving. I'll just put Android in a Docker container and build an app from code-snippets
[19:40] <superfly> kulelu88: Stack Overflow-driven Development ;-)
[19:41] <kulelu88> superfly: somehow, somebody else has always asked "that" question
[19:43] <inetpro> good evening
[19:43] <inetpro> Kilos: no
[19:43] <Kilos> yay
[19:43] <superfly> "Finding the perfect tool will just be yak shaving" -- perfectly said
[19:44] <kulelu88> what are you working on currently? superfly 
[19:45] <superfly> As in, at this minute, or as in "in general"?
[19:45] <kulelu88> in general
[19:46] <kulelu88> maybe a SaaS or something open source, etc.
[19:46] <superfly> I've got a pet project that uses Flask, App Engine, AngularJS and Bootstrap. Nothing to show yet.
[19:46] <superfly> I'm always working on OpenLP
[19:46] <kulelu88> NLP software?
[19:47] <superfly> No, lyrics projection. Gives a church with a data projector the ability to show their songs, Bible verses, etc. on the projector, with a management console on the PC
[19:48] <superfly> Then I'm also trying to guide the direction of the Ubuntu-ZA and Ubuntu-Africa sites
[19:48] <magespawn> and the other full time job
[19:48] <superfly> And, I'm involved with DebConf16
[19:48] <Kilos> but whip too small
[19:48] <superfly> oh, yes, and Nomanini during business hours.
[19:48] <magespawn> the family
[19:49] <superfly> magespawn: in between everything else.
[19:49] <magespawn> and not to mention the little things like sleep
[19:49] <superfly> kulelu88: AngularJS + Flask = WIN
[19:50] <kulelu88> superfly: I applied for a job once using Angular + Flask. Then the COO/C-something-O hit me with a Google-fu question and told me to eff off (in symbolic terms) :D
[19:51] <magespawn> hi inetpro 
[19:51] <inetpro> oh hi magespawn
[19:52] <Kilos> inetpro  moppie drop ons
[19:52] <kulelu88> I really wanted to work for a startup as a coder, but ahh well, found greener pastures doing nicer work
[19:55] <superfly> I don't mind what company I work for, as long as (a) they pay me enough to support my family, and (b) people are willing to listen to me
[19:56] <magespawn> i am off to bed, good night all
[19:56] <Kilos> night magespawn  
[19:58] <kulelu88> is the commute bad for you? superfly 
[20:00] <superfly> kulelu88: depends on your definition of "bad" - mine is 45 minutes on the train, but I don't mind it. I get a chance to relax, sleep, play Ingress.
[20:01] <kulelu88> 90 minutes each day?
[20:02] <superfly> yeah
[20:02] <kulelu88> my commute is 30 seconds :D
[20:02] <Kilos> lol
[20:03] <Kilos> fall out of bed and you at work
[20:05] <Kilos> night all, sleep tight
[21:00] <superfly> kulelu88: I can't work at home. I'd be interrupted the whole time.
[21:00] <superfly> Also, we use Agile and XP, so being at the office with the others is very necessary. It also helps me concentrate.
[21:01] <kulelu88> that's whats happening these days superfly 
[21:02] <superfly> kulelu88: in some circles, not everywhere
[21:03] <superfly> anyway, merge proposal in, bed time for me.